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Boyfriend Living In Sin

My boyfriend and I am living in sin. If we get married will God forgive us for the fact we lived in sin! Will we still suffer consequences. Will God forgive us totally and bless our lives?

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 ---Emma on 8/4/10
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trav lady-
you certainly depend much on your own understanding thinking yourself to be wise.

The Lord has given His church teachers that can teach you the things of the Bible.
---leej on 9/9/10

I learn something everyday. Just learned you are dwelling on my hat size instead of answering the simple questions I asked.

I have learned from others careful scriptural work.....there are a few that use scripture witnessing scriptures. While a earthy teacher may point....scripture confirms.
And I can tell you before GOD, I am not a lady masquerading as a man.
Can you tell me the same? You also are Lee1538 right?
---Trav on 9/10/10


trav lady-

you certainly depend much on your own understanding thinking yourself to be wise.

The Lord has given His church teachers that can teach you the things of the Bible. And you would do well to take advantage of them.

Of course, you have left me wondering if your head is too big to possible learn spiritual things, that you are truly unteachable.
---leej on 9/9/10


trav -
Hebrews 8:8 I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of JUDAH.
Suggest you enroll in a formal course in theolgoy as all we can do on this forum is fed you a few tidbits.
---leej on 9/7/10

What part of the context of Heb8:8 above do you despise the most....the parts you refuse to discuss.
Woman, you would do well to quit financing "theologians" who do not address the obvious. There are literally thousands of witnessing scriptures (steak) for any 10 out of context theological opinions. Smell the steak. The prophets started the fire Christ (anointed) is serving the meal.
---Trav on 9/9/10


trav -
Hebrews 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house.

There is considerably more scripture you can view on this subject.

Heb 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

And about that Old Covenant becoming obsolete.

Heb 8:13 In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

Suggest you enroll in a formal course in theolgoy as all we can do on this forum is fed you a few tidbits.


---leej on 9/7/10


\Everyone knows that the new covenant does not start until the death of Jesus, and that everything done and said by Jesus( before his death) and John the baptist was done under the Old Covenant.\\

Wrong again, as in almost everything you say.
---Cluny on 8/16/10

Show where Francis is wrong. Your opinion is worthless as evidence, without scripture backing you up.
Hebrews 9:16
For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
Hebrews 9:15-17
Hebrews 9:17
For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

No answer...is an answer.
---Trav on 9/7/10




frances - your biggest failure is to rightfully handle the word of God.

You simply do NOT recognize that God made a New Covenant with the Jews that included the Gentiles.
---leej on 9/6/10

Ms professor, show Francis where the covenant included ....then we'll all know.
Is it in Heb 8:8?
Hebrews 8:8
For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

A knowledgable teacher would know the scriptures 2 or more testifying beyond the teacher. A professor....might even be able to explain farther.
---Trav on 9/7/10


frances - your biggest failure is to rightfully handle the word of God.

You simply do NOT recognize that God made a New Covenant with the Jews that included the Gentiles.

AND in accordance to the Jerusalem council Acts 15 HE DID NOT mandate obedience to any of the dietary laws or even the Sabbath or other laws that were strictly Jewish in nature.

If you believe in all the OT laws, then go get yourself circumcised by the Rabbi, observe the national feasts and Sabbaths. You might even try wearing one of those Jewish top hats and blow on a scofar!
---leej on 9/6/10


Remember Christ died for our sins! "Our" meaning mine and yours and everyones sins, if you truly believe in Christ as your savior and ask for forgiveness, forgiveness will be yours without consequences. The "consequences" may come if you believe you are forgiven and continue to sin and do not believe in Christ then you may have something to worry about. In Christ's name.
---RVB on 8/18/10


You need to repent NOW of your sin, likewise your boyfriend. GOD does not wink at sin. If you know that what you're doing is sinful, do not take advantage of GOD and play games with His Mercy and provoke Him. Repent of it NOW. Sin always, always, always has a price tag of some kind of death for your life when you indulge it. I know from personal experience, even as a Christian. It's worse as a Christian, because we should know better, and we have the available Power to overcome sin. Please, just repent for GOD's Sake.
---Gordon on 8/16/10


\\Everyone knows that the new covenant does not start until the death of Jesus, and that everything done and said by Jesus( before his death) and John the baptist was done under the Old Covenant.\\

Wrong again, as in almost everything you say.
---Cluny on 8/16/10




God's instruction is that you HAVE TO MARRY each other Exodus 22:16-17. I believe your marriage will cover the sin of what you have been doing together. In God's sight you have chosen each other for life.
---Adetunji on 8/16/10


Can you be serious for just one minute?
Everyone knows that the new covenant does not start until the death of Jesus, and that everything done and said by Jesus( before his death) and John the baptist was done under the Old Covenant.

