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Forgiveness After Divorce

What have been some experiences of forgiveness or non-forgiveness after divorce? What incidents regarding the divorce process brought you to tears of sorrow, or tears of joy? How has divorce has impacted your life and Christian walk?

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 ---Robin on 8/5/08
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Very true, I had forgotten about those.

And it's true that endless debate rarely serves any constructive purpose. I once heard a slightly-politically-incorrect statement to this effect - "arguing on the internet is like running in the Special Olympics - even if you win you're still retarded" :)
---StrongAxe on 8/29/08

strongax, There are scriptures instructing to avoid endless genealogies- I Timothy 1:4+ Titus 3:9, because they can produce endless debates which, when we can rather move past the "whom came first" onto "He is already come as prophesied." The not more important than the final Begotten One, because God is no biased repector of persons. And this is why I like Acts 17:26 when referring to those whom think that they are more special or holier than the rest of all flesh: Jesus "has made of One Blood all nations of men for to dwell upon all the face of the earth." Notice, Not two bloods, a royal blue blood, and a inferior common blood, but Only from One Blood comes all flesh.
---Eloy on 8/29/08


Yes, I know about the Levirate law (I point out on polygamy blogs that this REQUIRES polygamy if the surviving brother is married).

However, the whole point is that while the child is biological child of the first brother, he's legal child of the second (and biological parentage is not considered relevant). Ruth is an exception I never understood, as the whole point was for Ruth to have Boaz raise a child for his kinsman Mahlon (Ruth 4:10), yet Obed's heritage listed through Boaz anyway.

But thanks for pointing out Dt 25:5. I didn't realize this applied only to "brothers who dwell together" (curious, as Mahlon and Ruth lived in Moab, not "together" with Boaz or the other kinsman).
---StrongAxe on 8/28/08

strongax, A-men. I only recommend that you rely upon the Inspired Scripture, rather than any scholastic copies of scripture like the septuagint. I translate the Holy Scripture, and in the past I compared the septuagint with the Hebrew and I have found errors riddled throughout the septuagint, and I could not in any good conscience use the LXX for accurate translating of God's Word. One reason I believe that it contains so many errors is because the translators were not inspirited and they used their own reasoning capabilities when handling God's Word (this is like asking the worldly to define love), and this has led to the "dizzy" (for lack of a better word) translation called the septuagint.
---Eloy on 8/29/08


You're right. This is flogging a dead horse. Neither one of us is going to convince the other, so it's pointless to argue about it any further. (Besides which, it's WAY off topic for this particular blog).
---StrongAxe on 8/28/08

.strongaxe, According to God's posterity law for kinsman, a child can easily have two different paternal grandparents. For a person may have one parent today and a different parent tomorrow. For example, if you and I were brothers, and I was married, and I died, you are to take my wife to yourself in order to preserve posterity. And this is another reason why different names are listed in different places in scripture when refering to someones genealogy. Please Read- Deuteronomy 25:5-10+ Ruth 4:5-16.
---Eloy on 8/28/08

strongax, you certainly are beating a dead horse, for last time: you are trying to confuse or merge together two separate and distinct genealogies into one, and for the purpose of misapplication of rendering credence to an uninspired text, therefore you are finding the truth I speak unfathomable.
---Eloy on 8/27/08

Yikes, Some people sure talk out of both sides of the mouth! The comment is not against Eloy either.
---Nana on 8/27/08

Kim, if your husband were truly forgiven he would either be joined back to you, or else remain single until you each can accept each other. Only the backslider whom returns is forgiven. I had a wife whom was committing adultery and then asked me for my acceptance of her going to date "other" men, and if I really loved her she said that I would let her go and I would also join her in doing what she was doing. Horribly struck by her contempt, I said, "No way! Jesus gave me everything, but what did you give me? And you are already doing what you want to do, inspite of what I say." Then she went out into the night again.
---Eloy on 8/27/08

Sometimes I am astounded by the brazen audacity of sinners. My ex actually told me that if I really loved her, then I would leave my faith and come join her in sin. Yuk! she makes Adam's wife look like a saint, and she really gives women a bad name.
---Eloy on 8/27/08

