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Are All People Bad

Who thinks that they are a good person? The Bible says in Romans 3:10-18,23 that there are NONE that are good, and ALL have sinned. Only God is good. What are your thoughts?

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 ---Leslie on 5/24/10
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Warwick,

After numerous translations, interpretations, additions and redactions I do not believe there is a credible account of a "historical Jesus".

Nor, do I believe that any two "Christians" could agree, based on their personal interpretations of an uncertain "scripture", on what it would mean to follow Jesus.

I have stated the above numerous times.

I could not make the statement you attribute to me because I believe nobody has any idea of what "following Jesus" means.

I have consistently stated that god and religion are used by people to excuse and justify all manner of belief and actions. Some that call themselves Christian are among those, and you know it.
---atheist on 5/29/10


Remember atheist is willingly deceitful in saying following Jesus has negative consequences for society. ---Warwick.

This is a lie.
---atheist on 5/29/10


MarkV ... Where have I taken sides with Atheist?

I think I understand where he stands. That does not mean I agree with him, and I think my overall comments show quite clearly that I don't

But I will not call a man a murderer because I know he is a thief, which is what happens if we rubbish anything A says, rahter than argue honestly with it.

You and David should notice that I said "It is possible to argue" ... not saying that I agreed with that argument! It is part of understanding someone else's position, and I am trying to show you what outsiders may argue, so that we are equipped to respond to such challenges.

Don't you think you would sway Atheist better if you tried to understand his position?
---alan8566_of_uk on 5/29/10


In God's world, there is no such thing as "DARK", there is only light (no contrast/opposite to "LIGHT").

1 John 1:5
"God is light and in him is no darkness at all".

For the same reason, true aetheists tend to be very righteous,....but they don't truly understand the concept of "righteous" because in their world and mind, there is no contrast/opposite to "righteous"/light ("MORALITY" is simply man-made guidelines that replace a CONSCIENCE/spirit of our own and is meant to compensate for a rebellious lifestyle).

God wants us to CORRECTLY understand and use the knowledge gained in the Garden of Eden and have a mind that rejects "darkness".
---more_excellent_way on 5/29/10


Alan, atheist understands right and wrong, because of the influence of Christianity.

He would not have the same moral concepts if born in an atheistic or Islamic society.

Christians have accepted God came through love (John 3:16 etc) to pay the price for our sin. We love and worship Him because of this. We obey Him because of love, not fear. Sadly those who ignore or reject Him, have much to fear.

Christians therefore have a universal concrete foundation for morality.

The atheist has only feelings, and fear of man's law.

When atheism rules the law of the survival of the fittest prevails.

Remember atheist is willingly deceitful in saying following Jesus has negative consequences for society.
---Warwick on 5/29/10




There is no conundrum as propounded by alan of UK. Either we 'are animals' as atheist insists, or we are created for a purpose and possess morality inherently setting us apart from animals. It can't be both, it's either one or the other.

This is where I will agree with Warwick, because atheist is unable to explain why evolution would cause by chance humans to have qualities such as 'love', 'morality' and other 'human' qualities not found in animals.

It is the debase teaching of atheists and darwinists who say 'Humans ARE animals' that give people with animalistic tendencies such as Hitler the excuse to do what they do best- genocide without compunction.

Hitler was an animal, and is a fine example of atheist's philosophy.
---David8318 on 5/29/10


Alan, I don't expect athiest to understand anything that is of God but I expect you to. When you take sides you side with a person who is not only lost but speaks against God. He is from a different family then ours. He is in opposition to God. When Tom spoke the words he did, he was speaking on behalf of what God has to say about the lost. God is clear on that, and you turn around and take God's Word and give it a new meaning. The believers are born of the Spirit and are endwelled by the Spirit unto good works. They don't do good works because they have to, they do it because they want to. Of course athiest loves what you say, you are on his side, he doesn't believe in God, yet opposes God from every angle and has you to speak on his behalf.
---MarkV. on 5/29/10


Tom ... again you are saying the same as me ... "the only difference is as a born again believer we are FORGIVEN"

So why is it that your are right to say that, and I am wrong, and you condemn me and say it is apparent I do not live the word?

