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Why Is Faith Important

Why is faith so important to Jesus?

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 ---Rick_Supplee on 12/29/10
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Craig and char, what MarkV and christan fail to understand is in the NT we have the FINISHED work of Christ. Not an entirely new message.

OT looked forward to the Coming Redeemer. We rejoice in His coming and finished work, that we NOW can Walk in His Spirit and obey righteousness. His righteousness through us...where in the OT that was impossible.

None were righteous., none could live a righteous life, but righteousness is NOW IMPUTED through the Finished work of Christ. And because of That we can be SAVED BY HIS RISEN LIFE in us!!!

It's not that difficult to understand, if you understand teh Gospel
---kathr4453 on 2/15/11


Craig, you have a problem with Scripture. The whosoever believes are the only ones who can come to Christ.
Because without faith you cannot commit to Christ unless you believe already that He is hope of your calling. If you do not believe by faith before you commit to Christ then you have the wrong gospel.
Only those born of the Spirit seek after God.
" that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, May give you a spirit of wisdom and of revelation in the knowledge of Him, having the eyes of your hearts enlightened, that you may know what is the hope to which he has called you.." Eph. 1:17,18. That is the only way you will know the hope that is in Christ. Everyday I give you more Truths.
---Mark_V. on 2/15/11


For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?


You are not SAVED before you hear the gospel of Jesus Christ! You are saved after you hear it and call upon the Lord.

THEN and ONLY THEN are you sealed with the Holy Spirit!(Eph 1:13)

Look at Thomas! Look how much it took for this man to believe! It wasnt a switch flipped by God "Here ya go, heres some faith." NO. This man walked with the Lord, knew who he was and STILL didnt have faith that Jesus came back from the dead.
---CraigA on 2/15/11


Yes kathr,
We get a view of our weakness in comparison to our Creator's Strength.
Matthew 26:41 Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.

Not only are ALL things possible with God--He alone is Strenght...
but [With God] All things are possible--[In-Christ] WE have His strength-walking [with Him]-
2 Timothy 1:7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear, but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.


Praise God for His mercy and Grace-
Repentance brings to remission.
---char on 2/15/11


MarkV, don't you understand the Gospel. In Adam all died. Now we have a promised redeemer to take away sin. This promise is to the whole world. THIS is what we Preach...THE GOOD NEWS.

The GOOD NEWS is not, that Gods sent His son into the world to PICK OUT THE ELECT. There would be no reason to do so. Where in all the accounts of Jesus talking to people did He continually say over and over...The Father sent me to save only a select few...sorry guys...



The GOOD NEWS is really BAD NEWS in your account of things.
---kathr4453 on 2/15/11




Tom, you definitely have a problem with the fall of Adam and the devastation it did to all mankind. Let Scripture be your source of conviction,

"Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin, and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned." Romans 5:12,

"And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins, Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience," Ephesians 2:1,2

Unless the Spirit gives you life, your spirit is dead on the account of Adam's disobedience to God, is what these verses are saying.
---christan on 2/15/11


There is no argument with the Truth. All descendants of Adam are going to hell already. Nothing but a supernatural act of God can save them. No amount of good works can remove the lost from the path he is in. For all his good works are sin without faith. Without faith it is impossible to please Him, "for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him"
A person has to have saving faith in order to seek God and believe in the works of Christ on the cross when he comes to Him. The Grace of God makes us alive to Christ, and through faith which is a gift, so that no one can boast, is given to us, and we commit our lives to Christ because we already believe in Him.
---Mark_V. on 2/15/11


cher, isn't that verse in matthew fabulous! And here Jesus, is saying...oh I mean NOT SAYING, God will only save the elect. .

ALL THINGS include ALL THINGS..and include ALL PEOPLE
---kathr4453 on 2/15/11


Faith 2: Scripture tells us that
"even when we were dead in trespasses," made us alive together with Christ" This was done by Grace,
"by grace you have been saved" and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus" Eph. 2:5,6.
All those who are made alive to Christ by Grace, receive the faith to believe in Christ Jesus now that they are alive. For Jesus is the Author and finisher of our faith. All the work of God. No one can make himself alive, or produce faith from within. It comes by hearing the Word of God, and those who are lost cannot hear, see, are understand spiritual matters. He has to be made alive to Christ first.
---Mark_V. on 2/15/11


I see your point JamesL and that would certainly explain how there seems to be scripture to support both sides.

Its kinda like the faith and works argument. Some claim faith only , some claim faith and works. The truth being genuine faith produces works because the Spirit changes you.