Maria, I too pray for you. I remember the pain I went throug when she left me. I also took my wife out of a couple of bars where she was so drunk. I stopped doing that and one day my oldest son took her out, it hurt me very much.
I realize we are all human, and we all fail so many times. We make decisions that later on we find they were so wrong. My wife made many as I did. If I had kept thinking of the pain, I would have never forgiven her. Once I realize what true love was, I begin to heal. It was not only her fault but mine if I am honest. It took time for me to forgive but forgiveness never brings back the past. What is forgiven is gone and if we remember, it is because we want to thank God for making things right.
---Mark_V. on 8/27/08


I find your logic totally unfathomable. If both Mary and Joseph are descended from King David, then Mary's ancestor, David's father Jesse, must NECESSARILY be the same person as Joseph's ancestor, David's father Jesse. And as Jesse's father Obed from Mary's genealogy must NECESSARILY be the same person as Jesse's father Obed from Joseph's geneaologies, and so on, right back to Abraham, and Noah, and Adam. It is impossible for the two to differ from David on up.

The alternative is that two childen could conceivably have two DIFFERENT paternal grandfathers. This is biologically impossible. If you can find any example where this DOES happen, I would love to hear it (and so would the Guiness Book of World Records).
---StrongAxe on 8/27/08

Hi Maria, just wanted to let you know, I'm praying God's blessings for you, sister. Hang in there. :)
---Mary on 8/26/08

strongax, again I say to you, it does not matter if one same person is mentioned generations past in both Joseph's and Mary's genealogy (as Judah), for they are still two completely different genealogies, one is Joseph's and the other is Mary's, and thus each genealogy is expected to have different names listed within the perspective genealogies. And it is error to confuse the two as though they are the same, when in truth are Not the same just as my lineage is completely different then your lineage, eventhough in generations past we may have shared some common ancestors. And as I have already stated, the septuagint is proven comparitively to the Torah to be a nonInspired work.
---Eloy on 8/26/08

After unknown years of adultery, a walk-out on his part, separation and divorce, my ex has finally really asked for my forgiveness of what he did. I forgave him years ago before I even knew there was anything to forgive. Jesus said forgive and we will be forgiven. I stand on that daily because daily I still need to walk in that forgiveness, especially with young kids in the picture. I see my ex just about every weekend. He's to be remarried soon. I can't let up for 1 moment on forgiving because the pain will consume and drag me to a dark place in God. Thank God that He never leaves nor forsakes.
---Kim on 8/26/08

Matthew6:14 If you forgive everyone their trespasses God of Heaven and Earth will forgive your trespasses also.
note:When you repent admit your sins, name the sins.
---shalla on 8/26/08

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It seems like you jumped on my comment (and as usual, accused me of lying) without actually understanding what I was was saying.

I said: "Whether the geneology is of Mary or Joseph is irrelevant, since both are of the tribe of Judah"

That is, since Joseph and Mary are BOTH descendent from Judah (and, in fact both from David), all ancestors BEFORE that point MUST NECESSARILY BE THE SAME, regardless of which of the two genealogies you trace.
---StrongAxe on 8/26/08

I don't know at this time about the forgiveness but I know my main non-forgiveness was being left to raise my own daughter without aide from the father. My tears were of sorrow thinking how divorce has torn me apart from my daughter and made me in debt and poor from time to time. As far as the Christian walk I have gone back to basics and am currently reading the bible by myself and some things are starting to soak in now for me.
---Maria on 8/26/08

strongax, You speak more falsehood, for a person's genealogy is very relevant for the purpose of showing the necessary names relevant to the origination of the person's beginning, some list biological offspring and some will list in-law names. If I want to show the origination of King David, I would not bring out King Nebuchadnezzar's line, and if I wanted to show any other genealogy the names I would bring out would only be in reference to the person's genealogy I was showing. That is why Matthew's genealogy differs from Luke's genealogy in tracing Christ, for the one is of Joseph and the other is of Mary, both having a part in Christ's birth, but both completely different genealogies.
---Eloy on 8/25/08

.robin, divorce has impacted my life in more ways then one. Almighty God is in complete control of every single soul and all life, and he says when his world continues and when his world will end, and he will judge every vessel perfectly whom has chosen to raise their hand against us.
---Eloy on 8/25/08

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Whether the geneology is of Mary or Joseph is irrelevant, since both are of the tribe of Judah, so both are from Abraham. Any ancestors before that point must necessarily be the same.

