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Women Teach Men In Church

Is it Biblical for women to teach men in the church?

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 ---Jerry on 3/5/10
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Proverbs 14:1. At least as it regards the subject of women in ministry, Lee1538 and Miche3754 are teaching error, and should each be thought of as a false prophet. Their responses are often apostatical, carnal, dishonest, hypocritical, prideful, scornful, and are written in order to deceive people. They, similar to the Pharisees in John nine, keep asking the same question(s) that have been answered already. They are insensitive to the Lords direction.
p.s. Since Jesus made the decision to only use men in certain positions within the Church structure, to dispute it is to call him a liar. Thus, to reject his word is to reject Him.
Numbers 23:19, Psalm 89:34, Isaiah 14:24, Malachi 3:6, 1Corinthians 11:16, 14:36-38, 40, 1Timothy 6:3-4.
---Glenn on 3/11/10


Miche: To preach is to proclaim, to speak the gospel in words & by our actions. ALL Christians (male & female) should do so in our daily lives. Yes, there are elders/presbyters (men & women deacons) placed in the Church & given ministerial roles to perform. Yet, as you've said, the overall care for a church is given to the pastor/under-shepherd & the bishop/superintendent who is over many churches. The Bible designates the pastor & bishop office to be male positions of leadership. A bishop is a pastor's pastor.

Are we straight my sister? :)
---Leon on 3/11/10


Thank you Leon for finally answering my question.
I always thought that a bishop was the same as a pastor, which I believe is a position only for a man.
And I believe women can be elders but their role as an elder has different functions than a male elder.
Women elders are supposed to teach the women of the church. Any duty concerning the women of the church body. In fact the Bible even gives instructions on how and elder woman is supposed to behave too.
Anyway, you are fine with a woman preaching?
Wow, I would have never expected that.
Can you tell me why?
---miche3754 on 3/11/10


2/2 No it is not!
D. Agreeing are, all the Apostles, Galatians 1:11-12, 16-17, 2:6-9, 11, 2Peter 3:15-16, all the first century churches including Corinth, nearly all of the commentators for 1900 years, and most of the people who have called themselves believers in Christ.
E. Disagreeing are, Satan, Genesis 3:1-6, rebels, 1Samuel 8:7, 1Corinthians 10:9-10, the unlearned, 2Timothy 2:15, 3:6-7, 4:3, Hebrews 5:13, wolves, Matthew 7:15, Act 20:29.
F. Galatians 3:28, Colossians 3:11, Joel 2:28-28 & Acts 2:17-18, a list of women, and misused scriptures do not negate the above cited verses.
---Glenn on 3/11/10


1/2 These verses say no!
A. Genesis 2:18, 20, 3:16-19 (Eve desires to rule over Adam / 4:7 Sin desires to rule over Cain), Numbers 12 (whereat Miriam, not Aaron, gets leprosy), Deuteronomy 22:5, Isaiah 3:12-4:1(12), 32:9-14, Amos 4:1-4, 1Corinthians 11:1-16 (16), 14:33-38 (36-38), 1Timothy 2:8-15.
B. Godly women: Ephesians 5:22-24, 33, Colossians 3:18, Titus 2:5, 1Peter 3:1-2, 5-6. Also, 1Timothy 2:15, and (older women), Titus 2:3-5.
C. A pastor guards, and feeds, the sheep, Romans 12:6-8, 1Corinthians 12:28-30, 14:1 (to teach), Ephesians 4:11-15. The great Pastor (poimen masculine noun) selects men to the pastorate, Romans 9:21, 1Corinthians 12:4-6, 14-30.
---Glenn on 3/11/10




Yes Alan, that's right. God chooses men & women, e.g., Noah, Abraham, Moses, Miriam, Ruth, Esther, Deborah, David, the virgin Mary, Paul, etc., to fill specific roles amongst His chosen people & in His Church.

Many here see Church leadership roles as a democracy. It's not! It's a theocracy without respect to persons, male or female. "GOD" chooses (according to Scripture) whoever He will! Yet, many people question God's authority figures, e.g., Moses, Paul, when what they say clashes with one's personal agenda. When God speaks thru His chosen leaders, many people want to change His words to suit themselves. It's so easy to get it twisted when we focus on people instead upon God.

