Heaven Immediately At Death
|
|
At death the spirit goes back to God, but the body and soul remain on earth until he returns and the Trumpet of God is sounded. |
|
---Eloy on 11/15/09 |
Before God came as Jesus, People slept in the graves awaiting payment for sins: Jesus died once for all. The Lamb became God/Spirit at his resurrection and started judging mankind. He already judged those who slept in the graves, the thief on the cross and every person after that day, He will judge us at our deaths too.
The day of the Lord isn't a 24hour day, it's a time period of judgment of anyone who dies. 2 Peter 3:8-10. We die at an unknown hour during this time period of judgment, aka the last days, The great and dreadful day of Jehovah, That day, those days, the last hour, that hour, etc.
We die to this world at an unknown hour, then we're translated to living spirit (air) instantly 'in the twinkling of an eye'. |
|
---Tyge_Wellman on 11/15/09 |
Even heaven will not last forever. Lord Jesus says heaven and earth will pass away. |
|
---sri.ramakrishna on 7/22/09 |
The answer of where we go at death can be found in the Scriptures.
2nd Corinthians 5:6and8
"6-Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
8-We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
The Lord is coming back (bringing our spirits with him) to raise our new glorified bodies that will be joined with our spirits at the resurrection!!!
It is our spirits that go to be with the Lord at death. |
|
---mima on 7/22/09 |
"The Bible speaks of two resurrection. One of the Righteous and one of the wicked."
Samuel on 7/20/09
That seems to be one and the same resurrection, only the disposition of the resurrected is different, like some to the left and some to the right. However, I gather that there are two resurrections per Matthew 22:30-31: "For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven. But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying, ..." |
|
---Nana on 7/22/09 |
When the wicked die the second death in hell they will feel nothing for they have died a second time.
The Bible speaks of two resurrection. One of the Righteous and one of the wicked. The Righteous are raised to eternal life. At that time we will be changed. I Corithians 15.
But the living are not promised eternal life. To say because someone is spiritually dead they are not alive does not fit. Go up to any sinner and tell them they are dead and if they argue with you then you are wrong. |
|
---Samuel on 7/20/09 |
absent from the body,present with the lord,applies only to the saved.the dead in christ.those who are lost are both dead spiritually,and physically,until the resurection for the great white throne judgement,where they will experience the second death after they are judged. |
|
---tom2 on 7/19/09 |
Mark V: I think that we are on the same page here. Immortality is not currently our inherent state, but rather is "put on" at Jesus' second coming - whether we are alive or dead at that time (1 Cor 15:51-53). Thus, the dead cannot now be in a conscious state, as Jesus has not yet returned. |
|
---jerry6593 on 6/26/09 |
Samuel, when Scripture speaks about "the dead" it is refering to those who are lost. Spiritually dead. They do not believe in God. So He is not their God. "He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living, you are greatly mistaken"
That is why Jesus answered the Sadducess in verse 29 quoting from Deut. 10:12, 30:6 how to be right with God.
Death in the Bible belongs to the lost. They are dead to God. Spiritually dead. When they physically die and are judge after receiving their new bodies, they will continue to be spirituall dead in Hell. Separated from God. And they will feel the pain of punishment.
If they were physically dead in hell they would feel nothing. |
|
---MarkV. on 6/26/09 |
We will all be in the grave when we die.Some christians try to use 2-3 verses to say that we go straight to heaven at death.Jesus said death was a "sleep".If the theif on the cross went straight up when Jesus said this day u will be with me,then y after Jesus was raised He said to mary,do not touch Me as I have not yet assended.The NT saints also refered to Death as a sleep.If we sleep for 5 minutes or 500 years,it will seem like no time at all.We die go to the grave then are raised,so it will seem like no time as past as "the dead no nothing"Read all the verses in your Bible about "sleep". |
|
---daniel on 6/25/09 |
The bible says"to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord"We instantly go to be with Jesus when we die, when Jesus comes back, our spirit is reunited with a glorified body that is ressurected if we know Jesus.Those who don't know Jesus, when they die, go to hell where there is torment for eternity. on judgement day the dead who are in hell and on earth are judged by God and the saints as we will be seated with Him.The judgement on the redeemed is only for our works which places us in heavenly places the Bible even says that there is a better ressurection for believers.there are levels of rewards in heaven, but we still will be made perfect and there is no jealousy in heaven. once we accept Jesus -we are saved |
|
---michael on 6/25/09 |
I cannot believe nobody has quoted Luke 16, Lazarus and the Rich Man.
Where were they? Luke 16:22 says Abrahams bosom, or OT version of heaven. Where was the Rich Man? Luke 16:23 says Hades, or OT version of Hell.
What does this tell us? That we go immediately somewhere and some kind of judgment must be made prior to us going there. |
|
---Mark_Eaton on 6/25/09 |
I guess I have a question.. hehe maybe a few..
