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Law And Grace Differences

What is the Difference between the Law and the Grace?

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Christians believe that the means of gaining salvation in the Old Testament differes from the New T. The most common view is that the salvation was by law in the Old and by grace in the New T. The law was given within the context of a gracious Covenant between God and Abraham, a Covenant which the giving of the law never nullified (Gal. 3:17). Second, God had graciously rescured Israel from Egypt and sustained the people with manna and miracles. Third the law was given after Israel had, as a body of believers made a commitment to serve the Lord (Ex. 19:8). The law was given, not as a means for justification, but as a guideline for living after Israel's commitment to serve the Lord.
---MarkV. on 10/27/08


Law tell us what sin is. But it does not save. It cannot save. Romans 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law [is] the knowledge of sin. KJV

But when are saved we love to obey GOD. The commandments are right for us. For we love GOD and love others. So love makes keeping the law a delight.

NASB - 1Jo 5:3 - For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments, and His commandments are not burdensome
---Samuel on 10/25/08


Law defeats Joy. Under law you are never sure. Law forces you to have a "tippty- toe", "walking on egg shells" religion.
Grace brings joy freedom an assurance. Thereby giving you liberty to spread the gospel without constant worry about your sins. Understanding Grace shows you that sin does not seem a person to hell.
---mima 10/23/08

Did you learn this in church? Because you did not get it from the Bible.
"The wages of sin is death" Romans 6:23
"He that committeth sin is of the devil" 1John3:8
"For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth more sacrifice for sins, but a fearful looking for of judgement.." Hebrews 10:26,27
---Gina7 on 10/25/08


Understanding Grace shows you that sin does not seem a person to hell.
---mima 10/23/08

"What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?" Romans 6:1,2

"But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life. but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord" Romans 6:22,23

False religion teaches you can be saved in your sins
The Bible teaches Christ came to save us from our sins, and remove it from our lives, to live victoriously in joy and holiness.
---Gina7 on 10/25/08


Law defeats Joy.
---mima 10/23/08
"And I will delight myself in thy commandments, which I have loved" Psalm 119:47

"Oh How I love thy Law! It is my meditation all the day." Psalm 119:97
"It is time for thee, Lord, to work, for they have made void thy law. Therefore I love thy commandments above gold, yea, above fine gold." Psalm 119:126,127

"But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel, after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and will be their God, and they shall be my people" Jeremiah 31:33 (See Hebrews 8:10 where it is repeated!)

God's law is a Joy and delight to those who Love Him
---Gina7 on 10/25/08




Part 1. "Only way back to God with /through Jesus Christ":

* Jesus and Father sitting together on throne in heaven (Holy Place,Sanctuary in heaven)

*Jesus leaves the father's side to come to earth

*Jesus comes to this earth (the court) and is born in Bethlehem

*Jesus is baptized (the laver of water)

*Jesus dies on the cross (alter of sacrifice)

*Jesus meets man to lead him back to fellowship with the father
---Gina7 on 10/24/08


THE LAW: helps us to kow when we have sinned.
GRACE: is the free unmerited forgiveness of th sin committed. PR
---Pierr5358 on 10/24/08


Grace is given so that we can repent of our sins and be brought back into the fellowship of the Father through His son Jesus Christ. Sin has caused separation from God. We are granted a period of probation, to repent, accept Christ as our saviour "and go and sin no more" John 8:11. To be brought back into the fellowship of the Father, sin must be removed from our lives. Sin cannot exist in the presence of the Father.

False religion teaches one can be saved in their sins, despite all the Bible has to say to the contrary.

The Bible teaches one is saved from their sins through the power of Jesus to overcome. "And ye know that He was manisfested to take away our sins, and in Him is no sin" John 3:5
---Gina7 on 10/24/08


"Go and sin no more" John 8:11 Jesus to the woman caught in adultery, breaking one of the 10 commandments

She was forgiven (Grace) but told not to do it again.

"What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God Forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?" Romans 6:1,2

Grace offers forgiveness, but it is not a license to sin or nor a reason not to worry about sin.

