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Is Mystery Babylon America

In Revelation 17:5 we have this statement,
"And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH." Who or what does this refer to? Could it possibly be the United States?

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Well said, Samuel
In order to be a proficient warrior, one has to know his enemy.
Our enemy, the evil one, seeks to kill, steal and destroy our souls. He appears to be an angel of light, to fool even the elect if it were possible.
Recognizing the enemy is half of the battle.
The battle ground is our hearts and minds...for the heart is wicked above all the things.

Satan is not called the god of the world for nothing.
What did he offer to Jesus during the 40 days of temptation in the wilderness?
He offered him all of the nations of the earth, if Jesus would bow down to him.
For we battle not against flesh and blood, but against principlaities and powers in high places...To the victor go the spoils.
---allan2777 on 5/29/09


Allan/Rhonda: Can you please give me your reasoning for Babylon not being a place?
Rev 17:18 says: And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.
I'm not disputing you, just interested in your concept. Thank you.
---Jo_Ann on 5/29/09


I can agree with the point that Babylon is not just a place but a system.

Whenever men wish to find a way to earn their salvation or give themselves a liscence to sin and still go to heaven they are partaking of Babylonish spirit.

A person can be in a strong Bible teaching church yet still think they are more precious to GOD and better then others.

We should spend less time looking for Babylon and more examining ourselves to see if Babylon is in our heart.
---Samuel on 5/29/09


Mystery Babylon is not a place...

If it were a place, we would all know where it is.
It is world system, with 3 parts,
one world government, one financial system
and a relious system of tolerance...
"all paths lead to God"
Yes, the good old USA displays many aspects of Mystery Babylon, because of the influence of these world systems. (we are one the world leaders in making these come together).
Things will continue to get worse the more the USA turns away from God.
As a country we have thrown off the Godly precepts that this country was founded on, and traded them for a worldy system, that seeks to destroy the truth.
This is why God says "Come out of her my people"
---allan on 5/29/09


I think it is possible that the US is MYSTERY BABYLON.
*****

US is not a religion it is a country

Babylon was a city also used to describe all pagan religions ...heathen customs created by men void of God

MYSTERY worship to FALSE Gods not countries

much like christianity today ...worshipping ANOTHER Christ 2Corin 11:4 ...DUPED by THE MOTHER of all whore's REV 17 ...you do understand RCC openly calls itself MOTHER

pagan christianity held prisoner by The Synagogue of Satan ...pretty bow of mysterious traditions of men
---Rhonda on 5/28/09




Babylon drinks the blood of saints it has murdered. The U.S. has been a refuge for Christians not a place of death.

The little horn of Daniel also refers to Babylon.

Dan 7:24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom [are] ten kings [that] shall arise: and another shall rise after them, and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.


Dan 7:25 And he shall speak [great] words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.
---Samuel on 5/28/09


I think it is possible that the US is MYSTERY BABYLON. The US has been greatly blessed since its foundation. But Europe held on to its Christian beliefs for 2000 years before its churches began to decline. But the US in just over 200 years has become so politically correct, it is allowing Christianity to be degraded. The US is much like the harlot in Hosea.
---Jo_Ann on 5/27/09


Sorry to say but USA looks like Mystery Babylon to me.

Look at its description in Chapter 17 & 18. It is describing a nation, a specific place and group of people.

Rich, buying and selling all kinds of cargoes and goods, immoral, a sea-faring nation, arrogant, controlling a beast of ten kings, a great city that reigns over all the earth, having great numbers of Jewish people, living sensuously, glorifying herself.

