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Jesus' Three Days And Nights

Referencing Matthew 12:40, is it possible to find three days and three nights if Jesus was crucified on Friday and Rose on Sunday morning at some teach?

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Matthew 28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.

Mark 16:2 And very early in the morning the first [day] of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.

Luke 24:1 Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain [others] with them.

also for your eyes only
John 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not, for I am not yet ascended to my Father
---francis on 9/14/10


John 20:1 The first [day] of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.
Jesus had already risen before dawn.
Try again...
---micha9344 on 9/11/10


Matthew 26:45 Then cometh he to his disciples, and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take [your] rest: behold, the hour is at hand, and the Son of man is betrayed into the HANDS OF SINNERS.

Luke 22:53 When I was daily with you in the temple, ye stretched forth no hands against me: but this is your hour, and THE POWER OF DARKNESS.

This started Thursday evening n the garden
Givin us THREE DAYS and THREE NIGHTS
Thursday night, friday, friday night, saturday, saurday night, sunday morning
---francis on 9/10/10


As do I yours francis.
Our views vary drastically depending on topic which makes me want to dig deeper into God's Word and confirm what is being said (the Bereans).
We may get heated at times, but I believe we come out with a better understanding of God and His will.
Blessings in Christ,
Michael
---micha9344 on 7/11/10


I enjoyed all your post
You did put soem thought into them, and also scripture.
I do have to look at the implication of the phrase " after two days" To me it suggested that the day on which is was said was wednesday so on friday evening ( the 7thday) would be passover

Ver good posts.
---Francis on 7/11/10




1.
I was looking at that as well and researching the passover and the days of unleavened bread to include the double portion 6th day. I must conclude that the feast itself was wednesday evening, evening of the 5th day, before they went to gethsemane(last supper). Now the preparation of the lamb was done prior, wed. daytime, 4th day morn
Preparation day also refers to double manna being gathered on the 6th day in order to rest on the seventh. Being that the passover was an 8 day sabbath including the unleavend bread, We can conclude that the normal sabbath being part of those days would still be considered a 'high day'.
Two days prior, one day prior to passover preparation would be when they looked for a place to have the passover feast.
---micha9344 on 7/9/10


2. Exo 12:1-20 14th day-21st day Abib
10th day Abib select your lamb
14th even slay and eat the lamb w/ unleavene bread
14th day burn the rest.
21st day feast of unleavened bread.
Now the 14th day is always a full moon.
Exo 16:5 preparation of the bread from heaven.
Compare the gospels:
Mat 26:2, Mar 14:1, Luke 22:1 12th day Abib
Mat 26:17-20, Mar 14:12-17, Luke 22,7-15 14th day Abib
Now John 19:14 doesn't agree with the others since they already killed and ate the passover according to the others. I believe this to read the 6th day preparation for 7th day rest during the 8day passover. Easier written as John did.
---micha9344 on 7/9/10


Well i think he was killed friday morning
You say wednesday or thursday
We both agree herat of earth isnot limited to grave.

Consider this:
Mark 14:1 After TWO DAYS was [the feast of] the passover, and of unleavened bread: and the chief priests and the scribes sought how they might take him by craft, and put [him] to death.

Mark 14:10 And Judas Iscariot, one of the twelve, went unto the chief priests, to betray him unto them.

Mark 14:16 And his disciples went forth, and came into the city, and found as he had said unto them: and they made ready the passover.
---francis on 7/9/10


I think we were on the same page here, just coming from different angles.
I don't think we need to split hairs on death/suffering since God's chosen gave Him up to the pagan heathens on the morning of the fifth day which is the same day He died.
I also believe in the agreement of all scripture. If we, being opposites(in a sense) agree, then I truly believe Christ is here with us.
Matthew 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.
Even though we both are passionate about our views, I believe that if we can reconcile all scripture together, we can both be enlightened by the Holy Spirit who guides us into all truth.
---micha9344 on 7/9/10


