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Rapture Theory Biblical

Is the Rapture Theory Biblical?

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exzucuh, no, what has happened is I have not given you any Scripture reference that you accept. There are many examples of raptures in the Bible, from Elijah to the two witness in the Revelation. You have rejected them all.
Now the poor ol' democrats are to blame according to you.
You may be right though, you don't have enough straws yet. We see you are still grasping for them.
You focus on the fact that there is no such word in the Bible as Rapture. You fall to see the many examples of it though. Thank God your belief is not the standard but the Word given for our schoolmaster is.
---Elder on 7/6/09


1 Thess. 4:15, is talking again about the Second Coming of Christ. Again the word "coming" is in reference to "Parousia" which again is connected to the Second Coming of Christ, as apokalupsis, and epiphaneia, found not only here in this passage but also James 5:7,8, 2Peter 3:4, 1John 2:28. The parousia corresponds with apokalupsis of the Son of Man, Matt. 24:27,37,39. and not a Rapture.
What we do know is by the verses that follow is that this Coming of Christ v. 16, "For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God" It will be so loud everyone will know His here.
---MarkV. on 7/6/09


***Why don't you answer the questions to those who are writing about the Rapture since you seem to know so much.
1. I did'nt mention restoring the kingdom***

MarkV, I did. my fist comment was to Elder.

I know you didn't mention retoring the kingdom..and this is what Matt 24 is about.

I guess because you seemed to know the difference between Grace and Law, I thought you also knew the difference between Grace and Kingdom Law a well. When you KNOW Grace, you KNOW what isn't Grace.

The Gospel of GRACE is different than the Gospel of the Kingdom. These two Blogs ( The Mystery)go hand in hand!
Please cross reference!
---kathr4453 on 7/5/09


Straws? You do not have any Bible scriptures that prove your rapture theory. you have
only backed what you believe with the same methods of the devil and democrats. You use your own words and twisting of my words to try to discredit Me. I could care less? I am not the one who will suffer by your false doctrine.
You and the ones that you mislead will. You rapturist believe that it is your salvation, The works of the Son of God is the only salvation and you have to obey the Gospel and endure to the end to be saved. Jesus is the Ark of salvation, not the rapture. You are not trusting in Jesus but his return an event in time.
---exzucuh on 7/5/09


When Jesus returns the bible says that the dead in Christ and those who are alive at that time will both be changed into glorified bodies
and finally be made like Jesus. It also says that heaven will marry the earth and be one.
The earth was made for man to dwell upon it is the world that will be burned up. The world is not the earth, It is the system by which man and the devil has manipulated into their carnal scheme. The Fire of the Holy Ghost is what burns the world up. I dwell in the fire,I am a minister of Fire, My baptism of fire burned the world out of me. Christians today want the baptism of the Holy Ghost but reject the fire and therefore cannot have power because they remain OF the world.
---exzucuh on 7/5/09




"You can keep someone without a rapture!"
exzucuh
You? You who?....
Can you keep a family from a flood without the use of an Ark?
Humm.... why didn't God think of that then?
Exzucuh you have grabbed enough straws to build you a house.
---Elder on 7/4/09


\\
Denominational "churches" (each having their own traditions, ways of living, and interpretations of the bible) are a product of Satan - the father of confusion.\\

That means all Protestant churches, including so-called "non-denominational" ones.

They might be a "denomination" of just one congregation, but more likely they will be seen to fit nicely into one of the 30,000 or so already existing ones.
---Cluny on 7/4/09


MarkV: Good for you! If more people would study the origins of their beliefs, there would be greater unanimity among Christians. There was a time when virtually all protestant denominations were close in their biblical understanding.
---jerry6593 on 7/4/09


Mark_Eaton: "What is wrong with demoninational "churches"? "

Denominational "churches" (each having their own traditions, ways of living, and interpretations of the bible) are a product of Satan - the father of confusion. A newly born christian would be confused when deciding to join a denomination. Christians among denomination bicker saying, "Our church is better," "We have a better pastor," "Our church has better entertainment," "We have ten thousand people at our church." And the list goes on. Christians even bicker within denominations.

