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Are There Steps To Salvation

What are the steps to salvation and do you believe the Holy Spirit has to be in you first before you get "saved"?

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 ---miche3754 on 3/30/10
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----And Kathr suggest that we need to know what prepositional phrases are before we can understand the Word of God. A simple sentence change to plus = plus= to = and you have your answer. Pretty cool, how they operate. We need formulas to answer explicit statments.
---MarkV. on 4/6/10


So MarkV, Why would understanding sentence structure be EVIL....are you mad? You twist sentences!!! I don't!

everything you accuse others of YOU do yourself.

And MarkV YOU were the one who is making sarcastic remarks here.

Did you make a sarcastic remark to donna66 with nouns and verbs...NO, why, because you are a hypocrite...always pointing fingers at others...three are pointing back at you!!!
---kathr4453 on 4/6/10


Cluny, because I do not agree with your view on the communion bread, it does not mean I do not respect your view. I see the passages saying something different then what you have learned. I know that what you believe I also believed once. For I came from the RCC and always thought it was correct. I do not think it is anymore because I have been more diligent in my studies. I was not diligent before, now I make every effort to close the gaps where I had problems before, by studying the Nature and Character of God, and His attributes. And now studying Christology and I know Christ doesn't turn to a piece of bread, or a piece of bread turn to Christ. My studies on the Trinity would be so corrupt if I held on to that view. Thanks brother
---MarkV. on 4/6/10


Markv,
Again, when have I insulted anyone?
No at any time.
Correct yes, insult NO.
I said that you and Cluny are carnal minded, baby Christians and you are.
Those are not insults.
Both of you are so wrapped into your man made doctrines that you don't bother to be Bereans and STUDY ALL OF GOD"S WORD TO SEARCH FOR HIS_ GOD"S TRUTH.
Try the truth and NOT man made doctrine and see what you find. You will be surprised and God will show and you will be ashamed for following man instead of God, I know, I have been there.
---miche3754 on 4/6/10


Cluny, I believe it funny to hear both of those two speak with such a tongue that when they speak, they do not recognize the evil remarks they give others for disagreeing with them. Miche says to stop calling other names, and here is her remark to you,
It is not our fault your denom is full of carnal thoughts instead of feeding and growing the Spirit of Christ."
She actually thinks she is not carnal when she answers. And Kathr suggest that we need to know what prepositional phrases are before we can understand the Word of God. A simple sentence change to plus = plus= to = and you have your answer. Pretty cool, how they operate. We need formulas to answer explicit statments.
---MarkV. on 4/6/10


Because she found some formula that fits her theological bias.

---MarkV. on 4/5/10

MarkV, Prepositional phrases are not a theory at all unless

BY GRACE= Prepositional phrase
THROUGH FAITH+ Prep Phrase

SO are THESE Prepositional phrases formulas that fit your theological bias??????

How IGNORANT a statement you made here.
Justified ( by His Blood) prep phrase
saved...(BY HIS LIFE) Prep phrase

A Prepositional phrase is the OBJECT of the SUBJECT.

If you took out ALL prepositional phrases in scripture you would have NOTHING!!!!

MarkV, I know you don't know the English language, and maybe that is why you fail to understand scripture and HOW Important prepositional phrases are.
---kathr4453 on 4/6/10




Oh, I see it done all the time on these blogs.

The most common and egregious example is twisting Jesus's clear words, "This is My Body" to mean "This is NOT My Body."
---Cluny on 4/5/10


It is not our fault your denom is full of carnal thoughts instead of feeding and growing the Spirit of Christ.
When he said his Body, he meant he is the Word, "eat it". He didn't mean for us to be pretend cannibals or magicians.

