ChristiaNet MallWorld's Largest Christian MallChristian BlogsFree Bible QuizzesFree Ecards and Free Greeting CardsLoans, Debt, Business and Insurance Articles

Purgatory, Heaven Or Hell

If there is no purgatory and we go to be with Jesus at the time of death, heaven or hell. Is this the time we stand before Jesus and He says you blessed enter the Kingdom... or get cast into the lake of fire? So the dead are already judged?

Join Our Free Chat and Take The Heaven & Hell Bible Quiz
 ---Linda on 4/12/05
     Helpful Blog Vote (23)

Post a New Blog



Joseph, Since this blog was resurrected that started in 2005 no one ever finished, and not a NEW blog that was busted in, I personally see no harm in continuing this conversation that actually pertains to the conversation that was carried over from another Blog.

GOOD move Joseph. Carry on. Here I mean!
---kathr4453 on 9/12/14


see....


pierre, Where do you get your info? What bible are you reading. The soul lives forever. If we accept Jesus as Lord and saveiour, then we go live with the Lord. To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. If we reject Jesus, we go to hell. At the end of the world, we will all be judged and the sinner and Hell will be cast into the Lake Of Fire. Two different places.

---Rev_Herb on 4/12/05
---kathr453 on 9/12/14


Hey Joe: I certainly don't mean you any offense, but you may want to consider (in the future) continuing your blog comments, pertainent to a closed out blog, on a FINISH IT HERE blog if one is available. If not, create one. To crash someone else's blog isn't the right thing to do. ijs God bless! :)

"For purgatory & trinity Is Ficticious. Heaven is real, hell is real."
---Lawrence on 8/13/14


Law: Doesn't Genesis show spiritually dead Adam & Eve being expelled from the Garden into a "very real purgatory" (the world)?

Purgatory: a place or state of suffering inhabited by the souls of sinners who are expiating their sins, by the blood of the Lamb (Jesus), before going to heaven.
---Leon on 9/12/14


------Samuelbb7 on 9/12/14

Wake Up,? How can something that does not exist wake up? Will your flesh wake up too?.

9When the Lamb broke the fifth seal, I saw underneath the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God, and because of the testimony which they had maintained, 10and they cried out with a loud voice, saying, "How long, O Lord, holy and true, will You refrain from judging and avenging our blood on those who dwell on the earth?"

Now angels don't have blood, humans do. AND the souls of these slain, meaning dead CRIED OUT! So we need to study the different meanings of death. EXAMPLE: I died with Christ, but I'm still here!
---kathr4453 on 9/12/14


Joseph I am glad you are looking into conditional-ism. The doctrine that eternal life is based on knowing JESUS.

An Excellent resource is the Fire That Consumes by Edward Fudge.

Dear Kathr

The Spirit and Soul are not the same thing. Soul is often translated as life. Spirit is sometimes translated as breath.

Dear Kathr
In Genesis three we are Body plus spirit and become a soul. In Ecclesiastes 12:7 our body returns to dust and our Spirit returns to GOD. But the Spirit is not a thinking part of us. It is who we are. But without the body it is not a person.

When I die I will close my eyes and then wake up at the resurrection immediately as far as I am concerned and see my Lord JESUS.
---Samuelbb7 on 9/12/14




Kat I apogize for my lack of clarity, I am saying the earth becomes a paradise, and that Heaven will fill the earth. Heaven is defined in one of two ways, as the visible arch of the sky, and as the abode of God. Rev.21:3> The tabernacle of God [will be] with men, and He will dwell with them. Heaven is where the LORD is, it is His presence on Earth, and His governing principles that constitutes the kingdom of Heaven and Paradise. After John was taken up he was carried away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, still looking up from the earth. Rev. 21:10. Other documentation of this, and paradise on Earth, Rev. 19:11>20:1,8>21:2. Rev. 22:2> See verse 22 cross referenced with Rev 5:10
---joseph on 9/11/14


