ChristiaNet MallWorld's Largest Christian MallChristian BlogsFree Bible QuizzesFree Ecards and Free Greeting CardsLoans, Debt, Business and Insurance Articles

Is Freemasonry Bad Or Good

What about freemasonry? GOOD OR BAD just a word here that you may not know, many Baptist pastors are masons.

Moderator - What makes you think Baptist pastors are masons? That would be a bad joke.

Join Our Free Dating and Take The Cults Bible Quiz
 ---mima on 1/8/06
     Helpful Blog Vote (24)

Post a New Blog



As to serving 2 masters, there is really no reason why one cannot fully serve God and be a Mason at the same time.
---Lee1538 on 6/1/09
Jesus said that he is the way, truth, and light, and no man can get to the father except through him.

The theology of Freemasonry teaches that God is universal, and that even unsaved Muslims, Hindus, and Jews will go to that great celestial lodge (Heaven) when they die.

"Can" a Christian be a Mason? Yes. "Should" a Christian be a Mason? Only if they are willing to be in alliance with false theology, so in my view, the answer is no.
---obewan on 6/1/09


There is a flotilla of bad information out there on Freemasonry. I even had this one chick try to convince me that the Masons sacrifice animals during their services.

Let's face it, lodges are competitors of churches and you cannot except the competition to always be truthful. One means is to instill prejudice against those whom one disagrees realizing that most religious people are really incapable of doing their own research and finding the truth.

As to serving 2 masters, there is really no reason why one cannot fully serve God and be a Mason at the same time.
---Lee1538 on 6/1/09


My google search "mason inverted pentagram" led me to what seems to be an independent site which said the masons do not use the pentagram, and my search "mason goat" led to "scapegoat", which is not the same as a satanic goat.
---alan8566_of_uk on 5/29/09
To research the goat thing you need to input Freemason Baphomet into Google. There are many papers on both sides of the debate. Some of them are pretty "parinoid".
---obewan on 5/30/09


Mat 6:24
No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other, or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

Deu 8:19
And it shall be, if thou do at all forget the LORD thy God, and walk after other gods, and serve them, and worship them, I testify against you this day that ye shall surely perish.

2Cr 10:5
Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ,
---Carla3939 on 5/30/09


Obewama ... From what I could make of all the mumbo-jumbo in Pike's book, he does not think Lucifer is Satan, and in fact says he is not.

So that means that although he is in error in worshipping a being which he calls Lucifer, he is not in fact worshipping Satan.

My google search "mason inverted pentagram" led me to what seems to be an independent site which said the masons do not use the pentagram, and my search "mason goat" led to "scapegoat", which is not the same as a satanic goat.
---alan8566_of_uk on 5/29/09




Albert Pike is a pillar "icon" of Freemasonry. In his book "Morals and Dogma", he says Lucifer is to be worshiped.

If you ask any Mason about it, they either do not know this, or they will tell you that the anti-Masons take Pike's comment out of context, and that Pike was only referring to a planet that "brings light", not to Satan.

If that is the case, why do they then also revere the inverted satanic pentagram, and also revere the demon goat figure that was part of pagan Satanic ritual worship? They may not be outright Satanists, but some of their symbols and ancient writings are at least suspected of not representing true light. Most Masons in the lower lodge do not even know their own history
---obewan on 5/29/09


Lorreta, even if it is only for the rites of entrance, the masonry has a strong demonical influence. What normal person would ever kill his child to become a member of any organisation. HOWEVER I KNOW MASONS DO NOT DO THAT NATURALLY!!! they do it spiritually putting curses on themself up to the fourth generation. there is no romance in that, it is a wicked reality with which one should not play.
---Andy on 5/28/09


My father was also a member of Freemasonry and I can agree with Loretta that such an institution did add much to the spiritual life of my father.

My mother often told me that such an influence drastically changed his lifestyle for better.
---Lee1538 on 5/27/09


Freemasonary is a good thing!! My father is a mason. I think it adds to your spirital life. You can be in any organization and if you are doing things in that organization that are ungodly such as backbiting etc., then it is not Godly.
---Loretta on 5/26/09


The rise of Freemasonry, Illuminiti and other 'secret' organizations really had their origin during those times when the Roman Church and monarchial governments held dictatorial powers over most of the institutions of society.

Free thought or anything that differed from such powers often placed one in danger of their very lifes.

Now that most of the world governments are democracies and the Roman Church no longer has the power of life & death over its members, such secret organizations have little no cause to be.
---Lee1538 on 5/26/09




Regarding Moderator's Opening Comment #2:

This document was mailed to 5,000 Southern Baptist Ministers and resulted in passage of a Doctrinal Statement that Freemasonry was incompatable with Christianity:

(The Southern Baptist Convention and Freemasonry, By James L. Holly, M.D.)

