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Is Baptism A Work

IS the act of being baptized a WORK or is being baptized to be considered FAITH?

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 ---mima on 9/2/09
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Baptizing is a command. To obey it is right. Jesus said so (Matthew 28:19).
---Betty on 9/21/09


Faith in Jesus Christ will lead you to heaven and paradise, baptism on its own cannot. Baptism is a testimony or public declaration that you give to others (by partaking in it) that you are now for Jesus and you are sharing in His death & resurrection. Baptism is a Christian rite that the Lord Jesus himself did and commanded us His followers to do.
---Adetunji on 9/20/09


If you are baptized into the RCC religion, baptism is considered faith. But faith not in God but faith in the teachings of the institution.
For we are saved by grace "through" faith in the works of Christ for our sins and faith in His resurrection.
In the RCC and similar religions baptism, and many other traditions brings salvation. But True Saving faith comes from God as a gift. Without that true saving faith no amount of works will save you, because if you only believe as Romans 1 states, it is sufficient to damn you to hell, for the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all unrighteousness, because when they knew God, they did not glorified Him as God, and glorified other saints with their traditions.
---MarkV. on 9/19/09


As a boy I once asked my father, after so much study why do the Catholic priest remain so blinded? And his reply was, Catholic priest do their religious studying in Catholic schools.

---mima on 9/18/09


What did you think he was going to tell you?, it is really not them who are blind but you because you go by your own interpretation of scripture!
---Ruben on 9/18/09


Mima. It's funny how you ignore all the non-Catholic sources I posted about this sect! You told me to study the Nicolaitans , and I did.

According to these non-Catholic sources, the Nicolaitans (Followers of Nicolas ) disobeyed the command issued to the Gentle Churches, by the Apostolic Synod held at Jerusalem in 49-50AD., that they should refrain from eating of "things sacrificed to idols" (Acts 15:29) and to commit fornication.

Do you have a King James Version Study Bible? It also agree with the sources I posted.

Why should I believe YOU above these authentic sources? Mima, it is you that need to study them, instead of passing misinformation!

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/18/09




---Ignatius and ---Cluny I understand that I do not believe what you have been taught.

"Wrong again, as in everything you say about Church history." by ---Cluny

Also 1 thank you for letting me keep my beliefs.

"Do what you will with these sources. We can't force you to change your beliefs."
by ---Ignatius

As a boy I once asked my father, after so much study why do the Catholic priest remain so blinded? And his reply was, Catholic priest do their religious studying in Catholic schools.


---mima on 9/18/09


"---Cluny "Nicolatitians" has to do with church authority ok or more correctly priest authority. In the Bible God clearly states that he hates it.

Abuse of church(priest) authority is one of the greatest wrong practiced in Christianity." (Mima)

I have researched them, and nothing you said matched with out I studied online. Once again, Mima has shown that he has no knowledge of Church History.

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/16/09


Mima. Search online for the "International Standard Bible Encyclopedia", which contradict your statements concerning the Nicolaitans.

Also search the "Faussets Bible Dictionary", and the "Smiths Bible Dictionary". You do need to research this sect, since according to the above sources, you are wrong.

According to these sources, the Nicolaitans (Followers of Nicolas ) disobeyed the command issued to the Gentle Churches, by the Apostolic Synod held at Jerusalem in 49-50AD., that they should refrain from eating of "things sacrificed to idols" (Acts 15:29) and to commit fornication.

Do what you will with these sources. We can't force you to change your beliefs.

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/17/09


\\---Cluny "Nicolatitians" has to do with church authority ok or more correctly priest authority. In the Bible God clearly states that he hates it.

Abuse of church(priest) authority is one of the greatest wrong practiced in Christianity.
---mima on 9/15/09\\

Wrong again, as in everything you say about Church history.
---Cluny on 9/15/09


"If baptism is viewed as a required prerequisite for salvation, then it is a work. If it is not required, then it is irrelevant."
---mugwump on 9/14/09

The answer is very clear and I agree with it.
---mima on 9/15/09




---Cluny "Nicolatitians" has to do with church authority ok or more correctly priest authority. In the Bible God clearly states that he hates it.

Abuse of church(priest) authority is one of the greatest wrong practiced in Christianity.
---mima on 9/15/09


***||indicates to me that your churches is practicing the deeds of the Nicolaitanes,||

The error of the Nicolatitians, based on Biblical data, was that they REFUSED to submit to the authority of the Church.