Concerning Gen 5:24, Deut 34: 5-6, Gen 25:8-9, 2Ki 2:11, Mat 17:3, Luke 16:23-25
Where is Moses, Abraham, Isaiah, and Enoch today? seperate answers if need be.. |
|
---MIchael on 6/25/09 |
Mark 12:27 He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err. MIchael
The topic of discussin in Mark is about the resurrection. The Sadducees did not believe in the Resurrection. JESUS taught that when we are resurrected we recieve as a gift eternal life. Promised when we are Born Again given at the resurrection.
Some churches teach we have an immortal soul so we are immortal already. But only the righteous get immortalisty. The Wicked will die in hell and cease to exist. |
|
---Samuel on 6/25/09 |
Jerry, you happen to put 1 Tim. 6:16, claiming that only God has immortality, while I agree He is the only One now, but at the Day of our Lord, all genuine believers will also have immortality. That event has not happen yet. Just because the Spirit after death goes to be with God, does not mean the person is immortal already. Believers will receive a body like Christ. Jesus brought "Life and immortality to light through the gospel" 2 Tim. 1:10. It does not mean we have it already, eternal life or immortality, but we will, for it is a promise. Immortality is the perpetual life of all genuine believers resurrection bodies. |
|
---MarkV. on 6/23/09 |
2 Corinthians 5:6 Therefore [we are] always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: 7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8 We are confident, [I say], and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.
Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it
Numbers 27:16 Let the LORD, the God of the spirits of all flesh, set a man over the congregation,
Mark 12:27 He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err. |
|
---MIchael on 6/20/09 |
John: "But Many believe that at death the spirit is returned to the Lord and that this part of the person is present with the Lord immediately upon death."
1Ti 6:16 [God] Who ONLY hath immortality
Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing
Psa 146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth, in that very day his thoughts perish.
Psa 115:17 The dead praise not the LORD, neither any that go down into silence. |
|
---jerry6593 on 6/20/09 |
Thanks for the blessing Michael. I have yet to meet anyone who does hold the understanding I have been given. Most would agree with Jerry, in that the "interpretation" I have share would not provide comfort for the disciples. However, for me, it would have been indeed comforting, in this way.
Informing His disciples that He would not leave them comfortless, He would return (Jhn 14:18) to indued them with power from on high. That day (the day of pentecost) He would return spiritually to intimately associated Himself with them from within for the specific purpose of empowering them to stay in an abiding state of expectancy and hope, as well as to strengthen, and continue to teach them concerning the task to which they were called. |
|
---Josef on 6/19/09 |
josef, although I do not hold the same understanding on this matter, I do applaud your attitude. God bless |
|
---MIchael on 6/17/09 |
Josef: "We will not leave the earth."
1Th 4:16,17 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. |
|
---jerry6593 on 6/17/09 |
"I believe that your attempt to apply a metaphysical interpretation to John 14:3 is unwarranted" You are certainly entitled to your belief sir.
Yet I have made no attempt at , I have simply expressed and understanding. After all Jesus did say, and I quote "that where I am (present tense), ye may be also." Rather than 'where I will be (future tense)' [there] ye may be also. We will not leave the earth. However, this is simply my understanding, I could be mistaken and you could very be correct. It is not something that I would argue. As a matter of fact I never argue scripture, I simply share an understanding of it:o) |
|
---Josef on 6/16/09 |
Josef: "In Jhn 14:3 the word [there] was unwarrantably added, never implied."
In my Bible (KJV), the word "there" does not appear. The word used is "where," and it certainly is warranted. It is correctly translated from the Greek "hopou."
I believe that your attempt to apply a metaphysical interpretation to John 14:3 is unwarranted. The context is given in verse 1 as a straightforward attempt by Jesus to comfort His disciples on the issue of His departure. A spiritual-only interpretation would not accomplish that end. |
|
---jerry6593 on 6/16/09 |
Luke 9:30 And, behold, there talked with him two men, which were Moses and Elias.
Duet 34:6 And he buried him in a valley in the land of Moab, over against Bethpeor: but no man knoweth of his sepulchre unto this day.
2 Kings 2:11 And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, [there appeared] a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder, and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.
Genesis 5:24 And Enoch walked with God: and he [was] not, for God took him.
No human bodies in Heaven? No human spirits in heaven? |
|
---MIchael on 6/16/09 |
John, Everyone has their own concept of what constitutes a "spirit"
Ruach Heb. and pneuma Gr. both mean breath or air. If that's what returns to God, so be it because when He created Adam He "BREATHED" INTO HIM THE BREATH OF LIFE! |
|
---1st_cliff on 6/15/09 |
Read These Insightful Articles About Software
|
1Cliff. Okay, I agree with you that no physical bodies are in heaven until after the resurrection. But Many believe that at death the spirit is returned to the Lord and that this part of the person is present with the Lord immediately upon death. The body will be reunited at the resurrection. |
|
---john on 6/15/09 |
Cluny/MarkV, You're right ,I don't, the bible does not support it!
No one can see God and live,not even Job!
When a person dies and is buried,a marker to show where he last rested ,stays there until resurrected!
