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Idea Of The Pope Develop

Where did the idea of the Pope develop? Please give scripture references from the Bible.

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Samuel_Thats true, But they(Jews) bought their freedom with a price, Saul was born free, I always thought that you had to have a Roman parent to be Born Free in those days?
---Duane_Dudley_Martin on 5/13/08


I was talking from personal experience, AlanofUK. I have lost count of the times I have been blocked from forums for mentioning the Jesuits evil doings and their plans in particular. Then fact is they took down 'Exposing the Satanic Empire' from youtube when it had only been fully operating under a month and few people had seen all of it, (under 24 people).
---frances008 on 5/13/08


AlanofUk, if you take a good look at those sites that remain up...there are indeed a few sites whose viewing numbers are so insignificant that they attract no attention from the monitors. Those sites are buried deep on the internet. Then there are others that do get many hits, and those ones are saying that Christianity is a false religion. So as long as the aims go along, finally, with the NWO, those sites are allowed to stay up. That is why when I find a good source I do not like to name it.
---frances008 on 5/13/08


Frances "Anyone who exposes that it is Satanic, is removed from the internet"
That's not really true ... If yuo google for roman Catholic, Satanic, you will find many entries that have been there a long time
---alan_of_UK on 5/13/08


Duane_Dudley_Martin a person could be a Jew and be a Roman citizen. The same way as today. My ancestory is Welch, Irish. But I am still a United States Citizen.

The Primacy of the Bishop of Rome was not recognized by any early church council or in the writings of the Church Fathers. When the Roman ponitiff worked to put himself in charge he split the church.
---Samuel on 5/13/08




Jerry, during Pauls time only members of tribe of Judah were given the nickname of Jew ...Paul was a Benjamite by birth of the tribe of Benjamin and a Roman Citizen ...Paul with Roman citizenship was given by Christ ministry of the uncircumsized (gentiles)

Paul was in Rome not Peter (fishermen) whose ministry given to him by Christ was to the circumsized (Jews)

Universal was not started by Apostle Peter the fishermen ...it was started by Simon (Peter) Magnus the pagan priest
---Rhonda on 5/12/08


Frances said :So because Jesus called our biological parents 'mother and father' and also said 'call no-one on earth your 'father' that makes it right to call non-biological men 'father' ?


But Jesus said call "no-one on earth your Father, so that would mean also your biological Father.. So Jesus meant something else didn't he!
---Ruben on 5/12/08


Pt. 1
Acts 22:
25 And as they bound him with thongs, Paul said unto the centurion that stood by, Is it lawful for you to scourge a MAN that IS a ROMAN, and uncondemned?

26 When the centurion heard that, he went and told the chief captain, saying, Take heed what thou doest: for THIS MAN is a ROMAN.

27 Then the chief captain came, and said unto him, Tell me, art thou a ROMAN? He said, YEA.



---Duane_Dudley_Martin on 5/12/08


All the first leaders and members of the Church were Jews. Eventually they were replaced and gentiles turned against Jews.

The Bible never speaks of a single leader other then JESUS.
---Samuel on 5/12/08


Nicole, to offend you is the last thing I want to do. I don't know how long you have been blogging here, but you may have missed all my blogs that would put you fully into the picture. I found a brilliant film on youtube and told everyone to look at it, then it was taken off youtube. (A sad coincidence.) The first part was about the Catholic Church. Anyone who exposes that it is Satanic, is removed from the internet.
---frances008 on 5/12/08




Nicole, you are right to doubt me. Go and check all the facts for yourself. Get yourself books on the period of English history four hundred years ago. Look at the history of the Popes on wikipedia. Look into the history of the Jesuits. Join the dots. Look at Catholics who led in World Wars and in Vietnam, and still do to this day right up to 911 and the aftermath. The end of freedom and the CONstitution. They are in control of the world. The Illuminati aren't the top of the pile.
---frances008 on 5/12/08


#4 So if St. Paul said that he was the Father of his discipes and the other apostles call there discipes "children and sons" thus appying a "father and son" relationship what did Jesus mean?

His admonition here is a response to the Pharisees proud hearts and their grasping after marks of status and prestige.
He was using hyperbole (exaggeration to make a point) to show the Pharisees how sinful and proud they were for not looking humbly to God as the source of all authority.
---Ramon on 5/11/08


#5 Jesus condemns calling someone "father" in the same way and intention as calling God your "father". Jesus is speaking when he warns against attributing to someone an undue role as master, father, or teacher.