"The men who are involved in Freemmasonry, on the whole, are not evil men. Yet, they are men who are being used for an evil purpose. It is the spirit which empowers the Lodge. The ludicrousness of the secret words and the secret handshakes would be laughable if it were not for the spirit behind Freemasonry. The spirit makes this more than a bad joke, it makes the issue of Freemasonry among Southern Baptists a serious issue of life."
---obewan on 5/26/09


Regarding Moderators opening comment: "as published by Biblical Discernment Ministries:

"U.S. membership [in the Masons] is claimed at about three million, with about five million worldwide... The official magazine of Masonry in the U.S. is titled New Age. Some church denominations are also led by avowed Masons (e.g., a 1991 survey by the Southern Baptist Convention Sunday School Board found that 14% of SBC pastors and 18% of SBC deacon board chairs are Masons. It is also estimated that SBC members comprise 37% of total U.S. lodge membership.)"

37% of 3,000,000 would have been 1,110,000 Masons who held membership in the SBC."
---obewan on 5/25/09


Freemasonry is organization based on ancient philosophies. Though many freemasons may not be "bad" people, the philosophy that is embraced can and will eventually corrupt their minds and behavior. The oranization is built on secrecy and influencing others. It is usually referred to as a shadow organization. Anyone that prescribes or teaches others to follow this worldview does not understand the history or influence of the organization.
---Ernest on 5/24/09


There are spurious groups that call themselves Masons, but the freemasonry I am familiar with is the Blue lodge which follows the traditional rituals and has no association with those outside of its association.
---Lee1538 on 5/23/09


i have discovered a mason like cult in my location they are preforming cerimonies and wearing gold necklesses they stand a certin way and wear black robes they prey over 4 black boxes and then clap and then prey they do this for a long time a sword is also involved in the cerimony (sorry for the spelling i have to act fast) we have been monitoring them for a long time now and they also enter a room and turn the lights off. all of these things are signs of a cult worshiping there "god" i dont think its healthy and it worrys me what do you guys think.
---j on 4/27/09


Keri~ also if you look at Lee's messages below on 10/20, 10/21, and 10/31, these are good, accurate, honest descriptions of Masons.

It is not a 'bad' organization, but I can think of other ways I'd rather spend my time, to grow in my Christian walk. That is why I do not pursue Eastern Star (organization for women) etc.

Actually, it is difficult to find an organization or church anywhere that is truly 'on fire' for God, and that loves God's word above all else. Best wishes to you.
---Anne on 12/4/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Cash Advance


Dave the Mason. It is not for any of us here to decide whether you are going to hell or not, or even to know the answer to that question. All we can do is warn you not to play with fire. Get out of all secretive societies, all idolatrous religions, and start to discover the depths of the Word of God. If that does not transform you, nothing will, I fear.
---frances008 on 12/4/08


Hi Keri~ The Masons do not have 'deep-dark' secrets...but I do feel that the 'secret' thing is really unneeded, and resembles a kid's club-house type secrets. I was an Honored Queen of Job's Daughters (An organization related to Masons, but for school aged girls.) We also had 'secrets'...but they were totally harmless, and had to do with honoring God. To this day, I do not know why we called them 'secrets.'

I know the Elks Club also has 'secrets', and I'm sure many other benevolent associations do as well.

Perhaps the 2 of you could join a Christian organization together, if you feel uncomfortable with Masons? Best wishes for whatever you 2 may decide!
---Anne on 12/3/08


Hi Keri~ The Masons do not have 'deep-dark' secrets...but I do feel that the 'secret' thing is really unneeded, and resembles a kid's club-house type secrets. I was an Honored Queen of Job's Daughters (An organization related to Masons, but for school aged girls.) We also had 'secrets'...but they were totally harmless, and had to do with honoring God. To this day, I do not know why we called them 'secrets.'

I know the Elks Club also has 'secrets', and I'm sure many other benevolent associations do as well.

Perhaps the 2 of you could join a Christian organization together, if you feel uncomfortable with Masons? Best wishes for whatever you 2 may decide!
---Anne on 12/3/08


Dave the Mason,
My husband is wanting to join the freemasons as his father, grandfather and uncle are all masons and we have had some pretty heated discussions about the matter. What would you say to a woman who has reservations to her husbands joining a society that has secrets. We are Christians and I stand firmly that there should not be secrets kept from your partner. I do not understand the benefits of masonry but would love to as I know that my husband desires the man-ships developed. I just wonder if he couldn't get the same from an organization at church.
Keri
---keri on 12/3/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Credit Counseling


">>The book of Truth was the Bible, no Koran or other book was there, and even if there were I would have been OK with it. I had no problems with the oaths.<<"
-----------------------------------
Your oaths did not conflict with your faith, but that does not mean it does not happen to some people in some orders.

