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Apostle Paul's Gospel

Did Christ and the Apostle Paul teach the same gospel? If they did not preach the same gospel, what are the differences?

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 ---trey on 11/17/10
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//Don't you find it a bit strange Jack, that what I teach is completely supported by the Author of Salvation in the Gospels, and what you teach is not supported by the Gospels?
How do you explain that?
---David on 11/22/10//

Bad interpretation?
---JackB on 11/23/10


joseph-In agreement with your full post- and others who agree.




////Paul Himself said "I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation..in mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God...I have fully preached the gospel of Christ." Rom 1:16>Rom 15:19
---joseph on 11/20/10///

Amen.
---char on 11/23/10


michael_e, just one question here.

How do you see Luke 22:18-20 with 1st Corinthians 10:16.

You say in the gospels Jesus death and resurrection was NEVER mentioned or that any of the Gospel message in the 4 gospels do not apply to US? Did someone fail to let Paul know that, or was Paul confused?
---kathr4453 on 11/23/10


Question: Did Christ in His earthly ministry ever mention the gospel of grace or the boC?

Answer: Gospel John 1:14 "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth." 15 "John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me." 16 "And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace." 17 "For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ."
---christan on 11/22/10


michael_e, I've already answered your questions. Do you hope that I will give you a diferent answer? So you say After Jesus shed His blood, He taught the 12 that they were still under the law? But wait, wasn't the New Covenant with the promise of the SPIRIT?michael-e Im done here.
---kathr4453 on 11/22/10




The Church is the Body of Christ.

1 Cor 12:26 "And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it, or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it." 27 "Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular."

Ephesians 5:29 "For no man ever yet hated his own flesh, but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:" 30 "For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones."

Colossians 1:24 "Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church."
---christan on 11/22/10


//Did the Apostles say after He rose....GEE, you rose again...what's up with that?//
Kath4453.. If they had of known don't you think they would have been at the tomb, instead of running to it?

If Jesus taught the 12 that they were not under law, they must have been asleep.
Acts 3:1 Acts 10:28 Acts 11:19

Did Christ in His earthly ministry ever mention the gospel of grace or the boC?

Why do Peter, James, John, Jude or the writer of Hebrews never mention the Church The boC?
---michael_e on 11/22/10


You're either really confused or a wolf in sheep's clothing, David. Which is it?
---JackB on 11/22/10

Jack
I guess to you, I am both.

Don't you find it a bit strange Jack, that what I teach is completely supported by the Author of Salvation in the Gospels, and what you teach is not supported by the Gospels?
How do you explain that?
---David on 11/22/10


Does it really matter "who" wrote the book of Hebrews or any of the sixty books in the Holy Bible? What matters is -

"But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them, And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works."
2 Timothy 3:14-17

It's the Holy Spirit who wrote the Word of God. Amen.
---christan on 11/22/10


michael_e, Hebrews 12 CLEARLY teach the CHURCH, "The Church of the first born.

Jesus was born UNDER the Law to deliver them who were under the Law. Do you think Jesus was re-iterating the LAW those 40 days? The Blood of bulls and goaats still in effect after Jesus rose?

Did the Apostles say after He rose....GEE, you rose again...what's up with that?

Didn't He teach them to go and wait for the promise of the Holy Spirit...never promised with law keeping. Didn't he teach them he was the First born from the dead? I believe so!
---kathr4453 on 11/22/10




// But michael_e, if you insist Paul wrote Hebrews, then why are you saying these jews saved at Pentecost are not the church//
Kathr4453
Where did I insist paul wrote Hebrews?

What do YOU think Jesus was teaching in that 40 days?

Did Christ in His earthly ministry ever mention the gospel of grace or the boC?

Was Jesus born under Law, live under Law and die under Law?

Why do Peter, James, John, Jude or the writer of Hebrews never mention the Church The boC?
---michael_e on 11/22/10


The covenant of the law does not affect the covenant of promise.
---JackB on 11/22/10

Absolutely Jackb.

So to Donna66 and michael_e here is a question. If you want Paul to be the author of Hebrews, that's great. Here's why. Paul's Gospel, based on Hebrews clearly state that Gospel is after the pattern of things in Heaven.