Peace to you too. :)
---Leon on 3/11/10


Miche: God called (annointed) Deborah & placed (appointed) her into a specific type of ministry for His purpose & good pleasure. Deborah wasn't a pastor, elder or bishop. Peace! :)

Lee: The PRIDEFUL focus upon the personal pronoun "I" has & continues to cause much trouble in the Church. Just like in the Garden of Eden, the serpent is still lying to God's people & many believe his lies, to their destruction.

Bottomline: God is the one who does the "promoting" of one over another. (Ps. 75:6-7) We should focus upon God & how we can best serve Him in the Church according to His word, as contained in the Bible.
---Leon on 3/11/10


//Women evangelist, deaconess, missionaries -- yes! Women pastors, elders, bishops -- no!!! But PRIDE says, "Oh no -- that can't be so!

I can climb the highest mountian, swim the deepest ocean, fly higher than any bird, be elected to lead the greatest nation, win a noble prize, write the best selling novel, be a successful military leader, run the longest race,be an astronaut, etc etc. but must be very careful I do not teach a man something that he may need to know regarding the Word of God.

No wonder non-believers view those who would promote the gospel thru a woman as being a little on the bigoted side.
---Lee1538 on 3/10/10


no you didnt answer. you danced around it like a politician. why do you think god appointed deborah?
---miche3457 on 3/10/10


Children of the Father:

Have you noticed how those who support the doctrine of men which allows women to teach in the church have no Scripture to back up what they are saying?

What does the Father say about this issue with women?

Isa 3:12 As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they that lead thee cause thee to err, and DESTROY the way of thy paths.

13 Jehovah standeth up to contend, and standeth to judge the peoples.

Should we be concerned about how the Father feels about this issue with women teaching, ruling His people?
---Paul9594 on 3/10/10




Leon ... You are, I think, saying that God will chose the teachers, without regard as to whether they are male or female.

Which is the point I was making earlier, and which I have made on many previous occasions.

Pace.
---alan8566_of_uk on 3/10/10


Miche: You speak presumptiously & I did answer your question about Deborah in a prior post regarding "a slippery slope". You weren't paying attention though. :)

Who told you God would sit around & wait on anyone to spread the gospel. Again, you let presumption cloud your reasoning. God's will be done in all things & He really doesn't need "us" to perform what's His good pleasure.

Women evangelist, deaconess, missionaries -- yes! Women pastors, elders, bishops -- no!!! But PRIDE says, "Oh no -- that can't be so!

Hope you're not mad at me. :)
---Leon on 3/10/10


Alan: What is it you think I meant in the statement? Please jog my memory & tell me what you were saying right at the start? Thx!
---Leon on 3/10/10


We women have plenty of patience and so does God.
BUT
It will not prevent God from doing what he did with Deborah until men have done what God tells them to do.
You still didn't answer my question about her, by the way.
If God sat around waiting on men, the gospel would not get spread. He knows this. Just like he knows the enemy will go straight for the head.
And why do you always say these women usurped authority when you don't know if they did or not. Most women I know in these positions are put there by others.
---miche3754 on 3/10/10


By the way Leon, I have been waiting on a Godly husband for years and have been celibate in the process as God has asked me to be. SO, I know I have plenty of patience.
I know at my church, we had this woman evangelist come visit and she was just wonderful.
She dressed appropriately- had on a garment that covered her from her neck to the floor and her arms to her wrists. You could not even make out her form. She also pulled her hair back into a bun so she would not distract us from her message. It was a mighty powerful one too.
To me that is an example of a woman called by God. She was humble, and not vain soft spoken and patient kind and generous and very respectful to the men in our congregation.
---miche3754 on 3/10/10


Miche: Does this mean we're once again butting heads? :) No, no, no -- I'm not mad at you. :D Iron sharpens iron!

"Until men surrender & do HIS will..."

That's a double-edged sword & it cuts both ways -- men & "WOMEN". Are you speaking "for" God or is He speaking thru you in this regard? "Thus says the Lord" is usually accompanied by what the Lord has said in the Bible.

