MikeM, In the case of in-vitro fertilization as opposed to cloning, you have a case where parents want a child child and God would grant it a spiritual essence. It would be a special case of a sanctified union.
People are responsible for what they indiscriminately span and lack of judgement and forethought can have dire consequences.
---notlaw99 on 11/19/07|
Notlaw, "Only Human reproduction conceived in love have have a spiritual essence aka a soul" That statement, if true, would render all the test tube babies, children born in-vitro since 1978 a race of soulless beings. There must be thousands! My goodness! (lol)
---MikeM on 11/19/07|
Notlaw "All other Human reproduction is product of an unsanctified sexual union, the product of conception is soulless and reprobate, these should never be allowed to proceed to fill term, as they provides a living host system that can me indwelled by pure evil"
Do you really mean that?
The results of, say, prematital sex, are not "sanctified" and so should be aborted?.
---a on 11/18/07|
Notlaw, when you say that "Only Human reproduction conceived in love have have a spiritual essence aka a soul." are you stating that babies conceived through rape have no soul or babies conceived in a test tube using donor sperm and/or egg have no soul. Rape does not involve love and using a donor only involves the deep desire for a child but not love between it's two natural parents.
---RitaH on 11/17/07|
1. I am against laboratory cloning of humans.
2. Notlaw, please give me biblical chapter and verse for your comments.
3. Concerning souls. Humans have souls and spirits (Heb 4:12). Animals do not have souls (1 Pet 3:20). Animals have spirits (Eccl 3:21).
Lord bless each of you,
---trey on 11/16/07|
Are you trying to tell us that you seriously believe that humans conceived by rape, or a loveless mariage, or teen pregnancy, etc. have no souls??
---StrongAxe on 11/16/07|
Hi Notlaw and others, this is fascinating--kinda scary but interesting to think it may someday happen (yikes!). But Notlaw, you said only humans conceived in love are sanctified? What about those conceived in rape? They obviously have souls--and believe me, in many countries, it is indeed more rape than love.
---Mary on 11/16/07|
Could clones have souls? Probably. Im not sure who said it in a post...only someone conceived in love can have a soul. So since my mother was raped, that means I have no soul? Gee thanks, that puts a damnper on my life.
---Kris on 11/16/07|
Excellent insite StrongeAxe.
I believe all men have souls regardless of where or how they were concieved. The spark of life that animates these "bodies of dust" is nothing less than the breath of God, even if the dust came together in a test tube.
---AG on 11/16/07|
1. Only Human reproduction conceived in love have have a spiritual essence aka a soul.
2. All other Human reproduction is product of an unsanctified sexual union, the product of conception is soulless and reprobate, these should never be allowed to proceed to fill term, as they provides a living host system that can me indwelled by pure evil.
3. A clone is not produced by a sexual union and is reprobate by definition.
---notlaw99 on 11/16/07|
IF humans are ever cloned, or the so-called (fake) shroud of Turin, it will give a body with a very good likeness of Christ for all of the spiritually blind to follow, straight to hell.
That would be man's pride and knowledge giving him just what he wants and deserves.
---Frank on 11/16/07|
A clone is a life taken from another life. Since I was a babe in my mother's womb, could we say that my life was taken from her life? This is a fascinating subject and we most remember, that the Apple cannot fall from the tree except with God's permission, therefore, if there is cloneing. It will be with God's permission!! Could it be that each clone will have its own individual soul? Perhaps.
---Mima on 11/16/07|
I understand that the spirit is not in the heart.
If a human heart cells are cloned, eventutally a human, what will 'it' be?
It is interesting to listen to those with heart transplants, and how their tastes, ideas change. Is it familiar spirits clinging to the new heart, influencing them?
We know the spirit departs at death to heaven.
---Chad on 11/16/07|
I think the thing to consider here is the fact that humans can be conceived in a laboratory situation and that cloning really is nothing more than doing much of the same thing. I also think that we may have been convinced that cloning is some form of creating a Frankenstein monster, which in my opinion, is not true.
The real question here is whether we have the right to manipulate "life" in order to produce a "better" alternative to what God "naturally" creates.
---Mike on 11/16/07|
I firmly believe that human beings will never be cloned. I also believe that Dolly the sheep was not cloned. The Scriptures state that God is the giver of life. Giving life is something man cannot do.
---Helen_5378 on 11/16/07|
What do we mean by soul?
I've heard from some here that animals have souls ... it is what gives life to any living thing. (what humans have is something extra)
In that case, what about the animals that have already been cloned ... did they have that essentiality of life that is called the soul?
---alan_of_UK on 11/16/07|
Clones are a perfectly natural phenomenon. They have been going on for as long as there have been human beings. They are called "Twins". The main difference between natural clones and laboratory clones is the fact that they aren't conceived (and so born) at the same time.
Do you think that twins don't have souls?
---StrongAxe on 11/16/07|
Blessings to you chad, humans trying to clone humans is playing God. I do not see how a cloned person could have a soul. God is our creator, and only God gives life. That life that God creates is in His hands. Only He has the power to create a human being, and as far as cloning, I am totally against it. But in this day and time who knows what they will come up with next? God Bless friend!
---Cynthia on 11/16/07|
I really don't know the answer to your question but cloning worries me very much. Man is tampering with nature to such an extent now that there is going to be a backlash eventually. I think that God will only allow so much meddling before He intervenes.
---RitaH on 11/16/07|
""If they clone beating heart cells - do those cells have a soul? What are they?
---Chad on 11/15/07""
What do you think happens to a person that receives a heart transplant?
Does the soul gets transplanted also?
---Nana on 11/15/07|
Chad, blessings! Interesting question. If all humans have souls, and if cloned humans are truly human, then they must have souls too. Whether or not humans have souls in the first place is a seperate issue which I don't have an answer to.
---John1944 on 11/15/07|
My best guess will be yes. All humans have a immortal soul. God gives every human being souls, so the question is whether or not clones are human beings. If makes sense why a clone will have a soul, but if is true that all human receive their souls at the moment of conception, then a clone will not have a soul because a clone is simply a copy of cells.
Again, only God knows.
---Ramon on 11/15/07|
Clones will have souls (mind, will, emotions), however, they will not have spirits (the real you, the breath of God). The Spirit part of the human is the only thing that God Himself must create (in the womb), therefore, without a spirit, you are doomed to Hell, because you cannot get saved.
---Leslie on 11/15/07|
I think you're worry a bit early--it seems unlikely that whole-human cloning will take place in the foreseeable future, since animal clones didn't work out so well. (It seems clones are cloned 'old', not young like humans would hope.)
As for cloned cells having souls, do non-cloned cells have souls? If they do, then every bit of fallen hair, every bit of sloughed-off skin takes a bit of soul with it.
Kind of gross, if you ask me.
---Nancy on 11/15/07|
It appears they have cloned the heart cells of monkeys, news showed them beating under the microscope. Creeps you out, really.
So next it's humans, what will those beating heart cells be?
---Chad on 11/15/07|
Chad, A living breathing sentient creature ,including human, IS a soul. You don't HAVE one ,you ARE one. Get it??
---1st_cliff on 11/15/07|
To clone a human being is like imatating God, trying to do as He has done. The bible says that satan can copy or imitate what God does but cannot create so for a cloned human to have a soul makes one wonder because satan cannot give life.
---carol on 11/15/07|
I had never really thought about that before. I can't see how they could have a soul though. Only God can create a soul. You can't clone that.
---mary on 11/15/07|