Hebrews 9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions [that were] under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Hebrews 9:16 For where a testament [is], there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.

Hebrews 9:17 For a testament [is] of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.
---francis on 8/13/10


If you think that NT books are part of the OT, you are confused.

The NT starts with Annunciation to Zechariah.

And your quote from 1 Cor is perfect justification for infant baptism today.
---Cluny on 8/13/10


Do not forget, that the NT does not start until AFTER the death of Jesus

Here is your OT baptism:
Mark 1:4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

1 Corinthians 10:2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea,

Exodus 15:22 So Moses brought Israel from the Red sea, and they went out into the wilderness of Shur, and they went three days in the wilderness, and found no water.
---francis on 8/13/10


\\All laws in the NT do occur in the OT, but not all laws in OT appear in NT.\\

Where is water baptism in the Old Testament?

Please give book, chapter, and verse.
---Cluny on 8/12/10


All laws in the NT do occur in the OT, but not all laws in OT appear in NT.
Mainly in areas where the church needed correction do we see the OT laws being repeated.

Example:
The rainbow. How many times in the NT do we see any apostle reminding believers that the rainbow was a sign of a spoken covenant by God?

It is an OT covenant that still exists today ONLY because it is not a covenant made with blood.

So then are we still under OT covenants?
Or has the rainbow changed it's meaning?
IS christ now our rainbow?

Genesis 9:16 And the bow shall be in the cloud, and I will look upon it, that I may remember the everlasting covenant between God and every living creature of all flesh that [is] upon the earth.
---francis on 8/12/10


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francis

you see how the truth in your words comes out.




Where do you see bride price n the NT?
---francis on 8/10/10



It was you!
Not Cluny!

A but we still love you!
Just speak the truth!
---TheSeg on 8/11/10


Hi...I just. Wanted to share with you that you are still God's apple of his eyes...he loves you...
Your heart is telling you that you are doing it and continue doing wrong...
Lay on your knees and pray from the bottle of your heart...have a privacy with Jesus Christ...
If you and your boyfriend really love each other married...don't think marriage is an old tradition...is seriuos commitment.
And explain to your partner your love for God...with no fear but with patience and love....

God bless you and your relationship sister...
---Isabel on 8/10/10


\\remember i also asked for those that are given in LAW or PROPHECY, so all those are indeed forshadowed.

Where do you see bride price n the NT?\\

You were the one who dragged up bride-price from the OT, not I.

Here is your quote, in fact:

**Deuteronomy 22:29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty [shekels] of silver, and she shall be his wife, because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.
---francis on 8/4/10**

Just another example of how you cling to a homemade faith that is neither authentically Christianity nor Judaism, but made up of selected verses that you choose with a pre-determined view.
---Cluny on 8/10/10


aka on 8/9/10

I see what you are saying
But matthew says do not make an aoth you cannot keep. Don't make prediction which you have no control over. DO not abligate God.

Example you cannot make the hair on your hair white or black, it is beyound your control. And God does not gaurantee that he will do as you ask.

Proverbs 22:26 Be not thou [one] of them that strike hands, [or] of them that are sureties for debts.

Proverbs 22:27 If thou hast nothing to pay, why should he take away thy bed from under thee?
---francis on 8/10/10


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Oh, Baptism.
Eucharist.
Anointing of the sick.

(Though I will admit these are foreshadowed in the OT, and types can be found, they are not commanded.)

In the mean time, please tell me what the modern bride-price--which you yourself brought up--should be.
---Cluny on 8/10/10
remember i also asked for those that are given in LAW or PROPHECY, so all those are indeed forshadowed.

Where do you see bride price n the NT?
---francis on 8/10/10


\\PS find any commandment in the NT that doe snot first apear in the OT
---FRANCIS on 8/9/10\\

Oh, Baptism.

Eucharist.

Anointing of the sick.

(Though I will admit these are foreshadowed in the OT, and types can be found, they are not commanded.)

In the mean time, please tell me what the modern bride-price--which you yourself brought up--should be.
---Cluny on 8/10/10


Cluny:

Pro 28:9 He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.
---jerry6593 on 8/10/10


//Now you want me to show you not to be hasty to make a vow//

no...now I want you to show me a command in the OT that says, "Do not take an oath at all".

