Salvations Based On Obedience
If this scripture" For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous." is true, why then do we insist that our salvation our righteousness depends on our obedience?
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---Mima on 1/17/07
Helpful Blog Vote (2)
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#1 - I understand perfectly what Mima is saying and she is correct. Scripture tells us that Obedience is better than sacrifice, but it doesn't say it is better than faith. Abraham wasn't always obedient but He had faith and it was counted to him as righteousness. Our righteous standing before God is not affected by our obedience or our lack of it. Our rewards are affected but God is the One who makes us righteous, it has nothing to do with what we do or don't do. |
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---Debbie_Jo on 5/2/08 |
#2 - That is grace and the more needy you are, the more you lack in self-sufficency, the more dependant you are, the weaker you are in your self, the more grace God gives you. Why do you thing Scripture tells us to reckon the old man dead? It is because God wants us totally dependant upon Him and not our own human ability and He especially does not want us to take credit for anything He has done. It was Jesus obedience that made the difference. |
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---Debbie_Jo on 5/2/08 |
#4 - Our obedience will make our life more blessed but it will not affect the soveriegn will of God concerning our salvation. He can't lie or go back on His Word. Just because some can't see the fullness of God's grace, His desire and ability to save to the uttermost, doesn't mean that it is not true. Even if you don't believe in eternal salvation, it doesn't mean that you are right and every other grace believer is wrong. A revelation of the grace of God is needed by all believers. |
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---Debbie_Jo on 5/2/08 |
Some want to speak about what they do. I want to speak of what JESUS does.
Luk 10:20 Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you, but rather rejoice, because your names are written in heaven. |
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---Samuel on 5/2/08 |
mima, Since I am a born-again Christian, I am not able to receive your falsehood, but if you repent then I would be able to hear you. John 10:4,5. And if you had grace then you would manifest it, but since you show no fruit, therefore you have no grace. |
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---Eloy on 5/2/08 |
mima, when you have no fruit to prove your words that you profess, then your faith is in vain, like salt which has no saltiness and is good for nothing. |
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---Eloy on 5/2/08 |
God surely never forgets what he gives:
Deteronomy 29:20: "The LORD will not spare him,
but then the anger of the LORD and his jealousy
shall smoke against that man, and all the curses that
are written in this book shall lie upon him, and the
LORD shall blot out his name from under heaven." |
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---Nana on 5/2/08 |
Mima::Can you see grace? Mary who was a favoured one was not aware till declared by an Angel as messenger.So on what authority does any one claim this grace in view of Romans3:23.Yet we know God dispences GRACES to those who keep His commandments.Yet again many say 10 C's are abolished ?Maybe you can explain? |
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---Emcee on 5/1/08 |
We are to obey in CHRIST JESUS. That is we are to be filled with the HOLY SPIRIT by the Grace of GOD and walk in the ways of JESUS.
But that earns us nothing towards salvation. Salvation is the free gift that gets our name written down in Heaven and keeps it there. Those who do not follow are not servents of GOD. |
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---Samuel on 5/1/08 |
"And grace forgotten is grace not gotten" you can see from these words, very clearly that the writer is depending on his remembrance of grace and not Gods remembering grace. God is one that offers grace, we accept grace, and remembering of grace is the prerogative of the Lord Jesus Christ. I do not believe he will forget what he has given. |
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---Mima on 5/1/08 |
Samuel,1
What started Jesus unto the sayings of Luke 17:7_10 you cited? It was on account of the disciples asking the Lord to increase their faith right after he had told them to forgive each one their brother even if seven times in a day. Why do you think they asked for faith? I believe it is because they felt that unless they had a faith unlike what they knew themselves to have, they would not be able to carry the Lords command. |
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---Nana on 5/1/08 |
Samuel,2
The Lord's answer was a rebuke and a testimony to them that they could do even more than what it was asked of them. If Luke follows a somewhat chronological order, in Luke 11 Jesus had already taught them about forgiveness and even the Lord's Prayer. |
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---Nana on 5/1/08 |
Samuel,3
Moreover, if what we do is insignificant and of no value, the parable of the talents would mean nothing and Matthew 24: 46: "Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. 47: Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods." would not be so. |
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---Nana on 5/1/08 |
Faith without works is 100% dead. And grace forgotten is grace not gotten. |
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---Eloy on 5/1/08 |
JESUS illustrated the point of the value of doing right. NASB
Luk 17:7 "Which of you, having a slave plowing or tending sheep, will say to him when he has come in from the field, 'Come immediately and sit down to eat'?
Luk 17:8 "But will he not say to him, 'Prepare something for me to eat, and {properly} clothe yourself and serve me while I eat and drink, and afterward you may eat and drink'? |
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---Samuel on 4/30/08 |
Luk 17:9 "He does not thank the slave because he did the things which were commanded, does he?
Luk 17:10 "So you too, when you do all the things which are commanded you, say, 'We are unworthy slaves, we have done {only} that which we ought to have done.' "
You find very few in any who stresses obdience more then we do in my church SDA. But not one tinest part of anything we do earns us anything toward salvation. |
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---Samuel on 4/30/08 |
The only works that earn us salvation is the work JESUS did on earth and in heaven as our High Priest. We bring nothing in our hands simply to his cross we cling.
