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Speeding To Church Sinful

I sometimes drive faster than the "speed limit" so that I get to church on time. Is it a sin to disobey the driving rules "just a bit"?

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 ---Augie on 6/22/09
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The issue of conscience rests here Ro 13:5 I find it easier to break the next seemingly petty law that comes along, and then a confederate mindset begins to take over, and communion with our Redeemer is interrupted. I don't really care for that, so I stay away from breaking traffic laws as much as possible.
---Phil on 7/8/12


Micha, very good points. I'm not a legalist that checks every single thing and to make sure everyone is perfect in the way they live as a Christian. Because all sin and come short of the glory of God, and also know that no circumstance is the same. But that does not change the command of God. That remains no matter our circumstances. I don't believe there is one person who drives that has not gone over the speed limit. Some even drive too slow. My point is that the command of God does not change. So thank you very much for your impute, it was very well done.
---Mark_V. on 6/19/12


There are legalists...you must follow the laws...
There are rebelers...the laws are only there to be broken...
This applies whether the laws be from God or man..
How do we not be legalists nor rebelers?
Ask the question: Is what I'm doing honoring or displeasing God?
But first we must know the mind of God, what God intends for us.
So, let us ask: Does speeding (breaking the posted speeding limit) honor God or displease Him?
Not to be a legalist nor a rebeler, the answer must lie in circumstance.
Therefore, unless breaking the laws is more honoring to God than keeping them, there is no reason not to keep the them i.e. speed limits.
Keep in mind whether the laws apply...posted on highway is defferent than posted in city.
---micha9344 on 6/18/12


MarkV, again, I never support disobedience to God. Disobedience to man and disobedience to God is NOT the same thing. Anyone could set themselves up as an authority and call themselves the government, and it doesn't mean God expects us to obey everything they say. If I get a bunch of friends with guns and take over my town and start calling myself the new government, would the townsfolk then be required to obey me? Many people live in countries where it is unclear who the real government is. In many countries, there are two or three different entities claiming to be the government. What about the people during the American revolution. Was it a sin to disobey King George or the colonial government? Even federal and state laws disagree.
---Jed on 6/17/12


Jed, you argued for a long time against the commands of God. Here it is:

"Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God"

Now, how much clearer can that be? They are appointed by God. He wants us to be subject to the authorities, He God appointed them, yet you don't like that law. There is only one exception to this command: when obedience to civil authority would require disobedience to God's Word (Ex. 1:17: Dan 3:16-18: 6:7,10).
---Mark_V. on 6/15/12




MarkV, I never argued that it is okay to break God's laws. I have never argued for that. This entire discussion was about man's laws, not God's. You seem not to be able to grasp the fact that there is a difference between the two. Or the fact that not all man's laws are of God. In fact, most of them are not of God. This discussion was about speeding, which is a man-made law, not a God-made law. You said that any disobedience to government is a sin, even if God told you to do it. Then you turned around and said that the Holy Spirit may tell someone to do something that is against the law, and it would still be a sin, but God will forgive it. Now you are saying you did not say that.
---Jed on 6/14/12


Jed, you argue for nothing. I never said the Holy Spirit tempts anyone to sin. Just nonsense. I thought you wanted to discuss the laws of God. You have your own laws, you argue you can break them then turn around and argue on another blog you cannot disobey God. You should have just said from the beginning,

"There are some laws that I feel are against the Word of God and invade freedom. I am oposed to following those laws." And that would have been it, what you feel not what is Truth.

That would have been great, but you argued saying it was ok to break the laws of God. If that is how you feel, great. No one can change what you feel. But it is not true that it's ok to break the commandments of God.
---Mark_V. on 6/14/12


Linda, you sound exactly like Kathr. It is too bad that others follow your example. You must be her twin, or the same person.
---Mark_V. on 6/14/12


In the cases of Abraham's lie, Rahab's hiding of the spies, David's adultery and subsequent murder, Noah's drunkenness, etc., the focus should not be so much on their sin as it is on the covenant God made with them that superceded their sin. That is good news for those who lived before the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ and even greater news for those of us after His passion.
---blogger8980 on 6/14/12


You wont find it, Jed. Because its not in there! God doesnt tempt us to sin. Anyone who believes that is a reprobate!