GOD SWORE to Abraham, meaning God's word is what is sovereign, and His Promises are what is sovereign. God never swore to Abraham any such thing about electing only certain people. God never showed in the Tabernacle any type of election....God never came out of the Holy of Holies, snatching only certain Jews turning them over and instructing the High Priest to atone for ONLY THEIR SIN.
---kathr4453 on 11/22/10


Galatians 3:15


Brethren, I speak after the manner of men, Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto.

Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many, but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.


The covenant of the law does not affect the covenant of promise.
---JackB on 11/22/10


2nd Timothy 4. Paul states he knows his time is at hand, he knows he is going to die. No one was there but Luke at his first court date.

No where does he state that he plans to leave with Timothy.

Now look at Hebrews 13:23. This person is stating Timothy has been released,( no indication of that when Paul wrote to Timothy in 2nd Timothy) and will come to that person who authored Hebrews and go with Timothy to come to them.

Where in Paul's LAST letter did he ever indicate he would be set free? Where in Hebrews 13:23 is there any indication that person was held prisoner?

Two different people. But michael_e, if you insist Paul wrote Hebrews, then why are you saying these jews saved at Pentecost are not the church?
---kathr4453 on 11/22/10


//michael_e, NO WHERE did Peter himself say he didn't understand what Paul taught.//
---kathr4453 you are right he said Paul's
epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things Hard to be understood.

What do YOU think Jesus was teaching in that 40 days?

Did Christ in His earthly ministry ever mention the gospel of grace or the boC?

Was Jesus born under Law, live under Law and die under Law?
---michael_e on 11/22/10


michael_e, NO WHERE did Peter himself say he didn't understand what Paul taught. Peter is WARNING those who wrestle with Pauls teaching teh consequences. If they were teaching two different gospels, Peter would not be warning HIS SEPARATE saved group of teh consequences of what Paul was saying. KEEP reading what Peter said michael_e. You keep using that verse to try to PROVE they were on different paths. Just the opposite.

I've statd here a clear reason why I as well as other very good Bible teachers, that Hebrews was not written by Paull. It was writtenn to JEWS after the temple was destroyed after Paul died in a ROMAN prision.
And no where like all his other epistles does it begin "PAUL, a servant....
---kathr4453 on 11/22/10


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Romans says the law of the spirit of life has made us free from the law of sin and death.
Nobody can keep the fiery law that God gave Moses.
Only Jesus could.
That law made all guilty before God.
All we can do is our best that we have faith coupled with works for a just weight and an equal balance in which the Lord delights.
Paul wrote the Jews sought the Lord but not by faith. There is to be faith with works.
---Frank on 11/22/10


//michael_e, I actually don't see any questions you have asked that I HAVEN'T answered.//
kathr4453, just a few you HAVEN'T answered

You say
//Hebrews was not written by Paul//
//Hebrews was written about a year after Paul died.//
How do you know?

Peter said Paul's teaching was hard to understand, if he had already heard it, why was it hard to understand?

What do YOU think Jesus was teaching in that 40 days?

Did Christ in His earthly ministry ever mention the gospel of grace or the boC?

Was Jesus born under Law, live under Law and die under Law?
---michael_e on 11/22/10


//Note:
The Bible also says it will be those who keep the Law that will be justified.
(Romans 2:13)
"For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified."//

You're either really confused or a wolf in sheep's clothing, David. Which is it?

Keep reading...

Romans 3:19,20

Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

Therefore
(because of what he said in verse 19)by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin
---JackB on 11/22/10


David, Paul CONCLUDES in Romans 4 and 5 that Justification is by faith ALONE. The Blood of bulls and goats in the OLD never justified anyone. However in the New, it's the Blood of Jesus that Justifies,. WE are justified by HIS BLOOD, and SAVED by His life, Homer.

Don't be what is called verse snatchers..those who take ONE VERSE and build their case. These are called lazy lawyers who cut out their degree from mad magazine.

An excellent attorney LOOKS AT ALL the evidence,and is able to rightly divide the word of truth!
---kathr4453 on 11/22/10


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donna66, NO ONE knows who wrote Hebrew. It was written after Paul died, about a year later.

second, as to my imagination.