Otherwise, Atheist IS as good anyone. He is as good as you and me, and Mark, and Eloy, and all the others here.

The sadness is that he does not beleive in God and Jesus.

When you refer to the conundrum that I posed, you are straying into another area where I don't think you are able to understand that I am talking about the apparent motives for behaving morally, where fromone perspective, the atheis't motive could be seen as purer and less selfish.
---lan8566_of_uk on 5/29/10


alan,what matters whether or not you do not steal,do not murder,whatever if you are woithout faith in God?there is no conundrum,only life or death,only belief or you are lost,you act as though athiest is as good as anyone,but no one is,thats my point,the only difference is as a born again believer we are FORGIVEN he is not.he is doomed.
---tom2 on 5/29/10


Alan, I do think you understand my position.

Each of us, religious or not, chose their morality, have a sense to one degree of right and wrong, (expect those lacking a 'normal' brain---whatever that might be), and decide themselves what they believe and what they should do.

I admit it's just me.

The religious on the other hand do the same, but use the intermediaries of god, religion and scripture to create a justification beyond themselves for what they believe and do. They thus in a very real way move responsiblity from themselves to an abstract, undefinable, and from my perspective, imaginary entity.

Check out a video call Battle for Haditha, to see adherents of all faiths pray before they slaugter one another.
---atheist on 5/29/10




azlan,athiests morality is more soundly based than a christians?christians dont do these things because they are fearful of Gods judgement?christians dont do these things because God says not to do them,and athiests moralities are based on the world, so they have no basis at all.brother you are so lost in your opinions,and actually they are not based on the word,but your perception of how you believe a christain should interact with a non believer,and guess what your are scripturally wrong.
---tom2 on 5/29/10


as usual any conversation with you makes little sense,about the same as athiest,its apparent you do not live the word.
---tom2 on 5/29/10


Warwick ... it's possiblle to argue that the atheists morality is more soundly based than the Christians

Atheist and Christians would agree that it is wrong to steal, commit adultery, kill, and so on.

Why does Atheist not do those things? Because he just knows or has reasoned that they are wrong.

The Christian does no do those things because he is fearful of judgment from God.

Whose morality is the purer?

Who is the better giver, the one who gives out of the generosity of his own heart, or the one who gives because God the Judge says he must?

A conundrum!!
---alan8566_of_uk on 5/29/10


Tom ... You do like to disagree with everything I say, don't you?

You now say "your problem is you are afraid too tell them the truth"

Did you not read what I said? ... "Atheist's problem-to-be is that He does not beleive in God and trust in Jesus. That's what gives us salvation, not any purity in the way that we live"

You seem to be like an accuser, who says "he is a thief, so he is the murderer"
---alan8566_of_uk on 5/29/10


alan,of course we are all sinners,some forgiven,othners like athiest who may never be because we all have free will,your problem is you are afraid too tell them the truth,you wish or want to be polite,or civil,,thats great, but it doont change the truth,and it surely dont change their eternal destiny.
---tom2 on 5/29/10


Tom ... I'm sorry, I read your earlier post

"you and me,and every single one alive,the only real difference is the saved are forgiven"

If that did not mean we are all sinners, what on earth did it mean?

And, pray tell me where I have sugar-coated sin?
---alan8566_of_uk on 5/29/10


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As an acknowleged nemesis of 'atheist', I wish to declare openly that no one has the right to condemn him to hell. It is God's job to declare the eternal fate of each one of us - and to usurp the prerogative of God is blasphemy. Indeed, we Christians can't even agree on what or where hell actually is, so how could we send someone there?

It is my hope that, before he dies, 'atheist' will come down from his mountain of self-importance, see himself as he truly is, recognize his need of a Savior, and respond to the call of infinite love. Salvation is offered freely to all who are still alive - even atheists.
---jerry6593 on 5/29/10


Warwick, Your post shows you don't "get" the "fundamentals"!
Jn.3.16 The "world" God loved was the Edenic one He created that his Son died to restore where people could live forever!
God has NOT changed His mind about having an earth teeming with people who worship Him!
To insinuate that God blows up the earth taking all the saved ones to heaven means "satan wins".
The answer is in the bible that you "think" you understand!
---1st_cliff on 5/29/10


Actually, Warwick, "fundamentalism" got its name from a series of writings by Frank Machen of Princeton called "The Fundamentals."