Luke was the only gospel writer who did not meet Jesus personally, so if he got the geneology from Jesus, he must have obtained the genealogy second hand (say, from one of his disciples). In any case, however, how do you explain that the Septuagint (written 100-300 years B.C.) included correct information which was not found in the accepted Hebrew text (which is much older)? I would really be delighted to hear a logical explanation for this.
---StrongAxe on 8/25/08

.strongax, I did an intensive study on the genealogy of Christ and completed it, and I am not going to dispute why at times lists include some names and at other times the same lists exclude some names, for I know why. But because Luke records a name in a list and other places in scripture a name is left out in a list does not mean that the scribe or writer is using a different source, and especially not a corrupted septuagint. For I know of a truth that the New Testanment scribes recorded from Jesus' very mouth firsthand. Hebrew is the oldest language and the original language of the Torah, all other languages dispersed afterward from babel.
---Eloy on 8/23/08

Genesis 11 and Luke 3 are not the same genealogy, for Genesis 11 is showing Abraham's genealogy and Luke 3 is showing Mary's genealogy: two different genealogical lists are recorded.
---Eloy on 8/23/08


In Jesus's ancestors after Noah, Luke 3:35-37 inserts Cainan between Arphaxad and Heber, but Gen 11:10-26 does not.

Gen 11:13 (KJV):
"And Arphaxad lived after he begat Salah 403 years, and begat sons and daughters."

Gen 11:13 (LXX):
"And Arphaxad lived after he begat KAINAN 403 years, an begat sons and daughters, and slept, and after KAINAN lived 130 years, and begat Sala, and KAINAN lived after he begat Salah 330 years, and begat sons and daughters and slept."

LXX adds Cainan (or Masoretic text skips him). But, Luke INCLUDES him, so Luke preferred LXX over Masoretic, at least here. There are many other similar examples but bog rules limit me to one at a time.
---StrongAxe on 8/22/08

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""In Luke, Jesus quoted from the OT. His words (translated into Greek, since he spoke Hebrew) ""

Actually, it seems that the common vernaculars of the were Aramaic and Greek. In fact, since the time of Alexander the Great, everyone in that part of the world had to speak Greek in order to get along.

I'm not denying that in His human nature, Jesus was familiar with Hebrew. But it wasn't generally known. Otherwise there wouldn't have been the meturgaman in the synagogues who gave a running translation into Aramaic. And when He quoted Ps 21/22 in Hebrew, people thought He was invoking Elijah.
---katavasia on 8/22/08

.strongax, there is zero truth that Luke used any Greek text. And also you are correct in posting that I know better than church tradition.
---Eloy on 8/22/08


In Luke, Jesus quoted from the OT. His words (translated into Greek, since he spoke Hebrew) were identical to the Septuagint Greek and differed from our Hebrew text. So Luke thought that the Septuagint Greek was good enough for him.

You say the Septuagint takes liberties (like translating "sons of God" into "angels"). Perhaps this is because it was generally accepted that those meant the same thing. If you look at the King James and other translations, in many cases they take similar liberties, substituting some words for others that means the same thing (especially since a word in one language may not exist in the other).

But of course, Eloy knows better than 2200+ years of Church tradition.
---StrongAxe on 8/21/08

strongax, you speak falsehood. Because man copies scripture and changes and removes and adds words from the genuine words does not make that man's copy holy scripture, but a commentary. But you will believe and say whatever you desire.
---Eloy on 8/21/08

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Mark:-Thank you for your candid reply as you see it.You are surprised that more do not complain?Maybe Eloy and you are alike in Nature and do not wish to step down JAO.Yet you say you love Him? HOW? The only reason I spoke is because you CONDEMNED him.which is different from a disagreement.However I believe yourself and you good wife are entitled to an expression of your passion which could have been, softened.But this is water under the Bridge.Let it Pass.Peace is better than Friction.
---MIC on 8/21/08


That's a very good passage. When I was young, I was always concerned with winning, and with appearing to be right. Now I am more concerned with BEING right (not that "what is right" should conform to what I believe, but the other way around - that my understanding should increase and get closer and closer to the truth.)

