ChristiaNet MallWorld's Largest Christian MallChristian BlogsFree Bible QuizzesFree Ecards and Free Greeting CardsLoans, Debt, Business and Insurance Articles

Pope Must Be Cannonized By Man

Why does the Pope have to be " Cannonized " by men to become a Saint, when we are already Saint's in Christ?

Join Our Free Penpals and Take The Sanctification Bible Quiz
 ---John on 4/4/05
     Helpful Blog Vote (6)

Reply to this BlogPost a New Blog



Not sure.

God is all we need.
---char on 7/9/10


Canonization, in the Roman Church, is a formal act allowing public liturgical commemoration of someone believed to show heroic sanctity.

That's all.
---Cluny on 7/1/10


That's another Man - made trin - rcc conception that came from here, 2nd.Cor.11 v's 14 - 15. Along with the other Man - made conceptions they have is an abomination to Almighty God.
---Lawrence on 7/1/10


Mima, I know a lot of Born Again Catholics, even by your definition. But I wish I could find more Protestants that behaved as if they were truly born again and not just paying lipservice to the idea.
---lorra8574 on 6/7/07


Helen,

'I belong to Jesus' Church. I am a member of His body, the'

- What do you understand by Church?

- Do you know who your fellow brethern in the Church are? The disciples and apostles knew each other. They worked together in their Christian faith. They worshipped together. They prayed together.

- What other Christians do you know (who share the same beliefs as you)? Who do you pray and worship with? And where (when you are with them)?
---Ed on 6/7/07




Mima
There are Catholics, no doubt, who see religion as a tradition. But there are many others who see Catholicism as being their Christian faith, and bringing it the hope and joy that Christianity is meant to bring to the Christian.
At least 'traditional' Catholics are still within the grasp of being won over properly to the Christian faith.
There are many non-believers (especially in traditional Protestant countries such as Sweden) who have no Christians around them at all, to whom to turn.
---Ed on 6/7/07


A wise man once told me," that that which is learned on your mother's knee is extremely difficult to depart from" hence we have people born Catholic but we rarely have born-again Catholics!!!!!!
---Mima on 6/7/07


Ed - ("So Helen
I put it to you which Church do you belong to.") - I belong to Jesus' Church. I am a member of His body, the Church.
---Helen_5378 on 6/7/07


So Helen
I put it to you which Church do you belong to.
When Jesus taught us to pray he taught us to pray 'Our Father' - that is our faith isn't just something individual between God and person but also something communal between God and the faithful.
"Every Believer in Jesus Christ is a member of the church of Jesus Christ, 1 Corinthians 12:27" - the word 'Church' appears throughout the New Testament.
---Ed on 6/7/07


3. Helen
99% of Christians believe in communal faith as well as Church (because Jesus teaches us to pray 'Our Father' and because 'Church' derives from the scriptures.
Although each denomination believes it is the True Church at least we all believe in the concept of the Church.
You seem to think that faith is purely individualistic, between God and individual |(yes personal relationship with God is absolutely paramount)- and that there is no place for community / Church.
---Ed on 6/7/07




4 Helen
But the Bible tells us that we need communal worship / Church as well as a purely personal relationship with God.
God is in others as much as ourselves. We must look out for and pray for the well-being of others as well as ourselves. For the unity of the family in Christ and His Church.
---Ed on 6/7/07


5 Helen

Just to conclude and reiterate (because i really think this is so important).

Personal relationship to God is paramount.
But being part of a Church - worshipping God as a community, and praying for others and fellowship in Church, is also central to our faith.
The Bible telling us, in fact, not only is there a Church but that Jesus is the head of the Church - Ephesians 5:23; Colossians 1:18.

