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Is Hell Eternal Damnation

We typically use the word hell for eternal damnation. In Matthew 5:22 (and in other verses), Jesus uses the word "ge-enna". What is the reference and what are the implications?

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"Tell us what you believe and not what not to believe." aka

"Is Hell Eternal Damnation?"

No.
---scott on 8/24/10


"GOD is Three Divine Persons in ONE Divine Unit, a GOD-Head." Gordon

What scripture says anything like this?
---scott on 8/24/10


Tell us what you believe and not what not to believe.
---aka on 8/24/10


"That there is a false translation." Gordon

"The Word was a god." The NT of Our Lord Jesus Christ, Reijnier Rooleeuw, 1694.

"The Word was a god." The New Testament in an Improved Version, 1808.

"The Word was a God." The NT In Greek and English, Abner Kneeland, 1822.

"As a god the Command was." A Literal Translation Of The New Testament, Herman Heinfetter, 1863.

"And a god was the word." (interlinear translation): The Emphatic Diaglott, Benjamin Wilson, 1863 and 1864.

"And a God (i.e. a Divine Being) was the Word." Concise Commentary On The Holy Bible, Robert Young, c. 1885.
---scott on 8/24/10


"Spin doctor" aka

While you're looking up 'deity', you might want to also look up the meaning of 'spin'. Calling you on your inaccurate statements is not 'spin'.

"...Insert one word and it would seem that we believe the same thing, right?" aka

What? How does adding the name "Jesus" to "Christ" change my statement about him being the Son of God?

"Truth is important to me" aka

Maybe. Christ said "Your [God's] word is truth." Generally your comments to me have not involved an examination of God's word. You are defensive without actually making a biblical defense for your assertions.
---scott on 8/24/10




scott, i admit that you do do your homework. so, tell me, how many years does it take to become a spin doctor?

JWs believe the Holy Spririt is God's impersonal active force and any reference to "it" is personified.

//...believe that [Jesus] Christ is the Son of God with a pre-human existence."//

Insert one word and it would seem that we believe the same thing, right?

Tell us what you believe and not what not to believe.

Man's opinion is important to you and your reputation. Truth is important to me despite my reputation.
---aka on 8/24/10


David8318, The point is, is that YOU CLAIM that GOD detests making people suffer being burned by fire like what happened in JEREMIAH 7. Those child could have very well suffered a QUICK DEATH by fire, NO? NEVERTHELESS...we see GOD causing and allowing the citizens of Sodom and Gomorrah to suffer a death for all by FIRE AND BRIMSTONE. Don't you even dare say that the fire for the children of JEREMIAH 7 was somehow "different". The fires on Sodom and Gomorrah were no less tolerable. People there were BURNED ALIVE. And you have no clue how "quick" it was for them, anyhow. For some yes, but, for others it could have been very slow in some ways.
---Gordon on 8/24/10


Scott and David8318, YAHUSHUA (JESUS CHRIST) is the Son of GOD. GOD is Three Divine Persons in ONE Divine Unit, a GOD-Head. YAHUSHUA became a Man when He came to Earth through the virgin Miriam (Mary). But, YAHUSHUA existed in the Beginning and He was Co-Creator with the GOD-Head. YAHUSHUA is the Word from JOHN 1:1 "In the Beginning was the Word, and the Word was with GOD, and the Word was God." New World Translation reads "......and the Word was a god." That there is a false translation. If you deny that YAHUSHUA was God of very GOD Who later came to earth in the Flesh and Blood of a Man, then you deny the Truth of GOD.
---Gordon on 8/24/10


David8313, PSALM 11:6 "Upon the wicked HE shall rain Snares, Fire and Brimstone, and an horrible Tempest: this SHALL BE the portion of their Cup." This Verse is describing GOD's Holy Vengeance on the wicked IN HELL and in the LAKE OF FIRE. Psalm 11:6 is a description of Hell and the Lake of Fire, David. But, since you do not believe they exist, let alone "eternally" you, therefore are left to interpret it with some other meaning. Best you just accept the hard Truth. GOD is indeed Love. But, REAL LOVE is tough when it needs to be. And, Judgment from GOD is a tough consequence for choosing evil and sin. GOD is also Holy and is a GOD of Wrath as well! See JOHN 3:36.
---Gordon on 8/24/10


"A setup to the real [JW] doctrine:..." aka

You should really do your homework if you want to be taken seriously. None of what you've stated about JW beliefs is true.

