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Avoid Made In China Products

I've noticed that it is difficult to find things that are made in the USA. Many things are made in the USA's economic savior: China. I don't like buying things that result in more jobs being sent to other countries. Are my thoughts "wrong", "bad", "mistaken", etc.?

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 ---Sag on 6/16/09
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For whatever excuse, or reason, Cannibalism is allowed, It is still evil!
---John on 4/30/10


John: while yes, it is true that cannabalism is still practiced in China, this is an ancient practice, most often the victim is a 'victim' of an abortion, which is then eaten - ancient Chinese practice tells them it encourages fertility (WHY that is necessary, I don't understand, since they can't have more than one baby!). So I don't think it's a left-wing thing - it's an ancient, pagan, custom

But yes, the millions of aboritions are certainly due to the command of the communists - AND after they ordered the people, in the 60s, to have MORE babies!

I avoid made in China when possible
---peter3594 on 4/30/10


CHINA STILL ENGAGES IN CANNIBALISM!!!

Yet this fact is totally unreported by the Left Wing Media who want to put a different light on this SICK Communist Country.

THEY ALSO SLAUGHTER CHILDREN ON A MASSIVE SCALE!!

To enforce their 1 child per family law.
---John on 4/25/10


Donna, you are right about finding made in US goods (in Greece, where I live, it's generally Poland (safety generally OK), Hungary (the same), Germany (better products) or India (???), Malasia (???), etc

It's just that in China I have experience of dangerous practices, while for India and Malasia, I cant blame them without some evidence, which I don't have
---peter3594 on 4/24/10


peter3594--You are right. It's hard to get people to comply with health and safety rules sometimes, unless they see for themselves the difference it makes (or have someone standing over them)

I'd prefer not to buy Chinese goods for the additional reason that they have often been proven to contain harmful substances.

BUT to find products made in the USA can be very time consuming. And when you find them, they are likely to be considerably more expensive. Most of the time I just don't have the time nor the money. I think most American consumers are like that, too.
---Donna66 on 4/20/10




Donna66: You are also polite - we need more of that, it is sad to me that we bicker so much. Maybe we should spend some time trying to calm down some of the blogs when they get out of hand!
---peter3594 on 4/20/10


peter3594--- The blog on Obama and healthcare is closed so I'm responding to you here to say I didn't mind your response. I didn't take it as "arguing". Sorry if I sound defensive sometimes...politics in this country has gotten very heated as of late.
I appreciate your intelligent, and always polite, posts. Blessings to you!
---Donna66 on 4/20/10


Donna - I never tried to suggest [to the Chinese] that this was wrong, because I had already learnt that this owuld be useless. I just prefer not to purchase things made in China [I suspect other Asian countries which are Buddist may be the same, but I do not have first-hand knowledge]. I just feel that this may be one reason why China can produce such cheap goods [their water pollution may be another reason - I not it is not very clean, and, though they are just told to boil it - to kill bacteria - some of the metals in the water do not leave by boiling it]. So I just try to avoid their products when I can - not an easy task!
---peter3594 on 4/20/10


peter3594-- If the building you visited had been in the US, people would rise up in protest. They would demand laws requiring the manager protect the workers safety.

This doesn't happen in China (perhaps, to be safe, I should say, it almost never happens). Not only their religion, but also their government, has taught them to accept their fate without complaint. Americans from half way around the world can do little to change entrenched cultural attitudes. Even if companies try to enforce safety standards in their own plants in China, they get minimal co-operation.
even from those they try to protect.
---Donna66 on 4/19/10


Donna, I had not thought about the Buddist ideas, which yes, are more fatalist than the Christian ones.

But I have had chats with some supervisors (in building sites, not factories) who appeared to me not to care (in this case it was about those belts that workers wear so they don't fall to their death from a high building when they are constructing it) - because the belts were very expensive.

That, of course, may also be due to the fatalism of Buddism, but still, I did not like it, because I know that two workers HAD died falling from the buiding - with the belts, they would have been fine
---peter3594 on 4/19/10




Peter3594 -- I have spent time in China too.
The point I tried to make was that Chinese owned and operated companies would not necessarily be any safer than American ones! I don't believe it is a matter of business practices. It may be partly due the fatalism of Buddhism. Their entire culture accepts more risk to human life than ours does.
---Donna66 on 4/16/10