If all the christians are the same, why won't a Catholic priest preside over a Protestant congregation?
---Steveng on 7/3/09


In the end times the churches are completely fallen away, why would anyone want to go and be taught a lot of evolutionary lies and left wing propaganda? And even if you could put up with it silently, they would not make you welcome unless you proved yourself part of their new world order.
---frances008 on 7/3/09




Jerry, your so right. I just finished reading about the Council of Trent, where papal leaders and Jesuits brainstormed about how to counteract Protestantism and bring defectors who had left the church, and to remove the stigma of the Antichrist away from the Papal rule. Behind close doors they decided it was going to be done, not only through the Inquisition and torture, but also through theology. The theology was to be reinterpreting the prophecies about "the man of sin," "the little horn," and "the beast." Two Spanish Jesuits took the challenge, Luis de Alcasar, of Seville and Francisco Ribera of Salamanca. the strategy was, one of reapplication, one to the preterist view, the other to the futuristic view.
---MarkV. on 7/3/09


Steveng:

What is wrong with demoninational "churches"? Do you attend a church or do you "wing" it on your own?

I see nothing wrong with discussing the Rapture. In fact, at the end of the discussion of the Rapture in 1 Thes 4, Paul writes "comfort each other with these words". Is that not encouragement, building up of one another?

What you talk about, this "real" discussion, is not possible online. I have to inspect your life, up-close and personal, to see how to encourage you, how to exhort you, how to kick you in the seat when you need it. I cannot carry your burden if I do not know you.
---Mark_Eaton on 7/3/09


No. The Secret Rapture Theory has its origin in the counter reformation futurism theology of Francisco Ribera, a Jesuit Catholic Priest. This theory, that the last week of Daniel's 70 week prophecy was moved to the future, was concocted to take the heat off the Pope, whom all protestants at that time considered to be the antichrist. One can trace this fable from Ribera to Lacunza to Irving to Darby to Scofield to Moody and then to the Assemblies of God and the pentacostal movement in general. Look it up for yourself.
---jerry6593 on 7/3/09


Kathr, I hate to go back and forth with you because you seem to create something not there and make a mountain of it.
If you had been reading the thread Mike had just posted Matt. 24:1.2.3 and others. And He did not correctly put the passage down concerning Matt. 24. What I did was put it down and explained it. If you saw him put his down, why didn't you come and ask him what you ask me? It is because you want to continue to argue with me. Why don't you answer the questions to those who are writing about the Rapture since you seem to know so much.
1. I did'nt mention restoring the kingdom
2. I did'nt mention church reinging
3. I didn't mention the mystery of the kingdom.
4. I didn't mention anything about rewards
---MarkV. on 7/2/09


MarkV:

NOW HEAR THIS:

This thread is ABOUT the Rapture!!!



I'm completely aware you have not made any comments concerning the Rapture. Why would you use scripture concerning the Kingdom to be restored to Israel to prove there is no rapture????? Nonsense!

MarkV, when Jesus comes to restore the Kingdom to Israel He will be doing that on earth...for 1000 years. Not somewhere in the ozone!

WE His Body..the Church will reign and rule with Him at that time....here!

THIS IS the HOPE of our calling Mark!!! Again more of the Mystery you can't see, because you are in the wrong Kingdom!

Part of the REWARDS WE are to receive will be for this particular time....
---kathr4453 on 7/2/09


Davida, discussing Scripture among brothers and sisters is always right. What I did was put down the passages in Matthew 24 and went through some of them as space would allow. I didn't mention Rapture on purpose. I figured that by going through the passages at a time would reveal what God's meaning was. No attemp by me to argue with anyone, who believes one way or another. But when you go through each passage the Truth is found.
There are those who don't even care to meet among other brothers and sisters and that is why they hate churches. It should be a joy and a pleasure to meet with others and discuss things of God with each other.
---MarkV. on 7/2/09


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The rapture is announced with the blast of a trumpet. Not secretly. The elect are taken to be with God. The nations are then judged by Jesus.
---frances008 on 7/1/09


It's apparent that there are many debatable theories regarding the rapture as evidenced by the many contrary posts.