"But to say the man who put his faith in Jesus calling him Lord, and confessing he was a sinner, wasn't saved that very moment."
Kat I would never say that, I know, that he was saved.
Concerning 2Co 5:8 I do not see where being in the presence with the LORD is implied as immediately following death. As believers we are spiritually in His presence now. Eph 2:6 For Spiritually He abides within those that love Him. Jhn 14:23. Personally I do not believe man will be in His physical presence without a physical body, that is the purpose of the resurrection. However Kat, I will keep your view in mind as I continue my studies. Thanks for the courteous exchange, I appreciate it.
---joseph on 9/11/14


James 2:2626 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Samuel, this verse doesn't say that the spirit without the body is dead, but the opposite. Absent from the body is to be present with The Lord. And Hebrews 12 ..both witness to the fact of the spirits of Just men made perfect are now in Heaven with God and Jesus and the angels. Rev: the Souls of those murdered under the alter. God tells them to WAIT until what? again we have Luke. Jesus lead captivity captive, meaning all the souls in Abraham's bosom He LEAD into heaven. He also came to set the captives free. Saul summons Samuel through a medium. Saul did not believe a dead soul or spirit extinguished when the soul left a dead carcass.
---kathr4453 on 9/11/14


Kathr the soul can die and no where in the Bible does it say it will never die.

Mat 10:28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

GOD can and will kill the souls of the wicked in Gehenna. Ezekiel 18,4,20

What does this passage Better Resurrection mean:
Heb 11:35
Women received their dead raised to life again: and others were tortured, not accepting deliverance, that they might obtain a better resurrection:
---Samuelbb7 on 9/11/14


Joseph, I agree with you here on many points and scripture. But to say the man who put his faith in Jesus calling him Lord, and confessing he was a sinner, wasn't saved that very moment. We are also told, absent from the Body is to be present with The Lord. Also knowing the soul of man never dies, that those saints who died in the OT, Jesus brought into Heaven with Him. Jesus was the first to enter through His own Blood. Heb 12: 22-24 show all together now, with God and Jesus.

I believe Abraham's Bosom was another name for Paradise until Jesus rose from the dead. Certainly no dead saved has to wait until then ( His Tangible Kingdom) to BE WITH The Lord, unless you believe the soul dies too?????
---kathr4453 on 9/11/14




Joseph, G4594 to day, is the same word James also uses in James 4. To day or to morrow. Here in both, "to day" is G4594 says it means this very day.
---kathr453 on 9/11/14


Kat I apogize for my lack of clarity, I am saying the earth becomes a paradise, and that Heaven will fill the earth. Heaven is defined in one of two ways, as the visible arch of the sky, and as the abode of God. Rev.21:3> The tabernacle of God [will be] with men, and He will dwell with them. Heaven is where the LORD is, it is His presence on Earth, and His governing principles that constitutes the kingdom of Heaven and Paradise. After John was taken up he was carried away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, still looking up from the earth. Rev. 21:10. Other documentation of this, and paradise on Earth, Rev. 19:11>20:1,8>21:2. Rev. 22:2> See verse 22 cross referenced with Rev 5:10
---josephm on 9/10/14


Hi Joseph,

You said, if I haven't misunderstood, that Paul was taken in the third age where heaven is earth and earth is heaven?

When has the earth ever been said to be the third heaven or even paradise, except before Adam sinned . The Garden was most likely a paradise. But today, John was also taken UP and shown things to come. And those things were shown from being up looking down. And what John saw looking down sure was no paradise. Paul said he didn't know if he was in the body or out.

Yes Paradise is only used three times, and one time Paul was taken up there, also called the third heaven, no longer on earth.
---kathr4453 on 9/9/14


Hello Kat, I will respond to your statment to me on the now closed "When did Heaven Start" here. I am sure you know, paradise is only spoken of three times in scripture. When Jesus spoke of it, of "Paul" being caught up to it, and as the location of the tree of life. "Paradeisos"-Paradise, is defined as a park, i.e. (spec) an Eden, [a] (place of future happiness). Concerning "Paul", Father does not live in time,time lives within Him. He took "Paul" to the Heaven of the third age, an age where Heaven is Earth, and Earth, is Heaven, Paradise. "The Kindom of Heaven. A time when "The kingdom of the world, become the Kingdom of our LORD. Rev. 11:15
---joseph on 9/9/14


jason9835 on 8/17/14: 'The fact that Jesus and the NT writers referred to the OT as we have it today and none of the apocrypha is enough for me.'