If you study OT, and can actually SEE the picture God drew of the pattern of things in heaven, ( the Tarnacle) clearly shows God did not bust through draging anyone in FIRST and then turning anyone over to the High Priest, the way you and MarkV claim happens. You re teaching a false Gospel not founded on scripture.

The Holy Spirit works within the Body of Christ preaching the Gospel to the Lost pointing to Christ who's own blood opened the way for man to be reconciledd back to God.

We have been given the minitry of reconcilliation!! BE reconciled TO GOD is preached to the lost!

---kathr4453 on 11/22/10


Are we Justified and then saved, or if we even need to be justified to be saved?
---Homer on 11/20/10

(Titus 3:7)
That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Homer
I hope this verse answers your question.
Paul clearly says that we must be justified if we are to have Eternal Life.
So the answer is Yes, you must be justified to be saved.

Note:
The Bible also says it will be those who keep the Law that will be justified.
(Romans 2:13)
"For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified."


---David on 11/21/10


When the CHURCH is raptured out, then that mystery given to Paul be fulfilled.

michael_e, I actually don't see any questions you have asked that I HAVEN'T answered. But if you are not going to LISTEN and compare scripture to scripture, you will never see that teh Gospel of JOHN is different than that of Matthew. Matthew is Kingdom LAW, not Mosaec Law, and not GRACE.

There are no Kingdom LAW teachings in John.

Kingdom LAW state, cut off hand or poke out eye to enter kingdom. GRACE states no such thing to enter. It only tells me you really don't understand GRACE to begin with if you can't see GRACE teaching in John!Paul taught GRACE plus nothing! Grace is the finished work of Christ's death and resurrection at work IN US!
---kathr4453 on 11/21/10


kath--//Hebrews was not written by Paul//. Then who DID write Hebrews? Just curious..How do you know?
---Donna66 on 11/21/10


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kath--//Hebrews was not written by Paul//. Then who DID write Hebrews? Just curious..How do you know?
---Donna66 on 11/21/10


Did Paul imagine a trumped up vision of Jesus on the road to Damascus, of course not. Because of the vision which Paul had received, well, now, this automatically made Paul an apostle for the Lord Jesus Christ+
---catherine on 11/21/10


Cluny, This should be an easy one for you:
Name the prophecies of Paul that have come to fruition!
---1st_cliff on 11/21/10


//What you are following is called HYPER dispensationalism...just as dangerous as HYPER Calvinism...both false teachings!!
---kathr4453 on 11/21/10//

Seems like you are full of accusations and very few answers.
I've asked you several questions, that either you can't or won't answer, it is not a sin to say "I don't know"

//Hebrews was not written by Paul//
Prove this.
And be careful of a blenderized gospel, that also is very dangerous.
---michael_e on 11/21/10


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michael_e, again Hebrews was not written by Paul, however the whole book of Hebrews is about Jesus death and resurrection and our FAITH now in His death and resurrection based on better promises. Do you still think Hebrews was about the earthly Kingdom, when Heb 10 state, THROUGH the veil, that is to say His Flesh, and NEW and LIVING WAY. That IS John 6...and that is why those turned AWAY! It means CRUCIFIED with Christ.

What you are following is called HYPER dispensationalism...just as dangerous as HYPER Calvinism...both false teachings!!
---kathr4453 on 11/21/10


// ---kathr4453 on 11/21/10 Everthing Paul preached IS IN JOHN! John 15...you can't ABIDE IN CHRIST unless you are IN CHRIST!! // You can't be IN CHRIST and HE IN YOU unless you undeerstand the Mystery Paul preached//

I agree with the second part of your statement, but it isn't mentioned in Matt through Jn.

Peter said Paul's teaching was hard to understand, if he had already heard it why was it hard to understand?

All you have to read is what Peter offered to the Nation of Israel in Acts 2 and 3 to understand what Christ taught prior to His ascension.
Rom 15:8 is very clear.
---michael_e on 11/21/10


Cluny, It means that "eye witnesses " are credible, 2nd hand info may not be (not valid in court)
When none of the "eye witnesses" back up the here-say witnesses, there's room for suspect SI/no?
What constitutes a "sacred author"? one whom the consensus declared "inspired"?
What information do you have that gives the committee the authority to declare any writing "inspired"
After much deliberation they agreed that they "thought" it to be!