I would be hesitant to join an organization with a secret ritual where the oath to be sworn was unknown prior to the ceremony.

A civic organization once tried to get me to join, but insisted the oath and ceremony was a big secret. Of course, since I did not know what I was in for, I stopped attending the introductory meetings.
---obewan on 11/19/08


Sorry I was gone so long,

All I can say is it seems pretty cryptic. There have always been Masonic wanna bes as well as detractors. I have a hard time telling people that blue is blue when they insist that red is blue.

It didn't seem important at the time, but the lodge I was declared risen to the third degree in was duly and truly official. Truly modern, and truly 100% in line with my own Christian beliefs. The book of Truth was the Bible, no Koran or other book was there, and even if there were I would have been OK with it. I had no problems with the oaths.

Now, am I going to Hell or what?
---Dave_the_Mason on 11/18/08


Dave: I did some review on the subject of atheists and Freemasons. If you run a keyword (CNTRL F) search in the "Secret Societies" text (by Webster) using "atheist" or "Grand Orient" Freemasonry, you will see what I am talking about. It was some of the French Freemasons who were atheists or "free thinkers", and they were in the branch known as the Grand Orient lodge. I think it is well documented. They had political objectives as well that were oriented towards socialism. That is not to say that all Masons are the same, quite the opposite is true I think.
---obewan on 11/12/08


Obewan "Do you know about modern Masonic orders for atheists and "free thought" people?.

That's a fair question, but I don't know of any. I have my doubts that any Lodge could "fly under the radar" for very long pushing such an agenda. Do you have examples?
---------------------------------------------
The example I found was cited in the "Secret Societies" text. It was a foreign lodge and was some branch of FreeMasonry. I think they split off, and as a minimum proposed the agenda of atheism or free thought. I don't know how far it went, but the book quotes a speech at a major meet of Masons where it was proposed. I don't remember the country - Russia or Eastern Europe???
---obewan on 11/12/08


Send a Free Congratulations Ecard


Obewan "Do you know about modern Masonic orders for atheists and "free thought" people? The goal is a worldwide "brotherhood".

That's a fair question, but I don't know of any. I have my doubts that any Lodge could "fly under the radar" for very long pushing such an agenda. Do you have examples?

I offer up that the misunderstanding that could create such a question might be in the understanding of religious tolerance.

Just like in America where I live, we understand many great men of many religions can make a difference in the world if they work together. We can do so by treating each other "on the level", without any objective to push for a single worldwide religion.
---Dave_the_Mason on 11/11/08


Masons may do things considered 'corny', but they are mostly trying to do some good works (a lot like the 'Elks', VFW etc etc.) I would not say they are 'on fire' for God...but I do admire that they do some very benevolent acts of kindness. Masons are not some crazy 'secret-society' with evil schemes at all. I was once an 'Honored Queen' of Job's Daughters. (A group affiliated with Masons except it is for young women instead.) We did things very similar to the Masons. (benevolent acts etc.) Interesting fact: Many of the nation's founding leaders were Masons, such as George Washington and Ben Franklin.
---Anne on 11/10/08


I did talk about the Gospel when I was Honored Queen of Job's Daughters. That was my main mission as queen...But Job's, Masons, DeMolays, or Eastern Star are not really about teaching the scripture in their completeness, it is more of a social organization that does good deeds. Very similar to your local congregations.
---Anne on 11/10/08


">>Obewan, I didn't like your position at first, has that changed? Dave<<"


I re-read "Secret Societies" text and have better understanding. I think some Masonic orders are good, and some bad. There is variation between countries and orders.

Do you know about modern Masonic orders for atheists and "free thought" people? The goal is a worldwide "brotherhood".

History I found says British Masonry was largely Christian, & may have migrated to the U.S. Some lodges required members to be professing Christians. Not all Masons agree, and not all reqmts are the same!

I would object to goals conflicting with profession of Christianity or devotion to the church.
---obewan on 11/10/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Debt Relief


One last thought, the modern KT's are the only Masonic organization totally dedicated to the fundamental teachings of Christ. Here's a summary from the KT/Masonic website.

Unlike most branches of Freemasonry, wherein the Candidate need not follow a particular faith, the Chivalric Orders of Masonry require a belief in the doctrine of the Trinity. That is to say they must profess a faith in Christianity.

My Dad is a KT, York Rite 33rd degree, a Past Master, a Shriner, and a 3rd degreed Mason.

