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How To Become Righteous

How do we go about obtaining righteousness?

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 ---jerry on 10/14/05
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Haz27 (pt 3): Sin is no longer the master of someone with a new life in Christ Jesus, for God is his master now, and God didn't come from the law, the law came from God.

This is not about trying to obey the law in its entirety otherwise we are cursed, its about learning, by the Holy Spirit, to decrease that shortfall (Romans 8:4), and yet standing all the while (Romans 5:2).

And just as Christ can never die again, neither can we, not by sin, law, heights, depths, etc. So, there is no need for the Christian to fear obeying the law, and that he ought to resist self, Satan and sin.
---John_II on 1/16/13


Haz27 (pt 2): Notwithstanding, in his new life he will learn obedience and participate in the divine nature (2 Peter 1:4).

And just as Jesus lives His resurrected life to God (Romans 6:10), and He is obedient (Hebrews 5:8), so should we. Or do you suppose that Christ died so that you don't have to mature in Him?

You're constantly throwing in verses that apply to imputed righteousness, (which is a Godsend for the shortfall of the newly saved (Acts 13:39)), yet the Christian ought always be moving towards participatory righteousness, which, if he follows your gospel, which is no gospel at all, he will founder, though saved, he will founder.
---John_II on 1/15/13


Haz27 (pt 1), you suppose that it's "fortunate" that Christians are righteous by faith? Do you need the Holy Spirit for a guide or what!

You're trying to convince the Christian that obeying the law is sin and that actual sin is now non-existent. Kind of a conundrum to suppose that the only sin a Christian can commit is to observe God's laws: you're one step away from Romans 3:8.

Everything that you're putting forward is in regard to the Christian's old life (Romans 6:6) that was nailed to the cross along with his old masters - law (Romans 7:1) and sin (Romans 6:14). For now you are lingering on pre-new life, not Romans 6:4, pre-baptism, not Romans 6:3 and pre-servitude, not Romans 7:6.
---John_II on 1/14/13


SDA doctrine deceives it's followers into denying Christ.

In Christ we're cleansed of sin.
BUT SDA's call unclean what God has cleansed.

In Christ we're righteous.
BUT SDA's only see righteousness in terms of works of the law, just as the Pharisees did.

In Christ we're justified so no one can lay ANY THING to charge against us, Rom 8:33.
BUT SDA's continue to charge transgression of the law/sin against those God has justified.

SDA's are the modern day Pharisees.
Beware the leaven/doctrine of the Pharisees, Matt 16:11
---Haz27 on 1/13/13


Oh, do you know the best way of being Christ-like? Forget your outward mannerisms. Obey God even to the Cross. Jesus did!
---pat on 1/13/13




---christan on 1/12/13
Do you see Jesus?

IMPUTED righteousness is the righteousness of Jesus, credited to us to keep us from the wages of sin.
---francis on 1/10/13

In short, No man through his own efforts could keep the law, But God sent Jesus to live a righteous life, die and God gives His spirit, same one that Jesus had, so that we too could meet the righteous requirement of the law in our mortal bodies
---francis on 1/12/13


---James_L on 1/12/13
How do you know that you are 5 MPH under the sign of you are not paying attention to the sign?


The G(i)vernment are made up of elected officials who serve us. We ask that they use our funds that God has given to us to help the poor.
---francis on 1/13/13


If we could do this on our own, Jesus would not have had to come and die a most torturous death at the hands of wicked men who held power in their hands. We are made righteous automatically when Jesus saves you and now resides in you, He has made His home inside each true believer. The Person of the Holy Spirit.
---pat on 1/13/13


"If I do these will I love my salvation that I have obtained by Grace through Faith?" francis

You CANNOT even complete your sentence with "by grace through faith in JESUS CHRIST", can you? Why just stop at "faith"?

You're actually clinging on to the law instead of Christ. Don't you notice it through ALL your replies of just showing the ten commandments and nothing but the ten commandments. You still cling on to the law even after saying you have been saved "by grace through faith"? Where's grace? Talk is cheap, isn't it?

It's so hard to see the name of Jesus Christ in any of your blog replies. Do you know why? It's because there's no love in you toward Christ.
---christan on 1/12/13


Francis. You claim that sanctification is the spirit within us enabling us to obey the law. This is error and NOT supported in scripture.