What other nation does this describe? What other nation reigns over all the earth?
---Mark_Eaton on 5/27/09


Elizabeth.
Jerusalem was piled up as a city when revelations was written. it was nothing but rubble. moreover Jerusalem always has a been an image of God's city rather then a bloodshedding destroying. When "judgement" fell on jerusalem it was only too purifie and to cleans the city from idolatry. i know that Jesus wept over Jerusalem and his prophecy (everybody agrees fullfilled in 70ad.)
now back to the question, it appears that the protitue on the beast was drunk of the blood of the saints. How many saints have been killed for their faith in the US? historically the US cannot be the whore.
---Andy on 5/27/09


2. About the prostitute, she was riding on a beast. those acquanted with greek mythologie will agree that Europa was a woman, who was violated by a bull (actually a god that took suchform) as one of the most horrible greek stories its unpopular in todays classrooms, trying to convey greek culture as an advanced tolerant society. taking all charcterstics in acount one might see Greek culture as that prostitue. since many concider RCC as a continuation of the Roman Empire, its easy to see where the idea of RCC is the prostitute commes from. it must be added that the US has a "bodyculture" founded upon greek ideas as well. so both thesises can be "proven if one is willing to neglect certain contradictions.
---Andy on 5/27/09




Part one
To understand how the RCC could be "Mystery Babylon" one has to have a basic understanding of Babylonian and Roman pagan religions.
Nimrod, builder of the tower of babel was king, his wife Semiramis, was queen. Semiramis, was the instigator in forming the false religion aimed at supporting their rule. Eternal truths were corrupted by her (rather, quite obviously, by the evil one controlling her) into a mythic cycle wherein the great dragon is depicted as the rightful lord of the universe whose throne has been temporarily usurped by One whom we can recognize as the God of the Bible.
---Allan on 5/26/09


Part two
From it's begining, Babylon equated itself to God... With the building of the tower of Babel Nimrod elavated himself to being god on earth. Upon his death, his wife, Semiramis elevated her dead husband to godship. She called this new god Baal, lord of Heaven.
Through her union with Baal, she was to produce a child "the son of god"
To oppose the accusations of "mere" womanhood laid against her, she had herself deified as the mother of the god Damu (since only a god can beget a god), and installed as "The Queen of Heaven". A shadow and type of the RCC depiction of Mary, the Queen of Heaven and mother of God.
---Allan on 5/26/09


part 3
All false religions are represented in the Babylonian model.
Yes, Mary was blessed among women, but she was never a diety...
Even though the Babylonian religion predates Christianity it serves as the model for the RCC and other churches around the world.
One doesn't have to dig very deep to find that the RCC Saints are the Roman gods thinly veiled with christian names.
To take it one step further, most main stream churches, catholic and protestant are more closely tied than we might think.
The reformation changed a few points, but most of the "religious system" has remained intact.
We are not talking about one church, but a whole religious system. that is Mystery Babylon
---allan on 5/26/09


Mystery Babylon is NOT the USA
Babylon is where you are If your confused.
The Constitution-Was Written from God's Word
Documentation:
Isaiah 18: We are the Super Power
Revelation 17:Babylon is Confusion

If we rightly divide the word,and study with understanding
Gabby6487
---Gabby on 5/25/09


Jerusalem cannot be Babylon. It does not fit the critera set forth in revelation. I see many definiitons here. But the evidence that compare them to what the Bible says is lacking. You can say what you want but it must check out with what the Bible says to be true.
---Samuel on 5/19/09


MYSTERY BABYLON IS JERUSALEM!
---Elizabeth67 on 5/19/09


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3 days after the 2 witts are killed by the AC(at the END of his 7 years),
darkness falls upon the Earth, THEN the Lord in ALL his Glory sets his Foot on the Mt. of Olives and the ground splits down to the east gate of the wall in Jerusalem, It pushes the graves out of the way and he enters Jerusalem on his White Horse to set up his 1000 reign with those who I've mentioned numerous times and the AC & FP and their armies are cast into the Lake of fire & Satan is cast into a pit and sealed up by an Angel of God for those 1000 yrs, then AFTER those 1000 yrs. Satan is released 1 more time and he gathers whom he can(rev.20) and comes against us in Jerusalem AND God devours them with fire from Heaven, How many Armageedons are there? YLBD
---Duane_Dudley_Martin_Jr. on 4/7/09


Gordon,
Thank You & Shalom to you & yours my Brother and may the Love of our Father continue to Bless you as well.