His sword, belt and scabbard are breathtakingly stunning and look to me to be very, very old, with a prominent cross on the handle. When I was a kid, I used to try it on. I never got the symbolism at the time.
---Dave_the_Mason on 11/8/08


My point is that modern Masons (and affiliated organizations) are good.

So, I guess we're kind of stuck here. I think this statement gets to the point of the original author's question. We can start another post if you want on "Aincent RCC, Good or Bad" if the Moderator will allow.

Can anyone provide any hard evidence of satanism or any heresy happening in the worldwide modern Blue Lodge, or any affiliated organizations, Shriners or whatever.

This means a lot to me. I will continue to provide counterpoints, or drop my affiliation in a second and repent.

Get your own hard facts folks, and let me cross check them.

Obewan, I didn't like your position at first, has that position changed any?
---Dave_the_Mason on 11/6/08


This statement,
"read up on the Shriners Childrens Hospitals. It's the "Greatest Philanthropy in the World".
Is absolutely true!!!!!!
perhaps you will want to mention this at the pearly gates. I do not think works will get you into heaven but it's something you can talk about.
---mima on 11/4/08


Dave: When I was 12, I had a mini-bike and the neighbor kid said I should join the Masons. I sold it to him and bought a full size dirt bike, and he gave the mini-bike to the Masons. He did not go to church, so he considered that giving back to God or something like that. What I remember most about the Masons in parades was the carbide cannons! I always wanted one of those. We used to make our own bombs using shotgun reloading materials taken from my neighbor's father's stock.
---obewan on 11/4/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Debt Settlement


I'm going to regret this:

First off, I am a 3rd degree mason, and I am also a Shriner. I should add that I am not only a Shriner, I am a shrine club president.

(I just read that I sound like I'm hawking hair regrowth products!)...I'll keep it for the joke!

Anyway, read up on the Shriners Childrens Hospitals. It's the "Greatest Philanthropy in the World".

BTW, my little indy car go-cart can easily hit 25mph, and it spins on a dime!! With wet pavement, that baby will spin cookies!! Maybe I'll see you in the next 4th of July parade!
---Dave_the_Mason on 11/3/08


Search TimesOnline. And search the Templars. I would be proud and honored if these men were the forerunners of Freemasonry.

The prayer is addressed to "Holy Mary, mother of God", the "consolation of those who hope", and "humbly implores" her to obtain freedom for the order "through the intercession of the angels, archangels, prophets, evangelists, apostles, martyrs, confessors and virgins". It adds that the Virgin Mary knows that "our enemies" have spread "calumnies and lies" about the order, and pleads with her to make them "return to truth and charity".

Pope Clement declared that the Templars were not heretics, (sounds like the Vatican kept their money.)
---Dave_the_Mason on 11/3/08


Obewan, there are many mysteries in life. Who in the Catholic Church is on the side of God and who is on the devil's side, for instance? There is war for control of the RCC. Many top Catholics are freemasons, and popes included. Whether or not the Pope belongs to any lodge is irrelevant because the Jesuits control freemasonry and the Black Pope controls the White Pope. Now, you do not have to assume every Jesuit is a genuine Catholic. One Jesuit I hear of (Michael Saso) is a trained Buddhist or Taoist monk who also has a wife and two children. He left, but finally rejoined the Jesuits. You need to wonder if he ever left them in reality and was not just working behind the scenes for them.
---frances008 on 11/3/08


">>Then the lodges that appeared in Paris especially were known to be started by families who were Catholic supporters of the Stuart Royal family line (Princess Diana was a descendant and so is William and Harry).<<"
-------------------------------------------
Frances: How do you reconcile your "history" with the claim that the Catholic church has always been opposed to Freemasonry - at least it won't let its members join Freemasonry. Has something changed that I am not up on?
---obewan on 11/3/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Distance Learning


There is a perfect continuity if you call the Jesuits the forerunners of the freemasons and the escapees of the KT's. Saint Ignatius of Loyola and St Francis Xavier both came from noble families of the basque region - one of the areas that the KT's had headquarters especially after they sought refuge in mountain areas - Scotland was the other place. St Ignatius at least and possibly St Francis fought in the crusades, and it is highly likely I of Loyola was a KT. Then the lodges that appeared in Paris especially were known to be started by families who were Catholic supporters of the Stuart Royal family line (Princess Diana was a descendant and so is William and Harry).
---frances008 on 10/31/08


The KT's were officially "disbanded" (burned?, beheaded?) in the 13th century, and the earliest Masonic Lodge in London didn't show up until the 17th century. It should be noted that 400-odd years had passed in the interim without written record of the Lodge or the KT's. That I think would be improbable, and so I believe that the Masons, (and other organizations) may have just borrowed the KT's mystery and legend. There exists today a Masonic/KT organization.
BTW- The Knights Templar did win a heresy reprieve after 700 years. Reuters and CNN both reported it. Pope Clement V absolved the Templars of charges of heresy. Maybe they really did only give up forced confessions under tortured duress.
---Dave_the_Mason on 10/31/08


...we know it is through JESUS CHRIST that one comes to light and escapes the "darkness". HE is the light of the world...........For the Masonic Organization to state that IT is the "light", is blasphemous!

