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Sabbath Breakers Going To Hell

Am I going to hell because I don't keep the Saturday Sabbath?

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 ---kelli on 8/25/09
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Warwick - You might not have noticed that in Matthew 19:17f that the rich man really did not benefit from obeying all the commandments since he went away sadden. Material wealth was regarded as a blessing from God.

What Christ really wanted is total committment, more than just obedience to commandments. And I believe the same is true today.

Like Jesus we should try to obey all the commandments found within the New Covenant of the church and that for our own good.

And all of the commandments are there except the Old Covenant Sabbath which was given as a sign of the Old Covenant (Exodus 31:17). However, in principle man should rest one day in seven. In may case, I am retired so I can rest any day of the week.
---lee on 9/2/09


//In Matthew 19:17-19 Jesus says If you want to enter life then obey the commandments...

You really need to answer the question as to when the New Covenant of the church came into being. Before or after the resurrection? If you say after the resurrection than that may mean something Jesus told the Jews reflected the Old Covenant teachings and not the New.

Let us hear from you on this one, perhaps this will help you with your problem.
---lee on 9/2/09


Lee it is interesting how you ignore any Scripture which oppose your ideas.

In Matthew 19:17-19 Jesus says If you want to enter life then obey the commandments, to which the young man replies- Which ones? Jesus then enumerates some of the 10 commandments. It is plain for all to see but you say no, it is not there!

Likewise you propose ideas which undermine the gospel and ignore any Scripture which demonstrates your error.

I can learn from you? Yes I can, but only how to end up in hell!
---Warwick on 9/2/09


dconklin //The reason you need to be saved is because you break God's law, whether it be through murder, or hate, or lies, or breaking the Sabbath.

And where in the New Covenant of the church does it state breaking the Jewish Sabbath is a sin?

There are 4 lisings of sins in the New Testatment (Mk 7:21f, Romans 1:29f, Gal. 5:19f, 2 Tim. 3:1f)and none of them lists breaking the OT Sabbath as a sin.

And did the early church leaders sin by not teaching Sabbath observance since it was no longer observed in the Gentile church by the end of the 1st century? None of the church fathers taught Sabbath keeping, that much is obvious from any of their writings.
---lee on 9/2/09


>We can easily see that some Adventists do not believe one is saved by grace but depend upon their meritorious works to enable them to earn the free gift of their salvation.

The only one's who will be saved are those who are saved by faith in God's grace through the shed blood of His Son.

The reason you need to be saved is because you break God's law, whether it be through murder, or hate, or lies, or breaking the Sabbath.
---dconklin on 9/2/09




Jerry - ***Am I going to hell if I commit murder?

Only if the blood of Christ is insufficient to cover your sins,i.e. some sins cannot be forgiven.

You must likely will go to jail and sit there with lots of time to meditate on your actions as what you have done is strike at the very image of God (Gen. 9:6) in murdering another.

Of course, you can murder another by what you say.Mt. 5:21

We can easily see that some Adventists do not believe one is saved by grace but depend upon their meritorious works to enable them to earn the free gift of their salvation.
---lee on 9/2/09


>Because, when they started meeting they met the first day of the week.

Actually, no. In fact, until at least the 5th century most Christians kept the Sabbath. Search the web for Sozomen and the Sabbath.

>And everyday became Holy.

Only God can make a day holy and that day was the Sabbath, we are to keep it holy
---dconklin on 9/2/09


manny - **Therefore, when Jesus said "if you want to enter life, obey the commandments" ... He was talking about the commandments given in the new covenant.. in the gospel.

Totally agree, and the supreme commandment of the New Covenant is given in Romans 13:9-10 to love your neighbor for therein one fulfills all the law.

When did the New Covenant come into being? Before or after the Resurrection? If after, then much of what Christ taught may reflect Old Covenant teachings. Your comment on this will be appreciated.
---lee on 9/2/09


Manny I am not working from 'preconceived belief' but asking questions. I have yet to receive a conclusive answer. I am not a Sabbath keeper but wonder why only this Commandment can be ignored out of the 10.

In Matt. 19: 17,18 Jesus does define 'the commandments', as the 10 commandments. Read on a little.

Luke 18:20 also shows Jesus meant the 10 Commandments, by 'the commandments.

He commands us to obey them. This of course destroys the argument they are gone, done away with, and obselete.