(James 1:13)
Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man
---LindaH on 6/14/12




MarkV, it just doesn't seem right to me that the Holy Spirit would tell someone to sin. I don't find that anywhere in scriptures. I guess we'll just have to disagree. There are some laws that I feel are against the Word of God and invade freedom. I am oposed to following those laws.
---Jed on 6/14/12


Jed, breaking of the law is sin no matter how you see it. That does not mean that if your conscience tells you to help the Jews, you cannot. Believers who are indwelled by the Spirit follow their conscience, for the Spirit speaks to the Conscience. There is always forgiveness when we confess our sins. Yet sin never stops been sin when we break the law. You also said,
So do you think it's a sin to put money in a parking meeter that is about to expire so someone won't get a ticket? Because that's against the law too."
It is sin also, you are breaking the law. And if the guy who is suppose to pay the meter is not there he too is breaking the law. Does your good deed, change the law of God? No. Why not just follow the laws?
---Mark_V. on 6/13/12


Jed, I never said God gave faith so that they could sin. Please stop twisting my words. Ahab committed sin by lying. God does not condone sin. He commended her for her faith in the Lord of heaven and earth (v. 11,12). And for Him she lied to protect those men. Lying is still a sin. It never changes. What she did for the cause of God and her family was great. If you want to believe something else go for it. If you want to sin, go ahead. Do what is in your heart. Don't blame God or me for your sin. Go ahead and pay everyone meter. Do as you like.
---Mark_V. on 6/13/12


Wow. Someone doesnt like the Jews very much. That would certainly explain the hostility towards Kathr.
---LindaH on 6/13/12


Not surprising since he believes that people who live in unbelief are doing Gods will as well.

This man needs prayer.
---CraigA on 6/13/12


MarkV, So God gives people the faith to sin? Umm, Okay. You just said that sin is rebellion against God, yet Rahab was obedient to God by disobeying the king of Jericho, and you called that a sin. If it is always a sin to disobey the government, then Shadrach Meshach and Abednego were sinning when they refused to bow down before the idol as their king had commanded them, is that right? But the Bible makes it appears as though God honored them for this action after saving them from the furnace. Does God honor sin?
---Jed on 6/13/12


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Wow MarkV, you're the first person that I've ever had tell me that God would have wanted us to obey Hitler and help exterminate the Jews. So if the president says that we are to bown down and worship him, it would be a sin not to do that as well I guess.
---Jed on 6/13/12


Jed, of course it is a sin. Did you not read the word of God? I gave it to you. Why do you want to make exceptions of the rules? It is as much a sin as the one Rahab committed. She lied in (v. 5,6). Lying is sin, for God cannot lie (Titus 1:2). God doesn't condone sin for good reasons. Sin is rebellion against God. Again, God commended her faith, not her lie. For none is without some sin, thus the need for forgiveness. But God honors true faith, no matter how small it is, because it imparts saving grace (Ex. 14:7).
---Mark_V. on 6/13/12


MarkV, a simple yes or no will suffice. I'm asking if it was a sin to resist Hitler and save the Jews since he was the government at the time. My argument is not whether God allowed Hitler to be in power or existence. Obviously God allowed it. My argument is that breaking man's laws in not necissarily a sin. So again, was it a sin to save Jews, or even just not report the Jews that you know about?
---Jed on 6/12/12