You're right, it is blasphemous, it is also inaccurate, and quite easy to debunk. You're already on the computer with a net browser... I assume it has a search function.

Please, brothers and sisters, just because in the past when knowledge was scarce it was fun to bash Masonry, remember the ninth commandment. It stands for speaking truth, and the obligation of knowing what you're talking about. Even when, (and especially when) all the other Christians are doing it.

Have a great weekend everyone.
---Dave_the_Mason on 10/31/08


Cindy - take it from a former member of Freemasonry - the initiate asks for more light in Masonry, not more light in Christianity.

While their ritualistics ceremonies are interesting, they really convey no real truth concerning the Gospel message. They did however, ask me to conclude with a prayer and in Jesus name I did just that.
---Lee1538 on 10/31/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Education


The fact that Christian evangelism is prohibited in the meeting place should speak much concerning whether the Masonic org is compatible with Christianity. Another troubling this is the wordage of the initiation ceremony in which the new member must state that prior to coming to the "brotherhood", they were in darkness..........now they are in the light. Wow, how could such a statement come from a TRUE Christian when we know it is through JESUS CHRIST that one comes to light and escapes the "darkness". HE is the light of the world...........For the Masonic Organization to state that IT is the "light", is blasphemous!
---Cindy on 10/31/08


">>What does any of this have to do with the question of [Masons, Good or Bad?]<<"
--------------------------------------------
According to the "Secret Societies..." text, Freemasons have obtained some of their rituals and traditions from the Knights Templar. Some of the Knights Templar were Christian, while others reportedly became anti-Christian and had bad rituals. Some of the bad rituals were verified, while others were attributed to false confessions brought by torture by the RCC. The question becomes, which Masonic rituals and traditions (if any)came from the KT, and from the "good" or "bad" KT's?
---obewan on 10/30/08


Obewan "Look into the Nights Templar or the Assasins for starters."

I assume you mean "Knights" Templar. I cant tell you much about them, but I can tell you that my early research shows they were officially endorsed by the Roman Catholic Church in the early 11th century, the Order became a favored charity throughout Christendom. They were among the most famous of the Christian millitary orders. They were Christian Crusaders. The Assassins were some rough boys, who at one point sought support from the KT's even offering to convert to Christianity, but were refused.

What does any of this have to do with the question of [Masons, Good or Bad?].
---Dave_the_Mason on 10/30/08


">>Obewan, "Some of the religions are not true light, and as such the Bible would command Christians to not fellowship with them or to come out from among them."

If this is true, and you were commanded to leave those who practice freedom of religion, then you would be forced to leave the United States. How do you justify that position with other groups on record that support religious tolerance?<<"
---------------------------------------------
That position does not mean we cannot live together with them as neighbors, or work toegther, or be in the same civic groups. I take it to mean we cannot WORSHIP or pray together or be in the same religious group.
---obewan on 10/30/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Home Equity Loans


You're right Obewan, "It cannot be stolen from the web," because it's not copyrighted in the United States. (legal, if you're only using it for yourself.) If you live elsewhere check the laws of your country before downloading this ebook. But in the US, it's free, legal, and readily available.

Obewan, "Some of the religions are not true light, and as such the Bible would command Christians to not fellowship with them or to come out from among them."

If this is true, and you were commanded to leave those who practice freedom of religion, then you would be forced to leave the United States. How do you justify that position with other groups on record that support religious tolerance?
---Dave_the_Mason on 10/29/08


">>So you've read it. Good. As far as the "rare book vault" actually, it's downloadable for free.<<"
-------------------------------------------
Yes I found it too. The first Google hit is the same book I read by Webster. It cannot be stolen from the web, but when I borrowed it from the library at a major Christian university, they kept it in the rare book vault. Maybe they were just paranoid. I am glad they have it on the web, but it is heavy reading and many people might get bogged down in the details. I think it gives a fair evaluation, and it makes the case that many many Masonic writers do not agree, so comments by one person do not represent all of Masonry I suppose.
---obewan on 10/28/08


Obewan- "Secret Societies and Subversive Movements. Sometimes kept in the rare book vaults to prevent theft. That is where I saw it last -in a locked vault".

