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Avoiding Abominations

Is it critical for Christians today to avoid the "abominations" listed in Leviticus, Deutoronomy and Proverbs? If so, why?

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 ---AG on 12/13/10
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Romans 3:4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar, as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

Romans 3:5 But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? [Is] God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man)

Romans 3:6 God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?
---francis on 12/21/10


Everything we know about God tells us:
1: God never changes His laws
2: God is not prejudice or partial.
3: God has made no difference between Jew and Greek ( gentile)
---francis on 12/21/10

Well you might as well face some scripture now as never. He is partial. In Matthew, divides between Goats and Sheep. Partial, here is unarguable scripture.
Deuteronomy 7:6
For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.
Deut 14:2...same.
GOD is just and Righteous and it still works out to what he see fit to do. Get used to it now or later.
---Trav on 12/21/10


Francis //Everything we know about God tells us:
1: God never changes His laws
2: God is not prejudice or partial.
3: God has made no difference between Jew and Greek ( gentile)


If that is true, then please tell us WHY O'WHY did the Jerusalem council have to convene to decide if Gentile converts needed to be circumcised and observe the laws of Moses if the same laws given to the Jews applied to Gentile converts.

Could it be that your doctrine is faulty and follows Ellen White who really did not know too much about either the Bible or its Author? I would be surprised if can respond to this question.

THINK!!!!!!
---leej on 12/21/10


Some people deceive themseoves, and some are deceived by others.

Everything we know about God tells us:
1: God never changes His laws
2: God is not prejudice or partial.
3: God has made no difference between Jew and Greek ( gentile)

That alone should be enough to tell you that you shuld not eat anything unclean.
Even if you are not 100% sure about some scripture, you MUST be sure about the HOLINESS and RIGHTEOUSNESS of GOD
---francis on 12/21/10


And just what do you think "Kosher law" means?
--Cluny on 12/20/10
Kosher laws go beyond biblical laws.
Example:
1: Kosher law restricts grape products to jewish only. Not biblical.
2: Meat and dairy may not be served at the same time, or eaten together: Again not biblical
3: Meats and fish cannot be cooked together, not biblical.

There are many more non biblical laws included in kosher laws.

While Kosher law does include all biblical dietery laws, it goes beyond the bible.
---francis on 12/21/10




Jack sir, you said:
"Its obvious you have been persecuted a lot in life (and not necessarily as a Christian) and this doctrine is your chance to be on top."
It's obvious to me that you do not know the God of scripture, if you did, you would know that this doctrine puts God on top. Your doctrine is for man to be on top. I rejoice that God is in control of all things, you rejoice that He is defeated day and night by man, in fact sinful. You rejoice on the free will of man, his works, I rejoice in the Works of God, who drew me to Himself and put me in the Hands of Jesus Christ. I deserved nothing. You think you deserve something for your commitment. You and I have a very different view of God.
---Mark_V. on 12/21/10


MarkV, I'll take it one step further.

Pharaoh represents anti-christ and Egypt represent the world.

If you actually understood the book of Joshua, you just one day may get it.

Joshua tells then DO NOT LOOK BACK, just as we are told...do not look back on the things of this world.

Heb 11 say of Moses..he left teh RICHES of Egypt to SUFFER with the people of God finding the reproach of Christ FAR GREATER than to enjoy the pleasures of sin fora season.

The Lord never showed you that MarkV....Oh, that's a shame!
---kathr4453 on 12/21/10


His problem, however, seems to be that he insist others follow him in believing the Old Covenant laws are applicable to the Christian. However, he will not convince anyone that knows both the Bible and its Author.
---leej on 12/19/10

He doesn't have the problems you do sis. Seeking his answers from scripture. Rather than going against... he stands/seeks like a Berean. You seek commentaries...profess-her.
You, like katr stand on your own logic/reasoning and your preachers.
Romans 14:3
Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not, and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

His laws Heb 8:10 Are not seen in you.
---Trav on 12/21/10


//Does francis dare to eat a beef steak with blood in it?

If I recall there were a couple of farmers who lived near us that specialized in producting kosher meats. The steer would be hung from its hind legs with its throat cut so that nearly all the blood would drain out.