---1st_cliff on 11/21/10


michael_e,

If you actually believe Jesus was teaching the Kingdom restored to Israel to His Apostles after he rose but before ascendinng, then why would Peter ask, right before Jesus ascended" Are you AT THIS TIME going to restore the Kingdom to Israel, Jesus reply, No, only the Father knows when that will happen, tells me that that is NOT what was discussed for 40 days. Then if you say they went ahead and preached it anyway, would tell me they completely DISOBEYED.

Everthing Paul preached IS IN JOHN! John 15...you can't ABIDE IN CHRIST unless you are IN CHRIST!! You can't be IN CHRIST and HE IN YOU unless you undeerstand the Mystery Paul preached.
---kathr4453 on 11/21/10


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Matt 16:21

From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he MUST go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day

His death and resurrection had a purpose...


This Paul stuff is getting ridiculous. HOw can you people rip apart the word of God like this and still dare to call yourself Christians?
---JackB on 11/20/10


The blog question seems to sense something different between Jesus' and Paul's gospel messsages. It appears from Paul's own writings that God has used Paul as a vessel to deliver some hidden mysteries unlike before (that even Jesus didn't teach). This is specifically with reference to the gentile inclusion. God operates a certain plan for reasons best known to him. It doesn't mean we are looking down on Jesus or his ministry or teaching as insufficient. However their messages are not different. Paul's inspired messages are from God and explain the detailed theology behind gospel doctrines. It builds on earlier truths. It's like NT giving the meaning of OT. Hence both Jesus and Paul speak the same Gospel.
---hop on 11/20/10


To those who deny that Christ and Paul's Gospel are one - "Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away. For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts, Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth." (2 Tim 3:5-7)

"But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness." (2 Tim 3:13,16)
---christan on 11/21/10


//What exactly do you think Jesus was teaching in those 40 days?
---kathr4453 on 11/20/10 //
I can't find the death, burial and resurrection mentioned in Jn 6 can you?

He was teaching what Peter preached to the Nation of Israel Acts 2:36-38 Acts 3:19

What do you thinking He was teaching?
---michael_e on 11/20/10


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"...I am not ashamed of the gospel of [Jesus] Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to everyone that believe...therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith:as it is written, the just shall live by faith" (Romans 1:16-17, the Apostle Paul)
---Leon on 11/20/10


Why cant people just post under their real names....---JackB on 11/20/10

when i first started posting, i posted under my real name, then i noticed that there were some answers that I did not give under joseph. So i tried Joseph. same thing. the, it was aka_joseph, aka.joseph, then finally aka.

if my name were Max and that is what i posted, would it matter? how many here will you ever meet? how does the use of josephn make it any more honest than aka. JosephN does not narrow it down anyway.

the HS knows and we will account for every idle word whether spoken or written.
---aka on 11/20/10


\\Both Luke and Paul said "Jesus said "Keep doing this.." Neither one was there or even met Jesus ..who thought up this ritual of continuing "Communion"????
---1st_cliff on 11/20/10\\

How many times does the Bible have to say something in order for it to be true, 1st_cliff?

And does WHICH one of the sacred authors recorded something actually mean that some things are more weighty or credible than others?
---Cluny on 11/20/10


//To disassociate Jesus from Paul is truly a disservice to the Christian faith. it was the Spirit of Christ that worked thru Paul to teach what we believe in today.
---leej on 11/20/10//

I don't believe I have done any disservice to Christains and I couldn't agree more that the acended Christ worked through Paul.
What I said was the Jeus in His earthly ministry, never mentioned the mystery program that He was going to reveal to us through Paul. I know Paul didn't dream it up himself.

---michael_e on 11/20/10


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michael //Christ preached the kingdom is at hand, and never mentioned the boC, or the necessity of belief in his death , burial and resurrection for salvation (1Cor 15:1-4)

Christians who recognize that Bible as being he very words of God, would tell you that it was the Spirit of Christ that worked thru Paul to teach what we believe in today.

To disassociate Jesus from Paul is truly a disservice to the Christian faith.
---leej on 11/20/10


Kathr4453, Luke was not an "eye witness" no evidence of his ever meeting Jesus! Luke 1.2. says he got the information 2nd hand!
"Thou wilt not LEAVE HIS SOUL IN HELL" (the grave) and he wasn't, He was resurrected on the 3rd day!

