Blotted Out Of Book Of Like
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Mima, let me go over this again, the words of David are only his words. What he feels and his emotions. He is speaking from his heart. It does not mean he knows of anyone been taken out of the Book. He wishes them to be taken out of the book of the living. The book of the living is the book of Life, the book of Life is the same one that all believers are in. The next verse you gave gives the clue, for David finishes with, "And not be written with the Rightous" who are the righteous? The genuine believers already in the book, what are they? Righteous. So he is talking about the same book. |
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---MarkV. on 12/2/09 |
I have always been amazed that people cannot distinguish between the book of life and the Lamb's book of life.
David drew a difference between the Lamb's Book of Life and the Book of Life. (read Psm. 69:28). The Book of Life contains the names of those born into the world. The land book of life contains the names of those born again blood bought Christians. |
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---mima on 12/2/09 |
Michelle, You're right about names being blotted out. The above Verse Revelation 3:5 admonishes "He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment, and I (YAHUSHUA/JESUS) will not blot out his name out of the Book of Life, but, I will confess his name before My Father (YAHUVEH), and before His angels." and Revelation 22:19 warns us "And if any man (saved or lost) shall take away from the Words of the Book of this Prophecy, GOD shall take away his part out of the Book of Life..." Just as you'd stated, a name cannot be "blotted out" of the Book, if it was not already written in there sometime prior. "Overcoming" includes having victory over the lusts and sinful desires of the old flesh nature. |
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---Gordon on 12/2/09 |
Mima 2, continue: In my explanation and maybe I don't know how to explain it in the right way as others, but within my explanation no where did I mention that your name can be taken out of the Lamb book of Life. They are there from the foundation of the world.
I reminded Nana that when people speak in Scripture, what they say is not always true. When God speaks it is always true. When the devil speaks it is mixed with lies. That all of them spoke is true, that is why the Bible is true. So when one person as in Psa. 69:28 says, "Let them be blotted out of the book of the living" does not mean they will. It means that David was showing his emotions when he was talking. I hope I explained it to you. |
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---MarkV. on 11/26/09 |
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Mima, you wanted an answer and I gave your Scripture. You will believe what your heart tells you and all I can do is give you the passages and what they contain. It is up to you to believe the word of God or not to believe it. Maybe later you will believe it but for now you can just let it go. Have a great Thanksgiven. |
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---MarkV. on 11/25/09 |
--- Mark V I do not believe these books are the same. One book of life you can be blotted out from. The other book of life is distinguished by being called the lambs look of life. And the Scriptures speak of your name being found in the lambs book of life. Scriptures do not mention ever being blotted out the lambs book of life.
Everybody born has their name entered in the book of life. And those that overcome and their name entered into the lambs book of life there to be for ever. |
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---mima on 11/25/09 |
Mima, the answer is that both are refering to the same book. If you notice in the Old Testament the term refers to physical death. "let them be blotted out of the book of the living" Psa. 69:28, means "let them die a physically" Such is also the case in Exodus 32:32, where Moses prays to be blotted out of God's book, and in Daniel 12:1 where all who "shall be found written in the Book" will survive the Great Tribulation. Isaiah's reference to "everyone that is written among the living in Jerusalm." Isa. 4:3 also embraces the physically living.
In the New Testament the book of life has references to eternal life and the roster of believers (Phi. 4:3, Rev. 3:5, 22:19). |
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---MarkV. on 11/25/09 |
What is your opinion concerning this question?
Is there a difference between "the book of life" and "lambs book of life" |
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---mima on 11/24/09 |
-- Miche : 2
Sister, The 'Day of the Lord' shall not come, except there come a falling away first and that man of sin/iniquity be revealed. 2Thess.2:3
This day spoken of in 2Thess.2:3, is the day that all the workers of iniquity spoken of in Matt.7:21-23 who Christ never knew, shall be revealed !!
These sons of perdition think that in that day, every one who says "Lord Lord have we not prophesied & casted out devils & done many wonderful works in thy name?", shall enter into the Kingdom of Heaven ..... but not very one who goes to church & says Lord Lord, is an over-comer in the Lord/doing the Will of the Father which is in Heaven.
This is the 'Great Falling Away', you wish to have explained !!! |
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---Shawn.M.T. on 11/24/09 |
To Whosoever Has An Ear To Hear?