God Bless.
---Ed on 6/7/07


Ed - I belong to Christ. I am in Christ. Read the New Testament and see for yourself just how many places it says "in Christ". God does not look to see what church you attend, He looks to see if you are in His Son Jesus. Are you?
---Helen_5378 on 6/6/07


Helen
"And as far as denomination goes, as usual my reply is: I am in Christ. God does not look to see if a person is in a denomination"
- Helen. Come on everyone thinks this about their own Christian faith. Catholics think they are the 'true Christians' - as do Baptists, Lutherans, and so on.
And you are labelling Catholics as this and that just as you don't want to be labelled as belonging to a particular denomination, yourself.
---Ed on 6/4/07


3. Helen

'no truth at all' - that can't be because Catholics and most other Christians share the same beliefs about the fundamentals of Christianity'
1. Jesus is the Saviour
2. Worship The Trinity
3. Jesus two greatest commandments are: 'Love God and Love nieghbour'

- there already you have 95% of what Christianity is all about. Therefore your claim about Catholicism is absured.
It is the 5% that we differ anbout. Therefore your claim is a massive and dangerous exaggeration.
---Ed on 6/4/07


Ed - ("I just think you see the negatives, too easily, over the positives (regarding Catholicism).") -- Ed, the RCC has no truth in it whatsoever. It is full of false teachings that mostly have taken Scriptures and twisted and distorted them until they have no Scriptural truth at all. If the RCC truly did not worship Mary, then there is no way that they would pray to her or have statues of her or call her "queen of heaven". (continued...)
---Helen_5378 on 6/3/07


Read These Insightful Articles About Advertising


2/... Much emphasis is put on the "Hail Mary" prayer in the RCC. Also, the "Our Father" is said word by word. Jesus says to pray "in this manner" as regards the Lord's prayer. It is a guideline as to how to pray when communicating with God the Father. It is not meant to be said as a prayer in itself. Once a person gets saved they know God in a very personal way and address Him as "Father".
---Helen_5378 on 6/3/07


Ed - I am here to tell the truth about the RCC, but unfortunately most perceive that as attacking. And as far as denomination goes, as usual my reply is: I am in Christ. God does not look to see if a person is in a denomination, He looks to see if you are in Christ.
---Helen_5378 on 6/3/07


Helen

"Hail" - there is nothing blasphemous about saying 'Hail' to a non-God being like Mary. Just look it up in the dictionary. With respect, here, you just don't understand linguistics. Nothing to do with religion.

"The reason RCs do not see that they are worshipping Mary" - well Catholic doctrine says it is blasmphemous to worship Mary. With respect what are you talking about?

You are harmful in your words without backing it up with facts or even any reasoning.
---Ed on 6/3/07


2. Helen,

Yes Catholics have committed terrible evils - and other Catholics who have lived out true Christian lives. I just think you see the negatives, too easily, over the positives (regarding Catholicism). Your loss but it is also damaging to others.

As I have asked before why don't you tell us what denomination you belong to. Then we can put their beliefs / practise under the spotlight. Don't you want to convert others or just attack Catholicism?
---Ed on 6/3/07


Read These Insightful Articles About Eating Disorders


Ashley, you need to read the Bible again. Try reading the Epistles which are frequently addressed to the saints as well as other church members. If you are going to condemn someone for the idea that we should become saints, start with the Apostle Paul. If you read the Gosples you will also note that Jesus called us to perfection.
---lorra8574 on 6/2/07


It is a catholic thing to say people become saints in life. According to my KJV of the bible, Jesus said do not elevate one person higher than the next person. We are all children of our Heavenly Father. How we live will determine whether we walk through the gates into God's kingdom, not man. Granted, many live their lives as examples of Jesus Christ, but to elevate them higher than a neighbor who does the same mocks God and is in disobedience to what Jesus taught. Oh the vanities of man.
---ashley on 6/2/07


Ed - ("Catholic docrtine FORBIDS any worship of Mary or the saints. If you continued to do this after warning you would be excommunicated (as an ex-Catholic weren't you ever told that).") -- I was taught to say the "Hail Mary" and also to say if I was scared "Jesus, Mary and Joseph". The reason RCs do not see that they are worshipping Mary is that they are spiritually blinded. Once born-again a person can then see the horrific wrongs of the RCC.
---Helen_5378 on 6/2/07


1. Helen

There are two types of prayer. Prayer / worship and Prayer / communication.

