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Is The Virgin Birth Essential

Why is the virgin birth essential to Christ's deity? Is the virgin birth a faith-based belief are is it somehow proveable?

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 ---Mima on 5/4/07
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One reason the virgin birth is essential is that it is a fulfillment of the prophecy of Is.7:14.
---john on 1/1/08


Luke 1:30-32 - And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God. And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS. He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:
---NVBarbara on 6/8/07


Alan OF Uk ::My Friend we are dealing with the actions of the creator of heaven & earth His will alone is Conception. He is God He can do every & anything except wrong & this he cannot do as He is Perfection.That is why he demands the same of us.
---Emcee on 6/7/07


Jerry::I speak openly for all to hear read & believe.If we cannot see the truth in Genesis 3:15 what other Plausible explaination will & or can you draw from a reaction By the Almighty, especially when Satan interferes with His Plan. He is God .He fully well knew satan would poke his nose in where it was not wanted so HIS alternatnate plan came into effect He creates EVA2 & takes Adam2 out of her at His discreation.& separates satan from Mary & the seed she was to recieve.
---Emcee on 6/7/07


Jerry::I speak openly for all to hear read & believe.If we cannot see the truth in Genesis 3:15 what other Plausible explaination will & or can you draw from a reaction By the Almighty, especially when Satan interferes with His Plan. He is God .He fully well knew satan would poke his nose in where it was not wanted so HIS alternatnate plan came into effect He creates EVA2 & takes Adam2 out of her at His discreation.& separates satan from Mary & the seed she was to recieve.
---Emcee on 6/7/07




Emcee ... I think we use the word conceive in different ways.
If you mean God conceived Mary "in His mind", I would go along with you, as the Plan was conceived then
But how could He conceive her physically, because He is a man not a woman, and her parents were not alive yet?
---alan_of_UK on 6/7/07


Alan Of UK::Do not be puzzled. Yes This is what I state.The way's of Gods Conception are limitless .When God concieves it can be instantaneous OR Delayed.when man concieves he has an idea draws a plan& reworks it & then incorporates his idea .Not so with God who created the universe as is seen in Genesis.At the blink of an eye He creates perfection.He demonstrates this by sending His angel thousands of years later to prove His Prophecy.The enmity we see, is the Divisions today.Her seed & his seed.
---Emcee on 6/7/07


Emcee > "But she was conceived by God In Gen3:15" ...You give this agian which puzzles me more than anything in RCC doctrine.
You seem to be saying that Mary existed from the time of Adam & Eve.
Was not Mary conceived physically by her own earthy parents?
---alan_of_UK on 6/7/07


Jesus was not conceived by Mary and Joseph.

Matthew 1:18 - Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.


---Marla on 6/6/07


Emcee: there are many truths contained in the bible that others refuse to see. Who is living in darkness. the christian that picks and chooses which scriptures they accept or reject or the person who refuses to see the scriptures and then tries to argue what is not written is truth. all people do on here is try to show truth as contained in the bible. why do so many reject it as false. it is written clearly in black and white. God is a God of truth with one road to follow back to Him, not many roads.
---ashley on 6/2/07




Emcee: It is indeed a rare thing for me to side with Ashley, but my Bible does not mention any conception in Gen 3:15 - only some enmity. And Mary is not the woman being discussed. In context, the woman must be Eve, but figuratively, you could make a case for her being the Church. But Mary? No way!!!
---Jerry on 6/2/07


Catherine ::I agree we are all decendants of A&E but not Mary & Jesus true they were to come from the house of David & the lineage shows that.But the conception being Miraculus is the difference & the prophecy in Genesis.
---Emcee on 6/1/07


Ashley :: You jump from blog to blog like a grass hopper this is not a mix & match programm.You do not believe God Only raise arguements .Find another bell to satisfy your clammouring.Mary was deccended As the OTstates But she was conceived by God In Gen3:15 Or dont you think God has such Power as A creator.
---Emcee on 6/1/07