Keep christianity simple. Obey the two commandments Jesus spoke of. Christians have enough to do just living in the present than to debate a senseless debate. Do an online KJV bible search for "one another, "each other," and "encourag" because living a christian life is a 24/7 lifestyle - not a once a week pep talk dished out by denominational "churches,"
---Steveng on 7/1/09


Kathr, If you were in a class room and didn't hear correctly you would not jump up and yell. You would listen, and compare what he said to Scripture. Maybe say, "Can you repeat that?"
"Now hear this:"
1. I never mentioned any Rapture, go back and check.
2. Jesus was speaking. All I did was interpret Matthew 24:3 We are talking about the Second Coming of Christ. I gave the word "Coming" meaning "Parousia" which is found in v. 3. because the question was, "Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately , saying, Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of "Your Coming" and of the end of the age?"
---MarkV. on 7/1/09


I'd like to put my voice behind what Parisee and StevenQ and few other have already spoken about the relevancy of this topic to our daily lives. This is just one of many topics that you will find it very hard to get fruit from in your daily lives especially if you are one that is convinced that you will take part in this. If it gives you strength to stand and keep fighting, good. Just be careful that you don't find yourself jumping on topics like this to fuel your human propensity for discord and arrogance, pride and the like. Whatever part we have in Jesus, know that it is of his choosing, rest in that and keep up the good work, letting go of your worldly cares and fears and continuing to stand.
---DavidA on 7/1/09


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He even mentions some will promote a secret coming and will say, "behold he is in a secret chambers," believe it not." verse 26. Because the Second Coming of Christ will be known by everyone. It will not be secret.
Hope that helps
---MarkV. on 7/1/09

WOW MarkV, if that isn't taking liberty with scripture.

Matthew 24:26
Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert, go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers, believe it not.

This verse has nothing whatsoever to do with the Rapture of the church. AND since we are not here.....no one can go to any secret chamber to find Him.

We are not being taken to some secret chamber anyway!

---kathr4453 on 7/1/09


Continued from Matthew 24 we find that Jesus gives the first warning and not to be deceived, "False Christ and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to decieve, if possible, even the elect." Meaning that satan's deceitfullness will become so powerful. He even mentions some will promote a secret coming and will say, "behold he is in a secret chambers," believe it not." verse 26. Because the Second Coming of Christ will be known by everyone. It will not be secret.
Hope that helps
---MarkV. on 7/1/09


It seems most here do not believe the secret rapture. GOOD.
---Samuel on 7/1/09


He does that by removing the Bride/Church out before it starts.
---Elder on 6/30/09

Exactly Elder!!! The GREAT TRIBULATION is the Wrath of God coming. The Church/His BODY are SAVED from that wrath to come. We do not have to endure to the end TO BE SAVED...we ARE saved. Why shoud a Rapture bother professing Christians?

We are also going to meet the Lord in the CLOUDS...we're going UP!!!!!

The 2nd coming Matt 25 and Zech 12-14 is not the Rapture of the Church... Here teh RISEN Jesus is coming down, and will stand upon the Mount of Olives!

You will also see in Zech 12-14 the SAINTS ARE WITH Christ at the 2nd coming. Jude Also states this as well as Rev..He is COMING WITH IS SAINTS.