"No Diety of Jesus" (sic) Define deity. Dictionary dot com provides several definitions that they would agree with. "1. A god. 2. Divine character or nature. 3. The...rank of a god. 4. A person or thing revered as a god."

"[No] existence [of] Holy Spirit" False. JWs believe in the existence of the HS.

"Perfect man" Far beyond that, JWs believe that Christ is the Son of God with a pre-human existence.

"Christ part is from Michael/archangel" False.
---scott on 8/23/10




Gordon- I agree Psalm 11 provides an insight into how Jehovah views the righteous and the wicked. Jehovah will provide 'refuge' for the righteous, but for the wicked, verse 6 is explicit.

However, I fail to see how Psalm 11 can be used to support 'eternal damnation', when these words are not even remotely suggested in the chapter, let alone verses 5 & 6. To me verse 6 shows how swift the end will be for the wicked, with no eternal life given them to experience 'eternal damnation'.

The destruction of 'Sodom and Gomorrah' was also swift. The scriptures do not say the inhabitants of Sodom were given eternal life to experience 'eternal damnation'.

Eternal life is a gift given to the righteous, NOT the wicked. Ro.6:23.
---David8318 on 8/23/10


//GOD also hates sending people alive into fire to burn//

That is precisely why I say it is a metaphor. Clearly, Christ (I mean Jesus Christ not an angel)said it and meant it, but what did He mean by it? Spirit has no nerve endings.

gordon, david8318 is JW. this is only a setup to the real doctrine that jw's carry: there is no Diety of Jesus Christ and the existence Holy Spirit. to them, Jesus is the "perfect man" and the Christ part is from Michael, the archangel.

if you are convicted to grab at smoke, by all means, proceed. the pain of eternal separation from God will far exceed the everlasting fires of gehenna.
---aka on 8/23/10


David8318, PSALM 11:5-6 says "The LORD trieth the righteous: but, the wicked and him that loveth violence HIS SOUL HATETH. Upon the wicked HE shall rain SNARES, FIRE and BRIMSTONE, and an HORRIBLE TEMPEST: THIS shall be the portion of their cup!" What did GOD do to the wicked and their cities who dwelt in Sodom and Gomorrah, David? Who was it that caused FIRE AND BRIMSTONE to rain down upon, and lay to ashes, those two wicked cities and their inhabitants? WHO WAS THAT? The LORD burns those that do evil with FIRE. HE protects and shields them who follow HIM. But, for those who love evil and continue in wickedness up to their deaths will be punished with everlasting FIRE.
---Gordon on 8/23/10


Jerry6593, You're only defending your Church's doctrine, not what the Bible is teaching. SDAs have the Sabbath bit, the obedience to the Ten Commandments and the love of the Bible all right. But they are ignorant to the truths about Eternal Condemnation and Damnation. There's more to learn, Brother. I'm still learning and so can you. Get with what the Bible itself is saying, and not what religious men's traditional teaching is telling you. Search it all out for yourself. You'll be shocked if you do, as to what is really up ahead for those who are perishing and have already perished.
---Gordon on 8/23/10


David8318: Good Stuff! Keep it up.
---jerry6593 on 8/23/10


"David8318, Further comment on JEREMIAH 7: GOD hates the murdering of innocent babies, children and people. And, HE hates the worship and honouring of FALSE gods!" - Gordon 8/21/10.

Absolutely Gordon! But don't forget in the context of Jeremiah 7:31 and 32:35 that GOD also hates sending people alive into fire to burn. This is a grotesque practice and not one that fits the personality of a 'God of love', which Jehovah, the God of the Bible is! 1 John 4:8.
---David8318 on 8/22/10


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David8318, you have answered well, and your patience is commendable.
---joseph on 8/22/10


Aka- Gehenna was Jerusalem's local refuse dump just outside the city, called the 'Valley of Geh-Hinnom'. Its fires were kept burning day and night by adding sulphur, so that refuse and carcasses of dead animals and criminals were consumed. Where the fires did not reach, maggots would devour.