As for the ? at hand, NO we/America are not the Babylon that's spoken of, The Babylon thats spoken of, IS the one who wore out/KILLED the saints/christians of old, and that was the Romans(Legs of IRON) & THEY are part of the Feet of IRON & Clay w/10 toes in the book of Daniel, WHICH happens to be the LAST form of Gov.(E.U) to RULE the world, read and understand.
I've been telling people for years to watch Turkey and when they join the E.U. it has come full circle, It's about to happen.
YLBD
---Duane_Dudley_Martin_Jr. on 4/6/09


Duane Dudley Martin, Jr., Well said, Brother. And, let us strive to walk in GOD's Holy Ways, and pray that we be accounted worthy to escape all these things to come. Shalom and Blessings!
---Gordon on 4/4/09


Yes, they are copy-cats,
even the AC will die and come back to life(resurrect) in the sight of men and he will be worshipped as God and he will know all the dark sentences that will lure men to his way's and to do marvelous things in their sight, Soon, the Son of Perdition comes upon the world and hardness comes to the hearts of men and Love flees from them and they devour one another with their weapons of mass-destruction.
John seen the Pillars W/fire(Nukes)that brings destruction upon mankind, the days in which man has NEVER seen before will soon be upon us, So lift UP your eyes & your worthy hands unto the God of Heaven and REJOICE that OUR redemption draweth near, woo hooo, I'm ready to go.
YLBD
---Duane_Dudley_Martin_Jr. on 4/3/09


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Samuel, The countries and movements will be under the control of the Dragon, the Beast and the False Prophet. So they will be beast-like as a result. For these countries and movements will be full of people who have rejected the True Triune GOD and will, therefore, fall for the alluring deceptions of the unholy trinity and will willingly succomb to their wicked leadership.
---Gordon on 4/3/09


Samuel, The Dragon (Satan), The Beast (Anti-Christ) and the False Prophet are Satan's attempt to copy the Holy Trinity. Father, Son and Holy Spirit. ...Gordon

Agreed.

The Beast and the False Prophet are evil individuals who will be as a False Jesus Christ and a False John the Baptist or Elijah, with Satan as the behind-the-scenes "father". Gordon

Disagree. I see these as movments and countries not individuals.
---Samuel on 4/2/09


Samuel, The Dragon (Satan), The Beast (Anti-Christ) and the False Prophet are Satan's attempt to copy the Holy Trinity. Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The "unholy trinity" works in unison to emit foul, evil spirits (like frogs) to curse the ungodly, rebellious human race. The Beast and the False Prophet are evil individuals who will be as a False Jesus Christ and a False John the Baptist or Elijah, with Satan as the behind-the-scenes "father". The ungodly world will be READY for a messiah-type global leader to solve the economic crisis and bring "peace and safety from the impending nuclear and terrorist destructions that loom above us. They reject the True Messiah, so they'll be open to receive the False Christ.
---Gordon on 4/2/09


Revelations 17:1-18: Adultery / fornication / and harlotry sometimes takes the place of idolatry, greed, or apostasy. It is the Lords intention that all receive Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, and to serve him, to not do so is a type of fornication. She especially represents those who oppose God in verse 6 "drunken with the blood of the saints and" "the martyrs of Jesus."

At the time Revelations 17:18 was written, the people would have understood it to be Rome.

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen. Glenn
---Glenn on 3/30/09


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Samuel, The lamb that came up out of the Earth which spake as a dragon is the False Prophet. Gordon

That disagrees with the Bible. Rev 16:13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs [come] out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.

Some miss it, because they refuse to believe that GOD has modern Prophets.Gordon

I believe that Modern Prophets are possible both true and false. They have to show if they are true.