Brethren, God's Truth isn't revealed through the natural man's wisdom of using the inverse of things, taken out of contexts !!
-- Miche : 1
Sister, No !! That not what it means. To Hear & See its Truth requires keeping things Spiritually in context.
Not very one who goes to church & says Lord Lord, is of the Lord : and few in the congregation of the church in Sardis(like in present day Christian Denominations) have overcome/not defiled their garments as stated in Rev.3:4.
Rev.3:5 is a reassurance to the few who have overcome : that their names will not be blotted out of the Book of Life just b/c their congregation as a whole wasn't pure & undefiled, walking with the Lord. |
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---Shawn.M.T. on 11/24/09 |
Samuel, according to John's own definition, to be an overcomer is to be a genuine Christian (1 John 5:5)"Who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?" The book of life is a divine journal records the names of all those whom God has chosen to save and who, therefore, are to posses eternal life (13:8, 17:8, 20:12,15, 21:27, 22:19, Dan. 12:1, Luke 10:20) under no circumstances will He erase those names "All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world."
If a person is not a genuine Christian his name is not even in the Book and later blotted out. |
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---MarkV. on 11/24/09 |
The passage says that those who overcome won't be blotted out. Which is a nicer way of saying those who do not overcome will be blotted out.
The passage does not say when our names are recorded there. The character of GOD is loving and kind but he will not cover unconfessed and unforsaken sin.
Exd 34:7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear [the guilty],....
The church will be judged.1Pe 4:17 For the time [is come] that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if [it] first [begin] at us, what shall the end [be] of them that obey not the gospel of God? |
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---Samuel on 11/24/09 |
Nana, you need to get rid of Satan in your life in order to move forward. Your comments are filled with his works. Jesus say's of those who do not believe in His words concerning the assurance of the true believer,
"But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep, as I said to you. My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish, neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand."
The words of the Lord. By criticizing me you criticize the very words of God. For I spoke Truth to you, and you condemn me calling me a low life, when all I was giving you was the Truth. |
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---MarkV. on 11/24/09 |
Miche, if it can be blotted out does not mean they have been blotted out. The same is true for the soul, it can be killed but doesn't say they are been killed. With God anything is possible, if He says He has done it already then it is a done deal.
You also said that God speaks different about my comment but do not show me where its different.
Miche, I do believe you have read the Bible, as most everyone here have. But you put your own meaning on passages, where God had a different meaning. It is easy to do because many do that all the time when they try to make Scripture fit their theology. In so doing they contradict the nature and character of God. You have spoken a lot of truth many times that is why I show it to you. |
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---MarkV. on 11/24/09 |
Markv,
Why didn't you answer my questions?
If it can be blotted out(erased) then wouldn't it be written there before being erased.
It is my understanding that you can't erase something that wasn't there in the first place.
"All the names of every single overcomer is listed in that book. If it's not there, it will never be there. If its there it will always be in there. If it was removed because of some action you did, then God would have made a mistake and He never makes mistakes. Only man make mistakes."
---MarkV. on 11/20/09
You said this but God says different from what I have read. And what makes you think I haven't studied my Bible? |
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---michelle on 11/24/09 |
In the 23 years since I came to Christ, The Lord never told me to be concerned about the "book of life" (neither did Paul concern himself about it)...
1 Corinthians 2:2
"For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified".
The only thing that is really necessary for a true devotion is an understanding and complete reliance on the fulfillment of the gospel. All other understandings are unnecessary distractions from true devotion.
Intellectual understanding about the book of life cannot compare to the undying love that was so graciously given at the cross.
2 Corinthians 12:9
"but he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you". |
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---more_excellent_way on 11/24/09 |
MarkV.,
You take David, Satan, the devil, "the devil speaks in Scripture", and make a burrito? I would call that presumptious. David spoke in the same tone that God spoke in the OT. Everything was now, here and now. But Jesus rather said, "Let both grow together until the harvest:", Matthew 13:30. The end is the same, all that work iniquity, be them "born again", "holy rollers", "osas", what have you, they will end the same. Matthew 21:31 "... Verily I say unto you, That the publicans and the harlots go into the kingdom of God before you." |
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---Nana on 11/24/09 |
Miche, as I said before to you and that is that you need to get the facts about God first. Learn who He is and always will be. And when you answer a passage and it seems to contradict who God is you have got it wrong. And most of the things you have said you have got them wrong because of that one reason. Man changes but God is the same yesterday today and forever. His nature, character do not change, and neither do His attributes. Once you get that right, you will get everything right. |
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---MarkV. on 11/23/09 |
Markv,
Why would I be angry? And why would you assume that?