Nothing living was sent there. When apostate Jews made human sacrifices of sons and daughters, by passing them alive through the fires in the 'Valley of Hinnom' (Jeremiah 7:31 & 32:35), Jehovah said that this was 'a thing that I had not commanded and that had not come up into my heart.'

So at Mark 9:43-48 Jesus did not teach 'hell-fire'. Gehenna is not a place where God sends people to burn for all eternity. 'Hell' is not a Bible teaching.
---David8318 on 8/22/10


Aka- 'HELL' is a word used in the KJV to translate the Hebrew 'sheol' and the Greek 'hades'. In the KJV, 'hell' is used for 'sheol' 31 times and for 'hades' 10 times. KJV is not consistent since 'sheol' is also translated 31 times 'grave' and 3 times as 'pit'.

'Hell' is an unsatisfactory translation of these original Bible words. 'Hell' is from the word 'helan', meaning 'to conceal' (Websters). The word 'hell' thus originally conveyed no thought of heat or torment but simply of a 'covered over or concealed place.' In the old English dialect the expression 'helling potatoes' meant, not to roast them, but simply to place the potatoes in the ground or in a cellar

'Hell-fire' is found in false Babylonian, Hindu & Buddhist belief's.
---David8318 on 8/22/10


Gordon- it won't come as a surprise to you that I disagree with your understanding of the 'wild beast' of Revelation. I do not believe the scriptures say the 'wild beast' and the anti-christ are one and the same. Thus, I believe your assumption that the 'wild beast' is literal is incorrect.

Your thesis however is correct, for example you say, 'We are to compare Scripture with Scripture.' But you do not follow your own advice with the 'wild beast' of Revelation 13. Compare the beasts in Daniel as an example- Dan.8:20,21. Here the beasts represent governments & political powers.

So it is my understanding that the 'wild beast' of Revelation is symbolic of political entities, to be destroyed in the symbolic 'Lake of Fire'.
---David8318 on 8/21/10


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Gordon- it is a recognised point of fact that the Greek word used to describe what Jesus said at Mark 9:43-48 is 'Gehenna'. Please consult your Greek interlinear.

The translators of your Bible evidently have not transliterated the word 'Gehenna' into the English text, but seen fit to translate the word 'Gehenna' as 'Hell'. This they have done to promote the idea of eternal 'hell and damnation'.

It is my belief that Jesus used the word 'Gehenna' to illustrate the point that a person would experience complete destruction with no hope of return if he persisted in wrongdoing.

Jesus was certainly not teaching at Mark 9:43-48 that a person would be tortured by the Devil for eternity in 'hell-fire'.
---David8318 on 8/21/10


Gordon- God emphatically states through Jeremiah 7:31 and 32:35 that 'to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, a thing that I had not commanded and that had not come up into my heart.'

I'm not the one taking scripture out of context. You completely avoid the point of how the Jews sacrificed their sons and daughters. Of course God objects to murder! God had already given the Law on murder in Moses day! God wasn't repeating something the Jews already knew.

What was abhorrent to God was not only the sacrifice of sons and daughters, but it was also the burning of them alive in fire- 'a thing that I had not commanded and that had not come up into my heart.'

It is not in God's 'heart' to send people to burn in fire!
---David8318 on 8/21/10


David8318, Further comment on JEREMIAH 7: GOD hates the murdering of innocent babies, children and people. And, HE hates the worship and honouring of FALSE gods!
---Gordon on 8/21/10


RICHARD: "IF ANYBODY can find were a unsave person has life after death in the BIBLE Please post it,I can't find it,and you can't use LUKE 23 - 25 thats a parable."

Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.

Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
---jerry6593 on 8/21/10


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David8138, You said YAHUSHUA (JESUS) "never said or taught" that people would be thrown into Hell. WHAT??! In MARK 9:43-48 YAHUSHUA clearly warned against letting yourself sin which will cause you to be "cast into Hell". He, Himself, said that and now, YOU'RE saying that He didn't say it! And those Verses you mentioned in JEREMIAH 7:31-35? GOD was talking about how people were sacrificing LITTLE BABIES and CHILDREN into the fires of a false god "Tophet". Much like what satanists do to their sacrifices. It's SLAUGHTER OF THE INNOCENTS that GOD hates! You totally misunderstood those Verses and you quoted them out of context, David! GOD will destroy, in eternal torments, the wicked angels and men in the Lake of Fire!
---Gordon on 8/21/10


David8318, Most, but not EVERYTHING, in the Bible is to be taken literally. We are to compare Scripture with Scripture. When you seek the LORD's Guidance and you do serious research for yourself and ask the LORD for HIS Understanding of what His Written Word is about, you will then learn and know which of the things in Scripture are LITERAL and which are METAPHORICAL or SYMBOLIC. We know that Hell and the Lake of Fire are LITERAL places for the LORD makes it plain in various Passages. The 7-headed, 10-horned Beast of REV.13 is a METAPHOR for the Anti-Christ and his kingdom. The Anti-Christ will be real, but, he won't look like a "Beast". He's described as a "Beast" because, to GOD, that's what he is!
---Gordon on 8/21/10


Gordon- so it is clear that you believe the 'Lake of Fire' to be literal. This means you believe the 'wild beast and the false prophet' are also literal, or 'real' as you put it.

Can you tell me then where have you seen the 'seven headed ten horned wild beast' of Revelation? Is it in a zoo somewhere?

Can you also tell me who the 'false prophet' is? Is he someone you have seen? How about the Harlot who rides the 'wild beast', is she a real person? Have you seen her aswell?

It's quite clear to my and many other's understanding that the 'Lake of Fire' is figurative (or symbolic) of complete destruction from which there is no return.
---David8318 on 8/20/10


Gordon- I disagree with your belief that Jesus said people would be 'thrown into hell'. Jesus never said or taught this.

At Mark 9:43-48, the word Jesus used is 'Gehenna'. This is the point of the blog question. Is 'gehenna' the 'hell-fire' some believe such as yourself, where people are sent to burn for eternity? I do not believe Jesus' use of 'gehenna' meant a place of eternal torment in 'hell-fire'.

Gehenna was a burning rubbish dump outside Jerusalem where nothing living was sent and because Gehenna's fires were maintained, anything sent there was never see again. Jesus' use of Gehenna thus indicated eternal destruction, with no hope of return.

Jehovah is disgusted with the idea of burning people- Jer.7:31 & 32:35.
---David8318 on 8/20/10


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micha9344, yes, those passages you quoted should be translated "age-abiding" rather than "eternal." (As for the Hebrew word "olam," it is not found in the New Testament. It seems that most of the New Testament writers were not familiar with Hebrew and quoted the Old Testament from the Greek Septuagent.)
---ger.toshav on 8/19/10


David8138, Peter didn't use the expression "thrown into Hell" there, but the Lord YAHUSHUA (JESUS) Himself did! He warned against being CAST INTO HELL in MARK 9:43-48! You are definitely FREE, FREE, FREE to believe however you wish. But no matter how much you believe the way you do, it will not change the Truth of the LITERAL Hell and the Lake of Fire that exist. There will be the "Beast/wild Beast" (the Anti-Christ, the false Jesus) and his side-kick False Prophet. They both will be the first to be cast alive in the eternally burning Lake of Fire. GOD is WILLING that none perish, but, that's His Desire...He does not force anyone to choose Life Eternal. Many are rejecting Salvation and they will perish in eternal torments.
---Gordon on 8/19/10


An eon has a beginning and and ending. So Eternal is a poor translation.
---ger.toshav on 8/18/10

The full understanding of the word is covered by the Hebrew word. If it was Everlasting for all Israel in the Old it remains so in the New.