I have rarely met a Sabbath keeper, and I have met hundreds, who believes we are saved by Sabbath observence. To a man they believe the Sabbath was given to man as a blessing, not a burden.
---Warwick on 9/2/09


Lee please explain how the 10 commandments can be 'obsolete' when Jesus said If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.' Matt. 19:17. It is clear from vs 18 He was talking about the 10 commandments. Who would know better than the law-giver Himself?

Also in Luke 18:20 He says 'You know the commandments...' and enumerates 5 of the 10.

Lee I can and do learn from anyone, however I have been thinking about the depth and breadth of God's word for decades.

I am well aware what Romans says but cannot see how it contradicts Matt. and Luke.
---Warwick on 9/2/09




Am I going to hell if I commit murder?
---jerry6593 on 9/2/09


Warwick, I did not mean it was you who believed that since you had already mentioned you did not. My answer was "why it bothered me" response only. I think I gave you a good enough answer. I believe Alan can see this very clear. No perticular day was mentioned by God. It was added by man just as it was added by man under the New Covenant. That is why many traditions came from the people. Not from God. Man did not institute the Sabbath as Wayne claims I am saying, God did, but God did not specify the day at anytime.
Under the Old Covenant the people implimented many traditions, ceremonial and moral laws. Laws that were binding for them only. Under the New Covenant man implimented Sunday and Hebrew 4,5 says,
---MarkV. on 9/2/09


Warwick 2 continue:
"we have entered into Sabbath rest" In the Old Testament the Sabbath was not only a day of rest, it was a picture of a great rest to come. And when Christ came, the picture was over and we entered the rest. The early church is an absolutely immediate testimony to that. Because, when they started meeting they met the first day of the week. And everyday became Holy. They not only met the first day of the week, but in Acts chapter 2, they met everyday of the week and from day to day, from house to house, they wre breaking bread, and sharing the Lords table.
---MarkV. on 9/2/09


I believe lee is right in points concerning the change that took place with the sabbath. The Jews were being persecuted in the first century (temple destroyed 70CE), then there was another destruction of a Jewish revolt in about 136CE. The believers wanted to distance themselves from the Jews, and I believe that was a major part of the motivation to change the day of rest. So the initial change took place in the first and second centuries.
Right or wrong is another discussion. The issue is to follow Christ. Now the fly in the ointment, many try to tell others how to follow Christ and what rules they must follow when they can't live a perfect life. You without sin, throw the first stone.
---Rod on 9/1/09


Warwick>>"...Nonetheless Jesus said we must obey them."

You're letting your own pre-conceived belief get in the way of understanding the words. You yourself said, "Jesus said, 'obey the commandments.'" He did not say, "obey the 10 commandments" The word commandment(s) does not always pertain to the 10Cs.

The old covenant - which is the 10Cs (Deut.4:13), was replaced by a new covenant. Jesus gave commandments to the apostles (Acts.1:2, 8) and told the apostles to teach all to observe all that He commanded.

Therefore, when Jesus said "if you want to enter life, obey the commandments" ... He was talking about the commandments given in the new covenant.. in the gospel.
---manny on 9/1/09


//Can I commit adultery because the Commandments are part of the OT?

You really need to read Romans 6!!!

What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it?

But is there sin where there is no law regarding such?

There are over 600+ laws in the Old Testament and many of them are no longer applicable to the New Covenant of the church. Do a google on Judaism 101 for such a listing.

I am glad to see I make you think about these things, I hope that you truly benefit from what I post.
---lee on 9/1/09


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//You agree we cannot disobey 9 but believe we can disobey 1. On what grounds?

there are really 3 grounds -

One being the 10 commandments is the Old Covenant declared obsolete, however, all the commandments EXCEPT the Sabbath commandment are found as commands in the New Covenant.

Second, Sabbath observance was not taught in the early church as apparently not passed onward as a requirement to Gentile converts at the Jerusalem council.

None of the early fathers, I know of taught Sabbath keeping. In fact some viewed and condemned the practice as a Judaizing influence.

Last of all, Saturday was a workday in the Roman world, it would not have been practical for converts to observe the Jewish Sabbath.
---lee on 9/1/09


Lee Jesus said '.If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.' Matt. 19:17

You write 'the 10 Commandments is the Old Covenant.' Nonetheless Jesus said we must obey them.