Francis, believing that he became a Jew upon conversion needs follow those OT laws that created kosher foods.

Too bad he does not have Acts 15 or Romans 14 in his bible.
---leej on 12/21/10


//You just didn't believe you were. If you did believe by faith, you would know you are one of the Elect.
//---MarkV

Sir I know my election is ONLY thru Jesus Christ because HE is Gods elect. He is the seed to whom the promise was made. I was never elect ***before*** coming to him.

I wouldnt dare deny Gods love for all mankind and his desire to save all men just to exalt myself above others.

Its obvious you have been persecuted a lot in life (and not necessarily as a Christian) and this doctrine is your chance to be on top.

One day youll let all that bitterness go and accept the fact that God loves the man who persecutes just as much as those who have been persecuted.
---JackB on 12/21/10




Leej, that was the same question I put to my sister who was a Jehovah Witness. They barbecued all the time. No possible way for them to get the blood out of a steak. Yet when she was sick, she refuse to take the blood that would possibly save her. Only God knows of course what would have happened if she had. If all J. Witnesses refused to eat meat altogether then they could stand on that principle. But they don't.
---Mark_V. on 12/21/10


Does francis dare to eat a beef steak with blood in it?

If not, then that is kosher.
---leej on 12/20/10


\\first of all KOSHER LAW is not BIBLICAL LAW.\\

And just what do you think "Kosher law" means?

Among other things, it means NOT eating pork or certain aquatic creatures forbidden in the Bible.

Your preaching "Thou shalt eat no pork" is nothing but proclaiming one of the kashuroth.
---Cluny on 12/20/10


Kathr, You make up things not in Scripture in order to believe what you do. Just take the last sentence you gave,

"Pharoah represents satan, and gentile arrogance who again hate Israel."

Nowhere does Scripture say that Pharoah represented satan. You made that up. Pharoah was present to us by God so that we could understand that God raise him to be who he was, for a purpose. So that all people in the earth like you and I, know that God is Sovereign, He raises kings and brings them down.
"For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth. "
But you didn't get it, not one piece of it.
---Mark_V. on 12/20/10


Kathr 2: It's an abomination to change the meaning of God's Word. You decide because of your prejudice that you will give it your own meaning. Paul said after Romans 9:17,
"You will say to me then, "why does He stil find fault?" So I say Kathr, "Who are you to reply against God? will the thing form (mankind) say to him (God) why have you made me like this? And God will reply, "Does not the Potter (God) have power over the clay, (mankind), from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?" You refuse to believe the Truth and decided to change it so that the Potter is not God, and you are not the clay, this way your theology will work, but you are wrong.
---Mark_V. on 12/20/10


leej, again it is an abomination to mis-represent salvation. YOU are not the CLAY in Romans 9. Never have been, never will be, no matter what all your books tell you.

That was ADDRESSED TO MOSES, under LAW, not the Church.

It was between Israel God's chosen elect vs Pharaoh and Pharaoh holding them in BONDAGE.


Pharoah represents satan, and gentile arrogance who again hate Israel.
---kathr4453 on 12/20/10


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---kathr4453 on 12/20/10
It is not possible to witness to me with a lie. I firmly believe in the UNCHANGING GOD.

I truely believe Jesus when he said:
Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven:

LEEJ witness is simple to get everyone to break ONE or more of the commandments of God, and teach others to do so.

Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
Hebrews 13:9 Be not carried about with divers and strange doctrines

LEEJ teaching are both strange and divers from the WORD OF GOD
---francis on 12/20/10


//while you arrogantly bash francis believing himself a Jew under OT , you are doing the exact same thing with your Romans 9 THEORY that YOU are the good clay.

Romans 9 which speaks of God being the Potter and we as the clay is NOT NOT NOT a theory or my interpretation. If you were to take the time to research the passage in any of the better commentaries, you would find that what I expouse is clearly the dominant interpretation.

As I stated before, we do not have to like it, but God being the Creator will do exactly what He desires with His creation.