OK now i see what you are saying
---francis on 7/8/10




Jewish day- sunset to sunset
current day-midnight to midnight
Jesus captured, questioned-Wed. evening, 5th day even.
Jesus sent to Pilate-Thur. morning, 5th day morn.
Jesus crucified- Thur. 8am, 5th day 3rd hour.
Jesus dies.- Thur. 2pm, 5th day 9th hour.(day 1)
Jesus buried- Thur. evening, 6th day even.(night 1)
Spices prepared- Thur. evening/Fri. morning, 6th day.(day 2)
Day of rest- Fri evening/Sat. morning, 7th day.(night 2/day 3)
Jesus risen- Sat. evening, 1st day even.(night 3)
Witnesses- Sun morning, morning of the 1st day.
'Grave' is not as accurate as 'death' for 'heart of the earth'.
---micha9344 on 7/8/10


I believe He was taken, crucified, and died on the fifth day, as scripture states, as long as our definition of 'high day' is true.
Buried the evening of the sixth day.
---micha9344 on 7/6/10

I do not understand. I am not disagreeing I am just not understanding.

Are you sayinghe died thursday or friday?
Thursday would be 5th day
friday would be sixth day
---francis on 7/7/10


francis, to this I also agree.
Now the fifth day started wenesday evening at sunset and proceeded through thursday sunset. This was His suffering. His death occured on the 9th hour in the 4th watch of that day. At sunset or even(evening) as the Bible states, He was brought down and buried, which started the sixth day, the day of preparation. We both agree that the seventh day was a high day meaning it was both the sabbath and passover. In which the Jews rested. Notice all the things that had to happen in 3 hours, if Jesus actually died on the preparation day. I believe He was taken, crucified, and died on the fifth day, as scripture states, as long as our definition of 'high day' is true.
Buried the evening of the sixth day.
---micha9344 on 7/6/10


francis, you believe Jesus was caught and tortured on the fifth day, and buried on the evening of the sixth day correct?
micha9344 on 7/6/10

To this i can say correct.
Jesus was crucified about the 3rd hour, if i rememer right that would be about 9 AM in the morning, there was darkness until about 12 PM.
That leaves about 6 hours ( assuming sunset at 6 PM)

My calculation may be wrong.
---francis on 7/6/10


francis, you believe Jesus was caught and tortured on the fifth day, and buried on the evening of the sixth day correct?
Matthew 27:57 When the even was come, there came a rich man of Arimathaea, named Joseph, who also himself was Jesus' disciple:
To give us a better idea on time frame, how long do you think it would take for Pilate, being in his court, to get a soldier to confirm death, report it back, approve the release of the Body,Joseph and the soldiers to get the Body down,Joseph and others prepare Him for burial, bury Him, and seal the stone? Keep this in mind as we go through this.
This is where the translations from Jewish days to current time keeping come in.
---micha9344 on 7/6/10


---micha9344 on 7/5/10
I am not sure what you are asking.
Are you asking if good friday is man made?
the name is made by man as the day on which Jesus died. beyound that i am not sure what you are asking
---francis on 7/6/10


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francis, my point exactly.
Where do you tie in the grave to friday evening? Is not Good Friday manmade?
Was not Jesus buried on the evening of the sixth day? Rested thru the sixth day, the seventh evening, the seventh day, the first evening, and arose the first day?
Do you not think the conversion to modern time keeping and Roman days has led to any confusion about this matter?
Does/did not the Jewish days start at dusk/sunset and go to the next sunset?
Is not our saturday comprised of the Jewish 7th day 3rd+4th evening watches, 1st-4th day watches, and the 1st day 1st+2nd evening watches?
Do we translate this correctly when trying to figure this out from all four gospels?
---micha9344 on 7/5/10


A sabbath which celebrated a feast is called a sabbath day, or a feast day.
The weekly sabbath in the ten commandments is called the sabbath of the lord.

But when a weekly sabbath, and a sabbath which celebrates a feast ( like passover) falls on a weekly sabbath day(Saturday), it is called a HIGH SABBATH.

What we have are two sabbaths on the same day, thus the phrase HIGH sabbath.

Also note that the day he died was preparation day referenced from when thay had to PRAPARE for the weekly sabbath by gathering two tyimes as much manna

Exodus 16:5 And it shall come to pass, that on the sixth day they shall PREPARE [that] which they bring in, and it shall be twice as much as they gather daily.
---francis on 7/4/10


Well MIMA I hope that would make some people actually think. Great.