"For the wages of sin is death" Romans 6:23

"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins but a certain fearful looking for of judgment.." Hebrews 10:26,27



---Gina7 on 10/24/08


Part 2 Jesus meets man to bring him back to fellowship w/Father

*As High Priest, Jesus meets us

*1st stop Calvary to accept Christ as our substitute for sin "The Lamb of God" (alter sacrifice)

*Next stop,baptism at laver of water

*We must remain in court(earth) and by faith rest in ministry of Jesus as High Priest in heaven

*Christ finishes atonement by blotting out sins in judgment, which provides man with complete restoration/fellowship w/the Father
---Gina7 on 10/24/08




Law says IF YOU WILL, THEN I will

Grace says, It is Finished ....DONE....I WILL,...GIFT...FAITH....
---kathr4453 on 10/23/08


Law defeats Joy. Under law you are never sure. Law forces you to have a "tippty- toe", " walking on egg shells" religion.
Grace brings joy freedom an assurance. Thereby giving you liberty to spread the gospel without constant worry about your sins. Understanding Grace shows you that sin does not seem a person to hell. Refusal to accept the Lord Jesus Christ and what he has done,sends a person to hell.
---mima on 10/23/08


"And that is why one female wolf was kicked out of the Methodist church back in the 1840's, she would not listen to the gospel and cursed those who refuse to believe her self induced visions were from God.

She did listen to the Gospel--read Steps to Christ and see for yourself. And she never cursed anyone--that's why you couldn't show us where you got that from--Romans 13:9. You can't self-induce visions in which you don't breathe--she was examined by a number of physicians.
---djconklin on 9/8/07


"We were present when (in February, 1857) Sister E. G. White had a vision in Waldron's Hall, Hillsdale. Dr. Lord {he had 50 years experience as a doctor} made an examination, and said, 'Her heart beats, but there is no breath. There is life, but no action of the lungs, I cannot account for this condition.' " Signed, "A. F. Fowler, Mrs. A. F. Fowler, Hillsdale, Mich., Jan. 1, 1891."
---djconklin on 9/8/07


dj - *Lots of wolves amongst the Lord's sheep.*

And all of them are telling us not to listen to the teachers the Lord has given to His church.

And that is why one female wolf was kicked out of the Methodist church back in the 1840's, she would not listen to the gospel and cursed those who refuse to believe her self induced visions were from God.
---Lee on 9/8/07


The quick version would be if you live under the law you have to be perfect and keep all the Ten Commandments.

Grace is what God gives you because He knows you can't possibly do it. It is not getting the punishment you deserve for not being perfect.
---denna7667 on 9/6/07


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"nearly all the commentaries on Hebrews agree that those who believe in Christ enter into God's rest, not necessarily those who observe a sabbath."

Those are the words of man, it is better to go by the Word of God. The bold is fine--the way you know who they are vs say-so is watch what they do on the Sabbath after they've been told about keeping it.

Lots of wolves amongst the Lord's sheep.
---djconklin on 9/6/07


Geoff - nearly all the commentaries on Hebrews agree that those who believe in Christ enter into God's rest, not necessarily those who observe a sabbath.

Yes, circumcision became something of the heart but in Judaism, circumcision was a physical acts usually performed on the 8th day after birth. It identified one as a Jews, ask any Rabbi and that is what you will be told.

If circumcision is of the heart, then why not the Sababth rest also of the heart as Christ is our rest?
---Lee on 9/6/07


Lee, on 11/7/2006 you said "our circumcision is of the heart."

It has always been a matter of the heart-Deut 10:16, 30:6; Jer 4:4; Rom 2:29.

But no matter how much you try to "spiritualize" away the Sabbath, you are in disobedience if you do not enter that rest-Heb 4:11. Please explain how you do that without keeping the Sabbath holy-Isaiah 58:13-14.
---Geoff on 1/16/07


ZIMBABWEAN 1-4 read carefully.

What are the Commandments of God as found in Revelation 12:17, 14:12, & 22:14?

The Greek word for "commandments" is the word "entolas" which means teachings, instructions or commands. This word is used always in John's writings when He is referring to the instructions or teachings of Christ. When John refers to the 10 commandments in his writings he uses a different Greek word, "nomas".
---lee on 11/10/06


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ZIMBABWEAN 2-4 John also defines for us what the "commandments" of God are.

Please look carefully at the following passages:

I John 5:2-3 - "By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and observe His commandments (entolas). For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments (entolas); and His commandments (entolae) are not burdensome."
---lee on 11/10/06


ZIMBABWEAN 3-4 We aren't left to guess what the "commandments" are. The context of I John 3:22-24:

"and whatever we ask we receive from Him, because we keep His commandments (entolas) and do the things that are pleasing in His sight. This is His commandment (entolae), that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded (entolaen) us. The one who keeps His commandments (entolas) abides in Him,..."
---lee on 11/10/06


ZIMBABWEAN 4-4 It's quite clear that the "commandments" of God are two:

1). Believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ

2). Love one another

So you can see that 'commandments' in the New testaments does NOT always mean "10 commandments" particularly in Revelation.