We're the Saints folks!
---kathr4453 on 7/1/09


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Matthew 24:3
"Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, 'Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your Coming, and of the end of the age?"
Here the word "coming" refers to the word "Parousia" which comes from the word "Paron" here Parousia is connected to the Second Coming of Christ. So the question is, about the Second Coming of Christ and the end of the age. Does that help?
1 Thess.4:15-17 Also refers to the word "Parousia" The Parousia corresponds with the "apokalupsis of the Son of Man" Matt. 24:27,37,39. Of Christ 1 Cr. 15:23, of our Lord 1 Thess. 3:13, 5:23.
---MarkV. on 7/1/09


In Matt 24:1-2, Jesus tells of the destruction of the temple. The disciples then ask two questions in vs. 3: When will this be? and when will be the end? Jesus answers two questions, the first ends with vs 34. Jesus clearly describes signs that are visible, and people will be able to look for them - but also that they will be completed within that generation (vs 34) - which aligns with the destruction of the temple in AD 70. He then speaks of events that will not have signs. The disciples assumed the destruction of the temple would be the end of the world, but Jesus answered with two distinct events. The signs of Matt 24:3-34 have already been fulfilled, or else there would have to be 2000 year old people walking around.
---Mike on 6/30/09


The Old Testament book Exodus is a parallel of the book of Revelations.
The children of Israel were not removed when God poured the plagues out on Egypt, God protected them through each worsening pleague.
When the final plague was poured out on Egypt God had the Children of Israel place the blood on the door posts ansd with a hysop branch... symbolic of the tree that Jesus shed His blood on to be applied to our hearts.
The plagues of Revelation parellel the plagues of Egypt, God id not remove them until after the Tribulations poured out upon Egypt... you will also notice that only poured out His wrath on the Egyptians...
---allan2777 on 6/30/09


Revelation 3:9-10 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie, behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will KEEP thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

You can keep someone without a rapture!
The hour of temptation that Jesus will keep me from is the day we are living in right now, he is keeping me from believing lies that people make up about the bible and political lies that are trying to change morality. I will not compromise I have power by the Holy Ghost.
---exzucuh on 6/30/09


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exzucuh, where or what are you doing/reading that would make your mind think that Jesus was speaking of AD 70? He was asked about His second coming. Have you read that in Matt 24:3 ... What shall be the sign of thy coming and the end of the world? Jesus answered in the following verses.
Did the world end in AD 70? Did or has He returned yet? Has the world ended?
There is a difference between tribulation and the GREAT TRIBULATION.
Read v21.. There shall be great Tribulation as has never been.
Read the Book not some of that stuff you have been.
---Elder on 6/30/09


"With all due respect, Elder, I think that you are not dividing the scripture correctly either. You cannot base a statement on an analysis of one verse."
Jonathna
Thank you for being respectful. Please take note that I don't base my analysis on one verse only. That would be a big mistake for anyone to do on any subject.
I have shown from Gen to the Revelation the examples and promises. For one, Jesus said He would protect the church from the "Hour of Temptation".. IE the Great Tribulation. He does that by removing the Bride/Church out before it starts.
---Elder on 6/30/09


Revelation 19:9 And he said unto me, Write, Blessed are they who are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he said unto me, These are the true sayings of God.

There is only one scripture about the marriage
supper you cannot make a doctrine on one scripture.

Revelation 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

John saw heaven come down to the earth so the marriage supper could be in heaven when it is in the earth. heaven is raptured to the earth . people are caught up to meet heaven as it is coming down.
---exzucuh on 6/30/09


Tracy:

There is nothing secret about the Rapture, except the time.

What you may be referring to is 1 Cor. 15:52 "in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet, for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed".

There will not be much for the world to see. People will suddenly be gone, vanished.