Markv, you are being carnal too.
Kath explained that verse perfectly according to GOD"S word not according to some man's idea.
---miche3754 on 4/6/10


Cluny, I believe that what you stated can be understood with simple doctrine. "This is My body" cannot possibly be the real body of Christ, since a piece of bread cannot literally be Christ. Jesus transformed the last Passover into the first observance of the Lord's Supper. He is the central antitype in both ceremonies, being represented symbolically by both the paschal lamb of the Passover and the elements in the communion service. His statement, "This is My body" could not possibly have been taken in any literal sense by the disciples present that evening. Covenants were ratified with the blood of a sacrifice (Gen. 8:20, 15:9,10). Jesus words here echo Moses pronouncement in Ex. 24:8.
---MarkV. on 4/6/10


\\Donna66, I never heard of a simple passage been interpreted in such a way to make the passage say something completely different then what it was intended for\\

Oh, I see it done all the time on these blogs.

The most common and egregious example is twisting Jesus's clear words, "This is My Body" to mean "This is NOT My Body."
---Cluny on 4/5/10


Donna66, I never heard of a simple passage been interpreted in such a way to make the passage say something completely different then what it was intended for. The real meaning that God wanted to convey to us, =so and so=so and so=so and so. Because she found some formula that fits her theological bias.
Some people are victimized because they grow up in a certain theological system and they become indoctrinated by it and they begin to live out that pattern. They spend so much time defending it that they can never get rid of it. And notice that others who have the same theological bias will agee whatever those others comes out with. The absence of conclusive information and lack of careful study prevents them from finding the Truth.
---MarkV. on 4/5/10


"He hath chosen us in him, that we should be holy and without blame before him, in love having predestinated us unto the adoption of sons by Jesus Christ to himself, He hath made us accepted in the Beloved."
The prepositional phrases "in him," "before him," "to himself," and "in the Beloved" = Adoption of Sons by Jesus Christ = The CHURCH of the FIRST BORN! =BEGOTTEN SONS.
OT Saints were saved, but were NOT the Church of the FIRST BORN through Jesus Christ.


Hebrews 12:23
To the general assembly(ANGELS)

and church of the firstborn,(US) ---,

--and to the spirits of just men made perfect,(OT SAINTS)
---kathr4453 on 4/5/10




Donna66If Ephesians 1:4,both here and Romans 8 talking about being predestined to be conformed to His Image, here, that we should be holy and blameless etc.

The Thing about sentence structure is you have to read the WHOLE SENTENCE to know what Paul is telling us.

Paul is telling us in all his epistles the CALLING, Purpose, hope of our calling to those saved TODAY in this dispensation, the CHURCH.

If in fact Gentiles were without hope as Paul tells us in Ephesians, then YOU as a Gentile were not Chosen before....you were without hope. Scripture does not contradict itself....only those who fail to read ALL are in conflict of scripture.

---kathr4453 on 4/5/10


Donna66,
The point is that God does not choose who is saved or not.
He has already done the saving actually. He has already determined that anyone who believe on his son Christ WILL HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE.
That is what Ephesians means.
That God has predestined those who are in Christ to be saved.
What you miss, is the in Christ.
That is a must to be saved.
And God doesn't force you to believe.
He asks ALL of mankind to believe because he sent Jesus to reconcile ALL MAN back to him.
Man is required to do something for salvation.
Say YES to God and BELIEVE.
---miche3754 on 4/3/10


Miche and Kath -- you can talk about emphasis and context all you want, but you cannot make a sentence NOT say what it plainly says. Sentence structure is important.

Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
.
The words "Us" and "In Christ" are both essential. Yes, Ephesians was written to the church...but does that make "us" mean somebody other than those who are part of the church?

Who teaches that the OT saints are not saved? I know of no one. Gal 3:9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham (even though Abraham never knew Jesus in his flesh)
---Donna66 on 4/3/10


Amen Kath,
Not to mention that the proper context and emphasis on that particular verse is "IN HIM" not US. Miche***8


Yes Miche, the WHOLE of Ephesians, is about CHRIST and the CHURCH,.

The Church began on Pentecost. The Church are those IN HIM and HE IN US.

According to those who are preaching God picking and choosing, they are saying only those from Pentecost until the rapture are saved and no one else.

OT Saints were not IN HIM and HE in them.
Why, because the Church began with the RISEN CHRIST, and no one was IN HIM until He rose from the dead.

AND nothing of the teaching of the Church was even taught in the OT.
---kathr4453 on 4/3/10


Catherine-- Is that some kind of prophetic word? Did God speak to you? Or did you draw this, somehow, from scripture.