Please reply to my comments on this otherwise I will have to answer your question again.
---lee on 11/10/06


ZIMBABWEAN - In conclusion, a paraphase of Revelation 12:17 could be

"Helpless with rage, Satan raged at the Christians. Then he waged war on all true believers who refuse to disobey Jesus Christ and or to relinquish the gospel."

---lee on 11/10/06


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Lee* Again, whenever the word "commandments" occur in the NT, it does not alway refer to the ten commandments. The SDA adds to the word of God, when they insert the word "ten" in front of 'commandments' in violation of Deut 4:2.
I DIDNT ASK WHAT SDA'S DO - I ONLY ASKED WHICH COMANDMENTS ARE THESE ON ALL THREE VERSES, PLEASE RESPOND ON ALL
---ZIMBABWEAN on 11/10/06


Jeff - *Lee- question for you: How did you or Jesus keep the laws of Niddah?*

While I was a student taking Greek, we sometimes used Greek word among ourselves as then we knew we would be understood. On this forum, it is unlikely that anyone here can understand what you are posting about. To enable for others to participate, you will have to use the common English language to convey your message.
---lee on 11/9/06


Lee-"There are essentally 2, one is to believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, the other is to love one another" rev 14:12 The original text reads that its those who keep the commandments of G-d and the faith of Yeshua, not faith in. Theres a large difference b/w the two. Faith of Yeshua would be the Halacha of the Master, and commanments of G-d, well thats the Torah.
---Jeff on 11/9/06


Lee- question for you: How did you or Jesus keep the laws of Niddah? Because if you say that you kept them through the two commands Yeshua gave then you and the Messiah sinned. What about the laws of the Cohen or the other laws for women? Since Yeshua wasn't able to keep those laws are women and Cohens still held to the law because he didn't keep them to "set them free"? Do you believe you know everything in the bible and is it possible you could be wrong on a few things?
---Jeff on 11/9/06


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ZIMBABWEAN - *LEE, which law/Commandments are these:REVELATION 4:12...

There are essentally 2, one is to believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, the other is to love one another.

Again, whenever the word "commandments" occur in the NT, it does not alway refer to the ten commandments. The SDA adds to the word of God, when they insert the word "ten" in front of 'commandments' in violation of Deut 4:2.
---lee on 11/8/06


LEE, which law/Commandments are these:
REVELATION 4:12 "This calls for patient endurance on the part of the saints who obey God's commandments...
MATTHEW 5:18"I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments...
JAMES 2:10"For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles..
---ZIMBABWEAN on 11/8/06


Geoff you referenced Romans 4:16, 9:6-7, & Gal. 3:7,28. These verse speak of "those of faith" are the sons of Abraham; not those who observe Mosaic laws.

While we are the spiritual children of Abraham, that does not mean that we must visit our local rabbi and become circumcised as spiritually our circumcision is of the heart, in the same matter as Christ has become our Sabbath rest. Our rest is therefore in Him not in a day of the week. Think about it!
---lee on 11/7/06


The law given in the OT tells us what is expected from us. It is clear and to the point. It shows us that even the best of us can not keep the law. That is where grace enters in the NT grace says ah U have not kept the law but due to Gods grace I have made a way for you. I heard this once an old man dying said I now will throw all the good things I did overboard, and the bad things I did overboard also and sail to heaven on grace alone.
---Jeanne on 11/6/06


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There is virtually no evidence that the Sabbath was observed by any nation except Israel.

Believing that the Sabbath was given to all nations was based upon Mark 2:27 ignores not only the context but the fact that even the Jews themselves considered the Sabbath to be an institution given only to them.

Based upon sound exegetics of scripture, and the fact that you read too much into the verse, leaves little choice except to reject your interpretation of Mark 2:27.
---lee on 11/6/06


One technique used in the interpretation of Scripture is to research how the various theologians over the centuries interpreted the verse under discussion.

If you were to do that with Mark 2:27, you will certainly find that the SDA interpretion that the Sabbath was given to all mankind, totally stands alone. And that is another good reason to reject it.