This is why I like debate - if my opinions differ from someone else's, I present my reasons, and hope that they present theirs, so that in the light of day, we can all finally arrive at the truth, and no matter who "wins", everyone benefits.
---StrongAxe on 8/21/08

Mic, you have picked a side. No reason to go on. I don't have to be polite to those that go against Christ. Never will. I love Eloy, but hate his conduct and his words to others. My wife and others read what he say's and they are appalled at what he says and surprise not more are complaining about him. Why do they let him go on speaking blaspheming things. You and him are not alike in that you are a Catholic and you answer for the RCC and not for Christ. Now you answered on behalf of him and what he say's. Eloy doesn't need a Church since he is a little god. What he speaks is always righteous even when he condemns others. But still you took his side. Lets just say, I know for whom you fight for.
---Mark_V. on 8/20/08

Strongaxe:-I believe that was a Typo, misprint it should read 1Cor13:8-13.sorry for the error.
---MIC on 8/20/08

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I am not judging. I don't want a pound of flesh. I want accountability. If someone says something, he should be able to back it up (by quoting a scripture, or an authority, or admitting it's his own opinion). When Paul speaks of divorce, he distinguishes the Lord's teachings from his own. The Bereans "searched the scriptures daily to see if these things were so" to ensure what they learned was authoritative.


The Septuagint (excluding the Apocrpyha) IS scripture. And even Apocrypha was respected then, as we respect books written by Christian authors today. Do you reject modern Christian books, since they are not scripture? If so, must also reject your words because THEY are not scripture either?).
---StrongAxe on 8/20/08

Mark:- "My pride is for Christ"so be it but He, Jesus taught Humility and love, qualities, which appear deficient in your post & posts.Yes Pride you Have which by the saying "Must have a downfall"You refer to my Catholocism which it not even necessary.But since you do, I must remind you "Once a catholic always a catholic"fallen disenchanted apostate but still a Catholic.To blaspheme is to speak about God with contempt.Was this the case?and even if there was, who has the sole power of retribution."Returibution is MINE" Thus says the Lord.Live in peace to love and serve the Lord.
---MIC on 8/20/08

Strongave:-You are like Shylock you desire your pound of Flesh,and need a Quote. Well Sir."Make peace with your Brother before you come to make an offering to me"Thus says the Lord.Read 2Cor.13:8-13You too were once a Catholic?is that not true?.Then do not judge your Brother.
---MIC on 8/20/08

.strongax, I have no desire to quote from nonBiblical sources, such as a septuagint, in order to show it's nonInspiration. My words are inspired from the inspired Word of God, and I do not choose to highlight any other nonBiblical sources, but only the Holy Bible. If you want to expound the septuagint, I ask that you not do so on this Christian forum which relies upon the Holy Bible for the absolute truth and guidance, rather than directing outward to "other" nonBiblical books. The world is replete of scholastic writings and commentaries on the scriptures, but I do not follow any of them, for I am committed only to God's Word and the accurate translation thereof.
---Eloy on 8/20/08

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Seems like "teaching" others that they must forgive is an easy thing. Not applying the teaching to oneself seems to be just as easy...
---Nana on 8/20/08


"Thus says the Lord" is used frequently in two different ways:
1) by prophets speaking directly for God
2) by people directly quoting from previous scriptures or prophets (such as the case you mentioned in Isaiah).

When someone says "Thus says the Lord" but what follows is not any specific biblical quotation, one must assume that he is therefore speaking as a prophet, rather than quoting scripture.

In Eloy's case, the "you destroyed me once, but never again..." passage sounds like something a wrathful prophet might say, but is not scripture (if I'm wrong, please provide chapter and verse).
---StrongAxe on 8/19/08

Mic, my pride is for Christ. I don't blaspheme or support those who blaspheme His name. I support Christ with my life. And I defend the Truth which is Christ everyday against those who do. Now you don't have to answer to me. I cannot forgive sins against God. Only He can.

