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Women Pouring Ointment

After the woman poured ointment on Jesus' head (for His burial), Jesus said, "wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world, what this woman has done will also be told as a memorial to her." (in Matthew 26:6-13) Was this Mary Magdalene? Or?

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 ---Bill_bila5659 on 4/1/10
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Bill, it was Mary the sister of Martha and Lazarus whom Jesus brought back from the dead. John 12:3 is speaking of the same occasion but with a different twist since they are two different writers. Matthew and Mark mention she anointed His head. John adds that she anointed His feet.

While Luke 7:36-38 speaks of a women but the name is not mentioned. This was a different occasion because the difference is timeing, location and detail. This occasion was before the Pharisees who ask Jesus to eat with them and set down to eat. This women washed His feet with her tears and wiped them with the hair of her head and she kissed His feet and anointed them with the oil.
---MarkV. on 4/13/10


Miche3754. We DO HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION.. and it comes by the very words of Jesus! A woman who has had five husbands and is living with a man NOT her husband IS either a fornicator or adulterer.
Or do you believe that was righteous living.
Why do you think she came to the well alone... instead of in the cool of the day with the other women?

She hadn't told Jesus this, but HE knew. And by telling her this he proved that He knew everything about her. And in spite of her shame, He offered her the water of life. She went to her people saying Jhn 4:29 Come, see a man, which told me all things that ever I did: is not this the Christ?

Her sinfulness is not incidental to the story, but a major feature of it.
---Donna66 on 4/12/10


Markv,

Please see my comment to Donna66.

Jesus clearly told her about herself to prove he was the living water.
Of course she didn't know until he did this.
See their conversation.
Not enough is told to us about her past to draw a conclusion and I don't believe Jesus wanted us to do that. I believe Jesus used her to show us that there is no sin that can't be forgiven and washed away by him.
Jesus did not label her and we as Christians should not do that either.
Does anyone bother to read ALL of the blog post before jumping to conclusion and judging a person around here?
---miche3754 on 4/12/10


/The point is, NOT that she wasn't living a sinful life-style, as Miche would like to believe, BUT that Jesus KNEW even the more sordid details of her life. Yet He accepted her and offered her forgiveness.
---Donna66 on 4/11/10.....


I never said or implied that Donna.
I said that we didn't know enough to say she was either this or that.

Jesus told her these things so she would know he is the prophesied Messiah.
I agree with you, Jesus could have cared less about her past. He cared about her belief in him and forgiving her sins, changing her future... saving her.
---miche3754 on 4/12/10


Miche says, the woman was not a harlot, she just had five husbands and is living with other who is not who husband. When Jesus mentioned her five husbands He did it because she failed to understand the nature of the living water He offered (v,15). Jesus abruptly turned the dialogue on her real spiritual need for conversion and cleansing from sin. His intimate knowledge of her morally depraved life not only indicated His supernatural ability, but also focused on her spiritual condition. She was living with a man not her husband. By such an explicit statement our Lord rejected the notion that when two people live together it constituted marriage. Biblically, marriage is alway restricted to a public, formal, official and recognized covenant.
---MarkV. on 4/12/10




If she was living with a man not her husband, what would it be but fornication or adultery?!***

FWIW, the words "husband" and "man" in John 4 about this interview are in fact the SAME word in Greek--anir.
---Cluny on 4/10/10

I know they mean the same thing.

My point is that we don't have enough information to say she was a Harlot or that she was fornicating. Jesus never says any of this.

Example- I lived with a man who was not my husband.. HE WAS A ROOM MATE! No fornication or harlotry going on either. Had his own room and all.
Why does it always have to be an argument with you even when I am agreeing with you? Or are you too blind to even see that?
JEEZE!
---miche3754 on 4/12/10


Cluny -- However I transpose the words "man" and "husband", I can't see any change in the meaning of the passage:

KJV---John 4:18--- (For thou hast had five husbands, and he whom thou now hast is not thy husband: in that saidst thou truly.)


In either case, it sounds as if the woman was living outside the accepted norm (i.e) in sin. If it were not an important point, I do not believe Jesus would not have have remarked about it.

The point is, NOT that she wasn't living a sinful life-style, as Miche would like to believe, BUT that Jesus KNEW even the more sordid details of her life. Yet He accepted her and offered her forgiveness.
---Donna66 on 4/11/10


John 12:47 And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
John 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
-No matter what her sins were, His words weren't death, they are Life.
-It wasn't important who she was, It was important who He is.
-Jesus didn't accuse or name her, we shouldn't either.
John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth, the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, [they] are spirit, and [they] are life.
John 6:68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
---MIchael on 4/10/10


***Miche3754 You say
//It says she had 5 husbands and the one she was living with was NOT her husband. It doesn't say she was fornicating or living in adultery//

If she was living with a man not her husband, what would it be but fornication or adultery?!***

FWIW, the words "husband" and "man" in John 4 about this interview are in fact the SAME word in Greek--anir.
---Cluny on 4/10/10


Miche3754 You say
//It says she had 5 husbands and the one she was living with was NOT her husband. It doesn't say she was fornicating or living in adultery//

If she was living with a man not her husband, what would it be but fornication or adultery?!

