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Did Jesus Die For Everyone

Did Jesus die and pay the penalty for those who will not accept him? Another words was his death on the cross substitutionary for all mankind?

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 ---mima on 7/9/09
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Kathr, a year ago you knew nothing about Calvinist teachings MarkV***


MarkV, I was aroung here long before a year ago, long before YOU ever came on CN. See how WRONG you can be on things.

Just where do you get off ASSUMING I know nothing about Calvinism? I'm afraid I know MORE about it that you will ever know or ever know WHY I know.


Donna66, There are different kinds of Calvinists, with different understandings. Spurgeon a Calvinist preached the Gospel. YEA!!!HYPER Calvinism is what I am talking about....MarkV is a Hyper-Calvinist. This kind boycott revivals wearing T Shirts saying NO CHOICE!!! No Joke!!! Their nasty!
---kathr4453 on 7/20/09


Kathr4453 --- How do you account for all the missions and evengelical outreaches of Baptists, Presbyterians, Lutherans and other denominations whose roots are in Calvinism?

They realize that Jesus said: "All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father, neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him" (Matt. 11:27).

Calvinist evangelists do not know who is "predestined", but deliver the salvation message for any that may be! They still must hear and believe the Gospel.

I'm not a Calvinist but I can understand this!
---Donna66 on 7/20/09


The Calvinist says they cannot tell anyone specifically Christ died for their sin, because they dont know who Christ died for. Under this bondage of false truth, Calvinists do not preach the Gospel to the lost.
---kathr4453 on 7/20/09

Kathr, you both are a little confused on the who.
Only those who had the law sinned. Only one people did.
Markv is because he is correct but doesn't know why.

Heb 8:8,Jer 31:31 tell who the covenants were too. Redemption is only spoken of to one group.
Others?? Scripture says so...but the marriage is too Israel...All Nations of.
---Trav on 7/20/09


Miche, I totally agree with here on this subject.


I believe the reason Satan is so angry and wants to destroy mankind and rob and steal as many souls as possible is out of pure...JEALOUSY!

The Church, Begotten Sons through Jesus Christ was God's plan from before the foundation of the world, taken out of humanity. Our end is greater than our beginning. The Church, SONSHIP, was what was predestined from before the beginning because God wanted CHILDREN.

How God accomplished this was to first plant the seed of humanity( not angels) With our fall and through the death and Resurrection of Jesus Christ...we're raised up higher than at first...seated with Christ in Heavenly Places. More later on this.
---kathr4453 on 7/20/09


JESUS died so that anyone can go to heaven. Since anyone can go to heaven he must have died for everyone.

The Bible says GOD is not willing that any should perish. It is our choice. Life or death.
---Samuel on 7/20/09




Trav:

Redeem IS mentioned with all mankind. Galatians 4:5 "so that He (God) might redeem those who were under Law, that we might receive the adoption as sons---Mark_Eaton on 7/16/09

"redeem those who were under the Law"
Israel was who law was given too.

Nations of Israel the only ones under the law.
Israel (Nations of) consisted of several million people. You probably have be indoctrinated from a young age to believe Judah (jews) are the only Israel existant today.
But, they will never be able to explain why "All" Israel is found throughout N.Covenant....to the last chapters in Revelations.
Israel...was GODs wife, divorced,and to be remarried. Heb 8:8. Possible by YAHSHUA'S death.
---Trav on 7/20/09


Kath, your last post was......
AWESOME!!!!

"He most certainly did die for everyone. His death on the cross paid the debt for sin once and for all. He died for the sins of the world. Pretty clear. The truth is that one must accept His death and resurrection personally for their sins to be forgiven."
---Chuck on 7/17/09

I want to state that I'm in agreement with the above statement by Chuck!!!
---mima on 7/20/09

DITO!!!! Mima and Chuck!
---miche3754 on 7/20/09


Anne, great answer, couldn't have said it any better.
---MarkV. on 7/20/09


Sister, Just trying to figure out WHY Markv doesn't get this?....---miche3754 on 7/20/09

Miche,

Markv has been indoctrinated by HYPER Calvinism.