Ya, I'm gonna drive my Toyota filed with foreign gas and oil to the plaza to boycott made in China products while dressed in my Italian suit and Malaysia silk tie with Moroccan shoes while eating pizza, egg rolls and drinking French wine. I will carry my Glock .45 made in Austria to protect myself in case someone throws a Pepsi at me.
I'm like everyone else here.... I am pro-American buisness and don't mind saying so....
I am gonna ask why oil produced in this country is sold to foreign countries, why toll roads are built in this country and sold to the French and others and why foreign governments wanta dictate policy to American citizens.
---Elder on 4/16/10


It's a cryin shame that the U.S.A. is caught up in this mess. Hard to find Good American Made products. Like the Victory m - cycles I heard that was made here in the U.S. So I took an emailed the Vict - m - cycle corp & asked them. I heard that the V-m-cycles are Amer - made. I asked them how much Jap technology is in it?, how much Jap metals are in them? If there is, then they'r Not truly Amer - made. I received No reply from the V-m-cycle corp. No doubt is the same with these newer H - D evos. To much was done to them & they do Not have the true H-D sound. The old H-D knuckle - pan & the earlier shovel heads do.
---Lawrence on 4/16/10


Donna66, I have spent long enough in China to have things I dislike.... I am just saying that when we buy Chinese things, we may be, indeed, saving money, but someone may well have died in that factory (MANY more than would have died in an equivalen American, European or Japanese factory, I'm sure). So I try to avoid those products when possible - but I am rather biased by my living there
---Peter3594 on 4/16/10


Adam Smith, US forefather,coined the term "Invisible Hand" "Smith assumed that individuals try to maximize their own good (and become wealthier)and by doing so through trade and entrepreneurship, society as a whole is better off. Furthermore, any government intervention in the economy isn't needed because the invisible hand is the best guide for the economy. - Investopedia

"I have never known much good done by those who affected to trade for the public good." - Adam Smith

in short, 1.) group/govt intervention is a no-no. 2.) the rest of the world has a right to capitalist economics and food too.

The real issue is there is two hands in the pot: God and mammon. With whom do you really shake hands?
---aka_joseph on 4/16/10


Elder:

It is not a matter of regulations "being impossible to meet". Rather, it is matter of the government forcing the safety bar to be set so high that the products cannot be produced at prices low enough to compete in the market against foreign-made products.

I'm pretty sure that the company could keep up with those regulations if they (say) doubled the prices of their furniture. Unfortunately, then almost nobody would buy them. Once again, this is not a matter of "if", but rather "how much".
---StrongAxe on 4/16/10


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Strongaxe, China and other countries do not have the US government interference that US companies have to endure.
Over 500 jobs were sent to Mexico by a Los Angeles furniture company. Government regs from South Coast Air Quality Management District were impossible to meet. The company moved to Mexico, shipped products back to the US and put more pollution in the air with trucks than they did with US plants.
Federal regulations are bankrupting America like they have Calf while US jobs are being sent to our enemies. Just like we buy CITGO gas, because it is a penny cheaper, from one of our biggest enemy dictators while we lose our freedoms daily.
Soon we will only be able to remember how it was to be free.
---Elder on 4/16/10


peter3594
Of course the manager's actions would be unacceptible to you and me.

But the story you relate is not too suprising in a society whose government requires the abortion of every child except a couples' first.
---Donna66 on 4/15/10


peter3594:

Yes. If a harness costs $200 (for each everyone), and a funeral $125 (for the unlucky ones), the funerals are clearly cheaper. For them, the bar is set quite low.

But how high is our own bar set? If a company had to spend an additional $2,000 per employee for safety shut-offs power saws, or $20,000 per driver for safer cars, or $200,000 for an environmental suit to keep them free from air pollutants - where do we draw the line and say "you're required to take precautions if they cost less than this, but not if they cost more"?

We all have a bar - we just have diffent heights at which ours are set, and we criticize others who set theirs lower, while justifying ourselves to those who set theirs higher.
---StrongAxe on 4/15/10


StrongAxe, you have something of a point, but I will share a story with you, so you can see the difference. When I worked in China, I would often pass outside a site where a block of apartments was being built. A number of times I would see people bringing dead bodies out of the site, so after a while, I brought a translator (my Chinese is miserable) to ask why. After finding the manager, I asked what the situation was. I was told: 'Well, I could save them, all of them dies because they fell from high up. BUT the harness costs me (US equivalent $200) but when a worker dies, I only have to pay his family $125. So I don't but the harness becaue its cheaper for me if I dont save them'. I think that is unacceptable!
---peter3594 on 4/15/10


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I've never suggested a boycott.
As I said, earlier,
It's too late to boycott Chinese goods...you'd have trouble finding USA made products to meet all your needs. Anyway, a boycott would not save a single job in this country.
---Donna66 on 4/14/10


peter3594:

People sometimes get injured and die in American factories, just like China and elsewhere. No company wants its workers injured or killed - it's bad for business and morale. However, all companies weigh the cost of human vs. safeguards to avoid them. If the safeguards cost more than lawsuits and percieved damage done to company's reputation, it's more economical to not bother with them. There have been many cases where major U.S. corporations were shown to have done this (Ford, McDonalds, etc.). And we do the same - how many buy Volvos because they are safer?