While it is true that whosoever calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved, God did not intend to save everyone unto eternal life, only the elect.
---leej on 12/20/10


That is exactly what you have been doing in rejecting such beliefs as predestination and foreordination. That is easy to see from your comments on Romans 9 regarding the Potter (God) and the clay (humankind), your war is really against those who have the scriptural backing for what they believe.

---leej on 12/14/10

leej, while you arrogantly bash francis believing himself a Jew under OT , you are doing the exact same thing with your Romans 9 THEORY that YOU are the good clay.

That is why you will never be effective in witnessing to francis, untl YOU also repent of your believing yourself to be a JEW!
---kathr4453 on 12/20/10


Cluny on 12/19/10

first of all KOSHER LAW is not BIBLICAL LAW.

Second: The 70 went out not carrying any monny.
Luke 10:4 Carry neither purse, nor scrip, nor shoes: and salute no man by the way.

How would they eat?

They were to stay in ONE HOUSE, and eat all their meals from the same house, and not go from one house to another eating. That is what the text is saying. It is NOT saying eat unclean food, after all, they went out ONLY AMONG JEWS.

Luke 10:7 And in the same house remain, eating and drinking such things as they give: for the labourer is worthy of his hire. Go not from house to house.
God would provide for them! This may have to do with quantitee and quality, but surely NOT clean and unclean.
---francis on 12/19/10


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francis, then just WHY did Jesus tell His disciples to simply eat whatever they were served if He still insisted that they keep kosher?

You can practice Karite Judaism if you wish, but don't call it Christianity.
---Cluny on 12/19/10


We all need to realize Francis believes he is Jewish under the Old Covenant while the rest of us are New Covenant believers.

Having stated that, we believe in what Jesus taught, namely what goes into the stomach (via the mouth) is not what defiles (makes unclean) but what comes out of the heart. (Mark 7:18f).

If Francis wants to be different and boast in his religion by observing Old Covenant dietary laws and in the Jewish Sabbath, that is his right according to Romans 14.

His problem, however, seems to be that he insist others follow him in believing the Old Covenant laws are applicable to the Christian. However, he will not convince anyone that knows both the Bible and its Author.
---leej on 12/19/10


Cluny
Does that not seem very contradictory to you?

Maybe you should read more:
Matthew 15:20 These are [the things] which defile a man: but to eat with UNWASHEN hands defileth not a man.

The whole context is EATING WITH UNWASHED HANDS

Matthew 15:2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.

Mark 7:2 And when they saw some of his disciples eat bread with defiled, that is to say, with unwashen, hands, they found fault.

Mark 7:5 Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashen hands?
---francis on 12/19/10


What you're saying, francis, is that you cannot reply to what I said, because it goes against what you want to think.
---Cluny on 12/19/10
No, because it goes against what THE BIBLE, the UNCHANGING word of GOD says.
Leviticus 11:12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.

Leviticus 11:4 Nevertheless these shall ye not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that divide the hoof: is unclean unto you.

Isaiah 66:17 They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one [tree] in the midst, eating swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, saith the LORD.
---francis on 12/19/10


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Jesus also said that it is NOT what goes into people's mouths, such as food, that makes them unclean.
---Cluny on 12/19/10


I'll put this another way. There's obeying because you have to, and there's obeying because it brings you the greatest joy.

Take tithing for example, OT demands it. NT says give cheerfully. The point is God doesn't want grudged money or works done because one feels they have to. This doesn't honor him. The fact is he has given the freedom to not go to church, to not tithe, and to still be counted as one of his people.

He's done this because he knows the heart of man is wicked and desires genuine praise from his people, he desires Mercy/fellowship more then sacrifice, and he'll sacrifice everything, even his own son to get into it with you. It's possible to be distant while trying to draw near to him, the Pharisees proved that.
---Pharisee on 12/19/10


Donna66
The answer is yes, Just look at the TEXTS:
Romans 11:17 and with them( JEWS) partakest of the ROOT AND FATNESS of the olive tree,
Romans 15:27 the Gentiles have been made partakers of their SPIRITUAL THINGS

Ephesians 2:14 he is our peace, who hath made BOTH ONE.

Surely God did not make Jews become gentiles.

