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What Is Regeneration

What is regeneration? Do you know the moment you were reborn? Show by Scripture.

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 ---MarkV. on 2/1/10
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Amen sis Kath, tell the truth and the whole truth!
Markv really needs to have his eyes open LORD please open his eyes!
---miche3754 on 2/23/10

Miche, I'm STILL waiting for answers concerning my other questions...that Jews were held up in faith until Christ came.....

He can't answer them. That's why.
---kathr4453 on 2/23/10


How did God hit you in the Heart, Markv?

That is what I am trying to get you to understand.
You heard his word, and you believed it was truth and you made up your mind to follow Jesus, all this happened at the same time. When it did, the Holy Spirit came into your heart and started to transform you.
It was a choice you made Markv. You chose to believe God and not the enemy, and because you made the right choice, God is going to save you.
It is not because he chose you before the foundation of the world, it is because you chose to believe in the PLAN God set before the foundation of the world.
You chose to believe, Markv, God did not make you believe!
---miche3754 on 2/23/10


It seems that "regeneration" can mean making things new and rebirth. Jesus speaks of "in the regeneration" (Matthew 19:28-29), when He will sit on His throne and the twelve will "judge the twelve tribes of Israel." I'd say this has to do with when God makes all things new, in the new heavens and new earth. The nature of things will be changed into "the glorious liberty of the children of God." (Romans 8:21) Is not God able to resurrect the whole universe, into the resurrectional glory "of the children of God"? And first, *in* us, now God has regenerated us, as we have in Titus 3:4-7. He has washed us to make us new, by changing our nature from corrupted, to how His love is in the Holy Spirit.
---Bill_bila5659 on 2/23/10


Interestingly Peter did NOT say, Oh there is absolutely nothing you can do to be saved, If God doesn't regenerate you first you can't be saved.

You will NEVER find the doctrine of Calvinism in the Book of ACTS!
---kathr4453 on 2/22/1


Amen sis Kath, tell the truth and the whole truth!
Markv really needs to have his eyes open LORD please open his eyes!
---miche3754 on 2/23/10


Miche, God hit me in the heart, He awaken me to the light. I was in darkness as some here. I could not come to the light because as the Scriptures says' man love darkness. If something simple as this you cannot understand then no amount of Truth can help you. You can keep giving contradicting statements if you wish because you have no choice, you believe one thing and say another.
If you had read the teachings of Shawn T, that those who are lost make acts of goodness, but they are all sin without faith in Christ. If there was one thing good in the lost, God would not have said, "There is none who does good" Everyone lost has no faith. Shawn T teaches very good, you should listen to him if you cannot understand me.
---MarkV. on 2/23/10




Markv,
Just goes to show that maybe God needs to hit you over the head with HIS common sense stick. You didn't even realize that I was making a point.
Yes, man can do good, man sometimes unknowingly seeks out God. In fact, that is exactly what the unsaved are doing. They are searching for the truth. It is our job as the saved to show them the truth in us- Christ's light, and help bring them into the light.
Again, man is not totally depraved, Markv. You just need eyes to see it.
We are all searching and it is the enemy's job to stop us.
Tell me Markv, if man was so depraved, why did God even bother? It would do you good to really listen to Shawn when he teaches, maybe you will finally see the error of Calvinism.
---miche3754 on 2/23/10


"Nana, so grace was lost someplace and Noah found it. Great job for Noah, but what about his family? They could not have found grace themselves since Noah already had found it."
---MarkV. on 2/19/10

Matthew 13:45_46: "Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls: Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it."

By your logic, does that mean that only ONE MAN found and even purchased his way into the kingdom of heaven?

Exodus 33:17: "And the LORD said unto Moses, I will do this thing also that thou hast spoken: for thou hast found grace in my sight, and I know thee by name."

Ooops,one more...!
---Nana on 2/22/10


To Whosoever Has An Ear To Hear?

Brethren, I was reborn the moment God's Grace through Faith in Christ was Heard : and Hearing came by the Word of God !! Eph.1,13,2:8~Rom.3:22,10:17

We ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts & pleasures, living in malice, envy, and hating one another : But after that the Kindness and Love of God our Savior toward man appeared, not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His Mercy He Saved us, by the washing of Regeneration and Renewing of the Holy Ghost which He shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior. That being Justified by His Grace, we should be made Heirs according to the Hope of Eternal Life. Titus 3:3-7
---Shawn.M.T on 2/22/10


Acts 16:30-32

30And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

31And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

32And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.

Interestingly Peter did NOT say, Oh there is absolutely nothing you can do to be saved, If God doesn't regenerate you first you can't be saved.