So you've read it. Good. As far as the "rare book vault" actually, it's downloadable for free. The first hit on my google search tonight (10-27-08) found it right away, the first link actually, with about four more pages of hits.

I think you "exaggerated" about the availablilty of this text, and I'm calling you on it Obewan. I want to continue this discussion, and I appreciate your insight, but don't embellish. It's confusing to others.

The moderator doesn't allow links. Feel free to search on your own though.
---Dave_the_Mason on 10/27/08


">>Presumably you are privy to these secrets.

Can you tell us what they are, and why the higher levels should keep the ultimate goals from the lower initiates?<<"
--------------------------------------------
I am not privy to all the secrets, however some direct quotes from high-level Masonic writers constitute a smoking gun as far as I am concerned. Mostly they delineate the goal of uniting all mankind into a one-world religion, possibly comprised of elements of existing religions. That is the goal that is obscured from the initiates - I have seen quotes from actual Masonic writers to back it up. Some might find such a goal offensive, which is why it is intentionally obscured.
---obewan on 10/27/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Interest Rates


Obewan 'However, writings of higher lodges discuss how the secrets of the ultimate goals are hidden from the lower "initiates".'

Presumably you are privy to these secrets.

Can you tell us what they are, and why the higher levels should keep the ultimate goals from the lower initiates?
---alan_of_UK on 10/27/08


">>Secret Society?
Freemasonry cant be called a "secret society" in literal sense.<<"
-----------------------------------------
True for the lower lodges. However, writings of higher lodges discuss how the secrets of the ultimate goals are hidden from the lower "initiates".
If one digs deeply into the history of Freemasonry he will find a complex root system of development with connections to secret organizations. Look into the Nights Templar or the Assasins for starters. A good reference book is "Secret Societies and Subversive Movements". It is scholarly research and well documented. Sometimes kept in the rare book vaults to prevent theft. That is where I saw it last -in a locked vault.
---obewan on 10/27/08


Secret Society?
Freemasonry cant be called a "secret society" in a literal sense. A truly secret society forbids its members to disclose that they belong to the organization, or that it even exists. Much of the Masonic ritual is in books called "Monitors" that are widely available, even in public libraries. Many Freemasons wear rings and lapel pins which clearly identify them as members of the fraternity. Masonic lodges are listed in public phone books, Masonic buildings are clearly marked, and in many cities, Masons place signs on the roads leading into town, along with other civic organizations.

In terms of what it does, what it teaches, who belongs, where it meets, there are no secrets in Freemasonry!
---Dave_the_Mason on 10/26/08


****However, I agree with you and speculate that many men find themselves closely aligned with the core values of Masonry. They too value personal study, self-improvement, and social betterment via individual involvement and philanthropy. ***


HOWEVER we must remember as Christians this is humanism...SELF improvement????

Goes completely against the Gospel and Christians cannot have two masters...



We build upon the foundation of CHRIST....not the world!
---kathr4453 on 10/24/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Internet Marketing


You make an observant point Lee. Since Masonry is not a religion, (see other posts) I guess the point is moot.

However, I agree with you and speculate that many men find themselves closely aligned with the core values of Masonry. They too value personal study, self-improvement, and social betterment via individual involvement and philanthropy.

Masons at their core respect the dignity of man and the liberty of the individual, as well as the right of all persons to worship as they choose. They stand for formation of democratic governments, and the importance of public education. Did you know that Masons supported the first public schools in both Europe and America?
---Dave_the_Mason on 10/24/08


While I agree with much that Dave states, the fact is that some in the Masonic lodge have made it their religion, as such has become a competitor to the church.
---Lee1538 on 10/23/08


">>It has no dogma or theology, no wish or means to enforce religious orthodoxy.<<"
-------------------------------------------
That is precisely the problem for some Christian Masons who ascend to the highest levels. Many of the writings of top Masons seek to establish some kind of brotherhood of mankind where all world religions are united into one. Some of the religions are not true light, and as such the Bible would command Christians to not fellowship with them or to come out from among them. I think true Christianity forces the issue of enforced orthodoxy if people are to remain Biblical.
---obewan on 10/23/08


Basic Principles of Masonry.
Freemasonry is not a religion, nor is it a substitute for religion. It requires of its members a belief in God as part of the obligation of every responsible adult, but advocates no sectarian faith or practice. Masonic ceremonies include prayers, both traditional and extempore, to reaffirm each individual's dependence on God and to seek divine guidance. Freemasonry is open to men of any faith, but religion may not be discussed at Masonic meetings.

I hope this helps you out, the three things I cannot bear to see in a brother or sister in Christ are ignorance, fear, or prejudice.