Jed, why do you not understand? God gives life and God takes it. Without Him you can do nothing. Hitler was on the scene in his appointed time, and left at his appointed time. Everyone does. God did not make Hitler murder anyone. You want to blame God for bringing him to life. Did God know he would murder so many? Of course, He is Omniscient, knowing all. yet still gave him life. Did God know Satan would sin before He created him? Of course. He didn't make him sin, but knew he would. Speaking of Jehovah, "Who saith of Cyrus (the heathen king of Persia), he is my shepherd, and shall perform all my pleasure, even saying of Jerusalem, She shall be built, and of the temple, your foundation shall be laid" (Is. 44:28).
---Mark_V. on 6/12/12


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MarkV, your still dancing around my questions. Did God appoint Hitler? Was it a sin to resist the mass extermination of humans? Did God condone slavery? Has God authorized the Iranian government to ban all forms of Christianity and legalize wife-beating? Would it be a sin to oppose these things?
---Jed on 6/11/12


Jed, I gave you what God commanded believers concerning govermental laws. We are to honor them. If God didn't want to command us to do that He would not have said it.
"Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God" You break the authorities law, you sin against God since He appointed them. Compare it to what you go in life, and you do what you want. But it does not change the Word of God. Of course there in area's like the one I mentioned concerning Ahab, God commanded her for her faith, not for her sin. Maybe He will command you for feeding the meters, but He will not condone sin.
---Mark_V. on 6/11/12


MarkV, I fully agree that disobedience to God is sin, I'm not arguing with that. What you said is that disobedience to man's law is sin. That is what I am arguing with. You still didn't answer about weather it is a sin to feed parking meters or help slaves? Because you know yourself that there is a difference between man's law and God's law.
---Jed on 6/10/12


Jed, you are been rediculous, it is not my reasoning you have a problem with, it's God's Word and His reasons. You don't like what He ask of us. It is clear. Disobedience to God is sin. You mentioned those cases as if to say, I am wrong, but what you really mean is that God is wrong.

Look, remember Rahab in (Joshua 2:7)? She hid the two spy's. When ask, she lied. Lying is sin (Ex.20:16). God commended her faith (Heb. 11:31), James 2:25) as expressed in (v.9-16) God never condones sin, yet none are without some sin (Rom. 3:23) thus the need for forgiveness. But God honors true faith, small as it is, and imparts saving grace (Ex. 34:7).
---Mark_V. on 6/10/12


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StrongAxe, I agree 100%. I don't think the original question was about going 90 in a 55 zone. I think they were talking about the regular speeding of 5 or 10 mph that most of us do when we're running late, not really enough to increase danger. Most of the people on here who said it is a sin to speed probably would say it is not a sin to eat while driving, although eating while driving is much more dangerous than speeding.

MarkV, by your reasoning, those who helped Jews excape during the holocaust and black slaves excape before the Civil War were also sinning, because that was illegal at the time.
---Jed on 6/9/12


Jed:

Right. Everyone who drives knows there's a certain risk involved, and they accept that risk.

Speeding a few miles above the limit has a low impact on risk, but reckless speeding (like 90 in a 55 zone) can be very dangerous, at least with other cars around, as can doing other attention-intensive activies like texting, listening to very loud music, puttint on makeup, etc. I once saw someone texting at 60 miles an hour ON A MOTORCYLE. That was an accident waiting to happen.

The parking meter thing is just stupid (the law, not you). Years ago I heard about a woman in Cleveland who was arrested for doing that. There's another story from Eugene, Oregon, although apparently it's fine in Chicago. It varies from place to place.
---StrongAxe on 6/9/12


Jed, don't you realize what is sin? Disobedience. We are instructed as God's children to submit ourselves to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. (Romans 13:1-7). We are told those are the ordinances of God and not to bring judgment on ourselves. We are also told,
"Therefore you must be subject, not only because of wrath, but also for conscience sake" (v.5) and he also tells us,
"Render therefore to all all their due: taxes to whom taxes are due, customs to whome customs, fear to whom fear, honor to whom honor" (v.7). Any breaking of this is sin against God.
---Mark_V. on 6/9/12


MarkV, I was not talking about the ones who said it was a sin because it is breaking the law. I was talking about the people who said it is a sin specifically because you could kill someone. All I'm saying is I think alot of people forget that everytime you get into a car you may very well be killed, and speed has very little effect upon that. Many of our routine day to day actions have the potential to kill or harm someone.