Kathrine, if He was "immortal" He couldn't have died for you and me!
God does not resurrect someone who is "alive"
---1st_cliff on 11/20/10


I just read what Barb said on the 19th,
(Paul taught that salvation is a gift given to us by the death of Jesus on the cross. He teaches salvation by grace and justification thru faith. Gal 2:16.
---barb on 11/19/10)

Can someone tell me if we are saved before we are justified or are we Justified and then saved, or if we even need to be justified to be saved?
---Homer on 11/20/10


michael_e, yes Jesus did..John 6...those who eat my flesh and drink my blood....meaning His death and resurrection.

After Jesus rose He spent 40 days. Thomas wouldn't believe Jesus rose unless he saw him first...jesus said..blessed are those who don't see but believe.

What exactly do you think Jesus was teaching in those 40 days?
---kathr4453 on 11/20/10


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//What exactly do you think John 3:16 means?//
Isa 9:6 For unto us(Israel) a child is born, unto us a son is given:..

Matt. 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Matt. 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Where would have you have been at this time under these circumstances?(Eph. 2:12)

//Did Paul preach something different?//
Christ preached the kingdom is at hand, and never mentioned the boC, or the necessity of belief in his death , burial and resurrection for salvation (1Cor 15:1-4)
---michael_e on 11/20/10


1st Cliff. For Luke to write one of the Gospels Luke would have to be a first hand witness. Paul did not CONVERT Luke, but got him to go with him. Since Paul was not a firsthand witness when Jesus was on earth, proves Paul did not teach Luke anything about those days.To answer your other statement: Immortality of the soul...

OT, Davis fortells of Jesus death and resurrection...Thou will not LEAVE His SOUL in Hell.
---kathr4453 on 11/20/10


JackB,
I do use my real name.
It's called honesty, not fearing being hated for your views and trusting Christ.
More should do that.
Frank
---Frank on 11/20/10


Why cant people just post under their real names....
---JackB on 11/20/10


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I see no difference. Paul certainly suffered greatly for the gospel of Jesus Christ. Paul wrote 2/3 of the N.T. sitting behind prison walls. He was chosen by guess who, Jesus Christ, Himself. I am sure that when you study Scriptures you will find that Paul preached true messages of the cross, Blood, and Jesus' resurrection. No doubt. You people are too, doubters. You need to get saved of course, and then you can study, and then you might know something. Hallelujah+
---catherine on 11/20/10


Maybe some of you Paulites can answer this question=
Every denomination in Christendom has some form of "communion" .
At the last supper all the Apostles attended including the bible writers Matthew,John, Peter, James and Jude. Not one of them quoted Jesus as saying "Keep doing this..."
Both Luke and Paul said "Jesus said "Keep doing this.." Neither one was there or even met Jesus ..who thought up this ritual of continuing "Communion"????
---1st_cliff on 11/20/10


michael_e, I'm a little shocked at your question. What exactly do yoy think John 3:16 means? You think God gave Jesus to be King right then and there If Israel believed Jeses as their King, God would have THEN given ISRAEL ALONE everlasting /eternal life? Maybe you forgot John the Baptist also announced BEHOLD the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. EXPLAINED in Hebrews 10.

It's not that you believe in a death/resurrection, So was Lazarus. It's what you believed the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ involved. Hebrews 10! And that you believe Through God's Gift of Giving His Only Begotten Son to DIE FOR YOUR SIN,(the Lamb of GOD) YOU have eternal life.

Did Paul preach something different?
---kathr4453 on 11/20/10


There is only one Gospel taught in scripture, the Gospel of Jesus, The Christ. The Gospel of The Anointed One and His Anointing, the burden removing, yoke destroying Power of God that has been delivered to man, to be expressed through man, to give insight into the Kingdom of God and Heaven.
Paul was individually chosen for that purpose, The Lord Himself said unto Ananias "He is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles and kings, and the children of Israel:" Act 9:15
Paul Himself said "I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation..in mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God...I have fully preached the gospel of Christ." Rom 1:16>Rom 15:19
---joseph on 11/20/10


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Jesus taught that you cannot even see the Kingdom of God until you are born of the Holy Spirit. John 3: 3-8.