The truth is usually somewhere in the middle isnt it.
---CraigA on 2/14/11




Shira ... The KJV does not contradict anything. It is the everlasting authority of a Holy God

Those who translated and produced the Authorised Version (known to you as the KJV) would be the first to deny that their translation was perfect, and permanent.
---alan8566_of_uk on 2/14/11


///"When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved? But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible, but [with God all things are possible.]" Matthew 19:25,26///
Praise God the beauty of this is "With God ALL THINGS are possible".

Not our own wisdom but the [Wisdom of God]--without it we are relying on our own intellect or the traditions of men.
We are accountable for every word we utter-I say
"Seek Gods Counsel-only".
Follow His path He gave(Yeshua)without waiver-His Word leads to Him.
Seek the Counsel of God alone-He alone knows and testifies of His Word.
We are not God.
He alone is perfect--Only In-Christ we are covered
---char on 2/14/11


The problem is, we are all reading the same Holy Bible, regardless of the versions. The question is, who's directing your understanding of the Word of God? Even satan and his demons know the Word of God, but their mission is to deceive the world like he so clearly did in Genesis 3 to Adam and Eve. And when Christ came, he tried the very same thing but failed miserably.

Some have the same problem like the Jews. They thought that when God gave them His commandments/law, they could establish themselves with obeying them. That was never the purpose of the law as Paul declared in Romans 3:20, "Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin."
---christan on 2/14/11


The KJV does not contradict anything. It is the everlasting authority of a Holy God. The other perverse versions contract God's Word.
---shira3877 on 2/14/11


"But from there you will seek the LORD your God, and you will find Him if you search for Him with all your heart and all your soul." (Deuteronomy 4:29)

"Let all who seek You rejoice and be glad in You, Let those who love Your salvation say continually, "The LORD be magnified!"" (Psalms 40:16)

"The humble have seen it and are glad, You who seek God, let your heart revive." (Psalms 69:32)

"6 Seek the LORD while He may be found, Call upon Him while He is near. 7 Let the wicked forsake his way And the unrighteous man his thoughts, And let him return to the LORD, And He will have compassion on him, And to our God, For He will abundantly pardon." (Isaiah 55:6-7)
---kathr4453 on 2/14/11


....both views (Calvinist, Arminian) are incorrect because a human is incapable of choosing to believe anything, whether regenerated or not.

We have to be convinced.
---James_L on 2/13/11

What better way to convince a jury of "12" than with established witnesses. What better way to convince a jury of 1 than with "12" witnesses?

There is merit to what you stated above.
The only flaw I can find is what someone is taught from early Childhood...and maybe even then your statement applies. It seems harder to unlearn an error than learn a new one. Probably because of the lack of credible witness presented,or easily available.
---Trav on 2/14/11


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christan, where does the Bible say "our will" is dead in trespasses and sin?

Our will is the seat of our conscience. Our conscience is not dead in trespasses and sin.

In our position before God, we are dead in trespasses and sin.

There is a difference between position and possession.

The difference between man and animal is our conscience.
---Tom on 2/14/11


\\First, I am shocked you said what you did. Can you explain?\\

---Mark_V. on 2/14/11

Mark part 1,
I would also be shocked had I said those things, but I didn't.

What I said is:
"both views (Calvinist, Arminian) are incorrect because a human is incapable of choosing to believe anything, whether regenerated or not. We have to be convinced."

Faith is not active. Faith cannot be wrought by choosing, deciding, wanting, desiring, turning, confessing, committing, submitting, praying, or anything else that someone might "do".

Saving faith has one element:
Are you convinced that God's promise concerning Jesus is reliable?

If so, you are born again.
---James_L on 2/14/11


Craig ... That is no contradiction ... the two versions (Authorised Version and NIV) say much the same thing, but in slightly different ways

It is interesting that William Tyndale's translation says:

He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief, but was made strong in the faith, and gave honour to God, full certified, that what he had promised that he was able to make good.

It's also interesting that the translaors of the KJV made no claim to have produced the perfect translation, nor the final one
---alan8566_of_uk on 2/14/11


MarkV, part 2
the opposinng views are:

Reformed - God regenerates us, and imparts to man a righteous will whereby he will choose Christ by faith (paraphrase)

Remonstrant - it is an act of the man's free will to choose Christ by faith (paraphrase)

Both views are incorrect because faith is not a matter of the will. Faith is passive.

BUT, both opponents are correct in saying:

Reformed - Saving faith is entirely an act of God. There is nothing wihin an unregenerate man to want, or will righteous things.

Remonstrant - God does not force anyone to believe. Man does have the ability to resist the urging and conviction by the Holy Spirit.