You will NEVER find the doctrine of Calvinism in the Book of ACTS!
---kathr4453 on 2/22/10


Miche #3, Here is what you said,

"Amen Kathr there is no such thing as total depravity"

Just to bring you to what you said and then turn what you just said around to mean something different just as Kathr, for now you say,

"I know mima, I asked that question myself...
How is a person who is unsaved do "Good works" if they are totally depraved and incapable of any good at all?"


Do you see what I am talking about Miche? Exactly what I said to you. How can he Miche? how can person unsave do good? If they are incapable of any good at all?
---MarkV. on 2/22/10




Markv, to believe something is to have faith in it.
That is why God says for us to have faith in him NOT in man.
Why would God say this if it weren't possible?
We know that faith in God comes by hearing and believing his word.
Do you deny that?
Or again, do you argue with the all powerful word of God placing your calvinistic beliefs above God's word?
See God knows his creation. He knows man will have faith in what man believes to be true. And this is what God is talking about and how we know we have a choice.
Ephesians talks about only those who believe/have faith in Christ are predestined. BELIEVE Markv, you miss the little and very important things in God's word.
Mima, its okay, I still love you and you too Markv.
---miche3754 on 2/22/10


---miche3754 on 2/22/10, my apologies I thought you were making qualifying statements and misunderstood.
---mima on 2/22/10


Miche, thank you for praying for me. Praying is a blessing, you've got many.
I said that when you stand before Jesus "before" you confess Him as Lord and Savior, you have to believe by faith what you are going to say. You have to believe He is who He is. You have to see Him, and you have to love Him. That is before you confess Christ. Otherwise how can you confess if you are still in unbelief? Still cannot see or hear Him calling? That comes when you are made alive to Christ by the Spirit.
Then you confess Him as Lord and Savior. Why? Because you believe and because you love Him. That is why you confess. Keep reading the passages you just gave. You have not got it yet.
Again, thanks for the prayers, I will do also.
---MarkV. on 2/22/10


Miche #2: If you confess Him as Savior before you have faith in Him, then your commitment was false. You hadn't believe and you confessed Him. Do you not get that part Miche? That is why Eph. starts with,
And you He made alive who were dead in traspasses and sins, in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of this world, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience"
He made us alive while we were dead in sins. Very simple message. You want to twist out of what the Word of God says but you cannot escape. It is there for all to read.
---MarkV. on 2/22/10


--miche3754 on 2/22/10 said,
"When a person stands before Christ, that person has to see Christ, understand the gospel, love Christ, have faith in Christ, before he confesses Him as his Lord and Savior."

Now Romans 10:13 says,"For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved".

miche's qualifications for salvation seems a bit wordy in light of what the Bible says.
---mima on 2/22/10

Mima, I didn't say those things were qualifications. Markv did. I was only quoting him and responding.
Yes, salvation is a not work. The work comes AFTER and it is done by God on us, and through us.
---miche3754 on 2/22/10


Jonah 2:8 (NIV) Those who cling to worthless idols forfeit the grace that could be theirs.


If God determined before time began who would be reprobates, and therefore does not extend the grace to them by which they could be saved, how logically can we understand this verse's statement that these reprobates, "forfeited the grace that could be theirs.?"

Did they forfeit Grace before the world began? Did they even exist before the world began? Or do those who cling to idols forfeit GRACE now, by their own self willed disobedience?

You can't FORFIET what is not yours to begin with can you?
---kathr4453 on 2/22/10


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---miche3754 on 2/22/10 said,
"When a person stands before Christ, that person has to see Christ, understand the gospel, love Christ, have faith in Christ, before he confesses Him as his Lord and Savior."

Now Romans 10:13 says,"For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved".

miche's qualifications for salvation seems a bit wordy in light of what the Bible says.
---mima on 2/22/10


Markv, please use context NOT cherry picking
John 3:18-21
18Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.
19This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil.
20Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed
21But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God.

v21 says not all are depraved, Markv. And v20 says 'whoever', NOT everybody, like Markv would have u believe.
---miche3754 on 2/22/10


When a person stands before Christ, that person has to see Christ, understand the gospel, love Christ, have faith in Christ, before he confesses Him as his Lord and Savior.
Jesus said, "And this is the Judgment, that light is come into the world and men loved the darkness rather than the light"
---MarkV. on 2/20/10
Tell me something Mark, How does a sinner "see Christ's Light"?
Through US as Christians. They see God's love in us, and they start to want it for themselves.
Now ask yourself this question, do sinner SEE that you are Christ's? D show the light the was placed in you at your salvation or do you hide it under a bushel because you think God only saves who he wants?
---miche3754 on 2/22/10