We must not put our own ideas into the text as Frances and other did. When we compare Scriptures with Jesus words, we get the correct interpretation either that who St. Paul is a false teacher! I call my daddy "father"! No sin.
---Ramon on 5/11/08


The imperative "call no man father" does not apply to ones biological father. It also doesnt exclude calling ones ancestors "father," as is shown in Acts 7:2, where Stephen refers to "our father Abraham," or in Romans 9:10, where Paul speaks of "our father Isaac."
Second, there are numerous examples in the New Testament of the term "father" being used as a form of address and reference, even for men who are not biologically related to the speaker.
---Ramon on 5/11/08


#2 A careful examination of the context of Matthew 23 shows that Jesus didnt intend for his words here to be understood literally.

The whole passage reads, "But you are not to be called rabbi, for you have one teacher, and you are all brethren. And call no man your father on earth, for you have one Father, who is in heaven. Neither be called masters, for you have one master, the Christ" (Matt. 23:810). But Christ himself appointed certain men to be teachers in his Church (1 Tim. 2:7)
---Ramon on 5/11/08


#3 Paul regularly referred to Timothy as his child: "Therefore I sent to you Timothy, my beloved and faithful child in the Lord, to remind you of my ways in Christ" (1 Cor. 4:17), "To Timothy, my true child in the faith: grace, mercy, and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord" (1 Tim. 1:2)

St. Paul said he was a spiritual Father to his discipes! (1 Cor. 4:1415) St. Peter, the same (1 Pet. 5:13) St. John too (1 John 2:13, John 4).
---Ramon on 5/11/08


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Rhonda: "PAUL was a GENTILE" ???

Act 21:39 But Paul said, I am a man which am a Jew of Tarsus
---jerry6593 on 5/10/08


.ruben, again you are misapplying scripture to make false doctrine. Jesus Commands: "Upon the chair of Moses have set the Teachers and the Ministers. And he whoever father, call not yours upon earth: for one is your Papa which is in heaven." Matthew 23:2,9. He says the Teachers and Ministers pertaining to the ministry are the ones whom are sinfully called father, and not the man whom raises his children.
---Eloy on 5/10/08


So because Jesus called our biological parents 'mother and father' and also said 'call no-one on earth your 'father' that makes it right to call non-biological men 'father' ? In fact I don't know anyone who calls their own father 'Father'. Most use more endearing words like 'dad, pa' or sometimes 'sir'. The fact remains that what Jesus said He said, and no matter what else he said, you cannot take part of what he said in another context and make it an excuse to do the opposite of his instructions.
---frances008 on 5/9/08


The Keys of the Kingdom refers to binding and loosing of demons and was given to the apostles in Acts and in Jesus time to some of them. That is why they were amazed at their power. This continued on into the Roman Empire, whenever demons were around, they would send for Christians to exorcise them. This is nothing to do with being Pope. That is a worldly office.
---frances008 on 5/9/08


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Jesus said it was wrong to call anyone on earth 'Father'. That is the courtesy title of God the Father. So straight away we have the RCC departing from Jesus's commands/instructions.
---frances008 on 5/9/08



Jesus also said "Passage Luke 18:20:
You know the commandments: 'Do not commit adultery, do not murder, do not steal, do not give false testimony," Honor your Father and Mother."
---Ruben on 5/9/08


1 Corinthians 4:14-15
14I am not writing this to shame you, but to warn you, as my dear children. 15Even though you have ten thousand guardians in Christ, you do not have many fathers, for in Christ Jesus I became your father through the gospel.

We should not call anyone "Father" IN THE SAME WAY that we call God "Father"

Either that, or Paul was a false teacher,
(And yes, I'm aware some believe that, I don't)
---Greyrider on 5/9/08


Look up Paul III (1534-1549) to see what kind of person he was. This is what the RCC teaches lead the church correctly. He also took over the Brothels in Rome and the RCC controlled them for years. See also the Borgia Popes.

