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Is Pope John Paul II In Heaven

Is the Pope John Paul II in Heaven or in Hell?

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 ---Gordon on 8/9/07
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alienUK: I agree, Gordon is way off,fooled by a doctrine of devils

The Bible is clear: Hell-Fire, Fire that Utterly Kills/Cleanses, will be poured out upon Earth, the heavens, and sinners at the end of the age

"There will be no more death nor crying nor pain nor sorrow for the former things have passed away"

My God is not a sadist. He puts an end to misery for creatures that would never be happy in a sinless "New heavens and Earth" that He "shall create"
---SeventhSeal on 9/18/07


Emcee, I use the Hebrew Names of the Trinity because that is their True Names. GOD's chosen people of the Faith began with the Jewish/Hebrew race. Salvation is of the Jews FIRST, then to the Gentiles. The Gentiles are GRAFTED in to the Jewish root. Jesus (YAHUSHUA) was BORN in the Jewish race. He was born in Israel. If Iwere born in Germany, I may be called Gunter, not Gordon. GOD created the Hebrew language for the race from which came Salvation. The name "Jesus" is Anglicized Greek.
---Gordon on 9/18/07


Alan of United Kingdom, One day you will see that those visitations to "Heaven and Hell and back" were REAL after all. And that it was INDEED done by the LORD's Own Hand. You will see. Because, Truth ALWAYS wins out in the End.
---Gordon on 9/18/07


I heard there is a place in the states called Waco Ive heard of some being called waco but I have yet to meet a waco.God sends people to hell back againTo verify the truth,what truth that there is a hell??AlanI agree with you "What utter nonsence"
---Emcee on 9/17/07


I heard there is a place in the states called Waco Ive heard of some being called waco but I have yet to meet a waco.God sends people to hell back againTo verify the truth,what truth that there is a hell??AlanI agree with you "What utter nonsence"
---Emcee on 9/17/07




Gordon::While what you say may be true I dont see the point of expounding on it as 99% of people realise there is a hell.it is like saying They sell meat at the butchers shop.Obvious am I missing something?what has that got to do with Pope John Paul?
---Emcee on 9/17/07


Gordon ... What nonsense
---alan_of_UK on 9/17/07


trinity is mystery. Its our best human attempt to define the state of the Godhead. It might well be wrong. It provides wonderful metaphor for community and love. What this had to do with JPII I have no clue, but lol...
---alexia on 9/17/07


Alan of U.K., Right! The LORD Jesus (YAHUSHUA) allowed some to die and descend to Hell and come back to testify that what the Scriptures say of Hell is TRUE! Likewise about Heaven. Their experiences were REAL. The LORD Jesus (YAHUSHUA) has ALL Power to take people to Heaven a/o Hell and then back for His purposes. Too many people, even within the Church, do not believe in the existence of Hell. By these testimonies, the Bible's descriptions of these Places "come to life"! Just believe it!
---Gordon on 9/17/07


Gordon::Your name indicates English so why do you use jewish names for the Blessed Trinity is it to for impresion, effect or what.In the RCC the Blessed Trinity is described as 3"seperate" Divine persons equally powerful in one God FATHER-SON-HOLY SPIRIT.do you agree yes or NO.It is a MYSTERY,not explainable & known to God alone.
---Emcee on 9/17/07




Pope John Paul II is asleep in his grave. In fact, all dead people are neither in heaven or in hell now but asleep in their graves. The dead in Christ will rise up at the 2nd coming of Christ and the rest after the end of the 1000 years.
---richard on 9/17/07


Gordon ... I had a quick look, and the "testimonies" appeared to be from people who had had near-death experiences
---alan_of_UK on 9/16/07


Emcee, Jesus Christ (YAHUSHUA), the Second Person of the Trinity, the Only BEGOTTEN Son of GOD (YAHUVEH) is both God and Man. Matthew 1:23 (Emmanuel: God with us), John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word...and the Word was God", John 1:14 "And the Word was made Flesh and dwelt among us...", and I John 5:7 "...there are Three that bear record in Heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these Three are ONE." GOD is ONE.
---Gordon on 9/16/07


Gordon, your suggested source of guidance depends entirely upon their truthfullness. Perhaps they did as they said, but there have been a number of Catholic visionaries who have claimed the same thing and yet all are denounced by non-Catholics. Test every spirit to see IF it is from God. And do not be too quick to follow someone just because they say something that you like. Make sure that you test it against the scriptures.
---lorra8574 on 9/15/07


Andrea, the term "Pope" was coined later, and it is easier that saying "bishop of Rome" every time. And that is easier still than if Peter had never settled down to a single location - Rome was not the first place where Peter was bishop, but it was the last place and where succession was established for his office after his death.
---lorra8574 on 9/15/07


Gordon,

I have heard Mary called a lot of things but never "God THE HOLY MOTHER".