Jody, the sinner has no power to turn himself unto God, but is turned or renewed by divine grace before he can do anything spiritual. "The nature of the divine goodness is not only to open to those that knock, but also to cause them to knock and ask." Man is free but he cannot originate the love of God in his heart. His will is free in the sense that it is not controlled by any force outside of himself. As a bird with a broken wing is 'free' to fly but not able, so the natural man is free to come to God but not able. How can he repent of his sin when he loves it? How can he come to God when he hates Him? This is the inability of the will under which lost man finds himself. "you will not come to Me, that ye may have life"
---MarkV. on 2/22/10


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The Holy Spirit did not INDWELL those in the OT. The SPIRIT, Spirit of GRACE or The Spirit of the LIFE OF CHRIST however you want to say it, sets us free from the Law, (speaking as a Jew here). So if I lived back before Christ came, can anyone find any OT scripture giving me the right to be set free from the Law?? If the Jews were held under Law until Christ came, were Gentiles then the only ones given the Holy Spirit to be regenerated? If that were so, wouldnt the Galatians KNOW this? Wouldnt Paul have shown the Gentiles that they were ALWAYS the privileged ones to have the Holy Spirit and only the Jews had to wait?
---kathr4453 on 2/22/10


Please post.


MarkV, how do you EXPLAIN these verses? WE Jews were shut up unto the Faith which should AFTERWARDS be revealed? Was THIS FAITH not just faith...given to Gentiles in the OT? BUT wait, Salvation/ the covenants etc is OF the Jews correct?

Galatians 3:22-24

22But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.

23But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

24Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
---kathr4453 on 2/22/10


When a person is convicted of sin and receives Jesus Christ,it is at that moment that our minds are enlightened and changed. It is at that time that we are born again. Born of the Spirit. Yes, the person realizes what is going on at the moment that God quickens Himself within him. It is then that the Holy Spirit indwells us. 1Pet:23, Matt.19:28,Titus3:5,Eph2:1,4-5,John3:3-8,2Cor5:17,Ez36:26,Psm51:10,Jer31:31-34,1Cor2:6-16 and many more.
---jody on 2/21/10


Miche, thank's for praying for me. God has answered your prayers and others. Maybe not as you like but nevertheless He answered it. I have found the Truth and continue to learn more as days go by. My prayers for you have not been answered yet, but I have hope that one day, you will roll up the blinds so that you will see clearly the Word of God. Again thanks for your prayers, they mean a lot to me.
Something simple to remember:
When a person stands before Christ, that person has to see Christ, understand the gospel, love Christ, have faith in Christ, before he confesses Him as his Lord and Savior.
Jesus said, "And this is the Judgment, that light is come into the world and men loved the darkness rather than the light"
---MarkV. on 2/20/10


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Kathr, now your words are so far gone that you don't even realize who brings people to spiritual life. You said,
"MarkV, did Achish regenerate David?"
Kathr, it is the Holy Spirit who brings people to life, not a person or for that matter a king like Achish. You have put a different meaning in the whole passage again.
Here is what my Bible says,
"Then David said to Achish, 'If I have now found favor in your eyes, let them give me a place in some town in the country,"
This passage is not even talking about Salvation, rebirth, regeneration but talking about a place where they could stay.
But hey, you are getting some amens.
---MarkV. on 2/19/10


are all under sin,
Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
Rom 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

except Noah and those with freewill you would have to conclude calling God a liar just with these verses

Rom 3:12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable, there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

that is why God says HE WILL have mercy on whom HE WILL have mercy. That is why it is called grace coz it was by God's grace Noah was saved and ALL whomChrist came for etc
---steven-rem7000 on 2/19/10


Please Post for MarkV,

1 Corinthians 3:1
And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.

1 Corinthians 3:3
For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
1 Corinthians 3:2-4

1 Corinthians 3:4
For while one saith, I am of Paul, and another, I am of Apollos, I am of Calvin, are ye not carnal?

Paul is addressing CHRISTIANS who have not died to SELF.

Carnal vs Mature. Canal drink milk only Mature Christians EAT MEAT!!!


Why would a depraved unbeliever be of Paul in the first place?
---kathr4453 on 2/19/10


Mima,
Nobody said Noah was perfect. By the way, if what you say is truth, then all of the giants were destroyed in the flood and we are all capable to do what Noah did since man comes from him and Noah from Adam. We are not totally depraved!

That is right God's love for US! All of mankind not just one or two BUT ALL.