This vanishing may be the secret you are referring to.
---Mark_Eaton on 6/30/09


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What is secret about Christ's coming? It clearly states in multiple places in the Bible (e.g. Rev. 1:7) that "every eye shall see him" when He returns. We will all be "caught up" in the air: the dead in Christ shall arise from their graves first, and those who are still alive shall follow. Where is the "secret rapture" in all that?
---Tracy on 6/29/09


My question would be, how could there be a wedding ceremony in Heaven with part of the bride stuck on earth?! To me, the rapture theory just doesn't make sense. Besides, it says in Thessalonians that the dead will rise first--now why would the dead rise if there were more people left to die? Just my two cents :)
---Mary on 6/29/09


You still err my friend Jesus was not talking about THE great tribulation doctrine you speak of, but great tribulation that came on Jerusalem in 70 AD, what good is prophecy if the people you prophesy to never see it come to pass. He told those weeping for him weep for yourselves and your children. The great tribulation doctrine is another man made mistake in scripture. Just like there will always be wars and rumors of wars there will always be great tribulation, through much tribulation we enter the kingdom of God. As it says in rev. these are those that came out of great tribulation. You rapture people are not willing to lay down your lives for Christ but believe a fable of escapism .
---exzucuh on 6/29/09


a great study is to do a parralel comparison between Matt. 24 and I Thess.4, and it is easy to see that both passages are talking about the same thing. Not two seperate events. In II Thess. Paul says "brethern I would not have you ignorant concerning the coming of our Lord and our gathering to meet him in the air". Notice the order of the events, His coming is listed first and then the gathering of His elect. There is only one article "the" which indicates he is talking about one event and not two seperate events.
---JAYbird on 6/29/09


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With all due respect, Elder, I think that you are not dividing the scripture correctly either. You cannot base a statement on an analysis of one verse.
---Jonathna on 6/29/09


It was said, "Jesus Himself does not say He will come for His people before the "great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be."
This is true. It is because He was NOT asked that question! He was asked, "What shall be the sign of thy coming and the end of the world?" (Matt 24:3)
Matt 24 is not about the Rapture. There are other passages that promise to keep us from that great hour, trouble and judgement during that time. The Great Tribulation is judgement. Why would God allow the Saved to be judged again if they were already judged at Calvary? We must Divide the Scripture properly to see and understand these truths.





---Elder on 6/29/09


Thank you Elder...couldn't have said it better myself.

Due to arguments & folks not studying the bible for him/herself many oppose christianity altogether.
---Rickey on 6/29/09


To me, the best evidence one can point to in support of the rapture theory is 1 Thessalonians 4, particularly verse 17 ("Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air"). Reading this 'literally', so goes the argument, yields the inescapable conclusion that the rapture is fact. However, modern readers of this epistle might miss a second possible interpretation. It has been noted that Paul's words here could refer to an ancient custom in which citizens of a city met prominent visitors prior to arrival to escort them into the city. Paul might be trying to describe, therefore, not a rapture event, but the actual Second Coming of Christ.
---Bobby3 on 6/29/09


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Matthew 22:28-29 Therefore in the resurrection whose wife shall she be of the seven? for they all had her. Jesus answered and said unto them,
You do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.

Every day that passes there is a so called rapture 300,000 people leave this earth and stand before the judgment seat of Christ some saved some lost, just like Jesus said if you will have it John the baptist is Elijah, But Peter saw Elijah in heaven with Jesus on the mount of transfiguration, Did he argue the Jess's interpretation of scripture. No! you cannot make a doctrine from mans interpretation of scripture it is always flawed.There will be a second coming that is Doctrine.
---exzucuh on 6/29/09


exzucuh, my response to your rhetoric is, So? Stop the smoke and mirrors with so much talk.
Tell us when will believers stand the Bema judgement? Where is the marriage supper of the Lamb? Have you noticed that Jesus doesn't come to earth in Thess?
If you can see the Greek word for caught why can't you see the truth of the verse in Thess.
Finally let me ask you where is Jesus coming from in Rev 19:11-16? We don't see the horses, armies or other things in the Thess passage. That should be enough to convince anyone that these are two different events.
---Elder on 6/27/09


No. The Secret Rapture Theory has its origin in the counter reformation futurism theology of Francisco Ribera, a Jesuit Catholic Priest. This theory, that the last week of Daniel's 70 week prophecy was moved to the future, was concocted to take the heat off the Pope, whom all protestants at that time considered to be the antichrist. One can trace this fable from Ribera to Lacunza to Irving to Darby to Scofield to Moody and then to the Assemblies of God and the pentacostal movement in general. Look it up for yourself.
---jerry6593 on 6/27/09


exzucuh: "Elijah and Enoch lived by faith the reason they did not die is because their faith in God could not permit death."