The False Prophet will APPEAR to be a follower of the True GOD (as one of His sheep), but, he will be a servant of the Dragon Satan. Gordon

Say like the Pope or modern evangelists do?
---Samuel on 3/27/09


Samuel, The lamb that came up out of the Earth which spake as a dragon is the False Prophet. There will literally be a one "like Christ", the Anti-Christ. And, his partner in crime will be the False Prophet. Seventh-Day Adventists have the Sabbath issue well intact, but, they misunderstand alot of future Prophecy. Some miss it, because they refuse to believe that GOD has modern Prophets. GOD has been revealing some details about prophetic occurances in these Last Days THROUGH His Prophets of today. He has also given His Church more understanding of Prophecies as recorded in the Canonical Scriptures. The False Prophet will APPEAR to be a follower of the True GOD (as one of His sheep), but, he will be a servant of the Dragon Satan.
---Gordon on 3/27/09


Babylon is pointing to a false relgious system. That would be the Roman Catholic church which has adopted Paganism and tried to make it Christian.

The U.S. is the beast like the nations in Daniel were shown represented as animal. Originally the U.S. acted as a lamb. But more and more it is becoming a beast who sounds like the dragon.

Rev 13:11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth, and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
---Samuel on 3/26/09


Katavasia, GOD is going to be severly Judging the United States of America, it's already settled, and no argument about historical facts will change it. America was set up as a special country that GOD had blessed as no other country. No argument about historical facts will change that. The bigger they are, the harder they fall.
---Gordon on 3/26/09


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**
Katavasia, The forefathers of America got away from England because of the lack of Religious Freedom, etc. As in king George III.**

The American Revolution at the time of King George III had nothing whatever to do with religious freedom.

Try again.
---katavasia on 3/25/09


Alan of U.K. and Katasavia, England was, at one time, a blessed Country. One of the past ruling Monarchy was very Godly and the LORD blessed said country during that time. But, England has since then, gone astray, and very liberal. This is not intended to be a put-down. I'm not talking "arrogant patriotic pride" in regards to America, either. GOD has set up nations, and He has taken down nations. America has been an ally to Israel, unlike any other country ever has, in today's World. England betrayed Israel during the Balfour incident, way back when. America has mostly befriended Israel, and GOD has blessed her for that. But, now, we have been betraying Israel in some ways, and GOD is judging us for that, too.
---Gordon on 3/24/09


Katavasia, The forefathers of America got away from England because of the lack of Religious Freedom, etc. As in king George III. England does not have the same degree of Freedoms and Priveleges as America has had. Sorry, it's simply a fact.
---Gordon on 3/23/09


**England does not declare their country to be "under GOD", as America does. Is it even printed on the British Pound note?**

Actually, the image of the Queen on British coinage and currency has the initials D.G.--Dei gratia, or "By the grace of God"--near it.

**I'm not referring to the exclamation of "God save the Queen", it's not the same thing.**

It's exactly the same thing.

Teddy Roosevelt had some trenchant words about putting such phrases as "In God we trust" on money or other items of common useage. He said it merely cheapens the name of God.
---katavasia on 3/21/09


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Gor4don ... that fact that America puts "underGod" on its currency does not mean anything. Other peaders of powerful nations have in the past declared themselves to be God.

Does not make it thus.
---alan8566_of_UK on 3/20/09


Alan of U.K., GOD raised up this country with freedoms, privileges and prosperities that no other country has. Not to the same scale as America. And, to whom much is given, much is required. England does not declare their country to be "under GOD", as America does. Is it even printed on the British Pound note? I'm not referring to the exclamation of "God save the Queen", it's not the same thing. America has not lived up to the Godly principles that GOD ordained her to. She was to be a beacon of light among the other nations. Just as Israel was always to be. GOD raised up America to be an ally and a friend to Israel. But, she quite messed that up, too. Bringing MORE reason for GOD's Judgment.
---Gordon on 3/20/09


Gordon ... proportionatly America has no more power wealth and influence that previous great nations and empires

And though you might like to think it, America does not have a monopoly of sinfulness.