I think you've gotten it egalitarian feministically twisted my sister! A fruit of the spirit is patience. Just because God doesn't move upon "men's hearts", as fast as you'd like, doesn't give women license to usurp God-given male leadership authority.

Love you... :)
---Leon on 3/10/10


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Leon,
You are the one waffling now, brother.
Tell me why you really think God appointed Deborah?
And what about Paul's comments, recommendations and praise of the women that worked BESIDE him laboring in the Gospel?
He called some Deacons, teachers, and the like.
I believe because of this, when Paul makes the comment to Timothy in his letter, he is addressing a problem that Timothy was having.
What do you have to say about these women?
Were they in direct disobedience to what Paul said to Timothy?
Remember too, that these women were serving at the same time Paul gave this advice to Timothy.
Paul, brother, you need to point that finger at your brothers not your sisters in Christ.
---miche3754 on 3/10/10


Leon ... "God's appointments haven't a thing to do with male & female issues"

How extraordinary!

It's taken you a long time to come out and say what I was saying right at the start.
---alan8566_of_uk on 3/10/10


1 Cor. 14:34 the women should keep silent in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be in submission, as the Law also says.

Since Paul seems to permit wives to pray & prophesy (11:5,13) as long as they do not dishonor their hubands by the way they dress (11:5) it is difficult to see this as an absolute prohibition (cf Acts 2:17, 21:8-9).

Paul is likely forbidding women to speak up and judge prophecies (the activity in the immediate context, cf. 1 Cor. 14:29) since such an activity would subvert male headship.

Law also says - Paul is probably thinking of the woman's creation 'from' and 'for' the man (see 11:8-9, Gen. 2:20f) as well as a general pattern of male leadership among the people of Israel.
---Lee1538 on 3/9/10


I believe in matters that are disputable such as who may or may not hold the various offices in a church is pretty much up to the denomination to which they belong.

Some approve of women (and divorced believers) being pastors, elders & deacons, others do not.

In any case, it is the bottom line that really counts. If the Gospel is preached, souls won to Christ, why should we be critical of others that do not agree with us?

God blesses His word no matter who presents it and regardless of gender. At least that has been my observation.
---Lee1538 on 3/9/10


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Children of the Father?

Should we not keep the teaching of the Apostle, Paul? Baptized in the Holy spirit, Teaching the SAINTS 30 yrs. INTO THE CHURCH AGE?

What is our example FOR THE CHURCH AGE?

1Cr 14:33 for God IS NOT [a God] of confusion, but of peace. As in all the churches of the saints,

34 let the women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak, but let them be in subjection, as also saith the law.

Should we let confusion or peace, IN THE CHURCH?

Should we follow THESE exampleS of the church of saints or of the apostates?
---Paul9894 on 3/9/10


How does the Father feel about women ruling over His People?

Isa 3:12 As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they that lead thee cause thee to err, and DESTROY the way of thy paths.


Isa 3:13 Jehovah standeth up to contend, and standeth to judge the peoples.

Women are ignoring the will of the Father for them in the Church.
This is one of the reasons double judgement is coming to this nation.

On judgment day, MANY women after they present their MIGHTY WORKS , will be surprised to hear Matthew 7:20-23.

Should we not be concerned about how our
Father feel about this isssue WITH WOMEN?

---Paul9594 on 3/9/10


Leon, .
You know what I mean by "Thus says the Lord".
and if not, it means Proclaim what God says in his word.
We are seriously lacking in REAL GODLY men to do this.
So, God is doing what he did in the judges time, He is appointing "Deborah's" to do it because men won't step up to the plate and do what God says.
We have too many men with hidden agendas for God to use until they surrender to him 100%.
No waffling, just speaking the truth. Until men surrender and do HIS will, God will continue to use women. The way to tell these women are for real is by what they say, how they dress, and how they carry themselves. Measure by the Holy Spirit.
---miche3754 on 3/9/10


Alan: I'm not personally offended by anything you say. You "oft" don't make your posts clear. I wish you'd just say what you mean instead of waltzing around the subject.

Cut to the chase Alan!!! :)

I "misread" it?! :D How do you know "no one else" misread it?

Miche!!! THUS SAYS THE LORD?! :) Bible chapters & verses please.

