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Are You A Real Christian

Who here is a REAL Christian? Who here reads the Bible for themselves? Who here when reading the Bible asks the Holy Spirit to teach them the Word and reveal to them the Word through His eyes - a.k.a. reads the Bible through God's eyes NOT human eyes?

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 ---Leslie on 12/16/10
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leej -- Who are the Adventists that are not "Seventh Day Adventists" and what is the difference?
---Donna66 on 1/20/11


//SDAs target CHRISTIANS. (Not all Adventists are SDA, btw.)

And Francis or Jerry refuse to acknowledge that they believe Adventists were given a special annointing from God to judge other Christains of their beliefs and walk.

But such is typical of cultists. They deliberately ignore any scripture that would expose their erroneous beliefs.

What can be encouraging is that 1.5 million have left the Adventist church during the period of 2000 to 2005 and that according to their own General Conference -a 35 percent lost.

I wonder what their lost has been during the period 2005 to 2010. Looks like God's word is setting some free that bondage.
---leej on 1/20/11


Cluny //WHERE does the Bible say that reading the Bible for yourself is the mark of being a real Christian?

It really does not since we see that one can even be a scholar but really not come into the truth.

1 Tim. 3,6-7 For among them are those who creep into households and capture weak women, burdened with sins and led astray by various passions, always learning and never able to arrive at a knowledge of the truth.

However, it is my personal opinion that those who belong to Christ will be attracted to the Bible for it is by the guidance of the indwelling Spirit that one learns and grows spiritually.
---leej on 1/20/11


No, leej.

Adventists do not target other Christians.

SDAs target CHRISTIANS. (Not all Adventists are SDA, btw.)

WHERE does the Bible say that reading the Bible for yourself is the mark of being a real Christian?

Remember that people didn't have their own copies of the Bible until relatively recently.
---Cluny on 1/19/11


They spend all their time targeting other Christians, .....

If one does not have the indwelling Holy Spirit (Romans 8:9) one may read read and read and pray pray and pray but never come into the knowledge of the Truth. 2Ti 3:7
---leej on 1/19/11

We all notice, the irony, that infilled you can single/target out someone....read,and read,read,.....determine that laws are illegal.
Hebrews 8:10
For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my LAWS into their mind, and WRITE THEM in their hearts: and I will be to THEM a God, and THEY shall be to me a people:
---Trav on 1/20/11




//Who here is a REAL Christian? Who here reads the Bible for themselves? Who here when reading the Bible asks the Holy Spirit to teach them the Word and reveal to them the Word through His eyes I.E. reads the Bible through God's eyes NOT human eyes?

francis answers: I AM AND DO.

If you are really a genuine Christian you should be one who abides in Christ bearing much fruit. John 15.

What fruit do Adventists bear? They spend all their time targeting other Christians, believing that cherry picked OT laws are essential to ones salvation.

If one does not have the indwelling Holy Spirit (Romans 8:9) one may read read and read and pray pray and pray but never come into the knowledge of the Truth. 2Ti 3:7
---leej on 1/19/11


The gospel is there to claim as our own.
We are called to be witnesses, not only proclaiming the good news of Christ Jesus' death, burial, and resurrection as a ransom for us, but also proclaim the good news of our salvation by His grace through faith.
Salvation is not only corporate, but also personal.
'whosoever will'
---micha9344 on 12/25/10


alan,"what are you saying about christians"-alan.I said in my previous post that Paul expanded on Jesus's gospel creating what Paul calls"my gospel'.Christians cling to Paul's gospel.
"mistaken in beliefs"What part of christian beliefs do you say I think they are mistaken in?A few topics I have already posted are noted differences in the two gospels.I have not passed judgement ,have I??It seems christians do not know what Paul means saying"my gospel".
"beliefs" are Jesus based,as I said earlier.I am non sectarian.
"mumbo jumbo",-are you speaking in tongues?
---earl on 12/25/10


alan,My Post on 12/24/10.p.3.What is your interpretation?
---earl on 12/25/10


Earl ... More mumbo-jumbo.
What are you ssaying about Christians? I beleive that you are saying they are mistaken in their beliefs?