But anyway, you're wrong on a lot of things you say. This is no exception, mima.
---Cluny on 9/14/09***

In case you didn't notice, mima, I put YOUR quote in upright bars. ||, not backslashes.

And I ALWAYS follow your lead and use the lower case of your screen name.
---Cluny on 9/14/09


If baptism is viewed as a required prerequisite for salvation, then it is a work. If it is not required, then it is irrelevant.
---mugwump on 9/14/09


Peter did not preach works salvation. Never did. Many mistranslate the passages of Peter to support works for salvation, which is false.
Works is the evidence of true faith.
True faith produces good works. If there is no works, there is no true saving faith. All genuine believers with true saving faith will do good works. Again, as simple as that.
If works is the cause of our salvation then we earn our own salvation. False teachings of the RCC, Mormans, Islam, Jehovah Witnessess, SDA'S, I see by the their answers of works of the law, and many others.
---MarkV. on 9/14/09


---Cluny I believe you made a little mistake. I did not say,"If salvation comes from been baptized, it is a work's Salvation." MarkV said that Iran do agree with that statement.
---mima on 9/14/09


\\ Mima, If salvation comes from been baptized, it is a work's Salvation.\\

Then Peter preached "work's salvation."

As I've already said, baptism would be a work if you baptized youself. But you don't. You RECEIVE baptism.

||indicates to me that your churches is practicing the deeds of the Nicolaitanes,||

The error of the Nicolatitians, based on Biblical data, was that they REFUSED to submit to the authority of the Church.

But anyway, you're wrong on a lot of things you say. This is no exception, mima.
---Cluny on 9/14/09


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Mima. There is no other first-hand evidence to give us certainty about the nature of this sect, besides the Scripture you gave. The Early Church Fathers did spoke about them, but either way, nothing I said indicate that I follow them. Do tell Mima, who were they?

I believe you reading too much into my statement. Of course I can give reasons for asking permission from my Priest, but what is it to you?

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/14/09


Mima, If salvation comes from been baptized, it is a work's Salvation. If baptism is an act of obedience, it is the evidence of someone been saved already. All true faith produces fruit. No matter if you are Russian, Middle eastern, African, Mexican etc. The meaning does not change.
---MarkV. on 9/13/09


Igantius- I have had the great pleasure of being at a Russian Orthodox Liturgy, its a beautiful service. The Orthodox faith is a strong well grounded Faith, I myself accept none of the roman service, or doctrines. They added the filioque and added to the original 7 ecumenical councils. They ursurped control of the jurisdiction of other Bishops. But you already know all of this. Im honored to speak with you. Im still a priest just with the Jerusalem Orthodox. I still have dealings with the Coptic, I love the Orthodox Faith, but you know what thats like also. YHVH bless you Brother, Again I will say it, Im Honored to speak with you.
---Wayne on 9/13/09


---Ignatius-you're saying that "I do visit, with the permission of my priest," indicates to me that your churches is practicing the deeds of the Nicolaitanes, spoken of in Revelation 2:6. Please check the definition of Nicolaitanes.
---mima on 9/13/09


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Mima. I do not know what you mean.

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/12/09


\\---Igantius this statement is very revealing,"I do visit, with the permission of my priest, other near by canonical Orthodox Churches (mainly OCA and the GOAOA)."
---mima on 9/12/09\\

To me it reveals that he has many and important spiritual responsibilities at his own church.
---Cluny on 9/12/09


---Igantius this statement is very revealing,"I do visit, with the permission of my priest, other near by canonical Orthodox Churches (mainly OCA and the GOAOA)."
---mima on 9/12/09


\\and if you have the same doctrines as they do\\

As I said on another blog, sentences such as "If you do so and so...." when talking about Orthodoxy simply mean that you don't have a CLUE about what Orthooxy teaches.
---Cluny on 9/12/09


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"You made it perfectly clear you don't follow Scripture alone but you follow two, Christ and the traditions of man" (Mark V)

No, I follow Christ and no traditions of man. You may believe in Bible alone, or that the Bible interpret itself, but you made it perfectly clear those are your philosophies, not the Bible. So it is you who follow traditions of man.

"I don't know much about the Eastern Orthodoxy"

Yes, you know nothing about us. Don't forget, you also agree with the RCC on some issues.

"You can follow whoever you want. It is your choice."

Yes, I follow Jesus Christ, our Lord, God, and Savior. You may follow whoever you want as well. Go in peace.

