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OK For Christian To Leave

Should a Christian stay with a spouse who refuses to communicate with the other on any level, will never show a sign of warmth, give a kiss, or hold a hand, but instead takes joy in tormenting the other, offers no friendship. Is it o.k. to leave and remarry in such cases?

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 ---Lynne on 10/5/07
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Go talk to your Pastor about your proablem get his advice
---Betty on 10/15/07


hi i dont think its easy to stay with an all quet spouse at all ,however be carefull when making any decisions because you might be the cause of such -if this is the case then -the solution is in your hands.blessings
---francis on 10/15/07


First,there's a reason why they went from dating/love/marriage with all the benefits. Something changed,you need to find out or get someone to.Are they a domestic violator?What's your definition of "tormentor?!" Pauline principal for divorce: fornication- they want to leave.You can divorce if they're using domestic violence on you/ child.If you were saved AFTER marriage, & they don't like it,you can't divorce.Ask God to change them.Get some solid PRAYER warriors!What's this rush to remarry?!
---Angel on 10/14/07


"My understanding is then
that adultery is idolatry. What do you think of this that I am saying
now?"

We are in agreement?
---Matthew_from_LA on 10/12/07


"So then, I do not see that idolatry requires things
of "stones and with stocks""

I agree.
---Matthew_from_LA on 10/12/07




Nana)It would be nice if you would state some type of conclusion for this lady. I am sorry that you are in this situation. There is nothing stopping you from leaving this man which sounds like a great idea. I am not going to stretch scripture. Unless he is not a christian,orhas committed adultry you are bound to him until he dies. If you seperate and you find that he committs adulty,you have the go ahead to date and remarry. Chances that if you leave,he will find someone else and fornicate.
---larry9688 on 10/12/07


When someone takes joy in tormenting the other then it is a form of ABUSE. Abuse wears a person down mentally, physically, and spiritually.
---Darlene on 10/12/07


1)
Matthew,
Last night when I wrote, Col 3:5 seemed to be the Scripture that
would focus more unto what you asked me to provide: "Nana, if
there is a passage where God's people were accussed of adultery
when no idolatry ocurred, then please show me because I am
about to make up mind here that spiritual adultrery involves
worshipping other god's(this is my first time studying up on this).
---Matthew_from_LA on 10/10/07
---Nana on 10/12/07


2
Matthew,
Very good you looked up those definitions.
Here is one more thing I will add based on Col 3:5. The word
"covet" has "desire" as a synonym. Paul says: "...and covetousness,
which is idolatry:" Now, one of God's Commandments: Exodus
20:17: "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not
covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant,
nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's."
---Nana on 10/12/07


3)
Matthew,
Adultery of the heart or the physical act were equated one to another
by our Lord Jesus. So then, I do not see that idolatry requires things
of "stones and with stocks" necessarily. My understanding is then
that adultery is idolatry. What do you think of this that I am saying
now?
---Nana on 10/12/07




0)
alexia,
What is it to you?
---Nana on 10/12/07


"Colossians 3:5: "Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth,
fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and
covetousness, which is idolatry:"

If this was to be likened to marriage I again see adultery being occured, either, the physcial act or adultery of the heart.
I'll show you why. I looked up the definitions for these words.
---Matthew_from_LA on 10/11/07


2)
Fornication is a given.
Uncleanness is not so clear, but the rest is.
Concupiscence- A strong desire, especially sexual desire, lust.

So if concupiscience was likened onto marriage it is adultery of the heart.

Inordinate- Exceeding reasonable limits, immoderate.

So you can't be inordinately affectionate to God so the same would apply to your wife/husband.
---Matthew_from_LA on 10/11/07


3)
Continuing with inordinate affection...

Spiritually, this is over affection to other things or other people which is idolatry. If it was likened onto marriage I can imagine adultery of the heart applying here or the physical act. I am even leaving my heart open to loving something more than your wife(like work or your hobby etc.) but still very apprehensive.

Covetousness is also a given.
Wanting something that is forbbiden.
---Matthew_from_LA on 10/11/07


4)
COntinuing with covetousness. In marriage that would be another wife/husband, spiritually, it is making an item or person more desirable than God.


