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Urgency To Pray For Others

I sometimes feel a real urgency to pray for certain people, then they die, still in their sin. Others say "GOD HAD NOT PREDESTINED THEM TO BE SAVED." So, why would God waste His time and mine by urging me to pray for them, if they were PRE-destined for hell?

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 ---RitaH on 2/24/08
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"For I will save my people from their sins". That is the ones whom God chosed before the foundation of this world. Because the "heart of man is desparately wicked", Jesus came. You have it all wrong. Jesus did not come to save this world. Actually He came to make trouble. Noone deserves heaven we all should be in hell. And we would be if Jesus had not come to save a few lost sheep. Jesus Christ is the good shepard.
---catherine on 3/13/08


Nobody is pre-destined to Hell. Salvation is available to all.Jesus died for all men that we might have a right to eternal life. It is our choice to receive Jesus as our Lord and Savior. If we reject Christ it will be our very own fault. Jesus will not return until every soul has had an opportunity to be born again. Every nation has heard about the Godd News of Jesus Christ. There will be no excuse for any man to say he/she did not know about Jesus.
---Robyn on 3/12/08


I think we should pray for each other on this forum. It beats arguing with each other. Thanks Rosalie for the encouragement to pray for others, I have been going through a period of thinking 'What is the point, they are dedicated to destroying themselves?' But I see now that only God knows when people receive sudden realization of their sins on their deathbed. Meantime I find the prayer in Daniel 9 very useful to cover for our brothers and sisters who might be going astray/ourselves too.
---frances008 on 3/6/08


.emcee, "Moreover I will put oppostion between you and the woman, and between your offspring and her offspring: HE will crush your head, and you will strike HIS feet." As you can see, Genesis 3:15 speaks of the MAN Christ Jesus, and not the woman Mary. But you catholics are notorious for wresting the scripture and twisting it into all kinds of false doctrines to suit your own sinuous falsehoods.
---Eloy on 3/1/08


Eloy ::For all your wisdom and your zeal you do not understand Genesis 3:15 You make God a failure by not understanding. What ever God wants to do, HE accomplishes.Satan destroyed his first plan His second was Fool proof Perfect.If you understand many things will fall into place even His plan of one Flock One Shepherd Jesus christ.HIS son.
---Emcee on 2/28/08




Whoever told you that load of snap-crackle and pop sure doesnt know that in the last dying breath you are able to accept Jesus as your Lord and saviour. The parable about the workers in the field all being paid the same wage - ring a bell? Keep praying i was saved many a time by intercessory prayer it works
---rosalie on 2/28/08


Hyper-TULIP/Calvinism is unscriptural, false doctrine.

It is full of pride and neglect of soul winning.
It is Satan's effort to kill concern and compassion for souls.

If any of those false doctrines were accurate, there would be absolutely no need to OFFER UP A PRAYER FOR ANYONE.

Forget street ministry, forget leading someone in the prayer that leads to salvation. Forget witnessing altogether.
---Cindy on 2/28/08


Thanks, Duane. I confess I do not pray for the lost as much as I should, if at all. There is a prayer in Daniel 9 that I find helpful as it includes covering the sins of our fathers. Maybe that kind of prayer has some power to help others.
---frances on 2/27/08


.emcee, "Because of this, as through one human that sin into the world entered, and through which sin the death, and so on all humans the death passed, since which all failed." Romans 5:12. Opened: Since the 1st woman sinned and incurred death, her offspring that she produces also has her sin.
---Eloy on 2/27/08