Instead Heb 10:10 says "we have been sanctified through the OFFERING of the body of Jesus Christ ONCE for all".

The error SDA doctrine of works of law, makes you a transgressor/SINNER (Gal 2:18).
To continue in such false doctrines is to continue to sin (Gal 2:18) willfully after having the knowledge of the truth (gospel of grace), Heb 10:26

SDA doctrine tramples "the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was SANCTIFIED a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace"Heb 10:29

Repent and believe in Jesus
---Haz27 on 1/12/13


\\\You expect us to believe that...you go the same speed regardless of the minimum or maximum speed limit\\
---francis on 1/12/13

You asked me in another blog for an example of you misquoting people. Well, there's your example.

I never wrote that I drive the same speed, regardless of speed limits.

What I actually wrote is that I drive about 5 mph under the speed limit.

And yes. Without paying any attention to the signs.

I also don't observe a law that says I have to use my turn signals. I use them without even thinking about it. Even in parking lots.

I naturally drive slow and use my turn signals, so I have no need of a law demanding them

but you don't have to believe it for it to be so
---James_L on 1/12/13




francis,
I'm really curious about the comandment to have no other gods before our God.

People weren't simply devoting time or energy to a god, like a fan of a football team.

The people of Canaan were relying upon those gods to provide, protect, feed, make fertile, etc.

When God says have no other gods before Him, He meant don't RELY upon anyone besides Him for our needs and such.

So if you're so adamant about people relying upon only God, why do you affiliate with a political agenda that has people rely upon the government?

Who are they counting on for their shelter, their daily bread, clothing, etc.

If you're so concerned with people relying on God, why do you point them to the government?
---James_L on 1/12/13


John 11. Rom 1:5 speaks of "obedience to the FAITH" (NOT the law).
Gal 3:12 "the law is NOT of faith"

Francis preaches death for disobedience to law, just like Pharisees. It's rebellion,self-righteousness, not submitting to the righteousness of God (Rom 10:3). Satan wants us under the law so he can accuse us of sin.

Is it detrimental to be under the law/obey it? With the above in mind, note Gal 5:9 "A little leaven leavens the whole lump".

Leaven is the doctrine of works of law (Matt 16:12). A little of it will leaven you completely, resulting in death.

For Christians, we're NOT under the law (Rom 8:2, Gal 5:18). Christ set us free from sin (John 8:36, Rom 6:7, 1Pet 4:1, 1John 3:9)
---Haz27 on 1/12/13


John 11. What is "wrong measured against" for Christians?
We "LOVE one another" and "love does no harm to a neighbor" Rom 13:10.

1John 5:17 "All unrighteousness is sin". Fortunately, Christians are "righteous", by faith.

Gal 2:11-14, but read the rest for context. It speaks against going under the law. To do so you "make yourself a transgressor" (SINNER) Gal 2:18.
Note also Gal 2:15. "We (Christians) who are Jews by nature (Rom 2:29) and NOT SINNERS of the Gentiles".

Rom 14:23 whatsoever is not of faith is sin. Well, works of the law is not of faith, Gal 3:12.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but you seem to follow a similar gospel to Francis.
---Haz27 on 1/12/13


1 Corinthians 9:27 "But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway."

Proverbs 22:6 "Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it."
Yeah, teach them the value of hard work and perseverance in virtue or carry on, teach them that things jut happen for no rhime or reason...
---nana on 1/12/13


---James_L on 1/12/13
You expect us to believe that you do not care what the road signs says. That you go the same speed regardless of the minimum or maximum speed limit



---shira4368 on 1/12/13
Are you not amazing the number of blogs which have to do with obedience to God? I think that there are more blogs on obedience to various commandments than anything else of CN

My life is all about telling people of the power that is available through the righteousness given by God. First to keep them from the penalty of sin ( JUSTIFICATION). Second by the indwelling spirit of God to keep them from committing sin ( SANCTIFICATION).
What better life can there be?
---francis on 1/12/13


Francis said: "Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death
The penalty for not keeping the sabbath is the same as adultery"

Francis. Note your similarity to the Scribes/Pharisees.
John 8:3 "Then the scribes and Pharisees brought to Him a woman caught in adultery. And when they had set her in the midst, they said to Him, Teacher, this woman was caught in adultery, in the very act. Now Moses, in the law, commanded us that such should be stoned".