There is much discussion on these boards between Christians as to what our beliefs are

Will you tell us what your beliefs are?
---alan8566_of_uk on 12/25/10




markv,Paul was not as you say or as you seem to believe I say making a lie.Paul was honest and dedicated to expanding the gospel of Jesus.He however expanded Jesus's gospel and identified it as "my gospel".
You said earlier there is nothing to debate but now you imply a challenge but you ask that I provide you with challenge material.My posts are filled key biblical phrases and words relating to Paul's gospel in contrast to Jesus's gospel for you to freely examine.
However you might want to think about why Paul states"my gospel"in his letters.
---earl on 12/25/10


earl, I challenge you to post the two gospels you are talking about. You say Paul teaches one and Jesus teaches another, now since you made those comments, why don't you show us the difference between them. I know you lack space but take your time, I would love to hear what you are talking about. The reason I ask is that you are suggesting that what Paul taught was a lie. Probably the reason you believe only on parts of Scripture, and not all of it as you suggested to me on another blog.
---Mark_V. on 12/25/10


Who here is a REAL Christian? Who here reads the Bible for themselves? Who here when reading the Bible asks the Holy Spirit to teach them the Word and reveal to them the Word through His eyes I.E. reads the Bible through God's eyes NOT human eyes?

I AM AND DO.
---francis on 12/25/10


alan,p1:"you say 'real christians" follow "Pauls gospel" not Jesus's so they must be wrong"-alan.
Paul's christian gospel and pauline doctrine is accepted and recognized as gospel truth in christian communities.Christians do not recognize the two gospels as having differences.I would not use the word "wrong" as you stated I have but Ill use the word blind because two gospel differences are fully visible but stand in the shadow of traditional christianity.p.1.
---earl on 12/24/10


alan,p.2.Replies to your post.
my "beliefs" are Jesus based.
I do not know any "unreal christians" or anyone who uses such title.
I call myself earl.
"why are you on christianet?"-well why not?Do you believe I interfere with christian beliefs and doctrine to where you may perfer that I have no place here?What is your point in asking "why"?This is usually the intent of this question as I have on occasion been asked the same question.The other question is,if I do not believe as christians then why am I here challenging their doctrine?-true??Is it "wrong" for someone to expose legit issue conflicts in a holy book???
---earl on 12/24/10


alan.p.3.So far no one here has demonstrated to me what I have said is untrue.
What do you say?Is it true or is it untrue?
---earl on 12/24/10


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Earl ... I have reviewed all your posts here, and you do appear to say that "real Christians" do not follow the Gospel of Jesus.

You say "real Christians" follow Paul's Gospel, not Jesus's, and so they must be wrong.

So I repeat my question ... what are your beliefs?

And what do you call yourself ... an "unreal Christian" or do you give yourself another title?

And why are you on ChristiaNet?
---alan8566_of_uk on 12/24/10


alan,You may want to review my post on 12-18 10.
All groups of christianity say they are "real christians".
Christianity was first structured and organized by Paul in his letters.His letters are a guide and believed to be by most all to be gospel truth like Jesus's gospel used when organizing religion now come to be known as christianity.
Christianity is exclusively contributed to Paul.Jesus did not organize or coin christianity,this came from Paul and his additional teachings not found in Jesus's gospel.Real christianity is via christian views not necessarily blended with Jesus's gospel.
---earl on 12/24/10


markv,I have reviewed my posts on this blog.All contain something of Paul's "my gospel" in contrast to Jesus's gospel.No,they are not posted with bible verses for ease of access but are actual words and phrases in the bible.
My posts show that Paul's gospel dominates Jesus's gospel.This dominance is considered "real christianity" according to Paul and current christians.If Jesus's gospel was dominate then christianity would have been much different than today.
This conclusion,not opinion, is accomplished by comparing the two gospels teachings/doctrine which is a simple task.
---earl on 12/24/10


Earl ... Your posts are confusing!

You seem to say that "real CHristians" have got it wrong becasue they believe what Paul taught, and that Paul did not teach the same a Jesus.