Catholic docrtine FORBIDS any worship of Mary or the saints. If you continued to do this after warning you would be excommunicated (as an ex-Catholic weren't you ever told that).
---Ed on 6/1/07


Send a Free Love Ecard


2. Helen

Prayer / communication.
This is nothing more than mortals here on earth asking 'saints' (and nothing more than as if they were on a spirtual telepone' to plead to God on hehalf of the orginal beseacher. This is ABSOLUTELY NOT worship of saints. Do this and you would be excommunicated.

Whether you think this is right or not is a different matter but this is not the same as worship.
---Ed on 6/1/07


3. Helen

Coming to your point now.
No Catholic - no-one for that matter is suggesting Jesus ever prayed to Mary. He couldn't have prayed to her because He died before she did. And, of course, since Mary is not God the only prayer that is permittable to Mary is the prayer of mere communication (mortals to the saints). Not the prayer of worship.

Where on earth are you taking people with your post?
---Ed on 6/1/07


The Pope would have to be canonized by men, but one does not have to be canonized to be a saint, only to be officially recognized as a saint by the Church. I have no doubt that Mother Theresa was a saint long before the process of canonization was begun, and even before she died. But I just don't call her "Saint" Theresa until it is confirmed by a sign from God.
---lorra8574 on 6/1/07


You will find that man's traditions and God's ways frequently clash. God does the Sainting, God does the anointing, God does the appointing, and God does the ordaining- and according to Scripture He alone does all these things. But man always tries to imitate the genuine, they set up leaders and systems and doctrines, but God himself has not set them up. Remember the poor shepherd boy is the one who walked on the water and raised the dead, not the college educated pharisees and saducees, on the contrary they kept the people in bondage along with themselves and slew the real Savior.
---Eloy on 6/1/07


Read These Insightful Articles About Travel Packages


John, who said He does? When will folks realize that "it was appointed unto man ONCE to die and then the judgement." He's dead. He can't become anything now. What does Cannonized mean anyway? I was raised Catholic and never understood that term. The Pope is no holier than us, the Saints in Christ Jesus. WE ARE THE RIGHTEOUSNESS of GOD THROUGH CHRIST JESUS. Where does it say the POPE is higher than we are? or more important that the Saints in Christ are?
---Donna9759 on 8/24/06


Listen - You have brought out an extremely good point in that Jesus never prayed to His mother. It would be just so preposterous to even think of that wouldn't it. While Jesus was on earth with His mother, He was always the One in charge, never her.
---Helen_5378 on 8/24/06


Note: For some of the Scriptures on saints of God, see 1 Corinthians 1:2, Ephesians 3:8, 2 Thessalonians 1:10, Jude 3, Revelation 16:6.
---Helen_5378 on 8/24/06


The point is you have to actually be in Christ to be a saint. One is in Christ the moment one believes that Jesus Christ died on the Cross for their sins and that He rose from the dead.
---Helen_5378 on 8/24/06


Read These Insightful Articles About Credit Repair


Jana - LOL That is about all the good it would do LOL.
---Helen_5378 on 8/24/06


LOL maybe he need to be canned ... what say...or preserveed
---jana on 8/24/06


Brian ... please help us then to understand the original meanings ... on't just leave us hanging here
---Alan_of_U.K. on 4/20/05


Guys, I appreciate this discussion and agree with a lot of what is being said. However, if you want to argue over specific words, it's bad form to use an English translation. For that kind of discussion you really need to go back to the original Greek.
---Brian on 4/19/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Christian Products


Everyone This the the last thing I will say about praying to DEAD SAINTS! In MATT 22-29 `I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob' ? He is NOT the God of the DEAD but of the LIVING." (St. Luke's Gospel 20:38 adds "for to him all are alive" or In JN 11:25 Jesus said "I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in me will LIVE, even though he DIES; and whoever lives and believes in me will NEVER DIES.
---ruben on 4/17/05