So do you think it's a sin to put money in a parking meeter that is about to expire so someone won't get a ticket? Because that's against the law too.
---Jed on 6/8/12


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Jed:

Two related, but separate, issues:

1) Driving at at reasonable speed, because that's the right thing to do, and is likely to be the least risky

2) Obeying laws

Ideally, laws should be enacted to promote safety, but that is not always the case. In the 80s, under Carter, an oil crisis caused the federal government to lower all maximum speed limits to 55 - not for safety, but to save energy. Also, if you're driving in a fog, it's legal but foolish to drive down the highway at 55.

Who knows? If we eventually have computer-driven cars capable to responding to situations faster and more reliably than human drivers, we may see higher speed limits in future, but that would be because driving dynamics would change.
---StrongAxe on 6/8/12


Jed, I don't want to pick a fight with you, but you made a mockery of the answers concerning driving too fast or too slow. It is sin that we break the law Jed. That is what we are talking about. You don't break the law getting out of bed, or killing someone accidently on the job. Whats' up with that? The breaking of the law is sin. Of course taking someone's life is sin, but that is not the point. Driving fast is breaking the law. God wants us to abide by the goverment laws.
---Mark_V. on 6/8/12


I have heard people say driving fast is a sin because it could get you or someone else killed. Yes, that's true. Also, driving at or below the speed limit can get you or someone else killed. In fact, driving at all can get someone killed. Getting out of bed can get someone killed, is that a sin? You could accidentally kill someone while on the job, is it a sin to work? 30 years ago 55 was considered fast and was the speed limit in most states, now that is considered slow. So is 65 any less likely to kill you now than it was back then? 30 years from now the speed limit may be 100.
---Jed on 6/7/12


shira4368:

I don't know your father, and I don't know the circumstances, so I'm not in a position to make any judgments. I'd also be a hypocrite if I condemned anyone for speeding, as I am not completely innocent in that regard (and I suspect most people aren't either).

I was just pointing out why a police officer might not find that particular excuse compelling.
---StrongAxe on 6/6/12


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Shira, I agree with your answer. I also agree with almost everyone's answer. Each had something good. One thing I noticed, that many become very legalistic. Everything to them is sin. We are told in Scripture, anything without faith is sin. So they are right. But that's talking about the high standard God ask of us. We always fall short of the glory of God. He knows already we do. Driving fast is a sin, and can get us killed or others. I was stopped 25 years ago. I was heading to a Bible store. When asked where I was heading, I told the Truth, He said, "sure you were." I was telling the truth, not to get out of the ticket but he asked me where I was heading to. Just about everyone drives faster then the limit at one time or another.
---Mark_V. on 6/6/12


strongax, my dad didn't even realize he was speeding and he wasn't going much over speed limit. I was just having a little fun so please don't take things so seriously. my dad paid his ticket and went on about his business. to be frank, everyone speeds...no I take that back...I have been behind some drivers who were so slow they were interuping the flow of traffic. now, that is what I call sin.
---shira4368 on 6/5/12


shira4368:

Breaking the law in order to get to a place that teaches righteousness and obedience to lawful authority epitomizes hypocrisy, which may be why the police officer may not have been impressed. How seriously would you believe excuses of "I only robbed the store so I could donate the money to the mission fund", or "I am having an affair with my girlfriend instead of marrying her after divorcing my current wife - because my church say divorce is wrong", or "I covered up the pastor's crimes to preserve God's reputation"? These are all examples of exactly the same kind of thinking. This is also what lost Saul his kingdom - he tried to help God along, instead of actually doing what God asked him to do.
---StrongAxe on 6/5/12