He insisted there were several propositions for approaching Scripture that were intellectually defensible.

Of course, I realize that Church history is not the usual Western evangelical's strong suit.
---Cluny on 5/29/10


Cliff a fundamentalist, by definition, is one who believes in the fundamentals of Christianity, as revealed in Scripture. You set your self apart from and opposed to 'fundamentalists' exposing that you do not believe in the fundamental tennets of Christianity.

Considering what you believe I am happy we "fundamentalists just don't get it!"

Are you saying Jesus did not come to die and rise again that all who believe in Him would inherit eternal life?

You see this polluted, war-torn, disease ridden, hate-filled earth as the same place He created? Or rather is this the world that sinful man has 'created?'

What you call arrogance is simply the confident assurance which those who trust Him and His word have.
---Warwick on 5/28/10


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atheist, atheists can behave well, but have no concrete universal foundation for morality. It is only personal opinion, therefore lacking absolutes of right and wrong, only situational ethics as the record shows. Atheistic promotion of killing live unborn children is also a good example of atheistic morality.

BTW we do not obey God because of fear, but because of love. Jesus died because He loves us, and we love Him for it! We are "morally compromised." That is why we asked Jesus to save us from the effects of our compromise.

"I want to engage in all manner behaviors without punishment." Indeed.

Rejection of another's beliefs is not intolerance of the person. If it was you too would be intolerant.
---Warwick on 5/28/10


atheist, further to your personal morality may I say it is in considerable doubt. You have claimed that religion (in which you include Christianity) has negative consequences for society. Fair enough, as many religions do. However I have repeatedly asked you to show what negative consequences exist in the commands of Christ. Remember Christianity it faith in Him, not faith in ceremonies, denominations or people's opinions.

You will not answer this question because you know you are wrong. Nonetheless you continue to promote what you know to be a lie, and further defend the monstrous idea that Hitler, the antiChristian psychopath was Christian.

That you continue with this deceit shows you lack integrity. So much for your morals.
---Warwick on 5/28/10


alan,by your statement you have clumped everyone together,sorry you are wrong,as a christian I know what Gods word says ,we are set apart from the world thru jesus,non believers are lost,and fullfill the lusts and desires of the flesh without thought,or better yet any repentence,a big difference,this too is scripturally based,only thru christ are we different than the world,which is what athiest is,we are to speak the truth in love,not sugar coat sin with your language.
---tom2 on 5/28/10


Only the rebellious/reprobate will not receive GOOD/holy "rewards".

....ALL FLESH shall "SEE" the salvation of God (regardless of behavior or belief). Some will receive a BAD "reward" (penalty) because of their mistreatment of others (like those who are 'JUDICIAL' and pursue others), but those who are gentle, peaceful, and just towards their fellow human being will receive GOOD REWARDS/"gifts".

Nobody in the O.T. had GOD IN ENTIRETY, but some were "holy"/peaceful...

Ephesians 4:8
"he led a host of captives, and he gave gifts to men".

Scripture was not written to "Christians", nor written to any GROUP at all, it was written to ALL OF HUMANITY.
---more_excellent_way on 5/28/10


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Leslie, "God desires ALL people to be saved and in heaven"
What scripture says God wants "people"in heaven??
If that's what He wanted then why did He create this beautiful planet suited in every way for human habitation???

You fundamentalists just don't get it!

It's like satan says "you want to be like gods!"(not satisfied with our perfect home)
The meek will inherit the earth!(not the arrogant pseudo-Christian)
---1st_cliff on 5/28/10


Alan,

You appear to be one of the few I have come across who think reasonably, and understand that although I am an atheist, (which means I don't believe in any god), I do not hold that position because, lacking any sense of right or wrong, I want to engage in all manner behaviors without punishment.

(I believe that people who don't do wrong because they are afraid of punishment are really "morally" compromised to begin with.)