God loves us (John 3:16) and wants us to be saved (2 Peter 3:9). God is also just and righteous He cannot allow sin to go unpunished. That is why God sent Jesus Christ to pay the penalty for our sins. All we have to do is place our faith in Him and we are saved, forgiven, cleansed and promised an eternal home in heaven. God loved us so much to provide for our salvation. If we reject His gift of eternal life, we will face the eternal consequences of that decision.
---Court7646 on 2/26/08




frances speaks the truth on this matter...
quit trying to figure out Gods reasons for things & start doing things that will save yourselves & those around you....
Remember we are the Clay, Not the Potter of the Clay...
Every person has heard about the Lord at one point in their lives, You/we/they Have 2 choices, Cleave to or Dismiss the word of God.
Weather they live or Die, I'll keep praying for the lost.
---Duane_Dudley_Martin on 2/26/08


Eloy::WHY would God permit His gift on the birth of a child whom He endows with His Breath of life Predestine Him to perdition.This ia a non believers fallacy NOT of Salvation Mercy and His teaching" Come to me all who are laboured & burdened I will refresh you "Those who believe will share his kingdom.What is the quote from the bible that pertains as you say in your post.
---Emcee on 2/26/08


2. Some people really do believe that, I AM NOT ONE OF THEM. The bible says that God would have that all men be saved which I read as meaning that He desires that all men come to Him. I believe that God wants us to pray for, and witness to, all those that He places in our path and we should do that with the guidance of the Holy Spirit, not just barge in and do our own thing. I don't believe that anyone is predestined to hell and I don't think that there is anyone that we should NOT pray for.
---RitaH on 2/26/08


Ritah,
Luke 23:34: "Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them, for they know
not what they do. And they parted his raiment, and cast lots." What
a time to have the urgency to pray! Such compassion and such hope!
Perhaps that turned the malefactor to his side. Ritah, pray and pray
and believe always.
---Nana on 2/26/08


You say they still die in their sin but how do you know they didn't repent? Maybe someday you'll be happily surprised to see many who did repent at the end. I think you should keep listening and obeying God to pray.
---john on 2/26/08


1. I think that some of you have slightly misunderstood my original question. I was not saying that God wastes His time (I know that He does NOT) nor was I suggesting that we should not pray. I was querying the responses of some people that if someone dies in their sinful state, not having accepted Christ, even though they have been witnessed to and prayed for, it must be because it was never God's intention that they would be saved.
---RitaH on 2/26/08


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Please read and follow the Holy Bible, and not the words from lost people. If you ask 10 sinners the same question, you may easily get 10 different answers, and none of them being the truth. But when you ask Jesus Christ, he will always give you the straight truth from heaven.
---Eloy on 2/25/08


Please read and follow the Holy Bible, and not the words from lost people. If you ask 10 sinners the same question, you may easily get 10 different answers, and none of them being the truth. But when you ask Jesus Christ, he will always give you the straight truth from heaven.
---Eloy on 2/25/08


Children are born with original sin from the fall of man (Adam) but Jesus came along to put us right. If a child dies before being able to receive the intellectual ability to accept Christ, that child will be covered by God's mercy. It is those that deliberately, wilfully reject Christ, that are predestined for destruction. You should not worry so much about babies and infants it would be a waste of effort. Pray for yourself and your living children, that they will accept Christ.
---frances on 2/25/08


Jeremiah 7.16 According to this prophet, God does not listen to prayers for those who had been warned and refused to learn.
---frances on 2/25/08


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RitaH:A child is a gift of God and does not have the capability to sin.with the advancement of time Age upbringing, choices come into effect, Those choices determine our destiny.No such thing as "PREdestination" from a mans perspective.Its when men want to think like supreme beings enter into the game of"What if" and wind up where their thoughts led them to-their own Fault so dont Blame God for your lack of understanding or misunderstanding.Do it Rita Pray,God knows best.
---Emcee on 2/25/08


It is God's will for all to be saved and go to heaven. But unfortunately he can't make that decision for them. It is up to each person to serve Christ or die in their sins. If God puts someone on your heart to be prayed for, then pray for them. You've done what God wanted you to do. If they reject the call of God, that is not your fault but theirs. We don't know the heart of a person and for someone to say their in hell it can't be determined unless God shows us where they are.
---Rebecca_D on 2/25/08


Let's not completely write off predestination.