Nana, I seem the same pattern. What God calls idolatry here still appears to be worshipping something other than them or loving something more than Him or wanting something more than Him.
---Matthew_from_LA on 10/11/07


5)
Keep in mind I said more than once that adultery of the heart would count as adultery in a marriage. I don't limit adultery to the physcial act either, I am just very careful to go beyond that point, because I want to be careful.
---Matthew_from_LA on 10/11/07


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nana, what has all this to do with the question at hand?
---alexia on 10/11/07


7)
I now will pose that the root of all our wrongdoings and transgressions is
an unruly and evil spirit. Our very own spirit. Many pose that it is the
Holy Spirit that does the works through us. But I say that the Holy Spirit
is a Counselor, John 16:13. We have a spirit that must comform to the
selfsame image of the Holy Spirit. If couples sought to do that there
would not be divorce to speak of.
---Nana on 10/11/07


8)
John 4:23: "But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers
shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such
to worship him." And Paul says: II Corinthians 7:1: "Having therefore these
promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the
flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.", and Paul would
not be saying that the Holy Spirit needs a cleansing.
---Nana on 10/11/07


1)
Deuteronomy 5:29: "O that there were such an heart in them, that they
would fear me, and keep all my commandments always, that it might be
well with them, and with their children for ever!"
---Nana on 10/11/07


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2)
"if this was to be likened ", love that bit! Jesus was always "likening" the
Kingdom of God. I see that there is not much likening going aroud, but
rather a distancing and a separation of functions and entities. From an
orange orange juice and from a lemon lemon juice, but from where do
we get adulteries? Well, even, what is the seat of idolatry from which
it is enacted and brought forth?
---Nana on 10/11/07


3)
Mark 7:20: "And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that
defileth the man. 21: For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed
evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, 22: Thefts, covetousness,
wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride,
foolishness: 23: All these evil things come from within, and defile the man."
---Nana on 10/11/07


4)
Colossians 3:1: "If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are
above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. 2: Set your affection
on things above, not on things on the earth. 3: For ye are dead, and your
life is hid with Christ in God. 4: When Christ, who is our life, shall appear,
then shall ye also appear with him in glory.
---Nana on 10/11/07


5)
Colossians 3:5: "Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth,
fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and
covetousness, which is IDOLATRY: (caps mine)
6: For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of
disobedience: 7: In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in
them."
---Nana on 10/11/07


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6)
I will furthermore like to add that we all are aware that a man nowadays
can get a heart replacement surgery and still come out of it with his same
old affections and memories. Paul does well to separate the "works of
the flesh" from those of the Spirit, its "fruit".
---Nana on 10/11/07


2)
Jeremiah 3:9
9And it came to pass through the lightness of her whoredom, that she defiled the land, and committed adultery with stones and with stocks.

Referring to idols made of stone and wood.
Nana, if there is a passage where God's people were accussed of adultery when no idolatry ocurred, then please show me because I am about to make up mind here that spiritual adultrery involves worshipping other god's(this is my first time studying up on this).
---Matthew_from_LA on 10/10/07


3)
If this is true then if this was to be likened onto human marriage I would imagine idolatry in a marriage would be sexual adultery or adultery of the heart. If I am wrong then I apologize, but I ask that God correct me if I am. This is a very delicate subject and I need to treat it delicately and very carefully.
---Matthew_from_LA on 10/10/07


What definition of "adultery" are you using, Matthew from LA? Is it
the secular or the biblical? Oh yes, it is clearly defined what is the
meaning of "adultery" in God's terms. It is more than what one finds
in Dictionaries. Jeremiah 3:8: "And I saw, when for all the causes
whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away,
and given her a bill of divorce, yet her treacherous sister Judah feared
not, but went and played the harlot also."
---Nana on 10/10/07


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Jeremiah 3:19: "But I said, How shall I put thee among the children,
and give thee a pleasant land, a goodly heritage of the hosts of nations?
and I said, Thou shalt call me, My father, and shalt not turn away from
me. 20: Surely as a wife treacherously departeth from her husband, so
have ye dealt treacherously with me, O house of Israel, saith the LORD."
---Nana on 10/10/07