We don't know that she was a "harlot", but there is more reason to draw this conclusion than there is to assume the same of Mary Magdalene.
I can understand Anon's preacher's point about the woman at the well. It is a godly and powerful teaching. I certainly would NOT call him a false teacher.

If he was teaching the same about Mary Magdelene he might be accused of false teaching because he would be teaching tradition and not Bible.
---Donna66 on 4/10/10




anon,

If you can't prove it, why are you making a dogma out of it? It was YOU who started the whole discussion. You can't prove from Holy Scriptures that Mary Magdalene was a harlot and that her being such is doctrinal important and yet with others point that out to you, you say they a being 'mean'?

That Mary Magdalene was a harlot is simply a ancient tradition. There is no Scriptura references for such teaching.

In IC.XC.,
---Ignatius on 4/10/10


\\Cluny, you are right, I can't prove it. Are you happy now? You people can be very mean here.\\

Let's see.

You make statements, but when you are challenged to support them and finally admit you cannot, OTHER people are mean?

Do I understand you right?

Forgive me, but this is very childish reasoning.
---Cluny on 4/10/10


Anon, what are you talking about?
I was not calling Cluny a false teacher.
Didn't you say you heard a preacher say that the woman at the well was a harlot but that Jesus didn't see her as that?
I believe you did.
The woman at the well was not a harlot.
And I am going to say you misread what posted because that last line was not directed at Cluny. It was a general statement about false teachers.
If I were going to call Cluny that, I would not have praised him or agreed with him. And I certainly would NOT insult him like that. I have my disagreements with him, but I would not ever call him a false teacher.
---miche3754 on 4/9/10


Please post,
I also apologize if you are offended about me saying that man was a false teacher but truth is truth, Anon.
What he said about the woman at the well was speculation on his part NOT what Jesus said or did.
I was simply pointing that out.
What he taught you about the woman at the well was false because she was not a harlot.
---miche3754 on 4/9/10


In fact go read the Bible for yourself instead of listening to false teachers.
---miche3754 on 4/9/10

miche3754, thanks for sharing the love of God that's shed abroad in your heart towards me, another sister in the Lord. You are very nasty here, why is that? This is totally out of character for you. I am going to write to the man who taught me the story and I will cut and paste you calling him a false teacher. This man is so much like Jesus, you wouldn't recognize him because I don't even think you realize how nasty you are.
Cluny, you are right, I can't prove it. Are you happy now? You people can be very mean here. No wonder why I lose my desire to come here sometimes. People get so nasty here.
---anon on 4/9/10


\\Donna66, like I said to Cluny, it may not matter to you but it does matter to me.\\

anon, I noticed that you did not actually answer the two questions I asked on 4/6.

For your benefit, I will repeat them.

Prove according to the Scriptures and no other source:

1. That Mary Magdalene was a prostitute.

2. That her being one is of any doctrinal or spiritual or salvific importance.

If you cannot do so, have the grace to admit it.

If you can prove it, do so.
---Cluny on 4/9/10


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Because I heard a teaching on the women at the well and when this preacher said, "Jesus didn't see her for the harlot that she was, He saw her as the Bride of Christ that she would become."
anon/

Who said the woman at the well was a harlot?

The Bible does no say that. It says she had 5 husbands and the one she was living with was NOT her husband. It doesn't say she was fornicating or living in adultery.
Just like it does not say Mary M. was a prostitute. It says Jesus cast 7 demons out of her.
Cluny right, Anon. You should listen to him. In fact go read the Bible for yourself instead of listening to false teachers.
---miche3754 on 4/9/10


Anon-- Of course I understand! The woman at the well could easily have been be called a "harlot". I'm not against teaching about harlots (or adultery...remember the woman taken in adultery, that the men were wanting to stone?) The mercy of Jesus in these cases speaks volumes.

But when it comes to Mary Magdelene, we simply do not know.
The Bible doesn't say she was a harlot. And I think we must check every teaching against what the Bible actually says.
---donna66 on 4/8/10


Donna66, like I said to Cluny, it may not matter to you but it does matter to me.

Because I heard a teaching on the women at the well and when this preacher said, "Jesus didn't see her for the harlot that she was, He saw her as the Bride of Christ that she would become."