There is no reason for America to be punished any more than other states
---alan8566_of_UK on 3/19/09


Alan of U.K., How does that change the fact that it will happen to us, here in the United States? Your mother country's daughter has become a Harlot before the LORD. The LORD has pleaded, in Love, for her to repent, many times. She has continually refused to. The LORD has sent her many Warnings of coming Judgment. She just stops her ears, and depends on her kings for her livelihood. Rejecting the King of kings. So, now, her hour of Visitation has come.
---Gordon on 3/19/09


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America has been blessed with such freedom, material wealth and prosperity, military strength and power, freedom to worship the ONE and True GOD without fear of persecution, prosperous agriculture, highly advanced technologies, etc., This Country has been blessed by GOD in such a way that no other country has been. Not to mention how mightily GOD has used His Church throughout America to help declare the Gospel to the World. With a country as influential and great as America has been in these latter days, does it make sense that GOD would not have things to say about her in His End-Time Prophecies mentioned in the Holy Bible?
---Gordon on 3/18/09


Gordon ... that has happened to many previous empires (not by nuclear fire of course, but certainly their principal cities were torched.
---alan8566_of_UK on 3/17/09


Amen Gordon

Yes America will be destroyed ...already happening within right now ...socialist government masquerading as "democracy" ...powers that be are invisible behind the scene's

Americans that survive this holocaust taken into captivity and slavery by Holy Roman Empire

little horn is a government Dan 7:8, 8:9, Vatican is a sovereign government ...The Holy Roman Empire will be resurrected Rev 17:12-14 through 10 nations in Europe uniting led by little horn

ALL governments of earth belong to Satan 2Corin 4:4 ...Christ returns to DESTROY Holy Roman Empire Rev 17, and ALL nations will be HIS when Satan is bound
---Rhonda on 3/17/09


Read Revelation 18, and Jeremiah 50-51. These speak of the United States. It's just that the Church has been erroneously taught for SO LONG that "the U.S.A. is not in the Bible". They say that "America is not referred to in Prophecy because she either becomes Third World or she is somehow brought to such insignificance that she's not even worth mentioning." But, what in the world does it look like that has happened to "Babylon" from Rev. 18? It shows her as a wealthy, prosperous and prideful land being brought down to NOTHING. Being burned by fire, as in fires brought on by nuclear explosions.
---Gordon on 3/17/09


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I am very sure America is Babylon.
A quick look at what she has led the world into makes this clear.Materialism, import, export, Making wealth the road to happiness.
Just check out all our activities that apply to the Harlot. America has fulfilled each one.Sadly it seems to undo all the wonderful things of the past
---Dorthy on 3/17/09


'Babylon' in Revelation is ancient Rome. God bless.
---JohnnyB on 3/16/09


**abylon is basically the church of today churches who don't teach what jesus taught the kingdom of god he did not teach himself being the kingdom but he did teach the kingdom. so if you don't understand the kingdom of god you are in babylon
---john on 3/14/09**

In other words, john, you mean all pop-evangelicals.
---katavasia on 3/16/09


We should start with the fact that The People of God are not of flesh and blood anymore. They are born again in the Spirit of Christ.
*****

ancient Israel tribe of Judah known as Jews killed Gods prophets because they had GONE AFTER other gods ...blinded to Gods truth when their God came as flesh in Christ, messenger of Gods Kingdom, they sought to destroy him

Christians, spiritual Israel today, are most certainly flesh and blood ...it is appointed ONCE FOR ALL to die ...claim born again in spirit now calling God a liar ...eternal life is a promise and inheritance WHEN we are resurrected 2Corin 15 ...a mystery to self professing Christians why they cannot see the MOTHER is rcc
---Rhonda on 3/16/09


