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Ready To Be Tortured

There are many opinions about what is in store for humanity in the next segment of history. Only a person in deep denial could anticipate good. Best case scenario: economic Depression or worst case scenario: torture and persecution of Christians. Are we strong enough for either of these?

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 ---melissa on 7/26/06
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If Christian(s):

Women are offended by men ruling over them,

Don't want to apply the works of the law to balance out their faith,

Cannot go beyond a denominational limitation,

Cannot discern between a false prophet and a true prophet,

Cannot abstain from the lusts of this world,

Aren't willing to be shunned by family and friends,

Have to be seen or heard,

How can they ever endure torture?

Frank
---Frank on 12/18/07


Given the apostate condition of the church in general, no we are not strong enough for persecution and torture. Jesus said that the love of many will grow cold.
---Helen_5378 on 12/18/07


melissa, I'm ready to go home and be with the Lord, however, "He who dwells in the secret place of the Most High, will abide under the shadow of the Almighty." He is my refuge and my fortress, my GOD in HIM will I trust. David said he's never seen the righteous forsaken nor begging bread. I think your question should be: Are we rooted and grounded enough in Christ Jesus to withstand the attacks of the enemy?
---Donna9759 on 5/16/07


, sorry, i meant to say "spit on", not "sit on".
---steve on 9/12/06


, i have been sit on, laughed at, assaulted, and treated like dirt, just for passing out gospel tracts. i consider it an honor to suffer for the name of my lord and savior.
---steve on 8/31/06




As for persecution, we American Christians don't have a clue what it means to suffer for the cross.

As for the homeless and the poor, believe it or not, only 10% of the people on welfare abuse the system. The other 90% are honest people who want to work and support themselves.
---Madison1101 on 7/28/06


Don't get me wrong. I agree we need to feed, cloth and house the homeless. I was just "enlightening" y'all to what happens when gambling is allowed in a place. Think about it when you are voting when they try to get legalized gambling where you live.
---Susie on 7/28/06


#3--Our mandate from the lord is to preach the Gospel, feed the hungry etc. He has said "what you do to the least of these, you have done to Me".These are among the "least" since we can think of many that seem, to us, more "deserving". But we must attempt to share the Gospel with them all and offer them prayer. This is sowing the seed. The results are up to God. If they turn away from Him, at least let it not be because they were never told.
---Donna2277 on 7/28/06


#2 We must be wise as serpents but harmless as doves. Don't give cash..give goods, coupons for food or a referral to a Christian food or clothing bank.Don't pay for bus tickets, unless you take them and put them on a bus, same with medical services. Make referrals to Christian rehab programs or other Christian social services. And help in any of these agencies as you can. Give Christian literature, but pray that they read before using as cigarette papers.
---Donna2277 on 7/28/06


#1 Susie and Melissa--Yes, there are a great many whose chief occupation is "using" others in addition to working the street and social services, they know that many Christians are sympathetic and naive. These "homeless" sociopaths tell such sad, but fabricated, tales.. often going from church to church, collecting cash to feed various habits.We need not become discouraged, though.
---Donna2277 on 7/28/06




I personally find it hard to believe that when Christians don't have what it takes to love God in the bad times and when abased or poor as Paul said they will be able to endure torture. Also, if a person is willing to sell out their faith for money, fame or or their own desires it's doubtful.
---Shari on 7/28/06


Jack ... those who could feed themselves etc should be encouraged to do so.
But otherwise the needy should be helped, although there seems to be much "Christian" sentiment here that because there is some abuse, all help should be withdrawn.
Did I say "Christian"?
---alan8869_of_UK on 7/28/06


The issue is the fact that all of this help for those who need it is about to stop. Our government is already reducing greatly those benefits created by FDR. When the "gravy train" stops for good, America will have a problem because these people don't know how to make it without help.
---melissa on 7/28/06


There are people everywhere who know how to "work the system." Where I live, there are dozens of young single moms who get food stamps, live in decent apartments with little or no rent, get free educations if they want, clothing vouchers for kids' school clothes etc. and 9 times out of 10 there is a boyfriend living with them with additional income that they don't report. They "have it made" because the "system" encourages it. If they get married, they lose everything!
---melissa on 7/28/06


Jesus commanded us to feed the hungry, clothe the naked, and harbor the homeless.