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/12/09


wayne. My Orthodox jurisdiction is the Russian Orthodox Church Abroad (aka, The Russian Orthodox Church Outside of Russia) (ROCOR). I do visit, with the permission of my priest, other near by canonical Orthodox Churches (mainly OCA and the GOAOA). It is very interesting that you were a former Coptic Orthodox Priest. I am very interesting in your conversion story, but perhaps it will take more than 125 words.....:)

In IC.XC,
---Igantius on 9/12/09


Ignatius, you made it perfectly clear you don't follow Scripture alone but you follow two, Christ and the traditions of man, for you felt angry at the mention of Idol worship. And cluny seems to agree with you. And you are right, I don't know much about the Eastern Orthodoxy, what I do know about is the RCC and if you have the same doctrines as they do, which seems to be the case since you are defending their stand, I don't need to know more about it. I know enough to know that Christ has been replaced as the only Mediator between God and man, and with the worship of saints and Mary. That His death on the cross was not sufficient to save anyone, because it needed the good works of man. You can follow whoever you want. It is your choice.
---MarkV. on 9/11/09


Mark V "I was not asking you to follow me. I was explaining what has happened in the RCC and other churches that take tradition over Scripture. "

Not in Eastern Orthodoxy. Shows how much you know about Orthodoxy, yet you want to "preach" to Cluny and I. Let's not forget that your Protestant traditions have no Scriptura support (you made that clear), yet we are the ones in error?

"You are welcome to follow who you want and worship who you want, God gives you that freedom."

Yes, I made the decision to follow Jesus Christ, my Lord, God, and Saviour.

And Yes, I have found the Truth. That is why I am a Eastern Orthodox Christian.

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/11/09


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Bob, whoever you are, thanks for bringing up what you did about the thorn. I had not thought of that but really it is a good point to bring up. In the case of Paul, God was allowing Satan to bring this severe trouble to the Church for the purpose of humbling Paul, who, having had so many revelations, including a trip to heaven and back, would have been proud. The demonized false apostle attacking his work in Corinthians was the stake driven through his otherwise proud flesh. Could be I was also getting proud and needed humbling. But a good point. Peace to you.
---MarkV. on 9/11/09


\\You too are welcome to follow any believes you think are for you, and worship anyone you want to worship. God has also given you freedom to choose.
---MarkV. on 9/11/09\\

That's right, Mark.

You choose what you wish.

And I'll believe our Lord, God, and Saviour Jesus Christ and His holy word.
---Cluny on 9/11/09


MarkV - I dont bring doubt, I bring questions to make you think, you are to be ready to give an answer as to why you believe what you believe. This is why I push so much, if you cant answer questions for those who ask, you will never be able to bring them to YHVH. I have scriptures in Hebrew and Greek, why?
---wayne on 9/11/09


Cluny, to you I leave you peace. I would not want to you to think I think badly of you as a person or Ignatius.
As Bob put it on another blog, that I have one thorn on my side, or as scripture puts it, "a thorn on the flesh" and as with Paul's thorn, it is given to me so that I don't ever exhalt myself above measure. The results are purposeful. This thorn keeps me humble.
You too are welcome to follow any believes you think are for you, and worship anyone you want to worship. God has also given you freedom to choose.
---MarkV. on 9/11/09


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Igantius, I was not asking you to follow me. I was explaining what has happened in the RCC and other churches that take tradition over Scripture. "You are welcome to follow who you want and worship who you want, God gives you that freedom." That is why He is able to judge us.
I was once a Catholic myself so have read the history of the Church very well and their doctrines. I was giving information that is already history. That if you look for the truth you will find it. If you don't care to look for the Truth you will not find it. I leave you peace
---MarkV. on 9/11/09


Hello Wayne, I do have the Scriptures in their language. I really don't have to research much unless someone brings a topic which is in question. God has given us enough information that we are without excuse for not knowing.
If you are a priest of God, why do you do your best to bring doubt to God's Word? Putting Paul against Christ, and Paul against Peter?
Instead you should be explaining why it might be wrong but you don't even do that. Isn't a priest suppose to teach Scripture?
---MarkV. on 9/11/09


Ignatius- If I may ask, which Holy See are you apart of? I for a long time was a Coptic Orthodox priest. But now Im a priest of the Jerusalam Orthodox Patriarchate. As far as MarkV he claims to follow scripture alone but yet has know knowledge of original language and what scripture actually says.
---wayne on 9/10/09


Mark V "Cluny, what you believe I say is wrong, does not make your statement right or correct, it only gives your opinion of me. It only speaks of what you think, not what is Truth. If you were speaking for God and Scripture you would not say what you say. But since you are not, it has no value to God or to anyone who is already truely saved."