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actually samuel,
According to the Old testament and Jesus,the people of Israel have killed more prophets than RCC or any other denomination, COMBINED.
Go back and read scripture.
Matthew 23:29-31
Jesus says that Israel did it.
Lamentations 4:12-14
God says that Israel did it so that no one would touch their robes.
2 Chronicles 24:18-20
Israel and judah would not listen. They committed adultry to God with false gods.
Jeremiah ,Ezekiel, and Daniel says it is the people of Israel that did this.
We should start with the fact that The People of God are not of flesh and blood anymore. They are born again in the Spirit of Christ.
---miche3754 on 3/16/09


babylon is basically the church of today churches who don't teach what jesus taught the kingdom of god he did not teach himself being the kingdom but he did teach the kingdom. so if you don't understand the kingdom of god you are in babylon
---john on 3/14/09


**But no one disagreed that the RCC has replaced the authority of Scripture by their traditions an act of rebillion agaisnt GOD.**

This has already been done many times elsewhere.

** Nor has anyone stated that the RCC did not murder millions of Christians and others.**

Nor has anyone disproven that Protestants did the same thing to Roman Catholics when they got the chance.
---katavasia on 3/13/09


Thank you Mima

Originally all of the city of Rome was under control of the Pope.

It is funny that people argue about the number of hills or the area of the city. But no one disagreed that the RCC has replaced the authority of Scripture by their traditions an act of rebillion agaisnt GOD. Nor has anyone stated that the RCC did not murder millions of Christians and others. Nor has anyone disputed that the Pope claims to be the only true reprsentive of GOD on earth. Thus exalting himself above all men.

Are not all of the above acts of an antichrist?
---Samuel on 3/13/09


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**
How many hills does the Vatical stand on?**

One.
---katavasia on 3/13/09


Samuel has pin the tail on the donkey!
And it is true that someone does not know what they're talking about, are blinded, and perhaps willingly blinded to the truth but that someone is not Samuel.
---mima on 3/12/09


Does it really matter how many hills the city of Rome sits on? Rome is a secular city

How many hills does the Vatical stand on?
---alan8566_of_UK on 3/12/09


**The RCC has martyred millions of Christians. It sets on the seven hills of romes. It leaders are crowned with purple and Jewels. **

Protestants did the same thing to Catholics when they got the change.

Rome actually sits on NINE hills, so Rome can't be the city. (Though Jerusalem and Mecca both sit on seven hills.)

And finally, no the leaders are not crowned with purple and jewels.

Doesn't it bother you to pop off about things you clearly know nothing about?
---katavasia on 3/11/09


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Well Islam never left the true GOD. They left Paganism for a form of Monotheism based on a mixture of Christianity and Judaism.

The RCC has martyred millions of Christians. It sets on the seven hills of romes. It leaders are crowned with purple and Jewels.

It teaches Salvation by works and that tradtion is above scripture. It has a single man as the representive of GOD on earth who has the power to send people to hell or save them.
---Samuel on 3/5/09


I do not beleive that America is Babylon, although because the world follows evil (in order to win) over good it could very well be a part of Babylon's system
---tonne on 3/5/09


HMMMM, who is the harlot? Let me see? the harlot Left God for false Gods.
Who did that? Maybe you need to check out the old testament for this information.
Islam will join and be part of this Harlot.
It is not the RCC.
The RCC is one of the 7 churches that has fallen and Christ tells them to repent of their ways and return to their first love.
Who killed the most prophets? was it the RCC or was it someone else?
Check out Jeremiah chapter 3.
We have to remember that the OT coincides with Revelations in respect to the Harlot.
And identifies who she is. Islam plays a serious part because they are the 10 kings without kingdoms that turn on her.
---miche3754 on 3/5/09


That "Woman" represents Seduction.
1 John 2:These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you.
1 John 2:15: "Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever."
James 1:14_16, Prov. 6:16-19
Must be why it was said, "Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues."
---Nana on 3/5/09