You agree we cannot disobey 9 but believe we can disobey 1. On what grounds?

Luke 18:22 shows Jesus approved of the rich man's Commandment observance but was aware he loved his riches-his problem-sell it all and follow me-He couldn't. I see nothing here which says the Commandments are not in force.

Knowing what an evasive person you are I must add: I do not believe we can be saved by following the 10 Commandments, but on what basis can we disobey any one of them?

Can I commit adultery because the Commandments are part of the OT?
---Warwick on 9/1/09


>the legalistic view from the SDA's.

You've assumed that SDA's keep the Sabbath in order to be saved. We follow the Laws of God because they were ordained by Him for life. We obey Him because we love Him for what He has done for us.
---dconklin on 9/1/09


dconklin -***Since most Christians, as least as late as the 5th century, kept the Sabbath, that scenario is wrong.

Your historical sources please, all my church histories including some written by SDA church historians state the Gentile church by the end of the 1st century, no longer observed the Sabbath.

Furthermore, if you were to take the time to read what the 2d to 4th century church fathers had to say on this issue, you will find none of them taught Sabbath keeping.
---lee on 9/1/09


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MarkV- So your saying that the Sabbath was made by the jews??? What????!!!!! You so called believers use every excuse in the book. If you believe that the jews did this then what would stop you from believing that the rcc made sunday the day of rest??? The greek version of the scriptures say miaton sabbaton which means on one of the sabbaths, this is the day Yahushua was raised from the dead, the english says on the first day of the week which is an out and out lie. You so called believers do not believe in the Elohim of Ysarel, nor do you believe in the true Mashiach. Warwick and I may not agree on everything, but I respect him as a true believer, but you are blind in every way!
---wayne on 9/1/09


Mark leave SDA'a out of it. Some can be legalistic but they are not alone in that!

You wrote 'What you are saying they should follow the commandment of the Jews, if not they are sinning against God.' Not true I made it clear I do not believe this.

You say there is no evidence God meant Saturday, then propose the Jews selected Saturday, without any evidence.

Jesus 'Lord of the Sabbath' attended synagogue on the Saturday Sabbath making no comment that it wasn't the same Sabbath day He had commanded the Jews to observe.

Why can't we leave Saturday as the Jewish Sabbath, and non-Jews can follow it (not for salvation) if they wish?
---Warwick on 9/1/09


MarkV says jews made Saturday the Sabbath, not YHVH. But yet Yahushua kept the same Sabbath as the jews, and we know for sure that the day Yahushua kept was saturday. So once again MarkV's logic fails! Yahushua agreed to keep the same Sabbath as those very jews that MarkV says they made up. This is christians at thier best!!!! Say you believe and know you can break any commandment because Yahushua is our rest!! What a lie to use Yahushua's Holy Name this way! You make me sick to my stomach!!! Yes Yahushua is our rest, but this never meant we can live however we want and break any commandment we wish, YHVH forgive this blind world and those who use your Name falsly!
---wayne on 9/1/09


Mark ... You make the point well that God's commandment is that we work 6 days and rest the 7th, and that it is Man's application of this rule which led first to the Jews selecting what is now Saturday, and then to Christians selecting the day after.

God does not say Saturday or Sunday ... He does not say we all have to worship & rest on the same day.

And of course at the time of Jesus, Man's custom was to rest on the Sabbath, and Jesus Himself showed us that it was not necessary, by healing on the Sabbath.

As you say, God did not say which days we should work
---alan8566_of_uk on 9/1/09


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Warwick 2 continue:
Somewhere in time the Jew decided to began work on Sunday and have Saturday as their Sabbath. Now think, this was instituted by the Jews not God. So it was the commandment of the Jews that set Saturday their Sabbath. Now this are sinners just like veryone else. Now along comes Christ which is our rest and all Christians from the time of Christ decided to make Sunday the day of rest on the Lords Day. What you are saying they should follow the commandment of the Jews, if not they are sinning against God. They could not possibly be sinning against God if they work six days and rest on the seventh. That was God's commandment. Not man's. Our rest is Christ, now you tell me who should we believe God or man?
---MarkV. on 9/1/09


Warwich, I want to answer you question, "why does it bother me" on the, "Days of creation" blog because the other is full.
Let me explain why it bothers me. First, not because I go to church on Sunday. That is not the reason. Not because I was an RCC either. Not because someone told me I should do Sunday and not Saturday, cause no one has ever mentioned that to me.
The reason is, the legalistic view from the SDA's. By all means let's be legalistic about this matter then if they want it that way.
God commanded them to works six days and rest the seventh. He did not mention which days to work but that they were to work six days and keep the seventh to rest.
---MarkV. on 9/1/09


>the 10 Commandments is the Old Covenant -

Part of the OC, not the whole.

Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel, After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
---dconklin on 9/1/09


//Jesus said If you want to enter life, obey the commandments. Did He mean 6 of them, or the whole 10?

In the dialogue between Christ & the rich ruler (Lk. 18:22), Christ told him to sell all he had, come and follow him. What Christ wants is total commitment, not just obedience to commandments.

the 10 Commandments is the Old Covenant -

Deut. 4:13 And he declared to you his covenant, ... i.e. the 10 Commandments, and he wrote them on 2 tablets of stone.

those who believe the New Covenant of the church is simply an addendum to the Old ignore Hebrews 8:13 which states the Old Covenant became obsolete.

"In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. ..."
---lee on 9/1/09


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Lee, I would like to see your reasoned reply to the following scripture:

Jesus said 'If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.' Did He mean 6 of them, 8 of them or the whole 10? It looks like 10 to me!
---Warwick on 9/1/09


Am I going to hell if I commit adultery?
---jerry6593 on 9/1/09


>The Sunday Sabbath from what we can surmise from the history of the church was a tradition started by the Apostles and their immediate successors since we find that the church outside of Jewish communities did not observe the Jewish Sabbath by the end of the first century.

Since most Christians, as least as late as the 5th century, kept the Sabbath, that scenario is wrong.
---dconklin on 9/1/09


Jerry, you said, "
Am I going to hell if I Bear False Witness?"
No Jerry you will not go to hell for bearing false witness. You go to hell for not having true faith in the works of Christ and His resurrection. And that goes with, you will go to hell if you don't have the Spirit of God within you.
And since you reject the Spirit of God in the born again believer you might be in big trouble. No Spirit, no salvation. You might be on your own.
---MarkV. on 9/1/09


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This discussion reminds me of when the rich young ruler came to Jesus and asked what he must do to inherit eternal life. Jesus told him keep the commandments. Of course, Jesus was merely showing that IF he could without sin keep every commandment, he would have eternal life. Nobody, but Jesus, has or can do so. We have a sin nature and will never keep all the law in this body. Remember to sin on one point is to be guilty of the whole law. Thus, live perfect and sinless or eternally die, if you want to be judged by your works. Trust Jesus and live, if you want to be judged by HIS payment of your sins.
---Dan on 8/31/09


Rhonda 8/30:
If there's a particular citation that you do not understand, please ask abut it. One christian saw states 'he who has a verse wins, and he who uses the correct verse(s) wins all'. There also a Jewish proverb that says If you have the opportunity to talk of the Lord, do so. If you are wisest, stand up and speak, but if you are not, sit down and listen. Proverbs 1:7, 12:15, 15:5, 16:22.
If you are a Christian, perhaps the Lord is attempting to teach you the difference between law and grace. If not: Psalm 2:1-4, Jude 1:18-19, Revelations 9:20-21.
---Glenn on 8/31/09


Bless you Lee!++
---catherine on 8/31/09


Many would agree with Catherine that the principle behind a law is far more important than following the exact letter of the Law.

I guess it is basically the difference between 2 nickels and a dime.

The Sunday Sabbath from what we can surmise from the history of the church was a tradition started by the Apostles and their immediate successors since we find that the church outside of Jewish communities did not observe the Jewish Sabbath by the end of the first century.

It is interesting that even some Sabbaterians who are church historians found that to be true.
---lee on 8/31/09


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No! Make one day the Sabbath. God expects you to rest and keep holy one day a week. Let it be Saturday or Sunday. It is God's Blood that saves, "Not a day".
---catherine on 8/31/09


Am I going to hell if I Bear False Witness?
---jerry6593 on 8/31/09


Lee you are being very dogmatic, and I believe incorrect.

Jesus said 'If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.' Did He mean 6 of them, 8 of them or the whole 10? It looks like 10 to me!
---Warwick on 8/31/09


Sorry Jerry, but no one can agree with you that the Apostles and their immediate successors taught Sabbath keeping to Gentile converts.