Francis A high Sabbath is one of the special holidays treated as a Sabbath that could occur on most any day of the week, but there are some Special Sabbaths that are exceptions. Rosh Hoshanah is never to occur on a Sunday, Wednesday or a Friday and in years when it would naturally occur, a day is added to the preceding month to keep it from occurring that year.

I am surprised that no one challenged the 72 - 74 pounds of spices when most Bibles say 100 pounds, but you have to remember that a Roman pound is only 11.5 ounces not 16 ounce. The Roman weights and measures were the standard in the market place because that is how taxes on transactions were calculated.
---Friendly_Blogger on 7/3/10


\\Another nail in the coffin of the 'Jesus is God' brigade.\\

It didn't work when the Roman soldiers and/or Temple guard sealed the tomb, and you can't nail the truth shut in a coffin now, either..

\\Jesus Christ however is not eternal, having been created by AlmightyGod and sent to earth to suffer death on mankinds behalf.\\

This is precisely the heresy of Arius that was wrong in 300 or so, and still wrong today.
---Cluny on 7/4/10


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Assuming that by destroy you mean killed him. When did they BEGIN to destroy his body. Did they start on the cross, or in the garden?

lets just agree that we do not agree.
I see the heart of the earth as not the grave because oher text including IN THE EARTH do not mean the grave.

I we are both away that the death of Jesus did not start on the cross, but in the garden.

Matthew 26:67 Then did they spit in his face, and buffeted him, and others smote [him] with the palms of their hands,
---francis on 7/3/10


The Heart of the Earth is what throws people off. They think it means the grave, and so they start to count from Friday evening.

But do a bible search for IN THE EARTH ( since heart of the earth appears only once)
See how many times IN THE EARTH actually refers to the grave, and how many times in refers to in this world ( of sin)

Then you will understand that for three days and three nights Jesus felt the affliction of this world of sin, as given in isaiah it started in the garden Thursday evening.

Did it ever occur to you that in the Garden they arested him, and started beating him, and at no other time could they have captured him, even if they wanted to.
---francis on 7/3/10


francis, still not tieing it in to 'the heart of the earth'
John 2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
Are you telling me the temple was destroyed as soon as He was captured?
Or was the temple destroyed when He died as most people here believe.
Tie all scripture together.
Isa 53:8b-9 for he was cut off out of the land of the living: And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death,
You're implying 'heart of the earth' means 'he became sin for us' which isn't supported by Jonah or the temple. Jonah in fact became sinful when he ran from God before he was 'swallowed up'.
You are trying to fit in a man-made day (good friday) into scripture...sad.
---micha9344 on 7/3/10


here are you three days and three night.

Isaiah 53:4 Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

Isaiah 53:5 But he [was] wounded for our transgressions, [he was] bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace [was] upon him, and with his stripes we are healed.

Isaiah 53:6 and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
Isaiah 53:8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living:
Isaiah 53:9 And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death,
---francis on 7/3/10


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You do realize that Jonah was NOT DEAD right?
He ws(?) just captice(?) in the whale 3 days
And you do realize that Jesus was himself captice(?) of sin for those 3 days.
For three days and three nigyts(?) paying the price for our sins.--francis on 7/2/10
But, according to your theory, Jesus was not alive for His three days of captivity, whereas being in the same condition (like dead) for three days and nights makes much more sense. But seeing your posts on other blogs like bigamy support, I don't think you rely on sense or proper interpretation and discernment.
Release yourself from your false doctrines, take up your cross, and follow Him.
---micha9344 on 7/2/10


francis, your theory holds no weight. You have yet to tie 'heart of the earth' to His complete suffering account and not just His death.
---micha9344 on 7/1/10

You do realize that Jonah was NOT DEAD right?
He ws just captice in the whale 3 days

And you do realize that Jesus was himself captice of sin for those 3 days.
For three days and three nigyts paying the price for our sins.

Jesus was made SIN for us for three days.
You do realize that before that thursday no one could lay a hand on Jesus do you?

Above all i do hope that you realize that Jesus started to pay for our sin WAY WAY before he was killed.
If you cannot getthis by the bible RENT THE VIDEO
---francis on 7/2/10


Mat 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly, so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
John 2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.
Luke 23:45 And the sun was darkened, and the veil of the temple was rent in the midst
Mark 15:42 And now when the even was come, because it was the preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath
francis, your theory holds no weight. You have yet to tie 'heart of the earth' to His complete suffering account and not just His death.
---micha9344 on 7/1/10


Isaiah 53:5 But he [was] wounded for our transgressions, [he was] bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace [was] upon him, and with his stripes we are healed.