And Peter was teaching Gentiles to live as Jews:
Galatians 2:14 I said unto Peter If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?

and Peter never ate anything unclean: Peter gave ONE interpretation of that vision:

Acts 10:28 God hath shewed me that I should not call any man common or unclean.
---Francis on 12/18/10


\\---Cluny on 12/17/10
Are you kidding me?
Or are you kidding yourself?

That comment truely does not deserve any answers
---francis on 12/18/10\\

What do YOU think "eat those things that are set before you" means?

Do you think it means, "Don't eat pork or certain sea food if they serve it?"

What you're saying, francis, is that you cannot reply to what I said, because it goes against what you want to think.
---Cluny on 12/19/10


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Pharisee: Your logic escapes me. You are the only person who has ever tried to convince me that obedience is attained by disobeying. LOL!
---jerry6593 on 12/19/10


trev //had to change his "plan" of salvation...

I can only agree with you as salvation is in Christ alone. Howbeit, God deals with His Creation in terms of covenants. While He gave the law to the Jews, grace and truth came through Jesus Christ. John 1:17

You are correct in that under the old Mosaic Covanant given at Mt. Sinai, the law was our schoolmaster until we could be justified by faith in Christ.

What you and other see, however, is the demand of some that we observe law, and they imply that we do so for our salvation or as a result of our salvation.


Scripture is very explicit that the Christain walks by faith (Gal. 3:10, Romans 1:17), not by the law given at Mt. Sinai.
---leej on 12/18/10


Trey what you call heresy I call poorly selected words. However it is undeniable that formerly salvation was for Israel, and now the rest of the world is included. There is some change that took place so to label it total heresy is not wise. The fact is it was all one plan from the beginning but we see it historically in two parts. Change however is there as the covenant of old was solely with Israel, Jesus evidenced this with the Samaritan woman when he told her it's not right to take the children's bread and feed it to dogs. I know you cannot say that you don't know what I meant and I feel mincing words when a point was being made is somewhat counterproductive, unless of course your idea of productivity is to discredit and tear down.
---Pharisee on 12/18/10


When I hear people say that the Lord God Almighty, who declared the end from the beginning (Isa 46:10), who doesn't change (Mal 3:6), had to change his "plan" of salvation I am moved to address this statement. I have heard this heresy stated before from the pulpit, and it bothers me greatly. The Law was our Schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ (Gal 3:24)? The saints of old (children of God) have always believed in and looked for the Messiah (John 4:25, Heb. 11) God did not have to make multilple doors into heaven. He has one door, the Door (John 10:7).

If you do not agree, please pray and study, and come let us reason together.

Lord bless you all in your studies.
---trey on 12/18/10


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Jerry what you call trusting Jesus is the opposite of trusting Jesus. It's the very thing I'm trying to show you, that you're not trusting Jesus.

If your payment has been made to get you to heaven there's nothing you add or detract from it, "it is finished," as he stated.

In the Old Testament God told Israel that the Sabbath was a sign of their sanctification, but Jesus and the sign of Jonah is the sign of sanctification now and it's evidenced by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. Either his commandment keeping is yours or your still in your sins. That's the bottom line.
---Pharisee on 12/18/10


francis-- Do you really believe that the scripture about the "wild olive being grafted in" means Jewish in ALL respects. Should Christians be circumcised to please God? What about this:
Act 10:12-15...Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air. And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter, kill, and eat. But Peter said, Not so, Lord, for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.
And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
---Donna66 on 12/18/10


---Cluny on 12/17/10
Are you kidding me?
Or are you kidding yourself?

That comment truely does not deserve any answers
---francis on 12/18/10


\\..
To what extent do you believe Jesus should be our example?
---leej on 12/17/10
ALL THE WAY
---francis on 12/17/10 \\

Remember that when Jesus sent out His disciples two by two, He told them to eat whatever things they were served.

In other words, He wasn't overly concerned about other people keeping kosher.

Why are you, francis?
---Cluny on 12/17/10


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Sorry, but to follow the example of Jesus does not require us to become Jewish.
---leej on 12/17/10

YIKES.
Romans 11:17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree,

Romans 11:24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree:

Ephesians 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel,
Ephesians 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God,

seems jewish to me
---francis on 12/18/10


Pharisee: "YOU, I, Or ANYONE else who follows Jesus does not keep the commands of God."

Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Do you not believe that Jesus IS God?

I could trust you or I could trust Jesus. Tough decision!
---jerry6593 on 12/18/10


It is critical for Christians today to avoid abominations:

Paul, James, John, Peter all have a very clear list of Abominations in the NT.

If those are not followed one will certainly NOT enter the Kingdom of God,regardless of their delusional election theory, but rather end up taking the mark of the beast...no matter what day it is, or what you have eaten for dinner, or what/who your favorite GURU is. They can't save you!

Many here today are desporately wanting you to bbow down to their anti-christ and will use any tactic they can to do it. Lying, twisting like crooked politicians.

Their tactics ARE AN ABOMINATION TO GOD!!
---kathr4453 on 12/18/10


..
To what extent do you believe Jesus should be our example?
---leej on 12/17/10
ALL THE WAY
---francis on 12/17/10

That would require us to totally ignore the decree of the Jerusalem council that Gentile converts need not convert to Judaism to be genuine Christians.

It would also require us to ignore the teachings as held by the early church which did not teach observance to laws that were strictly jewish in nature. Things such as the Levitical dietary laws or the Jewish Sabbath.

Sorry, but to follow the example of Jesus does not require us to become Jewish.
---leej on 12/17/10


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Pharisee - "God may have changed his plan of salvation, but he himself has not and cannot change (Mal 3:6) What was an abomination to the Lord is still very much so."

I agree that God has not changed. God does not make things up as He goes along. Therefore His position on the abominations of old is still the same. I might also argue that his plan of salvation has not changed either. Christ simply fulfilled what the Father had planned from the beginning.
---AG on 12/17/10


To what extent do you believe Jesus should be our example?
---leej on 12/17/10
ALL THE WAY
---francis on 12/17/10


AG - Luke 16:14-15 The Pharisees, who were lovers of money, heard all these things, and they ridiculed him. And he said to them, 'You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For what is exalted among men is an abomination in the sight of God.
---leej on 12/17/10


If those which do what is unseemly are not abominations then we sever a God that lies.

I had a time when I stood firm on these things and was criticised in front of a crowded salon for saying these things have no part in heaven.

Those who stood against the word had those very abominations enter their dwellings.

''I still stand firmly upon the sold word of the Lord''.
---Carla on 12/17/10


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AG God may have changed his plan of salvation, but he himself has not and cannot change (Mal 3:6) What was an abomination to the Lord is still very much so.
---Pharisee on 12/17/10


Does God still consider certain behaviors to be abominations?
---AG on 12/17/10


jerry //Jesus was a Law keeper. Jesus is our example.

To what extent do you believe Jesus should be our example? Should we all convert to Judaism, become circumcised, observe all the Jewish festivals, tithe to the Levitical priesthood, do the temple thing, observe the Jewish Sabbath the way it was done during his time, refrain from eating certain foods despite the fact that such were not the teachings of the early church?

Or should we simply live by faith under the guidance of His Holy Spirit considering ourselves dead to the law?
---leej on 12/17/10


Pharisee, great answer to Jerry, and it should be for all those who think they are on higher ground to any of us. If that is not boasting, I don't know what boasting is. They should be boasting in the Lord. Without Christ, they can do nothing.
---Mark_V. on 12/17/10


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YOU, I, Or ANYONE else who follows Jesus does not keep the commands of God.

The truth is that in our strength we have no ability to do so, it is instead the work of God in us that does it. God convicts of a higher awareness of sin, God changes the heart even so that it breaks ours to be at odds, and God enables his people to follow Christ, so it may be a technicality, but nonetheless it's one you keep taking credit for, Christ has done it all. The only part we add is to join our will with his, and even this is never perfect. (James 2:10) So nobody keeps commandments. I implore you by the mercies of Christ to get off of your soapbox and depart from your self righteousness. Repent of your works and receive his.
---Pharisee on 12/17/10


Jerry6953

"Jesus was a Law keeper"

Indeed he was. He was a Jew born under the law and could do no less to be the perfect redeemeer.