When the Spirit of God takes something taught like that and pierces your soul and spirit with it and it changes your life, then you would understand why it's important to me and harlots. Maybe there's an area of your life where you need that special touch from Jesus and He spoke something directly into your being, see my point?
---anon on 4/8/10


anon --The idea that Mary Magdeline was a horlot was mere tradition...no scriptural basis for the belief whatsoever.

I'm with Cluney. What difference does it make? Since Jesus cast seven devils out of her, she was no doubt very sinful. She could have been a harlot...and that might demonstrate the compassion of Jesus to prostitutes today, but we don't know for sure what her sins were. I think we must be careful not to make the Bible say something it doesn'r really say.
---Donna66 on 4/6/10


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\\Second - by Cluny saying it doesn't matter whether she was a prostitute or not is negating the fact that Jesus said, they will get into heaven before the Pharisees.\\

Please prove from the Bible (and no other source) the following:

1. That Mary Magdalene was in fact a prostitute.

2. That her being so is doctrinally important.
---Cluny on 4/6/10


peter3594...You missed my point COMPLETELY.

I'm not the one quoting a Pope, and since Pope Gregory's words are not recorded in scripture, then why quote a Pope? Someone people worship which is idolatry.

Second - by Cluny saying it doesn't matter whether she was a prostitute or not is negating the fact that Jesus said, they will get into heaven before the Pharisees.

Don't you think it IS important for the prostitutes out there who aren't saved to believe Jesus can save them? If he delivered and saved prostitutes in the bible? If I were one, I'd be jumping for Joy right now - the point SHOULD NOT BE negated.

And I didn't quote myself, nor a Pope so your last point is very silly.
---anon on 4/5/10


anon:

There is actually nothing in the Bible that says that Mary Magdalene was a prostitute.

The Bible does say that Jesus cast seven devils out of her, and perhaps before this time she was free and easy, but positively claiming she was a prostitute would be insisting upon an unproven conclusion.

All I did was to give the basis for the identification of Mary Magdalene as a harlot.

If you believe this, you are believing a teaching of the Pope.
---Cluny on 4/5/10


Anon: you really should not write that way to Cluny - he is quoting someone else who did, after all, rise to high position and appears to have studied the matter. Your question about Epistliles are silly - after all, what you ask if he (Gregory) has done is patently impossible, as he was Pope (590-604AD)AFTER the canonical epistles had been chosen (325AD) - it's like me asking YOU which epistle YOU wrote.
---peter3594 on 4/5/10


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Cluny, what epistle did Pope Gregory write? Where is he mentioned in the Bible and why are you quoting him? and not Paul the Apostle? Or Peter who write 1st and 2nd Peter?
Cluny on 4/1/10 and the idea that Mary Magdalene was a prostitute.
Whether she was or not is unimportant.

Cluny - to you it may be unimportant whether or not Mary Magdelene was a prostitute, but Jesus did say the harlots will enter into the Kingdom of God before the Pharisees, so I think it's important to know that she was a prostitute and Jesus saved her and she became a great woman of God-gives hope to the prostitutes out there, don't ya think?
---anon on 4/5/10


Luke 7:11-50 > Jesus went to Nain. Then "a sinner" anointed Jesus. Next (Luke 8:2), we meet Mary Magdalene "out of whom had come seven demons". This was well before the Passover mentioned in Luke 22.

In *Bethany*, "six days before the Passover", Mary the sister of Lazarus "anointed the feet of Jesus" (John 12:1-8).

*Two* days before > Matthew 26:6-13 says "a woman" in *Bethany* at "Simon the Leper"'s house anointed Jesus, "for My burial," He said. Plus, Jesus said, "wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world, what this woman has done will also be told as a memorial to her." (So, what she did has just been told, here in Christianet!)
---Bill_bila5659 on 4/1/10


There are three accounts of the anointing of Christ.

The Eastern Christian writers understand these to be by three separate women at three separate times: Mary of Bethany, Mary of Magdala, and the woman simply called "the sinner."

Pope Gregory was (as far as I know) the first writer to believe that these are three accounts of the same event, thus causing the "muddle of the Marys" that exists among Western Christians, and the idea that Mary Magdalene was a prostitute.

Whether she was or not is unimportant. The important fact is that she loved Jesus so much that she is the first person recorded in the Gospels to see the Resurrected Jesus.
---Cluny on 4/1/10


While it is impossible to be dogmatic about this. We are engaging in guesstimation and my guess is that it was not Mary Magdalene!!

I believe it was Lazarus' Sister Mary.
John 11:1-2,"
1-Now a certain man was sick, named Lazarus, of Bethany, the town of Mary and her sister Martha.

2-(It was that Mary which anointed the Lord with ointment, and wiped his feet with her hair, whose brother Lazarus was sick.)
---mima on 4/1/10


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