MarkV states scripture and cannot understand why something stated is obscured by the viewer?? Yet I find MarkV, who without reading scripture was WRONG on when Angels were created..called that truth a lIE, and calls this one lie too.

Why, because his false doctrine twists EVERYTHING around.

1 John 2:2
And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.


It doesn't get any clearer than this, yet this horrible doctrine of Calvinism has blinded the minds of those brainwased by it.
---kathr4453 on 7/20/09


Calvinism is a type of cop-out. Many Calvinist think outside witnessing to the world is a waste of time(such as my street witnessing) and from a strict point of view(their point of view) they are correct.
A church who does not believe in witnessing can be likened to the Shakers, who did not believe in procreation(marriage). This belief is self eliminating of course, how utterly ridiculous!!!!
---mima on 7/20/09




Kathr, a year ago you knew nothing about Calvinist teachings and last week you knew nothing and today you still know nothing about his teachings. Nothing has change. Cancer grows unless you take care of it in time before it completely consumes you. Cancer is so bad it takes people who once were healthy to death.
---MarkV. on 7/20/09


God HAS reconciled all mankind, through Christ not counting their sins against them. This is called reconciliation.It is finished.
Now consider what mankind must do. We must believe on the SON of Almighty God(receive Christ and HIS promises) and we will be set free from sin. Now it is finished for us.

The sin of the world is unbelief in HIM.
---duane on 7/20/09


The Calvinist says they cannot tell anyone specifically Christ died for their sin, because they dont know who Christ died for. Under this bondage of false truth, Calvinists do not preach the Gospel to the lost.

The reason we CAN preach the Gospel is because Christ DID die for the sin of the whole world.ONCE AND FOR ALL the Bible says! We as His witnesses. must have this witness in us to bring the Gospel to the world. The Holy Spirit speaks this truth through us, drawing sinners to Christ. Make you wonder if Calvinists even have the Holy Spirit at all.

The PLAN of salvation.Jesus died for the sin of the World.

The PUROPSE of Salvation, a totally different subject.
---kathr4453 on 7/20/09


"He most certainly did die for everyone. His death on the cross paid the debt for sin once and for all. He died for the sins of the world. Pretty clear. The truth is that one must accept His death and resurrection personally for their sins to be forgiven."
---Chuck on 7/17/09

I want to state that I'm in agreement with the above statement by Chuck!!!
---mima on 7/20/09


We also know that the plan of salvation for fallen mankind was planned from before teh foundation of the world!
---kathr4453 on 7/20/09


Sister, I know we don't agree on two small things, but on this, you hit the nail on the head. Just trying to figure out WHY Markv doesn't get this?
THe Bible says it, but for some reason, his doctrine is wrong on this. It is too bad he won't receive wise council on this.

You go girl! Let's pray he GETS IT!
---miche3754 on 7/20/09


Markv,
There you go again talking about someone's faith.
Brother, God made all of us we are his clay, but God does not control his clay.
It is you who does not understand that.
God wants us to love him like he does all of us.
You still have not given scripture that states God made some to be destined for Hell.
You don't understand what real free will is nor the fact that it is our freewill love that God wants. He does not make us obey him. Do you make your children obey you or do want them to obey you because they love you?
Mine do because they love me. AND that is how the Potter works.
Would greatly appreciate scripture to back up you "DESTINED FOR HELL" theory.
---miche3754 on 7/20/09


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We do know that God created the angels before he created the physical universe.

Where were you when I laid the earth's foundation? Tell me, if you understand. Who marked off its dimensions? Surely you know! Who stretched a measuring line across it? On what were its footings set, or who laid its cornerstone - while the morning stars sang together and all the angels shouted for joy? (Job 38:4-7).

God created the angels just prior to the creation of mankind because one of their duties is to be ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation (Hebrews 1:14).


We also know that the plan of salvation for fallen mankind was planned from before teh foundation of the world!
---kathr4453 on 7/20/09


Jesus's sacrifice on the cross is sufficient to cover the sins of all those in the entire world who sincerely become His deciples/followers. Jesus' deciples/followers are all those who sincerely obey Him and live to His glory and abide in His ways and righteousness. Jesus' deciples are not those who say they 'believe' yet still follow the flesh and not the Spirit.