Plants in America and China act the same. In the east, human life is cheaper, so the safety trade-off bar is just set a little bit lower than it is in the west.
---StrongAxe on 4/14/10


StrongAxe, yes, it is true that many people will just not pay the extra for a made in USA video. BUT - if the one made in China involves many people dying in the factory (as I saw when I actually went to one, it looked like an ER from a war movie....) - would it be better to just not buy one if people died making it?
---peter3594 on 4/14/10


How selfish can you people be.

The gospel is being introduced to the world by using America's business. Many Chinese learn about the American way of life, including the gospel, after receiving their first contract to manufacture products. Don't you know that by sending American manufacturing overseas that we are planting the seed of the gospel?

Our evil nature must point the finger somewhere and that somewhere is China. It is our own fault that America is going down the tubes. It is our sin that is destroying America as we have quickly turned our backs toward God over the past forty years. This country would still be great if God was still on our side.
---Steveng on 4/13/10


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How selfish can you people be. #2...

You people are so vain to think that it's the American corporation's fault that they are sending work to other countries (while it's really a blessing in disguise in the eyes of God).

Unless Amercia repents as a nation, America is doomed to be destroyed. This country can be blessed by God and be propserous once again if we repent even while the world is in turmoil.
---Steveng on 4/13/10


Sag- StrongAxe is correct that low wage workers overseas undercut wages and higher priced competitors here at home.

Obewan is proof that underneath all the political and ideological fighting suffering by American workers is real.

Donna is correct that so many items are made outside the country a boycott, though not impossible, would be very difficult.

Betty's reference to the Illuminati conspiracy is good for a laugh. Maybe it will be covered in "Godfather IV" along with the anti-Christ 666 being Ronald Wilson Reagan.
---larry on 4/13/10


Betty:

If you go into WalMart, and have a choice to spend $200 for a Made in the USA DVD player, or a similar $50 Made in China DVD player, which would you buy? While many people can afford to spend %150 more, most of those don't shop at WalMart. The reason companies manufacture overseas is that it's cheaper to pay workers there to make them and then pay the shipping costs here, than to pay workers here to make them. Our society grants our workers benefits like minimum wage, unions that can negotiate for better pay, vacations, health care, etc. SOMEBODY has to pay for all that. Either the consumer is willing to pay higher prices for goods made in the USA, or American workers price themselves out of the market by being more expensive.
---StrongAxe on 4/13/10


Obewan--Your argument says those developing nations will buy more jets, and give some more high paying jobs to the aircraft builder

That was NOT my argument.
You misunderstood

Almost all of the products manufactured overseas are PURCHASED in the US by Americans. Americans benefit from the lower prices of goods sold at discount stores i.e. Walmart. Walmart, aside ...the price of goods manufactured elsewhere will be cheaper than those manufactured in the US.

I don't know about Boeing. They don't sell to Walmart :) but their products are sold all over the world. The less it costs to make, the lower the selling price can be (to compete with others who sell the same product).
---Donna66 on 4/13/10


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Frankly, I believe it is crazy and dangerous for Americans to take away jobs from Americans and put their factories & businesses in other countries for those other countries to reap the benefits. Those countries could bring us to our knees economically & otherwise. If they grow all the food, what will we eat if they decide to make war against us? The Illuminati is behind all that junk anyway. It is part of their written plan.
---Betty on 4/13/10


I will agree with Sag in avoiding those products [Chinese] for two other reasons: [1] I have been to the Chinese factories, and they are incredibly dangerous - planty of blood on the floor, etc etc, so we are actually [in some cases] buying what we could call 'blood products', like the 'blood diamonds', and [2] because they persecute Christians [and other faiths as well]. So I would avoid their products when possible. Also [on an aside] because their factories are polluting the seas, rivers, etc etc even outside China
---peter3594 on 4/13/10


Hi from Ireland, I agree! Do not buy product,s Made in China.
---john on 12/29/09


Donna: no offense taken.

Now I am on the giving end of the downturn. I work for the largest builder of aircraft engines.