Please show more where this is even close to being biblical. Luke 1:30 The angel said to her, "Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God. All believers have favor with God. That's along was from being called God.
---denna7667 on 9/15/07


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Gordon ::As we all know the divinity of the Blessed Trinity is known only to ALMIGHTY GOD.Yet you, the only one in Christendom makes a Blatant statement like that WHY? do you have DIVINE INSPIRATION? God would have revealed this to humanity -- but he didn't.
---Emcee on 9/15/07


Gordon:: The Holy Family as is known to Rcc's is patterned to Jesus Mary & Joseph.However your assumption is your own We do need to see a pattern to follow may be again you have divine inspiration & above us mere mortals.
---Emcee on 9/15/07


Emcee, In order for True Prophecy to be fulfilled from the Book of Isaiah, etc. The Holy Begotten Son of GOD Jesus (YAHUSHUA), Who IS GOD Himself (John 1:1 and 14), had to also become a Man, in Flesh-and-Blood, to be mankind's Perfect atoning Sacrifice. And, was BORN like a normal man, by way of a woman, the virgin Mary (Myriam). So, therefore Christ Jesus (YAHUSHUA) could experience life as a Man and be our Perfect Example of how to live and OBEY GOD (YAHUVEH)!
---Gordon on 9/15/07


Alan of U.K., Here are some more people who have been to Hell and Heaven. To Hell: B. W. Melvin, Jennifer Perez, Ronald Reagan (NOT the U.S. Prez), Charles McKaig, Howard Storm, also see "Revelations of Heaven and Hell By 7 Youths", See N.D.E. Studies by: Maurice S. Rawlings. To Heaven: Don Piper (sic?). Search them out and ask for the Holy Spirit's guidance!
---Gordon on 9/15/07


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Emcee, the human family is patterned after the Holy Trinity. GOD The Father YAHUVEH, GOD The Son YAHUSHUA and GOD the Holy Mother SHKHINYAH. Again, I will tell you what I told to Ruben. Do not scoff at what you do not understand. There is no way that imperfect, fallen man can possibly FULLY understand a Perfect, Holy, OmniEVERYTHING GOD. So, I suggest you truly PRAY for the Holy Spirit's confirmation of what I'm telling you before you speak of this RASHLY.
---Gordon on 9/15/07


SeventhSeal: 1 Corinthians 6:3 "Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?"
---lorra8574 on 9/14/07


SeventhSeal: The Devil is a fallen angel - if he should spout heresy would you not rebuke him? And if any other angel were to do the same, would you remain silent? Or assume that the angel must be right because he is an angel?

If my Pope did not have the fortitude to rebuke an angel for heresy, then he has no business leading Christ's flock.
---lorra8574 on 9/14/07


Gordon:: If God was a mother what need did He have to create Mary to be HIS sons earthly Mother. So now you bring a female into the Godly Equation why??did not God create ADAM to HIS likeness Adam was a Man.Then you insist you do not understand to this I agree because God is 3 persons in one equally distinct but one and the same God.It's HIS Mystery accept it as is.
---Emcee on 9/14/07


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thank you alan - I have reminded people in the past that Emcee may be the eldest blogger here - and it is to his credit that he keeps us with the whipper snappers on CN.

We should all note that no matter what our doctrines or even if we're christian - we are all human an Jesus commanded respect - it is His testimony and yours.
That's not a rebuke to you 7th - it is to myself as well.
Sometimes our passion and exasperation gets out of hand.
be blessed all. Andrea
new penpal name
---andre5846 on 9/14/07


Alan of UK:: Thanks friend.
Gordon:: what you are suggesting to Alan is "Communication with the dead" which is different from VOLUNTARY apparations of Mary Jesus Earthly Mother.You quote Wisdom from the OT but display different tendancies in other Posts.
---Emcee on 9/14/07


andrea, we werent discussing whether peter was the pope, only that he was the subject of Jesus statement that he was the rock. And that he was. Prove to me otherwise.
---alexia on 9/14/07


Ruben, GOD is so GREAT and so much HIGHER in Greatness and Perfection that I, as a limited creature, cannot understand EVERYTHING about Him. But, The Bible says that GOD is One. And the Scriptures as well say that He consists of Three Whole Individual Persons. And yet, still they are One. Three in One! GOD the Father YAHUVEH, GOD the Son YAHUSHUA (Jesus) and GOD the Holy Spirit, Mother SHKHINAH. But, do not scoff at what you do not understand. I believe it though I don't know all that there is to know.
---Gordon on 9/14/07


