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Explain Purgatory Doctrine

Is there such a place as purgatory? I've never heard this issue addressed in my church. Is this strictly a Catholic doctrine? And where does this teaching come from?

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Emcee: I believe the Word of God from cover to cover, ALL the scriptures, as written and taught by the Holy Spirit, not as interpreted by the Catholic church. I have received Jesus Christ of Nazareth as my Lord and Savior, been water baptized and baptized in the Holy Spirit. I am a believer through and through and am secure in the fact that Jesus has provided Himself as a sacrifice for my sins, so that I will be in heaven with Him when I die. No one can take that truth of the Bible away from me.
---holly4jc on 7/31/07

Unholy HollyListen to your investigativefindings
1Mat16:17-17 --Infamouswords are Gods words.
2"I'm for Him:Proveit dont contest His word.
3"I choose to be hot for Jesus>--then why deny Him,dont condemn be his champion.You destroy what HE Builds"The Gates of hell shall not prevailagainst it.The tongue that speaks is action,recieve Him His body is food & drink.
---Emcee on 7/30/07

1) Emcee: I have investigated your claim of the infamous scripture of Matt 16:17-19 and when put into context with the rest of God's Word, the Catholic church's interpretation has proven to be false and does not line up with the rest of the Word of God. My faith is sure and unwavering and there is nothing I have wavered on. Everything I have posted I stand by and all has scriptural back-up. I have not contradicted myself at all in any of my posts. There is no neutral ground when you serve God.
---Holly4jc on 7/30/07

2) Emcee: Jesus said, "either you're for me or against me". I am for HIM...not the Catholic church or any man-made doctrine. I will continue to defend the truth and lift up the name of the Lord, Jesus Christ of Nazareth and defend His Word. It's all about HIM and HIM alone, not me, not you, not Mary, the Pope or any church building or denomination. I will not remain silent when false doctrines are being preached that takes away the Glory from God.
---Holly4jc on 7/30/07

3) Emcee: Having myself been victimized by Satan in my life, I long to see others set free also. I HATE Satans lies and deception. The truth burns within me, and to speak the truth and reveal the lies, well it's what I am called to do and I will be obedient to MY call, just as Mary was obedient to her call.

Revelation 3:16
So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth.

I choose to be "hot" for Jesus!!
---Holly4jc on 7/30/07

Trish - ("On one side of the gulf are the ones who did not except Christ and the other side are those who did but all are with God.") -- You need to read that Scripture again. They are not all with God. There was a great chasm fixed between the two and nobody could cross from one to the other. One side is in Heaven, and the other, Lazarus' side, in Hell.
---Helen_5378 on 7/30/07

Mario::How many times do we mess up does He forgive us---Yes! so why not Peter whom He chose & trusted. Do you think He chose unwisely,would you like to tell Him that?We should not question the actions of the Lord.He always knows best.
---Emcee on 7/29/07

Holly:I deliberately addressed you as holy.because you were being unholy.If you say we are one by quoting scripture then why do you attack.This would be unholy holly.You say one thing but then contradict your self which shows instability.If you do not agree with The Doctrine of Catholisism is it not better to investigate than denigrate?Every thing is done by Gods word & it is only the apostate & those who serve satan that denigrate the others remain Neutral or havent you noticed.Go in Peace.
---Emcee on 7/29/07

Purgatory predominately comes from the catholic faith. But Luke 16:26 advise a gulf where we go if we die before Christ returns. On one side of the gulf are the ones who did not except Christ and the other side are those who did but all are with God.
---trish on 7/29/07

Abomination, there purgatory is explained in one word.
---MARK_N on 7/29/07

1) Emcee:

Once called me HOLY :-) You accuse me of using scripture to cover scripture and are correct, I gladly do. When Jesus was in the desert for 40 days and then Satan came to test Him, Jesus used SCRIPTURE to answer Satan. Everything MUST be tested by scripture. Scripture is our "plumb line" to God, we should measure ourselves against it daily, in everything we do. If it a claim does not measure up with the ENTIRE Word of God, then it is not of God.
---Holly4jc on 7/29/07

2) Emcee:

2 Timothy 3:16

ALL Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness.

Isaiah 28:10

10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept, line upon line, line upon line, here a little, there a little.