Jesus' deciples are those who God makes born-again as shown by the fact that they have repented of their past wicked life and now live to follow the Lord and His Spirit.

Jesus' blood does not cover those who claim to be Christians/believers, yet who follow after the flesh instead of the Spirit.
---Anne on 7/18/09


Whether Mima or Donna want it to be so or not, it says in the Bible that the righteous (those who help there neighbour etc) will be chosen as sheep and the rest will be goats and it does not matter two hoots whether you are Chrsitian or not. That is what Jesus preached. The Jesus whose death paid the price for the sins of the whole world. Guess what? Jesus earned the right to judge the whole world and whoever he saves he will save sins and all, and the ones who do not obey the LOVE command will go to the pit, even if they say Lord, Lord.
---frances008 on 7/18/09


Carla, thank you for coming forward with the scripture concerning the Potter and the clay. Kathr had some other interpretation as she normally does, and Miche will never stand for God to be in control, she has to defend man. Even to the point of stripping the deity of God. She says I am calling God a liar, when she is stripping Him just as the heretics did in the early church when they stripped Jesus of His deity with their false doctrines like Arius and Sabellius. I say this because that is what they are doing. God not knowing, waiting for man, to pick Him, poor old God, He is such a pitiful god. With no Supreme Power over sinful man. They have created a god to their own liking.
---MarkV. on 7/18/09


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Jesus overcame sin for all peoples whether they believe it or not. It is finished.
All that mankind must do is accept the finished fact of Gods reconciliation and go to HIM in faith.(reconcile ourselves to God) We must believe that HE did what HE claimed to do.
HE came to put sin away.
Jesus cannot help you if you dont believe it is finished and it is a fact,..
---duane on 7/18/09


What I see in the things some of you write to each other. Youre like little children, fighting over a ball, they were given. Each one saying, its mine, no its mine! Its not your! It belongs to God! He the rightful owner!

Lord told you!
Joh 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Is this a lie, because you believe someone to be unsaved?
Do you know when the last day is, is time up?

Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
---TheSeg on 7/18/09


Chuck, if you are correct in that Christ paid for the sins of everybody with His blood, then all of mankind is forgiven. No one owes any debt.
When you are a debt in the bank and someone pays for it, you owe nothing. If the bank comes to you and charges you, they are not been just for charging you for what already has been paid by someon else.
The same holds true for all who are lost. They owe a debt, and Christ is willing to Sacrifice His own blood for your soul if you only believe and you won't have to face the wrath of God. But if it is as you say, no one needs to face the wrath of God for Christ has paid for their sins already. God could not judge them wrong anymore.
But that is not what Scripture says.
---MarkV. on 7/17/09


Let me add a few thought provoking questions someone proposed to me.
Is God all-powerful?
Is God powerful enough to accomplish His Will?
And, if God is not willing that any should perish, will all people, perhaps after death, be saved?

I don't buy this train of thought, but it is interesting.

There are verses that say, by one man all died, by One man all will be saved.
---Rodj on 7/17/09


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He most certainly did die for everyone. His death on the cross paid the debt for sin once and for all. He died for the sins of the world. Pretty clear. The truth is that one must accept His death and resurrection personally for their sins to be forgiven.
---Chuck on 7/17/09


MarkV, 1st John says ( THE BIBLE) Jesus not only died for our sin...BUT for the sin of the WHOLE WORLD.

The atonement for sin was and is for EVERYONE, but not everyone will accept the GIFT of His atonement.

They are made righteous by the Blood of the lamb the moment they believe...not before.

It is the ungoldy God Justifies...not the Godly. How can God justify the ungoldy? Because of Christ's sacrifice. Right then and there....


Markv has it ALL wrong due to a perverted understanding of the Sovereignty of God, saying He can do what He wants when He wants at his own whim.....meaning MarkV YOU have NO eternal security....as God's whim at any time may be to throw you back!
---kathr4453 on 7/17/09


For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
-To me this says everyone! But, even if you dont believe this!