That is why God is "Long suffering, not will that any should parish".
God stepped down from his glory and sacrificed himself for US! That is love.
He loves us so much that he gives us a choice.
Love is not making someone do something they don't want to do but ASKING them to do it.
God asks us to choose HIM and not the enemy.
---miche3754 on 2/19/10


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mima, I was wondering, of all those of the line of Seth, it would appear only Noah and his sons and wives were spared....even the Godly line of Seth perished. I believe this is what is meant by the sons of god marrying the daughters of men. I actually don't believe angels married earthly woman and had children, because angels can not procreate.

Therefore, righteousness is not something passed from generation to generation. Noah found Grace in God's eyes, because obviously Noah and family did not participate in the EVIL going on....yet his cousins, brothers, sisters etc did!
---kathr4453 on 2/19/10


Special act of God in which the recipient is passive. God alone awakens the person Spiritually through the power of His Holy Spirit....In a technical sense the act of regeneration takes place at the moment of conversion as the individual is spiritually awakened]. Found only in Matt. 19:28, The creation and Titus 3:5, regeneration of the individual.....Mine took place out in my front yard sitting under an old oak tree in June 2000. Sorry to say I do not know the day or exact date. I felled to record it. However, it was either a Monday or Tuesday because I thought about going to prayer meeting, but decided to wait until Sunday. And I believe it was either the first or second week of the month.
---catherine on 2/19/10


1 Samuel 27:5
And David said unto Achish, If I have now found grace in thine eyes, let them give me a place in some town in the country, that I may dwell there: for why should thy servant dwell in the royal city with thee?


MarkV, did Achish regenerate David?
---kathr4453 on 2/19/10


Amen Kath!
There is no such things as total depravity.
We can find God without the Holy Spirit being in us first(this is not possible anyway without believing Christ FIRST)
You and Nana have done an awesome job on this, just praying that Markv will receive the truth.
---miche3754 on 2/19/10


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Total depravity is the reality. It is not our goodness that draws God to us but rather it is God's love for us that does the drawing.

Noah's finding grace in the eyes of God has to do with the fact that his ancestry was clean of the deluding effects that brought about someone like the giant Goliath. Noah of course had some sin, drunkenness, nakedness, let's be careful about making Noah perfect.
---mima on 2/19/10


Kathr, there is no such thing as a carnal Christian. Words used by Christiandom but not fact. Second, if none of the people saved in the Old Testament were reborn, how can they enter the kingdom of God? What you are suggesting is that people without rebirth can enter heaven, when Jesus said,
"Jesus answered' Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, you must be born again."
Jesus said the opposite of what you say. You must have another answer of course.
---MarkV. on 2/19/10


Nana..great point, Noah FOUND Grace in God's EYES...God's eyes don't regenerate anyone. If that were so, no need for Jesus to die on a cross, shed His Blood for the forgiveness of sin, and rise from the dead for our justification.

However what this DOES say is...there is no such thing as TOTAL DEPRAVITY!!!
---kathr4453 on 2/19/10


MarkV, the passage in 1 Cor Chapter 2 is talking about those already saved. Paul is addressing Baby Christians he calls carnal, still thinking out of their natural mind. He said He only fed them milk and regretted it because they didn't understand the deeper spiritual things... go on to Chapter 3...but first start with Chapter 1....

MarkV, Abel was saved BY FAITH yet was not regenerated or Born Again first..No one in the OT was Born Again who were saved by FAITH. They did not have to be regenerated first to have faith, neither did Abraham. Romans 4.

Read Hebrews 11. OT Saints died without RECEIVING THE PROMISE. The Promise was the Holy Spirit, given in the New Covenant after Jesus died and rose from the dead.
---kathr4453 on 2/19/10


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Nana, so grace was lost someplace and Noah found it. Great job for Noah, but what about his family? They could not have found grace themselves since Noah already had found it.
---MarkV. on 2/19/10


concerning this post
---MarkV. on 2/18/10

This is very true Markv. When you speak about salvation of fallen man you have to tell it all not just half.
The Holy Spirit was poured out upon all man-DRAWS ALL MAN-(not in but ON)Joel 2 & Acts 2- Holy Spirit convicts sinners of their sin! When this happens, they do one of 2 things- receive the truth or rebel.
When Christ died, he gave access to ALL, not some- WHOSOEVERWILL! His Spirit poured out!
NONE of us knew anything until we first believed Christ. Salvation starts the moment a person believes in their heart and that decision is made by CHOICE not by force like you think. Once they choose LIFE, the HS comes to live IN them and teach them things of God.
---miche3754 on 2/19/10


"Nevertheless, Noah found grace in the sight of GOD (grace, Gods grace)How?"

Noah did not just receive grace, he FOUND it>
Genesis 6:9 "These are the generations of Noah. Noah was a righteous man, blameless in his generation. Noah walked with God. 10 And Noah had three sons, Shem, Ham, and Japheth."