Ephesians 6:17
And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the WORD of God...
---Holly4jc on 7/29/07

3) Emcee: I will continue to use the Word of God, quoting it to back up my points, for it is scripture and only scripture that can confirm the truth. The scriptures are part of our weapons of warfare against the enemy (Eph. 6) and we are told to use it as a weapon to protect ourselves from the attacks of the enemy, just like Jesus did in the desert. I will do as Jesus did. As I said before, read the entire bible, use it ALL of it, as we are directed to. Don't just keep repeating one or two scriptures.
---Holly4jc on 7/29/07

My Heart rejoices in the Lord! Allelua to the Lord who has paid my dept in full and has gone to Heaven to prepare a place for me. I hope to see you all there. I have the key to my mansion and when my work here is done I will enter into my rest.
---Marcia on 7/29/07

I like you, Emcee, but Peter never had the keys. They've always belonged to Jesus Christ.
When Peter died, did he hand them back to Jesus? Jesus is the same, yesterday, today and forever. He didn't loan the keys out to anyone. How could he trust a man with the keys? After all, Peter did mess up a time or two. Yes, Peter did repent. But Peter never did have have keys.
---Mario on 7/29/07

Helen:: Have you ever heard the truthfulPhrase Apostolic succession & Jesus word in Matt28:20.If you seek you will find those keys THERE.Please don't be trite with me.Go back to your roots,ask your aged Mother,if you love her.She prays daily for you.
---Emcee on 7/29/07

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Helen:: Have you ever heard the truthfulPhrase Apostolic succession & Jesus word in Matt28:20.If you seek you will find those keys THERE.Please don't be trite with me.Go back to your roots,ask your aged Mother,if you love her.She prays daily for you.
---Emcee on 7/29/07

HOLY:: Who am I to argue with you the daughter of Deception using deception to cover deceptiion,But in the end the truth will out We are told by St Paul hold fast to our traditions You use scripture to cover scripture.It is said "If you tell one lie you must continue to use that method to the end".Satan has been doing just that since his fall from Grace. God is looking for suitable replacements hence he calls for Perfection this is what heaven is made of.Satan cannot worm his way into heaven.
---Emcee on 7/29/07

1) Note: Hades = Hell

Luke 16: 19-26:

19 There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. 20 But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, 21 desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich mans table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
---Holly4jc on 7/29/07

2)***22 So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abrahams bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 And being in torments in HADES, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.***
24 Then he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am tormented in this flame.
---Holly4jc on 7/29/07

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3) 25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things, but now he is comforted and you are tormented. 26 And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.

***note...the rich man went DIRECTLY to Hades (hell) while the poor, beggar man (Lazarus) was taken DIRECTLY to Abraham's busom, in heaven. And...
---Holly4jc on 7/29/07

4) ...Abraham also stated that if you are in heaven, you cannot pass over into hell and visa versa. Notice, the rich man was "burning" in hell...he was stuck there forever, not able to cross over into heaven. You are either in Heaven or Hell with nothing in between. If purgatory is a place of burning, of "cleansing fire" to purge you of sin in order to enter heaven, well...this scripture clearly shows that you cannot pass over if you are in that place of "burning" aka hell.
---Holly4jc on 7/29/07

Emcee - Who has the keys to the kingdom of Heaven now that Peter is dead? (I sure do hope that you know that Peter did die). I ask because I do not recall that Jesus named anybody for them to be handed to after Peter's death. And how did Peter manage to hand the keys over?
---Helen_5378 on 7/28/07

1) Emcee: First of was not MY pretext theory...I was just building on what Johannes said, since she brought it up. Apples to apples, oranges to oranges. Second of all, there is not only ONE truth found in ONE scripture in the Bible.

John 17:17
Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth.

2 Timothy 3:16-17
ALL Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness...
---Holly4jc on 7/27/07

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2) Emcee: 2 Timothy 3:16-17 cont'd...that the man of God may be COMPLETE, THOROUGHLY equipped for every good work.

And third of all: You're trying to validate your belief that God built the church on Peter by saying (and I quote) that "The proof of that trust is verified in the vast size the mustard seed God sowed,all the birds, come & nest there in." Just because alot of people follow this belief and have been pulled in by this deception, this is not proof.
---Holly4jc on 7/28/07

3) Emcee...Don't you know that Satan also sowed his seed of deception while still in heaven with God and when God threw him out, Satan took 1/3rd of all the angels with him. That's a whole lot of angels, many in number. Numbers have absolutely nothing to do with following the truth.