See my point?
---James_L on 2/14/11


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We will never come to an agreement on doctrine until we are all reading the same Bible.

KJV
He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strong in faith, giving glory to God,

"but was strengthened in his faith"? Not in there

Just one of the many examples of how the NIV and KJV contradict one another.
---CraigA on 2/14/11


---"no one seeks after God." Can you explain? --- Mark_V


Noone does seek after God, but that doesnt mean its not possible for us to do so.

Jesus Christ told us to seek God (Matt 6:33, Luke 12:31)

Why would God tell us to seek him if it were not posssible? That verse simply means even though we had the ability to seek God, none of us have.
---CraigA on 2/14/11


JamesL, what you say with quotation marks does not come from the Scripture but from your very own heart which is contradicted by Scripture.

Your understanding of the the word "persuasion" in Romans 4:21 cannot be read without context of verse 20, which says, "Yet he did not waver through unbelief regarding the promise of God, but was strengthened in his faith and gave glory to God,". And what was Abraham persuaded about, "that God had the power to do what He promised".

Salvation is impossible for man (Matthew 19:25,26), Jesus said, but all things are possible for God. This I'm persuaded by Christ declaration, but your declaration, I'm not persuaded.
---christan on 2/14/11


There are some who vehemently say that you do not have to be born of the Spirit to believe in God. They say, you "can by you own will (which is supposedly to be dead in sins and trespasses) believe in God's command". In other words they are declaring that you can choose salvation outside of the work of the Holy Spirit. Is this true? Let Scripture shut their mouths,

"When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved? But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible." Matthew 19:25,26

The keyword is "impossible" for men and yet some say it's possible. Who's the liar?
---christan on 2/14/11


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//and passed over the rest, leaving them to the consequences of their sin, unbelief, and rejection of Christ.---Mark_V. on 2/13/11//

Please clarify.
This appears you are stating Yehovah created [some] souls to reject him. Yet-God does not want them- to sin.

If God hates sin-and does not want man to sin--why create them to do so and then judge them for it?

Something can't be rejected without the option of not being rejected.
That requires choice.
Yes-Yehovah alters conditons that influence behavior for the purpose of [The Kingdom].
As stated previously-there is an elect-scripture state so--but-not in the context as you stated.

Praise God for His mercy and grace.


Repentance unto repentance
---char on 2/13/11


MarkV, I disagree.

\\Everyone refuses to be convince if they are lost. It's God who makes them willing.\\

Faith comes by hearing, not being made "willing" to believe

\\chose to endure "vessels prepared for destruction" for the supreme fulfillment of His will (Rom. 9:22).\\

Romans 9 is not predestination to eternal life. The context starts with ch 8, He predestined that those who suffer with Christ to be co-heirs.

In His eternal purpose He chose only the elect of the world (John 17:6) and passed over the rest\\

John 17:6 is referring to the apostles. Verse12 "While I was with them...I guarded them...not one of them perished but the son of perdition"
---James_L on 2/13/11


When have I ever said that the Spirit doesnt make the change in a man? The Spirit leads us to Christ and when we place our faith in Jesus Christ the Spirit seals us and begins to regenerate us and renew our minds.

What I HAVE said is that Spirit CAN be resisted. A man CAN harden his heart to God. I have already shown you that in scripture. It doesnt fit with the teachings of "Irresistable Grace". Does it?
---CraigA on 2/13/11


---Craig, I don't know why you harden your heart towards the Truth
--- Mark_V

I dont reject the truth, Mark - just your version of it.

The truth I beleive in doesnt require changing the meanings of the words of scripture so that they mold to my preconceived belief.

When the Holy Spirit says "all men" and "every man" I believe that is EXACTLY what He means. I dont care what the opinions of other MEN are.

God has already declared that He has no pleasure in the death of the wicked. NONE!

Who is working in us mightily to teach every man to present them perfect in Jesus Christ? (Col 1:27-29)
---CraigA on 2/14/11


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Mark ... the same old contradction

God did not choose to endure ... HE actually made them deliberately so He could destroy them!

And He "Punishes" them for their rejection of Christ, when He made them unable to accept Christ.

According to your theology, anyway
---alan8566_of_uk on 2/14/11


God knows.
God knows mankind will attempt to use their mind to try and define Him.