-believe this!
And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.
-without telling you! Will everyone go to heaven?
-Not that, its not true, its that you cant believe it!

Behold, ye despisers, and wonder, and perish: for I work a work in your days, a work which ye shall in no wise believe, though a man declare it unto you.

Think me a fool?
---TheSeg on 7/17/09


Miche,

you might want to consider this Particular scripture!!!!!

Rom 9:21
Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honor, and another unto dishonor?

figurative speaking it means two things both a clay pot and likewise a human being!
---Carla3939 on 7/16/09
I know this already.
The first is the body we are born into-dishonorable one.
The second is Christ in us when we receive him -The honorable one. Christ in us makes us an honorable, new, reshaped vessel.
---miche3754 on 7/17/09


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Christ died for His children. The wicked are not his children. If the wicked convert, then Christ would have died for them as well. He is a sustitude for all who believe. They have been counted as righteous by the blood of the Lamb. Learn to be approved
---Mark_V on 7/17/09
Before Christ came, ALL were wicked.

Matthew 15:18-20
18But the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and these make a man 'unclean.' For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander. These are what make a man 'unclean', but eating with unwashed hands does not make him 'unclean.' "
That is why Christ says he will give us a new heart to obey God.
---miche3754 on 7/17/09


Christ died for His children. The wicked are not his children. If the wicked convert, then Christ would have died for them as well. He is a sustitude for all who believe. They have been counted as righteous by the blood of the Lamb. Learn to be approved
---Mark_V on 7/17/09


John 3:17>>>God's plan was to save the world. V.18>>>Comdemnation is reserved for the ones that believeth not [takes the Blood] to believe the foolish message of the cross....There are only two kinds of people in the world, [1] the lost and [2] the saved. The saved, heaven awaits for us. The lost stands condemned already. Sentenced [CONDEMNED], and await only the execution of that sentence, which is the lake of fire. Christ in John 19-21 and I quote: "As the light is rejected by a dark world because their deed were evil". End of quote. Have a wonderful weekend, Christianet, and all people that works on here for the glory of God. Good day!
---catherine on 7/17/09


I apologize if I offend you Markv, but you did call God a liar by denying scripture.
If you don't want the truth, then stop speaking falsehoods.

You say that the only way to be saved is the Holy Spirit calling you(and God put it in you before birth) BUT we can't hear him. This is wrong according to the Bible.
News flash- God has a piece of himself in everyone because he made everyone.
You must hear the WORD of God, be convicted BY the Holy Spirit, then repent. first steps to being saved Yet you deny them.
I don't mean to upset you, but you really need to check your doctrine with whats really in the Word of God. See if it really lines up. If it doesn't, and you keep getting burned, maybe your doctrine is wrong.
---miche3754 on 7/17/09


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Here in is the ignorance of Calvinism's elect doctrine.

God hardened Israel's heart,not individual Jewish hearts, as we see on the first day of pentecost over 3000 the first day were added to the CHURCH.

Satan has blinded the hearts of men. The preaching of the Gospel OPENS the heart and minds of men...

God will open the eyes of Israel (the NATION) at the appropriate time, fulfilling HIS plan and purpose. Only a few branches were broken off.and not ALL were blinded.

Their blinding opened salvation to Gentiles!

MarkV has an identity problem, believing he is National Elect Israel, rather than an individual Gentile who heard the Gospel and believed.
---kathr4453 on 7/17/09


I honestly do not know what the blog question is asking?

Is the question "Did Jesus death pay the penalty for all mankind"?

Is the question "Did Jesus death make all men righteous"?

The answer for the first question is Yes. Jesus died for all mankind. Acts 10:34, God shows no partiality.

Trav:

Redeem IS mentioned with all mankind. Galatians 4:5 "so that He (God) might redeem those who were under the Law, that we might receive the adoption as sons".

The answer for the second question is No. We must act on His death and accept the free gift He has given to us.
---Mark_Eaton on 7/16/09


Miche,

you might want to consider this Particular scripture!!!!!