I am sure you extend that consideration to people of other faiths than your own, which I find is a quality lacking in many of the deeply religious. Everyone else is going to hell.

Thanks for behaving as a "Christian" in the way the common vernacular implies.
---atheist on 5/28/10


Mark & Tom

You don't really read what others have said, do you? You say much the same as me, from a slightly different angle

You agree that we all live for the lusts of the flesh ... Christians do as much as atheists. That's why we all need God and Jesus.

But you made the one-way accusation that Atheist is "living for the flesh,you are lost in the lusts and desires of the flesh" without acknowledging that we all do.

Atheist's problem-to-be is that He does not beleive in God and trust in Jesus.
That's what gives us salvation, not any purity in the way that we live... that would be "works"

MarkV ... I have no problem with taking "lake of fire" as being figurative.
---alan8566_of_uk on 5/28/10


markv,isn,t it amazing how even professing christians can ignore the truth,its called justification,but its actually an empty justification,as we know scripturally we as mere humans receive justification thru jesus and the word of God.truth real truth resides only in God, jesus and the holy spirit,but iam amazed at how some people take offense ,personally offense with me doesn,t bother me in the least,but I like your statement and have used it often myself,THE TRUTH IS THE TRUTH,I would add whether they know it or not.
---tom2 on 5/28/10


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Atheist declared on a different thread- 'Humans ARE animals', as if he is saying something new. I know atheists/Darwinists believe this, which is why people can excuse themselves when they act like animals- 'It is an evolutionary thing'.

The point I am making is the Darwinian religious belief is dangerous because of its foundation philosophy- 'Humans ARE animals'- which in the wrong hands (ie Hitler) causes death on an industrial scale. 'We are animals, so let's at like one'.

In fact, Hitler wanted to rid 'humans' of their consciences, which is not inherent in animals.

I agree, 'religious people were herded about'. They were herded about by Hitler who cunningly convinced a gullible yet influential organization to follow him.
---David8318 on 5/28/10


Alan, what Tom posted is Scripture so how can he be wrong? All of what he quoted is in Scripture, God said it, if God said it, how can it be wrong? You say your a Christian, so you should stand by the Word of God. As to what God has to say, athiest is lost. God describes the lost very clear. Athiest is not only lost, he speaks against God. Your saying he is not what Tom mentioned, that he lied, and compare athiest actions to those of Christians. You even suggest "your lake of fire" Its not his lake, it is the lake that God created, that too is in Scripture.
I talk to Athiest and I think he is polite when he answers. But the Truth is the Truth. Do you turn around and tell him a lie just to please him and look good doing it?
---MarkV. on 5/28/10


1)Haven't and won't feel a thing, because 'god' doesn't exist. - Atheist

Atheist, then why do you blog and why do you question?


For the rest of us that have sight Genesis 6 says it all.
And Jehovah saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that EVERY imagination of the thoughts of his heart was ONLY evil CONTINUALLY.
---larry on 5/28/10


Atheist: I can see where you are coming from, for once I felt the same way.

I will just point out that one of your comments ((2) God doesn't seem so nice if he's going to torture me in hell just for not believing) has a problem, which I will explain

The reason for hell is not what you suggested. The real reason for hell is that, if people will not accept that they are not the way God wants us to be, then WE are stopping God from making us into what we should be

As a result [this is a strange way of saying it] if we do not believe, and let God (only God can do that) sort out our problems, we will be 'cast out' in the same way we cast out an item which is broken - because it is not what we want
---peter3594 on 5/28/10


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I'm sure Atheist stays around here because he loves all the attention he's getting. And he knows how to get it. But I would imagine most of us are here for the same reason. People like us like to bicker and fuss. We need to get a real life, don't we...
---ger.toshav on 5/27/10


Yes, all people are sinners no exemption. Even babies under the womb were sinners. Psalm 51:5 We are a fallen Nature. Unless you are God's Elect, God will change your heart bec. only God can communicate our hearts. He change whom He wants according to his election of Grace. Therefore it is not right to say "Because I am righteous" "I made decision to obey or follow God" How could a wicked obey the Gospel unless unless change his heart? How can a sinner confess unless God touch his heart?