I am not a Catholic as you are. You have access to confession every Saturday, and you can get absolve by a priest and be pure again after a few Hail Maries. And, you can do it any time you want, you have up to a year. I am not a Catholic and so I am very aware of what I say concerning God. I have to go to Him every day. Only He can absolve me.
Your support for someone that blaspheme's the name of the Lord is your choice. You have taken a side.
---Mark_V. on 8/19/08

katavasia, Jesus, myself, and my family from Christ never forgive the nonrepentant, else there would be no need for the lake of fire and eternal damnation, instead we would sinfully welcome all murderers and child molesters, all adulterers and fornicators and kidnappers, all liars and thieves, all violent and evil and ravenous wolves into the kingdom of heaven. See your sin, by acquitting the guilty you have become co-participant of the guilt. No, the guilty whom repents from their wrong is forgiven and never the nonrepentant. "Nevertheless, when I come again, will I find faith on earth?"
---Eloy on 8/19/08

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.strongax, if you have a septuagint, compare it side by side with the Holy Bible, and you will find many corruptions according to the hebrew text. I do not own a septuagint, but I have studied that greek text comparing it with the hebrew and I have found many corruptions. If I recall correctly, in the hebrew "sons of God" is often used reference to men from God, but in that greek septuagint the hebrew was adulterated to read, "angels of God". And many such like things exist, there is too much corruption, hyperbole, and exaggeration in that septuagint to make any confident use from it. Clearly it is not inspired from God, but is a very poor compilation and copy of the scriptures. A scholarly work, yes, but inspired, no.
---Eloy on 8/19/08

Mark::Fair is fair -"Thus says the lord"Isaiah uses this often is a quotation used in the OT by prophets were they usurping the Lord?Isaiah 50, 56--come on! To quote Jesus or Almighty God is not a transgression.But you make it so by Judgement .Is this the truth? own up, swallow your pride, and shame the devil.A REAL man would admit the error.
---MIC on 8/19/08

eloy, right in the middle of Christ's Sermon on the Mount is "forgive us our trespasses AS we forgive those who trespass against us." In other words, forgiveness for ourselves is conditional on our willingness to forgive others.

Throughout the Gospels, Jesus makes it very clear there is NO forgiveness for those who are not themselves willing to forgive freely.

And one of His most pointed parables is that of the Unmerciful Servant.
---katavasia on 8/19/08

MATHEW 13:11-17. This applies to all who are not baptised in the Holy Spirit.
---Kenny on 8/19/08

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I need to inform you, God tells me, "that blaspheme can refer to His people". Woooo!
---catherine on 8/19/08

Mic, I did expect someone to stand on his side as you have. It gives evidence of who you are in Christ. It doesn't shock me. Anyone that utterly blaspheme's the Lord will be paid back by God accordinley. He might get away with it now, or while, but it will decide his fate.
Before I wrote what I did, I knew there would be some out there that would support him no matter what he said to people, about his wife, and about Christ. You see Mic there is murderers in prison like Rameriz that are evil and women still write him and love him. So you don't shock me. You want to support someone who blaspheme the name of the Lord, well you only give evidence how much you love support the Lord as an R.C.
---Mark_V. on 8/19/08


I know you post scriptures to promote your points, but not often to defend them when questioned. When you make assertions (like "the Septuagint is corrupt" in another forum), I repeatedly ask you for evidence of that assertion, but you never gave any).

I don't think I asked any derogatory questions. If so, I humbly apologize, but I ask again that you point out which questions are derogatory. If I do it frequently, it should be trivial to find an example.

(And yes, I can be wrong - I was going to question your comment "blaspheme against me", as blasphemy refers to God but not people - but I found a few verses that refer to prophets and kings as well, so my comment would have been in error.)
---StrongAxe on 8/18/08

In all matters, forgiveness of another is critical to being set free and having peace and healing. Obedience to all of God's Word, no matter if we have a hard time doing it, is important. By so doing, you are honoring God and being obedient. He will bless your obedience. Remember, above all things, "Obedience". We obediently love the unlovable, tolerate the intolerable, have patience with those we don't want to, etc...God said if you love me, keep my commandments(sayings, teachings). We benefit every time, both spiritually with God and life in the here and now. It worked for me and will for anyone.
---Robert on 8/18/08

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strongax, I post very much scripture on this forum, probably more than most people because the scripture lives in me and I translate the holy scriptures. And am never reluctant to share truth, but when you or another asks derogatory questions not because you truly desire to know the truth but only in order to dis the truth I post, then I will not provide the pearls. There are some that pose as Christians, but their words blaspheme against me and blaspheme what I say, which exposes them as nonChristian. I could easily post a list of every name here of the nonChristians, but that is not my ministry. I share the gospel to lead others to Christ, and I do the works of Christ.
---Eloy on 8/18/08

At my old church, there are two blended families who exemplify forgiveness.