Even our Lord did abide by that same relationship in that He said: John 8:29: "And he who sent me is with me. He has not left me alone, for I always do the things that are pleasing to him."
So then, we see that righteousness is not just a thought or imputation, it is complemented in action, ("Noah walked with God").
---Nana on 2/18/10


Kathr, eternal life is what we get when we are reborn. Adam was to receive life if he obeyed. It is something God gives to those who born again. You again gave a good passage in 2 Cor.4:4 that passage again makes my point to you, but lets look at 1 Cor. 2:4 first,
"But the natural man (lost) does not recive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, nor can he know them, for they are spiritually discerned"
A lost person with his free will cannot receive the things of the Spirit, illumination to the word, life eternal, faith, nor understanding to know the things of God.
Now lets go to the passage you gave, start at v.3, The lost are blinded and cannot understand the bible, why?
---MarkV. on 2/18/10


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Rm3:9-18... don't cut these out, i am in that number, 144k (one of many numbers of completion), the world, the flood etc. Nevertheless, Noah found grace in the sight of GOD (grace, Gods grace)How? It was given him "by grace" is one saved,through "faith" (ones faith WILL not save them! period) It is Christ faithfulness "It is Finished" for therein is the righteousness of God revealed and word is something BIG to those being saved in God's economy. It "TELLS" of the Way,the Truth and Life. Why? coz it is eteranl life KNOWING THE TRUTH Jn17:3 look at ch17 reconcile all the scriptures 1Co 2:15 But he that is spiritual judgeth "ALL" things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
Act4:12
---steven-rem7000 on 2/18/10


Kathr, you say a lot and what you say does not conform to the passages you give. John 3:16 you gave. No rebirth anywhere there but if you had read v.19,20 you would have read that the lost are in darkness. They cannot see the light no matter how much free will they have,

---MarkV. on 2/18/

Oh MarkV, ETERNAL LIFE is the New Birth. Eternal Life is the life of the risen Christ in you, Bogotten /Birthed/Born again is also the life of the risen Christ in you.

Stay away from commentaries, and let the Holy Spirit teach you. Without the New Birth you will perish.

The New Birth IS ETERNAL LIFE!!! The New Birth is the Spiritual Birth...flesh and blood cannot enter the Kingdom ,only the New Man who has received the New birth.
---kathr4453 on 2/18/10


Please post for MarkV,



John 3:16 is the GOSPEL.

2 Corinthians 4:4
In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

2 Timothy 1:10
But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:

2 Timothy1:10 and 2 Cor 4:4 say it all!
---kathr4453 on 2/18/10


Kathr, you say a lot and what you say does not conform to the passages you give. John 3:16 you gave. No rebirth anywhere there but if you had read v.19,20 you would have read that the lost are in darkness. They cannot see the light no matter how much free will they have,
"And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil."
The condemnation that everyone lost is in, is that they love darkness rather then what? Jesus, who is the light. Now who comes to the light?, "v. 21, He who does the Truth comes to the light," did you get that, Only those who already do the truth come to the light.
---MarkV. on 2/18/10


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Miche, I think what MarkV doesn't grasp YET is this:

We are BEGOTTEN SONS through Jesus Christ. Begotten means BIRTHED BY GOD. Begotten Sons AKA Born Again all come through Jesus Christ.

We have been Begotten again/Born Again

1 Peter 1:3
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us(Born Again) again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

1 John 5:18
We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not, but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not

Revelation 1:5
And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, ---
---kathr4453 on 2/18/10


Amen Kath,

What people don't realize is that We would not be able to be indwelled with the Spirit if Christ had not died on the Cross either.
In the OT, the Holy Spirit could be upon people but not IN people.
We have Christ to thank for that.
---miche3754 on 2/18/10


Kathr, said,
"The WORD in Peter, not only is Christ who is the WORD, but it is Christ who QUICKENS the dead via CALVARY. John 3:16"
Nothing close of what she said is found John 3:16.
---MarkV. on 2/18/10

MarkV, verse snatchers read a verse, numbered by man, not GOD.

Please begin at the beginning of John where the WORD became FLESH. Now ask yourself WHY. You will find the answer in Hebrews 1/2 among several places. The WORD took upon Him the seed of Abraham, becoming flesh to die on a cross for OUR SIN.

Adam/Eve sinned, and they died..spiritually as well as physically. The New Birth or eternal life, or regeneration is our NEW LIFE we have in the RISEN Christ who made Eternal life/New Birth possible.
---kathr4453 on 2/18/10


Nicodemus should have known about the New Birth, as it was spoken of in the OT. The New Birth is salvation! period. The OT prophesied about the Messiah who would come to save man from their sin, and that in the New Covenant of which Christ is the mediator, the Holy Spirit would be given.