You, like most christians, assume they did not die, but the bible says otherwise.
---Steveng on 6/27/09


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Jesus Himself does not say He will come for His people before the "great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be." (in Matthew 24:21) But He does clearly say what will happen "immediately after the tribulation of those days" > Matthew 24:29-31. So, there is no *direct* Bible teaching of a pre-trib rapture. But the Holy Spirit has given us various clearly stated Bible things, like "saved by grace", "love your neighbor", "Jesus is the Son of God", etc. Jesus says, "be ready" (Matthew 24:44) > we could give more *attention* to what He means by being "ready".
---Bill_bila5659 on 6/27/09


"Is the Rapture Theory Biblical?" No.

The only "rapture", as concerning the LORD's second comings, that any of us will experience, will be the ecstatic joy and delight of the His return to us in His glory.
---joseph on 6/26/09


Your right the second coming is not the rapture
because there will be no rapture. There is only going to be a second coming.

Hebrews 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many, and unto them that look for him shall he appear the SECOND TIME
WITH OUT SIN unto salvation.

If you living in sin and not looking for him to return a second time, but in a rapture that does not exist you are deceived by Antichrist doctrine and be judged a tare.

Titus 3:10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject,Titus 3:11 Knowing that he that is such is perverted, and sins, being condemned of himself.
---exzucuh on 6/27/09


The bible is written in Hebrew/Chaldean and Greek, It was translated from these languages into all other languages, Just because the Catholics translated the Greek word(harpazo) into Latin as rapture does not mean you can make up a lot of nonsense about the second coming of Christ.

harpazo har-pad'-zo
from a derivative of 138, to seize (in various applications):--catch (away, up), pluck,
pull, take (by force).
---exzucuh on 6/26/09


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Matthew 11:12 And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent
take it by (force.) *Harpazo Rapture* This same word is used in this scripture, it was translated into English as force.

If we take the kingdom by Harpazo then those who meet the Lord in the air by Harpazo must be doing it by an act of faith on their part
like Obeying the Gospel.

harpazo har-pad'-zo
to seize :--catch (away, up), pluck,
pull, take (by force)
---exzucuh on 6/26/09


exzucuh, The second coming is not the Rapture. At the rapture Christ doesn't return to earth. He calls His up to him.
"Christian" and "net" in the Bible, Ha, you're funny. The Bible says Judas hanged himself go and do ye likewise. Under your theology we must all go hang ourselves.
Which was the first baby to be named "Exzucuh?" I was not talking a thing but a person.
I didn't say that Enoch or Elijah died. I said they were caught away. Are you saying that they were not?
Exousia/authority means "privilege to exercise power" also. You don't have that privilege. You only have a pen name.
Next I have found those like yourself who say they don't sin are very proud that "they don't."
---Elder on 6/26/09


Noah was caught up in a flood, Jesus was caught up after His resurrection. The two witnesses, in Revelation, will be caught up. So will the Church.