Rom 3:20 because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for through the Law {comes} the knowledge of sin.
Rom 3:24 being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus, NASB |
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---Samuel on 4/30/08 |
The sin of the galations was to rely on works and the law to save them.
Rom 3:27 Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith.
Rom 3:28 For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law. NASB |
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---Samuel on 4/30/08 |
Obedience begins at the moment of salvation. When God pays you a visit and you say I do. OBEDIENCE, begans. |
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---catherine on 4/30/08 |
Because it does: Israelites>>A good example of dosobedience. God killed 24,000 of them in one day.If you love me you will obey me. It's in the Bible somewhere. True obedience means>>>imitating God in holiness, humility, and love. Don't forget Jesus Christ even though He was God in the flesh He obeyed the Father even unto the cross. Facing clashing claims for one's allegiance, the Christian obeys God rather than other persons. |
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---catherine on 4/30/08 |
Comment.
The first part of the verse is in jeopardy.Sin is not transferable.We do not inherit sin from a former human.No one was born with a sin.One chooses to be disobedient by free will decisions ,not another's decision. |
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---earl on 4/30/08 |
A slave can obey but still hate his master.Do not think for a second that YOUR obedience will save or make you righteous.Perfect obedience comes only through Jesus Christ.We have AND NEED the imputed righteousness of Christ. |
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---duane on 4/30/08 |
Perhaps most important of all: does one display and further develop dynamic love for others? This, not obedience, is the essence of salvation. Remember, "I called you servants before....now I call you friends." |
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---Jenny on 4/30/08 |
Our righteousness comes from obeying Jesus Christ, and not because Jesus Christ was righteous. Each soul is held accountable for their own works, and not those of our Father's works. Some preacher's children leave their father and go serve sin, and likewise many unregenerate children leave their father and go serve Christ. Christ my Father finished his own mission, and now it is left for each soul to choose whether to obey and take up their own cross and follow after Christ, or else not and be condemned. |
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---Eloy on 4/30/08 |
.samuel, you speak falsehood, every work is rewarded now in this lifetime, and also in the hereafter, every work, whether good or bad will be rewarded. |
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---Eloy on 4/30/08 |
Yeah really, why people think that?
Must be because they realize that after getting
that "righteousness" they were not placed in
God's Museum of Holy Artifacts but rather
were told that they are branch of a peculiar
vine which if it bears not fruit is cast and
burned (John 15), or they fear being kicked
to the curb were, "there shall be weeping and
gnashing of teeth.", Matthew 24. |
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---Nana on 4/30/08 |
Our righteousness comes from obeying Jesus Christ, and not because Jesus Christ was righteous. Each soul is held accountable for their own works, and not those of our Father's works. Some preacher's children leave their father and go serve sin, and likewise many unregenerate children leave their father and go serve Christ. Christ my Father finished his own mission, and now it is left for each soul to choose whether obey and to take up their own cross and follow after Christ, or else not and be condemned. |
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---Eloy on 4/30/08 |
Unsaved people can behave righteously.
Conversely, saved people can behave unrighteously.
There is a clear bright line between the scriptural concept of "being righteous" and "doing righteousness".
If that distinction isn't clear people may equate righteous acts to salvation. |
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---AG on 4/29/08 |
Our righteouness comes from being in JESUS CHRIST. In Him is life and the power to do right. Apart from JESUS we can do nothing. Nor do our works earn anything for us. Good works are to be the result of being Born Again. Those who do not follow JESUS are showing they are not born again. |
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---Samuel on 4/29/08 |
Mankind (including Christianity) has always been under a "strong delusion" and felt more comfortable believing that our own efforts and scholarly accomplishments could make us deserving of salvation, but Christ alone is our "cornerstone" (Ephesians 2:20) and by laying a foundation of our own (works/deeds, scholarly accomplishment) repentance in Christ becomes impossible (Hebrews chapter 6). This must not continue. He will not be unjust and overlook this at the final judgement. |
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---greg on 4/29/08 |
One human's sin brought a curse upon her children, but each offspring could repent back to God and be made righteous. Each soul is held accountable and rewarded according to their own works, not their parents works. So too with Christ, he obtained righteousness and blessing for us, but evenso each offspring coming after him is held accountable to either obey or else be disobedient. Jesus finished his own mission, now each must also finish their own. Please Read- Matthew 16:27+ II Corinthians 5:10. |
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---Eloy on 4/29/08 |
All the good things anyone does will not pay the price of a single sin. JESUS alone can save us and He does that by Grace alone.