All I said is that what you are saying doesn't make sense. Not according to what God is telling me or what I have seen from others.
God says if we overcome we can't be blotted out, right? Well, what happens to the ones who don't overcome?
It says Blotted out, Markv, that tells me that at one time they were listed or else why would God say he would erase them(blot out). How do you erase something that was not there, Mark?
And there aren't 2 books of life.
And what about the great falling away when Christians will be deceived, how do you explain that? |
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---michelle on 11/23/09 |
Nana, 2 continue:
If you notice that this is a Psalm of David. An urgent pleas for help in troubled time. David does not know what God is doing in heaven. He does not witness God blotting names out. There is no way he could possibly know this is happening. He is speaking what is in his heart, his emotions and his feelings at the time.
In Scripture, what God says, is true, what man says, may or may not be true, what Satan says, usually mixes truth and lies. That they spoke is true. |
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---MarkV. on 11/21/09 |
Nana, that was no argument at all with what you posted.
Of course our sins are blotted out. They are forgiven. And then you give Psa. 68:28 as if God had spoken that He would blot out the names of those already on the list.
The Psalmist here was angry and he was the one speaking. It didn't mean that what he spoke was true or not. It was his feelings and emotions. He was been ridiculed. So he answered that way. Not that God was already blotting names out. You took someone opinion and made it a fact. When the devil speaks in Scripture it is not true. He is a liar. Just because he speaks does not make it true what he is saying. That he said it is true, but what he said is not true. |
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---MarkV. on 11/21/09 |
Good going michelle, that is how I read too.
Isaiah 44:22: "I have blotted out, as a thick cloud, thy transgressions, and, as a cloud, thy sins: return unto me, for I have redeemed thee."
Pslms 69:28: "Let them be blotted out of the book of the living, and not be written with the righteous."
Acts 3:19: "Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord,"
Matthew 7:23: "And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." This one is like Arnold Schwarzenegger in "Eraser", "You have been erased." |
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---Nana on 11/20/09 |
Miche, again, you have to go read what I wrote. Did I say no souls were been saved? No I didn't. Do not imply something not there. If you knew God, you would have known that God already finished the plan. That all of it is open to His eyes. That when He makes something it is alway right and just. That He knows the beginning and the end of all things. He does not learn through time every time someone is save. He already knows who is and who is not, who will come to Christ and who won't. The only reason you have trouble with Scriptures that seem to imply something is because you do not know the God of the Bible and when comparing passages you concluded He does not know, which is saying, our God is dumb or is learning like a child, His Omniscient. |
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---MarkV. on 11/20/09 |
Miche, 2 continue:
let me make something clear again before you get angry again.
When I say you do not know the God of the Bible I mean you have never studied who God is. By not sudying who He is you make many errors in your answers. You conclude many times, He is learning. Let me say He is not controlled by time. He is not increasing in knowledge. He knows all.
Then when you read a passage that seems to imply something you go for it and in doing so you compromise His deity or His nature or even His character. |
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---MarkV. on 11/20/09 |
If it's not there, it will never be there. - markv
Are you saying God doesn't save souls everyday?
If it was removed because of some action you did, then God would have made a mistake and He never makes mistakes. Only man make mistakes.
---MarkV. on 11/20/09
Man does make mistakes and they can come to Christ only to fall away. I thought that was what the great falling away is. People who were in the Book of life but were blotted out because they fell from Grace.
This verse tells me that they can be blotted out for not remaining and enduring with God.
Blotted means to remove or erase.
How could they be blotted out if they weren't written in it in the first place?
what you are saying makes no sense. |
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---michelle on 11/20/09 |
Michelle, what it means is that if you do not overcome, you are not an overcomer, and if not an overcomer, your name will not be listed in the book of life. All the names of every single overcomer is listed in that book. If it's not there, it will never be there. If its there it will always be in there. If it was removed because of some action you did, then God would have made a mistake and He never makes mistakes. Only man make mistakes. |
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---MarkV. on 11/20/09 |
"Dont live in daily torment.
Sancitification IS instantaneous.."
JackB
"For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified." Who is perfected are those which ARE santified.