It seems you have a hidden agenda that's causing you to waffle regarding the truth. God's appointments haven't a thing to do with male & female issues.

I'm not mad at you -- honestly! :)
---Leon on 3/9/10


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Sister Miche: I tend to get mad at you?! Sorry I made you think so. Yes, we've on ocassion significantly disagreed. :)

"If what Paul said was true for ALL churches, then how do you men explain Deborah?"

It's always a slippery slope for us (men & women) to try & explain Deborah. :) God spoke to (inspired) the Prophetess Deborah for the nation Israel & spoke to (inspired) the Apostle Paul for the whole Church body (sheep & shepherds...pastors, elders, bishops, etc.) -- ALL.

Bottomline: What God says in the Bible "to & thru" His chosen leaders is what we should believe is true. ALL is done by & for "God's" good pleasure, & benefits ALL of us.
---Leon on 3/9/10


Interpreting 1 Timothy 3 in light of the Patristic Interpretation, one will come to a conclusion that Holy Scripture does not require that a bishop be married. It simply says that if he is married, he is only to have no more than one wife. Several apostles never married and there were married and unmarried men as the first bishops of the Church. Early writings of the Church say that Saint John the Theologian was never married. And we know from Church History that he was the bishop of many churches in the Asia Minor, which he founded, and appointed faithful men to succeed him.

In IC.XC.,
---Ignatius on 3/8/10


As far as 1 Timothy 11-12 is concerned, the Traditional and Orthodox position of the Church as always been that while woman can be part in some offices of the Church (such as Deaconess, Reader, Chanters, Choir directors, etc), she has preserved the Tradition passed by the Holy Apostles, and there Holy Successors, to allow only man to be ordained as a Bishop or Priest.

This does not demised the position of women in the Church nor does it mean she can not teach per say. In fact, in the Eastern Orthodox Tradition, we have many Holy Ammas- A woman who is a spiritual mentor or leader, either for one or more individuals or as the head of a monastery, such as Amma Synceltic of Eqypt, a fifth century Holy Desert Mother.

In IC.XC.,
---Ignatius on 3/8/10


If one study Church History, one will find out that when men began to seek the desert as a place to live out a more radical commitment to God, women, beginning with Saint Mary of Egypt, to whose holiness even Saint Anthony the Great deferred were not far behind. There were of course some early Christian teachers who viewed woman in a negative way (succinctly expressed in the traditional male prayer, "Thank You, Lord, that You did not make me a woman"), and such attitude can be found today in many churches.

In the Eastern Orthodox Tradition, our greatest Saint is a women, the Virgin Mary, the Holy Theotokos.

However, one should stay away from the errors of the Feminism movement, completely unorthodox.

In IC.XC.,
---Ignatius on 3/8/10


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Shouldnt' we keep the traditions of the Apostles who taught into the church age?


Does the church really want to know about women teaching in the church?
---Paul9594 on 3/8/10


Amen Miche, I believe you're right on target with this one.
God's plan and purpose will be accomplished one way or another.
Esther 4:14 For if thou altogether holdest thy peace at this time, [then] shall there enlargement and deliverance arise to the Jews from another place, but thou and thy father's house shall be destroyed: and who knoweth whether thou art come to the kingdom for [such] a time as this?
---MIchael on 3/8/10


Leon ... Maybe I did not make my post a clear as you needed it to be.

No-one else misread it, but that maybe because nearly everyone else knows my oft stated position on this.

The point is a literal reading allows only for married men. You modified this by "That means, of course, if they're married in the first place"

I don't argue with your right to make that change to show what you think the scripture actually means.

I am surprised that you take such offense against me suggesting that it refers to spouses, if married.
---alan8566_of_uk on 3/8/10


miche3754//Not to mention, no where does it say men can't appoint a woman to do a specific job. Look at Paul and the women he mentioned that labored along side him.

I love that!

It shows that what is really important is the promotion of the gospel message that men & women everywhere my hear the word of God unto salvation.