John 8:39 "Jesus said to them, If you were Abrahams children, you would do the works of Abraham." (FAITH).
Instead, "You are of your father the devil, and the desires (rebellion/self-righteousness) of your father you want to do."John 8:44
---Haz27 on 1/12/13


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\\how do you and your friends know you go 5mph below the limit?\\
---Nana on 1/12/13

I can't help it, nor do I care, if others watch.

I have a work helper who regularly rides with me, telling me that I need to speed up because I'm not going the speed limit.

I also have a six year old son who just learned what speed limit signs mean, and he watches the signs and my speedometer like a hawk. He's always telling me that I'm allowed to go faster if I want to.

But I don't care one bit what those signs say.

When someone observes them, it's out of fear of consequence.


Same with God's laws. If you're observing the OT law, then that means you are predisposed to breaking them, and need restraint
---James_L on 1/12/13


"But I'm not observing or keeping any speeding laws. I know I'm already driving under that limit.

The signs are there to restrain people who drive at unsafe speeds."

Matthew 26:41 "Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak."
1Thessalonians 5:6 "Therefore let us not sleep, as do others, but let us watch and be sober."

What are they watching, others? You push the gas, how do you and your friends know you go 5mph below the limit?
Is it that you all watch?

The signs are there to restrain people who drive at unsafe speeds.
Wrong.
---Nana on 1/12/13


Haz27, you talk of the perils of mixing works with grace (Rom 11:6), and indeed, obedience by faith saves (Rom 1:5), whereas obedience by command is impossible (Rom 3:20). This all per salvation.

You talk as though obeying the law is detrimental to the Christian: it's not obedience to the law that is wrong, it's the belief that it can save that is wrong (Mark 10:19).

Sin reigns in death, grace reigns in life (Rom 5:21), so what does grace reign over? Is it not sin (1 Cor 15:56)? Which is our battle (Rom 6:12). By your teaching Christians to treat sin as though it were not only allows for a Trojan Horse theology: for sin to roll back in to the Christian's new life.

Yours is truly a pernicious doctrine, and it is yours.
---John_II on 1/12/13


francis, you are jumping around on these blogs and you are posting the same ol stuff. get a life.
---shira4368 on 1/12/13


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---James_L on 1/12/13

James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill.

God spoke ALL ten ommandments. The penalty for breaking ANY of them is death, unless you repent

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death

The penalty for murder or coveting is the same. The penalty for not keeping the sabbath is the same as adultery

For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Don't kill, don't covet, don't steal, honour your parents, don't bear false witness, don't make graven images to bow down to, don't take God's name in vain, have no other gods, and remember the sabbath day to keep it holy
---francis on 1/12/13


---shira4368 on 1/11/13
Actually they do
Deuteronomy 6:25 And it shall be our righteousness, if we observe to do all these commandments before the LORD our God, as he hath commanded us.

It is the spirit of God given us every believer to keep the commandments of God / live righteous lives

1 John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

Romans 6:16 sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?




---James_L on 1/11/13

You cannot have it both way
because you are not breaking the speeding laws, you are actually keeping them.

Romans 6:16 sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?


---francis on 1/12/13


francis,
the Law does not only consist of rules, regulations and restrictions

part of EVERY law is a consequence for not following/keeping/observing

What do you believe is the consequence for you or anyone else who might break the BIG 10

THAT will reveal whether or not you are actually observing the Law
---James_L on 1/12/13


Haz27, previously I asked you, "If a Christian cannot sin, then how does God remain just if the Christian commits adultery?", to which you explained to me that God chastises him for these types of "wrongs", so now I ask: If a Christian cannot sin, then isn't God unjust in chastising him? For what is this "wrong" measured against? If it's not God's law then what further part can He play? And what do you make of 1 John 5:17 (All wrongdoing is sin)?

Also, Peter led Barnabas astray in Galatians 2:11-14, which has implications with Romans 14:22,23 (everything that does not come from faith is sin), then what is to be made of your declaration: 'Clearly there is no righteous saved SINNER, according to God'?
---John_II on 1/12/13


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Psa 119:4 Thou hast commanded us to keep thy precepts diligently.
Psa 119:5 O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!
Psa 119:6 Then shall I not be ashamed, when I have respect unto all thy commandments.