Matthew 7:13
[ The Narrow Way ] Enter by the narrow gate, for wide is the gate and BROAD is the way that leads to destruction, and there are MANY who go in by it."
---Holly4jc on 7/28/07

4) Emcee...

Matthew 7:14
"Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are FEW who find it."

Luke 13:24
Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for MANY, I say to you, will seek to enter and will NOT be able."

See...I ALWAYS have scripture to back up my statements of faith.
---Holly4jc on 7/28/07

Holly:: With due respect let me say that the word In Matt16:17-19 if you consider it to be The word of God,then it MUST be truth.Therefore your pretex theory is out of Place & false.If there is only ONE truth then it will be repeated from all 4 corners of this universe by honest people who respect this word,love & worship the one true GOD JESUS & it is the people who don't are using your pretex Theory.
---Emcee on 7/27/07

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Holy:: Yet for all your rantings against ST. PETER Jesus the Almighty Saviour chose Peter to be the initial builder of HIS church,giving him the Keys (authority)The lord trusted Him,not you or anyone else.The proof of that trust is verified in the vast size the mustard seed God sowed,all the birds, come & nest there in.
---Emcee on 7/27/07


Philippians 3:8
Yet indeed I also count all things loss for the excellence of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them as rubbish, that I may gain Christ.

Yes....I gladly lose and loose off of me all teachings that are of the world, and in error, so as to gain Christ, to gain the true Jesus Christ of Nazareth, the King of Kings, Lord of Lords, spoken of and testified of in the ENTIRE bible, from cover to cover.
---Holly4jc on 7/27/07

Romans 8:1: There is therefore now no condemnation to them
which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the
Does anybody know a bit more about God's reward program than
that stated in Matthew 25? There it appears there are 2 awards,
everlasting punishment or life eternal for the righteous. Is there
another judgement for the 'saved' that will entitle them some other
'rewards' I am not aware of?
---Nana on 7/27/07

Johannes: A scripture out of context is a pretext.

Definition of PRETEXT: something serving to conceal plans, a fictitious reason that is concocted in order to conceal the real reason.

Just as the RCC and the Pope has used Matt 16:17-19 as a PRETEXT throughout the years (out of context) justifying the office of Pope? Not to mention this scripture being quoted over and over again by every RCC on here, never mentioning a scripture before or after....
---Holly4jc on 7/26/07

Read These Insightful Articles About Bible Verses entire church has been built on just one scripture, taken out of context. How about quoting Matt 16:23, where it says...
But He turned and said to Peter, Get behind Me, Satan! You are an offense to Me, for you are not mindful of the things of God, but the things of men.

Or how about when Peter denied Jesus 3 times? Not only did he deny him, but he CURSED AND SWORE and then wept bitterly when he realized what he had done (denying Jesus)...
---Holly4jc on 7/26/07

... which showed he was remorseful, realizing that he had sinned against the Lord. If Peter was the first pope...well I thought the pope is infallible..incapable of error. Peter erred and had a foul mouth too. Doesn't sound perfect and infallible to me. Peter was a very good example of how NOT to behave many times, but he also was a good example given to us by the Lord of the Lord's love and forgiveness towards us when we mess up, how Jesus can and does restore us.
---Holly4jc on 7/26/07

Peter was a reminder to us of our humaness and how the Lord chooses us, even in our imperfection and humaness to do great things for Him and to be dearly loved by Him.
---Holly4jc on 7/26/07

Holy/Helin::The loss is yours the choice is yours. Even Jesus will not take that away from you.You did choose the wrong seed : but then,some will, some wont. Pride YKWIM
---Emcee on 7/26/07

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Marcia...thank did a wonderful job of explaining what the bible says and what it "does not say" (which is anything at all) about purgatory.

Helen...once again...good point... well said!

Johannes: Marcia's reply is so complete that there really is no need to add anything else.
---Holly4jc on 7/26/07

And...last but not least...Emcee: I'm sorry...but the book of Machabees is NOT in my bible, so I will not be reading "Book 2 Machabees,ch12:45" anytime soon. It is irrelevant to my faith in the Jesus of the bible or to my salvation, which came by His finished work on the cross.