---Elder on 6/26/09

Elder, Noah and his family went nowhere except in a Boat. Jesus was asended to Heaven and the two witness will be assumed to Heaven as was Elijah and Enoch!
---Ruben on 6/26/09


Elijah and Enoch lived by faith the reason they did not die is because their faith in God could not permit death. I find it difficult to even find a christian that will have enough faith to believe they can live for God much less have enough to be translated to heaven.
They argue with me about healing and spiritual gifts say we all have to sin every day, they have no faith in the sacrifice of Jesus or his
resurrection power that should be in our lives.
They refuse to take up their cross, they sell Jesus for worldliness, Jesus is coming for a church that is spotless, without blemish. He said when he returns will he find faith in the earth?
---exzucuh on 6/26/09


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I would like to make it perfectly clear that I believe in the second coming of Christ and that he will return in the manner that he left and every eye will behold him. It is the rapture doctrine that I will not support. It like other man made ideas is not based on truth but a clever imagination and speculation with nothing sound to back it up. It adds to the scripture and takes away. The bible says Jesus is coming to stay not leave and return a third time, It says the tares will be removed first, There is nothing about us waiting seven years for God to pour his wrath on the world, It says he pours out his wrath on the ones that take the mark and spares those that have Jesus wrote in their foreheads.
---exzucuh on 6/26/09


The Word Exzucuh is in the bible it is Greek for authority and Christianet is also in the bible (christian and net)

Mt 10:1
And when he had called unto him his twelve
disciples, he gave them
power= (exousia, english version exzu'c'uh)


exousia ex-oo-see'-ah
from 1832 (in the sense of ability), privilege, i.e. (subjectively) force, capacity,
competency, freedom, or (objectively) mastery (concretely, magistrate,
superhuman, potentate, token of control), delegated influence:--authority,
jurisdiction, liberty, power, right, strength.
---exzucuh on 6/26/09


1 Thessalonians 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.

(Speaking of the dead in Christ)

1 Thessalonians 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

1 Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

1 Thessalonians 4:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

No rapture doctrine here this is about the second coming and seeing our loved ones again.
---exzucuh on 6/26/09


"There is no word rapture in the bible."
exzucuh
Exzucuh, there is no word "Exzucuh" or "ChristiaNet" in the Bible either.
Does that mean CN doesn't exist or is wrong for its ministry?
You and others should research where the word "Rapture" came from. It is a Latin word meaning "to catch up."
Noah was caught up in a flood, Jesus was caught up after His resurrection. The two witnesses, in Revelation, will be caught up. So will the Church.
Because of your and others lack of understanding you say there is no Rapture because the "word" is not in the Bible.
Tell that to Elijah and Enoch.
Your argument is lame bud, just plain lame and Biblically uneducated.
---Elder on 6/26/09


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The rapture theory is not Biblical there is no
word rapture in the bible. Paul was comforting
the church concerning those that had died, and said that they would not be in the ground but with the Lord and would return with him when it was his second coming. On that day we will rise to meet them all in the air and all be glorified at the same time. We will all be forever with the Lord, But in his kingdom he will set upon the earth. The Tares will be gathered and burned and Heaven will come like a bride adorned for her husband, heaven and earth will marry and be one place, the new Jerusalem will be set where the old was but all things will be made new.
---exzucuh on 6/26/09


Does it really effect what you have to do to be in Christ today?

Then why argue about it? This topic is ridiculous.
---Pharisee on 6/26/09


If by RAPTURE we are talking about the secret
rapture. then it is not biblical.

If we are talking about the saints being raptured. meaning lifted up, to meer their Savior in the air when He comes again, we are talking about a biblical event.
---Pierr5358 on 6/26/09


Matthew 13:30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers,
Gather ye together FIRST
the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Psalms 52:5-8 God shall likewise destroy thee for ever, he shall take thee away, and pluck thee out of thy dwelling place, and root thee out of the land of the living. Selah. The righteous also shall see, and fear, and shall laugh at him: Lo, this is the man that made not God his strength, but trusted in the abundance of his riches, and strengthened himself in his wickedness. But I am like a green olive tree in the house of God: I trust in the mercy of God for ever and ever.
---exzucuh on 6/26/09