Jason, are you sure they never referred to the apocrypha? I do not know the apocrypha well enough to know, but some people have said some quotations do come from there?

Have you ever checked that out?
---Peter on 8/24/14


Then why do we have JESUS as a High Priest now. Why was he bodily resurrected?


Heb 4:14,15

Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.

For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities, but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/24/14


Read These Insightful Articles About Jewelry


"1. Who was God talking to in G1:26-27, 3:22
2. (a.) Jesus was (identified as the Son of God), after being baptized & (b.) he saw the Spirit of God (appearing like a dove) & (c.) heard the voice of God (the Father) speaking from heaven. Matt. 3:16-17"

One Being Leon. The mind of His Being brought forth His Word as the channel through which He purposed and determined to express Himself, His Essence, Power, and Wisdom. "The LORD our God is one LORD." Deu 6:4>Isa 42:8 In Matt. 3:16-17 He is identifying the Son as His Divine Expression of Himself made tangible to man as Lord of his salvation, with all power and authority. "Christ [is] the power of God and the wisdom of God." 1Co 1:24
---joseph on 8/23/14


We can pray and trust that GOD lead these scholars in their thoughts.

Agape.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/18/14


jason9835:

These blogs are about what truth IS, or about what scripture SAYS. They aren't (or shouldn't be) about what I, or you, or anyone else THINKS it is. Our own personal opinions and conjectures are irrelevant to such discussions.

In court, a judge judges based on evidence, not his own personal opinions on the criminal's guilt. He must pust aside his own personal opinions on the subject to be able to judge fairly and impartially.

Clearly what these books teach is at odds with the bible and this is why they were rejected.

So you admit their rejection was a matter of scholarship and educated opinion - NOT the finger of God saying "Behold this book, in which I am well pleased".
---StrongAxe on 8/17/14


StrongAxe,

I would hope the Spirit of truth would guide you to discern what is truth and what is not rather than having a scholar decide that for you. Clearly what these books teach is at odds with the bible and this is why they were rejected. If you cant see that then I feel sorry for you.

// the argument a book being quoted in the New Testament is evidence of its inspiration, and it not being quoted proves it isn't inspired is logically indefensible//

I never said that was the only evidence, but I would say its the strongest and for you to disregard it is irresponsible in my opinion. The fact that Jesus and the NT writers referred to the OT as we have it today and none of the apocrypha is enough for me.
---jason9835 on 8/17/14


Read These Insightful Articles About Furniture


jason9835:

To be clear: I am not here saying "Enoch is canonical" or "Maccabees is canonical". (I'm also not saying they're not - I'll leave those arguments to scholars). I am just saying that the argument "a book being quoted in the New Testament is evidence of its inspiration, and it not being quoted proves it isn't inspired" is logically indefensible, and can lead to self-contradictory conclusions.
---StrongAxe on 8/17/14


The Jews have the set of books they call the Tanak. That is what we call the Old Testament.

They have some wisdom books which are not part of the Tanak. They are called the Apocrypha.

As pointed out earlier Bible writers can pull a true stamen from books that are not part of the bible.

The Bible does say when JESUS comes that: John 5:28,29

Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth, they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life, and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

So we see resurrection of people from the grave. Not placing of people back in the graves.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/17/14


jason9835:

It is known (from historical records) that Enoch was in circulation for a long time before Jesus's day, so it is likely Jude know of it.

If, however, they both independently quoted a third source, this leads to the questions: "Which source? And why isn't THAT in the bible?"

However, both are non-canonical because they were not inspired.

They are non-canonical because councils of men DECIDED they were not inspired. Whether they were, in fact, inspired is something only God knows.