The Point of Giving His Word.
To renew our minds with it.
He alone knows it--He alone confirms it----Holy Spirit.1Cor2
1Jn5(all)
9-10 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of [His Son].He that believeth on the [Son of God]hath the witness in himself:he that believeth not God hath made him a liar,because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.Jn 14:26,2 Tim 1:7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear, but of [POWER], and of [LOVE], and of a [SOUND MIND]

Repentance unto remission
Aleph to Tav
---char on 2/14/11


James L, you said,

"I agree that no one is born again before they believe. I was pointing out that error of Reformation doctrine"

First, I am shocked you said what you did. You are suggesting the sinner makes a commitment to Christ with the same heart he has always had, blind with no ears to hear. If his heart is not changed yet, why would he come to Christ? Are you saying, "Out of the goodness of his heart, he decides he will seek God?" Since Scripture says, "no one seeks after God." Can you explain?
You also suggest that a sinner without a conviction from the Spirit will come to Christ for the forgiveness of his sins.
---Mark_V. on 2/14/11


Kathr,
I agree that no one is born again before they believe. I was pointing out that error of Reformation doctrine

Westminster Confession VII.iii
"...and promising to give unto all those that are ordained unto eternal life His Holy Spirit, to make them willing, and able to believe."

That's part of the doctrine of irresistable grace. The belief that God imparts His Holy Spirit into those who were predestined to eternal life (regeneration before faith). Then, it is the Holy Spirit who changes a person's will toward Christ.

I was pointing out that both views (Calvinist, Arminian) are incorrect because a human is incapable of choosing to believe anything, whether regenerated or not. We have to be convinced.
---James_L on 2/13/11


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Christan,
Apparently you have a beef with scripture. I put the verse in quotation marks.

I hear you arguing, but it's just words. Where is any scripture which says a man can choose to believe something?

The gospel is a promise that God has made to mankind, that He would come here and die to pay the penalty for our sins. (Romans 4:21-25)

And that passage in Romans says being FULLY PERSUADED that what God had promised He was also able to perform. THEREFORE (i.e. becuse of this) it was reckoned to him as righteeousness.

It says he was PERSUADED that God's promise is true. THEN he was declared righteous.

argue your errors with God directly. Don't kill the messenger.
---James_L on 2/13/11


James L, what you stated about 1 Tim 2:4 is different then what you said. Everyone refuses to be convince if they are lost. It's God who makes them willing. There is a distinction between God's desire and His eternal saving purpose, which must transcend His desires. God does not want men to sin. He hates sin with all His being (Ps.5:4, 45:7), thus hates the consequences-eternal wickedness in hell. God for His own glory and to manifest that glory in wrath, chose to endure "vessels prepared for destruction" for the supreme fulfillment of His will (Rom. 9:22). In His eternal purpose He chose only the elect of the world (John 17:6) and passed over the rest, leaving them to the consequences of their sin, unbelief, and rejection of Christ.
---Mark_V. on 2/13/11


JamesL no one is Born of the Spirit of the Life of Christ FIRST in order to believe.

You are sugesting one is crucified with Christ, buried with him unto baptism of death, and raised up together with Him a New Creature IN ORDER TO BELIEVE, all without the person knowing? ..Believe What??? if you've already been Born again, you don't need to believe anything.

You are not born again first, THEN become unsaved to become saved again...
That's impossible, not only ludicrus.

The Spirit of the Life of Christ does not make a marriage in someone before justification. And Justification is NOT your Born Again experience.

We are Justified by HIS BLOOD, and Saved/Born Again by HIS LIFE!
---kathr4453 on 2/13/11


Craig, I don't know why you harden your heart towards the Truth. I hope one day you know the Truth for the Truth saves souls. A wrong gospel saves no one.
You said,
"Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with me"
The first question is "if anyone hears His voice"
Jesus said, "Only My sheep hear My voice and they follow Me"
In context Christ was seeking to enter the church at Laodicea, that bore His name but lacked a single true believer. He finishes with,
"He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches" Only Christ sheep hear His voice.
---Mark_V. on 2/13/11


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CraigA, what I simply cannot see is your claim "Its not overpowering God if he gave men the power to choose what they want to accept as "truth"." Why? Because I cannot find it anywhere in the Scripture of such a doctrine that God has "given men the power to choose" to choose salvation.

Salvation is a spiritual exercise and when God casted Adam and Eve out of Eden, that spiritual communication with Him was totally alienated to the point of his fleshly curse by God of "dust you are dust you shall return". Meaning, our spirit is now dead before God when we are born into this world. That's why Christ teaches spiritual regeneration in John 3.

But you believe otherwise.
---christan on 2/13/11


Father confirms His Word--ONLY.1Jn5(all)
9-10 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of [His Son].He that believeth on the [Son of God]hath the witness in himself:he that believeth not God hath made him a liar,because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.Jn 14:26,2 Tim 1:7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear, but of [POWER], and of [LOVE], and of a [SOUND MIND
1Jn5:6-7
This is the one who came by water and blood. Jesus Christ(Yeshua),not with the water only but with the water and the blood. And the
[Spirit is the one that testifies, for the Spirit is the truth].---The [Blood] was shed as paid wages.