I had an earthly father who was not a Christian and did nothing like laying down his life for me, but he never got "fed up"
to the point that he would "ship me out".
He never disowned me.
I certainly knew when I had displeased him. He disciplined me often. But I never had to wonder for a moment if I was actually his child..
I found out he was quite like the father of the prodigal (yes, I tested him practically to that point). But because I went my own way, rebelled, and had no time for him, he didn't reject me.

Should I expect less of my Heavenly Father?
---Donna66 on 4/3/10


God has spoken: And He is saying, "not all believers will make it to heaven". I've just got to tell you, God is getting fed-up, with some of His people, who had rather tend to business, than to tend to God. God is not going to have no time for you. You better shape-up or God is going to ship you out. Or a better way of putting it, He is going to spew you out of His mouth.....He didn't die on a cross.......for you, just so you can worship other gods. Come on!
---catherine on 4/3/10


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kath -- According to all rules of grammer, the object of a verb MUST be a noun or pronoun. "us" is a pronoun "In him" is a prepositional phrase, not a noun.
I believe you are misreading this passage.
---Donna66 on 4/3/10


Luke 3:22 And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son, in thee I am well pleased.
---MIchael on 4/3/10


kathr4453
I just read the cat thing. Nice story, I like it!
But, I never saw the ad and if I did, I sure didnt read it!

This is true also, two times before he called. I didnt, understand! So, my answer was No!
But, of my answer being, yes! I know this, now!

Whether the lord comes to you or you go to the lord! Is not a question! It will happen!
Your answer to him will always be yes! Because he is your father!
This one is a little harder for some to believe and understand!
His answer to you will always be yes! Because he is your father!
I know! It cant be!
O but it is!
God blessed each of you!
---TheSeg on 4/3/10


The Holy Ghost Is part of Lord & His salvation plan. Acts Is the book where The salvation is & Fulfills Matt.28 v's 19 - 20. It was delivered to the Jewish people on the day of Pentecost. Other steps include a clean & holy life, being in Church when the doors are open, staying away from the worldly pleasure's that the enemy has for to snare people to be lost.
---Lawrence on 4/2/10
Amen!!

I believe that when sinners look at us, they should be able to KNOW that we are Christian. By the way we act, talk, dress, live, treat other people, etc. They should see JESUS IN US!
God should be glorified in EVERTHING that we do.
---miche3754 on 4/3/10


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The Holy Ghost Is part of Lord & His salvation plan. Acts Is the book where The salvation is & Fulfills Matt.28 v's 19 - 20. It was delivered to the Jewish people on the day of Pentecost. Other steps include a clean & holy life, being in Church when the doors are open, staying away from the worldly pleasure's that the enemy has for to snare people to be lost.
---Lawrence on 4/2/10


Donna66 The object of Chosen is IN HIM

Paul is preaching in Ephesians THE MYSTERY of the CHURCH.

Paul is continuing in Ephesians 5:32
This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

This Mystery was first spoken in john 17, John 17:22
And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them, that they may be one, even as we are one:

Romans 8:18
For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
Ephesians 1:18
The eyes of your understanding being enlightened, that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,
---kathr4453 on 4/2/10


Donna66 The object of Chosen is IN HIM

Paul is preaching in Ephesians THE MYSTERY of the CHURCH.

Paul is continuing in Ephesians 5:32
This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

This Mystery was first spoken in john 17, John 17:22
And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them, that they may be one, even as we are one:

Romans 8:18
For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
Ephesians 1:18
The eyes of your understanding being enlightened, that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,
---kathr4453 on 4/2/10


Donna66 The object of Chosen is IN HIM

Paul is preaching in Ephesians THE MYSTERY of the CHURCH.