Pro 28:9 He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.

Heb 8:10 For this is the [NEW] covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

What LAW has God written in your heart? Certainly not the law of disobedience.


---jerry6593 on 1/12/13


Francis. You continue to avoid the issue of your own failure to obey the law PERFECTLY (as is required, James 2:10).

The false gospel you follow is not about obeying the law, because the fact is you yourself DON'T obey it perfectly anyway. The gospel you follow is about self-righteousness and rebellion against God. By your works you deny Christ. You refuse to submit to the righteousness of God, Rom 10:3

You have been deceived with the leaven/doctrine of works of the law.

2Cor 11:3 "But I fear, lest somehow, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ."

Repent and believe in Jesus.
---Haz27 on 1/11/13


wow francis, you are riding a dead horse. I don't kill either and I don't bare false witness either. the subject you keep harping on has nothing to do with righteoursess. our only hope is in Jesus Christ.
---shira4368 on 1/11/13


\\...do you believe that you should also keep these commandments...\\
---francis on 1/11/13

No. That's the ministry of death (2Cor 3:7)

You may have the wrong definition of "keep" and "NOT keep" the Law.

An example? I don't keep or observe speeding laws. So do I break them? No.

My friends call me a granny driver, as I'm always about 5 mph under.

But I'm not observing or keeping any speeding laws. I know I'm already driving under that limit.

The signs are there to restrain people who drive at unsafe speeds.

If you keep the OT laws, that means you need to be restrained. Guided, as if you don't know how to act

I am guided by the Spirit, not the letter
---James_L on 1/11/13


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Romans 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit

In short, No man through his own efforts could keep the law, But God sent Jesus to live a righteous life, die and God gives His spirit, same one that Jesus had, so that we too could meet the righteous requirement of the law in our mortal bodies

Eph 3:16 he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man,

Do you not want your inner man to be strengthened by His spirit?
---francis on 1/12/13


---shira4368 ---Haz27
--christan -- trey --Mark_V

DO ANY OF YOU:
Exodus 20:3 have other gods before Jehovah.
Exodus 20:4 make unto thee any graven image, and bow down to them
Exodus 20:7 take the name of the LORD thy God in vain,
Exodus 20:12 Dishonour your father and thy mother:

If not why not?
---francis on 1/11/13


---James_L Yuu are saved by GRACE, do you believe that you should also keep these commandments NOT as a means of salvation but because you love God?



Exodus 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image,..
Exodus 20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain,
Exodus 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother:
Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not Kill.
Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.
Exodus 20:15 Thou shalt not steal.
Exodus 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness.
Exodus 20:17 Thou shalt not covet
---francis on 1/11/13


Psalm 15 describes the walk of the righteous doer of the will of God.

Matthew 7:21 "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven, but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven."
Matthew 15:4 "For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death."
What part of God commanded you do not get?

Paul honored and taught that it should be taught, Ephesians 6:1_2 "Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right. Honour thy father and mother, (which is the first commandment with promise,)"

What part of 'Honor thy father and mother is below you 'christans'
---Nana on 1/11/13


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Haz27, you are absolutely correct. some here have me going to hell. believe me I am born again by the grace of a Living God. another thing, the thief did not get baptised either so that lets out baptism for salvation. some faiths are based on baptism redemption. my husband was saved but never got baptised and I know he is in heaven. I watched a life do a flip flop..no doubt ever he was saved.
---shira4368 on 1/11/13


Francis. You profess to know Christ but you deny him by your works of the law.

Why do you say we're saved by grace when you judge righteousness/salvation by deeds of the law?

Why do you avoid discussion on your own failure to obey the law? Just ONE offense makes you guilty of ALL the law (James 2:10).

You argue incessantly for obedience to the law claiming that disobedience means your unsaved, BUT you disobey the law yourself. Your guilty of ALL of it.

The thief on the cross who called Jesus "Lord" was saved WITHOUT any obedience to the law.
BUT, under your doctrine that thief must be lost because of his disobedience of the law.
---Haz27 on 1/11/13


Romans 3:5 But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man)

Romans 3:6 God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?

Romans 3:7 For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory, why yet am I also judged as a sinner?