A woman got divorced and remarried. Her ex did the same thing. Years later, she became a Christian, along with her new husband. Her ex also got saved along with his new wife. The most amazing thing is that they were all saved by/at the same church.

They all forgave one another. The example they set allowed all the children from both marriages to be saved as well. They are always a testimony to the entire church, and they spend Christmas and nearly all other holidays together as two new blended families. Weird? I dont know, but loving? For sure.
---obewan on 8/18/08

MIC, Thank you for your words. The Word of God which I preach is a double-edged sword, and many whom are living outside of Christ do not want to hear these sharp words. I will never tone the word of God down or dilute it into falsehood. There is absolute right, the narrow way which leads up to glory, and there is absolute wrong, the broad way which leads to destruction. The Lord demands obedience, and no nonCommitted following of him: you cannot serve sin and serve Christ. Many want to mix myth with truth, or falsehood with scripture, or add other antiChrist philosophies and thereby they make the word of God of none effect, equating Christ and the only way to be the same as other gods and other ways.
---Eloy on 8/18/08

I am divorced. My husband had many affairs out in the open, he emotionally abused me, tols what I was allowed to eat!!! One day I came home from work and he had thrown all my stuff out of our bedroom. He told me I could live in our place if I moved into the spare room, but he no longer wanted to be married to me and he would have woman over. I grew up strict where divorce was never even spoke of. I made it through, with prayer. I am remarried now. I prayed to never fall in love if I was not meant to be remarried. The day I met my husband God opened up my heart to him. My husband is a Christain man. God taught me many things through the hardships of my first marriage and divorce, and I am greatful for the lessons learned.
---ginn on 8/18/08

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In Fairness to Eloy:He does come on strongly but I am sure He has no intention of usurpimg the Lord as is suggested by Mark and others.He quotes Jesus words and as per his testemony adds or prefixes the words with "thus says the Lord".Please read the context NOT into it.Eloy lives by His convictions,
---MIC on 8/18/08

Lots of feedback from so many people. But I don't want to use this site to judge others, I would like to hear about how others have felt God's presence ... or lack thereof. There are so many experiences that others could benefit from ... are there times when God's face was more prevalent that others?
---robin on 8/18/08


I always want to hear the truth. I am glad to be proven wrong. I always learn things that improve my understanding (and sometimes challenge what I took for granted). When I was young I thought I knew everything. Then I grew up.

All I ask is if people say I am wrong, they show some evidence (like a verse) rather than just opinion. You and frances008 are both reluctant that way. If someone asks me, I always provide a verse, or a reference (or if I can't find one, I'll say so).

1 Peter 3:15
"But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear"
---StrongAxe on 8/18/08

eloy said, "For who is God? away with Jesus, away with God, and away with all who belong to him, for we be our own gods and not answer up to anyone" here he quotes his own words, and by his words he condemns himself. He say's he loves God, but away with Him and away with Jesus, and the reason why he said, Jesus never had to clean a dirty toilet. He is above God in that when Jesus was crucified, Jesus saw Eloy as the light in the sky. I never heard anything so blasphemous. He is a little god answering to no one. I can see now why his wife went running away from him. It must have been horrible every day to hear him talk, and hear him condemning her. I pray to God that she is over that horrible experience.
---Mark_V. on 8/18/08