Isaiah 53:6 All we like sheep have gone astray, we have turned every one to his own way, and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.

Isaiah 53:8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.

When did all this start which ended in him being cut off? friday or thursday. If you think that is was only by his death that he suffered for us, think again
---francis on 7/1/10


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---micha9344 on 6/30/10
repent for what?
Find any text where it is said that Jesus does anything IN EARTH and it refers to the grave.
ANd by the way IN THE HEART OF THE EARTH is not my only proof.

here is more proof:
Many times the people tried to kill Jesus, or throw him off a cliff. Never cold they capture him to hurt him.

But on thursday night. Unlike any other night. He was captured, beaten and humiliated.
---francis on 7/1/10


wow francis, so hardhearted and stiffnecked.
many people can tell you the same thing yet you will not repent. You are truly of Israel and should try as hard as you can to keep the law since it is apparent you don't rely on His Spirit to guide you into all truth.
You use 'in heaven and in earth' as your support for this? This would mean heart of the earth to be 30plus years Jesus was in earth. How illogical.
Where is your real support for your theory?
Jesus gave his and most everyone agrees, in the whale=in the grave.
I pray you are not a spiritual leader and are guiding many astray with all your earthly doctrines.
It would help if you checked your spelling so we can better understand your posts also.
---micha9344 on 6/30/10


Jesus said "just as" the three days and nights spent by Jonah in the belly of the great fish, He would spend three days and nights in the heart of the earth. That says to me that He would be in the grave three days and three nights. However it works out, the prediction was true.
---Mark_Eaton on 6/30/10
And you would be wrong
Heart of the earth does not translate to be grave or tomb.

There are many bible verses that says " In heaven adn IN EARTH.." Not one of them uses in earth as in grace, so why do you think that in the heart of the earth is the grave?
---francis on 6/30/10


This did not start on Friday, it started Thursday evening.
Now count again you will get 3 days and 3 nights.
---francis on 6/29/10

Did you read the blog question?

There are many theories about what day the crucifixion took place on, how many sabbaths days there were in that week, and on, on, on...

Jesus said "just as" the three days and nights spent by Jonah in the belly of the great fish, He would spend three days and nights in the heart of the earth. That says to me that He would be in the grave three days and three nights. However it works out, the prediction was true.
---Mark_Eaton on 6/30/10


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After studying what--Friendly_Blogger on 6/28/10 has to say on this subject I must acknowledge that he's become a schoolmaster to me.
I've always known that it was not Friday evening for the crucifixion. But here he offers another proof that I never heard about before. So I say thank you--Friendly_Blogger .
---mima on 6/30/10


Funny how some see things!
Someone said:
Thus Jesus is not Almighty God!

To say this, is to say!
Thus the Father is not Almighty God!
Thus the Son is not Almighty God!
Thus Holy Ghost is not Almighty God!

This kind of thinking will come back to bite you.
For when the time comes, who will you call on?
Not Jesus! If he is not Almighty God!

Even the Jew which did not believe him,
Killed him for saying he was equal with God.
Thus thy tried to kill God!
Much like some do today.

Mal 2:2
If ye will not hear, and if ye will not lay it to heart, to give glory unto my name, saith the LORD of hosts
God bless
---TheSeg on 6/30/10



---micha9344 on 6/29/10
The phrase " heart of the earth" is what generally throws people off, and let them assume that this means grace.
So lets examine this closer:

Matthew 6:10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done IN EARTH, as [it is] in heaven.

NO ONE SAYS THAT HIS WILL BE DONE IN THE GRAVE DO THEY?

Mat 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly, so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights IN THE HEART OF THE EARTH.
Why then assume that heart of earth is grave.

Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and IN EARTH.

HERE WE DO NOT ASSUME HE MEANS THE GRACE.
---francis on 6/30/10


Richard- you say a "proper" Bible says "The Word became flesh and dwelt among us" (6/29/10).

NWT says: "the Word became flesh and resided among us."

Sounds the same to me. Thank you for agreeing the NWT is a "proper" Bible translation.