My opinion on which books are inspired has no bearing on whether, those books are, in fact, inspired, nor do they have any bearing on any arguments I make on the subject.
---StrongAxe on 8/16/14


//Allowing for variations in translations, this is almost a word for word quote//

Youre still assuming one came from the other when really you cant prove that. Perhaps they both used the same source. Either way its an assumption, no one really knows. Youre correct that the book of Enoch is part of the pseudepigrapha which means "false writings" and is not even on par with the Apocrypha. However, both are non-canonical because they were not inspired.

Again I ask you StrongAxe, do you think Maccabees is inspired? How about Tobias? Please answer.
---jason9835 on 8/16/14


Send a Free Heavenly Angel Ecard


1 Enoch 1:9:
"And behold! He cometh with ten thousands of His holy ones To execute judgement upon all, And to destroy all the ungodly: And to convict all flesh Of all the works of their ungodliness which they have ungodly committed, And of all the hard things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him."

Jude 1:14-15:
"... Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him."

Allowing for variations in translations, this is almost a word for word quote.
---StrongAxe on 8/16/14


//Yet Ruth (a canonical book) is never cited//

There is more than just Ruth that is not quoted, however, what youre forgetting is the OT was in three parts: The Law, The Prophets, and The Psalms. Ruth is included in third part. Jesus himself referred to all three Luke 24:44.

//Jude 1:14 directly quotes 1 Enoch 1:9//

Its similar, but not a direct quote. Youre assumption that it is is purely speculation on your part. Perhaps they were both aware of the same prophecy.

//Titus 1:12 quotes the pagan Greek philosopher Epimenides//

Paul was simply quoting a popular saying at the time, nothing more nothing less.

So tell me StrongAxe, do you think Maccabees is inspired? How about Tobias? Please share.
---jason9835 on 8/16/14


jason9835:

You said: Nowhere in the New Testament are any of the apocrypha books cited. Jesus quoted from the Old Testament, never from the apocryphal books.

Yet Ruth (a canonical book) is never cited, Jude 1:14 directly quotes 1 Enoch 1:9, part of the pseudepigrapha, and Titus 1:12 quotes the pagan Greek philosopher Epimenides. There are also many books directly mentioned that no longer exist (e.g. Jasher).

So, if being quoted in the New Testament is a determining factor for whether books should be included in the Old Testament, we must throw Ruth out, and put Enoch (and even Epimenides) in.
---StrongAxe on 8/16/14


//Wow, and you are able to determine that Maccabees is not inspired, by what method?

The apocrypha promote doctrines which are at odds with the Bible. Nowhere in the New Testament are any of the apocrypha books cited. Jesus quoted from the Old Testament, never from the apocryphal books.

Maccabees teaches prayer for the dead: It is therefore a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead, that they may be loosed from sins 2 Maccabees 12:46. This is paganism. The bible teaches no second chances after death: And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment Heb 9:27
---jason9835 on 8/15/14


Read These Insightful Articles About Laptops


Lawrence:

SO many things would show God schizophrenic if Father, Son, and Holy Spirit were one and the same:

Mt 28:19: "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of me, myself and I."

Lk 24:22: "If I be willing, I will remove this cup from myself: nevertheless not my will, but mine, be done."

Lk 12:10: "And whosoever shall speak a word against me, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against me it shall not be forgiven."

Mt 3:16-17: "And, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw himself descending like a dove, and lighting upon himself, And lo his voice from heaven, saying, 'This is me, in whom I am well pleased.'".
---StrongAxe on 8/15/14


Yes God gave the insight n revelation in who He Is. The Mighty God Is Jesus. He has 1 Church which is in Acts. People are saved from their sins.
I used to go to 8th ave bapt church here in city where I live even visited others. Thank God No more deceiving Lies from those manmade theology ideology trinity peoples. 2nd Cor. 11 v 14 has churches Rev 17 vs 4 5 6. God has Nothing to do with them. I'm not in the group people that drink smoke do other as such n they Thnk their alright with God. These people are savedKept in their sins.
---Lawrence on 8/15/14


He also was that voice coming out from heaven. I'm not denying but God can do all things, since it Is all about Him n for Him.
---Lawrence on 8/14/14

If it is all about Him for Him, then why does He want a relationship with us and wants to dwell within us?