Thanks for the comments, great blog guys.
---Dave_the_Mason on 10/23/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Life Insurance


Freemasonry Compared with Religion. Freemasonry lacks the basic elements of religion:
(a) It has no dogma or theology, no wish or means to enforce religious orthodoxy.
(b) It offers no sacraments.
(c) It does not claim to lead to salvation by works, by secret knowledge, or by any other means.
The secrets of Freemasonry are concerned with modes of recognition, not with the means of salvation.

Freemasonry Supports Religion.
Freemasonry is far from indifferent toward religion. Without interfering in religious practice, it expects each member to follow his own faith and to place his Duty to God above all other duties. Its moral teachings are acceptable to all religions.

Thanks to Masonic Information Center Website
---Dave_the_Mason on 10/22/08


***Frances008 "No Baptist minister will admit to being a member." No joke about the minister, see my previous post.***

There is a Baptist/Mason church in Duluth GA. Both share the building, and both signs are out front.

Many Masons are buried in Baptist Church Cemeteries, with Masonic ICON on tombstones.

Interesting huh!
---kathr4453 on 10/22/08


I still say put down the apologetics books and talk to someone in your Grand Lodge then make an intelligent decision about the whole thing. I cannot discuss this intelligently until you do.

Donna66 and Obewan "But you will probably never find printed copies of the ritual." See Lesters "Look to the East" for fully transcribed rituals then go online to booksellers for about 20 other titles. When you are done with that, every state has a Grand Lodge, most have websites. The first five states are Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California.

Frances008 "No Baptist minister will admit to being a member." No joke about the minister, see my previous post.
---Dave_the_Mason on 10/22/08


Christians are forbidden to participate in such things.

Our loyalty is to Christ ALONE, not secret societies...without windows taking OATHS, who do things in darkness!

Ephesians 5:11-13

11And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

12For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret.

13But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light

James 5:12
But above all things, my brethren, swear not, neither by heaven, neither by the earth, neither by any other oath: but let your yea be yea, and your nay, nay, lest ye fall into condemnation.
---kathr4453 on 10/22/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Make Money


">>Freemasonry is both good and bad. Good in their chariable (sic) acts, bad in their theology. But so is some institutionalized churches, take for instance the Roman Catholic church.<<"
--------------------------------------------
Lee, I hear what you're saying, but would point out there is no comparison between the RCC and Freemasonry. At least the RCC believes in the trinity, the deity of Christ, and Christ as Lord. Masonic Theology denies the exclusive claims of Christ as God and King. To them, he is just another "enlightened" man. It is possible for Catholic theology to still save people. Masonic theology will not, although I acknowledge the existence of Christian Masons who been saved through other means.
---obewan on 10/22/08


Frances008--
Are you sure that anything hidden and secret is bad? In the early part of His ministry, Jesus would often tell people to tell no one of the miracles they had seen.Many "mysteries" of God are mentioned in Scripture.
Mat 13:35 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables, I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world.

The trouble with Masonic "secrets" is that they serve no real pupose other than tradition PLUS they cause people to become overly suspicious and believe wild tales and rumors.
---Donna66 on 10/21/08


Freemasonry is both good and bad. Good in their chariable acts, bad in their theology. But so is some institutionalized churches, take for instance the Roman Catholic church. She is one of the most chariable organizations on earth, but some of her theology simply cannot be defended from Scripture alone.
---Lee1538 on 10/21/08


">>You also said, "listen to the testimony of high Masons who have left the lodge...". That would likely be the anti masonic dogma/propaganda of which I spoke.<<"
---------------------------------------------
Dave:
1.) It is not propoganda. The high ranking Masons who left the lodge had access to volumes of Masonic literature that they eventually realized conflicted with Christian theology. They quote the actual literature in their books to prove that there is theology in the Lodge and it is not the exclusive teachings of the doctrine of the trinity.
2.) Such Masons are not against the good works of Masonry. They just found their alliegance to Christ to be in conflict with the teachings of the higher lodge.
---obewan on 10/21/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Rehab Treatments


">>Most "cults" are considered to be extremist, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader. None of these characteristics are true of Freemasonry.<<"
------------------------------------------
When I used the word cult, I did not mean in the extreme sense. In the religious sense, there are many cases of churhes that would be considered a "cult" based upon unorthodox teachings which do not recruit members. The mormon church would be one example. I suppose they to go door to door with their missionaries though, but I have only had one visit in my entire life, and they left right away and did not argue when I called them a cult.
---obewan on 10/21/08


Let's clarify something on this thread.

Masonry, as an organization, is understanding and tolerant of all religious thoughts.

Masonry has no specific creed, no dogma, no priesthood. There are no requirements as to religious preference in becoming a Mason.