Your comments regarding Jesus being tempted I agree with. The point I'm making is according to James 1:13, 'God cannot be tempted'. Thus Jesus is not AlmightyGod.

And I agree, without blood (a death), there is no remission of sin. But- AlmightyGod cannot die. However, Jesus did die! Thus again- Jesus is not AlmightyGod.

You say- "if you can't look at Jesus and affirm His divinity you are not born of the spirit". Scripture please!
---David8318 on 6/30/10


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Mat 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly, so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
Mar 8:31 And he began to teach them, that the Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders, and [of] the chief priests, and scribes, and be killed, and after three days rise again.
Jon 1:17 Now the LORD had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights.
You may want to study and reconsider your interpretation of Matt 12:40 there francis.
Do you find it so hard to believe that a day dedicated by man to the crucifixion of Christ could be the wrong day of the week?
---micha9344 on 6/29/10


---Mark_Eaton on 6/29/10
Three days and three night, is not limited to the time Jesus spend in the grave. It is about the time he spend (in the heart of the earth) meaning suffering for sins. A victim of satan.

It did not start on the cross. it started in the garden of Gethsemane and ended in the grave.

Isaiah 53:5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him, and with his stripes we are healed.

This did not start on Friday, it started Thursday evening.
Now count again you will get 3 days and 3 nights.
---francis on 6/29/10


I can find three days but not three nights.

According to Dr. Luke, Jesus said He would be raised ON the third day, not AFTER the third day

Luke 9:22 "saying, The Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed and be raised up on the third day."

If Jesus was in the tomb on the Friday of crucifixion, the Saturday in-between, and then on Sunday the third day, that constitutes three days.
---Mark_Eaton on 6/29/10


I look at the story of Abraham and Isaac.
Gen 22:2 And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah, and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of.

Right at this point, do you think Isaac was alive or dead to Abraham?
If a doctor came to you and said in three days your son will die.
When does your heard break?

I like what Francis and Eloy said

But, look at what he said here!
Joh 13:31 Therefore, when he was gone out, Jesus said, Now is the Son of man glorified, and God is glorified in him.

God Bless
---TheSeg on 6/29/10


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--Friendly_Blogger on 6/28/10
Good post:
Two issues with this

#1: The record shows that they did not have enough time. So yes they may have used us too much time in market.
#2: It was a high sabbath day menaing two sabbaths on the same day. Passover and regular weekly sabbath.

John 19:31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and [that] they might be taken away.
---francis on 6/29/10


David 8318 Dunno wot they done to to your NWT,but a proper bible tells us "The Word became flesh and dwelt among us" Jesus was in all points tempted as a man so that He could relate to man,He did not sin,He took sin upon Himself for our salvation...without blood there is no remission of sin..in John He says "no man takes my life from me,I have the power to lay it down and I have the power to take it back again"! ...if you cant look at Jesus and affirm His divinity you are not born of the spirit, because "the way to the father is through the son".."kiss the son" Psalm 2..
---richard on 6/29/10


If the Crucifiction was on Friday when was the market open for the women to by the 72 -74 pounds of spices to anoint the body of Christ. There is not enough time to do it with a Friday crucifiction. There were two Sabbath that week the Special Sabbath Passover followed by a secular day when the market was open followed by the regular Friday evening start of Sabbath. Remember the new day starts at sundown for time calculations. Christ was crucified the afternoon prior to Passover Read John's account the members of the Sanhedrin did not want to defile them selves by going to Pilate's headquarters and not be able to eat the Passover meal John_18:28. There is enough information in Matthew, Mark & John to put the sequence of events together.
---Friendly_Blogger on 6/28/10


I take it that the 'three' includes three nights (we can find that) but that the days include a pard of Friday and a small part of Sunday morning
---petere3594 on 6/28/10


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With that being said,I will continue.
With the scripture,
Is 9:6 unto us a child is born....
To my understanding the hebrew word used for God is EL'
It would seem like babble if we didn't understand what EL' means.
I encourage believers to Look it up-do not take my word for it- I am human and subject to error-however it appears it's already understood.
Father is also within the context and the hebrew word for that is Ab as in Abba Father.
Praise God for his mercy and grace.
---char on 6/27/10


But I do deny Jesus is AlmightyGod made flesh or 'God incarnate' for 2 specific Biblical points of fact.