And of course, the NT has no command for the church to observe the Sabbath.
---lee on 11/6/06


Lee, I listed OT references to discredit your assumption that the Law, incl the Sabbath, was only given to Israel. You are wrong-Mk 2:27. The Sabbath is for Israel and those who sojourn & agree with them, Abraham's seed-Rom 4:16, 9:6-7, Gal 3:7,28.
---Geoff on 11/6/06


Geoff - *Lee, obeying God was not optional. All who followed God obeyed the Law*

- and you list several Old Covenant references. (r u afraid of the New Testament?)

Christians have an obligation to Christ; not to the Mosaic law. If they do as He has commanded them in the New Testament, then observing Mosaic laws are truly optional.

Read if you will Romans 14 about observing food laws, esteeming one day over another, etc. You need to differentiate between the Old & New Covenants.
---lee on 11/6/06


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Lee, obeying God was not optional. All who followed God obeyed the Law. Not only in Ex 12:49, also Ex 12:38, Lev 16:29, 17:8-13, 18:26, Num 9:14, 15:14-29, 19:10, 35:15, Josh 20:9, Ez 47:22
---Geoff on 11/5/06


1-2 Those that promote Adventism often quote scripture out of context.

Ex. 12:49 by itself could be interpreted that there is only 1 law for Jews & Gentiles. But we see from the preceeding verse that this "one law" pertains only to those that are in Israel.
---lee on 10/31/06


2-2

Ex. 12:48 If a stranger shall sojourn with you and would keep the Passover to the LORD, let all his males be circumcised. Then he may come near and keep it; he shall be as a native of the land. But no uncircumcised person shall eat of it.
12:49 There shall be one law for the native and for the stranger who sojourns among you.
---lee on 10/31/06


Geoff You only need a good dictionary to determine whether the 4th commandment is a ceremonial law.

The Sabbath commandment is not a moral law for the reasons already given - it is an observance of an event, does not involve the conscience, was created (Mk. 2;27), not listed as a sin or commanded anywhere in the NT, not found among the Gentile nations, etc. The 10 commandments are the Old Covenant (Deut. 4;13) made between God and Israel alone (Ex. 31:17) and was declared obsolete (Hebr 8:13).
---lee on 10/30/06


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Lee, you insist only the 4th of the 10 Commandments is ceremonial without scriptural support. Then tell us the Sabbath's universaliality (as far as Earth's inhabitants is concerned?) is not supported by scripture or history? Well, the Bible is proved to be a historical work. Are you saying Ceremonial Law was universal, but the 10 Commandments were not? Ex 12:49 Or are you now going to switch Sabbath on us back to a moral law? Can't have it both ways. What's it gonna be, buddy?
---Geoff on 10/29/06


Geoff, if you want to follow the law which was given to Abraham to be obedient that is great. The part that is incorrect is that you want everyone else to do that. If this is what you feel that you have to do it fine, I suppose with anyone, but if you say that everyone else that doesn't is been disobedient, then you are wrong because it is you who wants to go under the law. You make that choice yourself.
---lisa on 10/28/06


2. I myself don't mind that you want to do what you are doing. You see, I am doing what I am doing only because I am in the covenant with Christ, through grace. I believe all the people make such a strict point of a perticular day, is only been legalistic. With Christ everyday can be your Sabbath. Our relationship with Christ is like no other. He is in us always. The Old Testament believers did not have what we have.
---lisa on 10/28/06


3. Thank you Geoff for answering me with kind words. I don't know much about your denomination but was speaking strickly from the studies of law and grace.
---lisa on 10/28/06


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Geoff - *I often use illustration of being under arrest... law abiding citizens are not worried about the law ...*

Nor do we have to be concerned about a law that has been declared obsolete and is no longer applicable.
For instance, the Sabbath commandment was not imposed on the church (Acts 15:28) and thus the Christian will not be judged for disobeying a law that is not applicable.

The theory that such a ceremonial law is universal has no basis in either Scripture or history.
---lee on 10/27/06


2-2 Being justified by faith alone, we are accounted righteous because of the righteousness that is imputed to us in Christ. (Romans 1:17; 1 Cor. 1:30)

In that belief we can identify with Paul when he stated to those under the law, I became as one under the law though not being myself under the law that I might win those under the law (1 Cor. 9:20)
---lee on 10/27/06


1-2 Geoff agree that 'the disobedient are under law' as we see in Romans 3:19 'Now we know that whatever the law says it speaks to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be stopped, and the whole world may be held accountable to God.'