Numbers 30:2 If a man vow a vow unto the LORD,...

I guess I did not understand the challenge.

You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy...Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you.

You heard but I say. I don't get it.
---aka on 8/9/10


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\\Acts 11:8 But I said, Not so, Lord: for nothing common or unclean hath at any time entered into my mouth.

Why did peter stay so long under a DIETARY BURDEN?\\

He certainly wised up 4 chapters later, didn't he?

And as I recall, St. Paul rebuked him for not keeping kosher himself, but demanding that Gentile Christians do. Galatians 2:14

It took him a while to learn better, though I doubt it took him as long as it's clearly taking you.

In other words, you're not acting according to the truth of the Gospel, francis.
---Cluny on 8/9/10


Matthew 5:33-35
Matthew 5:43-45

and there are more implied commands in Matt 5.
aka on 8/9/10

I have already show eye for eye in OT
Now you want me to show you not to be hasty to make a vow and if you make a vow keep it in OT? OK

Leviticus 19:12
Numbers 30:2 If a man vow a vow unto the LORD, or swear an oath to bind his soul with a bond, he shall not break his word, he shall do according to all that proceedeth out of his mouth.

Leviticus 5:4

Ecclesiastes 5:4 When thou vowest a vow unto God, defer not to pay it, for [he hath] no pleasure in fools: pay that which thou hast vowed.
---francis on 8/9/10


The ENTIRE JEWISH LAW, Sabbath and all, is what St. Peter is calling a burden--one that not even Jews could bear.
Cluny on 8/9/10

Acts 11:8 But I said, Not so, Lord: for nothing common or unclean hath at any time entered into my mouth.

Why did peter stay so long under a DIETARY BURDEN?

Acts 13:42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.
Acts 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.

why didn't paul relieve them of the REST BURDEN? Making these gentiles come to hear God's word on the sabbath: WHAT A BURDEN!
---francis on 8/9/10


The ENTIRE JEWISH LAW, Peter is calling a burden.
---Cluny on 8/9/10

EXCEPT THESE:
Romans 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet, and if [there be] any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Ephesians 6:2 Honour thy father and mother,

Revelation 14:7 and worship him that made heaven, and earth,
1 John 5:21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.
Hebrews 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
James 2:7 Do not they blaspheme that worthy name by the which ye are called?
---francis on 8/9/10


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//find any commandments in the NT that does not first apear in the OT//

Matthew 5:33-35
Matthew 5:43-45

and there are more implied commands in Matt 5.
---aka on 8/9/10


The ENTIRE JEWISH LAW, Sabbath and all, is what St. Peter is calling a burden--one that not even Jews could bear.
---Cluny on 8/9/10

Does that also include honour father and mother. Is honouring your father and mother a burden?

PS find any commandment in the NT that doe snot first apear in the OT
---FRANCIS on 8/9/10


\\Peter never said sabbath was a burden

Acts 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? \\

In case you don't know the meaning of "yoke," francis, it's for carrying a burden.

The ENTIRE JEWISH LAW, Sabbath and all, is what St. Peter is calling a burden--one that not even Jews could bear.
---Cluny on 8/9/10


Ephesians 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, [even] the law of commandments [contained] in ORDINANCES, for to make in himself of twain one new man, [so] making peace,

Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ORDINANCES that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross,

If you think this is talking about dietary laws and ten commandments see hebrews:

Hebrews 9:1 Then verily the first [covenant] had also ORDINANCESof divine service, and a worldly sanctuary.

Hebrews 9:10 [Which stood] only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ORDINANCES, imposed [on them] until the time of reformation.
---FRANCIS on 8/9/10


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Isaiah 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, [from] doing thy pleasure on my holy day, and call the sabbath a delight,

Peter never said sabbath was a burden

Acts 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

Whose fault was it they could not handle it:

Hebrews 8:8 For finding FAULT WITH THEM, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

THE PROBLEM WAS NEVER THE LAW, IT WAS THEM
---francis on 8/9/10


Acts 15:23-24.

To the brethren who are of the Gentiles in Antioch, Syria, and Cilicia:

Greetings.

24 Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, saying, You must be circumcised and keep the law[f]to whom we gave no such commandment

francis, which of the apostles gave you the commandment to try to unsettle people's souls with your troubling words about keeping the Jewish law?

Stop testing God!
---Cluny on 8/9/10


\\cluny: Whay do you go to such lengths to justify your lawlessness? Don't you realize that it is the CARNAL mind that is intentionally outside the law.\\

Keep on blessing me.