And they are to do with being 'tempted' and suffering death.

AlmightyGod 'cannot be tempted' (James 1:13) and cannot die, because He is eternal.

Jesus Christ however was tempted (Hebrews 4:15) and did suffer death.

Jesus also said when as flesh on earth, 'God is a Spirit'. Peter said Jesus was 'put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the Spirit' (1 Pe.3:18). It stands to reason then that Jesus was NOT 'God the Spirit' when he said what he said at John 4:24.

AlmightyGod Jehovah and his son Jesus Christ are thus 2 completely separate individuals.
---David8318 on 6/27/10


///Irrespective of Char's trinitarian 'psycho babble' of 6/25/10,///


I can't judge you-David I only ask you to clarity what you see so I can understand your perspective.
I will do this is Love.
Forgive me if I have offended you.
Please continue-my questions are those I truly have-if wish not to answer them-I understand.
I have asked some on the Jehovah witness Blog which I realize now that the tone may offend you-not my intention-I am truly sorry.
again, forgive me-I will not resort to name calling.
Not necessary-please continue.
---char on 6/27/10


Mark V.
Bless you brother.
---char on 6/27/10


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//Uncontested so far by trinitarians is the fact that Jesus 'was tempted'- Hebrews 4:15, but that 'God cannot be tempted'- James 1:13. Thus Jesus is not AlmightyGod.//
--My understanding, every word claimed "the Word of God" will be tried.WE need to seek truth not believing every one.
Only the True Word of God is confirmed by Himself-God alone knows and completely understands His Word.
The true Word in flesh was tempted(tried) by the deciever-(false word).The Word spoken in reply answered, "Man shall not live by bread alone,but by every word that proceedeth our of the mouth of God".
This is checking every word we are being told is true-they may not be.
My words-yours words others.
God merciful-He's teacher.
---char on 6/27/10


||Cluny/Catherine and others like them on this blog: we need to stop trying to outdo one another and just learn to show more love.||

If I didn't love catherine, I would not be concerned over the spiritual delusion she has allowed herself to fall into by giving heed to a lying spirit masquerading as God.

And irrespective of David8318's Arian babble, he cannot deny the Biblical fact that Jesus is Almighty God made flesh.
---Cluny on 6/27/10


Cluny, I have no clue why Catherine would say what she did to you, or even why Fay gave an amen. You spoke of nothing that was against the Trinity. As far as I know you defend the Trinity very well when you have the time. I disagree with some teachings with you but I respect you cluny.

Char, what you wrote and what Micha wrote was great. I will copy down what you both wrote to keep it when explaining things. Thanks for defending the Truth. All for the glory of God.
---Mark_V. on 6/26/10


Cluny/Catherine and others like them on this blog: we need to stop trying to outdo one another and just learn to show more love. Christianity is not about being the topdog. Who knows more,who is more saved ad nauseum.....Jesus is the topdog,so to speak. So we should just remember that.We need to learn our rightful place and stay in it. No one is more important than the other,in Christianity. That is a great lesson to learn and will make our journey(s) more enjoyable. We are all trying to get to the same place.L earn to love one another. Love covers a multitude of sins. Read I Corinthians ch 13.Then try to follow what it says.Then we can rightfully say, we are Christians. God blessings to all.
---Robyn on 6/26/10


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Irrespective of Char's trinitarian 'psycho babble' of 6/25/10, it remains a Biblical fact that Jesus is not AlmightyGod for scriptural reasons trinitarians cannot come to terms with.

Uncontested so far by trinitarians is the fact that Jesus 'was tempted'- Hebrews 4:15, but that 'God cannot be tempted'- James 1:13. Thus Jesus is not AlmightyGod.

It is also a scriptural point of fact that AlmightyGod cannot die. If you believe Jesus was 'God incarnate' (an unscriptural anti-Christ teaching promoted by Cluny- see 1 John 4:2,3), then you are bound to believe AlmightyGod can die. You then contradict scripture which teaches 'God is eternal'.

Jesus is not God, but the 'Son of God' (Jo.1:34)- the first ever creation of Jehovah God.
---David8318 on 6/26/10


||Jesus Christ however is not eternal, having been created by AlmightyGod and sent to earth to suffer death on mankinds behalf. ||

This is the heresy of Arianism.