Drowned at sea is a different story,nothing to mark their last resting place,so the
"sea" become the grave and the place from which the dead arise! New body and restored life! Resurrection means "re standing to life"!
Mark,the only thing to leave your body at death is your breath!You're dead until He brings you back to life! |
|
---1st_cliff on 6/15/09 |
The Thessalonians were worried that once a person died they would never see them again. Paul to correct them spoke of the Resurrection in I thess 4. If the dead had an immortal soul and could not die like the greeks taught why did Paul not tell them the Pagan Greeks were correct instead of pointing them to the resurrection? |
|
---Samuel on 6/15/09 |
Correction to previous post "to prepare a place for Him in us" should read "to prepare a place for us in Him". Just wanted to straighten that up. |
|
---Josef on 6/15/09 |
Man, (no gender implied) is going nowhere, the earth is man's home. The overcomer will reign here when Jesus returns, throughout the millennia.
When the dead in Christ are raised, those alive in Christ are changed. Together we are gathered together in our breath of life bodies to meet Jesus and His Angels as His wrath is poured upon the remainder of humanity.
The Spirit of Jesus, The Spirit of Truth returned to earth as the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit after He ascended bodily into Heaven to prepare a place for Him in us, and a condition within us for Him in fulfillment of His appointed task as Savior. That where He is, an abiding rest in God, we might be also. In Jhn 14:3 the word [there] was unwarrantably added, never implied. |
|
---Josef on 6/15/09 |
References for prior post.
"If we go to heaven immediately at death"
Concerning where-Psa 115:16>Rev. 5:10>Rev. 20:9.
Concerning when-1Cor. 15:52>1Thes. 4:16,17>
Concerning Why-Mat. 24:31>Mark 13:27>Mat. 3:12>Mat. 13:30>Zec. 14:4,5>2Th 1:7-10.
Concerning-"why did Jesus say He was coming back to get us to take us to where He is?"
John 14:2,3>John 14:18-20. |
|
---Josef on 6/15/09 |
\\Jesus says "the sea will give up the "dead" not dead bodies, they have long since decomposed or been eaten!Those that died at sea will return ,not the body!
You continually promote the false idea that the dead somehow still live somewhere. (without a body???) and come back to earth to get a new one to live in heaven..preposterous!(not to mention unscriptural)\\
What you're saying, Cliff, is that you you don't believe the basic Christian doctrine of the Resurrection of the Body.
Even Job said, "Though worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God." |
|
---Cluny on 6/15/09 |
1 Cliff, Ok, the passage does say that the sea gives up the dead, is the sea giving up Spirits, soul, dust, mudd, or what? You have the answer, why don't you tell us all what it is the sea is giving up? |
|
---MarkV. on 6/15/09 |
| Read These Insightful Articles About Anorexia
|
MarkV, "Here you are again"?? You try to slick one past me I will comment!
Jesus says "the sea will give up the "dead" not dead bodies, they have long since decomposed or been eaten!Those that died at sea will return ,not the body!
You continually promote the false idea that the dead somehow still live somewhere. (without a body???) and come back to earth to get a new one to live in heaven..preposterous!(not to mention unscriptural) |
|
---1st_cliff on 6/14/09 |
John, Same as markV, Tell me how they will "rise" if they are already in heaven??
The "dead" will indeed "rise" from the grave or wherever,complete with new body as arising from sleep!
Think about this....fundamentalist view..dead go to heaven can recognize each other even tho they apparently have no body because they have to come back to earth to get one (even after 100s of years,1,000s even?)...talk about a fairy tale!!!
And "I'M" the one in the dark???? |
|
---1st_cliff on 6/14/09 |
1 Cliff.What do you think is coming out of the ground when it says those in Christ will rise first? What's in the ground but a dead, decayed body? |
|
---john on 6/14/09 |
1 Cliff, here you are again doing the same as you do on all other blogs agains't someone, argue a word, phrase, sentence, or whatever you can spot. I am sure "Bodies" is talking about a dead bodies. Cluny's straight forward answer was not meant, I am sure, to be disected. Resurrection of the dead" is refering to bodies. |
|
---MarkV. on 6/14/09 |
Cluny: The Bible teaches that when a person dies, his/her body retrns to DUST and the SPIRIT/Breath of life (NOT THE SOUL) returns to God!
No one goes to heaven after death, until Jesus comes again and the dead in Christ are called forth from their tombs at the 1st resurection:
Ex. Acts: 2:34 specifically says that David
who had dies centuries eralier did not go to heaven.
1 Cor.15:51-54 tells us that we will not be rewarded with IMMORTAITY until Jesus comes again! |
|
---Pierr5358 on 6/14/09 |
Cluny, Show me a scripture that says "resurrection of the BODY!" |
|
---1st_cliff on 6/14/09 |
The reference to Jesus taking us to Himself to where He is refers to the resurrection of our bodies and being reunited with our souls at His Second Coming at the end of the Tribulation, when the dead are raised and we are changed. |
|
---Cluny on 6/13/09 |
|
|
|