It just is not in either the Scripture or church history.

Again your view that the Roman Church changed the Jewish Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday is without any historical credibility.

All the evidence indicates that the church by the end of the 1st century, no longer observed the Jewish Sabbath.

Yours is simply a distortion of history by taking advantage of religious prejudice, in order to gain converts (money and influence).
---lee on 8/30/09


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//Am I going to hell if I dishonor my mother and father?

No jerry, you will not go to hell if you dishonor your father or mother.

The only way you will go to hell is if you reject the grace that God has offered you through His Son Jesus who died and paid the penalty on your behalf for your sinfulness.

However, if you persist in your sins, you will come under God's judgment and be disciplined as He does with all those to whom He loves.

Hebrews 12:6 For the Lord disciplines the one he loves,and chastises every son whom he receives.
---lee on 8/30/09


Am I going to hell if I dishonor my mother and father?
---jerry6593 on 8/30/09


Rhonda: You may be right. Jesus could have been just kidding, or He could have made a mistake, or perhaps he was just trying out a test run on some rules when He wrote the Ten Commandments with His own finger in stone. But I don't think so. He's smarter than that.
---jerry6593 on 8/30/09


Jewish Sabbath (Jewish since ONLY the Jewish people observed it)
*****

ONLY self professing RELIGIOUS christianity who DISMISSES Christ WORDS to KEEP his commandments and OBEY would LABEL Gods Holy Sabbath Day a "Jewish Sabbath" ...Gods Holy Word describes the Sabbath Day ...only ignorant counterfeit christians have RE-LABELED it "Jewish Sabbath" to appease themselves for DISOBEYING Gods Sabbath


Glen

your post is pointless ...you can shove scripture down everyone's throat by posting a few dozen verses ...ANYONE can do that

UNDERSTANDING what you posted is a VERY different matter ...which is most likely why you chose the route you did
---Rhonda on 8/30/09


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Mark 2:27-28
Salvation comes through receiving Jesus as Lord and Savior *1, not by keeping the law *2! Note: Romans 6:14, Colossians 1:9-11, Hebrews 13:20-21, James 3:13-18, 4:6.
*1 Matthew 18:11, Luke 1:69, John 3:15-16, Acts 4:12, 16:31, Romans 10:9, 10, 2Corinthians 7:10, Galatians 1:3-4, Ephesians 2:8-9, 1Thesalonians 5:9, 1Timothy 2:4, 2Timothy 1:10, Hebrews 5:9, 7:25, 1Peter 1:5, 1John 3:5, 4:9-10, 15.
*2 Luke 16:16, John 15:4-5, Romans 1:17, 3:20-28, 4:2-8, 6:14, 7:6, 10:4, 11:6, 13:8, 10, 1Corinthians 1:18, 15:10, Galatians 2:11-16, 21, 3:1-29 (O foolish S.D.A.), 5:1-18, 6:7-16, Ephesians 2:8-10, Philippians 2:3-5, 13-15, Colossians 3:17, 2Timothy 1:9, Titus 3:5, Hebrews 8:6-13, 9:14, 10:16-25, 11:6, 13:8-10.
---Glenn on 8/29/09


gina -// Once slaves are free, they should return to observance of the Sabbath.

There are very few if any records that we know of that would indicate the Gentile church ever observed the Jewish Sabbath (Jewish since ONLY the Jewish people observed it).

And we do know for certain that the early church writers, many being the successors of the Apostles did not teach Sabbath observance. In fact, many condemned the practice believing it to be nothing more than Judaizing of the church.

Your assertion is that the early church either observed the Jewish Sabbath or that they were quickly misled by the Church of Rome. Either conclusion is without any historical credibility.
---lee on 8/29/09


Furthermore, Saturday as a workday in most of the Roman world. Most early Christians were of lower social/economic classes so it would not have been practical to observe the Jewish sabbath.