Every day it is a constant fight to keep work stateside. We used to pay factory skilled labor $17 an hour + benefits. Then the outsourcing to Thailand and Mexico started at $4 an hour. To keep some of the jobs in the U.S., we had to reduce pay to $9 an hour without benefits. People are told they can take it or leave it. If they don't want those jobs at $9 they will go out of the country.

Your argument says those developing nations will buy more jets, and give some more high paying jobs to the aircraft builder, but those jobs are being sent to China too. Google Boeing to see what is happening.
---obewan on 6/21/09


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Obewan --- please forgive me for seeming unsympathetic. I was just following an interesting line of thought... just making an intellectual argument about economics.

It must be devastating to go from a high paying job where one is respected,...to menial labor that barely feeds you. I ADMIRE you for WORKING and not just giving up and accepting dependence on the state for everything.
I'm glad things are better for you now.
---Donna66 on 6/20/09


Obewan--
You say:
>>The trend will only continue until wages equalize (if that ever happens). But, by the time wages are equal, our standard of living will have declined<<

What if their standard of living increases, as it is bound to, AND OUR standard of living increases or stays the same?

There is no natural law that says the wealth of the world is a fixed amount that requires some equilibrium, OR that it can never increase beyond a certain point! Otherwise how could civilizations ever have progressed?
---Donna66 on 6/19/09
I have lived it and you have not. When you are forced to work for $8 with no benefits you will learn mercy as I have.
---obewan on 6/20/09


Donna, will you marry me? I can't begin to express how good it makes me feel to see a wise woman who gets it.

You are spot on. Wealth is not a zero sum game. There is not one pie with a finite amount of pieces to go around. If one person has 6 pieces, it does not mean that there are only 2 pieces left for everybody else to fight over. Rather, we simply make more pies.
---ralph7477 on 6/19/09


Obewan--
You say:
>>The trend will only continue until wages equalize (if that ever happens). But, by the time wages are equal, our standard of living will have declined<<

What if their standard of living increases, as it is bound to, AND OUR standard of living increases or stays the same?

There is no natural law that says the wealth of the world is a fixed amount that requires some equilibrium, OR that it can never increase beyond a certain point! Otherwise how could civilizations ever have progressed?
---Donna66 on 6/19/09


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I don't see how that illustrates "if China's standard of living increases, ours will decrease"?

Do you think that if China charges more for their products, your wages would be even less?
---Donna66
If you were a manufacturer, would you pay $17 an hour when you could get the same work for $4 a day?

That $4 a day for China has already increased their standard of living. The trend will only continue until wages equalize (if that ever happens). But, by the time wages are equal, our standard of living will have declined.

I saw it when I did SKILLED factory labor for $8 with no benefits. It will only get worse before it gets better. And, China was in the middle of their boom 5 years ago when this happened.
---obewan on 6/19/09


"Michigan currently has 18% unemployment in some areas. Have some mercy for Pete's sake!

I had been out of work and looking for nearly 2 years. I had also been sick with no health insurance."
I feel for you obewan. At present we are on COBRA at $290/mo thanks to the President. It was $832/mo before he intervened. If we do have to maintain the same equivalent medical insurance, it will be on the order of > $1,100.00.
---Nana on 6/19/09


"I was forced to temp for $8 an hour at a building products slave labor camp."

Who forced you to do such a thing, Obewan?
---ralph7477 on 6/17/09
Apparently you have no concept of the words bank account, budget, and expenses.

Michigan currently has 18% unemployment in some areas. Have some mercy for Pete's sake!

I had been out of work and looking for nearly 2 years. I had also been sick with no health insurance.

Employers would not touch me with a 10 foot pole. I had lost nearly $200K, and it was a "choice" of that ONLY job offer or the homeless shelter. I suppose it is no longer a force though since I am not longer there, but at the time it was.
---obewan on 6/18/09


Obewan--

>>"The justificatioin for low pay used by the employer was "we have to compete with China."<<

I don't see how that illustrates "if China's standard of living increases, ours will decrease"?

Do you think that if China charges more for their products (as would be the case if their standard of living increases),your wages would be even less?
---Donna66 on 6/17/09


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"I was forced to temp for $8 an hour at a building products slave labor camp."

Who forced you to do such a thing, Obewan?
---ralph7477 on 6/17/09


Your question is well understood by most Americans. In China I found the following things to be true.
1. Even the Chinese people make fun of the slogan "made in China"
2. Chinese people were acutely aware of the fact that without outside consumers(about 95% American) they would be doomed.
3. Leaders of China will tolerate the gospel of Christ being taught as long as they can enjoy the profits of trade. In fact were the conditions of trade should be free expression of religion.
4. They are desperately trying to learn English and I believe they understand that they are as dependent on us as we are on them.
---mima on 6/17/09


Obewan's statements that "if China's standard of living increases, ours will decrease" is baseless. The "share the wealth policy" stifled the Chinese economy for years.
---Donna66 on 6/16/09
You obviously have never worked in a Midwest factory labor job lately.