No, our God is a God of relationship from time Eternal. All three are separate but indwelling each other. All so closely indwelling that the best word to describe it is one. And they want to include us and connect us to them, because at the core they are about RELATIONSHIP.

A single entity would only want to be worshipped and admired from afar, not dwelling inside us.
---Mark_Eaton on 8/15/14


Lawrence A vision that contradicts the Bible is a false one.


Matthew 7:21

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven, but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Mat 10:33

But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

JESUS is both GOD and man. While on earth He limited himself and the Father worked alone with the Holy Spirit.


Matthew 24:36

But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/15/14


Read These Insightful Articles About Lawyer


Not mine, but probably yours. Does it have historical significance? Perhaps. Is it inspired? Definitely not!
---jason9835 on 8/14/14

Wow, and you are able to determine that Maccabees is not inspired, by what method?

What is accepted is that Maccabees did not make the Rabbinical cannon for whatever reason, political, spiritual, or historical. While it does fit many of the criteria for selection, the Jamnian council did not select it. Luther later accepted the smaller Rabbinical canon which has since removed it from the Protestant Bible.
---Mark_Eaton on 8/15/14


Mark
God. It's all about Him n for Him. While God was in the fleshly body of Jesus standing in the water He knew what was going on in the world n His universe, even He had control of it all. He also was that voice coming out from heaven. I'm not denying but God can do all things, since it Is all about Him n for Him. It confounded my mind until He gave me the Revelation. I have no say about it.
---Lawrence on 8/14/14


Lawrence, I am not a pervert, sadist, stupid or unsaved. I am a born again believer and it's fine whatever you choose what to believe. There is a Holy trinity. Who do you think God is? He is God the Father, His Son, Jesus Christ is just that that...God the Son. Where does the Holy Spirit come from? They are the third person and is called the Holy Spirit or Holy Ghost. Now. How do you explain that? You cannot explain that. Makes me wonder about your soul.
---shira4368 on 8/14/14


//But 2 Maccabees IS part of the Bible//

Not mine, but probably yours. Does it have historical significance? Perhaps. Is it inspired? Definitely not!
---jason9835 on 8/14/14


Read These Insightful Articles About Dedicated Hosting


Other so called trinity religion Is man made theology ideology, trying to prove something that Is Not.
---Lawrence on 8/14/14

Please Lawrence, help us understand. What are we trying to prove which is not?

Is Heavenly Father not God? Is Jesus not God? Is the Holy Spirit not God?

What is it about these three do you see that we do not?

Whose voice do we hear during Jesus baptism? How can the Spirit descend onto Jesus during baptism if they are the same entity? Is God "divided" during baptism?

Jesus was either a lunatic by talking about His Father when He was talking about Himself or Jesus and Heavenly Father are two different entities.
---Mark_Eaton on 8/14/14


Correct Cluny 2Maccabees is part of your Bible. But even then it is not the doctrine of Purgatory but a reference to praying for the dead.

Lawrence this topic is not on the Trinity. So it does not belong here.

Start a sight on why you think oneness is correct and show it. If you can.

But then you follow your church tradition and not the Bible.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/14/14


\\Purgatory although having some roots in the past was not truly developed until the 11th century and is partially based on 2Maccabees.

Unlike the Trinity it does not come from the Bible and is a kind of salvation by torture instead of grace. \\

But 2 Maccabees IS part of the Bible.

Actually "salvation by torture" not the RC doctrine of purgatory, but rather a Protestant parody of it. But I'll let Reuben develop this.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 8/14/14


Shira
The only trinity I find Is, the devil the false prophet n the antichrist.
Other so called trinity religion Is man made theology ideology, trying to prove something that Is Not. For those that do believe in such which Are many. Along with those that worship other dif gods, the atheist, the agnostics, sexual perversions other etc, makes even More many, Mat. 7 v 13. Destruction hell n the lake of fire.
---Lawrence on 8/14/14


Read These Insightful Articles About Online Marketing


Lawrence, will you please shoe us why you don't believe in the trinity? The trinity is all thru the Word of God. How do you come to that conclusion?
---shira4368 on 8/13/14


Purgatory although having some roots in the past was not truly developed until the 11th century and is partially based on 2Maccabees.