But I cannot see what your beliefs are. Can you set them out for us, please?
---alan8566_of_uk on 12/24/10


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earl, everyone is free to post their opinions on line. If you want to express your opinion you are free to do so. But when you post your opinion and you mention other Christians in your opinion, expect someone to answer with their opinion also, since you mentioned them. Now, maybe to you God is the same in every religion, it is not to me. That is my faith. The Jesus of Jehovah Witnesses and Mormons is not the same Jesus of Christians. So they will get an opinion. It will not be a debate though unless they give Scripture to support their views. You have given no Scriptures at all.
---Mark_V. on 12/24/10


markv,-"there is nothing here to debate",that is your decision.
"you gave no scripture to debate about"-untrue,"my gospel",angel or god with Moses..
"you just gave your opinion---"-No,I have presented hard facts on this subject"real christianity" and Paul's doctrine from the bible.
I am not "your genuine christian" as you may see christians like yourself.
"question authenticity"-A real Father always wants his children to ask for truth.
"the word of God"-All religions have the word of God.Trustworthiness of such is by honest examination.Your " whole truth" of the bible is an opinion only.
---earl on 12/23/10


earl, there's nothing to debate, you gave no Scriptures to debate about. You just gave your opinion. And I gave you mine. You said,
"markv,I do recognize "your point".
However what you posted is a testimony of your belief that every word of the bible is a truth to you and to you only."

It is not to me only, but to all who believe in the Word of God.
I don't see how you could be a genuine Christian if you didn't believe that the Word of God is Truth. One of the essentials of the Christian faith is to believe by faith that the Word of God is Truth. You must not believe it is, for you question the authenticity of Scripture. If you don't believe Scripture is the Word of God, then there is nothing to debate.
---Mark_V. on 12/23/10


markv,Again and also in another blog spot I see accusations of judgement upon another,personal finger pointing .If my post is untrue then the reasonable decision is discuss,debate or bail,not point the finger.If I "make up" untruth then you could have provided me in your post with what is made up .I do not see that you have done so but accusations was .
I suppose ,as I posted earlier,that real christians cannot stand honest criticism and as I also said earlier,they "do not want to hear it".The civil quality of doctrine debate is yet to be seen.
---earl on 12/23/10


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To Whosoever Has An Ear To Hear?

Brethren, It's the Holy Spirit which Teaches those of us who are the Children of God by Faith in Christ.

We're kept in remembrance of everything that Christ said & did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

So, We know & look only to God's Holy Spirit of Truth for the Interpretation and Guidance into all Truth of any & every book we study, b/c God's Light is shining in the darkness and only the darkness comprehended it not.

Gal.3:26 John 1:5, 14:26, 16:13, 21:25
---ShawnM.T. on 12/23/10


Micha, thank you for writing those verses from Paul writings. What matters first of all is that Scripture is inspired by God. All of it is Truth. If we cannot come to and agreement that the Bible is the Word of God then people can pick what they want to make truth just like earl is doing. He questions one part and wants to except what he feels is truth. No telling what he will choose. He makes his own rules, laws, and the limits, not God.
---Mark_V. on 12/23/10


Ro.15.9."i have fully preached the gospel of christ."
Untrue.
He did preach the gospel of christ with edited preaching of his own personal views.
Proof-Paul stated on occasions"I speak by permission ,not by commandment".and "my gospel".
So it was not a commandment to "assemble ourselves together" in the specific way he organized and gave structure to the upcoming church.And his personal abstanance views constrasted where we are commanded by God to multiply where Paul encourages do not multiply and stay a virgin.Jesus did not encourage- abstanance"Paul"be like I am',maintaining virginity-"better not to " or consider not marrying again if widowed.
---earl on 12/23/10


//Who here reads the Bible for themselves? Who here when reading the Bible asks the Holy Spirit to teach them the Word//

Awesome question, Mima. That is the determining factor for having the right doctrine.