Paul is continuing in Ephesians 5:32
This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

This Mystery was first spoken in john 17, John 17:22
And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them, that they may be one, even as we are one:

Romans 8:18
For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
Ephesians 1:18
The eyes of your understanding being enlightened, that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,
---kathr4453 on 4/2/10


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Amen Kath,
Not to mention that the proper context and emphasis on that particular verse is "IN HIM" not US.
We were not known before the foundation of the world. JESUS was and that is who the "IN HIM" is.- JESUS.
You would not be chosen of anything if you weren't in CHRIST.
BUT since you are IN CHRIST you are chosen to inherit the kingdom as JOINT Heirs to the thrown.
And yes an elitist is like that, they believe God chose them to be saved AND in Christ. That is false. those who think God chose them without them being IN Christ first don't understand the Bible or what Christ did for us.
---miche3754 on 4/2/10


Amen Kath,
Not to mention that the proper context and emphasis on that particular verse is "IN HIM" not US.
We were not known before the foundation of the world. JESUS was and that is who the "IN HIM" is.- JESUS.
You would not be chosen of anything if you weren't in CHRIST.
BUT since you are IN CHRIST you are chosen to inherit the kingdom as JOINT Heirs to the thrown.
And yes an elitist is like that, they believe God chose them to be saved AND in Christ. That is false. those who think God chose them without them being IN Christ first don't understand the Bible or what Christ did for us.
---miche3754 on 4/2/10


"Us" is the object of the verb "chosen", not "him", no matter whether this is addressed to the church or individuals.
---Donna66 on 4/2/10


Donna66, US is the Object of the whole Epistle being the CHURCH. Paul is not preaching INDIVIDUAL Choosing of anyone.

The Church was forordained and predestined from before teh foundation of the world. If you believe it is individual chosing then yu are saying you existed before the foundation of the world. That's Mormonism.
---kathr4453 on 4/2/10


Miche -- an elitist is one who thinks they are somehow better than others. Being "chosen" has nothing to do with "better", for we were all in sin and unable to save ourselves.

I don't understand your interpretation of
of Eph 1:4
According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him.
"Us" is the object of the verb "chosen", not "him", no matter whether this is addressed to the church or individuals.
---Donna66 on 4/2/10


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Wow!!!!!!
Amen!!!
---miche3754 on 4/2/10


Hebrews 6:13
For when God made promise to Abraham, because he could swear by no greater, he sware by himself,


Eloy, great post. The Sovereignty of God is this....when God speaks, what God Promised HE WILL DO!!!

God's WORD is what we believe. Anyone can believe God.

If I placed an ad in the paper promising you a cat for free, and all you had to do was come by and pick it up...YOU have placed your faith in MY WORD that what I said was TRUE!!! But you won't know it's true or reap the benefit of my promise until YOU come by and pick up your FREE CAT!

The ONLY thing you did was believe me...it's that simple! If someone can do that....ANYONE CAN believe what God said and promised.
---kathr4453 on 4/2/10


Catherine, Yes, God obligates himself when he promises to save any soul who repents to him, otherwise God would not be trustworthy for not keeping his covenant that he promises. Else why would any soul follow Christ, if there was no good to do so at all, and if he could lie about his word to us? Yes, the covenant binds both parties in the covenant: we, the soul, is obligated to obey onto salvation, and he, the Lord our Savior, is obligated to save the obedient. Imagine if after Noah obeyed God, and God would be negligent and drown Noah and his family and all the animals anyhow. God forbid! God indeed is obligated to his word, always and at all times. He is worthy to be respected and to be trusted and to be praised in all the earth.
---Eloy on 4/2/10


Miche, The reason people wrongly believe that they have no choice in their salvation is because, as long as the person is choosing to stay in sin then God will never choose them, the soul must choose to come out from their sin in order for God to save them, but the sinner wrongly thinks that it is not possible to leave sin, in order to serve righteousness. So instead of taking responsiblity for their own actions: and taking the steps commanded to get saved from destruction, they cleave to their sins which they know is destroying them, and then wrongly say, "getting saved is all God's doing, and none of my doing." But man is not a robot which has no choice in the matter of salvation, but indeed each has a choice.
---Eloy on 4/2/10


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"God is not obligated to save anyone"! That's it.
---catherine on 4/2/10

Sis, I'm only telling you what God says he will do according to HIS word in the Bible.
He says he will save any who repent and believe his son and follow after HIM.
He does not make you do this. He asks you to.
So, God is obligated, He says so in his word.
He sent his son to reconcile ALL mankind back to him.
Why do you listen to man made doctrine and NOT God's word? Be a Berean, search the scripture yourself.
It's there just read it and believe what God says. Not claiming to know more than you, just maybe more mature in the Holy Spirit than you.