Ezekiel 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
---rosalie on 5/27/10


alan as usual you are way off base,personally IF athiest is insulted by by statements to him TOO BAD,and that applies to you to.the whole human race is an insult to God,that includes you and me,and every single one alive,the only real difference is the saved are forgiven.asthiest doesnt believe in God at all,so he is living for the flesh,plain and simple and scriptural.
---tom2 on 5/28/10


Samuel: Indeed, the false doctrine of the immortal soul being tortured in hell forever has created more atheists than any other. These poor souls will not only go through this life never knowing the "peace that passeth all understanding", but will go to their graves with no hope in the coming resurrection of the saints.
---jerry6593 on 5/28/10


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Well Atheist I have to agree with your statment that GOD does not seem nice if HE is going to torture you in hell for not believing. Fortunatly the Bible does not teach this.

The Bible says that those who do not love others in Matthew 25 by helping those who are less fortunate will not go to heaven but die the second death no matter their profession of faith.

Death is the wage for sin. We choose to let JESUS die for our sin or we choose to die in sin. So you will not go to heaven because you love sin and do not love others as you love yourself.
---Samuel on 5/27/10


Tom ... Let me first say I am a Christian.

But I can see no justification for your statement thta Atheist is "living for the flesh,you are lost in the lusts and desires of the flesh"

Atheists can, and most do, live lives no more controlled by flesh, lust and desires than Christians.

They may be destined to your lake of fire, or whatever punishment God actually has for those who don't beleive in Him.

But it is insulting and absurd to insist that atheists live immoral lives
---alan8566_of_uk on 5/27/10


Someone once said what when you say, "He's a good person," you've actually said the LEAST you can say about him.

In this sense, we're all "good people": well-meaning, sniff roses, kiss babies, pet hamsters, and the like.
---Cluny on 5/27/10


Atheist - 1st How do you know that God does not exist? Can you see the wind? If you can't how do you know that the wind exists? If you are right, and Christians are wrong, then you have nothing to worry about. But if Christians are right, and you are wrong, then what? 2nd God does NOT send us to Hell, we send ourselves there by rejecting Christ, and not repenting of sin - God desires ALL people to be saved and in Heaven. It's you who will send yourself to Hell, NOT God. 3rd People can know the heart of God by reading the Bible - what is in it is the heart of God. I encourage and urge you to repent of your sins and accept Christ as your Savior and Lord (Boss) before it is too late.
---Leslie on 5/27/10


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Atheist - #2 Cont. - If you think about it God is nice and good that He would send you to Hell. If a serial killer went into the courtroom and told the judge "I know that you are good because you are forgiving and loving, therefore you should let me go free", and the judge says "I am good and forgiving, so I will let you go free" - is that judge really good, or should he be thrown off the bench for that call of letting a serial killer go free? Most of us would say he should be thrown off the bench. ALL humans have committed crimes against God, should we go free or be punished in Hell? If God is good, He will punish us. God is even more good, in the fact He sent His son to take our punishment, so we could go free.
---Leslie on 5/27/10


athiest... I pity you. You're a person without hope. The Bible calls you a fool. Psalm 14:1 & Psalm 53:1 "The fool hath said in his heart,There is no God." I told you Sunday(not sure which blog), that I thought of you during church service & prayed for you.It is my hope that you realize how much God loves you & the sacrifice Christ made for you before it's eternally too late.
---Reba on 5/27/10


Punishment is not always a physical thing such as torture or being sent to prison. Punishment may also come in the form of witholding. Should the joy of knowing God be witheld from you, you are being punished.
---Cowboy on 5/27/10


athiest,not a judgement just a statement of fact as revealed in the bible,as a non believer you are living in darkness,living for the flesh,you are lost in the lusts and desires of the flesh,and doomed to the lake of fire at the great white throne judgement.nothing personal,this is what God says is your fate,we all have free will,we all choose whether to believe or not,and we all either suffer for rejecting God,for rejecting jesus,or are rewarded as a follower of jesus,the choice is yours.
---tom2 on 5/26/10


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Aetheist, clearly you object to the world's portrayal of the loving kind origin (the realization that there is a creator/origin is inescapable).