The words TO and FOR make a big difference. We are to pray FOR...one another, never TO.. anyone but God our Father in the name of Jesus, who is our Savior and only mediator. Jesus never prayed to OT saints...or even to his mother. Nowhere in scripture did He direct people to pray to "saints" or to his mother. That practice is absolutely contrary to scripture.
---listen on 4/13/05


Ruben You and I had this discussion before. But there is a heap of differnce between praying for someone and praying to them.

I will pray TO God FOR someone else.

When I feel I need someone to pray for me (maybe I do not feel adequate to form my own prayer, or even do not know what to pray for) I will ask others ... maybe a friend, or a pastor, or even people here ... to pray for me. I am not praying to them, I am just asking them to do that.

All the prayers will be directed to God/Jesus
---Alan_of_U.K. on 4/13/05


Ruben, scripture says it is OK for us mortals to pray for each other. We are all praying to the same person (i.e. Jesus). But, as I said in my last post, scriptures say it is WRONG to pray to any saints because Jesus is the ONLY mediator.
---Debbie on 4/13/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Christian Divorce


Debbie-(what about this: "For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;")If that is the case than why does scriptures say to pray for one another, instead why not go directley to GOD. Again DEAD PEOPLE (SAINTS) appear with Jesus at the transfiguration. If Jesus did not want us to pray to SAINTS in HEAVEN, this scripture would not be in the BIBLE!!!
---ruben on 4/12/05


Dear Ruben: You say that you pray to the dead to "intercede" on your behalf. Then what about this: "For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;" 1 Timothy 2:5
"And for this cause he (Christ) is the mediator of the new testament..." Hebrews 9:15

If one uses common sense on the above, one would be able to realize that Jesus is the ONLY mediator/intercessor!
---Debbie on 4/12/05


Debbie-cont- The difference between the two is the difference between night and day. One is an occult practice bent on getting secret information; the other is a humble request for a loved one to pray to God on ones behalf. Jesus himself went out to pray and the SPIRIT of MOSES and ELIJAH APPEAR to JESUS, are you saying JESUS practice occult rituals, if he did we better start ourself.
---ruben on 4/12/05


Debbie= Please God indicates that one is not to speak to the dead for purposes of gaining information; one is to look to Gods prophets instead. Thus one is not to hold a seance. But anyone with an ( COMMON SENSE) can tell the difference between holding a seance to have the dead speak through you . Like a loved at his mother grave asking her to pray for him to Jesus, he is having some issues here. Cont
---ruben on 4/12/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Christian Marriage


Ruben: Here is what scripture says about praying to dead people. Deuteronomy 18:10 "There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch. Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer (definition being The practice of supposedly communicating with the spirits of the dead).
---Debbie on 4/12/05


Having established his church under Peter,He transferred his authority, they received the Holy Spirit as he promised they performed miracles in the name of Jesus.Regarding Confession Jesus gave that same power to absolve,yes its in the Bible the Catholic Church is an on going institution it did not stop with the Asension of Jesus into heaven I shall be with you all times even to the end of the worldwhat does that mean to you. He who eats my body & drinks my blood I live in them & they in me.
---Emcee on 4/11/05


Debbie You show me where it says if not in scripture it cannot be true.Now about the DEAD PEOPLE, lets see what scripture said about them. God said he is the GOD of the living not of the DEAD, MOSES AND ELIJAH appear to Jesus.
---ruben on 4/11/05


I agree that only mediator is Christ BUT, I do not share the opinion of many that the RCC WORSHIPS Mary and the saints or the Pope.
---Albert on 4/11/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Debt Consolidation