YOu can read in the Catachism how tradition is equal to scripture. None of this is from the bible. Evil men can reprsent GOD and human traditions are of equal authority.
---Samuel on 5/9/08


Jesus said it was wrong to call anyone on earth 'Father'. That is the courtesy title of God the Father. So straight away we have the RCC departing from Jesus's commands/instructions.
---frances008 on 5/9/08


Send a Free Apostate Church Tract


Satan. Matthew 23:9+ John 8:44.
---Eloy on 5/9/08


For the past three or so months I have read about eight chapters a day of the Bible. Some very long Chapters. So, you see, Emcee, it is not just my opinion. I speak from what I read in the Scriptures.
---frances008 on 5/9/08


In the words of the great apostle, Paul 'Have I become your enemy by telling you the truth?' Perhaps it would be kinder to let you die in ignorance, Emcee. (Not saying you will go before me just that anyone who does not get convinced of the truth on earth will find out when they die and then it will be too late.)
---frances008 on 5/9/08


Frances008, I agree with you. Jesus is the only Head of the Church. He has authority given to Him by His Father.
The Owner of His House. He can do anything he wishes. Including giving the keys to his house to whom he pleases. Jesus did so. He gave the Keys to His Church to Peter. You are not a thief when the Owner gives you the key are you? No.
This happened when Jesus choose Peter to have the Keys. Peter is Blessed as Jesus said in Matt 16:17 "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah."
---Nicole on 5/8/08


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Frances, In Matt 16:17, Jesus calls Peter Blessed because His Heavenly Father revealed to him that Jesus was the Messiah.
Do you think it offends me when you call the Vatican the seat of the Anti-christ? NO, I heard mean spirited words from so call christians all my life.
Remember, they called Jesus beelzebul, the prince of demons.
So, if the Pope is called evil names, then we know The Pope is the head of His Church.
The Church suffers just like Her spouse Jesus.
---Nicole on 5/8/08


Frances 008:: you believe more in yourself than in the word of God as contained in scripture apparantly by your theory you do not read the word so frequently like daily or it May change you.Conclusion by your own sandard.
---Emcee on 5/8/08


It is strange but Sad, that those who protest the loudest have the hardened Hearts and throw themelves against the Rock of Peter RCC built by God Matt16:17-19.and they roll down and disentergrate into little Pebbles.but come back again and again,like beached whales?maybe they dont realise "That the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it"Like God Said "MY word shall stand the test of Time."
---Emcee on 5/8/08


Peter was never in Rome ...you have been led away from the true God by your religious system

Again Christ gave the gospel of the Jews to a JEW and this was PETER

PAUL was a GENTILE and his gospel was to the gentiles who were in Rome

Gods Truth is very clear when it is read with an open mind ...closed minds led by religious sytems cannot see Gods Truth

you can keep telling people universal was built on Peter ...lies don't become truth the more they are told
---Rhonda on 5/8/08


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The Church has only one foundation that is JESUS CHRIST our LORD. He is the solid rock on which we stand.
---Samuel on 5/8/08


Messianic prophesy said that when the Messiah comes, He will restore the Davidic Kingdom of Israel. A big part of that is the reestablishment of the office of Prime Minister. If you believe there is no Prime Minister of the Kingdom today, you are declaring Jesus to be a false Messiah.
---Greyrider on 5/8/08


Nicole, do you believe that if you repeat a lie for long enough it will become the truth suddenly, one bright day. It won't. The church of Jesus Christ, the Church of God, is built upon one person and one person alone, and that person is Jesus of Nazareth, Son of God. He is the true vine. He is the only Head. He is the Good Shepherd. Any other shepherd is a thief and a deceiver. The Pope is the subsitute for Christ. He is the Antichrist. The Vatican is the seat of the Antichrist .
---frances008 on 5/7/08


Rhonda, even Paul stated he wasn't an apostle in the same status as the 11. So, to say he was the first Pope is wrong. But, if that's your opinion that's your right.
As for me, I will take Jesus words over Paul, or anyone. Jesus is clear in Matt 16:13-19 which He said His Father revealed the answer to Peter. So, Jesus put him in charge.
---Nicole on 5/7/08


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The Language of the RCC is Latin. It is sometimes called the Latin Rite church.

From Wiktionary
Etymology 1
Old English ppa, from post-classical Latin papa, from Byzantine Greek , variant of Ancient Greek daddy, papa.

So it is latin and greek.