I Corinthians 6:16: "What? know ye not that he which is joined to an
harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh." From v.15.
": Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ?" So then,
"one flesh"? Mark 9:43: "And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is
better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go
into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:"
---Nana on 10/10/07


Now, I am not advocating a divorce free for all. No, I am not saying
that people should divorce on a whim. All I am saying is that "adultery"
is not just about sex.
---Nana on 10/10/07


Jesus said remarriage is only acceptable when their was adultery in your past marriage.
He never said you can't get a divorce if adultery didn't happen(thats Catholic doctrine, not Bible teachings) If you get a divorce for any reason other than adultery, you just can't remarry.
---Matthew_from_LA on 10/9/07


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Jesus said divorce was only acceptable for adultery. Don't you follow the Word on that?
---alexia on 10/9/07


Lynne,
How long has the marriage been as such? From the beginning?
Did you court, had an arranged marriage or a shotgun wedding?
---Nana on 10/9/07


---Bob's statement has a great deal of wisdom in it.
---Mima on 10/7/07


# 1 "refuses to communicate with the other on any level, will never show a sign of warmth, give a kiss, or hold a hand, but instead takes joy in tormenting the other, offers no friendship"
The words in normal font show neglect in showing affection or love.
Those in bold indicate something much worse, an abuse.
---alan_of_UK on 10/7/07


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# 2 That I beleive is as bad as abandonment, and if individual and joint counselling for both of you fails, I think you should leave.
God would not want you to stay in an abusive marriage
But you would be wise not to rush into another marriage
---alan_of_UK on 10/7/07


NO it isn't. But I have to sympathize with you. You know that will not be the only lonliness you have. Living in this world for Jesus can be a lonly place. So what to do? Well, you have to wait, Perhaps, a long time. In the mean time: keep doing. What do I mean? Keep your eyes on Jesus and keep doing. >>>Your spouse has alot of problems. If he doesn't get saved, he will have more problems. Have a great week.+++ God bless you.
---catherine on 10/7/07


First of all, no one should be thinking about marring another person when their still married to their spouse. And a person shouldn't jump into marriage right after a divorce. What torment is this spouse doing? Some people aren't affectionate. but if you are unhappy in your life, how can you make God happy? You can't. I would seek God for an answer. And he will direct you in the right path...if you wait for his answer.
---Rebecca_D on 10/6/07


If you are a Christian and your spouse has committed adultery you have sciptural grounds for divorce whether the spouse is a Christian or not. If the spouse has been faithful (to your knowledge) my opinion would be that, given the details you describe, separation might be the answer. If he/she has feelings that, at the moment are just not being shown, they might resurface if you remove yourself from the situation. I hope this has a happy outcome for you.
---RitaH on 10/6/07


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This sounds like a marriage from hell. Marriage is for Love, I would leave.
---Whisper on 10/6/07


Actually no, it's not alright. Remember, if you leave this marriage in search of another - more likely than not you will find the same kind of person all over again. It will probably take less time to find that out with the second one, so stick this one out. Because honestly, it doesn't sound dead to me. The torment part sounds fairly normal and could lead to warmth if you would refuse to torment back.
---Bob on 10/6/07


not if you have been helping bring this about by already having someone you've been hoping to marry and this is "why" your spouse is treating you like this!!!

But if you are being honest--how could someone be in the same house and not want to tenderly love you? unbelievable!!! That shows me the person just does not know what love is. Can you believe God that it is possible to bring him to have love?
---Bill_bila5659 on 10/6/07


Lynne, I hear the frustration and despair in your question. From what I understand, according to Jesus, if you read Matthew 5:31-32 fornication is the only grounds for divorce. Also I would suggest reading and meditating on 1 Corinthians 7:10-16, there is much Godly instruction on divorce as well. Now if your husband is physically abusing you then I would seperate from him very quickly. Is he open to christian counceling? My heart goes out to you and I will keep you in prayer Lynne. God bless you.
---Cynthia on 10/5/07


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Adultery and abandonment are the only legitimate reasons it sounds like you have a case of abandonment. Physical abuse as well as mental abuse are a type of abandonment. BUT - we all answer to God and you need to know in your heart if this is the right thing to do. please go for counseling, pastorial and legal.
be blessed
---andre5846 on 10/5/07


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