Can we see a Christian slave asking his master for Saturday off for religious reasons? LOL
---lee on 8/27/09
Being forced into working on the 7th day Sabbath such as the slaves in Egypt were is one thing, choosing to do it yourself in a day of Freedom is another. Once slaves are free, they should return to observance of the Sabbath. It is the THE Sabbath, not the Jewish Sabbath as you so often incorrectly repeat. Saturday is a work day today, yet choices can be made and Sabbath can be kept holy.
---Gina7 on 8/29/09


Am I goin to hell if I take the Lord's name in vain?

nah ...Christ kept it ALL for you or so say majority of posters here

just toss out ALL verses where Christ asks you to KEEP his commandments and OBEY him because he was just kidding ...somewhere in code written backwards in Holy Word of God the PROTES-tant daughters of rcc (REV 17) have found evidence of Christ abolishing the Sabbath he is LORD of ...irrelevant they can't quote THAT scripture...

rcc states all who observe sun-day or any day other than Gods Holy Sabbath are DISOBEYING God because rcc established sun-day BOLDLY tell all nothing from scripture abolishes or changes Gods Holy Sabbath to sun-day HER ignorant daughters still PROTEST

Rhonda/AZ
---Rhonda on 8/29/09


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//Am I goin to hell if I take the Lord's name in vain?

If you truly believe that your salvation depends upon what you do instead of the Grace of God, then yes, since you will be judged by the law not having the righteous of Christ credited to your account.

Romans 1:171 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from (beginning with) faith to (ending with) faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

we are really starting to feel sorry for you since you have spent nearly all of your life out in the wilderness without any real spiritual water to drink. Find a good church that preaches the gospel.
---lee on 8/29/09


Am I goin to hell if I take the Lord's name in vain?
---jerry6593 on 8/29/09


Colossians 2:16. I wouldn't say "in respect of" is so ignored as to change the plain understood meaning. To be fair, it is "or in respect of." Don't ignore the "or." There are conjunctions between food/drink "and/or in respect of a feast and/or a new moon and/or a sabbath."

The passage does not say the eating and drinking were happening on, although it may have included that.

"Sabbaton" does not have a definite article which would have indicated a specific day, perhaps the Day of Atonement. It is plural which would indicate the general sabbath days.
---Rod on 8/27/09


Ro 14:23b For whatever does not proceed from faith is sin.

Jas 4:17 So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.

Since the Jewish Sabbath was not imposed on the Gentile church at the Jerusalem council (acts 15), breaking a law that is not applicable to the church could hardly be viewed as sign.

The OT Sabbath was negated in Roman 14:5 as one may esteem all days alike or none at all.

Furthermore, Saturday as a workday in most of the Roman world. Most early Christians were of lower social & economic classes so it would not have been practical to observe the Jewish sabbath.

Can we see a Christian slave asking his master for Saturday off for religious reasons? LOL
---lee on 8/27/09


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>vs 16:Let no man therefore judge you in meat,or in drink,or in respect of an holy day,or of the new moon,or of the sabbath ....

The most ignored words in this cerse is "in respect of". The Greek (en emerei) literally means "in that part of".

Those who were judging the believers at Colossae were juding the eating and drinking that was taking place _on_ the days that are then mentioned.

The word "sabbaton" here refers to the Day of Atonement and the blowing of trumpets which were not days of feasting.
---dconklin on 8/27/09


It depends on whether you knowingly do not keep the day holy or if you have not yet had the chance to be enlightened on the subject.
One ting is for sure, you will go to the place of YOUR CHOICE! Heaven or hell!
---Pierr5358 on 8/27/09


But there are spiritual beings that are love-dead but they last forever.
*****

that sounds nice I suppose but where is this concept or idea from Gods Holy Word? ...where are the verses that support ETERNAL LIFE for all? and where does it say HUMANS are spiritual beings NOW? seeing dozens of verses speak of an INHERITANCE and a future promise as described in 1Corin 15

one would have to ignore or dismiss most of NT where verses describe ETERNAL LIFE for the righteous and somehow IMPLY - maybe by reading scripture backwards - that eternal life is given to the wicked

no verse describes eternal life for wicked - not one

Rhonda/AZ
---Rhonda on 8/27/09


Col2:13-23(read all)
vs 16:Let no man therefore judge you in meat,or in drink,or in respect of an holy day,or of the new moon,or of the sabbath ....

Roman 3(all

Shah-baht strg"7676(many sabbaths)
1.Day of atonement,
2.sabbath year,
3.sabbath week...
Lev23:27-32
strongs#7673-to CEASE,REST(LABOR)

(Day of Rest).
Heb4:9-15(all)
Vs 10:For he that is entered into HIS REST,also hathe CEASED FROM HIS OWN WORKS,as God from HIS.