Joseph was NOT the father of Jesus Christ so if what you are saying is true and it was Joseph and not mary directly descended from David. you have just destroyed the bible because Jesus is the King of Kings and is directly descended from the lineage of David. We know that our Heavenly Father is the father of Jesus Christ and Mary is the woman who gave birth to him. Joseph has no part at all in the birth of Jesus Christ. He is nothing more than a bystander.
---ashley on 6/1/07


Ashley:: Ananswer was given but Not Printed Not my Fault.But look in Jn19:26-27.Mary understood & appears in obedience to her God to this day pointing to Him.But humanity chooses to get others to show me what verse & chapter.You want Proof well Look in Matthew what jesus says about people who want proof & a sign12:38-40.Not very nice words from your creator.
---Emcee on 5/31/07


Technically Jesus is a direct descendent of David from Joseph not mary...mary came into the picture b/c of the marriage to joseph...every place that lists the geneology brings up that Joseph is the direct relation to David not Mary...
---mark_B. on 6/1/07


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So if you want to be really pickky about it and use our societies norms of family and descendents not the jewish way...Jesus was birthed from Mary before mary and joseph Got married Luke 2:5"who was pledged to be married to him [joseph]"...so when mary had Jesus, was not a direct descendent of David...but after mary God married Jesus was...Get it??
---mark_B. on 6/1/07


Emcee, you have still not answered my question with book, chapter and verse that says mother behold thy son, son behold they mother. you say Mary was not a descendant of Adam and Eve. is that another quote from the book of emcee. my bible teaches me that Jesus Christ is a direct descendent from Kings. the line of David to be exact. How can he be that if Mary is not also a direct descendant from David. whoops.
---ashley on 5/31/07


You may make all the corrections you want to. Mary as is all of us, are direct decendants of Adam and Eve. Furthermore they were our first parents.
---catherine on 5/31/07


Catharine::You have Reverence For Jesus Mother.I do need to make a correction She was not Eves daughter,But the creation of God almighty In Gen 3:15 as WOMAN & the prediction that her would crush his head.She further emphasises that when she states "my soul doth magnify the lord my Saviour."but she had already been saved & separated from Satan By God in Gen3:15 by enmity & the OT Prophets clarify That sin was introduced by woman& By her seed & her it would be removed& stamped out.
---Emcee on 5/30/07


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Eloy::I hear you loud & clear & need to remind you that Lucifer was theAngel of Light Most high in Heaven.But by pride some of which you sometimes display he was CAST into the fiery Pit& dont forget Judas who betrayed his God for 40 pieces of Silver.Yet still there are those who wander this earth seeking the ruin of Souls.Do not worry about me like Jesus said "Weep for yourself & your children those who you lead astray."Unless you say you do not.
---Emcee on 5/30/07


Never was any daughter of Eve so dignified as the Virgin Mary was, and yet in danger of falling under the imputation of one of the worst of crimes. The mystery of Christ's incarnation is to be adored, not pried into. If we know not the way of the Spirit in the formation of common persons, nor how the bones are formed of the womb of anyone that is with child much less do we know how the blessed Jesus was formed in the womb of the blessed virgin.
---catherine on 5/30/07


The Nativity Story has me somewhat puzzled today because nowhere in the Bible does it states that we begin over from the beginning
Perhaps the problem is that someone is trying to take the womans seed and put it in their line???????????
---anonymous on 5/25/07


.emcee, God does not condemn his own whom profess his own righteous, for the righteous enter into eternal life with Jesus Christ, but all of our enemies are destroyed into the lake of fire and brimstone for the error of their ways. Jesus does not dismember his own body and throw himself into the everlasting torments, no, by no means. Instead my Papa throws all those against him and his body into the fiery abyss of hell. You need to choose the right side, for presently you are on the broad road.
---Eloy on 5/23/07


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.emcee, God does not condemn his own whom profess his own righteousness, for the righteous enter into eternal life with Jesus Christ, but all of our enemies are destroyed into the lake of fire and brimstone for the error of their ways. Jesus does not dismember his own body and throw himself into the everlasting torments, no, by no means. Instead my Papa throws all those against him and his body into the fiery abyss of hell. You need to choose the right side, for presently you are on the broad road.
---Eloy on 5/23/07