Romans 3:8 And not rather, as we be slanderously reported, and as some affirm that we say, Let us do evil, that good may come? whose damnation is just.
---francis on 1/11/13


\\I have not met one single christian who believes that he is saved by grace he should not keep these commandments in the law:\\
---francis on 1/11/13


Then you haven't met any Christians.


Galatians 3:11-13
The just shall live by faith. But the Law is not of faith...Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law

Romans 8:3
God has done what the Law, weakened by the flesh, could not do

Ephesians 2:14-15
[Christ]...has broken down in His flesh the dividing wall of hostility by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances
---James_L on 1/11/13


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I have not met one single christian who believes that he is saved by grace he should not keep these commandments in the law:

Exodus 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image,..
Exodus 20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain,
Exodus 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother:
Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not Kill.
Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.
Exodus 20:15 Thou shalt not steal.
Exodus 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness.
Exodus 20:17 Thou shalt not covet

It is this Exodus 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. That causes all this foolish talk
---francis on 1/11/13


If you want to do the law or you'll "lose your salvation", then you have not be saved by grace.
---christan on 1/10/13

If I do these will I love my salvation that I have obtained by Grace through Faith?

Exodus 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image,..
Exodus 20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain,
Exodus 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exodus 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother:
Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not Kill.
Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.
Exodus 20:15 Thou shalt not steal.
Exodus 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness.
Exodus 20:17 Thou shalt not covet
---francis on 1/11/13


How do we go about obtaining righteousness?

In the same way that Abraham obtained it, by believing God.
---jan4378 on 1/11/13


francis, not only are you spiritually blind but physically you cannot even locate where this verse "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth." came from? It's not from me! Let me help, ROMANS 10:4!

"Do you think that Christ ended this law?" francis

"Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil." Matthew 5:17 - you haven't even a slightest clue about what you're saying or challenging.

You know what? You think you're challenging me but I've got bad news for you, you're calling Christ a liar. The Word's been presented and you don't believe.
---christan on 1/11/13


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francis, you keep showing everyone the ten commandments and whatever for? "Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin." Do you realize you're a sinner before God?

"For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God."

And no, that's not from me either but the verses prior to Romans 10:4. It's meant for the likes of you.
---christan on 1/11/13


---christan on 1/10/13
You say " christ in the end of the law for righteousness."

1: Do you think that Christ ended this law?
2: Do you think that keeping this law made anyone righteous?

Exodus 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image,..
Exodus 20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain,
Exodus 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exodus 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother:
Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not Kill.
Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.
Exodus 20:15 Thou shalt not steal.
Exodus 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness.
Exodus 20:17 Thou shalt not covet
---francis on 1/11/13


James L, the testimony of yourself happens all the time. People judge you as saved, only because they do not see your heart as God does. Second, Justification is by faith in Christ alone. The passage Jesus spoke,(Matt. 12:37) refers to the words we say. They condemn us or save us. If you spoke against the gospel, they will condemn you because they reveal what is in your heart by God, the same for those who speak for the gospel of Jesus Christ, because they reveal the state of the heart to God.
Snakes were known by their poisonous mouths revealing evil hearts (Matt. 12:33-35) that's why Jesus said what He did in (v.37).
When we, humans, judge others by their fruits, we cannot see their hearts only God can do that and will at the Judgment.
---Mark_V. on 1/11/13


\\I quote scripture unlike yourself. All you give is your opinion....If you would like to respond to my comment please give scripture to validate your beliefs.\\
---trey on 1/10/13


Ummm, I guess you forgot how to read when I referenced the Sermon on the Mount. There's not enough room to quote it here, slick.

Or the two men in the temple. Are you unfamiliar with that story and you don't know it, or can't find it?

Nice, typical Protestant detraction/ distraction

BTW,
Where does 2Cor 5:17 say anything about behavior?

Does it help your cause when the scripture you quote doesn't say what you pretend it does?
---James_L on 1/10/13


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"As Christians we are called to keep the commandments of God." francis

"Keeping the commandments of God" is not about performing the law but having faith in Christ ONLY. That's because Christ alone fulfilled the law on behalf of His people. "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."

If you want to do the law or you'll "lose your salvation", then you have not be saved by grace.

"The righteousness of Christ" is what pleases God, nothing else. However, one MUST first be "born of the Spirit" to even be imputed with the "righteousness of Christ".
---christan on 1/10/13


JamesL,

Please note that when I comment I quote scripture unlike yourself. All you give is your opinion.