Rom 9:21
Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honor, and another unto dishonor?

figurative speaking it means two things both a clay pot and likewise a human being!
---Carla3939 on 7/16/09


Trav,
Christ was sent to redeem mankind and I believe David is refering to John 3:16-17 ...
Praise his name!
---larry on 7/14/09
Redeemer is not mentioned ever with all mankind.
Nevertheless being GOD over all. And he can do what he wants to do.
He will especially do what he has said he would do...and that is the point. We should not add or take away. One is as bad as the other.
Isaiah 41:14
Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel, I will help thee, saith the LORD, and thy redeemer, the Holy One of Israel.

Isaiah 54:5
For thy Maker is thine husband, the LORD of hosts is his name, and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel, The God of the whole earth shall he be called.
---Trav on 7/16/09


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Nana, Samuel, Miche~ Good common sense answers.
---Anne on 7/16/09


Miche, I sent blessings, you sent arguments and accuse me of saying God is a liar. You have joined the group of those who cannot discuss anything of Scripture without having to confirm to remarks. If you ever notice that not even the athiest speak as most of you guys do. Ask questions and put answer but stop making remarks that you will be sorry for when you finally know the Truth. Don't you have the fear of God?
As Seg posted:
"Rom 14:9
For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living. But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ."
Think about what you want to do.
---MarkV. on 7/16/09


Because GOD hardened their hearts, Markv.
God does that just to show he is God.
He hardened pharoah's heart and many others to prove HEIS THE ONE TRUE GOD TO MAN.

You know this and you know that the Bible says that faith comes from hearing and hearing the Word of God.
You do realize you just called God a liar, right?
You know what the word says but yet you twist it.
Give me scripture to back YOUR belief that God made man to go to hell.
And that God chose some not to.
My Bible says that Hell was NOT created for man.PERIOD.
---miche3754 on 7/16/09


Rom 14:9
For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living. But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

Isnt this also written, very mountain shall be made low and very valley filled!

Take heed what ye hear: with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you: and unto you that hear shall more be given.

In truth, I ask you, are we all not guilty of all?
---TheSeg on 7/16/09


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Yes some teach that all will go to heaven. Others that only some are picked by GOD.

But GOD loves all people. He wishes all to be saved. Yet some people would not want to live in heaven. They prefer the pleasures of sin. So GOD grants free will to all people and lets us choose.
---Samuel on 7/16/09


Romans 3:10 is a quote ("As it is written...") from Psalms 14 which , even if it describes what was, even what is, what do we think?, that it is encouragement to fold our arms? I rather see that the councel is to seek the understanding of the Lord, to seek God, to walk in the ways of righteousness for as v5 says, "God is in the generation of the righteous." He brings great charges against the "workers of iniquity", "eat up my people as they eat bread, and call not upon the LORD.", "Ye have shamed the counsel of the poor" We accomplish nothing by constantly describing 'the lost', rather by helping the lost come out of their ignorance into the knowledge of the Lord, faith and newness of life.
---Nana on 7/16/09


Miche, blessings to you.
As to your answers,
"It IS that God knows that anyone who hears the Word...HIS Word, they will turn to him." Miche, that is not true at all, many hear the word of God and don't turn to Him. The Word doesn't return void because It accomplishes the purpose which God had for it.
You said,
"How do we know this? God said anyone who hears, Markv."
What about those who heard Jesus speak (God's Word) in John 10:25-30 " Jesus answered them, I told you and you do not believe. The Works that I do in My Fathers name, they bear witness of Me. But you do not believe, because you are not My sheep" They have to be His sheep in order for them to believe His Word.
---MarkV. on 7/15/09


Jesus' death on the cross is sufficient to cover the sins of all those in the entire world who sincerely become His deciples/followers. These are those who God makes born-again, and they are those who turn from their past wicked life, and now live to follow the Holy Spirit and abide in the Lord.

Jesus' blood does not cover those who claim to be Christians, yet who follow after the flesh instead of the Spirit.