I would say to same to you Mark V. Believe what you want, but I will follow the teachings lay down in Holy Scriptures and all the Apostolic Churches (Alexandria, Jerusalem, Constantinople, Antioch, and all churches in communion with them) of the Holy Eastern Orthodox Church. Cluny, and others who are in the Truth will do the same.

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/10/09


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\\ Cluny, what you believe I say is wrong, does not make your statement right or correct, it only gives your opinion of me. \\

Everything you claimed about the Roman Catholic Church is factually untrue.
---Cluny on 9/10/09


Mark V,

I care not for the History of the Roman Catholic Church, at least not in our present discussion dealing with your Protestant traditions/customs (i.e., Bible alone, and that the Bible interpret itself), which you have made quite clear aren't supported by Holy Scriptures.

I don't believe in purgatory or making and the worshiping of Idols, works to gain salvation, however, all others are supported by Holy Scriptures, and the Early Church (1st-11th centuries) believed them!

Besides, your Protestant traditions are unscriptura and are wrong. You may follow your traditions, and believe they are right and are "Scriptura", but the bottom line is that they are not.

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/10/09


Cluny, what you believe I say is wrong, does not make your statement right or correct, it only gives your opinion of me. It only speaks of what you think, not what is Truth. If you were speaking for God and Scripture you would not say what you say. But since you are not, it has no value to God or to anyone who is already truely saved.
No one is stopping anyone from worshipping idols, going to mass, believing in purgatory, and replacing Christ in their church. They want to continue that way it is their choice.
---MarkV. on 9/10/09


There were Holy Icons and Statues at the Holy Temple/Ark. And besides, what God commanded them not to do was to make images and worship them as Idols.

When the Hebrews translated the Bible into Greek (The Septuagint, highly favored by Christ and the Holy Apostles), they translated "graven images" simply as "eidoloi", i.e. "idols." Furthermore the Hebrew word "pesel" is never used in reference to any of the images in the Temple. So clearly the reference here is to pagan images rather than images in general. Holy Icons and Statues was a very important part of Judaism.

Nothing in Scriptures forbid Holy Icons and Statues. Holy Icons and Statues goes back to the Old Testament.

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/10/09


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\\The making and worshipping of idols, is wrong, the Authority of Scripture is not sufficient, mass is wrong, purgatory is wrong, works for salvation is wrong, baptizemal regeneration is wrong, priest having the power to forgive sin is wrong. But the worst is Idol worship, for it replaces Christ with saints and Mary.
---MarkV. on 9/10/09
\\

But everything YOU said here is wrong, Mark!
---Cluny on 9/10/09


Igantius, I too agree with some doctrines the RCC teaches. I believe many denominations have some doctrines they have taught because not all of their doctrines are false. What is false is what they added as traditions and doctrines that are wrong. Look Igantius, history speaks for itself. I did not make-up the history of the RCC, they did. The making and worshipping of idols, is wrong, the Authority of Scripture is not sufficient, mass is wrong, purgatory is wrong, works for salvation is wrong, baptizemal regeneration is wrong, priest having the power to forgive sin is wrong. But the worst is Idol worship, for it replaces Christ with saints and Mary.
---MarkV. on 9/10/09


"You want me to leave the RCC and Eastern Orthodox churches alone and not mention them but it cannot be avoided when bringing examples concerning traditions." (Mark V)

Yes, I do, since we were discussing your traditions/customs. I don't believe in Bible Alone or that the Bible interpret itself, but you do, even though you can't give Scriptura support. So why bring up the RCC and attack there "unscriptura traditions" when you are quilty of the same?

To Be honest, I highly doubt you know everything about the Eastern Orthodox Church. And yes, I, a Orthodox Christian, agree with some doctrines/practices of the Roman Church, like everyone here does.

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/10/09


".....All you have to be is one who follows their doctrines about traditions." (Mark V)

And you don't believe any doctrine/practice held by the Roman Church? Come on! Everyone here on CN agree with the Roman Catholic Church on some issues, but it doesn't mean we follow "Rome". Why didn't you mention the Oriental Orthodox Churches, instead of the RCC? All the Ancient and Apostolic Churches of the East disagree with your man-made Protestant traditions.