Yes, Shira, I agree.
---Jed on 6/5/12


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jed, one of our problems is taking little things and blowing it out proportion. If we would use just a little common sense, we would see a change on these blogs. The little things don't matter, its the fundamentals of a Christian. To be a christian, we must be born again..
---shira4368 on 6/5/12


Yeah, we know that everything the gonvernment tells us to do is completely biblical and should be followed. Did you know it's also illegal to put money in someone else's parking meter? I guess being a good neighbor and giving money to someone is a sin? That one would probably send you straight to hell.
---Jed on 6/5/12


well, I would say at least he is going to church. my dad got stopped for speeding and the officer ask him if he was in a hurry and where was he going and he said "to church"...then the officer said "yea, right" and gave him a ticket. at least he wasn't going to some bar getting drunk and beating his wife. this thread could get a little stupid.
---shira4368 on 6/4/12


My dear old mother alway reminds me:

1Pe2:13 Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme,
1Pe2:14 Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers, and for the praise of them that do well.
---trey on 6/2/12


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I agree the most with Eloy, I think he puts this best indeed :) Good job Eloy. :)
---Mary on 6/1/12


Not only is it a sin, but it is illegal. If you get stopped by a policeman, you may not make it to church, and if you have an accident you could get hurt or hurt someone else, or even die or kill someone. Don't speed, it is better to be safe than to be sorry. Try starting out earlier for church, then you can drive peacefully to church.
---Eloy on 5/30/12


"...but if a person goes about telling folks speeding is a sin or tearing the tag off of a pillow is a sin then he/she is preaching bondage."

Bondage is to speak where God has not spoken. On this particular subject, God HAS spoken (Romans 13:1-7, 1 Peter 2:13-17 and Acts 5:29).

The difference between "ripping the tag off your pillow" and speeding is which of these laws is upheld (and more importantly, who are they directed at) by the government which you are living under? In the USA the "pillow label warning" is aimed at manufacturers and retailers. Once a consumer buys a pillow or mattress, you may remove the label (this may void your return policy/warranty if there is one!)
---BonitaBananas on 5/30/12


According to scripture, Romans 13:1-7 and 1 Peter 2:13-17 (Acts 5:29) cover this and all other civil laws of man. If you break a law of man (appointed by God Himself) you are indeed breaking a law of God, therefore sinning.

The point of speeding is the point that you exceed the posted speed limit. Toleration by "law enforcement officers" has nothing to do with breaking the law but has everything to do with getting caught. If spitting your gum on the street is against civil law, that too would be sinful. The same goes for tax evasion!

As has been stated before, the end does not justify the means. God will not overlook "small sins" as long as you avoid the "big sins".
---BonitaBananas on 5/30/12


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Yes, it is a sin to disobey the laws of the land (including the speed limits). The Bible says to obey the laws of the land. If you want to get to church on time, wake up earlier, get ready earlier, and leave earlier. This may not be what you want to hear, but it will help you in the end.
---Leslie on 6/27/09


What about a positive Christian witness, is it being effected by your speeding? Are there children, or friends in the car that use you as an example of what a Christian should be? There attitude might become, "if he can do it, so can I". What if you are stopped by a law officer, and you give him the excuse that you needed to get to the church on time, what kind of witness is that. While most states will give you a grace limit, concerning speed, it would be better if you would just get to church on time. It is a sin! Granted, God will forgive you, but will those around you also forgive, and how is it effecting your witness to those around you?
---wivv on 6/24/09


obewan:

What I have experienced in several places where I have lived was that 5 over the limit on city streets (and 10 on highways) was routinely tolerated, and the cutoff points seemed to be 10 city and 15 highway (Going 34 in a 25 zone or 69 in a 55 zone was fine, but going 36 or 71 respectively would get you at ticket).
---StrongAxe on 6/24/09


Trish9863, read the context. He isn't talking about sin, but obedience to those in charge over you. It's referring to submission.