Anyone can put together a handful of Bible verses and form their own religion but only the one who has a relationship with Jesus Christ and KNOWS his heart and places their faith in him will know when deception is drawing them away.
---JackB on 12/23/10


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Rom 1:9b ...I serve with my spirit in the gospel of his Son...
Rom 1:16a For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ...
Rom 15:19b ...I have fully preached the gospel of Christ.
Rom 15:29b ...I shall come in the fulness of the blessing of the gospel of Christ.
2Cor 2:12b ...I came...to [preach] Christ's gospel, and a door was opened unto me of the Lord,
Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Eph 6:19-20 And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel, For which I am an ambassador in bonds: that therein I may speak boldly, as I ought to speak.
---micha9344 on 12/22/10


a real christian?

oh come on are we in grade school?

do you waive a magic wand and pronounce someone as a real christian when they observe all of the self-professing must-do's or action steps created by man?

there is no such thing as a "real christian" and it's foolish to make assumptions about others and most oneself

a TRUE Christian is simply a follower of Christ HENCE they follow the ACTIONS of Christ
---Rhonda on 12/22/10


markv,I do recognize "your point".
However what you posted is a testimony of your belief that every word of the bible is a truth to you and to you only.This also gets christians in hot water for there are many christian denominations who also defend their whole truth but remain divided christians.
You would probably call yourself a real christian because of atonement doctrine-Pauline doctrine evident in your recent post in contrast to doctrine Jesus taught in recieving eternal life.After all,Paul did "start up" christianity.
So to be a christian by your standards one must recieve Paul's atonement doctrine as truth irrespective of Jesus's teachings on eternal life.
And this matter of fact is what I first posted.
---earl on 12/22/10


earl, I do not believe you got my point at all. First of all, let me say that Jesus is God. Right? And the Word of God is Christ, right? And the Word of God is Truth, right? And Jesus is the Truth, right? So everything that is in the Bible is Truth, not because Paul said it was, but because God said it was His Word. Whether the incarnate Jesus mentioned something or not. His time here had one purpose, to die on the Cross for our sins. He is our Atonement. Many things He did while here and many more that were not recorded. But all of Scripture is Truth.
---Mark_V. on 12/22/10


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markv,Where is Jesus's teachings on the 'HOW" of assembling ourselves together?Jesus never taught it because our Father never put those teachings in Jesus's mouth.
So is the "how" of assembling ourselves together something that God forgot to tell us by Jesus to do?
You said,The whole word of God?,well Jesus said he has a gospel to give .Likewise Paul said "my gospel".They are not the same. Jesus taught only one gospel.Why are there now two?.
Example from previous post,who was visiting Moses in the mountain,God or an angel?
There are other examples of honest criticism-the search for real truth.
---earl on 12/22/10


Earl, I too think you are wrong. Of course Paul was one of the special instruments Christ used to build His Church, but what you are forgetting is the whole Bible is the Word of God, and the word of God is Truth. For you to divide Paul from Christ is wrong, because Paul was around a lot longer then Christ was. That is why He prepared His followers. So that the gospel would spread a lot faster. The Holy Spirit was going to be doing the work through all of His followers. Another thing to remember is that the Truth is Christ. He is the way, the Truth and the Life. God's Word is the Truth, The Word of God became flesh, He was the Truth. And the Truth that Paul taught was Christ.
---Mark_V. on 12/22/10


Paul did say,"be followers of me the way I am of christ".
Here in lies the problem as my previous post states- "my gospel"by Paul.
Paul should have stated that be followers of christ as I am also a follower of christ.
If Paul did not emphasize "my gospel"as he states then his sentence structure would not have been relavent or a conflict of interest .His views would have been the same as when Phillip ,when asked by someone to see Jesus said,"follow me".
Otherwise Paul was the greatest contributor to structuring the christian church and movement in light of Jesus's teachings. .
---earl on 12/21/10


Paul doesn't let Jesus get a word in edgewise and he tells us nothing about the life of Christ, the miracles He performed or the lessons He taught. Paul can't tell us because he wasn't there, folks.
---barb on 12/19/10


WOW barb, have you not heard what Paul said...be ye followers of me the way I am of Christ.