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Samuel ... Calvin lived in Geneva, not in Rome
---alan8566_of_UK on 3/5/09


Yes Islam is a false relgion. But it fails to be the harlot in a couple of matters. To be the harlot the church had to be married to JESUS. Then leave him. That is not true of Islam.

the Harlot sits on seven hills. Which point to rome. Early History records Babylon as being a code word for Rome. Both Rome and Islam have murdered Christians. But the RCC have done it in the name of JESUS. They specifically hunted down and killed people for following JESUS above their teachings.

History records many Protestants labeling Rome the Great Whore for centuries.
---Samuel on 3/4/09


The Harlot is a FALSE religion
******

harlots are PEOPLE WITHIN FALSE religion

FALSE religion identified as Babylon started by Nimrod (Baal) and his mother/wife Ishtar (pronounced Easter) they created trinity and mother child worship

Rev 17:5 And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON (false christianity 2Corin 11:4) THE GREAT, THE MOTHER (papacy) OF HARLOTS (protest-ant daughters) AND ABOMINATIONS (heathen customs AGAINST The Eternal) OF THE EARTH

many DUPED by ministers of Satan 2Corin 11:13-15 to cloud identity of WHORE in Rev 17 are doing work for god of this world 2Corin 4:4 ...Christ returns binding Satan destroying his governments religions setting up Gods Kingdom on Earth
---Rhonda on 3/4/09


Mark, please read ALL these verses together. Peter is taking about the suferings of being a Christian.

He's comparing our sufferings ( which are light in comparison to what will happen to the LOST.


1 Peter 4:16Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed, but let him glorify God on this behalf.

17For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?

18And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

19Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.
---kathr4453 on 3/4/09


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** Last year on a publicly broadcast TV program, (on KLRU), a sitting priest and vatican historian flatly stated that the vatican archives include accounts of the names of 25 million people the RCC has put to death. Did anyone else see this? *** I am stating what I saw with my own eyes. If you have evidence that this is false please speak up.**

And what you see on TV is always 100% accurate, especially if it's about ANBODY'S Church, right?
---katavasia on 3/4/09


If you think God will not tolerate a house built on bad ground in a rough neighborhood, how much less will he tolerate a house that is built on good ground that spills so much sewer that even the good neighborhood is no longer fit to live in? Don't defend that house but leave and let her take what the Home Owners Agreement she claims to honor says she will get. Find a new neighborhood with unspoiled ground.
---DavidA on 3/4/09


katavasia, Remember it was the presumed followers of God that put Christ to death in the first place. Lets not rule out that possibly. God has a history of repeating patterns. There is in fact scriptural evidence (Mat 24:36) that falseness in the end will look a lot like what christians might expect a true follower to look like "if it were possible, even the elect would be deceived."

I don't have a beef with you katavasia but I know my words will not sit well with you either. Its not my intent to tear anyone down but there are things that are going to get torn down in all of us and its going to be painful at least until we let them go.
---DavidA on 3/4/09


RCC may not be *the* harlot but the arguments provided don't clear her.

>First, one that does not recognize Jesus as the Son of God and our Lord and savior.

"HAIL Mary mother of God, pray for us"
"HAIL, HOLY QUEEN, Mother of Mercy, our life, our sweetness and our hope!",

> One that says one thing with mouth does something else

Requires vows of poverty but lords over riches, claims to represent author of life but admits to killing 25 million....

> Pretend sanctified and worship God but they do not.

Jesus says father desires those who worship in spirit and in truth. Compare for yourself the spirit of Jesus with pomp, pageantry, image, symbol, human effort and worship of mystery.
---DavidA on 3/4/09


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I have to agree with Mark.
God's Church will be judged first.

the Rcc is NOT the Harlot. I am in agreeance with katavasia.

