No, I don't believe that any bible 'excludes' some of the words. I think it is just that all bibles show TWO different versions. If you type a few key words from the prayer (but not the last few!!) into the search box of a concordance (Blue Letter Bible is good for this) you will be given the two places where these can be found. I have no idea why some churches favour one version and some the other.
---RitaH on 9/17/07|
In fact I've heard both versions recited in Catholic churches one with and one without "for Thine is the kingdom, power and glory for ever and ever, Amen."
Even by omitting it, we're still saying "Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven".
---Caring on 9/16/07|
If I knew about it, I would not read it. So therefore, I do not know of any.
---catherine on 9/16/07|
"for thine is the kingdom and power and authority (glory)" does not come from the original manuscripts at all, and many translations do not include it at all because it was added later as a text note.
However, in my parish (and most that I have attended), this phrase is added to the Lord's prayer with a brief separation to show that it is an addition during the Mass - it is a beautiful and perfectly acceptable addition - but not part of the inspired text.
---lorra8574 on 9/16/07|
I've never seen that prayer in Luke 11:2 to include everything that Matt.6 does in any version.I see many quotes in the N.T that are taken from the O.T and they are way different than when you go there yourself and read them.
Anoher one is Luke 4:18 quoting Is.61:1.
Maybe they didn't use the KJV in the O.T.hehaw.
---john on 9/16/07|
I have written under various names. I don't think I have misled anyone, but they may have wondered why!
These are the names and why ...
Alan of UK,
Alan4469 of UK, (that was to show my Penpal ID, but for some reason I was terminated) AlanUKQuent5569 (to try and show what my new PenPal name was)
But since I have lost my PenPal profile again, (and seem to be prevented from joining P/P again) I have reverted to
---alan_of_UK on 3/3/07|
denise. Jack is Jack and john is john. I live in B.C. Canada. I don't know where Jack lives but we quite often don't agree with eachother. If we were the same person I think we'd support eachother totally wouldn't we? I don't know how to prove it though. I guess you'll just have to take my word for it.
---john on 2/26/07|
There is alot of name swapping going on. I see it and so do you. It's bringing more confusion and contention. I suppose that's the purpose. Several of us have voiced our opinions and people are mad. They use your name and write Scriptural errors. Rachel Reiter and I share a name, we don't step on each others beliefs. We may not agree, but she was up front. Swapping and using our names to spew out false gospels doesn't cast a favorable light on what you're pushing.
---Rachel on 2/26/07|
NVBarbara, the I got this from a nondenom site called Bible Text for you. If you google it you can find more on this.
"There is strong evidence that the original Greek text of Matthew did not include the KJV's "For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen." The Lord's Prayer as it appears in Luke 11:2-4 also does not include "For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen."
---augusta on 2/26/07|
** I think that Jack and john are the same.**
You think wrong, Denise. I write under ONE name: Jack.
---Jack on 2/26/07|
Actually both versions of the Lords Prayer are correct. In Matthew, Jesus was speaking to the multitude and He used the doxology at the Sermon on the Mount.
In Luke, Jesus was teaching His deciples, who were really commissioned Apostels by now. The doxology was already understood.
Jesus taught this on two completely different occassions, with two different audiances, and for different reasons.
The Bible is correct on both accounts.
---John on 2/26/07|
I think that Jack and john are the same.
---Denise on 2/26/07|
This doxology does not appear in the oldest Greek manuscripts, and in those which do include it, there are variations. Luke omits it. Many eminent textual authorities believe that it was added by later hands, perhaps to make the prayer more suitable for public worship. The doxology is, however, biblical.
Furthermore, the majority of Greek manuscripts do contain the doxology. I believe it is safe to say that it is in fact God's word inspire through the Holy Spirit. No reason to believe otherwise.
---Ramon on 2/26/07|
I use the KJV. But I have on my bible CD that I can compare bibles. I compared KJV to the English verison and the prayer is in the English verison but, it done alot of changes to the words. Mixed them up, added to the verses, used different words, that gives the prayer a different meaning. But to say that KJV is the best bible, I can't. I like this version because it's what I grew up reading.
---Rebecca_D on 2/26/07|
NVbarbara. The Lords prayer is different in Luke 11 than it is in Matt.6. Maybe the Catholics are quoting the one In Luke 11. Luke doesn't say "for thine is the kingdom and power and authority." Catholics are not doing anything wrong by quoting Luke 11 instead of Matt.6
---john on 2/26/07|
The two different versions of the Lord's Prayer that some of you mention are BOTH in the bible. The longer one is found in Matthew 6:9-13 and the shorter one is in Luke 11:1-4. The shorter one is favoured by the Roman Catholic Church and is also found in the Anglican book of Common Prayer. Both are equally scriptural.
---m.p.a. on 2/26/07|
NVBarbara - The RCC glories in itself and not at all in God. That is why they leave off the last part of the Lord's Prayer, because it gives all the glory to God which the RCC does not do.
---Helen_5378 on 2/25/07|
When you are comparing early Greek papyri manuscripts there are differences between Matthew and Luke's renderings of what Christ included in the Lord's Prayer. Matthew is writing as an eye witness to the event and Luke is writing based on multihanded accounts of others. Luke is simply writing the first of two private letters to Theophilus explaining events as best as he knows them and he becomes more technically accurate in the later parts of Acts where he becomes a principle in events he is chronicaling.
---notlaw99 on 2/25/07|
I DO NOT wish to get into a brawl with Catholics!!!! However I have always wondered why the Lord's Prayer is different in the RCC than that of other churches. Other churches end up the Prayer with "for Thine is the kingdom, power and glory for ever and ever, Amen. Why the difference?
PLEASE have some respect everyone and don't turn this into a train wreck snapping at each other!
---NVBarbara on 2/25/07|
Has anyone but me noticed that the Prayer is given in slightly different versions in Matthew and Luke?
Or that the common English version misrenders "ton arton imon ton episouion"?
---Jack on 2/25/07|
** Do some bibles exclude certain verses from the from the Lord's Prayer Luke in 11:2 and if so why?**
Once more the title of the blog is misleading.
Some old Gospel mss do not contain the words, "For thine is the kingdom and the power and the glory..." However, as this was a standard conclusion to Jewish prayers at the time, this would have been added anyway.
---Jack on 2/25/07|