It has it's place in our doctrine as Christians, or Paul (Eph.2:10) was a heretic for believing that he was given good works to walk in from the foundation of the world.

Psalm 37:23 The steps of a good man are ordered by the LORD: and he delighteth in his way.

Absolute predestination is a half truth made whole and surely doesn't fit with the entire revelation of scripture or life experience.
---Pharisee on 2/25/08


3) No one was or is pre-destined for hell. If they go to hell it was because they themselves chose to through free will, not because the Lord did not call them. The Lord is chastening everyone, and all those that do not understand this do not quite understand the grace & forgiveness of the Lord?
---Shawn.M.T on 2/25/08


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RitaH
1) Forgiveness is the Key. Just remember Job always prayed but the fullness in his life was not restored until after he also learned to forgive.

Yes, we are called to confess our faults one to another, and pray one for another, that we ourselves may be healed (James 5:16). But understand what is being stated about FAITH in James 5:15: it is our faith that saves us by the grace of God. This is because the Lord forgives everyone that asks for forgiveness by faith.
---Shawn.M.T on 2/25/08


2) These verses are not talking about you healing someone else, but you healing yourself. Making it possible for the Lord to work through you to heal others, but it will only be apparent if the others are walking by faith?

God is not wasting time, Hes healing us. It is ourselves that waste time? By not seeking to listen & to hear all of the Word of the Lord after we have prayed and then be obedient to the full measure of the Word, we find ourselves falling short of the grace of God.
---Shawn.M.T on 2/25/08


I am so pleased to see that, so far, no-one seems to believe in predestination. It is a subject that really upsets me because I just cannot see the point of allowing someone to be born if their final destination is decided even before they are born. It seems to make a mockery of the sacrifice that Jesus made to save people from their sins. No-one is capable of sinning BEFORE they are born.
---RitaH on 2/25/08


"And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world." (1 John 2:2) So, it's clear to me, that the Bible says Christ's atonement is for "the whole world", and not only for those who become Christians. So, if Jesus so suffered and died for all people, though ones would refuse this, we can expect that God will have us praying salvation for people who will reject this.
---Bill_bila5659 on 2/25/08


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"For to this end we both labor and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of those who believe." (1 Timothy 4:10) Paul clearly says God "is the Savior of all men", but also says, "especially of those who believe." I see that God is doing some kind of saving good to each and every person. Our prayer sends out the effect of God's own love to do good somehow to each person we pray for, even if they don't become Christians.
---Bill_bila5659 on 2/25/08


Romans 9:21 shows me God is our Potter...not just "predestining" us, but is hands-on making clay into who we become. I did not choose to be born in sin with a nature to refuse His love. I find it interesting that ones who are all claimed to be equal, with the same so-called "free will", would make such unequal choices...and so many more would choose to refuse.
---Bill_bila5659 on 2/25/08


You don't know their eternal state. God has not revealed to you what might have happened in their souls in the very last moment before they died.

Someone once said something to the effect that many people are lost because they have no one to pray for them.

If God has given you a ministry of intercessory prayer, go with it, and leave the results in HIS hands.
---Jack on 2/24/08


RitaH::It is a holy & wholesome thought to pray for the dead that they may be loosed from their sins.2machabees12: 45 Unfortunately Christians have decided that if you are dead it is all over.when people die with small sins they cannot enter Heaven as nothing defiled enters Heaven but by the same token they do not merit Hell Hence the prayers necessary to relieve them of their sins by Prayer of the living Faithful.
---Emcee on 2/24/08


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RitaH::It is a holy & wholesome thought to pray for the dead that they may be loosed from their sins.2machabees12: 45 Unfortunately Christians have decided that if you are dead it is all over.when people die with small sins they cannot enter Heaven as nothing defiled enters Heaven but by the same token they do not merit Hell Hence the prayers necessary to relieve them of their sins by Prayer of the living Faithful.
---Emcee on 2/24/08