It was wrong in 325 and it's STILL wrong today.
---Cluny on 6/26/10


My prayer for you, catherine, is not only that you be saved but be delivered from the religious spirit pretending to be God who has deluded you.

I pray you be saved, too, fay, and come to know our Lord, God, and Savior Jesus Christ.
---Cluny on 6/26/10


Jesus' Passover Communion was Thursday night, and on that night Judas the betrayer betrayed Innocent Jesus with a kiss, and Jesus said to the sinful violaters, "When I was with you in the temple you all stretched forward no hands against me: but this is your hour, and the power of darkness." Lk.22:53. So let us count from this hour, and start from the power of darkness: Thursday night and Friday morning is 1, and Friday night and Saturday morning is 2, and Saturday night and Sunday morning is 3.
---Eloy on 6/26/10


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Amen Catherine!!!
---fay on 6/25/10


||I really do not wish for you to go there.
---catherine on 6/25/10
||

Likewise I'm sure, catherine.
---Cluny on 6/25/10


Cuny>>You can say that because you have not experienced the power of His resurrection....Well, I have. Hell, my friend is real. I really do not wish for you to go there.
---catherine on 6/25/10


++//Jesus Christ (Messiah) is not GodAlmighty (El-Shaddai)because God cannot die.//
++

That's why there was the Incarnation.

He borrowed death--something not His by nature--from humanity.

He loved His creation so much, He wished to be identified with it as fully as possible.
---Cluny on 6/25/10


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Big Amen-micha9344

///There was never a point in time when the Eternal Father was wisdomless(without knowledge or understanding of truth), wordless(somehow unable to convey His commands), or Sonless(hence Eternal Father).
So, most of us understand that God is eternal and so are His characteristics.
But, some will say He has always been this (Spirit, eternal) but not that (Wise, Father, Powerful)
1Cor 1:24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
---micha9344 on 6/24/10///
---char on 6/25/10


My understanding.
God is God.
El'ohim is God as Creator in relations to mankind-lving "Word"to create.Jn1:1,Col 1:15-17
Yehov ah is God in covenant relation to us-created. God everlasting-existing ONE.
2Ch 18:31 Yehov ah is "My God" which is why we don't say My Yehov ah--it means "My God".
EL'shaddai is God-referred to His Grace.
As Giver He supplies all of our needs
Gen17:1,2 Cor:18
God is aleph to Tav-alpha and Omega
We now abide by His Word-which is the only way to Him.
There is ONE God. We believe In His Word(lesous) by Faith to Master and Lord over us.
HaMashiach-"Who.being in the form of God...took upon himself the form of a servant...as a man...
Phil2:6
---char on 6/25/10


//Jesus Christ (Messiah) is not GodAlmighty (El-Shaddai)because God cannot die.//

Is9:6 He is called EL (aL-aleph-Lamed).
EL is God as omnipotent-in ALL His strength and power.
ALeph-Father
Lamed-Teach-speak-sting.
Matt1:2
He is emmanu EL'
interpreted for us-God with us.

There is only One God-He spoke-performs His Words-spoken.
Is9:6For unto us a Child is born, unto us a Son is given:and the government shall be upon His shoulder: and His name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor,The mighty GOD(EL),The everlasting Father(Ab),Prince of Peace.
A-Father
b-son

Flesh died and ROSE from the dead-Word is eternal.
Christ-lesous-Yehovah-Salvation-Life Eternal Rom6:23
Death-cease of existence.
---char on 6/25/10


Some here deny the Eternal Father...
Some here would want to quote Proverbs 8 in relation to Jesus Christ the Word and Wisdom of God, suggesting that at one point in time that the Eternal Father was without Wisdom or His Word.
There was never a point in time when the Eternal Father was wisdomless(without knowledge or understanding of truth), wordless(somehow unable to convey His commands), or Sonless(hence Eternal Father).
So, most of us understand that God is eternal and so are His characteristics.
But, some will say He has always been this (Spirit, eternal) but not that (Wise, Father, Powerful)
1Cor 1:24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
---micha9344 on 6/24/10


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Char, where in those verses you quote does it contradict what I said about God's Son, Jesus Christ not being eternal?