Blessings to all :-)
---Holly4jc on 7/26/07

Holly4jc: Hebrews 9:27 Has nothing to do with the subject at hand Paul is dealing with a problem in the church at that time and it was not purgatory (try again) you stated "He said "It is Finished", what is the word "it" refering to??? A scripture out of context is a pretext.
---Johannes on 7/26/07

The Protestant church has objected to the doctrine of Purgatory by stating that this teaching denies the sufficiency and full efficacy of Christ's atoning sacrifice.
---Marcia on 7/26/07

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To say that our sins are expiated by our suffering is an insult to the cross of Christ, since it says that the cross was not sufficient to cleanse us of our sins. It says that we must suffer, that we must do something to have our sins fully cleansed.
---Marcia on 7/26/07

Jesus' sacrifice alone is what justifies and removes from us all guilt. We look to the cross and to the cross alone for the complete forgiveness of our sins and, though our works will one day be judged, we passed out of condemnation (Rom. 8:1). Our works reflect rewards in heaven, not to get us to heaven. Jesus bore all our sins (1 Pet. 2:24). There are no sins left for purgatory to cleanse because it was all done by Jesus on the cross. This is why Jesus said, "It is finished" (John 19:30).
---Marcia on 7/26/07

Emcee - ("Holly:: the only way ye shall find out about Purgatory is if you land there") -- Guess what Emcee, Holly is not going to land there and neither are you. God did not make such a place. He sent His Son Jesus Christ to die on the Cross for sin instead.
---Helen_5378 on 7/26/07

Holly:: the only way ye shall find out about Purgatory is if you land there Then you wil say "I should have read the Book 2 Machabees,ch12:45.woe is me. no onejust those Catholics,
---Emcee on 7/26/07

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Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment.

Death and then judgement...nothing in between. If it's not in the bible...then it is of man and purgatory is not in the bible. Jesus paid the price for ALL our sins and when we accept His finished work on the cross, we are cleansed from our sins. In essence, He did the purging of our sins for us, by giving His life as punishment for our sins...
---Holly4jc on 7/25/07


...He said "It is Finished", not "I suffered for some of your sins, it's only partially finished so you will also have to suffer for some of them before I let you into heaven." He took the punishment for our sins.

Isaiah 53:5
But He was wounded for our transgressions,
He was bruised for our iniquities,
The chastisement for our peace was upon Him,
And by His stripes we are healed.
---Holly4jc on 7/25/07

Remission (definition) =
1) pardon, forgiveness, as of sins or offenses.
2) the relinquishment of a payment, obligation, etc.

Relinquishment: to give up, put aside or desist from, to let go, release.

Matthew 26:28 (Jesus speaking)
For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the REMISSION of sins.

John 19:30
So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, IT IS FINISHED! And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.
---Holly4jc on 7/25/07

Holly4jc: I am waiting for your answer to my question.
---Johannes on 7/25/07

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Thank you Fritz for recognizing the truth when spoken and confirming (as an ex-Catholic) that it is the truth, as you yourself have first hand experience of being a victim of the lies. It means so much more when an ex-Catholic stands up against the lies and confirms the truth when it is stated. I praise God that He has opened your eyes, you were blind and now you go God!! Be blessed and never, ever stop seeking for the truth...for the truth shall set you free!
---Holly4jc on 7/21/07

It looks like every body is getting ready to take sides & snides.Holy Helin & now on to Fritz.That is what is foretold in Genesis 3:15 Her seed Or his seed.
---Emcee on 7/20/07

Holly God bless you for writting the truth. I am a former Catholic and now I know that there are a lot of lies and evil coming out of that church. Some Catholics mean well but are lied to about what it really means to be born again. When you are, God opens the eyes of your heart to the truth. Jesus is the way.
---Fritz on 7/20/07

catherine, you sound like such a sweet loving person with no guile at all. How long have you had a rebuking ministry?
---Res on 7/20/07

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Holly4jc: Please prove your statements like one dose in a debate format not a bash format. I would like to see where you get your info.
---Johannes on 7/20/07

Miss Catherine..since you said "everybody" I guess that includes you too :-)
---Holly4jc on 7/20/07

Catherine - ("I have a pretty good idea miss holly that you and everybody on this earth will have alot to answer before God on judgment day. You will be stripped naked.") -- "Everybody on this earth" includes you.
---Helen_5378 on 7/20/07

I have a pretty good idea miss holly that you and everybody on this earth will have alot to answer before God on judgment day. You will be stripped naked.
---catherine on 7/20/07

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Robyn: This is more false teaching spewing from the RCC. This is not in the bible. Where did this type teaching come from?