On another note, not talking about you or anyone on this site, but if a person goes about telling folks speeding is a sin or tearing the tag off of a pillow is a sin then he/she is preaching bondage.
---Rickey on 6/24/09


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Speeding is breaking the local law by exceeding the posted speed limit. The grace that law enforcement gives you of 5 or so mph is just that, grace from a crime committed. Also, an individual officer might grant you more grace above that in the form of a verbal or written warning. Grace cannot be given but when the law is broken. I don't believe exercising your christian liberty in this case applies as not speeding would be a better example to others and would set you apart from the world.
Rom 5:20, Rom 13:1-2, John 12:25, 1John 3:13, 1Thes 5:22, 1John 2:15, 1Pet 2:9
---MIchael on 6/24/09


Speeding to get to church on time.
Gunning down abortionists.
Cheating on your taxes to be able to afford to pay your tithes.

What do all of these things have in common? Justifying bad actions because they are done in the name of some good end.
---StrongAxe on 6/24/09


Hi, Augie . . . now you are exposing yourself to the *world*, here, by posting this. Of course, you didn't say you actually have done or would do such a thingy. That could get you a stingy. I think of how if you are speeding, this can mean you are not able to control yourselves to get ready in good time...maybe because you are speeding around in things that keep you from having control for doing things right and on time. So, your "need to speed" could be because of another problem, deeper. And as the law of Moses is used to expose sin, so might the law of the land be useful for exposing how we need to be better with patience and timing and wisdom for knowing what we should be doing and doing it right.
---Bill_bila5659 on 6/23/09


What defines speeding? The conventional enforcement is that 5 mph over is allowed.

I have never lived anywhere where that grace was not afforded.

Here in town, I routinely see patrol cars going 5 or 10 over. They know I am 5 over and never stop me for it. In fact, most of the traffic flow goes 5 over, so if I go with the flow, I end up 5 over. And, if I don't, the people behind me get upset.
---obewan on 6/23/09


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Rickey: Please explain how the following verse does not apply to this matter.

Romans 13

Submission to the Authorities

1Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.
---Trish9863 on 6/23/09


No. No one can even show that according to scripture. It's not a sin to "speed".
On another note, you will reap what you sow. If you speed and get a speeding ticket it wasn't God Who gave the ticket...it's just the police or highway patrol doing their job.

If it is a sin then spitting out your gum on the ground is a sin.
---Rickey on 6/23/09


\\She smiled as she told the church that that was God's way of getting her husband to SLOW DOWN after her years-and-years of pleading failed to do anything.\\

And she actually thinks that God left her husband lame in response to her nagging?
---Cluny on 6/22/09


A few years back, my wife and I rode with a Christian Motorcycle Club (Revelation Riders) Every time we set out to rendezvous somewhere,all we saw was their tail lights going over the hill. We stayed within the posted speeds, seems they couldn't resist the temptation to speed.
We quit riding with them over this issue!
---1st_cliff on 6/22/09


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Yes. What horrible thing would happen if you were "just a bit" late for church? Do you think THAT would be a sin? How about, next time, getting started "just a bit" earlier.
---Donna66 on 6/22/09


We are expected to obey the laws of the land in which we live. So, disobeying driving laws would be just as sinful as breaking any other law.
---Trish9863 on 6/22/09


Yes, it is a sin to drive faster than you should. And there is "no such thing" as "just a bit" as far as sinning goes. Either you ARE, or you ARE NOT, sinning.

I think that it is very silly how some church people justify their unlawful driving behavior. Too many "incidents" to list on this blog.

Interestingly, one lady at my church told about how her husband was "speeding", crashed, and was left a quadriplegic. She smiled as she told the church that that was God's way of getting her husband to SLOW DOWN after her years-and-years of pleading failed to do anything.
---Sag on 6/22/09


"The end does not justify the means"
---alan8566_of_uk on 6/22/09


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