Then also by Grace alone we are to be in CHRIST JESUS walking by faith. We may fall down many times. But we look to JESUS rise up and follow Him. Because we ask Him to be LORD of our life we walk with JESUS. |
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---Samuel on 4/28/08 |
mima, we have no rightenous except that imparted to us thru jesus.scripture tells us that without him we can do nothing.this scripture you quote is speaking of adam whos discbidience caused sin to enter the world, and jesus by who death and resurrection sin and death were defeated.we can do nothing without jesus.we are nothing without jesus. |
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---tom2 on 4/28/08 |
Pride is why. Man is prideful and loves to boast about his conquests. The only righteousness that God accepts is that of His Son Jesus Christ in His death on the Cross for sin. |
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---Helen_5378 on 8/17/07 |
I believe it is over emphasized in the Church, however it is necessary to be reveiwed every now and then. Many in the Church are not trully saved. They are Christian in name alone. They never made the commitment in their heart so there is no desire for obedience to God's Word. |
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---Marcia on 8/17/07 |
note 4:5R
Rom 4:3 What does the Scripture say? Abraham believed God, it was credited to him as righteousness.
Rom 4:4 Now when a man works, his wages are not credited to him as a gift, but as an obligation
Rom 4:5 However, to the man who does not work but trusts God who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness
Rom 4:6 David says the same thing .....the blessedness of the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works |
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---Andrea on 8/16/07 |
jana...I see you have a hard time understanding that true born-again-christians have freedom in Christ.
**you said: Do we just do nothing eg feeding poor, giving, help old people,visit jail, visit poor.Do we ignore all these?**
Doing these things does not get you salvation.
We do these things because we have Salvation and our love for Christ. |
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---JIM on 8/16/07 |
Salvation depends on the obedience of Jesus which is what this verse is talking about. The "one man's disobedience" is Adam. The "obedience of One" is Jesus. The Scripture reference is Romans 5:19. |
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---Helen_5378 on 8/16/07 |
1 John 1:8 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
We will have sin even up to the time of our death. Fortunately it will be the final act of our sanctification to remove all sinfulness from us when we see Christ face to face. In contrast to the SDA doctrine that one has to perfect oneself to be worthy of eternal life.
Sin is from the world system, our own flesh, and from the devil. In the eternal state, all 3 will be gone so how can we sin further? |
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---lee on 2/8/07 |
Ramsey, why do u rely on Christ to do all the works? So in saying what u said, does that mean we can sin yet still be saved? Do we just do nothing eg feeding poor, giving, help old people,visit jail, visit poor.Do we ignore all these? WRONG.Jesus said feed the poor, visit the prisoners etc etc.U do these to others, u also do 2 me.Thats work n we do it obediently |
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---jana on 2/3/07 |
"why then do we insist that our salvation our righteousness depends on our obedience?" Who are we?
Personally, I know that the Fathers salvation & righteousness, & their being both imparted & imputed to me depends entirely upon Him. I was drawn to salvation, given faith & empowered to submit to & obey the principles for life that the Father has opened my mind to. Abraham believed (relied on, adhered to, depended upon & trusted in) God and it was attributed to him as righteousness. |
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---josef on 1/20/07 |
It was by Jesus' obedience to God and dying on the cross for our sins that we can have salvation. There is no good works that we can do to save ourselves, else Jesus' work on the Cross would be useless. Only by JESUS' OBEDEDIENCE to the calling on his life are we saved. Hallelujah! |
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---Ramsey on 1/20/07 |
Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; |
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---BRUCE5656 on 1/20/07 |
I believe that our "salvation" is the Grace of God. I also believe that our "righteousness" is our obedience to God. |
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---Pat on 1/20/07 |
WE obey GOD because we love HIM. NOT to get something from HIM. PLUS, IF YOU want to be BLESSED BY HIM YOU will have to obey HIM. PLUS, YOU SHALL PAY for not obeying HIM. HE DIED a TUMULTUOUS death, for you, so if you are truly saved, you will want to obey GOD. YOU WILL HAVE A STRONG desire TO OBEY HIM.I AM hopeing JESUS HAS SAVED YOU. |
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---CATHERINE on 1/17/07 |
Mima
Whom this verse is speaking of is Adam & Jesus. The disobedience of Adam brought on the fall of man, form the grace of God. The obedience of Jesus has brought salvation to man, by the grace of God.
To answer your question, You need to know what it means to accept Christ and to repent for your sins. SALVATION comes through acceptance of Christ, and all that he is. You can not seek to be part of the body of Christ and also seek to be disobedient to the word of God. |
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---ShawnM.T on 1/17/07 |
(ii)
Jesus Christ was obedient to the word of God. By accepting Christ as our Lord & savior and repenting for our sins, we are SAVED. This makes us part of the body of Christ. In doing so we are accepting all that Christ is and this means being obedient to the word of God. We are saved by the grace of God through our faith in Christ. It is by his grace that we are made RIGHTEOUS unto him. |
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---ShawnM.T on 1/17/07 |
Because most people don't understand that the word salvation means a lot more than just having sins forgiven. It also contains healing, deliverance, protection from enemies, wholeness, wellness, and rescue. And some of those areas of salvation do have a lot to do with our behavior and obedience. I may be saved(forgiven) but if I'm drinking 10 cans of beer every day my body is going to need to be saved (healed) from sickness. |
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---john on 1/17/07 |
There is only one man whose disobedience made--and makes many sinners: Adam.
There is only One Whose obedience made--and makes--many righteous: Jesus Christ. |
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---Jack on 1/17/07 |
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