Hi Miche, you know I'm leaving this Sunday I think for at least a week, but will talk to you when we get back. Take care and keep up the great work.
---Anne on 7/15/09


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yes yes yes jesus died for the just and the unjust
---Vallie on 7/15/09


Markv, Hi and God's blessings to you.

It is NOT that God knows who will turn to him. God did not create beings that are destined for hell, that is not scriptural.(But you say God did)

It IS that God knows that anyone who hears the Word...HIS Word, they will turn to him.
How do we know this?
Because he says HIS WORDS will not return to him void.
God said anyone who hears, Markv.
And we know God created ALL, so, what you are saying is in direct contridicton with God's word. Sorry, but truth is truth.
---miche3754 on 7/15/09


Frances --

>>>the rest of mankind lets say 90 per cent, of those a small percentage of them live up to the love God (good) and love your neighbour as yourself laws. These ones go to Heaven even if they are Buddhist Falong Gong Muslim etc etc.<<<

The percentage of those who "live up to the love of God...and love your neighbor as yourself .." is 0 per cent.

Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Jesus said (Mk 2:17) I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Jhn 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son..., the wrath of God abideth on him. (that includes Buddhist Falong Gong Muslim if they don't turn to Him)
---Donna66 on 7/14/09


Trav,
Christ was sent to redeem mankind and I believe David is refering to John 3:16-17 where in the strongest discriptive terms we see words such as WORLD, WHOSOEVER, SHALL BE and ONLY SON.
The verses are both inclusive and exclusive, the best we could ever hope from a loving God!

Praise his name!
---larry on 7/14/09


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Miche, all this people with all their free will you say they have, will never choose Christ for the simple reason they don't love Christ. They cannot choose whom they don't love. They are free in that no body has a gun to their heads, but as free as they are and with all the freedom they have they just don't love Christ. They love sin, and desire to do the will of their father the devil. All the free will you say they have is not and never will be for Christ, unless God changes their attitudes. So it takes an act of God for them to come to Christ. Sorry, but that is the way it is. I did not make the plan, I did not curse them and put them in the state they are in, I only follow Scripture.
---MarkV. on 7/14/09


Yes, Jesus did die for those who will not accept him. ..........

---David8318 on 7/10/09

David...this is just not in scripture. There can be no contradiction in scripture right? There should be witnesses right?
There is a certain emphasis....when Christ makes a statement....

Matthew 10:6
But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

24But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Ezekiel 34:11
For thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I, even I, will both search my sheep, and seek them out.
Now you seem like a sheep....who just doesn't know your a sheep.
Heb 8:8, Jer 31:31
---Trav on 7/14/09


Miche, long time no see. Let me answer you as kindly as I can. I believe that God is all knowing. "Omniscience" and since He is all knowing, He knows who will come to Christ and who will not. When the Word of God is given, He already knows who will believe and who will not. Do you know why? Because He grants them the faith to believe. If He doesn't grant the faith, they will never believe.
God also grants them repentance. If God does not grant them repentance, they will never repent of their sins. They need for the Holy Spirit to convict their hearts.
God also gives them a new heart to percieve. Without God giving them that heart, they will never be able to love Christ.
---MarkV. on 7/14/09


Jesus doesn't pay the debt for those who reject Him- markv

Thats the point Markv.
God sent Christ to give us a choice. Christ will pay it for those who choose to follow him instead of their flesh.
We can accept the truth of Christ dying for our sins and accept Him as savior or we can reject him.
God set the choice and has given man the freewill to choose- Life in Christ or death in hell.
You don't understand this because you don't understand freewill.
You believe God created some specifically destined for hell when God says that is not true. God knew all of us when he formed us in our mothers womb and he loved us all even then.
Believing that your were created for heaven but others weren't is self righteous and prideful.
---miche3754 on 7/14/09


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While we were yet sinners, HE died for us.
What did HE die for? Ans: The forgiveness of sin.
God reconciled the world to HIMSELF through Jesus Christ, not counting mens sins against them.
Mankind is already reconciled to God, now mankind must reconcile themselves to God.
Just believe on HIM who loves you. Its by grace through faith.
---duane on 7/13/09