But I feel what is truly missing in the Scripture is what Paul was thinking about when he felt women should be silent in the church (thro they had the gift of prophecy) and that they should learn from their husbands if they had any questions. I am left wondering if Paul was referencing a particular situation and that was he wrote on this subject reflected the customs found in that area.
---Lee1538 on 3/8/10


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I just wish men would stop complaining and condemning women when they won't even bother to pick up their cross and follow after Christ and deny themselves.
---miche3754 on 3/8/10

Amen sister. My prayer also.
---Mark_Eaton on 3/8/10


Few things have just become apparent to me.
Until men step back up to the plate and do "THUS SAYS THE LORD", God will continue to appoint women to do his will.
He did it with Deborah. WHY? Because men were reprobate in their minds.
Men these days are led by their eyes, and certain other parts of their bodies.
And that includes Pastors!
I don't want to seem like I hate men, because I sure don't. I just wish men would stop complaining and condemning women when they won't even bother to pick up their cross and follow after Christ and deny themselves.
Not to mention, no where does it say men can't appoint a woman to do a specific job. Look at Paul and the women he mentioned that labored along side him.
---miche3754 on 3/8/10


Mark_Eaton -//Why do we war against God-given authorities?

Because our culture has changed the roles of both men and woman since the Bible was written.

There are women leaders of State, military generals, physicians, surgeon, leaders of industrial firms, mechanics, construction works, pilots, as nearly every occupations.

And a good second reason is it is debateable if Paul forbid women to leadership positions in the church.

We read both in the Scripture and in earcly church history of deacon and other leaders of the church that were women.

Acts 2: 17 states that when the Spirit is upon believers that they will prophesy, how then the commad to let the women be silent in the church if they are to prophese?
---Lee1538 on 3/8/10


Leon,

Ultimately Christ is the head of the church and when we are in congregation Christ leads.
My position is that men and women can do all positions in the Body of Christ except pastor.
I believe that a man such as the overseer should preside over all.
My church is like that. We have an Overseer and a council that has both men and women on it.
He presides over it but, we are allowed to exercise our gifts.
Anyway, you and I have already had this discussion Leon.
What I see in the Bible and what says has not changed since then.
I don't think it is a good idea for us to talk on this issue. You tend to get mad at me.
If what Paul said was true for ALL churches, then how do you men explain Deborah?
---miche3754 on 3/8/10


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"My latest post was expanding on what I had intended to indicate in the final paragraph of the previous one." Alan', 3/8

What?! Is that some kind of new speak double talk that actually says, "I made a mistake, but I don't want say that exactly."? :D

Miche: Help me understand your position. Do women have the Bible authority to pastor, be an elder or bishop over church congregations? They are all leaders (under-sheperds) over & responsible for the well-being of their church congregations.
---Leon on 3/8/10


AMEN LARRY!!!!!!
FINALLY someone said it right!!
I believe too that women can do all those things as long as they are under the supervision of a man.
Again, wonderful post Larry!
---miche3754 on 3/8/10


I find this question tiring.

Why do we war against God-given authorities?

God did not leave this question unanswered.

It is just that we do not like His answer. Everyone here KNOWS the answer, we just want to disagree with GOD anyway. His answer offends our delicate sensibilities. That God would be a male chauvenist, why it cannot be. Please. Are you reading the same books that I am? How can God write this Scripture if He does not have an order to things?

1 Cor 11:3 "But I want you to understand that Christ is the head of every man, and the man is the head of a woman, and God is the head of Christ"

We are more confirmed to the world than we think.
---Mark_Eaton on 3/8/10


I always love your question Jerry.

Welcome SandyG and yes the original question often gets lost and falls into political arguments. And you are correct in your reading of Timothy. There is a difference between teachers and pastors.

Junie was an apostle, Tabitha or Dorcas a disciple, Phobe was a deaconI while evangelists like Euodia and Syntyche preached with Paul.

All christians mature in faith should spread, preach and teach the gospel to the unsaved. Its "leadership" of the congregation by a woman that is unbiblical.
Its not a matter of women's ability to pastor it's a matter of obediance.
---larry on 3/8/10


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Leon ... There's no back pedalling!

My latest post was expanding on what I had intended to indicate in the final paragraph of the previous one.