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This answer by Timothy is very insightful.
"Call it whatever name you wish, the bottom line is that something big is coming and it isn't going to be pleasent for a lot of people."
I believe the second coming of Jesus Christ is made up of two events. First he comes in the clouds to receive believers. And then the second comes visibly to the whole world and touches down in Jerusalem and ends the battle of Armageddon.
The first coming will be the most astounding thing to happen since the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead.
---mima on 6/26/09


The Rapture Theory is biblical if you want to read the theory into the Bible. No one can control how someone interprets scripture.
---eric1968 on 6/25/09


These passages include gathering His elect from the four winds, to be on your guard, be alert, and two men in a field, one is taken one is left. These all describe the suddenness of the Rature, not the triumphant coming with His armies described in Revelation 19.
---Mark_Eaton on 6/25/09

Mark Jesus also said it will be like the days of Noah, if you recall the unrighteous were taken away and Noah family the righteous were left behind!
---Ruben on 6/25/09


People who are concerned about such things are weak christians. They fear that they won't make it through the tribulation. They fear of personally being persecution. They must find an escape from tribulation. Christians will live through the tribulation because this is the most wicked of all generations.

To build your confidence in your faith do an online KJV bible search for "one another," "each other," and "encourag." These will help you to DO the two commandments Jesus spoke of. You'll be so busy living a godly life you don't need to think about such debates as the rapture, the age of the earth, etc.
---Steveng on 6/25/09


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The second coming will be seen by all.And the left behind is NOT in the teachings of Jesus.Those not taken will be "Slayen by His Glory.
---Daniel on 6/25/09


In Revelation 3:10 "Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth.
However there appears to be( from thIS Scripture) a group which will escape these trials. The name of that group?
How about the RAPTURE GROUP!!!
---mima on 6/25/09

But yet nothing about a rapture or "taken up" to heaven. Could be Christ's means this: Father, "I do not ask thee to take them out of the world, but to keep them from the evil one" (John 17:15), and how about this "In the world you have tribulation, but take courage, I have overcome the world" (John 16:33).
---Ruben on 6/25/09


Call it whatever name you wish, the bottom line is that something big is coming and it isn't going to be pleasent for a lot of people. I believe that God has the power to create a "rapture" if he so chooses to do so.
---TIMOTHY on 6/25/09


How many different timings of the rapture are there?
---zach8765 on 6/25/09


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Yes.

In fact, I would suggest that the majority of Scriptures used to show the second coming of Jesus are in fact Scriptures about the Rapture.

Passages in Luke 21, Mark 13, and Matt 24 where Jesus describes the signs of the end of the age and His return describe the Rapture.

These passages include gathering His elect from the four winds, to be on your guard, be alert, and two men in a field, one is taken one is left. These all describe the suddenness of the Rature, not the triumphant coming with His armies described in Revelation 19.
---Mark_Eaton on 6/25/09


I have studied the rapture theory which came from Darby and is upheld by the Scoffield reference Bible. It is based on the 70 weeks not being over and the 70th week being yet future. It also based on Dispensationalism and that Israel is still the chosen people with the promises to them unfulfilled.

Since I follow the Covenant Explaintion of scripture, believe the 70 weeks ended three and one half years after the Crucifiction of JESUS and that the promises were transferred to the Church. I find no biblical basis for a rapture that is not once mentioned in the Bible.
---Samuel on 6/25/09


If you mean a pre-trib, pre-millennial rapture--otherwise known as Darbian dispensationalism, no.
---Cluny on 6/25/09


In Revelation 3:10 we have this Scripture,
"Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth.
From thIS Scripture we can see that all who dwell on the earth are going to be tried. However there appears to be( from thIS Scripture) a group which will escape these trials. The name of that group?
How about the RAPTURE GROUP!!!
---mima on 6/25/09


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Yes it is, everyone agrees on a rapture but the timing is what is in question.
---Pharisee on 6/25/09


Yes the Rapture IS Biblical (1 Thessalonians 4:13-5:11).
---Leslie on 6/25/09


I think the Rapture Theory in misunderstood.
---leonard on 6/25/09


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