The scripture I was refering to is:
2Cor5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away, behold, all things are become new.

Please also note that I do not judge. God is the judge. I do not condemn.

If you would like to respond to my comment please give scripture to validate your beliefs.
---trey on 1/10/13


Do not forget the power of God, through his spirit given to us to keep us from sin in our mortal bodies. That is what is referred to as sanctification.

Romans 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Romans 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

Romans 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
---francis on 1/10/13


\\Bro. Trey, I have no clue why James L would disaprove on the statement you made and his response...\\
---Mark_V. on 1/10/13

I disapprove because scripture disapproves. Jesus said we are justified by our words, not actions.

Also, I disapprove because of my own psat experience as a self-righteous, church-going unbeliever. I stopped drinking, smoking, cussing, gambling etc and was tithing, praying, helping others, etc

ALL IN VAIN

After about a year, I heard the gospel and believed - but through a different ministry.

But that whole time, I was embraced a fellow believer because everyone there only looked at the outside.

Outward appearance is not proof of what's inside
---James_L on 1/10/13


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Francis. ONLY PAST sin was remitted, Rom 3:25.
This then contradicts SDA doctrine which says God "enables" us to keep the law.
SDA's, like yourself, FAILED to PERFECTLY obey the law, since receiving Christ.
As there is no more sacrifice for subsequent transgressions of the law/sin, where do you stand?

You yourself have said "NO, NO, NO" to the salvation of any who disobey the law.
---Haz27 on 1/10/13


If God has already "imputed the righteousness of Christ in the sinner", what more is there needed for the sinner to do but to only believe in Christ?
---christan on 1/9/13
...to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man, Ephesians 3:16

IMPUTED righteousness is the righteousness of Jesus, credited to us to keep us from the wages of sin.

As Christians we are called to keep the commandments of God.

No man of his own will can keep the commandments of God. The spirit of God in us enable us to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man,

That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us,Romans 8:4

that sin therefore reign in your mortal body, Romans 6:12
---francis on 1/10/13


Romans 7:21 - I find then the law, that, when I do good, evil is present with me.
Roman 7,22 - FOR I delight in the law of God after the inward man,
Romans 7:23 - But I see another law in my members ,warring against the law of my mind., and bring me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members,
Romans 7:24 - O Wretched man that I'am ! Who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Romans 7:25 - I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So with the mind I serve the the Law of GOD : but with the flesh the law of sin.

1 Corinthians 15:52 - IN a moment, in a twinkling of an eye, at the last trump shall sound, and the dead shall be raise incorrupitible, - and we shall be change.
---RICHARDC on 1/10/13


"Judge by appearances, and you will welcome false brethren who are "towing the line", while condemning believers who struggle to live up" JamesL

Believers will struggle with their sins but their struggle is not to prove to the world anything or "live up" to anyone's expectations. The struggle is because the Spirit of God resides in their regenerated spirit.

Make no mistake, there will be a difference to the life of a Christian. Christ taught, "For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned."

You see, the good Samaritan never went out of his way to look for good works if you care to read the account in Luke 10:30-37.
---christan on 1/10/13


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Bro. Trey, I have no clue why James L would disaprove on the statement you made and his response when you said,

"\\Our actions show that God has made us new creatures in Christ\\
---trey on 1/9/13"


Jesus told us that those of God would produce good fruits. The actions or works we do are cause by the Spirit who now lives in the lives of all believers. It was ordained that way by God. This is Scripture not a protestant invention.
"For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them" (Eph. 2:10). Thank you brother for the Truth.
---Mark_V. on 1/10/13


\\Our actions show that God has made us new creatures in Christ\\
---trey on 1/9/13

HUH ????

You need to read more scripture, and less Protestant doctrine.

Jesus said it's not what we do, but what we think about what we do.

Read all the charges of hypocrisy in the Sermon on the Mount. Those hypocrites prayed, gave alms, and all sorts of outward things that Protestants would perceive as evidence of new life.

Two men in the temple, praying:
1) I thank God I'n not like this man.
2) Have mercy on me, a sinner.
Which one went up more justified?