His Title Supreme Pontiff" (Pontifex Maximus) is from the Roman Emperors.
---Samuel on 5/7/08


***Simon Magnus who was rejected by the Apostles was the first pope and he referred to himself as god***

This story is impossible since the word "pope" did not exist until centuries after the Apostles. More National Enquirer history.
---Greyrider on 5/7/08


**
Peter himself was never referred to as Pope.
**

True the Apostle Peter would never call himself father he obeyed Christ

Simon Magnus who was rejected by the Apostles was the first pope and he referred to himself as god ...Simon Peter the Jewish fisherman was given the gospel of the Jews his ministry was to the Jews not the Gentiles ...it was Paul who started the true Church in Rome ...Simon Peter started universal
---Rhonda on 5/6/08


The word Pope is a Greek word. Why are you all keep speaking of Roman. The langauge of Rome was Latin not Greek. The definition of Pope is "the head of the Catholic Church." It comes from the Greek word "papas", meaning "bishop, patriarch, or father".
The word Pope was not used in Scripture. The question by the Moderator is asking about the IDEA of the Pope- that is in Scripture Matt 16:13-19.
Benedict XVI is also known as the Bishop of Rome.
---Nicole on 5/6/08


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Matthew 16:13-19
Jesus never used the word "Petros", He spoke Aramaic. There is no way for Jesus to have made a distinction between Peter and Rock in Aramaic. The OFFICE has ALWAYS existed. The slang name of "Pope" was added later on. Peter himself was never referred to as Pope. The RCC has never denied this. Scripturally, Peter was (and Benedict is) the Prime Minister of the Restored Davidic Kingdom of Israel.
---Greyrider on 5/6/08


The idea of Pope did not come from scripture but from the Old Roman Emperior worship system mixed with Mitharism. That is how the Pope ended up with some of the same titles as the Roman Emperor.
---Samuel on 5/6/08


John 21:15-19 Jesus asked Peter if he loved Him more than these and telling Peter to Feed His lambs,Tend and Feed His sheep.
the Good Shepherd - John 10. Jesus speaks about His sheep and the hired man to shepherd the sheep. But the hired man has no concern for the sheep.
Why is Jesus making sure Peter loves Him and orders him to Tend and Feed His sheep?
Whoever enters through the gate'(keys).
John 10:46 Jesus speaks of other sheep outside of this fold.-THERE WILL BE ONE FLOCK, ONE SHEPHERD.
---Nicole on 5/6/08


A father would never let his children defend for themselves. He knows of the evil people outthere to harm them.
How much more do you think God our Father would protect us? If He gave us His Only Son, would He not protect the children His Son's Blood brought? Would He let satan and the demons have their way with us?
No, satan messed with us once in the Garden. But God vowed to satan never again. Gen 3:15. Jesus confirms this in Matt 16:18 And the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.
---Nicole on 5/6/08


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Fances008, this is taken from Catholic Answers.
1. We know that Jesus spoke Aramaic because some of his words are preserved for us in the Gospels. Look at Matthew 27:46, where he says from the cross, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? That isnt Greek, its Aramaic, and it means, My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?
---Nicole on 5/6/08


2. In Pauls epistles, 4 times in Galatians and 4 times in 1 Corinthianswe have the Aramaic form of Simons new name preserved for us. In our English Bibles it comes out as Cephas. That isnt Greek.Thats a transliteration of the Aramaic word Kepha (rendered as Kephas in its Hellenistic form).."And what does Kepha mean? It means a rock, the same as petra.(It doesnt mean a little stone or a pebble.What Jesus said to Simon in Matthew 16:18 was this:You are Kepha, and on this kepha I will build my Church.
---Nicole on 5/6/08


Frances008, John 1: 42, "You are Simon the son of John, you will be called Cephas." Cephas (Rock)
Matt 16:17 Jesus singles out Simon by telling him that His Father revealed this answer to him not mere men.
Matt 16:14 They replied, some say John the Baptist, others Elijah, still others Jeremiah or one of the prophets. Then Jesus narrowed the question to them and their own personal belief. Only Peter was granted the answer. "You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God."
---Nicole on 5/6/08


Matt 16:18 You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it. - All in one sentence. Jesus calls Simon as a title or object. Then At the end Jesus states "it". Church is the 'it' and Peter is the rock the Church is build on.
But, Jesus doesn't stop there. Matt 16:19 He states I will give you the keys. The Master of the House gives the House keys to whomever He pleases. The one He puts in charge.
---Nicole on 5/6/08