Jeremiah 4:4: "Circumcise yourselves to the LORD, and take away the foreskins of your heart, ye men of Judah and inhabitants of Jerusalem: lest my fury come forth like fire, and burn that none can quench it, because of the evil of your doings." Thereafter comes the perfecting, yet even a serious foot washing (sin is no small matter) here and there is needed.
Yeah right, trying to climb any other way... |
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---Nana on 11/19/09 |
Dont live in daily torment.
Sancitification IS instantaneous..
Heb 10:10,14 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
Rom 4:4-8 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
Trying to climb the ladder to Heaven will land a man in the pit of hell. Unless you allow God in His wonderous mercy and grace to set you on the top rung himself. |
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---JackB on 11/19/09 |
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Without Holiness, no man will see the LORD. Holiness means turning from sin and evil. Holiness involves loving GOD first and your neighbour as yourself. Holiness means loving Truth and disdaining evil and sin, no matter how pleasurable or attractive it is. Heaven is a Place for people who have learned to love GOD and man, and learned to live righteously before GOD. This involves time, and is a process. Santification is not instantaneous, it is a daily surrender to YAHUSHUA (JESUS). It is a daily decision to "crucify the flesh nature", and to follow the Spirit. I myself have not "arrived", but, this is my Goal. If a Christian deliberately chooses to hang on to a pet sin, it will be enough to land him or her in Hell at death. |
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---Gordon on 11/18/09 |
Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
Rev 12:11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony, and they loved not their lives unto the death.
It takes a humble heart willing to place your faith solely in the blood of Jesus Christ to overcome Satan and the world. Gods grace is the only thing we can boast of. |
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---JackB on 11/15/09 |
The bowing of the knee and the confession of the tongue that Jesus Christ is Lord will take place at the great white throne judgment where the resurrected wicked will be judged and sent to the lake of fire. |
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---mima on 11/11/09 |
Yes, that is the same thing. When God says, the repented obedient will not be condemned, that is the same thing as, the nonrepented disobedient will be condemned. |
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---Eloy on 11/11/09 |
Samuel ,How will they will recognize an "exact amount of punishment" ? They will never be resurected to know.They will never regain consciousness.There will never be a skip in memory like one may naturally die of old age or go to sleep for they will never regain that memory that belonged to them.They are as though as they never was. |
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---earl on 11/11/09 |
Many good points.
The resurrected wicked will proclaim before they perish that GOD was correct and bow down to them. Then they will be destroyed in the lake of fire. Each will recieve the exact amount of punishment they deserve. |
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---Samuel on 11/11/09 |
"Does this mean that if we don't overcome, we will be blotted out of the Book of Life?" Yes.
Therefore recognize just what it means to overcome, and just what it is that we are overcoming.
"whatsoever is born of God overcomes the world:" and "Who is he that overcomes the world, but he that believes that Jesus is the Son of God?"
For "Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwells in him, and he in God.
You are of God, little children, and have overcome them: [those who oppose Christ, and who you are in Christ] because greater is He that is in you, than 'he' [that Wicked One] that is in the world, and this is the victory that overcomes the world, [even] our faith." |
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---joseph on 11/11/09 |
1stcliff,
I was only quicker with the pen.Thanks. |
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---earl on 11/3/09 |
Earl, I couldn't have said it better!
Problem lies in the erroneous belief in the "immortality of the soul" Nice answer! |
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---1st_cliff on 11/2/09 |
The registry book of life for our world contains all living beings that are created in God's image.You might say it is a registry.It is as it is a book of life-those who are of the living.
Complete personality extinction occurs when at roll call one is blotted out from the book-.This also is known as to perish as in Jo.3.16.
To be blotted out is permanent,the judgement is final and the personality ceases to exist in personality,conscoiusness or any human like or non human like form.
The personality will never see hell because the person is blotted out of existance. |
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---earl on 11/2/09 |
You got it right! |
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---Pierre on 11/2/09 |
The answer to your question depends on what you belive "Book of Life" means.
Is it a literal book, or collection of books, in heaven?
Are they scrolls or codices?
Or is this a figure of speech? |
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---Cluny on 11/2/09 |
I believe he that does not overcometh will be the blotted out of the book of life. Go to hell.
But let these verses and first John comfort you. "4-For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.
5-Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?" |
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---mima on 11/2/09 |
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