Albert: It isn't my "opinion". It is simple comparison. Catholics pray to Mary -- that is NON-SCRIPTURAL! Can you show me in scripture where Jesus says to pray to her? No. What about purgatory. Is that in scripture? No. What about praying to saints? Is that in scripture? No, scripture actually says the ONLY mediator is Jesus Christ. Shall I go on or would you like to prove your point WITH scripture? I have many many more I could share with you.
---Debbie on 4/10/05


NV Barbara, You are right...praying to a dead person IS blasphamous and totally NONscriptural. God forbid it. This also includes Mary. NO place in scripture did Jesus tell us to address our prayers to his human mother. This is not my opinion....but God's Word. Direct your challenges to HIM.
---Lola on 4/10/05


Ruben - How do you know that your interpretation is correct one, than the Catholic Church, .....".

Simple answer! "You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?" The fruits of the Roman Church have been fairly obvious for those that can see.
---lee on 4/10/05


Debbie, not following Scriptures is your opinion and the RCC does not agree with you. You see, this is a problem which exists with so many people of all denominations. If one doesn't agree, s/he fights back with stating it is not scriptural.

It's about time we all start minding our own business and stop condemning others.
---Albert on 4/10/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Refinancing


Ruben: That is an easy question. Catholicism does not follow scripture. That is how we determine what is "right" and what is false teaching. If it goes against scripture -- then it is NOT of the Lord.
---Debbie on 4/9/05


Hello Question for all, How do you know that your interpretation is correct one, than the Catholic Church, please do not tell me you are guided by the Holy Spirit. Because if that is the case he sure confused a whole bunch of us . I also feel I must correct alot of you who try to tell people what the Catholic Church teaches,
---ruben on 4/9/05


Albert: I completely agree with you! That is why it is important that we correct the false teachings of catholicism. It isn't about paranoia or "being right" -- it is about scripture. If something that any church teaches does NOT line up with scripture -- that false teaching should be brought to light! It should be compared to scripture and we should realize that man-made doctrine does NOT supercede the Word of God!
---Debbie on 4/7/05


Debbie, I don't agree with all the RCC teaches or practices but when exaggerated or wrong statements pop up, I feel I should correct them.
---Albert on 4/6/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Franchises


Right on Debbie!
I wouldn't put it exactly like you do but you're right on every count. The scriptures are what we must stay in line with, and nothing else.
---John on 4/6/05


Rationalizing is what catholicism is all about. If one rationalizes that whatever they do is because of "tradition", then it all seems OK, but if you look closer and pray for enlightenment, then you would see that all this "tradition" goes DIRECTLY against scripture. It isn't paranoia or any such thing -- it is truth, pure and simple. God Bless all the Saints in Christ reading this and God Bless all those who are confused.
---Debbie on 4/6/05


Very well said, Ruben. I "see" a lot of "acting" in what some people post here. Little logic and lots of paranoia and pushing issues to rationalize what they try to impose on others.
---Albert on 4/6/05


The BIG issue I have with the RCC, is when one is made a "Saint", then the members of the church pray to them instead of to God through our Savior. Of course they also pray to God, but praying to dead people seems blasphamous.
---NV_Barbara on 4/5/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Lead Generation


Eloy ( God does the anointing, God does the appointing, and God does the ordaining- and according to Scripture He alone does all these things). But he left the APOSTLES to continue his work so he uses human for his work. You listen to MAN doctrines, BIBLE ALONE,FAITH ALONE and being SAVED so many years ago, those are man doctrines. About the Pharisees and Saducees Jesus also said . "The scribes and the Pharisees sit on Moses seat; so practice and OBSERVE WHATEVER THEY TELL YOU, but not what they do; for they preach, but do not practice" (Matt. 23:23).
---ruben on 4/5/05


Canonizing a person is nothing else but acknowledging his or her virtuous, God loving life and put as a mirror for others to follow.