The Harlot is a FALSE religion.
What does the Bible say a false religion is?
First, one that does not recognize Jesus as the Son of God and our Lord and savior.- Islam
One that says one thing with their mouth and does something else in action- Islam
Pretend to be sanctified and worship God but they do not- Islam.
Islam doesn't even recognize Jesus as Lord and savior. They think he was a prophet but NOT the Son of God.
---miche3754 on 3/4/09


Whatever is the mysterious Babylon we will know when it is destroyed in a day but OTOH, katavasia is right. It may not be necessary to bear any witness against the RCC since she seems to be doing a fine job of this herself. One example. Last year on a publicly broadcast TV program, (on KLRU), a sitting priest and vatican historian flatly stated that the vatican archives include accounts of the names of 25 million people the RCC has put to death. Did anyone else see this? Does anyone believe it is a media hoax? This is only one of her many self exposing witnesses. I am not speaking against any followers of christ and the RCC has many. I am stating what I saw with my own eyes. If you have evidence that this is false please speak up.
---DavidA on 3/3/09


Where did you get the idea I'm a woman? I'm not.
---katavasia on 3/2/09

I apologize (again) for assuming.

I have to agree with you on what you said about Mecca and Jerusalem.
Some on this site like to take the word Of God literal on this particular subject when it is most definately not literal. Most of (if not ALL) of Revelations is Spiritual.
We know that it is a false religion that will become wide spread.
False would be one that denies our Lord Jesus is the son of God(said in many scripture). There is one that does- Islam. They say Jesus was a prophet but not the Son of God. If this isn't a clue to who is anti Christ, I don't know what is.
---miche3754 on 3/3/09


**when the pope considers himself god on earth.**

"Thou shalt not bear false witness agains thy neighbor" does not have a codicil saying, "unless thy neighbor is Roman Catholic or the pope."
---katavasia on 3/3/09


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**
I apologize sister katvasia for my offense.**

Where did you get the idea I'm a woman? I'm not.
---katavasia on 3/2/09


7 hills represent 7 Holy Roman Empires ...6 have come gone LAST soon to come with merging of state and religion ...Vatican (little horn) sovereign government UNITING with 10 countries in Europe

NT many warnings to early church about the counterfeit already entering within Gods Church with mysteries (bablyon) ABOMINATIONS reference pagan customs 1Kings 18:21 2Thess 2:7

Babylon religion is MOTHER in Rome HARLOTS protest-ant daughters ...counterfeit christianity agent god of this world 2Corin 4:4 uses deceiving WHOLE world Rev 12:9 by first agent Simon Peter Magnus vicar of Christ today ...her daughters work spreading lies confusions calling on Islam or anything else to protect cloud Truth in Word of God about identity of whore
---Rhonda on 3/1/09


Indeed Mystery Babylon is referring to a church. But which church?

1Pe 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the HOUSE OF GOD... (what is the house of God?)

1Tim 3:15 But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the HOUSE OF GOD, which is THE CHURCH OF THE LIVING GOD...

Clearly it is the external church that the living God Himself established to be the keepers and spreaders of His Word. I'm afraid it is not just 1 church, it is ALL churches.
---Mark on 2/28/09


have you noticed the cross put on the forehead & back of the hand on ash wednesday? that indicates the mark of the catholic church. it means a person agrees with the teachings of the catholic church. people say that obama is the anti christ, when the pope considers himself god on earth.
---mike on 2/27/09


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**
She sits on the seven Hills and Many Scholars say Babylon was a reference to Rome. This only fits one church. For it is a whore. That means it has to be a church.**

Actually, Rome sits on NINE hills, if you count Vatican.

And there are several cities that sit on seven hills, including Mecca and Jerusalem.

If Rome is the whore, what does that make her Protestant daughters?
---katavasia on 2/27/09


the holy roman empire under the disguise of the catholic church.
---mike on 2/26/09


UNited Nations UNO.
---Andy on 2/26/09


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