WE have looked into scripture and accepted the common teachings,...we have "seen" that there is a creator.

John 20:29
"...Blessed are those who have not seen and yet believe".

Your belief that He is "quite pleased" with you pleases Him ("Blessed").

The man of God has enough wisdom to know what is right or not and discerns properly. His judge is not on this earth (others refuse to acknowledge this).

1 Corinthians 2:15
"but is himself to be judged by no one".

"he led a host of captives".
---more_excellent_way on 5/26/10


Athiest - Again I say to you, how come God has not let you feel His wrath & punishment for your sin?....You choose, Jesus or taking your own punishment in Hell.
---Leslie

1)Haven't and won't feel a thing, because 'god' doesn't exist.

2)God doesn't seem so nice if he's going to torture me in hell just for not believing.

3)How do you know the heart of 'god'(I thought that was unknowable)---perhaps, if he exists, he is quite please with me, and displeased with you for judging me...
---atheist on 5/26/10


Leslie, that verse is comparing the sinuous NonJews to being equal with the sinuous Jews, and is not speaking of all people, and especially not speaking of the saints. In context, lit.Gk: "What advantage then has the Jew? Engender this not! but come to be God whom true, and individual persons erring. What then? are we better? No, in no ways: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are each uner sin. Even the righteousness of God by obeying Jesus Christ onto each and upon whosoever them obeying: seeing there is not a difference, as each sinned, indeed whoever lacking glory of God. To declare at this time his righteousness: in his being he's just, and justifying whom of obedient in Jesus." Romans 3:1,4,9,22,23,26.
---Eloy on 5/26/10


lit.Gk: "Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of performings? No, but by the law of obedience. Therefore we conclude that a person is justified by obedience apart from the performings of the law. Or he God of Jews only? and not also of nations? Yes, of nations also: Seeing one God which will justify the circumcision by obedience, and uncircumcision through obedience. The law then do we make anarchy through that obedience? Not let it be! But law we establish." Romans 3:27-31.
---Eloy on 5/26/10


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Athiest - Again I say to you, how come God has not let you feel His wrath & punishment for your sin? The answer is clear, God is good, and humans are NOT. ALL humans saved or unsaved sin on a DAILY basis (you are included in this). Is there anyone who has not told a lie? Is there anyone who has not thought hateful or lustful thoughts? To God ALL sin is the same (if you lie it's the same as if you murdered). To God if you committ one sin, you committ them ALL. In this case God should eliminate ALL humans (including you), and let us feel the wrath and punishment of our own sins. He doesn't because He is good, and sent His son to die and take our punishment for us. You choose, Jesus or taking your own punishment in Hell.
---Leslie on 5/26/10


Atheist: While I see a number of other comments about your question about why evil exists, I will add just one more, as I can see why you ask

This has been a long-running question, with many Christians working to explain

I agree with most of the comments, that while people were INITIALLY created good, they (we) were also given the ability to choose to follow God

If we were created with the ability to choose to folow God, I take it that means we were also given the ability to choose NOT to follow God

I cannot say much more
---peter3594 on 5/26/10


Leslie on 5/24/10
WOW! reference your text please.
This text from romans 3:10 os a quote from the O.T book of Psalms chapter 14, 53,

There is also a reference in Isaiah.
What you will find is that this reference is said not about those who walk with God, but those who walk contrary to God.

the bible does call those who walk with God righteous.

Psalms 1:5 Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.
---francis on 5/26/10


I think we have to first differentiate between "Worldy Good" and "Biblically Good". Everything has to be looked at in its context. In a worldy view-SURE lots of us are Good! We volunteer our time to help others, we work to restore our communities, we do our best to not lie and cheat and steal.. We ARE "Good"
---Thea on 5/26/10


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"I am a firm believer in the total degradation and depravity of mankind.

As members of the human race we are members of a fallen race. And that fall was complete.

If any person that doubts the depravity of man, I would ask only that he search the dark corners of his own mind." mima

Never I have heard more positive and enlightening words...