Period.

He didn't say to benefit only those whom we think deserve it.

There will always be some (perhaps most) who abuse the help they are given, but we are not to pass judgement on who is worthy of our help.
---Jack on 7/28/06


Yea, but Susie, what about the thousands of homeless people who truly are homeless. There will always be the cheaters in every group of people, don't them them spoil it for the people who are truly in need.
---sue on 7/27/06


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There are literally hundreds of small ministries who are doing what they think is the Lord's work in Las Vegas. But, they are enabling people. I have seen homeless people use the pages of Bibles they were given to roll cigarettes. I have seen people go down the street to the local bar to sell the commodity cheese they just got to buy alcohol. This is not just Vegas. This is everywhere there are people who do not want to take care of themselves.
---Susie on 7/27/06


We have personally met hundreds of homeless people in Las Vegas who do not want help as they do not want to be accountable to anyone. We have also met many who live on social security who stay in homeless shelters. On their payday they go get a room in one of the skid-row hotels, clean up and go sit at a slot machine until their money is all gone. When the rent is up on the room, they go back to the shelter.
---Susie on 7/27/06


As a former resident of Las Vegas, let me explain what really happens with the homeless. There are several homeless shelters and help available. But, many choice to stay on the streets and live out in the desert. There are many places to get a meal and those who are long-time homeless know where they are. They go to all of them to eat.
---Susie on 7/27/06


Since the beginning, the Church has been persecuted. We have in America a different concept,maybe a different gospel. The persecution of the Church, is not God's Wrath. We shouldn't confuse the two. True Christians in America do suffer persecution, but in a different way than physical torture.The answer may be, "why do so many leave the church today"? I think our's is more emotional abuse,but it could get worse as time goes on.
---kathr4453 on 7/27/06


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How can people who want to be raptured claim they are ready to be tortured?

Seems that Peter made similar promises.

Remember, there was no rapture for believers in China, many of whom, when they escaped to the West, rebuked the missionaries who had promised them a rapture.
---Jack on 7/27/06


The other part of my original question dealt with a possible economic Depression in America in the near future, which is totally possible given the fact that gas for a family's vehicles could cost a large percentage of the monthly income. America is too spoiled to fathom adjustments such as walking to work, growing food, spending only for needs not wants etc. It could get worse than that! I don't think we have that pioneer spirit in us anymore.
---melissa on 7/26/06


If anyone is familiar with a group called "Voice of the Martyrs," then you have read about the horrible conditions some Christians in other countries are dealing with. Those folks continue to worship and preach and teach even after being tortured, maimed, jailed, witnessing others murdered. They are truly an inspiration. I hope I could be half as brave in those circumstances!
---melissa on 7/26/06


SAM--My understanding is that more than one humanitarian groups are deliberably flouting that ordinance. If I lived in LV, I would, too.

My point is that this is a POSITIVE precept of the Lord about feeding the hungry that a public law has been passed making a crime.
---Jack on 7/26/06


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I don't believe Christians in America are ready for anything. In many countries Christians today live in true economic privation, not "depression". They ARE being tortured and persecuted and martyred for the cause of Christ.May God forgive us our petty complaints and make us HALF as strong as they, if we face what they do.
---Donna2277 on 7/26/06


No, I am not, but in my weakness, God is strong! He will give us Christians grace for whatever we may have to face in the future, and his grace is sufficient for those that believe in Him.
---Katie on 7/26/06


Jack,
Do you know if they enforce the law about not feeding homeless? In a few states they have a law that makes fornication a misdemeanor, but I know a bunch of fornicators but don't know that any have been charged!
---sam on 7/26/06


You've asked a good question, Melissa.

FWIW, there's a city ordinance in Las Vegas making it an offense to give handouts of food to homeless people in the street or park.

I heard this on the news the other night.

In other words, a civil jurisdiction in the greatest of all Christian countries made it a crime to obey the words of Jesus about feeding the hungry.
---Jack on 7/26/06


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