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Has Knowledge Ceased

If people believe that speaking in tongues ceased, do they also believe that knowledge and prophecy also ceased, since they are all mentioned in the same verse?

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 ---Ephram on 9/10/06
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Todd1:

Yes, he is definitely talking about love here (and how meaningless other things are without it). Compare with Jesus's description of the sheep and the goats - the wicked are all boasting of performing great miracles, but it's all for nothing since they didn't show love.
---StrongAxe on 5/27/08


Strongaxe, good reference, admittedly I didn't have an answer for it. So I read the passage and here's my thoughts: when the whole passage (1 Cor 13:1-3) is read, we see Paul isn't speaking literally, saying he speaks with tongues of men and angels, he's saying IF he did all these things, and had not love, it is meaningless. He seems to be talking hypothetically to make a point about the importance of love...,
---Todd1 on 5/23/08


(cont.) he also says "though i give my body to be burned", "though i have all knowledge and understand all mysteries", "though i have all faith"...He certainly didn't give his body to be burned, have all knowledge and understand all mysteries, have all faith. It seems he was just saying even if we were completely "perfect", yet had not love, we are nothing. What do you think?
---Todd1 on 5/23/08


Todd1:

Scripture talkes of the "tongues of men and angels" - presumably "tongues of men" are known languages, while "tongues of angels" are unknown to us.
---StrongAxe on 5/23/08


Certainly. But I've found those who cannot speak in tongues, mock what's of the Spirit, also.
Because they cannot, they mock those who do with their own unbelief. It's highly apparent.
---Emily on 5/23/08




Emily:

There is "speaking in other tongus as the Holy Spirit gives utterance". There is also babbling incoherently in the flesh without any help from the Spirit.

Unfortunately, to an observer, these often appear the same. More unfortunately, many who think they speak in tongues actually just babble. (For example, the pastor who gave lessons on how to speak in tongues - say "I love you Jesus" as fast as you can until you're no longer speaking English - pure flesh).
---StrongAxe on 5/23/08


The word tongues in the Bible refers to known languages. Please give examples of anyone babbling incoherently from scripture as a form of edifying the brethren. All Biblical accounts of speaking in tongues (a known language) was done to help spread the Gospel, I think. How would babbling gibberish help anyone? There's a certain arrogance I see in some who "speak in tongues" and feel like that makes them superior...doesn't seem very Godly to me. By their fruits you shall know them.
---Todd1 on 5/22/08


Only those who cannot speak in tongues call it babbling.
If you could speak in tongues, there is no way that you would be able to speak about tongues the way that you do.
Since you cannot, you mock.
---Emily on 5/22/08


I dont believe speaking in tongues as ceased. But I believe that rolling around babbling incoherently is definitely not the Biblical gift of tongues. I think all the gifts of the spirit are still available to faithful believers...as always, to edify the church...not to confuse them. (or entertain them)
---Todd1 on 5/21/08


Don't forget faith, hope, and love, which are mentioned in the same chapter.
(BTW--Also don't forget that the chapter and verse divisions are NOT in the original, but are much later human additions.)
---Jack on 5/21/08




Anyone can take one scripture and make a doctrine. For example, I can take Mt 21:13 where Jesus cleared the temple and overthrew tables and say that Jesus was hot tempered. We know this is false! Other scriptures show us that Jesus was full of love! Some christians, including some on this site, have hand picked out scriptures to make their own doctrines, which is not a good thing!
---Ephidimius on 9/14/06


Why is it that those who say that apostolic and prophetic ministry is done and over with don't say that about those other three ministry gifts listed in the same verse...and even go on to call themselves evangelists, pastors, and teachers? Is is because those who call themselves evangelists, pastors, and teachers don't want either the governing or the guiding aspect of the hand of God in opearation because they would rather go their own way?
---Linda6563 on 9/14/06


Apostolic, as well as prophetic, evangelistic, pastoral, and teaching ministry will not end until we ALL come to the unity of the faith, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ. That hasn't happened yet, I'm afraid, and until it does, that five fold "hand" ministry of God is still in operation.
---Linda6563 on 9/14/06


LOL Big Daddy! "This isn't Burger King where you can have it your way!"
---Christina on 9/14/06


Tongues, knowledge and prophecy have not ceased. They will be done away with when "that perfect has come" (1 Corinthians 13:10), which is when Jesus comes back. Until then all the gifts are still available and should be in operation. To say otherwise is error.
---Helen_5378 on 9/14/06


I,am the same yesterday today and forever. God hasn,t,doesn,t, and won,t ever change.every word in the bible is true,all all the gifts of the spirit are operating today. to say that one isn,t is saying that God is a liar.AND GOD DON,T LIE only satan and people.
---tom2 on 9/13/06


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Ramon you are correct sir in pointing out that people are picking and choosing only the parts of the Bible they want...This isn't Burger King where you can have it your way!
---Big_daddy on 9/12/06


Herb where do you get that healing has ceased? God still heals today. Please show some scripture or else I think you are just making this up!
---Manny on 9/12/06


NO none of it has ceased and it won't ceased untill Jesus comes for hIS people Then there will be no need of tonuges or the othere things because the gilft giver has come for his people
---Betty on 9/10/06


greetings,cont.p3,knowledge and prophecy never stopped in that the Father continues to reveal himself to his children as fast as his children can handle such wealth of knowledge and the prophets ,although tardy from our age remain awaiting for the moment in time to speak encouraging words of wisdom to the Fathers children and to stand firm on the Sons appeal for all to love your brother as he love us.thanks
---earl on 9/10/06


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greetings,(cont,p2).in the winning of more than 2000 souls.six of the apostles participated in this meeting,peter,andrew,james,john,philip and matthew.for over a hour and a half they delivered messages in greek,hebrew and aramaic as well as a few words in other tongues with which they had a speaking acquaintance....revelation of our Father will never cease for our Father is an endless revelation.'speaking in tongues' never began but(cont,p3)
---earl on 9/10/06


greetings,many strange teachings became associated with the early narratives of the day of pentecost.the events of that day have become confused with the foolish outbreaks of rampant emotionalism.the chief mission of the "new teacher" is to teach men about the truths of the Fathers love and the Son's mercy.on the jewish day of pentecost at about 2:00 p.m.peter stood up in the temple and delivered that impassioned appeal which resulted(cont)
---earl on 9/10/06


It is intersting that while cessationists say that the Bible is clear that the prophetic gifts have ceased; when asked when the Bible states that the gifts have ceased, each cessationist gives a different answer!
Now, cessationists realize that they are arbitrarily picking which of the gifts have ceased and which ones are still here.They take the gift they dont like and say "Its has cease!". They only picked on Tongues! Simple as that.
---Ramon on 9/10/06


Yes! they to are only temporary gifts that ceased with the end of the apostles. Some gifts were temporary and others perament. Also the gift of healing and raising the dead as the apostles did it.
---Rev_Herb on 9/10/06


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---Ephram, Who said that speaking in tongues ceased? God is the same today yesterday and forever true. Just because some people's Faith is too weak to have any of the Gifts of the Holy Spirit doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Seek God and ask Him to reveal the gifts to you. The degree of your Faith is what determines what God will reveal to you. Seek Ye God FIRST......
---Dottie on 9/10/06


It is common but not always so that they believe all 3 of these gifts in this verse to be discontinued. I used to believe that but upon closer examination of the Scriptures I had to make a painful doctrinal adjustment.
---john on 9/10/06


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