Unlike the Trinity it does not come from the Bible and is a kind of salvation by torture instead of grace.

Good point BryanG

The doctrine of the harrowing of hell is from a 425A.D. So Jim it does not come from the Bible. Even though it has changed it's name and some aspects to get to your understanding.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/13/14


Heaven is real.

Hell is real.

Oneness/modalists will, apart from God's mercy, wind up in the latter.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 8/13/14


Lawrence: What if spiritually dead Adam & Eve were in fact put out of the Garden into a purgatory (the world)?

Purgatory: a place or state of suffering inhabited by the souls of sinners who are expiating their sins, by the blood of the Lamb (Jesus), before going to heaven.

If the Trinity is fictitious: 1. Who was God talking to in G1:26-27, 3:22
2. (a.) Jesus was (identified as the Son of God), after being baptized & (b.) he saw the Spirit of God (appearing like a dove) & (c.) heard the voice of God (the Father) speaking from heaven. Matt. 3:16-17

Bottom Line: ONE GODhead, three distinct personalities ~ Father, Son & Holy Spirit ~ the Trinity of God.
---Leon on 8/13/14


Read These Insightful Articles About VoIP Service


For purgatory & trinity Is Fictisious. Heaven is real, hell is real.
---Lawrence on 8/13/14


I believe when we die, we either rest in the Lord or go to Hades until the day of the resurrection. Time is irrelevant to God. When you wake up from a deep sleep, it seems like you were only asleep momentarily. There are two resurrections. The first resurrection is of all of God's people who have died while walking with the Lord, as well as the rapture of those of us who are still alive who believe in Jesus. The second resurrection accures after the 1000 year reign of Christ, in which the dead are raised to face the judgement throne, and that's when Jesus will seperate the sheep from the goats! Bahahahahad goat! Rev 20:4-6 and then Rev 20:11-15 God bless!
---BryanG on 2/7/09


***
where are those similar people today, those who oppose Jesus and HIS Church,Who so vehemenently opposes the RCC His doctrine and why?
***

nobody opposes rcc they are PROGRAMMED to believe EVERYONE opposes

rcc has LARGEST membership ...most wealthy religious system on earth

COMPARE to Christ who tells us HIS Flock is LITTLE ....many forget that Christ preached to many thousands who walked away ...120 left on day of Pentacost

NO OPPOSITION to rcc ...Truth is unchanging MANY STAND up for Gods Truth in His Holy Bible ...rcc does not follow Gods Truth choosing Constantine christianity who slapped Christ over pagan tradition

purgatory ...another pagan practice unsupported by Gods Truth
---Rhonda on 10/10/08


Purgatory existed up and until Jesus went into the earth and sat the captive free. The captives were in Purgatory Or Paradise. The captives or believers were seen in Jerusalem on their way to heaven. Purgatory no longer existed after Jesus took the keys of the kingdom from satan and released the believers who were in purgatory. Purgatory was were satan held the believers in prison.
It was a part of hell if you will,but not punished by fire etc.
---Jim on 10/10/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Settlements


Lawrence:- Believe what you wish but it is 'not' the truth.Who were the ELDERS in the time of Jesus ?why did the Scribes and Pharisees always have a bone of contention to pick with Jesus?They were plotting to kill Jesus Matt12:14 where are those similar people today, those who oppose Jesus and HIS Church,Who so vehemenently opposes the RCC His doctrine and why?This is what Jesus speaks about in Matt15:9Do you still wish to be considered amongst that crowd? So be it The choice is yours.
---Mic on 10/9/08


There is NO such place as pergutory. It's All part of catholocism's idol worship just like prayer-beads,graven-images,even the worship of Mary,the kissing of the popes ring. Such worship IS an Abomination to Almighty God. Matt 15 v 9.