Masonry does not require you to belong to a church, synagogue or mosque although many Masons are very active in their religious organizations.

Freemasonry accepts your right to belong to any church or religious organization of your choice and does not infringe on that right. Neither does Masonry try to be a substitute for your church. Masonry wants to unite men for the purpose of brotherhood, not as an organized religion.

Great discussion folks.
---Dave on 10/21/08


There are several Masonic publications sent to members. These are not hard to come by. But you will probably never find printed copies of the ritual. The ritual is memorized, and Masons who need to jog their memories have books containing only the first letter of each word.
---Donna66 on 10/20/08


Anything hidden and secret is bad. Did Jesus go around secretly when He ministered on earth?

It is true that some pretending to be Christians are masons.

The fact that the Moderator considers it a bad joke answers the question of the inquirer. Freemasonry is very bad.

Because it is also a secretive society, we cannot know who is a member for sure unless they admit to it. No Baptist minister will admit to being a member.

Jesuits are freemasons (the first) and they are instructed to go into other denominations and try to become pastors.
---frances008 on 10/20/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Stocks


Obewan--
Masons require that members believe in a supreme being, that can be anyone or anything a member desires. One branch, I believe it is the York Rite, requires a (very non-specific) belief in Christ. So, yes, it certainly attracts new-agers. It can't be called "Christian".

However, Freemasonry is unlike most "cults" in that it does not recruit members.

Most "cults" are considered to be extremist, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader. None of these characteristics are true of Freemasonry.
---Donna66 on 10/20/08


Thanks for making my point for me obewan, you used the phrase "actual literature" which I take to mean you have quotes from actual masonic rites. This I am interested in.
You also said, "listen to the testimony of high ranking Masons who have left the lodge...Christian Masons who eventually left the lodge". That would likely be the anti masonic dogma/propaganda of which I spoke.

BTW, Moderator, the guy that did my Masonic interview was a Baptist Pastor. If you e-mail me I'll put you in touch with him.
---Dave on 10/20/08


At best, Freemasonry says that Jesus was just a great moral teacher - they usually will not say he was more than just a good man.

Here is a line from their Maundy Thurday Easter Ceremony:

Dressed in long black, hooded robes during this Thursday ceremony, Masons chant:

"We meet this day to commemorate the death of our 'Most Wise and Perfect Master,' not as inspired or divine, for this is not for us to decide, but as at least the greatest of the apostles of mankind."
---obewan on 10/20/08


All one needs to do to see that Masonry is a cult is read their actual literature or listen to the testimony of high ranking Masons who have left the lodge. A number of books have been written on the subject by Christian Masons who eventually left the lodge. The literature is kept secret, but if you want books all you need to do is go to the estate sale of a dead high ranking Mason and buy them from the family. I have quite a collection in my library, and most were written by others who have used that research method. Its well documented that it is a new age (all "paths" lead to God) cult at best.
---obewan on 10/20/08


Read These Insightful Articles About Diabetes


Donna - *a "secret" organization which has no special knowledge worth hiding...

The only secret the Masons have is that they really do not have any secrets - Ben Franklin.

Many in my family were Master Masons and I really would not conclude they were practicing Christians.

Yes, I can only agree that most will not do any objective study on Masonry, much of what one sees posted about the Masonic lodge is totally false. And not all Masons can agree with what is found in some of their literature.
---Lee1538 on 10/20/08


I'm not a proponent of Freemasonry. But I won't demonize it either. My brother was a 33rd degree Mason, grand master of the state of Colorado. (Most men in my family have been Masons...they weren't Christians, but they certainly did not believe in nor practice the wild Satanic rituals ascribed to them by so many). The Shriners have 1st rate children's hospitals in which all treatment is free.

Those who post on these blogs probably won't look for objective facts. The truth makes Freemasonry seem pretty dull... a "secret" organization which has no special knowledge worth hiding...a source of business networking and entertainment for stuffy older men.
---Donna66 on 10/18/08


Does anyone on this thread have even the first idea what Freemasonry is all about? Write your state's Grand Lodge have them put you in touch with someone, and get somewhat (even the least bit) educated on the subject before you post any more. Don't parrot anti-masonic rhetoric, it's all largely disproven anyway, but beyond that it's old, worn out and it makes you sound stupid. If you have some first hand proof of what you say (I'd take a quote from a Masonic Rite as a jumping off point, as long as context is preserved) then please present it, or be silent. If the question was "Are the Masons good or bad", then stick with the subject or start a new thread.
---Dave on 10/17/08




Copyright© 1996-2014 ChristiaNet®. All Rights Reserved.
[Mall |Christian Blogs |Bible Quizzes |Free Ecards |Articles |RSS |Terms |Christian Advertising]