Paul taught that salvation is a gift given to us by the death of Jesus on the cross. He teaches salvation by grace and justification thru faith. Gal 2:16.

Did Jesus come to earth to die on the cross for our sins or did He come here to tell us the truth? John 18:37 "for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth, EVERYONE THAT IS OF THE TRUTH (my sheep) HEARS MY VOICE. Which voice are you going to follow Paul's or Jesus'? Read Jesus' prayer for his disciples in John 17.
---barb on 11/19/10


//John 3:16, GOD GIVING JESUS UPON A CROSS TO DIE FOR OUR SIN.//---kathr4453

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Kath443 which verse is John 3:16?
---michael_e on 11/19/10


Kathra4453, Guess what? the scripture you cited was by Luke (Paul's convert) quoting Christ ,whom he never met and no one else backs up the (parable?) of the Rich man and Lazarus!(perhaps it was Greek mythology since Luke was a Greek gentile??)
Also "truly I tell you today","(comma) you will be with me in paradise. (the tomb is a long way from paradise)
Doesn't any one here think for themselves???
---1st_cliff on 11/19/10


1st cliffs, Christ certainly DID preach immortality of the soul. Have you read the account by JESUS concerning Abraham's bosom, and Lazarus, etc?

To say otherwise is to teach reincarnation, that is if you believe the soul perishes at death and is re-created/re-incarnated again for either eternal life or Judgment.

Today you will be with me in Paradise is another place!
---kathr4453 on 11/19/10


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Peter having denied Christ 3 times was not stable so it's not surprising that Paul ,with his charisma, could win over Peter and the others. Peter did not write his epistle 'till 64 CE.
Excuse me Lawrence but Paul taught "Immortality of the soul" Christ did not! HUGE difference!
Paul instituted "churches" with Deacons,elders ,rules etc.the same hodgepodge of denominations we see today.
Christ did not!
No similarity!
---1st_cliff on 11/19/10


Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Where in Paul's epistles do you find this?
---michael_e on 11/19/10


Did Christ and the Apostle Paul teach the same gospel? If they did not preach the same gospel, what are the differences?

The simplest answer to the question is that it was the Spirit of Christ that taught the gospel thru Paul as well as others.

Php. 1:18 But what does it matter? The important thing is that in every way, whether from false motives or true, Christ is preached. And because of this I rejoice. Yes, and I will continue to rejoice, for I know that through your prayers and the help given by the Spirit of Jesus Christ, what has happened to me will turn out for my deliverance.
---leej on 11/19/10


//John 3:16,Is that what John 3:16 actually says?
---michael_e on 11/19/10

Yes michael_e, and Hebrews 10

5Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

6In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.

7Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.

---- 9Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.

10By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
---kathr4453 on 11/19/10


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Apostle Peter delivered Acts 2 v 38 to the Jewish people First on the day of Pentecost. The other Apostles received The Very Same & even Apostle Paul. Paul was chosen by God to deliver this Very Same Gospel to us gentiles.

Apostle Paul received The Very Same as Apostle Peter preached. Apostle Paul did not teach - preach - treach any diff.
---Lawrence on 11/19/10


---1st_cliff on 11/19/10God also allowed Joseph Smith to write the Book of Mormon and Mohamed to write the Quran, What's so "amazing" about that??//

What is so amazing, is that to your way of thinking there is no Word of God.
Do you beieve in the body of Christ?
---michael_e on 11/19/10


//---kathr4453
Jesus absolutely taught about His death and resurrection also stating I AM the resurrection//
Show me where he taught that belief in the death, burial and resurrection was necessary for salvation

//John 3:16, GOD GIVING JESUS UPON A CROSS TO DIE FOR OUR SIN.//
Is that what John 3:16 actually says?
---michael_e on 11/19/10


YES!

Of course there are those who don't understand and misapply Paul's writings:

2Pe 3:15,16 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation, even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you, As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
---jerry6593 on 11/19/10


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michael_e, God also allowed Joseph Smith to write the Book of Mormon and Mohamed to write the Quran, What's so "amazing" about that??
Because a "committee" decided to include Pauls writings in the NT,somehow makes it "inspired"
FYI there was much debate about who's script should be included,the Holy Spirit does not "debate"!
---1st_cliff on 11/19/10


michael_e, Jesus absolutely taught about His death and resurrection also stating I AM the resurrection.