Christ died for everyone but not everyone accepted his death for their life.
God is longsuffering and not willing that ANY should perish. There is nothing to indicade Christ died for a Jeff and not a Nancy.
Hell is by choice and is never full. We should not confuse our choice for God's will.
---larry on 7/13/09


John 3:16 states it very clearly For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. God wants all mankind to be saved. The problem not all mankind will believe so most will perish. The gate that leads to salvation is narrow and few will enter it. The gate that leads to destruction is wide and many will find it. Yes Jesus died on the cross to save all of mankind. It is left to mankind to take advantage of that gift and follow the teachings of Christ.
---Jon on 7/13/09


---Francesoo8 wrote the following,
"Now, of the rest of mankind lets say 90 per cent, of those a small percentage of them live up to the love God (good) and love your neighbour as yourself laws. -----

These ones go to Heaven even if they are Buddhist Falong Gong Muslim etc etc."

I believe the latter part of her statement to be outrageously wrong and will bring selfcondemnation in the sight of God on anyone who believes likewise.
---mima on 7/13/09


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Jesus is not even preached to everyone so that is unfair to begin with. God sent His Son for His People (hint: he made everyone) but some of them are in total all-out rebellion against God, and condemn themselves. These wicked people were made for destruction. God knew that they would reject Him and His Son. Now, of the rest of mankind lets say 90 per cent, of those a small percentage of them live up to the love God (good) and love your neighbour as yourself laws. These ones go to Heaven even if they are Buddhist Falong Gong Muslim etc etc. This is judgement, which is done by Jesus Christ. So He is the Way. He opens the gate of Heaven for you or he shuts it in your face - figuratively speaking.
---frances008 on 7/13/09


"Did Jesus die and pay the penalty for those who will not accept him?" No.
"He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abideth on him. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved, but he that believeth not shall be damned."

"was his death on the cross substitutionary for all mankind?" Yes.
"Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son [to be] the propitiation for our sins. and not for ours only, but also for [the sins of] the whole world." Now, In Christ's stead, I pray that you all "be ye reconciled to God."
Refs. Jhn 3:36>Mar 16:1>1Jo 4:10>1Jo 2:2>2Cr 5:20
---josef on 7/12/09


This scripture from what David quoted seems to be very plain and very compelling.
"John also wrote, 'And he is a propitiatory sacrifice for our sins, yet not for ours only but also for the WHOLE worlds."
---mima on 7/12/09


If Jesus died for the whole world, then the whole world has been forgiven. Which is not true at all. Jesus doesn't pay the debt for those who reject Him. That is why they are going to hell. There is no reconciliation for those who hate Christ. None whatsoever. Only those who put their faith and Trust in God will be reconciled to God, only because of the righteousness of Christ which has been imputed to them, and their sins forgiven. They were paid by the Blood of Christ.
His death is sufficient to cover the whole world if the whole world had faith and trust in Him, but they don't. God would be unfair to sent them to hell if their penalty has been paid by Christ.
---MarkV. on 7/12/09


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NO...and it wasn't suffient for all either. Christ death and life was and is particular. They are called the redeemed that is those whom Christ has redeemed WIIL come to faith and not just any faith. Those whom Christ redeemed shall ALL be taught of the Father and those the Father teaches SHALL come to HIS CHRIST and not (counterfiet) another. His substutionary death to satify God's law on behalf of those whom He came to represent. Showing God to be a just God and a Savior. You can find these people in Rev.5:9 and all over the bible they are the world God so loved.
---steven-rem7000 on 7/11/09


Yes, He did. His death is substitutionary for all mankind....But for those who don't accept it as such, it is ineffective. Salvation is voluntary.

Those who do not accept His redemption are simply electing to pay the FULL penalty for their OWN sins, perhaps in life, but most assuredly after death.