No one in the RCC has ever claimed that canonization has any influence in heaven.
---Albert on 4/5/05


I beleive the answer is this. We are saints because we trust in Christ and are made "santified" by faith in Him. The Pope and other catholics beleive they must work for their salvation and therefore are not made right with the Lord until they have paid there on way. The term "Saint" for catholics is different from the "saint" that the Paul called the christian of his day. That were still alive.
---Wayne on 4/4/05


Whatever the men do will make no difference whatsoever to the Pope.

I read in the paper that the reason they are trying to canonise the Pope, or make him a saint immediately, is so that there will be that much more authority attached to the way he left the church running, and to his doctrine regarding birth control, women priests etc.
---Alan_of_U.K. on 4/4/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Mortgages


I have been a christian for 23 years and used to be a Catholic and never had a problem with the church at all, until I got saved and my eyes were open. One of the first things the Lord told me to do was to witness to my ex Catholic Priest, and then all hell broke loose! He called me a heratic for leaving the Church, but about 3 months later he got saved and also left the church to be a missionary, praise God! I know that there are a lot of good saved people in the Catholic church, but why would I want to be in a place where there is so much idolatry? The Pope is no more a Saint than I am.
---Peter on 4/4/05


Being a non-catholic pastor, I need to weigh in on this subject. The structure of the catholic church is very biblical (i didn't believe it til i did a scripture study for myself on "ordaining of clergy"). The idea of a pope is based on something called apostolic succession - the leadership (the keys) of the church were given to peter by jesus and were handed down to peter's successor, etc. paul was the first to appoint bishops (leaders of the church). We may not agree with the way they use it today, but it is biblical.
---ken on 4/4/05


Eloy has plastered a post that's going to stand the test of all time, from all minds! The point to remember is that when we allow ourselves to worship anything or person above Christ, we become entrenched in idolatry, which is another form of witchcraft.
---Toby on 4/4/05


My dear friends not one of you have bothered to answer this persons question. I am sorry but I also do not know the reason other than we are the vessals of God and through the tradition of the Church the Pope is BLESSED in a formula manner Not all Popes are CANNONIZED to become saints, as far as I understand it only two or is it three have been given this honour.
---keith on 4/4/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Personal Loans


Amen, to Eloy's comments above. Would not have said it much differently.
---D.Anon on 4/4/05


Those who obey and live by the Word of God are the Saints of God.We need no man to give us that. What the Catholics do ,when people are"Cannoized",is pecular to their denominational teaching and means nothing to nonCatholics. I am not making a judgement of the practice,o nly an explanation.It seems they may do it to honor someone who has been very commited in giving of themselves to others through service to God.
---Darlene_1 on 4/4/05


In my view, and I am no authority, this is just one of the disjoints of the Catholic church. Why is the Pope 'Holy Father', when he is just a man? Why is he worshiped, when the 2nd commandment is, "thou shalt have no other Gods before Me?" When we focus on a man, any man, we take our eyes off of the Lord, I believe. I do not feel as though I am qualified to judge anything let alone another man's salvation, but there are so many rituals and methods the Catholics use that seem to be totally man made and to conflict with scripture. Yet the whole world seems to be on their knees.
---D.Anon on 4/4/05


As a non-Catholic, the scriptural value JP II gave to the Jewish people and nation of Israel is acknowledged and appreciated. We non Catholics need to pray earnestly God will give the Catholics another pope with the same godly, scriptural views of God's chosen race. God promised to bless the nation who bless Israel, and curse those that curse her. I'm not a Jew or from Israel. But the hope of all rests on the treatment of Israel.
---X on 4/4/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Auto Insurance


Just different doctrine in the Roman Catholic church. We're not going to change their minds. They have several regulations that decide if a person is a saint or not, AFTER they die. As an aside, I was raised Catholic. As a child I thought that if a person was 'cannonized', they were shot out of a cannon! I have not been a RC in nearly 30 years, but some of my family are.
---NV_Barbara on 4/4/05


Because Church Tradition prevails over the Word of God sometimes.
---Carl on 4/4/05


Copyright© 1996-2015 ChristiaNet®. All Rights Reserved.