Is your belief in god the only thing that prevents you personally from exploring and living out those thought you find in the dark corners of your mind? You need an imaginary friend to prevent you from doing the unimaginable?
---atheist on 5/25/10


I tell you my thoughts, I think that we are all Cotton-pick en rotten.....Do you know who Jesus saves now days? Only the ones who needs Him. Who knows that they are nothing without Him.....There is only one good person GOD, His Son Jesus Christ. We don't Even understand His goodness. We understand nothing about Him. Oh my goodness!
---catherine on 5/25/10


You just read that from the Bible, and the Bible is God's Word, so what the Bible says, is correct.
Only God is good. Everyone else falls short of the glory of God. Everyone misses the mark.
---MarkV. on 5/25/10


People good or bad is based on current moral constitutions for that age either by group,tribal ,territory ,region and country.No where globally is there a same sence of moral good or immoral bad.But a single phrase has rang true throughout humanity for ages and is taught by some .If God would have created man perfect at first rather than perfection being man's ultimate goal then all mankind will have no life experience to demonstrate free will.Without free will man is a simple machine void of decisions-the ability to think .Is this what we expected ourselves to be-a lifeless machine in man's beginnings?The "image "is that perfect substance that resides within the room of decisions.This is not a finished statement.
---earl on 5/25/10


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This world cannot act civilized unless at first this world realizes that it is not.The only way for man to realize his status is to experience the world.
A musician cannot become a musician unless he at first learns music. A teacher cannot become a teacher unless he at first must become a student.To achieve a goal of peace man must at first learn to become peaceful within himself.
If one thinks God is cruel when he is not seen retrieving a man from a senseless death consider the final outcome when man has found God-nothing of this man is lost.The end result is complete restoration.
This world suffers from selfish greed.It remains man's freedom to possess it or crush it.This also is not a finished statement.
---earl on 5/25/10


God created people with the ability to rebel, and knew in advance that they would rebel, and that most people would not become Christians. He set it up that way and just let it happen. So, what are we to make of a God like that? You tell me...
---ger.toshav on 5/25/10


God has given us all the ability to choose good or evil.

If God made us only able to choose good then good would be no good at all but a 'programme' we could not but obey.

To put it in earthly terms consider human love. We love one another by choice, making love special. If we had no choice but to love, love would be valueless, akin to a machine programmed to say 'I love you.'

BTW when you refer to the God of the Bible He is God, not god, to distinguish Him, the creator, from created non existant gods. That is how His name is written in the Bible. Therefore it is the only correct way to refer to Him. You may think you are making a point by writing this way. But you are not, any more that if you wrote usa for USA.
---Warwick on 5/26/10


Atheist - God made humans to be good and perfect, but humans CHOOSE to go their own way and be their own god - this is why humans are NOT good or perfect, because of their own CHOSING, NOT God's. This is why we need Jesus - He is the ONLY one that can save us from our wretched selves. This is also why God is so good, because He sent Jesus to die for us and save us - Jesus took our punishment of death, so we could go free. God is so good that He will passionitly and furiously persue us, because He loves us.
---Leslie on 5/25/10


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The rich man asked Jesus "GOOD teacher, what must I do to enherit eternal life?". Jesus responed "Why do you call me good, there is NONE good but God (the Father).". If Jesus who was God in the flesh, and sinless and perfect said this - what does this say about us humans, who are NOT God, and sinful and not perfect? Think about it.
---Leslie on 5/25/10


Atheist - You say that if God is so good then why is all this evil in the world? Here's the answer, people are evil out of their CHOICE. If you want God to stop all the evil in the world, do you want Him to stop it all or just a little of it? Where should God start, the lieing level, or the thinking level? You can NOT just pick and choose. ALL people are evil, so we ALL should be eliminated (including you). Should God eliminate you since you are evil? God is so good, that He gave His son Jesus to die for you, and take your punishment, so you will not have to be eliminated. It's your choice, accept what Jesus has done for you, or take your own punishment is Hell (being burned alive) for eternity.
---Leslie on 5/25/10


God said to satan that "Job was blameless and upright" is that not "good"?
Rom.3.10 was Paul's opinion that no one is righteous.
Jesus said "be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect" Mat.5.48 is he suggesting an impossibility??
We are made "in God's image" is that not good????
---1st_cliff on 5/25/10


The closer you walk with the Lord, the more you see how wretched you are...at least that's the case for me.