When I was laid off from my high paid engineering job for 4 years in Michigan, I was forced to temp for $8 an hour at a building products slave labor camp. The justificatioin for low pay used by the employer was "we have to compete with China."

Of course, 5 years ago when this happened to me, China was at the peak of their boom.
---obewan on 6/17/09


It's too late to boycott Chinese goods...you'd have trouble finding USA made products to meet all your needs. Anyway, a boycott would not save a single job in this country.

Taxes and regulations have made the cost of doing business almost prohibitive for some companies. Moving out of the US is the only way they can offer an affordable product. (but QUALITY is another issue!)

Obewan's statements that "if China's standard of living increases, ours will decrease" is baseless. The "share the wealth policy" stifled the Chinese economy for years.

But I feel the Chinese deserve good jobs that otherwise might be unavailable to them.
Their wage seems pitifully low by US standards, but it buys a lot in China!
---Donna66 on 6/16/09


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Betty:

There was a time when the USA produced almost 'everything' and much of the world bought them. Americans are having difficulties with the new realities, but that is the nature of life, empires fall.
The rise in Chinese power is not the cause of the American decline. The decline of the United State America is a result of American arrogance and greed.

However, here are just a few issues that will compound the difficulties that the American nation and people face: 15 million unemployed, almost fifty million without medical insurance, millions more are one to three pay checks from homelessness, 11 trillion dollar government debt and a 50 trillion dollar private sector debt. How long could that be maintained.
---Janze on 6/16/09


Sag~ Your thoughts are right...it's just hardly anything is made in the USA anymore, so you really don't have much choice than to buy items made elsewhere.
---Anne on 6/16/09


Sag feelings & thoughts are something we can't help coming but we can help the not staying. It is a little late for any of us to worry or even dislike things made in other Countries,whats already done isn't likely to be changed. I would have liked to see the US impose a penalty on American Companies who closed factories here and started them in other Countries. It should have stated the US wouldn't buy that factories products,or allow import for them,from 5,10 or 20 years. As for China we had better get use to them they have bought the USA,loan by loan. Pretty soon they will own us completely if our Leaders don't stop getting loans from them.
---Darlene_1 on 6/16/09


You have a right to buy products from wheresoever you wish, as long as justice is not being violated.

I myself am afraid of Chinese products because it seems like they're trying to poison us all.
---Cluny on 6/16/09


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You have a right to buy products from wheresoever you wish, as long as justice is not being violated.

I myself am afraid of Chinese products because it seems like they're trying to poison us all.
---Cluny on 6/16/09


What's wrong with a Chinese person having a job and being able to feed his family?

Protectionism never helped anybody. Free markets bring prosperity.

If you want people to buy an American product rather than the Chinese product, then the Americans should figure out a way to create a product that is of greater value to the consumer.
---ralph7477 on 6/16/09


I too do not like to buy things from china but I don't think your feelings are wrong.You are right about the way you feel. but it is real hard to find things made in the USA.And they can cost you quite a bit more.
robin
---robin_durfey on 6/16/09


It is true that if China's standard of living increases, ours will decrease.

But, on the other hand, we still have the highest standard of living in the world.

I have some degree of compassion on those in other countries who have suffered materially. I think we should at least give them some work. Share the wealth is a valid economic principle too.

Then too, we need to realize there are many Christians in China. Some say more than the number in the U.S. It is somewhat selfish to be concerned only with ourselves if it brings suffering to them.
---obewan on 6/16/09


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No if it hurts your consciouce dont buy it .It is better to go to the store and buy something with a clear conscience.
---michael on 6/16/09


Your thoughts are not wrong, just several years late. We should have all protested these foreign-made things by not buying them years ago. The problem is that so much stuff made in the USA cost more than that made overseas because in China and elsewhere the payscale is just a few dollars a month compared to a few dollars a day here.
---SusieB on 6/16/09


No, they're not. God expects everybody to have some sense. I don't like it either. This country should not make itself dependent on other countries for our supplies, especially food. If we get too dependent on other countries for what we need, they can one day pull the rug out from under us and laugh. As for jobs, we need to make sure people of our own nation have plenty of ways to earn a living. It has been so stupid of those who took away jobs from this country and gave them to some who could become our enemies. But it's all a part of the Illuminati plan.
---Betty on 6/16/09


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