**You call it a BURDEN God says IT IS A DELIGHT. **

St. Peter called it a burden in Acts 15. Go argue with him.
---Cluny on 8/8/10


REPENTANCE in it self will not save you,people that truly become save are forgiven.
---RICHARD on 8/8/10


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Romans 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet, and if [there be] any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Ephesians 6:2 Honour thy father and mother,

I see these six being directly related to the ten.

read isaiah 66 start at verse 15. In one passage it talk about the fate of all. The destruction of the wisked by fire, and the righteous inheritingthe earth.

Malachi 4:3 And ye shall tread down the wicked, for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do [this], saith the LORD of hosts.
---francis on 8/7/10


micha9344

How do these two passages differ:

Galatians 5:2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.
Galatians 5:3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do THE WHOLE LAW.
Galatians 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law, ye are fallen from grace.

James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep THE WHOLE LAW, and yet offend in one [point], he is guilty of all.
James 2:11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
---francis on 8/7/10


Typical interpretation error, take a word meaning and apply it out of context.
What is the 'law of God'? The 10 commandments? The 600+ ordinances to Israel? both? more? less?
How about when Jesus pulled 2 out of the 600+ which were not contained in the 10?
Do you think they cover it all as Jesus said?
Would they not truly be considered the Law God and the Law of Liberty? Royal law indeed!!!
Isaiah 66:22,23 is also taken out of context making v24 irrelevant and without regard.
Isaiah 66:24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched, and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.
carcases in heaven!?!
---micha9344 on 8/7/10


cluny: Whay do you go to such lengths to justify your lawlessness? Don't you realize that it is the CARNAL mind that is intentionally outside the law.

Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

God instituted the seventh-day Sabbath at creation for ALL mankind. Jesus and ALL His disciples (Jews all) kept the seventh-day Sabbath exclusively. Isaiah says that we will keep the seventh-day Sabbath in heaven.

Why do you hate that which God made and love that which man made?
---jerry6593 on 8/7/10


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Gal 4:21-24,28,30-31 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law? For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman. But he [who was] of the bondwoman was born after the flesh, but he of the freewoman [was] by promise. Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants, the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar. Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise. Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.
---micha9344 on 8/7/10


Isaiah 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, [from] doing thy pleasure on my holy day, and call the sabbath A DELIGHT,..

You call it a BURDEN God says IT IS A DELIGHT.

1 John 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous

YOU call it a YOKE
God says it is NOT grievous

Isaiah 56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, EVERY ONE that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant,

You say itis ONLY for JEWS,
God says it is for EVERY ONE

I agree with GOD on all points here do you?
---francis on 8/6/10


You try to get Gentile Christians to keep the Sabbath,
Is this right?
Cluny on 8/6/10

Not ME, GOD

Isaiah 56:2 Blessed [is] the man [that] doeth this, and the son of man [that] layeth hold on it, that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.

Acts 13:42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.

Acts 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.

Acts 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

Isaiah 66:22-23
---francis on 8/6/10


1 John 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

I am not sure why yu consider Gods LAW OF LIBERTY a burden

What man in his right spiritual mind would call it a BURDEN if GOD says to rest on the 7th day. Where is the burden in resting ONE DAY which GOD commands you.

Is it a burden when you secular lord / boss gives you a day off? Do you reject a day off fro your secular lord/ boss?

Think about it: you keep 9/10 commandments, but the ONE commandments that says STOP WORK and REST you find it a burden. WHY?

Romans 8:7 Because the carnal mind [is] enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
---francis on 8/6/10


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\\You have no idae what you are talking about\\

Let me see if I understand you properly.

You try to get Gentile Christians to keep the Sabbath, observe the kashoth in food and clothes, and now drag in OT laws about a man paying the bride-price of 50 silver sheqelim to a woman's father for taking her virginity (presumably)--which last you never explain, btw, even after you brought it up--and in general try to force Gentile Christians under the yoke of Jewish law (collectively called "circumcision" in the NT).

But I don't know what I'm talking about.

Is this right?
---Cluny on 8/6/10


Acts 15, Romans 14, and Galatians should do for starters.
---Cluny on 8/5/10

You have no idae what you are talking about
Let me help you.
NO CHRISTIAN jewish or gentile is required to be circumcized.
NO CHRISTIAN whether jewish or Gentile is required to eat any meat ( flesh) which he find to be contrary to his conscience.