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Alan of U.K., Search oh the Web for Bill Wiese, Mary K. Baxter and Elisabeth Sherrie Elijah. Those ought to be good for a start. Alan, you have Net access, type in "Experiences in Hell" or the like. You, I'm quite certain, should be amazed.
---Gordon on 9/14/07


SeventhSeal ... The way you address Emcee is offensive
We could distort your name in a similar way, but courteous people do not do that
---alan_of_UK on 9/14/07


I have a Jesus bias - do you see it - everything I say is to bring you into a stronger relationship with Him.
If I get off track from that I'd welcome a reminder.
Thanks dear.
Andrea - I'm changing to Andre5846, my penpal. So people can holler at me in private if they need too.
---andre5846 on 9/14/07


Emcee - Peter is the first man the RCC calls pope. We call him an apostle. He was blessed but not my pope. Pope is a much later addition.
Be nice Emcee
---Andrea on 9/13/07


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Andrea:: Your bias gets stronger each day.You are a well read lady Go to St Peter in Rome & read about st Peter right from the time of ChristHe was the first Pope so Matt16:17-19 is authentic.
---Emcee on 9/13/07


Empty: I qouted Catholic Source. Did not quote my opinion. You are clanging again with empty rhetoric.
---SeventhSeal on 9/13/07


Gordon "swell amount of TESTIMONIES of both Saints and sinners who the LORD GOD has taken both to Heaven and Hell and can attest to what the Scriptures say that those who die"
Hey, did they come back to write up their experiences, then?
Give us some names Gordon! Are you a Spiritist?
---alan_of_UK on 9/13/07


Alexia - only Catholics think Peter was the first pope.
---Andrea on 9/13/07


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7Seal::Empty vessels make the most sound & you are doing an excellent Job.Your convictions are your own and akin to those who resound Falseness.Your apostacy will yet be deflated,as you leak, to be a defunct seal.
---Emcee on 9/13/07


Oh but based purely on scriptural exegesis, Peter most assurerdly is the Rock. There is no serious dispute on this point by the vast vast majority of biblical scholars. Its just bad understanding of koine greek to suggest otherwise.
---alexia on 9/13/07


Lisa: "The Pope is..so exalted he is not a man but God" "Pope is called Most Holy because he is rightfully presumed such" "He is likewise divine Monarch, Supreme Emporer and King of Kings" "over Angels..So that if..angels might think contrary to the faith, they could be judged and excommunicated by the Pope" Ferrari's Ecclesiastical Dictionary with Papal Seal under the word "POPE"

Pretty strong and proud claims for a humble man making no claims.
---SeventhSeal on 9/13/07


Ruben, Like you, as I said, I believe that the Holy Bible does NOT contain EVERYTHING that there is to know. But, I only trust GOD YAHUVEH to reveal any of His secrets to His Holy Prophets (Amos 3:7 and Ephesians 4:11). I am not Catholic. I know that Mary is not the queen of Heaven. Rather, the Holy Spirit is. SHE is the REAL Queen of Heaven. The LORD recently revealed that through a Holy Prophet. The Church was NOT built on the Apostle Peter. It was founded on Jesus (YAHUSHUA) the Solid Rock!
---Gordon on 9/13/07


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no person in the Catholic church claims to have power to do anything.
It is God that works through whom he chooses.
If a priest has the gift of healing, it is not him who heals, But God who heals through him...and anything else God wants to do for that matter!
---Lisa on 9/13/07


Lisa: The Catholic Priest claims the power TO COMMAND JESUS from the courts of Heaven and then Physically enter a very ornate golden cup filled with alcoholic wine and then has the gall to call it the blood of Christ.

Christ was meek and humble and had no part in an ostentatious cup nor fermented product...and No Priest has to Power to Order Him out of Heaven.

Do you even know the teachings of the Catholic Church? I've seen this stated in concordances.
---SeventhSeal on 9/12/07


empty: No, the Warning is given in Love that you may not perish nor be "partakers of her sins and recieve not of her plagues"

"Come out of HER My People"
---SeventhSeal on 9/12/07


Gordon-Ruben, You still have not given ME Scripture Verses to "prove" that Mary was sinless and perfect. You say that "not everything to know is in the Bible (which is TRUE!), and yet you question the validity of what I am telling you "if it isn't in the Bible". HELLO?????????????


I have answer you, we go by Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition, which by the way it seems you believe this also. why are you not Catholic then?
---Ruben on 9/12/07


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Gordon-The TRUE Queen of Heaven, and Spiritual Mother of Jesus (YAHUSHUA) is The Mother SHKHINAH, the Holy Spirit. NOT the earthly mother of Jesus, Mary (Myriam).