But the purpose of the law (as a schoolmaster) was to 'bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith' and 'after that faith is come, we are no longer under the schoolmaster' Gal 3.24-25
---lee on 10/27/06


Lisa, we who obey the 10 Commandments (incl the 4th-Sabbath) by God's grace are actually under God's grace. The disobedient are under law. I often use the illustration of being under arrest. We law abiding citizens are not worried about the law that says do not steal because we don't. It is only law breakers who are concerned (maybe not about the law, but its consequences). The Law was given to Abraham & Moses, but it was universal & known prior-Gen 2:2-3, 4:7, 13:13, 20:6, 26:5, 39:9, Ex 12:49
---Geoff on 10/27/06


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GRACE....it is GODS unmerited favor given to us through FAITH alone in JESUS CHRIST alone....JESUS is LORD!!!!!
---JIM on 10/27/06


Geoff, what you are saying is that we are been disobedient to God by not using Sat. as a Sabbath. And also that it doesn't please God. In your mind you have put that law under you to follow Saturday as your day. We have not put ourselves under that law, for that law was for Israel. The law was given within the context of a gracious covenant God had made with Abraham, a covenant which the giving of the law was for those people at that time. God had graciously rescued Israel from Egypt and sustained
---lisa on 10/26/06


2. them through miracles and manna during their journey. This is the context of the law. The law was given after Israel had, as a body of believers, made a commitment to serve the Lord (Exodus 19:8). So the law was given, not as a means of justification, but as a guideline for living after Israel's commitment to serve the Lord. The New Testament informs us that the law could never serve as a means of salvation. Paul teaches that no one can earn righteous standing before God by the works of the Law
---lisa on 10/26/06


3. (Galatians 3:11,21,22). Romans 4:3 teaches that Abraham was saved on the basis of his fiath, not his works, and the subsequesti verses teach that the promise was extended to Abrahams descendants, not on the basis of their works, but because of their faith. Grace is the beginner of our faith in the Old and the New Testament, but our covenant is now by Grace alone, through faith in Jesus Christ. The moral laws of God always stand, but all the other laws we are not under.
---lisa on 10/26/06


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Romans 11:6 But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works; otherwise grace would no longer be grace.

The "basis of works" are really the flesh (human effort)working to gain righteousness as one seeks to justify himself on that basis.

Grace, however, is something unmerited like the rigtheousnss we are accredited with bec of what Christ did for us on the Cross.
---lee on 10/26/06


Lisa said "if works are included in grace, then grace is no longer grace." Is that Gal 3:18? Bible says "by grace are ye saved through faith; & that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast-Eph 2:8-9. We're created for good works-v10. Lee agrees. God works in us to do His good pleasure-Phil 2:13. Being saved by grace, should we break the Law? Rom 3:31
Mod credited Lee on 10/21 with my Q-is it "God's pleasure... to break the 4th... only?"
---Geoff on 10/25/06


Never forget Jesus Christ is the Gift. That gift is the Cross. The Cross/Grace is that Gift given to all who will believe and receive the Gift of His Son Jesus Christ. In receiving Jesus Christ the one who died for your sins, has offered you forgivness In HIM, a New Life in Him, This is the Gift of Grace. I am crucified with Christ. No Longer I but Christ in me. Grace is our New Life In Him via Calvary, Hebrews 10 says, A New and Different way, through the veil, that is to say His Flesh.
---kathr4453 on 10/22/06


Geoff, we are going to be judge by our choices. That is the reason I spoke to Kathr about the works of not only the believers but the lost. But the believer is saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ and he is made right with God, while the unbeliever is still lost for his love of the world and rejection of Christ. Grace saves. And if works are included in grace, then grace is no longer grace. It is a gift of God.
---lisa on 10/22/06


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"Are you saying it is God's good pleasure for you to break the 4th Commandment only?"

John 4:24 AV God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Sorry but the church has not been commanded to observe Mosaic laws such as the keeping of the Sabbath.
---lee on 10/22/06


John, you certainly will still be striving and will miss out as you will not heed to His call to obey HIS COMMANDMENTS. The very commandments describing His character whom we need to conform into His image. Whose image are you conforming to John?
---jana on 10/22/06


Lee, you said "If we are His workmanship, then 'it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure.' Phil 2:13"

I prefer "For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of His good pleasure."