I and Cluny are Eastern Orthodox Christians following in the footsteps of Jesus Christ (our Lord/Saviour), the Holy Apostles, there Successors, and the God-Bearing Fathers (and Mothers) of the Holy Orthodox Church since the 1st century.

In IC.XC,
---Ignatius on 9/10/09


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There's another tradition I follow that the Roman Catholic Church follows.

That of the 27 books in the NT as commonly received.

Do you follow this tradition?

Based on what verse of the Bible?

Can you find a passage in the Bible that lists these 27 books as authoritative?
---Cluny on 9/9/09


\\ Cluny, you don't have to be a Roman Catholic. All you have to be is one who follows their doctrines about traditions.//

Yes, I follow some Roman Catholic doctrines.

Among them: That Jesus is God Incarnate.

That Jesus rose from the dead.

That God is three persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

That the Bible is the Word of God.

Are you saying you reject these doctrines because they are held by Roman Catholics?

\\"You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness ..."\\

Do you have photgraphs in your house?
---Cluny on 9/9/09


Cluny, you don't have to be a Roman Catholic. All you have to be is one who follows their doctrines about traditions. Concerning God, any images that God orders is always just, and it's what He wants for His own purpose and will. He does not want others to make any images for themselves for their own purpose and their own will. If you cannot see this clearly, it is because you refuse to see it clearly. The reason your interpretation and theirs is wrong.
For He said,
"You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. You shall not worship or serv them"
---MarkV. on 9/9/09


\\Notice that God did not say, "it's ok if the Pope or the Bishops of the RCC say it ok, then you can because what I say only they can understand I mean it's ok"\\

I don't know what this has to do with anything I've said, as I'm not a Roman Catholic (something I must reiterate periodically).

BTW, are you unaware that God ordered images of cherubim to be made, not only for the Ark of the Covenant, but for elswhere in the Tabernacle?

So apparently the commandment to make no images is NOT absolute.
---Cluny on 9/8/09


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Cluny, I sure don't understand what you mean that Sola Scriptura said a women should be stone, Or that an "eye for an eye" was the cause of Sola Scriptura. Those were words were made by God.
Don't you understand anything? Sola Scriptura is not some invisible force called "Sola Scriptura."
It is a term used by readers of Scripture to make sure the passage they read has the correct meaning when they read it, by looking at other passages in Scripture that speak about the same topic.
Without using the method of Sola Scriptura a person can put his own meaning in a passage depending how he interprets a passage. Which is what the RCC and some others did with their traditions.
---MarkV. on 9/8/09


Cluny, here is the Truth for any Church,

"The Church is a servant and not a mistress. A depository and not a judge. She exercises the office of a minister, not of a magistrate. She delivers a testimony, not the judicial sentence. She discerns the canon of the Scriptures, she does not make it. She has recognize the authority of Scripture, she has not given it. The authority of Scriptures is not founded, then, on the authority of the Church, It is the Church that is founded on the Authority of the Scriptures."
History shows the RCC and some others have taken advantage of what God wrote and twisted the message to bring their own agenda, idea's and support their own traditions. Not the traditions of the Bible.
---MarkV. on 9/8/09


\\ Cluny, so what you are saying is that Scripture cannot interpret itself, it needs man's traditions, man who is sinful, to interpret the word of God. \\

That basically is what the Apostles said. Even St. Peter said there were things in St. Paul's writings that were hard to understand.

Sola scriptura said the woman in John 8 should be stoned. What did Jesus say?

Sola scriptura said "Eye for eye." What did Jesus say?

Sola scriptura said that Gentiles should be circumcised and keep Torah. What did the Apostles say?

NOWHERE does SS say, "The Bible interprets itself."
---Cluny on 9/7/09


Cluny, so what you are saying is that Scripture cannot interpret itself, it needs man's traditions, man who is sinful, to interpret the word of God. Here is an example of what God says, first. "You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. You shall not worship or serve them" Exodus 20:4-5. Sounds pretty simple to me. No metaphors, or similies, just a plain explicit statement. The primary meaning of the Hebrew word "worship" is to bow down.
Notice that God did not say, "it's ok if the Pope or the Bishops of the RCC say it ok, then you can because what I say only they can understand I mean it's ok"
---MarkV. on 9/6/09


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\\Both follow mostly the same doctrines and one of the reasons you speak against "Sola Scriptura" because you are oppose to it because of your religion.\\

Obviously, you know nothing of Orthodoxy.