Yahavah(Jehovah)
Yahushu'a(Jesus) is our shab-baht.
God who saves.Is43:3,45:15
Christ:Anointed.Act10:38
---char on 8/27/09


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Jerry **Are you saying Jesus was slandering you when He said those words (John 14:15)? ---

If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.

NO, but I can see your problem. Any good commentary will tell Jesus did not have in view here the 10 commandments.

SDAs are trained to add to scripture when they see the word 'commandments' they immediately insert 'ten' before it.

Of course, they really need something to judge others by as it is only by proving others wrong they can believe themselves right.

In John, the commandments in this verse are basically two, 1) to believe in the name of His son Jesus Christ, and 2), to love one another.

Suggest you read 1 John 3:22-24 where John speaks of these commandments.
---lee on 8/27/09


Jerry -**What day did Christ keep as holy? How about ALL of His disciples.

Admit it!!!you truly believe one must become Jewish when becoming a Christians.

And therefore like Christ follow all the Mosaic laws such as circumcision (Jesus was circumcised), do the temple routine, observe the various festivals, the dietary laws as well as the OT Sabbath.

Frankly, you ignore the decisions made at the Jerusalem council Acts 15 that Gentiles need not become Jewish.

Apparently you reject the scripture "when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law,to redeem those who were under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons". Gal. 4:4-5
---lee on 8/27/09


Hi, Rhonda > eternal life means the life of God's love which lasts forever, cannot run out, cannot get hurt or tired. But there are spiritual beings that are love-dead but they last forever. They need a place to go. They can feel and experience and have their emotions, but they are dead, as far as *love* is concerned. Example > "She who lives in pleasure is dead while she lives." (1 Timothy 5:6) Also, we have Romans 8:6 > "For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace." So, one can be conscious and active but dead spiritually - - - dead to God's love in the Holy Spirit (Romans 5:5), I mean. Our natures will be effected differently by the same fire, I understand through Hebrews 12:29.
---Bill_bila5659 on 8/27/09


Rod: "The correct question is: What does one do with the person of Jesus Christ? Does one believe on Christ? Does one follow Jesus Christ?"

What day did Christ keep as holy? How about ALL of His disciples. Why not follow Christ as did His disciples, instead of some non-holy, MAN-MADE counterfeit?
---jerry6593 on 8/27/09


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Does one believe on Christ? Does one follow Jesus Christ?

What one does with the Sabbath is not revelant to salvation?
****

Curious if one follows Christ and Christ KEPT the Sabbath and ALL the Commandments (Apostles too) then how can self professing RELIGIOUS christianity be DUPED by men Mark 7:6-9 believing Sabbath is abolished?

as for going to hell - it doesn't exist because ETERNAL LIFE is for the righteous ONLY ..one must IMPLY the wicked receive eternal life to have them "go somewhere"

rcc abolished Gods Holy Sabbath and TELL ALL who worship any other day are DISOBEYING God and BREAKING his Holy Sabbath to SERVE rcc ...even rcc knows scripture does not abolish Gods Holy Sabbath

Rhonda/AZ
---Rhonda on 8/26/09


Wrong question:

The correct question is: What does one do with the person of Jesus Christ? Does one believe on Christ? Does one follow Jesus Christ?

What one does with the Sabbath is not revelant to salvation?

God looks on the heart. Salvation is an heart issue, not a list of dos or don'ts.
---Rod on 8/26/09


"Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps, Who did no sin (broke not the 10 commandments 1 John 3:4 sin is breaking the 10 commandments), neither was guile found in his mouth" 1 Peter 2:21,22
"As His custom was, he went into the synagogue on the Sabbath Day" Luke 4:16 Christ worshipped on the Sabbath, and his is our example, to follow in His steps.
Jesus created us, and rested on 7th day, then He redeemed us, and rested on 7th day. The Sabbath is the dual memorial of creation and redemption. "Remember the Sabbath Day to keep it Holy" Exod 20:8 Words of Jesus, written with His own finger.
---Gina7 on 8/26/09


"Do we then make void the law through faith. God Forbid! Yea, we establish the law" Romans 3:31

"Sin is the transgression of the law" 1 John 3:4

"Do not commit adultery" "Do not kill" "So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty" James 2:10-12

"I had not known sin, but by the law, for I had not known lust, except the law had said, "Thou shalt not covet"" Rom 7:7