Kath, awesome post and to the others who are telling/seeking the truth, AMEN!!
---miche3754 on 4/2/10


He is not talking about God doing the choosing of who is saved or not.
---miche3754 on 4/1/10

Absolutely, if that were so, Judas would be SAVED!!!

Ephesians is about the CHURCH..the whole book is about the BODY as a whole. Peter tells us CHRIST was foreordained. Now WE in Christ HIS BODY have been predestined for WHAT ? To be HOLY and Blameless, to be His Bride, To have a HEAVENLY Calling, to be Joint Heirs with Christ, and Christ Himself will present US to Himself without spot or wrinkle. But NO SCRIPTURE says only certain people were/are saved. We live in this age of the CALLING OUT of the Church. Anyone who hears the Gospel and believes, GOD through Christ WILL conform you to the Image of Jesus Christ.
---kathr4453 on 4/2/10


A-men Miche. Some people are confusing the fact of God choosing certain individuals to carry out specific assignments, with the the different fact that God's gift of salvation he extends to each soul whom will obey him. Even a little child knows that they get exactly what they choose for themself, and life's experience teaches us that certain choices are good for us- namely, accepting the yoke of Christ, and other choices are not good for us- namely, rejecting Christ's commandments: There is "Yes", and there is "No". Them who say No to Christ, Christ will say No to them: but them who say Yes to Christ, Christ will say Yes to them, and them who accept Christ will see what great blessing he will have for them.
---Eloy on 4/2/10


Miche3754,
You are right, when you say, I said yes!
When, its the lord that comes for you.
Again, youre right! You, do have to say, yes!
So, youre right!

Got-ta tell ya!
I am writing this! But, I am laughing my head off!
But, its all true! God love ya!
There is no one like him!
---TheSeg on 4/2/10


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Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him.

Miche3754---Why do you insult Catherine? She may disagree with you doctrinally, but she hasn't ever seemed like an "elitist" to me.
---Donna66 on 4/1/10

When you say God leaves certain people out, you are being an elitist. And Christ was most certainly not that.
I didn't insult her and Im not insulting you, sis.
Both of you take Eph. out of context. Its those who are IN CHRIST that become chosen.
God does not choose. Please understand context when talking about it.
---miche3754 on 4/2/10


I have already done this one time I am going to do it again. "God is not obligated to save anyone"! That's it. If you know more than I know, why don't you tell me what you know? Come on. And God will tell you on judgment day, you knew nothing. You knew nothing about Me. Hallelujah. Thank You, Jesus.++
---catherine on 4/2/10


Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him.

Miche3754---Why do you insult Catherine? She may disagree with you doctrinally, but she hasn't ever seemed like an "elitist" to me.
---Donna66 on 4/1/10


Amen Alan, Kath, Lawrence.

Context is very important!
Jesus was talking to the 12 that he had chosen at that time to spread HIS gospel, THE Gospel.
He is not talking about God doing the choosing of who is saved or not.

Lawrence, bro, I said the same thing you did please go back and re-read.

Catherine, honey, no one is trying to be mean, just telling the truth.
God doesn't do the choosing.
He has his hand stretched out to every living person on this planet. All they have to do is take it. He loves his creation and it hurts and angers him that some rebel STILL.
---miche3754 on 4/1/10


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Catherine ... How can our loving God exclude people from His offer of Salvation?
---alan8566_of_uk on 4/1/10


Oh my goodness,I was going to answer this one, but, she is so far off base till I am not going to touch it with a ten-foot pole.
---catherine on 4/1/10


/I know God came to me, first. Because, I know I wasnt looking for him!
Now all I care about is that you believe God, not in God! But God!
The lord said I will come for you! So, is there something I believe you must do?
As a man who believe in God, No! What did I do? Nothing!
I have looked at my life, is there anything I did. Nothing!
If he came for a piece of nothing like me, how can he not come for precious you?/

Yep, God did the calling but you did do something.....YOU SAID YES!!.
Its like when you get a phone call. God calls and all we have to do is answer the phone.
---miche3754 on 4/1/10


Those who can read, with an open unadulterated heart will see that YES the Apostles were CHOSEN. Even JUDAS was CHOSEN!! HUMMM!