As I see Paul's life through God's eyes, and hear Paul's word through GOD's Spirit, Paul's life of SUFFERING just as Jesus SUFFERED is all the evidence I need to KNOW God CALLED Paul to be an Apostle!
---kathr4453 on 12/21/10


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John ,honest criticism is not evident in what you posted.You posted your judging others attitudes.
Your reply is not directed to the dialogue but to the poster.
Who gains from such accusations?Prove that it is blasphemous as you state it is,if you can.If you can imagine another's afterlife then you must have a pre written book of the roll call.
---earl on 12/19/10


Bravo, Earl! I agree 100%.

I am not a Christian. I am a Follower of Jesus Christ. Jesus said "if you continue in my word, then you are my disciples indeed: and you shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free". John 8:31-32.

Paul doesn't let Jesus get a word in edgewise and he tells us nothing about the life of Christ, the miracles He performed or the lessons He taught. Paul can't tell us because he wasn't there, folks.
---barb on 12/19/10


The [real christian ]concept is a devotion to Paul's christianity according to Paul.A christian will most always recite Paul's letters above Jesus's teachings from the original penmen apostles.
---earl on 12/18/

Sounds like a pretty Blasphemous post there Earl.

Have a nice life, because I can't imagine what is going to be waiting for you afterwards.

(actually I can!)
---John on 12/18/10


Cluny,even if it was a unique event in Scripture it sets a Biblical precedent.

John 8:30 says as Jesus spoke "many put their faith in Him."

In Acts 17: Paul preaches the gospel to Gentiles in Athens-some wanted to hear more and a few believed. From these small beginnings came the explosive growth in Christianity among Gentiles.

Chapter 18 says Paul spent every Sabbath trying to persuade Jews and Greeks.

I came forward at an altar call decades ago, feeling no man-made compulsion, only God's call. I have never regretted it.
---Warwick on 12/19/10


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I think that the answer is in the very name "Christian." A follower of Christ. How many truly "follow" Christ? Do we walk as He did, care deeply for others as He did, heal as He did, spread the Gospel as He did, worship as He did, and obey His Father's Commandments as He did? WWJD is fine, but What DID Jesus do is better.
---jerry6593 on 12/19/10


The [real christian ]concept is a devotion to Paul's christianity according to Paul.A christian will most always recite Paul's letters above Jesus's teachings from the original penmen apostles.
This is why there is what is known as Pauline doctrine.Otherwise known, as Paul states as "my gospel".
Paul parallels much of Jesus's teachings but there is some crucial views of Paul that Jesus did not teach.Example.Paul says an angel was on the mountain talking to Moses,not God .Why?
Christians always say there is no text conflicts in the bible but when honest criticism is placed on the table no one wants to hear it.
So, what does the spirit reveal?Truth, and there can only be one truth.
---earl on 12/18/10


few if any can answer yes to the all the questions, and if you answer yes, many would cut you down, which gets back to the first question "Who here is a REAL Christian?"
---michael_e on 12/18/10


Cluny you're distain for altar calls is very revealing. Frozen in a church of dead belief and church tradition you lack any understanding of your responsibility in getting the message of the Lord Jesus Christ to the lost!!
---mima on 12/18/10


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Cluny-- It wasn't unlike a "camp meeting" when Jesus taught multitudes outdoors...even distributing food in a one or two instances.
---Donna66 on 12/18/10


\\"altar calls, invitation hymns, pews, and hymnals, as they are nowhere in the Bible."
Cluny
Neither is posting on sites like this or driving cars, flying planes or eating at fast food restaurants. So what is your point?
---Elder on 12/18/10\\

I don't think you read my comment in context of that to which I was replying.

The writer claimed to take the Bible over church traditions--yet many practices beloved by people on these blogs are nowhere mentioned in the Bible.
---Cluny on 12/18/10


"altar calls, invitation hymns, pews, and hymnals, as they are nowhere in the Bible."
Cluny
Neither is posting on sites like this or driving cars, flying planes or eating at fast food restaurants. So what is your point?
---Elder on 12/18/10


Leslie,
do you really think anyone will say "Well truthfully, I only masquerade as a real Christian"

As far as reading the bible for myself, I was mocked (by someone who has already replied to this question) for possibly being a "do-it-yourself" student of the bible
---James_L on 12/17/10


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\\How can this be a church tradition and contrary to Scripture?