Can you explain to me How the Holy Spirit is the Mother of Jesus, when God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy spirit are the same persons?
---Ruben on 9/12/07


7th Seal::Its the evil spirit that responds Through you. Read Acts23 3-5.But the light of christ in Matt16:17-19 will bear testimony to your demonic gutteral utterances.:-(
---Emcee on 9/12/07


anti means against Christ.
Holy communion is not an abomination.
I don't know anyone who worships the pope.
that's absurd.
Idol worship is putting an image of something we can create from our hands as a god and worshiping it as a god.
Catholic don't do that either.
We only have the Eternal Father, the Son and Holy Spirit...3 are one.
This site is sure set up to condemn the Catholic members isn't it?
---Lisa on 9/12/07


Empty: You must be in great denial to call such clear Truth Venom.

Do you bow to the Pope "Sitting in the house of God showing himself that he is God" ?

Have you departed from the faith and been "Forbidden to marry"?

Do you attempt to call Jesus down into a "golden cup filled with abomination" and pass it off as communion? Drunk with the wine of Babylon (Confusion)?

Do you pray to Mary in place of Christ?
Anti (In place of) Christ?
---SeventhSeal on 9/12/07


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ditto trey, I can find no split during that time period either. I agree with lorra.
---alexia on 9/12/07


Ruben, You still have not given ME Scripture Verses to "prove" that Mary was sinless and perfect. You say that "not everything to know is in the Bible (which is TRUE!), and yet you question the validity of what I am telling you "if it isn't in the Bible". HELLO?????????????
---Gordon on 9/12/07


Trey, that is a myth that is not even held by many Baptists. There is no historical evidence of a separate group co-existing with the Catholic Church throughout that period of time. The only group that can come close to that is the Orthodox Church which was Catholic prior to 1054, but did show some signs of the inevitable split before then.
---lorra8574 on 9/11/07


7th seal:: You seal your own fate by your tirade and your infamy.You must really dislike yourself to spit such Venom.
---Emcee on 9/11/07


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It is not place to say the condition of his heart. If he accepted Jesus Christ as his personal savior the chances are pretty good.
---denna7667 on 9/11/07


The Beast: City on 7 Hills (ROME)
A Harlot(Church) riding a Scarlet and Crimson Beast(Country) Vatican-a country, Cardinals wear Scarlet/Crimson
666 number of a Man: Popes Title "DUX CLERI" "LUDO VICCVS" Numerals add to 666
"a little Horn" a little country
"eyes of a man" Always a man speaks for it
"Change times and laws" Removed 1st Commandment, allows Idol Worship, transferred Sabbath to Sunday, split #10 in two: Compare Catechism to Ex20
---SeventhSeal on 9/11/07


Lisa, when are the dead raised?
---Ryan_Z on 9/11/07


some of you say when you die..you go no where...you are alseep.
That is a lie.
The Bible says:
1 Corinthians 15:16
For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either.
---Lisa on 9/11/07


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Gordon-But, as I explained to you, the babies and, at least, some disabled are "automatically" allowed in Heaven because of their inability to understand and reason about sin, right-and-wrong and it's consequences.


And you got this from the Bible?
---Ruben on 9/11/07


Bible tells us not to say who is going to Heaven or Hell. One is to bring Jesus up and the other brings Jesus down. Noone knows who goes to heaven or hell and should not even speculate.:)
---jody_jmartin on 9/11/07


"Martin Luther did. John Calvin did. John Wesley did. Williams did. So what is your opinion of the Baptist, Methodist, Lutheran and Presbyterian Churches that were established in Protest to Papal Rome?"
---SeventhSeal

You know what else they had in common? They couldn't agree with each others' private interpretation of Scripture either. Just like you and the other Protestants can't. ,o
---augusta on 9/11/07


Ruben, Babies and the disabled were ALSO born in sin. They ALSO come short of the Glory of GOD. But, as I explained to you, the babies and, at least, some disabled are "automatically" allowed in Heaven because of their inability to understand and reason about sin, right-and-wrong and it's consequences. Mary, the TRUE Mary, was born in sin. The TRUE Queen of Heaven, and Spiritual Mother of Jesus (YAHUSHUA) is The Mother SHKHINAH, the Holy Spirit. NOT the earthly mother of Jesus, Mary (Myriam).
---Gordon on 9/11/07


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John Paul II is in neither place. The Father, The Son and the angels are in heaven, no one else. Hell, well it really depends, do you mean Sheol, the holding place of rebellious angels or the lake of fire? His soul is in Sheol awaiting resurrection like all other souls of humanity since humanitites time line began, from Adam and Eve to the people that are dying right now.
---Ryan_Z on 9/10/07


If Pope John Paul II is in Heaven, he is there by the same same way I hope to reside there - by the grace of an Almighty God.

