Prior To The Bible
You listened to your presbyters and bishops, who were just one or two generations removed from the Apostles and their disciples.
Tertullian wrote, "If not one one word of the Gospels had been written down, still all the world would believe...." and goes into a summary of faith, very close to the standard creeds, that has a Trinitarian form.
---Jack on 6/7/07|
What makes you think they had no scripture
Matthew 23:5 to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries,
This was their pockets they carried sciptures in they made them bigger so as to carry more scriptures to look like they really had the word of God. I see some big phylacteries on this Blog. Most of the new testement was written from prophesy given by Isaiah. And most jews could quote it.
---Exzucuh on 9/9/06|
Mike. I am now pounding them with questions. The mere fact that that they do NOT BAIL, stonewall, throw-in-the-towel, hide under a beanbag, so far does impress me. When they can't answer something, they get the answer. This is unique. I am ready to pull out the big guns. I am used to fundamentalist who run away when the kitchen heats up. My maxim is, "If ones faith cannot stand the test of free inquiry, its finished."
---MikeM on 9/9/06|
2)...You can also read Acts 8:32-35, Acts 17:11; Col. 3:16; 2Ti 3:14-17; and 2Pe 1:19-21...These are just a few of many passages that refer to the Hebrew Scriptures.
They would have probably also used various writings of the apostles as they became available.
---Tbabe on 9/5/06|
1)...I think they would have used what the Jews call "TANAKH" which is what Christians now call the Old Testament, it is also known as the "Hebrew Scriptures", and the "Hebrew Bible." I believe this is what Jesus was referring to when He said in John 5:39 "Search the Scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
---Tbabe on 9/5/06|
3/ In the light of Biblical teaching tht to be a prophet, how can Smith be classed as a true prophet when he had som many failures.
On the Book of Mormon, when I`m deppresed I have a read. It is so ludicrus, to anyone who can read KJ Engish, as to be pointless.
---mike8384 on 9/5/06|
MikeM, I have had run in with Mormons over the years, and at one point considered joining the Mormon church, actually came within a haird breath of being baptised.
Your quie right, it ids always the other guy who is the heretic, by deffinition it has to be that way.
Some questions to ask Mormons:
1/ What eveidence is there that anyone in the Americas, other the Mormons, used gold plateds to write on?
2/ What evidence is there for reformed hieroglyphics? Short answer: non whatsoever.
---mike8384 on 9/5/06|
The Holy Spirit and the teachings of Christ through the testimoy of the apostles: see John 2:27
---Pharisee on 9/4/06|
Mike;It is clear in history there was a wide variation of beliefs before the 'orthodox' Roman church hammer out what was corredt doctrine.
I note 'Apostate & heretical' is always the 'other guy.' The fact that they don't 'bail' when asked questions, so far, shows some substance. that is a contrast.
---MikeM on 9/4/06|
Interesting source of information, MikeM, going to an apostate, heretical sect for truth. Sure they don't run from questions, they have all their lies prepared.
The Marcion list, Marcioniets. was prepared by a gnostuc herecy, so their input in invalid. Other then reverse negatvity:if they condemn it, it mst be good.
---mike8384 on 9/4/06|
There were at least 30 books purported to be scripture. Some Christian groups between 100ad and 325ad completly rejected the OT (Marcionites) and there was a miasma of groups, gnostics and others claiming apostolic authority. I just started talking to some Mormon neighnors who say that part of history was the start of the 'great apostasy' Paul spoke of. They have strange ideas, but at least dont run when asked questions.
---MikeM on 9/3/06|
Wisdom? In the beginning GOD. If God always existed, then people probably went directly to God and asked Him? I am totally not sure on this, so I am just guessing. Thank God we have His word written down now, huh?
---Donna9759 on 9/3/06|
Jack - Thank you for your response my Orthodox friend. This is considered oral tradition, right? Is everything that the Apostles passed to the presbyters and bishops in the Bible?
---dana on 9/3/06|
Dana;When Jesus sent out His followers (Matt.28) and said "Go therefore into all nations teaching them...." (circa 33 AD)they had no NT. They verified Christ's words,birth,death and resurrection from OT scriptures.
---1st_cliff on 9/3/06|
The short answer is: they had most of the New Testament by that stage, and used it. Jack is right, alot of the beliefs were created in Credxal Statements, more often then not early baptismal creeds, but with only 2 additions, most of what we have today was already in use.
The 2 additions: The Didachae, called the teaching of the Apostles, and the Shepherd of Jermas.
---mike8384 on 9/3/06|