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.markv and trish, "Woe to them that call evil good, and good evil, that put darkness for light, and light for darkness, that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter. Blessed be you all when which malign you, and will persecute and say all evil word against you, lying falsely, on account of me. If they called the Lord of the house beelzebub, how much more them of his household? They will do this to you for my name's sake, because they know not him that sent me. He that is of God hears God's words, you all therefore hear not, because you all are not of God. We are of God: he that knows God hears us, he that is not of God hears not us." Isaiah 5:18+ Mat.5:11+ 10:25+ John 15:21+ 8:47+ I John 4:6.
---Eloy on 8/17/08

Among all peoples we Christians know whom are our Christian brothers and whom are our Christians sisters, and it is also evidenced that we know those whom are not of our body. "A good tree cannot bring forward bad fruit, neither a corrupt tree bring forward good fruit. Wherefore by their fruits you all will know them." Mt.7:18,20. The saint is not the sinner. Not all are bad, there are the good and the bad. Jesus was proven sinless and a good-doer- Mt.4:23+ Jn.8:46,47. Pilate found him innocent after interrogation- Mt.27:24+ Jn.18:38+ 19:6. We his offspring are also good- Mt.7:17-21+ 9:10-13+ 25:21,23+ I Jn.3:7-10.
---Eloy on 8/17/08

MarkV: Thank you for addressing the Eloy/God issue. I have not engaged Eloy in discussion because I have felt as you do for a very long time. Satan is at work in his writings and is using him to confuse young Christians, and lead them away from the Truth of God's love, grace, mercy and forgiveness. I just do not address him, and pray he will cease his writings on the blogs here.
---Trish9863 on 8/17/08

Please print this:
It is very important for all believing Christians to take note of what happens when someone is so corrupt in his thinking and claims himself a god when he speaks.

Eloy said, "Thus says the Lord" Here, he is God speaking to all who have and will oppose him, "You have destroyed me once, but never again will you have a second time" is pertaining to him when his wife left him because the wicked have never distroyed God. And anyone who does not agree with him is condemned. "For who is God? Away with Jesus, away with God, and away with all who belong to him, for we be our own gods and not answer up to anyone"
---Mark_V. on 8/17/08

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strongax, when you truly want to know the truth from me, then ask of me because you are truly seeking, until then you will abide in darkness.
---Eloy on 8/16/08

Revelation 22:10: "And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand. 11: He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. 12: And, behold, I come quickly, and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be." Has the judgement begun, Eloy?
---Nana on 8/16/08


You use the words "Thus says the Lord". Are you saying that you are a prophet?

You also said:
"When Christ died not all were in sin, but there were those in sin and there were those in righteousness"

So are you saying that Jesus died for the righteous but not sinners? If so, why would anyone need to die to save people who had nothing to be saved from?

Yet Romans 3:23 says:
"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God:
and Mt 9:12, Mk 2:17, Lk 5:31:
"Jesus answered them, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick.""
---StrongAxe on 8/15/08

kathrn, "us"? "sinners"? All scripture is qualified, and not unqualified. It is sin to take a verse out of context and misapply it to a subject not addressed in the context. You need to rightly apply the word, else you have 100% falsehood and nontruth, and falsehood is the Adversaries work. Truth 1- Christ did not come to die for every one, but for the lost. Truth 2- When Christ died not all were in sin, but there were those in sin and there were those in righteousness. Truth 3- Christ made the heaven and he also made the hell, and every unrepentant sinner is condemned, not forgiven.
---Eloy on 8/15/08

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Thus says the Lord: To every wicked one, You have destroyed me once, but never again will you have a second time: for your hand that you have raised against me is withered and your mouth blasphemed is diseased. You are altogether condemned, and your land is polluted: you have said, we will slay the righteous and take what we will, and who can hinder us? For who is God? Away with Jesus, away with God, and away with all who belong to him, for we be our own gods and not answer up to anyone. Truly truly I say to you, O' you dirt onto dirt, I laugh at your foolishness. We will see your end, and how glorious your judgment is. Restore what you have taken, and I will restore: but take, and I myself will take you onto your eternal places you think not.
---Eloy on 8/15/08


Jesus often forgave people without first asking them to repent (see the woman taken in adultery).

You mention forgiveness "seventy time seven" - yet in all your posts, you are full of condemnation towards anyone who disagrees with you in any way, not willing to forgive even once. Instead, you call people apostates and deluded and wicked and far from the kingdom.