John 6:70
Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
Acts 1:2
Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen:

BUT what were they chosen to do??? ANS: Preach the Gospel to you and me!!!
John 17:20
20Neither pray I for these alone,(the 12 HE had Chosen) but for them also which shall believe on me through their word,

And you who are saved through their WORD are chosen to preach to others!!!
---kathr4453 on 4/1/10


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John 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.
---Donna66 on 4/1/10


Miche
Yes Jesus came to take away the sins of the world. But when Jesus knocks on hearts doors, Not all will answer to let Jesus in with His Salvation Plan. So that persons sins are still with that person, to the grave, then to the white-throne judgment then to the lake of fire & it's that persons choice.
---Lawrence on 4/1/10


Catherine,
God does not choose one person over another, so stop being an elitist.
God has no respect of persons.

Jesus came to take away the sins of the entire world.
He will save any and all who believe in him, have taken up their cross and FOLLOW him. The Holy Spirit draws ALL men through God's WORD, some just refuse to believe. They know right and wrong by God's law. They know they are sinners.
Its the place that we go to when we are resurrected thats predestined.
Unbelievers will be raised, judged and tossed into the lake of fire.
Believers will be raised, judged and given eternal life.
Heaven or hell is predestined NOT man themselves.
---miche3754 on 4/1/10


In all due respect bloggers, God does choose. The word of God are full of scriptures on predestination. Why don't you look up the word? God creates everyone and everything for His own glory, even those who are destined to spend eternity in hell. Study for yourself. Don't just take my word for it. Study for yourselves....And Jesus said, "Remember, I chosed you, you did not choose Me". And I rest my case. And besides that, I am saved, I know what I am talking about. Amen. Thank You Jesus.
---catherine on 4/1/10


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Salvation is for All who obey: "And the times of this ignorance God winked at, but now commands All Humans Every Where to righten. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, seeing his eternal power and Godhead: so that they are without excuse. Repent You All therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out. For the Son of man will come in the glory who's Father of him, with the angels of him, then he will reward To Each according to the works of them." Act 17:30+ Rm.1:20+ Act 3:19+ Mt.16:27.
---Eloy on 4/1/10


miche3754, A-men. Thank you. Sometimes it is very rare to see the truth posted on these blogs today. Thank you again. Each soul chooses which path they will follow in life righteousness, or sin: and each path has it's rewards and consequences: if we follow the wide and broad road of the world we will be cursed and the end is eternal destruction, but if we follow the strait and narrow path of Christ we will be blessed and the end is eternal life in the glories of heaven.
---Eloy on 4/1/10


miche3754, A-men. Thank you. Sometimes it is very rare to see the truth posted on these blogs today. Thank you again. Each soul chooses which path they will follow in life, righteousness or sin: and each path has it's rewards and consequences: if we follow the wide and broad road of the world we will be cursed and the end is eternal destruction, but if we follow the strait and narrow path of Christ we will be blessed and the end is eternal life in the glories of heaven.
---Eloy on 4/1/10


Friendly blogger,
With respect to you,
God does not pick and choose. He said "WHOSOEVER WILL Pick up HIS cross, deny HIMSELF and FOLLOW after me."

What does this say? does this say God chooses who will go to heaven and hell, or does he SET the choices and let man choose for himself who he will follow?

God set the law in front of us so we all know what right and wrong is. He sent Jesus to reconcile us back. All man has to do now is choose.
All This says God gave man choice to do right /live or do wrong/die.
He says he did this.
Its the destination of believers and unbelievers that is predestined. Heaven or Hell.
---miche3754 on 4/1/10


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All actions associated with becoming a member of the family of God are God initiated, you can't opt for membership. It is by God's invitation only and he made up his mid who he would and would not chose prior to the creation process which was billions of years ago prior to God creating the Universe. God offers his grace to his elect at a time of his choosing and it is an offer you can not refuse because it is only offer to those he fore knew would accept.