H5769 o-lawm'
From H5956, properly concealed, that is, the vanishing point, generally time out of mind (past or future), that is, (practically) eternity, frequentative adverbially (especially with prepositional prefix) always: - always (-s), ancient (time), any more, continuance, eternal, (for, [n-]) ever (-lasting, -more, of old), lasting, long (time), (of) old (time), perpetual, at any time, (beginning of the) world (+ without end).
---Trav on 8/19/10


''The Greek word Aionios usually translated Eternal means "lasting for an eon." It is derived from the word Aion meaning eon. An eon has a beginning and and ending. So Eternal is a poor translation.''--ger.toshav on 8/18/10
So eternal or everlasting life is a poor translation also?
Mat 19:16b that I may have eternal(aionios) life?
Mat 19:29b and shall inherit everlasting(aionios) life.
Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting(aionios) punishment: but the righteous into life eternal(aionios).
Jhn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish , but have everlasting(aionios) life.
---micha9344 on 8/18/10


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The Greek word Aionios usually translated Eternal means "lasting for an eon." It is derived from the word Aion meaning eon. An eon has a beginning and and ending. So Eternal is a poor translation.
---ger.toshav on 8/18/10


aka: "So, when do we apply literal meaning or metaphorical meaning? when it fits our way of thinking or God's?"

Both literal and metaphorical. How many different ways was it written to describe Christ's death? (one hint: Christ's blood) Do you see how different metaphors all mean the same thing literally? It's too bad that modern man has become too knowledgable and too technical. This is the major reason many interpretations of the bible comes into being. If a person learns poetry, they will better understand many of the metaphors in the bible - not to take the metaphors literally, but the literal meaning behind the metaphors.
---Steveng on 8/18/10


Gordon- I do agree that God will express His anger when He comes to judge at Armageddon.

However, before His day of Wrath, Peter said God is 'patient with you because he does not desire any to be destroyed but desires all to attain to repentance.' (1 Pe.3:9) Notice Peter says 'destroyed' ('perish', KJV) not 'burned for eternity', or 'thrown into hell'.

You understand the 'Lake of Fire' to be literal. You must believe 'the wild beast and the false prophet' are literal as they are also cast into the 'Lake of Fire'. You must also believe 'death and Hades' are literal places because they are thrown there as well. Re.20:10,14.

I do not believe the 'Lake of Fire' to be literal anymore than the 'wild beast or the false prophet'.
---David8318 on 8/18/10


//The words and phrases written by the [Holy Spirit] are both literal and metaphorical.//

So, when do we apply literal meaning or metaphorical meaning? when it fits our way of thinking or God's?
---aka on 8/18/10


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Y'all may be interested to know that the word Eternity does not appear in the New Testament, not even once...
---ger.toshav on 8/17/10

Interesting.

Not arguing because I haven't checked but, it is implied in Covenants by "everlasting","for ever".
Genesis 17:7
I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.
Ezekiel 16:60
Nevertheless I will remember my covenant with thee in the days of thy youth,I will establish unto thee an everlasting covenant.

1 Chronicles 16:17
And hath confirmed same to Jacob for a law, to Israel for an everlasting covenant,
---Trav on 8/18/10


ger.toshav, Why do you even go there? If you even read the Scriptures at all, if you really understand the Scriptures at all, you would know very well that Eternity is real and it is in the Bible. What difference does it make what word or expression is used as long as it is saying, implying and MEANING "Eternity". People play these semantic word games to avoid the Truth. The words "Everlasting" and "For ever and ever" are in the Scriptures, in the KJV...and they mean and refer to "Eternity", that is, "Time" without end.
---Gordon on 8/18/10


Y'all may be interested to know that the word Eternity does not appear in the New Testament, not even once...
---ger.toshav on 8/17/10


Jesus said the people condemned will go "into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels," in Matthew 25:41. To be in that fire, for all eternity . . . that is awful "way beyond how I can realize". Hebrews 12:29 says, "For our God is a consuming fire." So, God could be the fire. If this is true, the damnation is not the fire, but how people do not believe and trust God (John 3:19). And their own selfish nature makes them so they burn in fire that is good. I think of how Satan was in Heaven, itself, in such a perfect place of love with perfect circumstances to be such good influence, but he was not satisfied with Heaven, itself, because of how *he* was!
---Bill_bila5659 on 8/17/10


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Bob_Gilliland: "The Scriptures teach that they will suffer pain and torment for eternity."

Use a little common sense, Bob. Would a loving God torture people for eternity in the new heaven and the new earth? Search your soul for the answer as you speak to the Holy Ghost.