What you fail so badly to realize is that these laws of which you refer apply equally to ALL christians whether JEW or GENTILE for God have made them ONE.

You seem to believe that there are different laws for jewish christiasn and gentile christians. you are dead wrong. BIble has always says ONE LAW, ONE ORDINANCE for ALL: Jew or Gentile.

God have made them ONE you try to make them TWO.
---francis on 8/5/10


This law protects her and frees her from being called a harlot.
---francis on 8/4/10

I thought that Jesus' death on the cross freed her from being called a harlot. Since when does the law protect anyone from their sins?
---KarenD on 8/6/10


Emma, it's not possible for you to view an alternate time-line, one where you were married all the while: you've already endured the consequences, you just didn't know it. Doing things God's Way brings blessings, doing it our way brings consequences. As God remains faithful many are sinning their way through life in the belief that they are 'getting away with it'. Truth is, they are missing out on many blessings, and using up those accrued. But God is great, so if you want your lives blessing...

We see it everyday: man brings about a problem, then he finds a solution, and then he puts his faith in that. But then the solution brings about another problem to which he finds another solution...and so on. But what if we'd done it God's Way?
---John_II on 8/5/10


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\\However, first answer the question about how the bride-price should be computed in modern times, specifically in 21st century America.
---Cluny on 8/5/10

No text huh?
I use the word of God as my guide. I believe that God does not make any mistakes.\\

In other words, you have no idea what the bride-price, which you yourself brought up, should be in American currency.

\\JEWISH PRACTOICES: Show me ONE law in the NT that was not first given in the OT.\\

The various verses in the NT that make it clear that Gentiles are NOT bound to Jewish Law, which you keep trying to impose on them.

Acts 15, Romans 14, and Galatians should do for starters.
---Cluny on 8/5/10


However, first answer the question about how the bride-price should be computed in modern times, specifically in 21st century America.
---Cluny on 8/5/10

No text huh?
I use the word of God as my guide. I believe that God does not make any mistakes.

2 Timothy 3:16 ALL SCRIPTURE [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
---francis on 8/5/10


.many of your postings where you try to push Jewish practices on Gentile Christians have shown.
---Cluny on 8/5/10
JEWISH PRACTOICES: Show me ONE law in the NT that was not first given in the OT.
---francis on 8/5/10


\\-Cluny on 8/4/10
Just show me the text
I can agree with the bible, but not with XYZ said
Please just show the text
---francis on 8/5/10\\

As a matter of fact, you don't agree with what the Bible says, as many of your postings where you try to push Jewish practices on Gentile Christians have shown.

However, first answer the question about how the bride-price should be computed in modern times, specifically in 21st century America.
---Cluny on 8/5/10


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-Cluny on 8/4/10
Just show me the text
I can agree with the bible, but not with XYZ said
Please just show the text
---francis on 8/5/10


While God is pleased that you got married I think he will be more impressed if you also got saved so that you'all will if you live right to the end, receive heaven as your reward.

Perhaps you were ignorant of the fact that blesses everyone but those who are saved receive an eternal blessing not accessible to those who reject him and do not believe.

Get Saved first then get married!
---Carla on 8/5/10


francis, you brought up the bride price the poster's boyfriend owes her father.

Since YOU are the one who brought it up, can you answer this?

Since the Biblical shekel was the equivalent of 1/3 oz of silver, at current rates, should he pay her father US $400, this being the modern value of 50 silver shekels?

Or should it be the equivalent of 50 new Israeli shekels, which would be $15?

Or should we take 1 ancient shekel as one US dollar, so the man owes the poster's father $50?

This is JUST AS MUCH a part of the Biblical law as simply allowing them to get married, francis.
---Cluny on 8/5/10


ask for forgiveness, stop living together untill your married, give God your life and live it for him, and He will bless you, your household, marriage if you always put Him first and go to Him for everything.
---a_friend on 8/4/10


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\\help me understand the purpose and posible length of this seperation.
---francis on 8/4/10\\

The ancient Christian teachers have written that fornication and concubinage are not not marriage, or even the beginning of marriage.

They have suggested that if they were TRULY repentant, they would separate and never marry each other--if at all.

However, they have also said it is better for them to marry lest something worse happen.

In any case, francis, the verse you quoted is NOT about concubinage and cohabitation.
---Cluny on 8/4/10


Once again francis quotes one of the 613 mitzvoth to put Christian Gentiles into bondage when it's convenient for him to prove his point.
Cluny on 8/4/10

Get used to the law of God, It cannot be bondage, SIN is bondage.