Judge by appearances, and you will welcome false brethren who are "towing the line", while condemning believers who struggle to live up
---James_L on 1/9/13


"No one is made righteous by just 'belief'." Nana

Really? Let's see what Scripture says, "For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory, but not before God. For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness."

Your words are truly why Paul wrote the next verse and warns, "Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt."

So, what you've said is unbiblical for it is clearly written, "But to him that worketh not, but believeth on Him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness."

Your confession is one of works and not grace.
---christan on 1/9/13


Nana, you said: "Faith must be lived and put in practice or is worthless"

That's correct. And what works do we do that shows our faith? Jesus answered this is John 6:29. These works are to BELIEVE in Jesus.

BUT, the law is NOT of faith, Gal 3:12. Hence those preaching obedience to the law are showing by their works that they deny Christ, Tit 1:16. They're in unbelief.

Christians keep his commandments and 1John 3:23 tells us what they are. 1) BELIEVE in Jesus. 2) LOVE one another.

If you claim obedience to the law is required proof of righteousness then you disobey his commandments.
---Haz27 on 1/9/13


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Our actions show that God has made us new creatures in Christ!!!
---trey on 1/9/13
Amen
1 John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil, for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin, for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1 John 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.
---francis on 1/9/13


"IMPARTED RIGHTEOUSNESS is the righteousness given to us by God TO ENABLE US to keep ALL his Laws." francis

And have you been walking a PERFECT LIFE since you've been "IMPARTED RIGHTEOUSNESS" by God?

If God has already "imputed the righteousness of Christ in the sinner", what more is there needed for the sinner to do but to only believe in Christ? If the sinner has to "walk a perfect life" then his salvation is no more of grace but of works.

See how ridiculous your "IMPARTED RIGHTEOUSNESS" doctrine is? It's in conflict with the "imputation" doctrine as taught in the Scriptures.
---christan on 1/9/13


James_L,

Faith must be lived and put in practice or is worthless, 1Cor.13:13
John 15:2 "Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away..." Next verse he said, "Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you." Yet, he follows that with "Abide in me" and "keep my commandments".

Take Romans 4:4_5 along your line of thought, yet see what Paul quotes the Lord saying in 2Cor.6:17_18?

2Cor.5:20_21 "... be ye reconciled to God. ... that we might be made the righteousness of God in him."
---Nana on 1/9/13


1. We are unrighteous sinners!!!
Rom3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

2. Rom5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
Rom5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
BEFORE GOD WE ARE MADE RIGHTEOUS BY THE BLOOD OF CHRIST!

3. Being made righteous by the blood of Christ we are now able to commit righteous works:
Gal3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

Our actions show that God has made us new creatures in Christ!!!
---trey on 1/9/13


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there is none righteous, no not one. we are as dirty rags and I know of no one who can keep the law. francis, even you can't unless you have a glorified body. we can all try to live righteous but as long as we have this body, it ain't gonna happen.
---shira4368 on 1/9/13


John 11. Are you saying Christians are under the law?

You quote Isaiah 53:12 "For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors"

Who is a transgressor?
Gal 2:18 "if I build again the things which I destroyed (works of law), I make myself a transgressor"

Anyone judging righteousness by obedience to the law is a transgressor/sinner.

BUT, anyone believing in Jesus, his faith is counted for righteousness. Such are NOT under the law. Hence they've "CEASED from sin" (1Pet 4:1), "CANNOT sin" (1John 3:9).

If one is justified without deeds of law/they're not under the law, then HOW can the devil/accuser charge them with "sin"?
---Haz27 on 1/9/13


Nana,
I think you may be missing a distinction between being righteous and acting righteous.

Romans 3:22 Righteous by faith
2Cor 5:17, 21 New creation, sin removed
Titus 3:5 Washed and regenerated

2Peter 2:7 - Lotwas a righteous man, but sure didn't act like it
---James_L on 1/9/13


Haz27, one must have a sin to be justified from it? From imputed to active righteousness, Christ is making up the shortfall:

Acts 13:39 Through him everyone who believes is justified from everything you could not be justified from by the law of Moses.

For all time:

Isaiah 53:12 ... For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.


And who is interceding for the Christian:

Romans 8:34 Who is he that condemns? Christ Jesus ... is at the right hand of God and is also interceding for us.