What you are trying to do is defining what is written 2000 years ago using today's English standards. The bible is surely literal and yet it is not. The words and phrases written by the Jews are both literal and metaphorical.
---Steveng on 8/17/10


Steveng - HEBREWS 9,27 And as it appointed unto once to die, but after this the judgement.( I think this verse conflicts with what your saying, I'am getting after a person dies the judgment immediate.
---RICHARD on 8/16/10


If you will follow the teachings of Scriptures as in Luke 16, Romans 6:23a, and many others, you will see that the eternal death is eternal separation from God, but not from experiencing pain and suffering. The final portion in Revelation 20:12 - 15 tells us that those not found written in the Lamb's Book of Life will be cast into the Lake of Fire. The Scriptures teach that they will suffer pain and torment for eternity.
---Bob_Gilliland on 8/16/10


RICHARD: "IF ANYBODY can find were a unsave person has life after death in the BIBLE Please post it,I can't find it,and you can't use LUKE 23 - 25 thats a parable."

You're looking at the trees instead of the forest.

There is to be a new heaven and a new earth. Those who are in Christ shall rise at the first resurrection and populate the Kingdom of God. These are the saved in Christ and shall not see the second death.

The second resurrection is to be at the end of the thousand year reign of Christ when all others who have died will be brought back to life and judged from the Book of Life according to their works - some to everlasting life and some to everlasting death.
---Steveng on 8/16/10


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Richard, my understanding is that ultimately there will be no unsaved people. John.12:32, 1.Tim.4:10
---ger.toshav on 8/16/10


IF ANYBODY can find were a unsave person has life after death in the BIBLE Please post it,I can't find it,and you can't use LUKE 23 - 25 thats a parable.
---RICHARD on 8/16/10


Sorry to say, David8318, either you still have ALOT to learn about GOD, or, the "God" you believe in is not the GOD of the Holy Bible. GOD is angry with the wicked every day, the Scriptures say. YAHUSHUA (JESUS) says in Mark 9:43-48 emphatically declares that Hell is a place where is "the fire that shall never be quenched." And He says in John 3:36b "...he that believeth not the Son shall not see Life, but, the Wrath of GOD abideth (remains) on him." Revelation 20:15: "And WHOSOEVER was not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the Lake of Fire." There is no Scripture to indicate that the lake of Fire is not really a Lake of Fire. GOD means a real Fiery Lake.
---Gordon on 8/16/10


Ger, people dont go to hell for their sins. They go to hell for rejecting Gods son who bore their sins and died in their place. Just what else can God do to show us His love besides suffer OUR fate for us. Only a prideful evil heart would reject that precious act of Gods eternal love for the ungodly.

If we reject Gods mercy and grace as sinners what is left to receive but his wrath?

Dont be so quick to judge who is in heaven and who is in hell. We dont know what goes on in the heart of people in the final moments of their life. I think we might be surprised by what we find out later on. Some of the most esteemed Christian leaders in the world could be fakes and never truly believed.

Matthew 7:22,23
---JackB on 8/16/10


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And Ger, God loves you far more than your parents ever did. You can rest assured in that.
---JackB on 8/16/10


Certain Christians have told me that my father and mother will burn in hell forever because they never were Christians. Growing up with them, I'm pretty sure they knew very little about Christianity. If this is what God has in store for the people who loved me and raised me, I'd have a great deal of difficulty loving such a God.
---ger.toshav on 8/15/10


steveng,

i honestly do not know what you beliefs are. i believe that Jesus Christ of approximately 2000 years ago was begotten in the flesh by His Father, died, and resurrected to overcome the the curse of death that man put on himself. I was referring to His victory over death. Now, we are just separating wheat from chaff. Satan knows his days are limited.

his lie that we must die has been overcome if we believe in Jesus Christ.
---aka on 8/15/10


geraldine 3/3 Humanity or torture depends on what side of the tracks do you live on? It is better to live on the side of the judges. I work in a group that serves children that are abused, starved, and neglected.

All of this is permitted to continue in our criminal justice courts in the US.