You claim knowledge, and to hold the keys to the kingdom, yet I sense no love, just self-righteousness and judgmentalism. I am not the only one, several others have also mentioned similar thoughts here (cf. Mt 18:15-17)

You seem well versed in God's judgment. I suggest that you should try to become as equally versed in his love as well.
---StrongAxe on 8/14/08

Speaking of Keys...

Revelation 1:18
I am he that liveth, and was dead, and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen, and have the keys of hell and of death.

Now these are Keys that trump any key!

Eloy, you do not have these, as you seem to think.
---kathr4453 on 8/14/08

Getting divorced rocked my world. I did not choose it. the pain & devesatation were unimaginable. However... God is more real and closer now because I needed him so desperately & clung to him through it. He has been faithful throughout and brought much healing. Forgiveness is key!! Forgiveness is an act of obedience. Forget how you feel and just obey even if you need to 100 times a day. Ask God to help you forgive when you can't seem to. If we don't forgive, God will not forgive us.
That's pretty sobering- and it is in the Bible. Pain can be released to Jesus. He is willing to bear our burdens! Isn't that wonderful!
---marilyn on 8/14/08

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OBSERVATION::Read these posts by individuals ,no remorse, recrimination, hate, disagreement,bringing up past issues Condemnation in its highest degree.WHAT WOULD JESUS SAY? Above all ELOY orchestrating the whole kit and Kaboodle.AND they sing "They will know we are christians by our Love"
---MIC on 8/14/08

Eloy, you say you have the keys, the catholics claim they have the keys, and did you know that the Pharisees also have the keys? Jesus Words, "Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering" Luke 11:52.
The keys were symbolic, not a metal object, it was "Truth pertaining to entrance to the kingdom. The gospel of salvation. The religious leaders were hendering those who wanted to enter. Now you have your own keys, the RCC has it's own keys, and the Pharisees have their own keys. And those keys don't open anything.
---Mark_V. on 8/14/08

****There is zero forgiveness for all whom remain in sin, zero.****

Actually Eloy, While we were yet sinners Christ died for us, not only for us, but for the whole world.
The only SIN there is today is rejecting Jesus Christ......not rejecting YOU!

Now, with those Keys you seem to have.....please bind Satan, and all his demons, who have blinded the eyes and minds of those without Christ.

AND Eloy, if you had those keys, why on earth didn't you use them in binding the works of Satan in your wife's life......seems to me, you don't have such power at all.....
---kathr4453 on 8/14/08

strongax, you are not close to the kingdom. There is zero forgiveness for all whom remain in sin, zero. That is why Jesus made the hell, and not only the heaven, for all those wicked whom refuse to repent. "From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Righten, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. If your brother trespass against you, scold him, and if he righten, forgive him. And if he trespass against you seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to you, saying, I amend, you will forgive him. For we know him that has said, Vengeance belongs to me, I will repay says the Lord." Matthew 4:17+ Luke 17:3,4+ Hebrews 10:30.
---Eloy on 8/14/08

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.kathrn, I have the keys, not the wicked, and what I bind indeed is bound and what I loose indeed is loosed, both in heaven and in earth.
---Eloy on 8/14/08


While you can't forgive her her sins against God, you can forgive her of her sins against yourself.

I am curious where you get the idea that "wrongly forgiving the guilty" is a sin. I don't recall ever reading that in the Bible anywhere. If it's there, please enlighten me.

Jesus forgave many people of sins. He never once said "Do you repent? OK, if so, I forgive you." Rather, it was the other way around - He forgave them FIRST, without any conditions, and THEN told them to repent and sin no more.
---StrongAxe on 8/12/08

Eloy, I was married for 18 years, and now divorced for 20. My x cheated on me, and hated me for becomming a Christian....It was tough tough years. He even told his own Children there was no such thing as God, and all the stories in the Bible were make believe. Talk about DAMAGE!!!

Took his money and hid it in secret accounts, stole everything of any value from the house....even after the divorce...

I could go on, but won't, but just wanted to say..I understand disappointment and bitterness...but if you hold on to it... she still controls you...not the Lord.

Eloy, GRACE means...I can't Lord, but YOU CAN.
---kathr4453 on 8/12/08

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