Why do you have a problem with the Law of God?

Romans 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

The bondage is this case happened when two people who are not married started to fornicate. That is sin and bondage.
God's law is not bondage.

This law protects her and frees her from being called a harlot.
---francis on 8/4/10


francis...Wow! I had no idea that you followed all the hundreds of laws set down by Moses.
---KarenD on 8/4/10


Yes, you are living in sin. Both of you need to ask God for forgiveness, (individually and alone - preferable). God will forgive at that moment. God says stop the sin practice. He does not say how long between the end of sin and marriage. Get Biblical marriage counseling. (I feel that living together has provided different views of each others' commitment and duty). When God tells you are ready, make it a special day! A special day that shows you have been released from the bondage of a sin.
---Dennis on 8/4/10


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Can someone tell me where in the bible, it says that there living in sin?
And while you're looking for that, keep your eyes open.
For where it says, they are not married, right now!

Emma, if you are living as one. You are married!


If you don't believe, you are married! Now you are living in sin!
Because you think you can separate, when you're married.
You are married, you cannot separate!

Look at it this way.
The same Guy that married Adam and Eve married you guys!
Good luck and God bless!

Ps. Don't forget to keep a pair of high boots handy!
You, will need them!
---TheSeg on 8/4/10


francis, let's talk about the Biblical bride-price of 50 silver sheqelim that the boyfriend must pay to the father of the woman who posted this.

1. Should this be the modern equivalent of 50 silver shequelim as at the time this verse was written? One silver shequel is about 1/3 oz of silver, which at today's prices would be a total of US $400.

2. Should it be 50 modern Israeli shequelim, which would be about US $15?

3. Or should it be simply US $50--treating an ancient sheqel as the equivalent of one modern dollar?

Don't forget, THIS is required by the Bible, too. YOU YOURSELF brought it up.

Let's decide this first.
---Cluny on 8/4/10


Where in the bible does it say they have to seperate? I see marry, I do not see seperate.

Deuteronomy 22:28 If a man find a damsel [that is] a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found,
Deuteronomy 22:29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty [shekels] of silver, and she shall be his wife, because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.

help me understand the purpose and posible length of this seperation.
---francis on 8/4/10


\\Actually to the BIBLE, you MUST get married.
No negative consequences will come from getting married. You will be 100% forgiven and be blessed.\\

Once again francis quotes one of the 613 mitzvoth to put Christian Gentiles into bondage when it's convenient for him to prove his point.

The passage is clearly talking about a secret dalliance, abduction, or possibly rape.

It's not talking about consensual concubinage.
---Cluny on 8/4/10


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He will also bless you if you repent and separate before your marriage--or even if you repent, separatie, and never marry.
---Cluny on 8/4/10

Emma....If you know that living in sin is wrong, then why are you still doing it? You need to stop the sin!
---KarenD on 8/4/10

I agree with both of you folks.

The man and woman should separate and STOP living in sin. They will be forgiven. They should both seek God and his will for their futures.

If marriage is what would be God's will for them, then they can get married.

And if not, they will still be forgiven, blessed, and free to go their separate ways.
---Sag on 8/4/10


---Cluny on 8/4/10 has given the right answer.
---mima on 8/4/10


Actually to the BIBLE, you MUST get married.
No negative consequences will come from getting married. You will be 100% forgiven and be blessed.

Deuteronomy 22:28 If a man find a damsel [that is] a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found,

Deuteronomy 22:29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty [shekels] of silver, and she shall be his wife, because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.
---francis on 8/4/10


Of course the Lord forgives and will bless your union because you both are doing what the Lord would want you to!
---Lin on 8/4/10


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He will also bless you if you repent and separate before your marriage--or even if you repent, separatie, and never marry.
---Cluny on 8/4/10


Emma....If you know that living in sin is wrong, then why are you still doing it? You need to stop the sin!
---KarenD on 8/4/10


Hi, yes God will forgive you if you ask Him and if you get married. :) My husband and I lived together also and we feel completely at peace now that we are married in the eyes of God. Bless you both. But get married :D
---Mary on 8/4/10


The more important question is after being together for this length of time, do you really love each other and thing that marring each other is a good idea? If that is not the case don't do it.

The only issue that really counts now is will the marriage be successful and will you spawn children that you may not want later.

If you are going to get married use an absolute fool proof method of birth control for 5 - 7 years as neither one of you seen remotely responsible enough to be parents at this time.
---Friendly_Blogger on 8/4/10


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