In this life, humans will always be "humane" and the courts will be "just" . And, I thank God for His Son that rose above and His justice instead our version of humanity.
---aka on 8/15/10


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aka: As you describe, there is much pain and much torture in the world, but the nations that make it part of their "legal" system are uncivilized in many other ways that place little value on human life. And God is not putting a gold star by any of it, either here or in the hereafter. Human beings who can feel Love can feel God, because "God is Love."
---Geraldine on 8/15/10


Romans 14:9 For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.
Matthew 22:32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.
Matthew 8:22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me, and let the dead bury their dead.
Revelation 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God, and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is [the book] of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works
Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
---micha9344 on 8/15/10


//When Israel did sacrifice children (not just babies)[no kidding] in the Valley of Hinnom, Jeremiah 7:31 tells us that the practice of burning them in fire was something God said, "I had not commanded, and that had not come up into my heart."//

So, God was not concerned about child sacrifice, he was concerned with how they are disposed of.
---aka on 8/15/10


aka: "Geraldine, 1/2) in no way can Satan win. He has already been defeated many years ago."

On the contrary, Satan has not been defeated as of yet. He will be at the second coming of Christ and then he will be let loose at the end of the thousand years after that (for a short while). He is defeated when all is fulfilled til the end of Revelation.
---Steveng on 8/15/10


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Let's reason this out. God is a loving God and, of course, a just God. Would he create a place that would torture people for eternally? God forbid.

Blessed are those who are resurrected at the first resurrection for they shall not see the second death.

Those who rise at the second resurrection shall be judged from the Book of Life according to their works - some to everlasting life on earth, some to everlasting death.

Most of you will not make it at the first resurrection so I strongly suggest you put your faith to work for the Lord.
---Steveng on 8/15/10


-- AKA :

Brother, I've never seen or heard the word 'ge-enna' in scriptures, so I cannot tell you its reference of implications... but Brother Gordon has well shared the implications of the word hell in references to what really is eternal damnation!!!

Hell is the temporary place of punishment to which the Damned go immediately when they die. The Lake of Fire is what is actually the place where the Lost experience eternal damnation. Hell in relation to the Lake of Fire is exactly like what Death Row is to the final day of Execution for the criminal. Both places are horrific beyond full comprehension, but, the Lake of Fire is the worst of the two. If for no other reason than because it will last FOREVER.---Gordon on 8/14/10
---Shawn.M.T. on 8/15/10


There are some who's in hell and don't know that it's hell because they were never taught about hell.
---catherine on 8/15/10


Never sugarcoat hell. It is literal fire. And I can promise you that it will not be a Sunday school picnic. I wish that someone would produce to me these original texts. These men have done a wonder job over the years in preserving the word of God in it's entirety. Take no comfort in your wonderful vain imaginations in what hell is like. It will be pure torment for the lost. HELL IS HELL, my friend. Ahh Jesus Ah. ++
---catherine on 8/15/10


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ISAIAH 26:14 THEY ARE DEAD,they shall not live,they are deceased, they shall not rise therefore hast thou visited and distroyed them,and made all their memory to perish.
PSALM 31:17 ------ let the wicked be ashamed,and let them be silent in the grave.
ECCLESIASTES 9:5 For the living know that they shall die, but the dead know not any thing neither have any more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten.
ROMANS 9:27 For the wages of sin is death.-----
---RICHARD on 8/15/10


Geraldine, 2/3) You must live in the US or some "civilized" society and are not aware of the other 3/4 of the world. However, while in the US: Visit an elderly home not of rich people. Humanity or torture?

Visit a prisoner when he/she is being put to death by electrocution or lethal injection. The reality of those methods might change your mind about our courts and humanity. Isn't how long a person has to spend on death row before that person is killed torture itself?

Have you ever witnessed a partial birth abortion? Humane?

What about social/economical stratification? Humanity or torture depends...
---aka on 8/15/10


Hell as a place of eternal fire and damnation is not a Bible teaching.

'Gehenna' was used by Jesus illustratively. Nothing conscious was thrown there. Anything that was thrown there would never be seen again.

When Israel did sacrifice children (not just babies) in the Valley of Hinnom, Jeremiah 7:31 tells us that the practice of burning them in fire was something God said, "I had not commanded, and that had not come up into my heart."