---Lawrence on 10/9/08


Interesting as it may seem the Catholic view point is different than what is expressed By Pierre.I believe what Pierre says is not biblical but a opinion.The breath of life is a natural act of creation as is the heart beat.which both cease at natural death.The soul is that which is spoken of in Genesis which is how we are made to the image and likeness of God, a spirit, called a soul. This goes back to its maker if Good as a reward. A bad one lingers in the torments of Hades."AS you have lived so shall you reap."Those which are mediocer,but have minor defects, stay in purgatory till they are cleansed.
---MIC on 8/25/08


Maybe you all could help me out here. I have been trying to understand your religion. Heaven, Hell, Salvation, Belief, and Sin per the 10 Commandments or New Covenant is quite confusing...

So:

Case 1: I am completely ignorant of "god" and "god's word", but somehow I live my entire life following the 10C ((by accident).

Case 2: I am aware of "god" and "god's word", but somehow I live my entire life following the 10C. BUT I DON'T BELIEVE.

Case 3: I am aware of "god" and "god's word", I BELIEVE, have accepted Jesus, but have fallen many times (violating many of the 10C's), asked forgiveness again and again.

Where will I go in each case?

Thanks!
---atheist on 8/25/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Internet Services


Pierre.. A rather intersting response. Even more interesting would be the scriptures that support your response. I will check back for them.
Thanks
Jim
---Jim on 8/25/08


Although it is true that one who does not accept Jesus will go to hell, that is not the gospel. The gospel is good news. I haven't found a single person yet who believed that going to hell was a good idea. Besides, it is rude to go where you have not been invited.
---Linda on 9/14/07


warning! people die and go to hell or heaven!
22"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23In hell,[c] where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'
---Lisa on 9/13/07


Abraham replied, 'Son,remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.He answered, 'Then I beg you, father send Lazarus to my father's house, for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, that they will not also come to this place of torment.'
---Lisa on 9/13/07


Read These Insightful Articles About Online Stores


being dead ..does not mean you do not exist!
29"Abraham replied, 'They have Moses and the Prophets, let them listen to them.'

30" 'No, father Abraham,' he said, 'but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'
31"He said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.'
---Lisa on 9/13/07


There is no such place as a purgatory! When you die, you really don't go anywhere. The body most often is laid in a
grave. The BREATH OF LIFE (not the soul) goes back to the Creator and the soul ceases to exist. There are at least two parts to the judgment. The INVESTIGATIVE and the EXECUTIVE. The first is going on right NOW! the second will take place at after Jesus returns. Resurection of the sav-
ed FIRST, then resurrection of the lost SECOND. When he comes back, every case will be decided! Hope to see you at the FIRST RESURECTION!
---Pierre on 9/13/07


Hello Joseph::If you were there in Fantasy Island I was not there.Dreams & their interpretation are more in your line.Forgivenessof sins demands Contrition."Expiate is different its a form of restitution for the sins "itty bitty" ones that lurk in the background when you die.You would need to explore this avenue before you go to the great beyong otherwise you become a member like those whoare weepimg & gnashing their teeth.Jesus Church The RCCwhich you apostated from does not lie.
---Emcee on 10/26/06


come on pete Colorado isn't that bad is it?

My understanding is that purgatory is a time of decision. it is not talked about much, but my guess is that it is a waiting place. The old testament speaks quite a bit on the subject using hebrew words. But I pesonally don't know. there just might be a pergitory and all people might go there. Read CS Lewis' the great divorce it'll give you some pretty throught provocing reading on the subject.
---Jared on 10/26/06


Read These Insightful Articles About Business Training


hell - lake of fire, Paradise----Heaven
---rw on 7/28/06


Emcee, are you sure I didn't see you on "FAIRYTALE THEATER"? Are you trying to lead people straight to hell? WE CANNOT PAY FOR OUR SINS! This is why Jesus came to pay the price that we could never pay. I used to be catholic until my eyes were opened. The truth will set you free!
---Joseph on 5/26/05