He kept the law perfectly - to set us free from it on the cross.
---Bruce5656 on 12/17/10


Pharisee: You have a twisted concept of our Heavenly Father. When I was a child, I obeyed the commands of my parents, not from a prideful perspective, but rather out of love and respect. Does our Heavenly Father deserve less?
---jerry6593 on 12/17/10


Isa 66:17 They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the midst, eating swines flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, saith the LORD.

The verse really does not tell us what 'the abomination' was/is -

Perhaps the New Living Translation can shew some light on the term.

Isa 66:17 "Those who 'consecrate' and 'purify' themselves in a sacred garden with its idol in the center-feasting on pork and rats and other detestable meats-will come to a terrible end," says the LORD.

While the people of Israel were commanded not to eat certain foods, food restriction were nullified by Christ in Mark 7:18f and not mandated to the church in Acts 15.
---leej on 12/16/10


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Jerry Jesus was a law keeper unique among law keepers...he inwardly had the Spirit of his God to be one with his human spirit as do the Christians of today who are forgiven by forsaking their own works of righteousness and sins to be credited with his works.
Someone who keeps a command religiously is full of pride for what HE has done, thinks that HE pleases God and doesn't understand that if HE's keeping a command he's forfeited the righteousness that comes by faith to stand before God with NONE. Go on law keeper stay proud, it's vanity and you'll die in your sins.
---Pharisee on 12/16/10


I apologize Joseph. I inadvertently capitalize my name before sending the post on 12/15. There was no intent to misrepresent you.
---joseph on 12/16/10


Pharisee: If you are a Christian, then these words have meaning for YOU. Again:

Jesus was a Law keeper. Jesus is our example.
Love for Jesus is our incentive.

What is the incentive of the Law breaker?
---jerry6593 on 12/15/10
---jerry6593 on 12/16/10


Jerry, when you read a passage where Jesus gives a command, it has a reason behind it. He also said as Allan M stated, if your right eye cause you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you, for it is more profitable for you that one of your members parish, then for your body to be cast into hell. Then He speak about the arm, to cut it out if you sin. And since I know that you and everyone sins, I don't suppose you are walking around with no eyes or no arms. I really don't think that anyone in your church service will be found with no arms or eyes. That is a command from Christ.
---Mark_V. on 12/16/10


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You missed the point, or was that your intention to play a
game? My words didn't include Jesus Jerry, it was about YOU AND ME, and you are a law breaker no matter how many you think you're keeping. Fact is there is NOTHING you can do that pleases God. WHY?
Because your faith is in your ability to adhere to a set of regulations rather then in the fact that those regulations are perfectly upheld for you already by Jesus. JERRY YOU NEED TO BE SAVED and enter into the only sabbath rest that remains, the finished work of Jesus Christ.
---Pharisee on 12/15/10


Actually I think this abomination is what should take priority.

Mark 13:14
But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:
---kathr4453 on 12/15/10


Avoid those Abominations of Desolation of the so called Christian Book Stores!

Anything BUT Christian!
---John on 12/15/10


God has not changed,neither has whats an nabomination to him.
---tom2 on 12/15/10


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Bruce5656:

Which of the following attitudes:
2) the ruling is still valid and the stated thing is an abomination, or
1) the ruling is outdated and should no longer be followed, or
3) Christians have strongly mixed feelings, and the issue is controverial

do you think applies to the following two abominations?
1) Seafood, such as catfish, shrimp, lobster, and clams (Lev. 11:10-12)
2) Carved or molded images, such as crosses and plastic Jesus figurines (Deuteronomy 27:15)
---StrongAxe on 12/15/10


Pharisee: "A law keeper has no incentive, he still wants sin more then anything"

Jesus was a Law keeper. Jesus is our example.
Love for Jesus is our incentive.