There is NO SCRIPTURE in the OT concerning the Spirit that it would be given FIRST to only a select people to believe on teh Messiah!

Jesus is actually rebuking Nicodemus for not knowing what he should have known.

Isaiah 53 ALSO prophesied the crucifixion of the Messiah. In Gal, Paul said the Spirit was also promised through Abraham to Gentiles. The Spirit is Grace verses LAW/Flesh.

Read Hebrews 13:20 & 21 with Romans 8:11-13.
---kathr4453 on 2/18/10


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Only the ones who believe, will have everlasting life. Why? Because they believed in the Son. No new birth mentioned.
---MarkV. on 2/18/10

You are 1/2 right, because you leave out important information. Those who believe in Christ become born again by the Spirit.
If you read further down in John chapter 3, you would see that, Markv.
I have advised you many times to stop dissecting the word of God and take it as a whole and then you would understand, but you aren't listening.
You are still stuck in Calvin, Markv. Understand that all it takes is TRUE belief in Christ, then God takes care of the rest.
---miche3754 on 2/18/10


1 Peter 3:18
For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

MarkV, ONLY Jesus death on the cross and resurrection can save or give anyone eternal life AKA: The New Birth.

To as many as receive HIM. Who is the HIM?

Again the Holy Spirit TESTIFIES to Christ. The Holy Spirit did not die for your sin.

Jesus Saves! We're SAVED/ Regenerated/ Born Again/ given New Life/ or how ever many ways you want to say it BY THE DEATH and Resurrection and SHED Blood of Jesus Christ. There's no regeneration to believe the Gospel. However you must be regenerated to understand the deeper Mysteries.
---kathr4453 on 2/18/10


Kathr, said,
"The WORD in Peter, not only is Christ who is the WORD, but it is Christ who QUICKENS the dead via CALVARY. John 3:16"
Nothing close of what she said is found John 3:16. In fact it says, "God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life"
1. God loves the world.
2. God gave His begotten Son.
3. Whosoever believes in Him will not perish.
4. but have everlasting life.
Only the ones who believe, will have everlasting life. Why? Because they believed in the Son. No new birth mentioned.
---MarkV. on 2/18/10


John 15:26
But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

1 Corinthians 15:45
And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul, the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

1 Peter 3:18
For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

Quickened is what being Born Again is!
---kathr4453 on 2/18/10


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Markv,
I liked yours but why you stopped at stating a person must reborn and go on to tell HOW they are reborn.
When you leave out scripture when explaining a thing, you leave a person with only half of the truth. See verses 15-21>---miche3754 on 2/17/10

Absolutely Miche, the Lord showed me that last night, Jesus goes on in chapter 3 to EXPLAIN HOW one receives the New Birth....

The WORD in Peter, not only is Christ who is the WORD, but it is Christ who QUICKENS the dead via CALVARY. John 3:16

The Holy Spirit ILLUMINATES the WORD. The Holy Spirit ALWAYS points to Christ...ALWAYS!!!
---kathr4453 on 2/17/10


Rob and Kath,
I really enjoyed your posts. they are dead on scripture based truth.
Markv,
I liked yours but why you stopped at stating a person must reborn and go on to tell HOW they are reborn.
When you leave out scripture when explaining a thing, you leave a person with only half of the truth. See verses 15-21
Notice they say there are those who do truth find the light, those who do evil hide from the light. BIG clue that we can, are capable of, and do seek out God before being saved.
And v 8 speaking not just of the Spirit by itself but a person who is already reborn of the Spirit.it ends with "So is everyone born of the spirit"
---miche3754 on 2/17/10


Mark, rebirth, is the beginning of a new life in Christ. A life that gives evidence of love not only for Christ Jesus but for our fellow man. Very little evidence is given by so many that it becomes hard to tell who is reborn. "Do not present your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin, but present yourselves to God as being alive from the dead." Things we did we should now be ashame "for the end of those things is death. We should be slaves to God
---Rob on 2/17/10


Peter says, Being born again, not by corruptible seed, but incorruptible, through the word of God, which liveth and abideth forever (1Pe 1:23).

Jesus said in Matthew..those who FOLLOW ME IN THE REGENERATION...

So is everyone who is born of the spirit.. This does not say the Holy Spirit Himself is out of control blowing where He wants to blow, and an independent contractor from the Father and Son!

The Holy Spirit we are told in Acts are GIVEN to those who OBEY.