Roman Catholicism and confessional Protestantism have MUCH more in common with each other.

Furthermore, neither Jesus nor the Apostles believed in "Sola scriptura."
---Cluny on 9/6/09


Ignatius, I can answer you here from the "Re-baptized when saved" blog.
You want me to leave the RCC and Eastern Orthodox churches alone and not mention them but it cannot be avoided when bringing examples concerning traditions. Both follow mostly the same doctrines and one of the reasons you speak against "Sola Scriptura" because you are oppose to it because of your religion. I am not speaking for a religion or denomination. I have no alligence to anyone but God. What you don't seem to understand is that I don't have to defend 'sola Scriptura" because Scripture interprets Scripture. How can I go against what is already Truth? Even Jesus who is the Truth quoted Scripture which is the Word of God and the Truth.
---MarkV. on 9/6/09


Ignatius 2 continue:
The question really is, do we accept traditions as Truth or do we accept the Word of God as Truth? The answer is easy, the Word of God.
The road to the Truth is the one established in Scripture. Everything in our world is changing, nothing is constant. Opinions change, views are modified, some traditions are abandoned, and many practices are updated, but God's Word remains firm, always trustworthy. Peter said, "All men are like grass, and all their glory is like the flowers of the field, the grass withers and the flowers fall, but the Word of the Lord stands forever' And this was the word that was preached to you" 1 Peter 1:24-25.
---MarkV. on 9/6/09


\\ Baptism is a TESTIMONY. \\

To whom was this "testimony" made?

It was never done before unbelievers.

Furthermore, following the precedent of the Jewish rite of Mikveh (from which Christian baptism is derived) candidates were baptized nude, with only the presbyter or bishop, sponsor, and maybe a deaconess (in the case of women) present.

If you doubt me, look up "nude baptism".
---Cluny on 9/3/09


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the baptism is an outward sign of an inward transformation. so it is not a work but an act of faith.
---ryans_mom on 9/3/09


\\Jesus Christ Is The Name of The Father, The Son & the Holy-Ghost, \\

Wrong.

"Jesus" is the name of the SON in His human nature.

Please find ONE PLACE in the NT where the Father is called anything buth "FATHER" or the Holy Spirit/Ghost anything but "Spirit/Ghost".

Give book, chapter, and verse in your answer.
---Cluny on 9/3/09


Baptism is a TESTIMONY. The only way it could be considered a work is if the person being baptized thought if was required for salvation. It's a testimony of what Christ has done for the person - it's an outward expression of a inward transaction & a promise of the one being baptized to walk in a new life according to the following verse, "Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life."
Romans 6:4 (KJV)
e
---wivv on 9/3/09


Cluny
Matt 28 v 19. (is a seed that was planted & watered). When it said go & baptise in the Name of The Father-Son & Holy Ghost, that Is what it's telling you do. Jesus Christ Is The Name of The Father, The Son & the Holy-Ghost, this Is where that seed bore fruit--->(Acts 2 v's 37-41 which Fulfills Matt 28 v's 19-20). When your batized in The Name Jesus Christ, you have His Name applied.
There is No one litterly found in scripture that was baptized in the titles Father Son & Holy Ghost(man says Holy spirit). When you are baptized you in the titles Father Son & Holy spirit, you go down a dry sinner & come up a wet sinner.
---Lawrence on 9/3/09


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\\ There is NO one found in scriptures that was baptized in the titles father son & holy spirit.<---This Is Man-made teachings.\\

So Jesus's command in Matthew 28:19 is a man-made teaching?
---Cluny on 9/3/09


Yes It Is a Work. Faith without works is dead. James 2 v 20 & v 26. Mark 16 v 16, 1st Peter 3 v 21. Being baptized has to be In Jesus Name. Acts 2 v's 37-41 which Fulfills Matt 28 v's 19-20. All were baptized in The Name of The Lord, & Jesus Christ Is The Name of The Lord.
There is NO one found in scriptures that was baptized in the titles father son & holy spirit.<---This Is Man-made teachings.
---Lawrence on 9/2/09


Baptism would be a work if you baptized yourself.

But do you baptize yourself, or do you RECEIVE baptism?

Besides, isn't the act of saving faith itself a work? YOU are the one who actually has to DO the believing.

In any case, as someone pointed out in a book on the subject, when you remove all the physical aspects of salvation, you have NO salvation.
---Cluny on 9/2/09


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