Repentance and all other life changing actions are subsequent to your salvation not preconditions for it. As we grow under Gods nurturing we learn, advance and become better stewards to serve God.
---Friendly_Blogger on 4/1/10


It is true, you absolutely have no control over this. I am talking true salvation.
---catherine on 4/1/10


The seg, "Seek you all Yhwh while he may be found, call you all upon him while he is near. And you all will seek me and find, when you all will search for me with all your heart. Ask, and it will be given to you: seek, and you all will find: knock, and it will be opened to you. For every one that asks receives: and the one that seeks finds: and to the one that knocks it will be opened. Pretend you all then err, really knowing good gifts to give to your children, how much more will heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him? Here I stand at the door and knock: if any person hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to that one, and will supper with that one, and that one with me."
---Eloy on 4/1/10


Romans 2:7_11: "To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile,
But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
For there is no respect of persons with God."
Luke 8:15: "But that on the good ground are they, which in an honest and good heart, having heard the word, keep it, and bring forth fruit with patience."
---Nana on 4/1/10


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I know God came to me, first. Because, I know I wasnt looking for him!
Now all I care about is that you believe God, not in God! But God!
The lord said I will come for you! So, is there something I believe you must do?
As a man who believe in God, No! What did I do? Nothing!
I have looked at my life, is there anything I did. Nothing!
If he came for a piece of nothing like me, how can he not come for precious you?

Why must he come for you?
Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me: and where I am, thither ye cannot come.
John 6:63! the flesh profiteth nothing
So, Yes!
God Blessed you all!
---TheSeg on 3/31/10


God commands
Gen 6:14, Ex 12:7, Jos 3:8, 1John 3:23
God promises
Gen 6:18-20,Ex 12:23, Jos 3:13, John 3:16
People act in faith
Gen 6:22,7:5,Ex 12:28, Jos 3:15, Acts
God delivers as promised
Gen 7:23,Ex12:29-33, Jos 3:16-17, Eph 2:8
This is consistant throughout the Bible.
---MIchael on 3/31/10


miche3754, no, you seem to be reading a lot that I never implied into what I wrote. But think what you like. It doesn't matter to me. God bless.
---ger.toshav on 3/31/10


miche3754, whatever I have done, God has somehow arranged for it. I am too small to understand the how of it. I do know for certain that I can't come to you and say "I" did anything on my own. That would be prideful boasting on my part.
---ger.toshav on 3/31/10

So, are you saying God made you get "saved" ?
Are you saying you don't have to obey God, or believe and have faith?
admitting that we must repent and believe and obey, is not saying we take credit instead of God. It is saying we submit just like a wife does to her husband.
Yes, God does all of it but he doesn't force you to, he asks that you submit to him.
He asks for obedience NOT sacrifice.
---miche3754 on 3/31/10


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miche3754, God is very clear: The do nothings, get nothings from the Lord: Doers are saved, NonDoers are condemned. Only Doers Are Saved, And Hearers Only Are Condemned. God commands man to be saved, thus it must be possible for man to do something in order to be saved. So what is that that man must do to be saved? God's Word tells us in both Testaments what we must do, namely, Repent (Please Read- Ezekiel 18:30-32). "Repent you all therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out." Acts 3:19. Therefore, there is no salvation without man's participation by first repenting.
---Eloy on 3/31/10


miche3754, whatever I have done, God has somehow arranged for it. I am too small to understand the how of it. I do know for certain that I can't come to you and say "I" did anything on my own. That would be prideful boasting on my part.
---ger.toshav on 3/31/10


NO! First you get saved and then the Holy Spirit comes and makes a home inside of you. God comes to you. And not the other way around. Only true religion, because, God does the choosing, not you doing the choosing. Have you been chosen by God?
---catherine on 3/31/10


Salvation is one hundred percent God's doing and zero percent our doing. If I tell you I did anything at all to bring about my salvation, then it is just empty boasting. (Eph.2:9)
---ger.toshav on 3/30/10

So answer this for me, do you think you don't have to do anything say- like repenting?
or confessing?
submit to God?
Do you think God makes you do these things or do you think God asks you to do these things?