Now those Born Again of the Spirit will never know where God will lead them!
---kathr4453 on 2/16/10


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What is rebirth? Jesus explained it this way,
"That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, you must be born again. The wind blows where it wishes." ( no one controls the winds,) "and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit."
Jesus point was that just as the wind cannot be controlled or understood by human beings but its effects can be witnessed, so also it is with the Holy Spirit. He cannot be controlled or understood, but the proof of His work is apparent. Where the Spirit works, there is undenialbe and unmistakable evidence.
---MarkV. on 2/16/10


Justification is the work of God where the righteousness of Jesus is reckoned/imputed to the sinner the moment of faith in Jesus work on the cross.

Justification is an instantaneous occurrence with the result being eternal life.


Sanctification, involves the work of the person of Christ in you through the WORD, conforming us to His image and given only to those who have already been justified *Phil. 2:13.


Justification is a legal declaration and instantaneous.
Sanctification is a process.

Justification comes from outside of us, from God.

Sanctification comes from God within us by the work of the Holy Spirit in accordance with the WORD. John 17Sanctify them through thy TRUTH, THY WORD is truth.
---kathr4453 on 2/15/10


MarkV, all New Born Christians indwelt with the Holy Spirit hunger for the word. This is MY SANCTIFICATION. You seem to be confusing Justification with sanctification. In Sanctification , Jesus is the Author and Finisher of our faith as we follow HIM through the CROSS into death and resurrection life, running the race, (also refer to Phil 3) Paul also clarifies this truth, is what we are called to AFTER salvation.

I DID NOT out of nowhere have any desire to read the Bible before my salvation.

I'm telling YOU that I was NOT Born again or regenerated first. I'm telling you it was the complete OPPOSITE.

You are totally disqualify JUSTIFICATION FIRST!

Please do not twist what I say to qualify your doctrine.
---kathr4453 on 2/15/10


After being saved for over 12 years I began to study the Bible. I had plenty of college credits in Old Testament and New Testament but I had not studied the Bible. As I begin to study the Bible. I carried the Bible with me everywhere. When my tax accountant saw me bring the Bible into his office he said," now here is a man who is serious about salvation he has brought his Bible to witness to his tax accountant". And though I did witness to the man, sadly I must report that I do not know if this man died lost our saved.
---mima on 2/15/10


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Kathr, made a great statement that backs up what I had mentioned to her before, she said

"Before I received Jesus Christ by faith, I really had no desire to read the Bible. Actually I hated to read. It was a painful experience for me. But after I was Born Again, I couldn't stop reading the Bible,"

I told her that before she could seek God she had to be born again of the Spirit, "because no one seeks God who is lost," so that God through that supernatural act could change her heart and give her a love for Christ. Then she would seek Christ, commit her life and receive the promises of God.
---MarkV. on 2/15/10


I know the moment I was Born Again. The holy Spirit brought me right in teh face of God where I said ABBA FATHER. There was no mistake.

Before I received Jesus Christ by faith, I really had no desire to read the Bible. Actually I hated to read. It was a painful experience for me. But after I was Born Again, I couldn't stop reading the Bible, and experienced the Holy Spirit enlightening me and teaching me. God's Word was transforming my life, and my mind. I would stay up all night reading and reading. Scripture says We are Born Again by the WORD of God.


Oh Father How I love your WORD,
and WHO the word would be.
I know the Word is your own Son,
and I know He lives in Me.
---kathr4453 on 2/10/10


Let me explain what I was looking for. First of all rebirth meaning is when the Divine nature is imparted to the believer (John 3:1-6, Tit. 3:5). In regeneration the spiritually dead person is reborn by the Spirit. He receives a new disposition, a new heart which begans his transformation under the New Covenant.
Second there was a time when you were thinking one way, and suddenly you begin to think different. When this happened some might know and others maybe not. But at some time you felt a conviction that came from God and you did not know it at the time, and you went with it. You began to seek God. You didn't know what was happening to you but something was leading you to a place you would have never gone before.
---MarkV. on 2/8/10


Exzucuh, I am sorry I did not make it more clear and I say this because you answered concerning salvation, of which I was not speaking about. I was speaking about rebirth. "Do we know the moment we are reborn?"
I wanted to make that clear because someone ask about regeneration. I assumed everyone knew that regeneration was rebirth, or born again. Though all those words mean the same the same thing, they do have a different way of been explained. Some call it "Transformation" Sorry for the mistake.
---MarkV. on 2/6/10


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It is very important to get your Gospel lined up with the word of God. God cannot die. And never will die.

Our salvation came from a man by faith he obeyed God and he was God's Son!

Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son,
Romans 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Romans 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Acts 17:31 God will judge the world in righteousness by that-- man---whom he hath ---ordained---, whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.
---exzucuh on 2/5/10


Leon, very Insightful. I raise your Amen with an Amen.(o:
---joseph on 2/4/10


Bible:

- God generated (originated, made a living soul) Adam.

- Adam, because he sinned, became degenerated (deteriorated, died,).

- Jesus (God), by his death on the cross, made it possible for us to be regenerated (born again, saved, revived, quickened, restored, made alive again).

- Generation, degeneration, regeneration!

Amen!!!
---Leon on 2/4/10


Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost,

Jesus told his Jewish disciples that by regeneration they would be rewarded and Titus
said that the Law would not be their means of reward but regeneration by the Holy Ghost.
---exzucuh on 2/3/10


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Man is not in his original form. Satan left his original state and became a beast and Adam in submission to the word of Satan surrendered his eternal life for death and Carnality.
This is evolution in reverse from man who is the image of God degenerating to the image of the beast, carnality the Human form. The only way that man can return to his original form is by regeneration through the Holy Spirit. He is transformed, translated out of the carnal kingdom of Darkness into the light of the kingdom of God and his Christ. The old human man Adam becomes the new man in Christ the Last Adam.
---exzucuh on 2/3/10


Regeneration is done completely by the Holy Spirit and is a process that can be slow or fast depending upon the willingness of the believer. The more you submit and surrender your carnality the more the Holy Spirit can do to change and empower your life. That is why John was closer to Jesus than Peter. Peter had issues with his flesh he would not surrender. And Judas never entered the regeneration process because he would not allow Jesus to come into his Life. Regeneration is allowing the Holy Spirit to conform you to the image of Christ.
Ephesians 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
---exzucuh on 2/3/10


We can only be "transformed"/regenerated (Romans 12:2) with spiritual growth ("maturity").

Scripture is introductory/elementary to our devotion/relationship.

1 Corinthians 3:2
"I fed you with milk, not solid food".

Hebrews 6:1
"and go on to MATURITY".

2 John 1:9
"he who abides in the doctrine [of Christ] has BOTH THE FATHER AND THE SON".

The Israelites only had THE FATHER.

"Be transformed"/regenerated by having the COMPLETENESS of God from the "doctrine of Christ" (and avoid all the lies of man)....

Colossians 2:9
"For in him the whole fulness of deity dwells bodily".

Verses are from the RSV.
---more_excellent_way on 2/2/10


MarkV, regeneration has two biblical meanings. 1. Spiritual rebirth (the state or the act). Tts 3:5. (2. Specifically Messianic restoration, or figuratively, spiritual renovation. Mat 19:28. I define regeneration as the restoration of lost insight and awareness through a reestablishment of a dormant spiritual connection prompted by a Divine influence upon the heart. A focus change that occurs after being brought to an awareness that something is missing in life. Later the "something" is recognized or realized as being an association with the Father of Life. As for knowing the moment that occurred, no, although I do remember suddenly acknowledging the fact that I knew something was missing in my life during an unrelated conversation.
---joseph on 2/2/10


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I believe you are talking about the rebirth or new nature. John3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. NKJV
Regeneration occurs by faith when you repent and are baptized. Regeneration occurs in water baptism through the work of the Holy Spirit. I repented at 5. Was baptized at 19 or so. But I did not become serious business about my faith walk until about 2 years ago. (Dying to the flesh) Ephesians 1:13-14 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.
---steph5837 on 2/1/10


I am with Donna. Is this a trick question?
I have a feeling that someone out there is ready to pounce on a misstatement or something that doesn't agree with the analyzer.

Regeneration to me is a new creation in Christ.

I was reading the book of John and remember reading that these things were written that you might believe that Jesus is the Christ the Son of God. I remember praying/saying, "That's what I believe."

I don't remember any particular feeling, but I committed my life to Christ, committing to following Him. BTW, my old way of life and old friends fell away.

I suggest that God is very creative, and people come to Him in various ways and in different circumstances.
---Rod4Him on 2/1/10


reborn? Is that a new term we're using for Born Again these days? LOL

The moment I was reborn? Is this a trick question?

I repented of my sins, turned from them, stopped committing fornication with my boyfriend on August 1, 1983. Asked Jesus to come into my heart and be Lord and Savior of my life and prayed Lord I want to know you like Moses knew you (big mistake) lol just kidding. The trials and testings were many, but all worth it.

Is that specific enough? I never turned back and have been walking with the Lord ever since. Still got growing to do, revelations to be taught, etc., We will never arrive until we arrive in heaven.

Regeneration? I'm not familiar with that term. Can you quote a scripture that uses it?
---Donna on 2/1/10


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