As Christians, our goal should be to clarify the nature of this choice for those who do not understand it, so that they can make a knowledgeable choice.
---Donna66 on 7/11/09


Yes, Jesus died for all men. HE came to do away with sin. Reason? So all mankind could come before a holy God to receive salvation through faith.So we ask, What sin shall a man do as to condemn?? Ans.. The sin of the world is UNbelief in HIM.All that mankind must do, is believe on HIM.WE ARE SAVED BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH.
---duane on 7/11/09


remember we can only live as God intended by accepting jesus and then walking,aka,living in the spirit following him.any other way is death,wordly,fleshly living,and not what God desires.God sow loved the world,thats all of us,that he sent his son,thats jesus,into the world that WHOSOEVER would believe shall not perish. You can be dead,you can perish spiritually,and will without christ.
---tom2 on 7/11/09


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scripture tells us that by one man,adam,sin came into the world,and deathe because of sin,and that by one man,jesus,sin and death are defeated.YES jesus died once for all,but it is a FREE WILL choice we make.Jesus died for everyone who has been conceived,though in my opinion many have died with the sin nature ,but also at the time of their death they were innocent,or wont be held accountable by God because they hadn,t reached the age of accountability.But tro directly answer your question,yes jesus died for everyone,even those who will never believe.
---tom2 on 7/11/09


Good question. Yes.
---amand6348 on 7/10/09


Yes, Jesus did die for those who will not accept him. It's up to each individual to avail themselves and exercise faith in his sacrifice.

John said 'For God loved the WORLD so much that he gave his only begotten son...' Jo.3:16.

John also wrote, 'And he is a propitiatory sacrifice for our sins, yet not for ours only but also for the WHOLE worlds.'

Apostle Paul (who persecuted Christians, but who later accepted the death of the Christ) also wrote and described Jesus as the 'last Adam'. (1Cor.15:45) Jesus propitiated for us by standing in place of the 'first Adam'. Jesus is our 'eternal Father'. Is.9:6

A side issue- Jesus died on a torture stake, not a cross.
---David8318 on 7/10/09


According to Paul's view, Jesus' death brings salvation to everyone. See Romans 5:13-21.
---eric1968 on 7/9/09

Romans 5:13 (King James Version)

13(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

Believe I've read that only Moses and Nations of Israel were given the law.

19 ......many be made righteous.

Psalm 105:10
And confirmed the same unto Jacob for a law, and to Israel for an everlasting covenant:
---Trav on 7/10/09


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Mima, Jesus death is sufficient for all people in the world if they all believed and trusted in Him by faith.
But since they don't, only the one's who have faith in His Works on the cross, count as their debts been paid. They are no longer condemn since Christ paid for their sins.
If He paid for everyone sin, then no one owe's a debt, which we know is not true since many are going to hell. If God had paid their debt, it would be unfair for God to send them to hell.
---Mark_V on 7/10/09


Mima, Jesus death is sufficient for all people in the world if they all believed and trusted in Him by faith.
But since they don't, only the one's who have faith in His Works on the cross, count as their debts been paid. They are no longer condemn since Christ paid for their sins.
If He paid for everyone sin, then no one owe's a debt, which we know is not true since many are going to hell. If God had paid their debt, it would be unfair for God to send them to hell.
---Mark_V on 7/10/09


I believe that the 5th chapter of Romans tells the whole story, but Roman 5:6-10 answered your question quite well.
---Janze on 7/10/09


According to Paul's view, Jesus' death brings salvation to everyone. See Romans 5:13-21.
---eric1968 on 7/9/09


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In other words, mima is asking if anyone here believes the Calvinist proposition of limited atonement.

I don't.
---Cluny on 7/9/09


ETERNAL LIFE is the ultimate goal that we seek.

Luke 3:6
"all flesh shall see the salvation of God".

We can only have the guarantee if OUR SPIRIT is compatible with God's spirit and we have the "fruit of light" (God is light, 1 John 1:5, Ephesians 5:8).

Ephesians 1:14
"which is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it".

So, if we make our spirit compatible with His by becoming a "GODLY spiritual" (as opposed to the "spirituality of man") creation, we will have the "guarantee".

Romans 8:16
"it is the Spirit himself bearing witness with our spirit that we are children of God".

From the RSV.
---more_excellent_way on 7/9/09


Jesus died for EVERYONE on Earth, even those that do not accept Him. Accepting Him is our choice.
---Leslie on 7/9/09


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