By the way, yes salvation IS of God, but taking that verse(eph.2:9) out of context to make people believe they don't do anything at all is false teaching.
---miche3754 on 3/31/10


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The first step to salvation is realizing that you need to be saved. The second step is to go to the only person who can save you, namely, Jesus the Savior. And the way to reach the Savior is in repentance, you must pray surrendering yourself to him and acknowledge or confess your wrongs and your separation from him. And thirdly, you then ask Jesus to forgive you and to save you from sin, and to come into your heart and life and make you born-again. After Christ saves and converts you, you no longer live for your self, but instead you gladly live for him. You would get baptized and obtain a Holy Bible and start reading the New Testament and living by Jesus' Commandments.
---Eloy on 3/31/10


Five steps of salvation are these. repentance, believing, calling, receiving, confessing. Of course all of these are preceded by hearing the gospel. The reason for the order is this. When a person repents of their Sins God places saving faith in their hearts so that they can believe. It is important to add at this point that this belief is deeper then a head education belief. This is a belief of the heart. After a person is given the faith to believe that will compel them to call out to Jesus whom they believe in. When they call Jesus responds and comes unto them at which point that person receives him into their heart. And after the salvation takes place the person will confess Jesus as their Lord.
---Richard on 3/30/10


first you must realize who jeus is and what ho did,and what he offers,then you must realize you are a sinner in need of his gift,then you must repent and accept him,then the holy spirit does its work in you.
---tom2 on 3/30/10


The Holy Spirit will come live in you after your saved.
---a_friend on 3/30/10


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Salvation is one hundred percent God's doing and zero percent our doing. If I tell you I did anything at all to bring about my salvation, then it is just empty boasting. (Eph.2:9)
---ger.toshav on 3/30/10


I believe the indwelling Holy Spirit comes simultaneously with salvation. I do not believe that the Holy Spirit comes before salvation. I do not believe that salvation is possible without being accompanied by the indwelling Holy Spirit.
---mima on 3/30/10


No, the holy Spirit cannot be in you before salvation. The Holy Spirit is that SEAL that we have placed our faith in Jesus Christ. If you read Romans 4 you will see that circumcision was a SEAL of the promise. Yet we see that when Abraham had faith he was NOT YET circumcised. SHOWING that faith comes before any sealing. Now we see in Colossians 2 what that seal or true Circumcision really meant...the cutting away of the sin of the flesh. It is in our IDENTIFICATION with Christ in Death that our resurrected life is the SEAL uniting us with Christ IN RESURRECTION LIFE,and is the Ernest SEAL of that promise of eternal life.

To preach the Holy Spirit any other way is a false teaching of the ministry of the Holy Spirit.
---kathr4453 on 3/30/10


To be TRULY saved you MUST repent (confess and turn from sins), and accept/trust in Jesus Christ as your savior and Lord (boss). The Holy Spirit can NOT come into your heart until you do these things. It is salvation FIRST, then the Holy Spirit dwelling in you.
---Leslie on 3/30/10


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The Church of the Living God & His Salvation plan is in the book of Acts which Fulfills Matt.28 v's 19-20.
Any & all others Are Man-mades from here 2nd.Cor.11 v's 14-15, & Don't belong to God..
---Lawrence on 3/30/10


Mima, that is NOT what I asked. We already know that part. You give good description on that too!
We already know Jesus' sacrifice.
DO you believe the HS has to be in you BEFORE you get saved?
---miche3754 on 3/30/10


Salvation is a done deal from God's standpoint. If and when a sinner answers the drawing of Almighty God then the new birth is accomplished. Salvation has already been granted by God. And for you to gain your salvation God has to do nothing more than what he has done, and is doing. What he has done is paid for your sins, and what he is doing is wooing(drawing) you to that fact. Once the wooing is answered salvation exist!!!! I realize many will not agree with this explanation. No one in hell can blame God for being there.
---mima on 3/30/10


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