Ask God about it honey. Undoubtedly God felt it was necessary He brought it into existence. It happened. It is true and that's all we need to know, my friend. Receive it, believe it. In Jesus holy name.
---Robyn on 5/23/07


Ashley & Eloy::To Paraphrase Eloy "You mock & do not have the truth in you "You will join those who weep & gnash their teeth till you repent of Almighty God.YES Your eyes will be opened Vengence is mine saith the lord.
---Emcee on 5/23/07


It is so funny reading how people squirm in their chairs or they try to twist things. Newsflash. many do read the bible. There is only one name under heaven where we can be forgiven of our sins and return to His kingdom, not her kingdom and that is Jesus Christ, not mary, joseph, moses, etc. why people choose to pray to, worship, idolize Mary is beyond our comprehension. Jesus said I am the way, the truth and light, Not Mary and I are the way. why read more into something that does not exist.
---ashley on 5/23/07


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It's only essential in the fact that it was to fulfill Isaiah's prophecy that a virgin will have a baby and his name will be called Immanuel, "God with us". Please Read- Isaiah 7:14; 8:10; 9:6.
---Eloy on 5/23/07


Anthony :: You have stumbled on Gods plan in Gen3:15,Instead of taking woman out of man as in A&E he reverses the plan & creats a woman who He Produces at His wish & is protected from the wiles of satan .He takes Man out of woman on this occassion.She is EVA2 & His son as man is Adam 2& thus perfection is again restored .Those who follow Jesus & Mary attain That perfection.Its all so clear when you follow his word The church The H/S Doctrines Of the Rcc .
---Emcee on 5/22/07


When I hear a person question or disregard the virgin birth of the Lord Jesus Christ I just discount that person's views and totally disregard what they have to say concerning spiritual matters.
---Mima on 5/22/07


The virgin birth is essential to Christ's deity because if Joseph was the genetic father then Jesus would have not only been just another man, but have inherited Adam's sin which would make Him an unworthy, unacceptable sacrifice to God. Also, it is interesting that the first woman came from Adam, a sinless man who brought death into the world; yet the last Adam, a sinless man who takes death from the world, came from a woman.
---Anthony on 5/6/07


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If it was not essential why is it being defended & opposed so vehemenently on this forum.GOD DOES NOT CREATE BLEMISH BUT PERFECTION.
---Emcee on 5/6/07


For once I agree with Lorra, the Virgin Bierth is essential and it is clear in the Greek.
I think that in many ways it is a comment on today that we assume that an unmarried girl is not a virgin, hence questoning "alma".
But the key fact is that the word uswed in both the Septuaging and Matthew is "parthenos", universally translated as Virgin.
---mike8384 on 5/6/07


For God to be the Father, the mother had to be a virgin, otherwise the human father is the father and Jesus would have been a mere mortal like the rest of us. The Jews rejected the Greek Septuagint translation in favour of the Hebrew transcripts because the Hebrew version has the Messiah born of a young woman instead of a virgin. This way, to them, Jesus was only a man and not the Son of God.
---lorra8574 on 5/5/07


P2 Note that the Hebrew term "alma" meaning young woman does not negate the necessity of a virgin birth, as a young Jewish woman was expected to be a virgin. The Greek Septuagint was just much more explicit in th prophecy. Most of the OT quotes in the NT are from the Septuagint translation, and the early Christians used the Septuagint.
---lorra8574 on 5/5/07


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The truth always Prevails inspite of dissention God only produces Perfection as he did A&EOur First parents encountered Temptation & failed Mary did NOT FAIL.This is what makes her EVA or AVE.2nd Eve spotless & pure The mother of Our God Jesus whom many deny,& some too ashamed to admit it.
---Emcee on 5/4/07


john, I am glad you bring up the prophecy in Isaiah. In Hank Hanagrafts book: The Bible Answer Book 2. Hank attempts to explain that the prophecy in Isaiah 7 is fulfilled 'in part' by Isaiah and the prophetess in Isaiah 8. Does anyone have any thoughts on this?
---Ryan_Z on 5/4/07


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