You must be fairly new here, as I have previously on numerous occasions made the point I've just now detailed, and have been castigated by several here for my support of women elders or clergy.
---alan8566_of_uk on 3/8/10


Men miss the leadership target so often because they are more often the target of Satan as he remains a terribly focused and efficient foe.
He doesn't waste time knowing he only needs to get MEN off target to ruin God's order and that is what he is about first and foremost. Brethren do not be ignorant of the wiles of the devil.

Its not an issue whether women can pastor or teach. The only issue is wheather its biblical. Teach yea, pastor nay.



Gay christians have been ignoring Romans 1 for decades and on it goes. Leon is right, if you can make an argument for women pastors I can make one for polygamy.
---larry on 3/8/10


---tom2 on 3/7/10
Concerning this post

Now tom, you know God's word says for men to LOVE their wives....
Loving a woman means to be sensitive.
God wants men to LOVE, LEAD, and be SENSITIVE.
But for some reason, men these days don't want to bow to God's will. Women are more likely to do that. I think that is WHY God is moving in women more.
Men are letting them enemy entice them too much. We need our men to come back to us and maybe we would not have the problems in church like we do. Maybe God would not appoint women, then. I think men should stop pointing at women and look at themselves.
---miche3754 on 3/8/10


God has given us the most blessed way, anything short brings curse (or ramifications to use a human rationale). So as the men fail to show up, the women role up their sleeves (the same is when a husband abandons the home, someone has to take the responsibility, but a curse is apparent). It only leaves to discern whether that female leader is there out of necessity, or to promote the feminine agenda. From the one who taught wisdom is a woman, to the one allowing children to clamber over the service, even engaging them as they interrupt her sermon, and incorporating them in the sacrament, this because Jesus said, "Do not hinder them". It's evident that Isaiah's prefigurement of leadership delegation is in the offing.
---John_II on 3/8/10


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Where'd you learn to dance (backpedal) like that Alan? :D
---Leon on 3/8/10


Leon ... "Beside Alan, are there any other bloggers that believe a man must be married in order to be a Church elder? If so, please explain why. Thx"

No there probably are not any at all. And you know that I don't beleive that.

My point is that that is what the words LITERALLY say.

If you look at what they MEAN, you should realise that they not only allow single people but also any people who if married have only one spouse.
---alan8566_of_uk on 3/8/10


Beside Alan, are there any other bloggers that believe a man must be married in order to be a Church elder? If so, please explain why. Thx.

Regarding the original question, NO, it isn't unbiblical for women to teach men in church or anywhere else. Women can teach in Sunday School, music ministry, etc. Whats unbiblical is for women to occupy the office of pastor, elder, bishop over church bodies. So, it's not about teaching. It's a matter of overreaching (usurping) God-ordained male authority in the church.
---Leon on 3/7/10


//I believe the book of Timothy gives the criteria for an elder, pastor etc.For one they are to be the husband of one wife. Pretty hard for a woman to fill that qualification. Bible content is how we know what God's views are on any given subject.

Pretty hard also for a single man to qualify for the post of pastor, elder, etc.
since they MUST BE married and to one wife.

Frankly, the qualifications in Timothy were designed to bar polgamists from leadership positions in the church.

Some say that polgamy was not a problem but the Jews in their Talmud addressed that issue.
---Lee1538 on 3/7/10


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Sandy ... "I used the scripture (husband of one wife) to show that elders were men not women"

Using the actual words of scripture, the Bible says the elder must be the husband of one wife (and that means he must be married) It does not say "if married"

You have aqdded "if married", to make it mean what you want it to mean.

If the passage can be extended in that way, it could with equal validity be extended to say "if married, the elder can only have one spouse"
---alan8566_of_uk on 3/7/10


leon,men leaders?not today yes by Gods word we are,and should be,also by nature we are,compromise comes by way of our society today women want men to be sensitive, and want to be in control of their men,most women practice equality to the point where men have lost their God given jobs,and rather than fight and argue they just dont do them.
---tom2 on 3/7/10


Amen Sandy G!!! As Christians it's all about our standing on what the word of God (the Bible) says regardless of whether we like it or not. WELCOME! :)

Tom: The Church should never give into (compromise) what we think is "practical" & usurp (override) God's authoritative word. There are numerous stories in the Bible that clearly show the dire consequences of doing such, e.g., Adam & Eve's sin, Aaron's making of the golden calf, Abraham & Sarah taking matters into their own hands regarding child-bearing, King Saul's willful disobedience against God, etc. The Church belongs to Jesus & He will install leadership according to what the Bible teaches.
---Leon on 3/7/10


Alan8566: Peter was married, but was Paul? What about the other apostles?