I am sure Candice was not calling such Biblical realities church traditions.
---Warwick on 12/17/10\\

This is a unique event, duplicated NOWHERE else in the Bible, nor attested to in descriptions of Christian worship in the first three centuries.

In fact, it wasn't heard of at all until 19th century America in what were called "camp meetings."

If you know where, when, or by who some Christian practice or doctrine started, it's probably false.

Therefore, it is a tradition and precept of men.
---Cluny on 12/17/10


Real Christains LOVE God and love those who belong to God. Real Christians do not twist your words in order to disqualify you as a form of REVENGE because you won't follow their beast and take it's mark.

Real Christians are so excited to know someone believes Jesus died for their sin and has received Him as their Lord and Savior.

No one can say Jesus Christ is ALIVE and LORD of their life, unless they are saved.

ReaL Christians do not take part of your thought and twist it anymore than you can take part of scripture and twist it.

Real Christians do not do that.
---kathr4453 on 12/18/10


Cluny I do not understand your point.

An altar call is only calling people to respond to a gospel message. In Acts 2 Peter preached such a message and his listeners were "cut to the heart and said to Peter and the other apostles brothers what shall we do?" To which Peter replied "Repent and be baptized." "Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day."

How can this be a church tradition and contrary to Scripture?

I am sure Candice was not calling such Biblical realities church traditions.
---Warwick on 12/17/10


\\I take the bible seriously over church traditions,\\

If you do, then I'm sure you reject altar calls, invitation hymns, pews, and hymnals, as they are nowhere in the Bible.
---Cluny on 12/17/10


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I do. that is why some on here disagree with some of my disscussions because I go with what the bible says verses what denominations teach. I take the bible seriously over church traditions,I weigh the costs & carry my cross daily. thank you for asking.
---candice on 12/17/10


Are we really Christian, in how we understand whatever the Holy Spirit gives us? I have been very fast to look down on others, after I have supposed God has shown me something. It is not for status. I need to be humble and honest. And it says, "teaching and admonishing one another," in Colossians 3:16. So, God has us helping each other to learn. And we need our "examples" (1 Peter 5:3) to show us in real life, how to live and love the way God's word means.
---Bill_willa6989 on 12/17/10


Leslie, that is a wonderful question. I read the Bible for myself. But it's more thn just reading..correct. When I first became a Christian, one verse God put on my heart and spoke to me immediately was Jeremiah 9:24

That you may KNOW ME, MY loving kindness, mercy and justice.

Because I grew up hearing so may LIES, I asked the Lord...YOU teach me. You teach me what is true and what is not.

God has NEER failed to show me or answer anything I have ever asked. Many truths I had to GROW into, through obedience and personal experience. THIS is what the word WROUGHT IN YOU means.

Look up "wrought". It's most enlightening.
---kathr4453 on 12/17/10


In my opinion to be a true follower of Christ one must possess the attributes of Christ.

To many people hold the view that as long as you know the jargon and Christian talking points that you are accepted, and you may be by man, but whom shall you please God or man.

Even in seminary for the most part you are reading commentary form another mans perspective and reporting on it. That indeed has its place but as someone posted, read and interpret through the Holy Spirit.

After all He is our teacher sent to bring us into remembrance of whatsoever things Christ has taught, and where did He teach it? You guessed it, in His Word.

God Bless, Paul
---paul on 12/16/10


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Good point, Donna.

NOWHERE does the Bible say that reading the Bible is the sign of being a Christian.

Were this true, the scribes and Pharisees would have been Christians par excellence.

I would like to know, however, where the Bible says to read it for yourself, and you therefore will see it through God's eyes.
---Cluny on 12/16/10


Leslie, I consider myself a genuine and real Christian.

Just remember, the devil knows the word too, so that's not a good way to measure whether one is a Christian or not.

Who here DOES what the Word says to do? Forgives, gives, loves unconditionally? develops the Fruit of the Spirit in their lives? Obeys the word at all cost? Who does that?
---Donna5535 on 12/16/10


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