Herb, would you kindly then explain Luke 16: 19 > ?
---Albert on 5/1/05


Good One Pete;but you will find the other, sure as God made little apples.Non catholic christians who believe, they are saved, believe that they will go to heaven.This I believe is presumption, as no one who dies with the stain of unrepantant sin goes to heaven.Only the spotless go there.Catholics firmly believe that after death people with venial sins go to a place called Purgatory where they stay, to expiate & cleanse themselves of sin.People who die in the state of Mortal, sin with the denial of God pay the extreme penalty for all eternity as they reject God.
---Emcee on 4/28/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Software


I used to be catholic, and went to catholic school. Now that the Lord has shown me the truth the only Purgatory that I know of, is in Colorado.
---Pete on 4/19/05


Shava ... Herb has been here a long time, and is known for his forthright views.

We are grown up enough to discuss things fully here. We will never agree on everything.

Please do not try to silence other people when they put their point of view.
---Alan_of_U.K. on 4/19/05


rev herb, i think it would be nice as a brother in christ- for you to stick to the bible and not touch on other people's religion or churches unless you where God who knows the truth as to who is being taught wrong doctrine - because we will touch on yours and end up calling each other satanists and Cults - which i personally think is not a good thing to do on this forum. God Bless
---Shava on 4/14/05


Some groups of evangelicals and what have you teach the doctrine that when a born-again Christian dies he/she falls into what is called "soul sleep" until the "last day" or better yet, the resurrection. (Its sad but Adventists, as well as the Witnesses adhere to this) I would not divide with a Christian brother or sister on this but I would be lying to say that it is true. I believe that it is clearly revealed in the Bible that a born-again believer is immediately in the presence of the Lord at death. The "soul" and "spirit" are separate from the body.
---Rev_Herb on 4/13/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Advertising


Rev Herb, You said: At the end of the world, we will all be judged and those in hell would be cast into the Lake of Fire. True? Do I understand you right that those of us who have received Jesus as our sin-bearer are already in Heaven...and will not be judged for our eternal destination? Jesus took our punishment on the cross. However, our works WILL be judged for reward or loss...but our soul condition/destination is already settled......right?
---Reader on 4/13/05


Rev Herb, point of correction, the soul that will only live forever is the One who after day of Judgement is found right. If judged a sinner you will be destroyed after a 1000 years. The dead will be judged when christ comes again, its unfortunate if you die in sin because you wont be able to repent.
---Shava on 4/13/05


People die with sin or without sin, and rarely given another chance to return after death. The soul is not the mind, and the soul is not the spirit, they are separate. Each person is made up of a body which is the building or flesh; a spirit which is the breath or aspiration; and a soul which is the life or anima. The soul can be living or dead. When one dies the spirit leaves the body and soul, and goes back to God. The body and soul remain behind on earth, until that time that the Lord will call for the dead to rise. (Mark 12:30; Acts 17:25; I Thessalonians 5:23; Hebrews 4:12).
---Eloy on 4/13/05


Oops!
My last response was for JIM no Jeff.
Sorry!
---Pierre on 4/13/05


Read These Insightful Articles About Eating Disorders


To Jeff:
GEN: 2,7 God created man out of the dust of the earth and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life. Result: A LIVING SOUL ECC: 12,7 At death the body returns to dust, the breath of live returns to God. Result: NO MORE LIVING SOUL. (NB. SPIRIT = BREATH OF LIFE) see Job 27,3. When the breath returns to God, the thoughts perish! PS 145:3-4. 1st+2nd resurection, see John 5:28-29.
---Pierre on 4/13/05


We go into the presence of God when we die. read 2 Corinthians 5:8, and Revelation 14:13 And Nobody will be judged untill the end of the Tribulation.
---a_friend on 4/13/05


pierre, Where do you get your info? What bible are you reading. The soul lives forever. If we accept Jesus as Lord and saveiour, then we go live with the Lord. To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. If we reject Jesus, we go to hell. At the end of the world, we will all be judged and the sinner and Hell will be cast into the Lake Of Fire. Two different places.
---Rev_Herb on 4/12/05


Copyright© 1996-2015 ChristiaNet®. All Rights Reserved.