Sandy did say, "For 'ONE' they are to be the husband of ONE wife." No concubines! That means, of course, if they're married in the first place. Scripture does not say or imply ONE must be married. :)
---Leon on 3/7/10


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Thanks Catherine.
To ala8566ofuk : As we all know Paul was single. I used the scripture (husband of one wife) to show that elders were men not women. SandyG
---Sandy_G on 3/7/10


Sandy G ... So no single elders, nor widowers?
---ala8566_of_uk on 3/7/10


Miche, I believe that women Lawrence is talking about claim to be Christian but in reality they are far from it, 2 Corinthians 11:13-15.

Examples are Jan Crouch, Joyce Meyers, Juanita Bynumn, Paula White, Etc, Etc.

When I see them on television, they don't look much different than the women of the world, They dress like they are trying to seduce the men of the world.
---Rob on 3/7/10


WELCOME SandyG!
---catherine on 3/6/10


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is it biblical? no.but in some cases its practical because there arent any men who will teach,and less that are qualified to teach.
---tom2 on 3/6/10


I am relatively new to this web site and after reading a number of blogs am amazed at how the original question gets lost site of. Most bloggers end up with a discussion among themselves about something totally off subject.
I believe the book of Timothy gives the criteria for an elder, pastor etc.For one they are to be the husband of one wife. Pretty hard for a woman to fill that qualification. Bible content is how we know what God's views are on any given subject.
Just because I do not believe in women pastors I am not a Biblically ignorant sexual bigot. Rather I am a believer of what is in the Bible even if it goes against the common
opinions of a lot of people.
---Sandy_G on 3/6/10


Judging-
satan wants us to believe-him-he places himself on the judgment seat.
Working with the flesh-we wants us believe we can sit there-also.
We can't.
Praise God for his mercy and grace.
---char on 3/6/10


I have viewed through fusion, c-net, m-christians, christian-date etc. There's no diff. I get turned down mostly because I'm Not ate up with things of this worlds pleasures as like others, social alcoh-drinks, movies, smokes, sports, dancing, missing services to see sports & the such like, these are because the devil has control of. Scripture tells me here, 1st. John 2 v's 15-16. You canNot serve 2 masters.
Even there's men that don't wear suitable apparel. Clothes so tight use can almost see all, even half naked being out in public, Ladies just as well.
---Lawrence on 3/6/10


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Hey, I am trying to figure out what kind of "Christian" women Lawrence is talking about.
I don't see any like that in my congregation.

We believe in wearing what ever is appropriate for what you are doing.
Like me, I work on a construction site. I can't wear a dress down to my ankles...THAT WOULD BE AN OSHA VIOLATION WAITING TO HAPPEN! I could get seriously hurt.

Now, I agree with Lee, Rickey, and several others. Paul was addressing a specific situation during a certain time. Many like to forget that the books he wrote were actually letters answering questions. And where it says all scripture is good, they are speaking of the OT. NT didn't exist yet.
---miche3754 on 3/6/10


Mary
Little oft I turn on tbn & or other because most of the women are decked out like jezebels.
The devil already has the Man-made secular christian church world & to keep them blinded about Jesus name baptism etc & that Jesus has only 1 Church.
The devil has relig-org's churches because of here Matt.15 v 9, 2nd. Cor.11 v's 14-15.<- This is why the minister friend didn't go to the ministers conference.

The devil is mostly aft us Jesus name people because we are Not blinded. Jesus has only 1 Church & the enemy is trying to destroy. The enemy is out to deceive the very elect if possible & that is Jesus 1 & Only Church.
---Lawrence on 3/6/10


Lawrence ... Those "christian dating sites you have seen are in fact only masquerading as christian. They are usually subsidiaries of very secular dating sites, just using the word christian to get the gullible to join.