Certainly God does not waste his time nor yours. When you feel lead to pray for somebody(this would be a type of intercessory prayer) do what the Spirit tells you to do. Man-made doctrines may all be wrong but most assuredly God is never wrong and is up to you and I as Christians to follow the lead of the Holy Spirit!!!!
---Mima on 2/24/08


Rita H, There's too much hocus-pocus in this predestination thing.We are all free moral agents able to make our own free choises,otherwise we are no better than preprogrammed robots. God's "foreknowledge" seems like predestination but it's not. Those that die in accidents are simply in the wrong place at the wrong time! Disease is no respecter of persons!
---1st_cliff on 2/24/08


It WOULD be a waste of your time if any of those false doctrines were true, but they are NOT.

PRAY Like there's no tomorrow, for anyone and everyone that God lays upon your heart.

You may not ever know the effect of your prayers for that one lost in sin. There are the inward prayers without speaking outloud, that many who've been in a coma or even lying on the operating table have been able to pray for themselves and invite Jesus Christ in to their hearts.
---Cindy on 2/24/08


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There's a big difference between the outward man and the spirit. It may look like they've died in sin, but one cannot know 100% until Judgment Day.
One cannot know what was spoken to God out of the heart, calling upon the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ in their moment of death.
God alone knows where they are.

Obedience is better than sacrifice. Prayer is not a "work". Obey and pray.
---Cindy on 2/24/08


John 3:16 ... God's Purpose for sending Jesus as the all-time sacrifice for our sins was proof of His Love & Forgiveness for mankind. HE does not "predestine" anyone to die in their sins and spend eternity in hell, but "choosing Jesus" is the "choice" of each and every individual. Jesus came to save the lost ... Satan's one goal is to deceive and to ultimately destroy mankind. Pray for the lost and God Bless You for doing so.
---Vel on 2/24/08


Only God alone knows the beginning from the end and who, in their lifetime or at their death, whoever will Call upon the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ.


Some of the most evil and hated of men have found God at the moment of death. We are not the Righteous Judge.
---Cindy on 2/24/08


"Unconditional Election" Is Not Bible Doctrine

"Limited Atonement" Really Means Limited Love, Limited Grace of God,
and So Slanders God, and Is Unscriptural

God's Grace Is Not Irresistible,
Some Are Not Compelled to Be Saved Unconditionally,
Others are compelled to reject God completely.
---Cindy on 2/24/08


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Men Come to Judgment for Their Sins, Are Accountable, So They Need Not Blame God OR Predestination for their Sins.

For every idle word men shall come to judgment, Jesus said (Matt 12:36). And Revelation 20:12 tells us that the unsaved dead will be judged "according to their works," which are recorded.

Man is accountable and must choose.
---Cindy on 2/24/08


God chose Jacob to head a nation for Him, and rejected Esau. (Rom. 9:11-13).

But Esau, while rejected as head of a tribe, was NOT Predestined to go to Hell, and for all we know may have been saved.
---Cindy on 2/24/08


Pharaoh was a wicked, murderous man, and in the matter of letting Israel go from Egypt, God had raised him up to make an example of him and kill him ( Rom. 9:17,18). But there is no evidence that God predestined him to go to Hell. He could have chosen to be saved. Knowing ahead of time what Pharaoh would do, God planned to make an example of His destruction of a wicked king.
---Cindy on 2/24/08


Hyper-TULIP/Calvinism is unscriptural, false doctrine.

It is full of pride and neglect of soul winning.
It is Satan's effort to kill concern and compassion for souls.

If any of those false doctrines were accurate, there would be absolutely no need to OFFER UP A PRAYER FOR ANYONE.

Forget street ministry, forget leading someone in the prayer that leads to salvation. Forget witnessing altogether.
---Cindy on 2/24/08


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