Are you saying it is God's good pleasure for you to break the 4th Commandment only?
---Lee on 10/21/06


The difference between Law and Grace:
Law:
The Law showed man his sin.
The Law kept the old adam nature in check(schoolmaster).
The Law shows us there is none righteous.(no one can keep the law perfectly.)
It's Called the Law of "Sin and Death".
Grace
Grace forgives man his sin.
Grace/Cross crucifies the old adam nature.
The Cross is now the Schoolmaster.
Grace/Jesus gives eternal life
Grace imputes the Righteousness that is in Christ Jesus to the sinner.
---kathr4453 on 10/19/06


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Geoff - you need to rest the following verses in Ephesians -

"For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

If we are His workmanship, then "it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure." Phil 2:13
---lee on 10/18/06


Lee, truth is we are saved by grace through faith alone (Ephesians 2:8), but we are judged by our works (Mt 16:27, Rev 20:12-13, Eccl 12:14). Hence, faith without works is dead (James 2:17, 20, 26).
---Geoff on 10/16/06


Geoff - *I don't see anything inappropriate in your response, such as trying to win God's approval, as Lee would suggest*

Those were quotes from God's Word to the Nations Bible Society Version (GWV).

But the SDA investigative judgment belief hold that one must be deem worthy to receive eternal life and that by observing the ten commandments, esp. the Sabbath Commandment according to Ellen White. So in effect the soteriology of the SDA is one of faith-works; not by Christ alone.
---lee on 10/14/06


Yes John, and balance that with Jude 1:3.

Right on, Christina! Strange thing, I don't see anything inappropriate in your response, such as trying to win God's approval, as Lee would suggest.
---Geoff on 10/14/06


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Tit. 3:9. But avoid stivings and contentions about the law for they are unprofitable and vain.
The ministration of the Spirit is so much more glorious. We should all spend more time on that subject. Strivings about the law are exactly that, striving. We might still be stiving when Jesus returns.
---john on 10/14/06


Amen Christina - Phil. 2:13 GWV It is God who produces in you the desires and actions that please him.

Galatians 2:16 GWV Yet, we know that people dont receive Gods approval because of their own efforts to live according to a set of standards, but only by believing in Jesus Christ.
---lee on 10/14/06


Amen Geoff: "AMEN Donna, the just live by faith Gal 3:11 and the justified obey-James 2:17-18." It is once we are justified, (note the -ed, indicating past tense), that we desire and are enabled by HS to obey
---Christina on 10/14/06


Living by Grace, I believe that God accepts me because I am in His Son Jesus. Living by the Law, I strive and strive hoping that God will accept me but never sure.
---Helen_5378 on 10/13/06


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Geoff - *the just live by faith Gal 3:11 and the justified obey-James 2:17-18.

Obey what? The Mosaic laws such as Sabbath keeping, dietary laws and other Old Covenant laws given to Israel only?

James 2:17-18 merely indicates that our faith should be reflected by our works.

James 2:17 So also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
---lee on 10/10/06


Donna - *The "good news" is that our position with God no longer depends on our ability to follow the Law, but upon the unmerited favor of God. :) "the just shall live by FAITH" Gal3:11*

Right on!


---lee on 10/10/06


Well said, Geoff!
---Donna2277 on 10/10/06


AMEN Donna, the just live by faith Gal 3:11 and the justified obey-James 2:17-18.
---Geoff on 10/9/06


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Geoff--Rejoice! God isn't limited to 58 words! I don't diminish the importance of the Law. Without it we would not recognize sin. The "bad news" is that it shows us how far short we fall :( We would be hopeless had Jesus not replaced all imperfect sacrifices by His perfect one, securing our redemption. The "good news" is that our position with God no longer depends on our ability to follow the Law, but upon the unmerited favor of God. :) "the just shall live by FAITH" Gal3:11
---Donna2277 on 10/8/06


Donna, God's word presents it differently. Moses Law was glorious although, unfortunately, it called for shedding of innocent blood, but then so did new covenant-2 Cor 3:11, Heb 9:22. But Mo's Law pointed to Jesus & that's wonderful! The 10 Commandments is also good for it points out sin & righteousness, although it doesn't cleanse us from sin or make us righteous-Romans 7:7, 12; James 1:22-25. So law & grace have much in common, both inspired by love.
---Geoff on 10/8/06


Donna2277 your absolutely right and your talking about the ordinances and the ceremonial laws of Moses that was used to prepare the people for the coming of Christ. Then at the cross, it was abolished for its not required no more for Christ became the sacrificial Lamb of God to take away our sins.
---jana on 10/8/06


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