Jehovah, the God of Love has not commanded people to burn in fire, neither is it in his heart to do such a grotesque thing.

At death, a sinner is acquitted of his sin. Romans 6:7, 'For he who has died has been acquitted from his sin.'
---David8318 on 8/15/10


The word Hell is not in the original scriptures. It is an English word added by our translators which has taken on a new meaning for many.
---obewan on 8/14/10

Nice research. The word Gentile is not either....and falls into your descriptive category.
---Trav on 8/15/10


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The word Hell is not in the original scriptures. It is an English word added by our translators which has taken on a new meaning for many.

The original texts use several different words for the place of supposed eternal punishment and make reference to Hades and several other places of punishment common to myths and other ancient religions. Christianity has borrowed these traditions.

I really take Hell to be a place of eternal seperation from God, and knowing that one is apart from a holy God will be torment enough.
---obewan on 8/14/10


Aka.. "Gehenna" or "Gehenna of fire" was a name originally given the valley of Hinnom, south of Jerusalem, where dead animals, filth, and the refuse of the city were cast and burned by a fire kept burning until all therein was consumed.
Symbolically referencing the future destruction of the wicked, and implies that "the day will come, that shall burn as an oven, and all the proud, yes, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: [for that day] shall burn them [so completely], says the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch. When the whirlwind passes by, the wicked is no more, But the righteous has an everlasting foundation."
---Josef on 8/15/10


Geraldine, 1/2) in no way can Satan win. He has already been defeated many years ago. Now, whether a form of eternal separation causes displeasure to us, "humanity" does not move God. It is ironic that we humans easily accept eternal life, but will not accept eternal separation.
---aka on 8/15/10


Geraldine, amen to that, and God bless you for saying it. :-)
---ger.toshav on 8/14/10


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1. If part of God's created humanity spends eternity being tortured because during the life they did not choose to be born into they did not accept Christ, then Satan wins. 2. Humanity's criminal justice systems forbid torture, so are we more humane than God?
---Geraldine on 8/14/10


Well, I am doing Gordon's: With the exception of James 3:6, it is used only by Jesus. Hell, is a place of eternal punishment. The book of revelation describes hell as a lake of fire burning with brimstone [Rev. 19:20, 14-15, and there are other Scripruees.....The final judgment---the ultimate separation of good and evil at the end of history. The precise time of the judgment is appointed by God, but it remains unknown to us [Matt. 24:36, Acts 17:31]. God Himself is the judge of mankind and that He has the power and wisdom to judge with righteousness and truth, and justice [Ps. 96:13]. God's people are associated with Christ in the exercise of this judgment [1 Corin. 6:2-3 and Rev. 20:4].
---catherine on 8/14/10


Hell is the temporary place of punishment to which the Damned go immediately when they die. The Lake of Fire is what is actually the place where the Lost experience eternal damnation. Hell in relation to the Lake of Fire is exactly like what Death Row is to the final day of Execution for the criminal. Both places are horrific beyond full comprehension, but, the Lake of Fire is the worst of the two. If for no other reason than because it will last FOREVER. "Gehenna" refers to the Lake of Fire.
---Gordon on 8/14/10


Any chastisement from God is meant to be corrective and restorative. His anger lasts for a moment, but his mercy endures forever.
---ger.toshav on 8/13/10


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Ge Hinnom was a valley outside Jerusalem where infants were sacrficed once upon a time (aka Tophet).

It became the garbage dump of Jerusalem, where fires consuming the refuse burned continually.
---Cluny on 8/13/10


Hell is death/sleep. there is no eternal buring hell. they use symbolic meanings to explain them. in that day the jews had a dump where dead corpses would go, a burning pit where the bodies would burn & turn to dust, but like every fire, it does die down into smoulders. When God destroys the wicked in the end he does it forever, NOT eternally hanging on. that means there is no more like dust disappering in the wind so will the wickedness(using example).
---candice on 8/13/10


Scripture says that death & hell were cast into the lake of fire. The lake of fire Is the eternal & ever lasting torment.
---Lawrence on 8/13/10


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