To see genuine Christian sites, look as CN's and also google "fusion101" and "christianconnection"
---alan8566_of_uk on 3/6/10


It sure is upseting for the bigot that views women as Jezebels when God blesses them with fruit that will last into eternality.

the male chauvinist is not on board when it comes to promoting the gospel of Jesus Christ.

They are just too blind to see that just about everything a woman minister speaks from the pulpit is identical to what a male pastor would address. They all receive the same basic training at seminaries.

Sad, but true.
---Lee1538 on 3/6/10


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Okey, Jesus, I am depending only on You, Ahhh! The answer is>>> YES! You Must study these scriptures. Paul were asking the women to not speak out in church, but to wait until they got home to discuss issues with their husbands. No yelling across the isles, ect. Hey, [I did my best without checking my sources].
---catherine on 3/6/10


According to Paul and everyone who grew up in an ancient society of prudish uncivilized bigots, men should constantly demonstrate their awesome power by restricting the freedom of the weaker sex, BUT, Jesus made it known to us that all spirit creations (new creations) that are spiritually INside His body have no gender....

Galatians 3:28
"there is neither male nor female".

Christians have no gender based restrictions/requirements/obligations.

---more_excellent_way on 3/5/10


That is sin.
---Eloy on 3/6/10


Not only the trin-people dress like the carnal worldly people & cant tell the diff, they also partake of the the worldly things of the world. Just like I see on the dating sites, the worldly & the christian dating sites there seems to be No diff. Their activities are social drinks, sports, smokes,
dressing half naked a lot of times not just at the beech, missing services to go to watch & or perticipate in sports & the such like. TRUE Christians Are to stay from such because scripture says here,1st John 2 v's 15-16. People ignore what this scripture says & go right on ahead in doing so thinking they'l get by with it, but it's not okay. You'l reap what you so. According to God & His Word, He Is strict.
---Lawrence on 3/6/10


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Lawrence...That would be Trinitarian, not "trin" and many of us Godly Trinitarian women don't dress the way you suggested. Of course, we don't wear our dresses down to our ankles and our sleeves down to our wrists and we do cut our hair occasionally and some even wear makeup and jewelry. If you saw one of those FLDS (fundamental Mormon) women walking down the street how would you be able to tell them from your church women? They have the same standards of dress as you are suggesting.
---KarenD on 3/5/10


So Lawrence, how are women supposed to dress? Long skirts and scarves?! So your minister avoided what might have been a real blessing just because of those two women? Shame on him.
---Mary on 3/5/10


//While it is true that the Church has some prominent (and wealthy) women that seemly provided some leadership in the church, Paul has to consider the culture of his day in addressing the role of women.

Scripture is very clear God has called both sexes to do proclaim His word. Otherwise why would He pour His Spirit onto both to proclaim His will?

Acts 1:7f And in the last days it shall be, God declares,that I will pour out my Spirit on all flesh,and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams,even on my male servants and female servants in those days I will pour out my Spirit, and they shall prophesy.
---Lee1538 on 3/5/10


A minister friend of mine read-heard about a ministers conference even thought about going. When he heard that a woman or 2 were to speak & they were deck out dressed up like jezebels, he didn't go. That Is So Un-godly. I guess he did find out that it was a trin-conference anyway.
The trin-women dress just like the carnal women in the world & I cant tell the diff, so they must 1 & or the same.

The Church of The Living God, His people dress in a Godly way & you Can tell the diff.
---Lawrence on 3/5/10


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Yes...in Ephesians 4:11 it says..."And He gave SOME...."

It shows that the gifts listed are given not only to men, but women as well.
1Corinthians 14:33-35 isn't telling women not to preach or teach. It was for the Corinthians church. Woman were sitting in different areas than the men. When they had a question they shouted across the room to their husbands & that brought disturbance.
---Rickey on 3/5/10


Are you referring to the scripture where the Apostle Paul said that a woman is to keep silent in the church? And that a woman is not to exercise authority over a man.

Well teaching the word isn't exercising authority over a man. And a woman isn't asking a man to submit to her, she's just proclaiming the word of God. And I don't think God sees anything wrong with that.

Where are the Elijah's of God? The anointed men of God?
---Donna on 3/5/10


Jesus told EVERYONE to spread the gospel, not just men.
---KarenD on 3/5/10


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