What is the incentive of the Law breaker?
---jerry6593 on 12/15/10


AG The abominations listed in those chapters would be a non issue for those who are given to follow Christ, for they have the influence, power and guidance of His indwelling presence. That which is an abomination to Him, would innately -spiritually speaking- be an abomination to them.
The only one that may cause the overly zealous and immature a little difficulty, at least until they come to truly recognize and embrace their place in Him, is the abomination of "sowing 'discord' (strife or contention) among the brethren". Proverbs 6:19
---Joseph on 12/15/10


L Will, a Christian will have kept "all His commandments" through faith in Jesus Christ. It is Christ who have fulfilled the laws, and the Christian receives His righteousness through faith in Him. This is grace. No more no less.

As Paul declares in Galatians 3:2 "This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?" 3 "Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?"
---christan on 12/15/10


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I wonder how many people avoid the ABOMINATION/TOEVAH of "diverse weights and measures"--or as we would say today, a double standard?

Proverbs 20:10.
---Cluny on 12/14/10


This question does not ask about the "Law". It asks about specific things called abominations in Lev, Deut and Prov. A quick look at them reveals there is nothing there that one would disagree with whether you believe in "keeping the law" or not. I don't think any Christians would have a problem with the specific things mentioned being an abomination then or now. There is only one that is at all controversial in today's terms.
---Bruce5656 on 12/14/10


1 John 2:3-6 does not imply obeying all of God's commandments written (it's impossible for man) but the commandment of "repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ." (Acts 20:21).



Christian...it says keep His commandments, meaning the one's Jesus commanded to his disciples in Matthew 5-7 and throughout the gospels..which is really his father's 10 commandments and the "torah" made full.

Think not that I have come to destroy the law and prophets..I have come not to destroy (do away with), but to fulfill (make more fuller)..Matt 5:17

One of the prophecies describing the Messiah, foretold that under Him, the torah would be made known and followed...Micah 4:1-4
---L_Will on 12/14/10


The question has no point, it's a true Christians desire to avoid displeasing God, it's not something they have to do it's what they want to do, and so it's mostly done already.

A law keeper has no incentive, he still wants sin more then anything, the heart is not changed, and so even on his best day is powerless to stop filling his cup with wickedness in the inner man even if all law is observed outwardly, it's grudgingly done and therefore has no merit with God who "looks upon the heart."
---Pharisee on 12/14/10


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We can only fully agree with Jerry that Matthew 5:17 tells us that Christ fulfilled the law including the rest depicted in the Jewish Sabbath as well as whatever else the law pointed forward to.

We can as Christians rejoice that we not under the law but have been adopted as His sons & daughter.

"But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons." Gal. 4:4f

Redeem = release, liberate, free, emancipate, deliver, rescue, save
---leej on 12/14/10


1 John 2:3-6 does not imply obeying all of God's commandments written (it's impossible for man) but the commandment of "repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ." (Acts 20:21).

Salvation for the Christian is by grace alone, nothing to do with "if you do not obey the Word then you are NOT really saved and do NOT belong to God." Scripture does not teach such a doctrine. You are seeking to be justified by the law.

If it was so, the thief on the cross with Christ did nothing but was promised by Christ that he will be in Paradise with Him. Hence the meaning of "For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God."
---christan on 12/14/10


christian: "Whoever teaches that the laws ... is a worker of iniquity"

Mat 5:17-19 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Now who's the worker of iniquity?
---jerry6593 on 12/14/10


Heb 13:8
James 1:17
Both scriptures indicate that once God said it that it is forever settled Ps 119:89
God Blesss, Paul
---paul on 12/13/10


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Matthew 5:29-30 (N.I.V.)
If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.
---Allan_McDougall on 12/13/10


Yes, it is critical for Christians to do this. The reason why is because God and His Word are the same yesterday, today, and FOREVER, and do NOT change. Also, Christians are to live HOLY. Jesus says to be HOLY as He is holy, and that He is comming for a bride that is spotless, blameless, and without blemish. If you claim to be a Christian, and are NOT living holy, the Bible says in 1 Cor. 6:9-10, and Rev. 21:8 that you WILL end up in Hell.
---Leslie on 12/13/10


According to the Bible, Christians are to OBEY the ENTIRE Bible and live HOLY. The Bible says in 1 John 2:3-6 that if you do not obey the Word then you are NOT really saved and do NOT belong to God.
---Leslie on 12/13/10


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