One other point I would like to make, the Baptist are not Protestants! The Baptist were never part of the Protestant movement. In 266 A.D. the original church split into two groups. One held to the old ways, the other began to model themselves after the old Jewish law service, with Priests, salvation by works, etc.

In 1832 the next major split occurred.
---trey on 9/10/07


lorra - not doctrine!
when a billion people are sending there prayers to the 'queen of heaven' instead of Christ - THERE IS A DOCTRINE PROBLEM!
---Andrea on 9/10/07


SeventhSeal - and these men generally considered the others in that list to be heretics damned to hell. So I am not concerned with their opinions.

And my church matches both the scriptures and the historical references to Christian church worship. That is good enough for me.
---lorra8574 on 9/10/07


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Lorra: You are right, I agree...

Your Church is the closest match to what Scripture Identifies as AntiChrist.

Shall I enumerate the points for all to see?
Martin Luther did. John Calvin did. John Wesley did. Williams did. So what is your opinion of the Baptist, Methodist, Lutheran and Presbyterian Churches that were established in Protest to Papal Rome?
---SeventhSeal on 9/10/07


Gordon-Ruben, Babies and at least a number of the disabled, and small children under a particular age of accountability are not condemned by GOD's own Wisdom and Grace.


But I thought "All" means "All", so there are exception, like Mary! Thru God's wisdom and Grace, he made Mary w/o sin...Thanks
---Ruben on 9/10/07


Gordon-Ruben, cont... I am still waiting for one or more Bible Verses that support that Mary was sinless and perfect. Tiempo esta pasando bien rapido. !Gracias!


Where does it say in the bible, if not in there it cannot be true?...Gracias Where does it say the Bible is the final authorithy?
---Ruben on 9/10/07


Ruben, Babies and at least a number of the disabled, and small children under a particular age of accountability are not condemned by GOD's own Wisdom and Grace. But, anyone and everyone else PAST the age of accountability, around the average of 8 to 12 years, when they definitely BEGIN to know and understand right from wrong, and GOD knows when that is for EACH individual, are held accountable. And Mary DEFINITELY got PAST the age of accountability.
---Gordon on 9/8/07


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Ruben, cont... I am still waiting for one or more Bible Verses that support that Mary was sinless and perfect. Tiempo esta pasando bien rapido. !Gracias!
---Gordon on 9/8/07


SeventhSeal, I am very familiar with the scriptures and my Church is the closest match to them. There have been sinners in my church and some corruption by some of its members, but not of doctrine. The Reformers can complain about the corruption, but their doctrines show a different picture. No two agreed on the proper interpretation of scriptures (with each other) and developed individual doctrines to suit their personal theologies.
---lorra8574 on 9/7/07


SeventhSeal P2, the Church today is very close with the Church of the first and second centuries. And I can go into any Catholic or Orthodox Church in this world and not be surprised by what I read or see.

But I cannot say the same for the many Protestant churches that I have been to. The Anglican seems very similar in many ways, but the others are so strange. And having friends of different Christian faiths, I noticed that they get very particular if I get their churches mixed up.
---lorra8574 on 9/7/07


7thseal-Rueben:

Isa8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

2Tim3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness



I agree 100% on these scriptures, but neither tell us "only", again the Bible does not make that claim. For instance where does it list the canonical books of the OT and NT?
---Ruben on 9/7/07


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Gordon-Ruben, The Verse "For ALL have sinned and come short of the Glory of GOD." DOES mean exactly what it says! ALL of mankind, including the earthly mother of Jesus (YAHUSHUA), Mary! Now, please show me Scripture that is Text-Proof that Mary, the earthly mother of JESUS (YAHUSHUA) was perfect and without sin. I'll be waiting!


I am sorry, but "All" means "All"...What about babies, disable? Where in the bible does it say it has to be in the scriptures to be true?
---Ruben on 9/7/07


Andrea-sola scriptura - insures we stay on the path our hearts and relationship with Christ demand. It protects adherents from going off after every charismatic figure. It is why the whole world is not Roman Catholic or Mormon. Thank God for His Word!

Please explain why there are over 28,000 Prots all claiming to be lead by the HS but can not agree among themselves!
---Ruben on 9/7/07


7S::If the people had trusted the lord & His church there would not be so many denominations giving rise to confusion.You are playing Devils advocate.
---Emcee on 9/7/07


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