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Matt 16:19 I will give you the keys to the Kingdom of Heaven.Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven,and whatever you loose on earth shall be lossed in heaven."
Jesus knew Simon would die. Have you ever heard the statement "Peter has spoken"? That phase throughout the centuries is speaking about the Pope at the time. Jesus started a new Office.He didn't give the keys just to Simon son of John.N0, but to Peter(title)The keys will be handed to the next Pope,until Jesus returns.
---Nicole on 5/6/08


Do you think all the disciples were the same?
3 times I know of, Jesus only allows 3 of the disciples with Him in important matters.- Raising Jairus'daughter Mark 5, Transfiguration Matt17 and Gethsemane,Matt 26:36.
But in all 4 Gospels and every single time when the Disciples are listed or called. Peter is always listed first.
The definition of Pope is "the head of the Catholic Church." It comes from the Greek word "papas", meaning "bishop, patriarch, or father".
---Nicole on 5/6/08


I'm not entirely sure as to how a Pope came to be. Nor will I refuse to respect someone -who like anyone else I meet that works for God- because *God Made Them Too* to cohabitate on this mudpatch with us and do His Will.
I love God. What a creative God He is!!! Dont you agree??
---Nicola on 5/6/08


Nicole, you may have missed the discussion on that Bible reference. It has been deliberately mistranslated by the RCC.

The rock is mentioned in many other places in the New Testament. For instance in Matthew 7 where it says we are to build on a rock, not on sand, and that rock is Jesus. In 1 Cor 10. 3,4 and I am sure I am forgetting other places.
---frances008 on 5/5/08


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Please don't be presumptious when it comes to the Bible truth. Peter was not the rock (petros means stone), it was the Son of God, whom Peter talked of, that was the 'this' which Jesus was talking of on which he would build His Church. Anyone other than Christ is a usurper, a thief come to destroy the sheep. Calling Peter a stone was a kind of banter or play on words. Peter was unreliable in times of crisis.
---frances008 on 5/5/08


Matthew 16:13-19
---Nicole on 5/5/08


5
Rom 16, Acts 28:15 (sometime during 55 or 56AD) Paul never mentioned Peter (because as Gods Word already established Apostle Peter was not in Rome ministering to the Gentiles) and AGAIN in 65AD Gods Word tells us that only Luke was in Rome with Paul (11Tim 4:11)
---Rhonda on 5/5/08


6
Apostle Simon Peter (Jewish fishermans death of old age) described by CHRIST Himself (John 21:18-19) ...just as Peter denied Christ 3 times, Christ FORGAVE Apostle Peter 3 times

universal by their own account is AGAINST Christ by declaring the Apostle Peter was martyred (Catholic Encyclopedia St. Peter)

It was Simon (Peter) Magnus who was rejected by the Apostles and martyred in Rome

The Apostle Simon Peter died of old age per Gods Word in prophecy of Christ
---Rhonda on 5/5/08


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1
no scriptures referenced from Bible about developing a pope ...pope idea is tradition from men using Christianity blending pagan philosophy from self proclaimed apostle Simon (Peter) Magnus

True Christians are warned to call no man on earth Father (Mat 23:9) ...idea of pope and first pope (father of fathers) came from pagan high priest Simon Magnus in 45AD - he claimed himself an apostle even though Apostles rejected him (Acts 8:9-25) ...Simon Magnus also claimed himself to be a god
---Rhonda on 5/5/08


2
Christs brother Jude states in his book: idea of false church was affecting true church and they were even among the church itself, pretending to be body of Christs church ...the mystery of iniquity doth already at work (2 Thess. 2:7-1O)
---Rhonda on 5/5/08


3
The REAL Simon Peter was a Jew and a fisherman called by God (John 6:44,65)whose ministry was for Jews as commissioned by Christ Himself ...Apostle Simon Peter was to be chief minister to the CIRCUMCISED ...the gospel of circumcision was unto Peter the fisherman a JEW (Gal 2:7-8) ...this verse also describes Pauls ministry was to be chief minister to uncircumcised (the Gentiles) who were in Rome (2Tim 1:11, Rom 15:16,18, Rom 1:11)
---Rhonda on 5/5/08


4
Rom 15:20 Paul declares he would not build on another mans foundation and he didn't while in Rome during this time frame (the universal church had already been established by the self proclaimed apostle Simon Magnus 10 years earlier but he was not an apostle commissioned by Christ) ...Paul knew that he would be the first to establish the true church in Rome
---Rhonda on 5/5/08