I feel like a failure because I went through my trials crying on the floor everynight instead of standing on the Word of God.

No good thing dwells in my flesh, however, in my heart, I try to keep my motives pure and holy. But my flesh, oh boy, that's another story - it screams and wants to manifest but, "by the Spirit of God we are crucifying the flesh daily." Amen? It's hard, isn't it?
---Donna5535 on 5/25/10


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In 2 Peter 2:7-8 Abraham's nephew Lot is described as a righteous, but Lot's description in the Hebrew Scriptures does not show him to be particularly righteous. So what righteousness is depends on the context.
---ger.toshav on 5/25/10


yes all are ,the point is in christ all are forgiven.there are no opnions,or thoughts ,just this fact.
---tom2 on 5/25/10


We all fall short of God's Glory. However, we have to allow the good in us to overcome the evil. Sin comes with consequences that lead to a road of destruction. In life there are choices, and a person have to choose which path they will take in life.

This flesh we live in isn't nothing nice. So we have to allow the Word of God to crucify our flesh on daily basic. On the end, you will be remember for good you did to help someone, or for the evil you did to destroy someone in life.
---Kimbe7395 on 5/25/10


I am a firm believer in the total degradation and depravity of mankind.

As members of the human race we are members of a fallen race. And that fall was complete.

If any person that doubts the depravity of man, I would ask only that he search the dark corners of his own mind.
---mima on 5/25/10


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Maybe some people are not as bad as others.
---Cluny on 5/24/10


sadly I must agree,with one acception,first you must reach the age of accountability,or the age where you know the difference between right and wrong.I believe even children are or have a sin nature,but I believe God does not and will not hold them accountable if they die before this age.
---tom2 on 5/24/10


If only 'god' is 'good', and he made all people, then why did he make people that could be 'bad'? Being 'good' why would a 'good' 'god' allow 'bad' to be at all?

If 'god' is a 'loving god' why would he allow 'bad people' hurt 'good people' or 'bad things' happen to 'good people'?

It would seem therefore, that god can be bad just like those he created (in his own image with good and bad), god doesn't exist, or perhaps we are just applying an anthropocentric perspective to the events we encounter in our lives and what we do to and with each other.

Perhaps the good and bad things are just descriptions we believe apply in certain circumstances.
---atheist on 5/24/10


"GOOD" is an ABSOLUTE ("GOOD" means PERFECT).

Only God is perfect.

"NO ONE is good but God alone" (Mark 10:18).

We can practice/do goodNESS if we so choose (from OUR spirit).

Philemon verse 14
"that your goodness might not be by compulsion but of your own free will".

"Practice hospitality ungrudgingly to one another" (1 Peter 4:9).

We are to practice goodness and hospitality (but NOT BE A 'DOORMAT' and let anyone use us, NO ONE is a primadonna or hero except JESUS).

...(example of an "absolute"....TRUTH IS TRUTH IS TRUTH...only OBJECTIVE truth is the "absolute" reference point of reality, not this world's SUBJECTIVE truth).
---more_excellent_way on 5/24/10


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Yes only God Is Good. In reference to us humans, it takes Jesus Blood to cleanse us from unrighteousness & self righteousness etc to be any good(little g) for Him. God thought enough of Joseph Gen.39 v 6 to be recorded in God's Word.
---Lawrence on 5/24/10


Why, oh, why don't we read the Bible for what it says? When will we start?
The Bible says,
"There is none righteous, there is none that doeth good, for all have sinned." Rom 3:10 - 23 (in part.)
There is no where that we see that no one is good. There are plenty of "good" people. Take Atheist for example, I believe that his goodness will keep him from Christ. Many are good and can't realize that they are sinners. God said, after He had created Adam, and everything, "that it was good."
Don't confuse being good to being Saved or doing evil to being lost.
---Elder on 5/24/10


I agree with the Word
---michael_e on 5/24/10


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