The 4 Gospels have two Gospels, one is THE Gospel of the Kingdom, that is yet to come, promised to Israel at the second coming of Christ when the SON OF MAN comes..taught in Matthew.

Matthew is not the Gospel of GRACE. The Gospel of GRACE is in John. It begins with Jesus coming full of Grace and truth, and also John 3:16, GOD GIVING JESUS UPON A CROSS TO DIE FOR OUR SIN.
---kathr4453 on 11/18/10


Amazing, how Christ allowed paul to write a big part of the NT just on his erroneous thougts.

1st_cliff you should become a member of the body of Christ, oops, that's one of Pauls erroneous revelations, you wouldn't be interested.
---michael_e on 11/18/10


Christ preached future resurrection of the dead.
Paul preached immortality of the soul (absent from the body ..etc) a holdover from Pharisee-ism!
Christ's was truth, Paul's was not!
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what's going down!
Christ sent out evangelists 2 by 2
Paul set up "Churches"

The influence of the 13 books sways the unsuspecting, especially when you label it "inspired"!
Angel of light?
---1st_cliff on 11/18/10


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Paul taught that belief in the death, burial and resurrection was necessary for salvation(ref 1Cor 15:1-4

Christ in His earthly ministry,(since he hadn't died yet) taught "Repent for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand" (Ref Matt. 3:2)

Different, not the same.
---michael_e on 11/18/10


Trey asked a very good question.
Yes,there are differences in the gospel of Jesus and the gospel of Paul.
The great difference is the atonement doctrine based on Paul's gospel.
The sacond is forgiveness.
The third is predestination of man.
Paul clearly says ,"my gospel".
Paul's gospel set the stage for development of christianity.
Jesus's gospel did not teach Paul's beliefs and methods of salvation,forgiveness, predestination or christianity..
The christian church believes more of Paul's gospel than Jesus's gospel.This is a fact.
---earl on 11/18/10


The whole bible is One. The OT concealed the NT and the NT revealed the concealment of the OT, who was none other then the Lord Jesus Christ.

Paul's epistles were written for only the Christians (who were born of the Holy Spirit by grace), teaching them and today's Christian the covenants in the OT and to what and who it was pointing to. The revelations Paul received were from the Holy Spirit and there's no difference between the teachings of Christ and Paul's epistles.

The epistles indeed makes everything crystal clear to the Christian, of God's plan, His will and purpose. And they must all come to past regardless of the many rejections and blasphemies from mankind.
---christan on 11/18/10


Yes, Paul and Christ preached the same Gospel - the Kingdom of God, salvation through grace & faith, and repentance. The ONLY difference between the two is that Paul preached Christ cruified and ressurrected, and the Holy Spirit being poured out, where is Christ did not preach this since it had not yet happened.
---Leslie on 11/18/10


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There are great differences in Jesus's and Paul's ministry!
Here's just one=
Christ never spoke about nor taught "speaking in tongues".
This one time incident of Pentecost was sized upon by Paul who made rules and regulations regarding the continuation of this practice.
Glossolalia was common in pagan religions and a drawing card in recruiting converts who wanted to experience this phenomena.
This meaningless babble was touted to be the Holy Spirit in action!
It has no relationship to "seeking first the Kingdom"
---1st_cliff on 11/18/10


The Gospel is a multi-faceted subject, and mere humans, such as St. Paul, will naturally concentrate or emphasize only a few of them.

That's why we need each other--to keep each other in balance.

As it is written, "Heresy is truth in isolation."
---Cluny on 11/17/10


The Lord and the Apostle Paul taught and preached the same gospel.
The reason it appears different is from the use of man's teaching, the spirit of man and a carnal mind.
All of which are not the spiritual discernment in which the Holy Ghost rightly divides the word.
An example are root forms of words and what a word appears to mean.
The Lord said "temple" meaning his body.
The pharisees who knew Hebrew and the meaning of words better than any Gentile today didn't know the Lord spake of his body.
The word means what the Lord says and not man.
And that is revealed by the Holy Ghost and not man or his means.
---Frank on 11/18/10


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