Jesus is not eternal. The verse you quote from Heb.13:8, "Jesus Christ the same yesterday,and today,and for ever", does not mean Jesus was not created.

You also quote Ephesians 1:20 (?) which says, "Christ (was)... raised up from the dead". So you do agree Christ is not eternal, yes? There was a point in Christ's existence, when he didn't exist. That's the whole idea of being 'the Christ' isn't it- "Christ" is not eternal by definition! But this cannot be so for AlmightyGod who IS eternal.

Jesus Christ (Messiah) is not GodAlmighty (El-Shaddai) because God cannot die.
---David8318 on 6/24/10


Warwick (6/23/10)- the New World Translation is not inconsistent in its use of the divine name 'Jehovah' at Romans 14:7-9.

At Romans 14:11, Paul says, 'For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord...' (KJV)

Notice- 'For it is written'. Written where? Paul quotes Isaiah 49:18 where the Hebrew text and LXX contain the divine name, the Hebrew Tetragrammaton- YHWH (Jehovah). When the divine name appears in the LXX and the original Hebrew, then it is appropriate for a translator to include the divine name in a text of a verse quoted by an Apostle. There is no deceit.

In context, Romans 14 discusses Jehovah God and Jesus Christ.

The NWT is accurate in identifying who is who, and is not corrupted by Neo-platonic philosophy.
---David8318 on 6/24/10


////Jesus Christ however is not eternal//---?---/////That's why John said it is the anti-Christ who say Jesus did not come in flesh, but was 'God' who is 'a Spirit'. Jesus is not eternal. He did die. Jo.4:24, 1 Jo.4:2,3///

Raised from the Dead-Jesus Christ the same yesterday,and today,and for ever.Heb13(all)
1Jn5(all)For there are three-testifies-the Spirit-water and the blood,and these three agree.
Word became flesh-(JESUS)Jn1:1
1Cor 15(all)if Christ be not risen-our preaching vain-your faith-vain
Is9:6
For unto us a Child is born, unto us a Son is Given,and the government shall be upon His shoulder:and His name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The Mighty God, The everlasting Father,The Prince of Peace.
---char on 6/24/10


Three days and three night, is not limited to the time Jesus spend in the grave. It is about the time he spend (in the heart of the earth) meaning suffering for sins. A victim of satan.

It did not start on the cross. it started in the garden of Gethsemane and ended in the grave.

Isaiah 53:5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him, and with his stripes we are healed.

This did not start on Friday, it started Thursday evening.
Now count again you will get 3 days and 3 nights.
---francis on 6/23/10


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Another nail in the coffin of the 'Jesus is God' brigade.

Almighty God cannot die, as He is eternal.

Jesus Christ however is not eternal, having been created by AlmightyGod and sent to earth to suffer death on mankinds behalf. That's why John said it is the anti-Christ who say Jesus did not come in flesh, but was 'God' who is 'a Spirit'. Jesus is not eternal. He did die. Jo.4:24, 1 Jo.4:2,3.

'El Shaddai' cannot also be 'Messiah'.

Hebrews 4:15, "(Jesus) was in all points tempted like as we are..."

But according to James 1:13, "God cannot be tempted".

Jesus cannot and is not AlmightyGod Jehovah because God cannot die, neither can he be tempted.
---David8318 on 6/24/10


tthew 6:10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done IN EARTH, as [it is] in heaven.
Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and IN EARTH.

"in earth." we do not believe that the above passages are speaking about the grave.

So why then do we assume that this text: Matthew 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly, so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights IN THE HEART OF THE EARTH.
Is speaking about the grave?
---francis on 6/21/10


He also said, "three days and three nights in the heart of the earth."

That doesn't mean "buried," as His body was placed in an arcosolium not all that deep.

But remember the sun being darkened? There was an extra day and a night in that.

"In the tomb with the Body, in Sheol with the soul, in Paradise with the penitent thief, on the throne with the Father and the Holy Spirit, were You, O Christ God, filling all things, bounded by none."
---Cluny on 6/21/10


matthew says "after 3 days" he does not say after 72 hours.

Mark seems quite clear ... Jesus died on the day before the Sabbath, and rose the day after the Sabbath.
---alan8566_of_uk on 6/21/10


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