1 Answer: From Satan, the father of lies and the pit of hell, same as all the other false doctrines of the RCC. I feel sorry for the people of the RCC, through their leaders, Satan has them so blinded and deceived. I also fear for for the leaders of the RCC, may the Lord have pity on them when they have to answer to Him at the end of their lives...
---Holly4jc on 7/19/07

2) ...for misleading so many people and keeping them from knowing the truth. Teachers of the Word are called to a much higher standard and will be judged more strictly.

James 3:1
My brethren, let not many of you become teachers, knowing that we shall receive a stricter judgment.
---Holly4jc on 7/19/07

2 Tim 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers, 4 and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables.

And the bible also says...

Matthew 15:9
And in vain they worship Me, Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.
---Holly4jc on 7/19/07

Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment.

Death and then judgement...nothing in between.
---Holly4jc on 7/19/07

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Eloy:A spiritual Birth is born in the Mind which is the Brain.The heart is deceitful & just an organ,a muscel.
---Emcee on 7/19/07

Eloy: you stated:
The Spiritual birth is never conceived in the mind, but rather the Spiritual birth is always conceived in the heart, and very few people are actually born-again.
---Eloy on 7/15/07

Read Jeremiah 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things,
and desperately corrupt,
who can understand it?
---Johannes on 7/19/07

yes, purgatory is one of the many unBiblical false doctrines of catholicism. And if you do some research you can easily find out exactly when this false teaching of theirs was instituted.
---Eloy on 7/17/07

Lisa:: Very commendable extracts in support of the existance of Purgatory.That was holy & inspirational Blessings.
---Emcee on 7/15/07

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The Spiritual birth is never conceived in the mind, but rather the Spiritual birth is always conceived in the heart, and very few people are actually born-again.
---Eloy on 7/15/07

1 Peter 4:6
For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. [Comment: These dead could not have been in Hell, there's no escaping Hell. They couldn't have been in Heaven. So where were they?]
---Lisa on 7/15/07

Purgatory at it's finest.
1 Corinthians 3:13-15
Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire, and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved, yet so as by fire.
---Lisa on 7/15/07

Purgatory is>
Zechariah 13:9
I will lead that third into the fire, and refine them as silver is refined, test them as gold is tested. They will call on my name and I shall listen, and I shall say: These are my people, and each will say, "Yahweh is my God!"

Daniel 12:10
Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried, but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand, but the wise shall understand.
---Lisa on 7/15/07

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Purgatory is a term derived from the Greek, but the doctrine began with the Hebrews around the same time that they began to understand the doctrine of the Resurrection of the Body. The Jews have been praying for their dead since before Jesus came into our world, and continue to this very day. But, this is not one of the many man-made doctrines that Jesus condemned.

Matthew 12:32, would suggest that some sins can be forgiven in the world to come, but this could not apply to Hell or to Heaven.
---lorra8574 on 7/14/07

Christina:: A spiritual Birth is concieved in the mind & can happen even from Birth,like Mary & many saints who want to serve God from a tender age.Those who do not wish to accept God & are engaged in the enticements of this world, are those who are lax in their Faith & hence realisation comes later which we call a spiritual birth.This is what Nicademus was experienceing & hence the query from Jesus.Those people who are engaged in Church Hopping are on the same quest.
---Emcee on 7/14/07

You either have to go to the Pope or another catholic. This is more false teaching spewing from the RCC. This is not in the bible. Where did this type teaching come from?
---Robyn on 7/14/07

As for the debate over the terms born again or born from above, Nicodemus' reply to Jesus was how can a man be born twice etc...the term born again entails being born from above, a spiritual birth.
---christina on 7/14/07

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.emcee, as usual, you are believing whatever you desire.
---Eloy on 7/14/07

.emcee, the Greek word in John 3:3 is "anothen" correctly translated here as "again". BTW, for "anothen" = "again", read Galatians 4:9: " then turn you all "anothen" or "again" (and not, "from above") to the weak and baggarly elements, whereto you all desire "anothen" or "again" (and not, "from above") to be in bondage."
---Eloy on 7/14/07

.emcee, there is only one way to become born-again, and it is not by trying to imitate Christ nor any other person.
---Eloy on 7/14/07

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