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Matt 24.23-25 At that time if anyone says to you, Look here is the Christ! or, There he is! do not believe it. For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect - if that were possible. See, I have told you ahead of time.
---frances008 on 5/4/08


2 Thessalonians 2.3,4
Don't let anyone deceive you in any way for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessnesss is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God.
---frances008 on 5/4/08


anti anti an-tee'
a primary particle; (opposite,) i.e. (instead) or
because of (rarely in addition to):--for, in the
room of. Often used in composition to denote
contrast, requital, substitution,
correspondence, etc.
---Exzucuh on 5/4/08


Sorry, Jack, it is you who is wrong. The Apocrypha was indeed printed in the book, but as others have stated, Notes made it clear that it was not to be regarded as divine, and thus it cannot be regarded as part of the Bible in which we place our trust and on which our faith is set
---alan8869_of_UK on 6/7/06


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The original KJV had notes the translators wrote explaning that they rejected the apocrypha as divine and gave reasons for not incorporating it into the text. They were forced to include it. If you read them as God's Word then you ARE reading a Bible full of holes. Funny that the word apocrypha even means "secret, hidden". The contents of the books themselves show that they were no part of Scripture. Plus, all the errors, like Wisdom 8:19,20 which contradicts being born with original sin, etc.
---tofurabby on 6/7/06


Wrong, Chris.

The Apocrypha WERE included in the original KJV.

I want the WHOLE King James Bible, not a Bible full of holes.

I won't have a mangled KJV in the house.
---Jack on 6/7/06


the Apocrypha was accepted reading based on its historical value, though not accepted as Scripture by anyone outside of the Catholic church. So, the King James translators placed it between the Old and New Testaments for its historical benefit to its readers. They did not integrate it into the Old Testament text as do the corrupt Alexandrian manuscripts. The KJV translators rejected it as divine and gave reasons for not incorporating it into the text.
---chris on 5/15/06


Ramon, it's not only the Roman CAtholic Church that includes these books. So do all of the Apostolic Churches of the East, both Chalcedonian and Non-Chalcedonian. The Christians who exclude them are in the MINORITY, started rather late (16th century) and are hearkening to the Rabinnical Synod of Jamnia who were made up of the spiritual children of those whom Jesus called "fools and blind guides" who rejected Him.

Moderator - Include Jesus and the Apostles in the list of people that disregarded those books.
---Jack on 5/14/06


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"Pope" is the English form of the word Greek and Latin word "papa"--meaning exactly what it does in English. It was historically a title of affection respect for all bishops.

Not only is the Bishop of Rome called "Pope," but so are the Greek Orthodox and Coptic Orthodox patriarchs of Alexandria.
---Jack on 5/12/06


Read the history of the Bible as recorded by whom? The RCC who still includes Tobit, Judith, 1 Maccabees, 2 Maccabees, Wisdom, Sirach, and Baruch as books in their Bible? The history of the Bible that concerns me is contained within the Bible itself. There is no other literature in existance that I need to read for everything else was written by man and is subject to error.
---chris on 5/4/06


Chris-(Rev. 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book,) What book was he writing? The book of Revelation! Please read the history of the Bible.
---ruben on 5/4/06


(Moderator - If you believe that, then you would have to believe there are no absolute standards. This is how cults and false doctrines are started. Why even use the Bible at all if a tradition can rule over the Bible?) You do not use one over the other, Sacred Scriptures and Sacred Traditions, cults started because of bible alone JWS etc..etc..

Moderator - There has never been a cult that uses the Bible properly. It's just the opposite. Mormons, JWs and other use the Bible and other things; just like the Catholic Church.
---ruben on 5/4/06


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Where Bible and Tradition stories occur, the RCC accepts the Bible. Where certain stories are omitted in the Bible, Tradition is considered also. The last week Moderator included Protestants in his black book. You mean the smaller denominations, most of which simply rebelled against the RCC, are correct!

Moderator - Forgot Orthodox Christians in the prior statement. A_Catholic, what I stated is that most of the people that call themselves Christians today are part of the Apostate Church not the Body of Christ. Regardless if their flavor is Catholic, Protestant or Orthodox.
---A_Catholic on 5/4/06


You are trying to get tricky with the context of how "Father" is being used. Clever, but I think the difference is between father the nearest male ancestor and Father our God. The pope is not the first one so what type of father are you referring to when you give him that title? The Holy Father?
---chris on 5/4/06


Rev. 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: 19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
---chris on 5/4/06


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