So who is he who condemns, i.e., lays a charge:

Revelation 12:10 ... For the accuser of our brothers, who accuses them before our God day and night, ....
---John_II on 1/9/13


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2 Corinthians 6:17_18

No one is made righteous by just 'belief'. Get walking...
John 15, fruit bearing.

Psalm 15
"LORD, who shall abide in thy tabernacle? who shall dwell in thy holy hill?
He that walketh uprightly, and worketh righteousness, and speaketh the truth in his heart.
He that backbiteth not with his tongue, nor doeth evil to his neighbour, nor taketh up a reproach against his neighbour.
In whose eyes a vile person is contemned, but he honoureth them that fear the LORD. He that sweareth to his own hurt, and changeth not.
He that putteth not out his money to usury, nor taketh reward against the innocent. He that doeth these things shall never be moved."
---Nana on 1/9/13


There's an awful lot of theological jargon on this topic - Imputed, Imparted, Infused, yada, yada, yada.

The biblical answer for how to "become" righteous?

Righteousness isn't some "substance" that God either covers us with, or mixes into us.

Righteousness is simply the absence of sin

GOD removes our sin when we believe the gospel. Then we BECOME the righteousness of God - 2Corinthians 5:21
---James_L on 1/9/13


---Haz27 on 12/25/12
IMPUTED RIGHTEOUSNESS is given when we believe his promise by faith. It is the perfect life / righteousness of Jesus credited to us.
Romans 3:22 the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe:

IMPARTED RIGHTEOUSNESS is the righteousness given to us by God TO ENABLE US to keep ALL his Laws. It is CHRIST IN YOU 2 Peter 1:3-4 That makes it possible for us to keep his commandments

1 John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

Romans 2:13 For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
---francis on 1/9/13


Hi John II. Do you define "sin" as transgression of law (1John 3:4)?
If so, then why say Christians can be accused of sin when we're not under the law (Rom 8:2, Rom 10:4, Gal 5:18)?

The reality is Christians still do wrong at times. And God chastises accordingly. BUT, the charge of "sin"/transgression of law (which includes death as penalty) does not apply to Christians.
Who can lay ANY THING to the charge of those God has justified, Rom 8:33

1Pet 4:18 "if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?"

2 Groups described here.
Group 1 Righteous/saved
Group 2 Ungodly, Sinner, unsaved.
Clearly there is no righteous saved SINNER, according to God.
---Haz27 on 1/8/13


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Well put there John II.
---Nana on 1/8/13


Haz27, if a Christian cannot sin, then how does God remain just if a Christian sleep with another man's wife?

(If it's hard to stand before jealousy (Proverbs 27:4), then pity the poor fool who says to the offended husband, 'Calm down. I'm a Christian, I cannot sin')

You've got a one-way-street Doctrine of Imputation going on. Content are you to have Christ's righteousness imputed to you, yet you are seemingly ignorant in that your sins are being imputed to Christ on the cross.

I don't know how quickly this happens, infinitesimal, but you still do the dirty deed, not Christ

In the same way that Christ has not become a sinner, for He is still sinless, neither are you now without sin, for you are still a sinner.
---John_II on 1/8/13


Abram (Abraham) believed the Lord, and He credited it to him as righteousness. (Gen. 15:6 NIV)
We believe in God's provision (Jesus Christ) and we become righteous.
We cannot obtain this righteousness on our own.
---John on 4/20/08


Knowing Christ as Savoir is the only way to obtain righteousness. Even than, it's imputed, not earned.
---WIVV on 8/20/07


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Jerry, Praise God for those verses :)
---Ulrika on 10/24/05


jerry, Read the context of Colossians 2. Paul is saying that Christ has freed us from the O.T. Law, but we must stay stedfast in our freedom. vs 6, "As you all have therefore received Jesus the Lord, WALK YOU ALL IN HIM." Jesus tells us that "faith-only" people, as well as "sin-supporters", will all be condemned. For faith without works is 100% dead. Salvation is not license to sin, else you fall back into condemnation. Please read Matthew 25:41-46; James 1:22-27; 2:14-26.
---Eloy on 10/24/05


Eloy, What do you do with Colossian 2:13? This states we have been forgiven, which is past tense. Christ has already forgiven us, and imputed his righteousness to us, Romans 4:1-12.
---Jerry on 10/24/05


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