Sabbath is a part of the 10. Break 1 you have broken them all. It is the seal of new covenant. You cannot remove the seal.
New Cov is God writing the 10 commandments onto our hearts (Heb 8:10)
The wages of sin (breaking 10 commandments) is death Rom 6:23
---Gina7 on 8/26/09


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Hi, Jerry > one idol can be Friday sunset to Saturday sunset, especially if we exalt ourselves over others because we glorify this time period and others do not. If we are boasting ourselves to be superior, looking down on ones who do not do what we do . . . *outwardly* . . . this is idol worship of the day and of ourselves. "For we dare not class ourselves or compare ourselves with those who commend themselves. But they, measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves among themselves, are not wise." (2 Corinthians 10:12) Notice how ones are *decoying* attention away from how we need to become in comparison with how
*Jesus* is > "as He is, so are we in this world." (in 1 John 4:17)
---Bill_bila5659 on 8/26/09


\\
Not if they don't know that it is a sin to not keep the Sabbath. Most people are unaware of the need to keep the Sabbath.\\

Just what do YOU mean by "keep the Sabbath"?

According to the Bible, "keep the Sabbath" meant to abstain from work.
---Cluny on 8/26/09


Am I going to hell if I worship Idols?
---jerry6593 on 8/26/09


Killi, don't let the SDA's and other's who follow the law scare you. In fact many of the SDA's (I did not say all of them) will be going to hell not for keeping the Saturday Sabbath, but by breaking other laws, since they live under the law and don't want to enter into rest in Christ under the Covenant of Grace.
The world is lost in that they are living under the Covenant of works of obedience and everyone of them needs Christ to be a substitute for them because they cannot keep the whole law.
---MarkV. on 8/26/09


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>Sabbath Breakers Going To Hell

Not if they don't know that it is a sin to not keep the Sabbath. Most people are unaware of the need to keep the Sabbath.
---dconklin on 8/26/09


Tommy3007 -- AMEN. That's the truth in a nutshell.
---Donna66 on 8/25/09


If you have trusted in the FINISHED work of Jesus on the cross, then you have nothing to worry about. Your desire should be to please the Lord and bring glory to His name in ALL that you do, 1 Corinth. 10:31. If you believe that your salvation is based on Jesus on the cross "plus" anything else, then you had better go back to your Bible and read, "For by grace are you saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, it is a gift of God not of works lest any man(woman) should boast." Ephesians 2:8-9
---tommy3007 on 8/25/09


Well, if you're condemned by people here for being a Sabbathbeaker, you're in good company.

The Bible experts of 2000 years ago said the same thing about Jesus.

\\ You are going to HELL if you don't learn the truth.\\

That's nothing but the heresy of Gnosticism.
---Cluny on 8/25/09


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To Whosoever Has An Ear To Hear?

We're not made Perfect by our flesh trying to keep the Sabbath Day.

When it come to keeping the Sabbath, the day is insignificant. What is significant is abiding in Christ where the Righteousness of all the Commandments of the Law(like the Sabbath) is Fulfilled in us.

You know not what you worship if you believe you must go here or over there or do it on this day or that one(John 4:21-24). The Sabbath is a day of rest made for man(and not man for the Sabbath) away from the heavy burdens of the world. This is fulfilled in us under the easy yoke of Christ whose burden is light.
---Shawn.M.T on 8/25/09


You are going to HELL if you don't learn the truth. According to the Word of God and not some priest,pope, church or some false teacher who will pay a heavy price for leading all these gullible nuts to Hell.

The Sabbath has no pace in a Christians life. The bible and all of its teachings were originally meant for the Jews,only! The Christians were drafted in and the new testament teachings apply to us(Christians). This is where grace comes in for the Christian. We do not have to eat fish on Fridays,observe holy days and all that other crap. Read you bible and ask the Lord for spiritual wisdom and guidance. Because you clearly need help and .....fast!
---Robyn on 8/25/09


Hi, no you are NOT going to hell for not worshipping on Saturday! There's a verse somewhere in Colossians that mentions too that whatever day a person has decided in his heart, he should. I wish I could remember the verse--sorry. Anyway, the mark of the beast has NOTHING to do with Sunday worship, dear--relax and may God bless your worship--all days of your week! :)
---Mary on 8/25/09


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