Repent unto Remission
---char on 2/13/11


"You simply cannot choose to believe a promise (the gospel). You have to be persuaded in order to believe something." JamesL

Persuaded? Really? God who creates everything in this world and even more, has to persuade man (whom He made from dust and gave life to) to believe Him? I thought I have heard everything but your theology is even more wicked. You make God out to be a beggarly God who's so desperate to save a creature He made of dust.

The only one who chooses is God and it pleases Him to save only those He loved from eternity and He have given them to His Son Jesus Christ for the remission of their sin. And those whom He loved from eternity will believe in Him after He regenerates them through His Spirit.
---christan on 2/13/11


CraigA, Christan, here's a good one

Acts 28:24
"Some were being persuaded by the things spoken, but others would not believe."

The problem you both have is you believe faith is a matter of the will. One says the Holy Spirit gives us a new heart then we choose to believe. The other says we choose to believe then the Holy Spirit gives us a new heart.

Both views are incorrect.

You simply cannot choose to believe a promise (the gospel). You have to be persuaded in order to believe something.

That is purely the work of the Holy Spirit (2Cor 4:6) So score one for Christan.

But, it is possible to refuse to consider the word, and refuse to be convinced (1Tim 2:4). Now score one for CraigA.
---James_L on 2/12/11


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---What kind of god do you worship that a man can overpower his almightiness after He pours out His Spirit on ALL flesh? I know that's not my God--- Christan

Its not overpowering God if he gave men the power to choose what they want to accept as "truth".

Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.(Acts 7:51)

If we harden our hearts to Him as other men in history have done we will not enter into his rest (Hebrews 3).
God would not warn us of the dangers of resisting the Spirit if it were not possible to do so!.

If you truly cant see the message in Hebrews 3 then I dont know what else to say.
---CraigA on 2/12/11


Praise God He is God-He alone is all knowing.

Ezekiel 18:4 Behold, all souls are mine, as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
Philippians 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report, if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.




Praise God for His mercy and grace.
Repentance unto remission
---char on 2/12/11


---If ALL flesh has His Spirit, then no one should be going to hell, right?--- Christan

I never said all flesh is sealed with his Spirit. That only happens after a man believes in Christ (Eph 1:13). I said His Spirit is poured out on all flesh.

Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, AND open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

You have to open the door of your heart in faith.

Faith in election doesnt bring salvation. Faith in Jesus Christ does.
---CraigA on 2/12/11


"How does he accomplish this? By pouring out his Spirit on ALL flesh" CraigA

If ALL flesh has His Spirit, then no one should be going to hell, right? But there are multitudes in Hades now and multitudes who will be heading there. Your understanding of ALL is ridiculous because after receiving His Spirit, "Men CAN resist God. That is what makes us sinners." What kind of god do you worship that a man can overpower his almightiness after He pours out His Spirit on ALL flesh? I know that's not my God.

My God will only pour out His Spirit to all whom He has given to Jesus. And that all represents only His elect people chosen in Christ.
---christan on 2/12/11


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It is by faith we believe-In the Presense of Yehovah.

The Holy Spirit-Jn1Cor2,1Cor12,Jms1:17
[privileged gift]to provide and protect what is given as a privileged gift. Love Yehovah, neighbors, and family,in emotion,also in the sense of our actions.
Jn 14:26But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send [in my name], he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
Jn 15:26 ... he shall testify of [me]:
Jn 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth, It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you, but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

Aleph-Bet-Gimmel

Father-Son-Holy Spirit
---char on 2/12/11


Christan, this is the last time Im going to say this. Listen and please stop putting words into my mouth.

The only place I disagree with you and Mark is that the word of God testifies that God desires ALL men to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth(1 Tim 2:4).

How does he accomplish this? By pouring out his Spirit on ALL flesh (Acts 2:17, Joel 2:29). Jesus tell us one of the roles of the Spirit is to convict the world "of sin, because they believe not on me". The Spirit shows us our need for Jesus Christ.

This same Spirit tell us in Hebrews 3 not to harden our hearts as Israel did or we will suffer the same fate as they did.

Men CAN resist God. That is what makes us sinners
---CraigA on 2/12/11


christian,markv,craigA
[adversaries hates you all love---Yehovah].

My point---///"the Spirit didn't exist when God created the world"///--I do not see this ever stated by the brother-therefore-Any rebutal to it is - null.--Advarsaries tactic--detour off path.
Iniquity[ah-von,crookedness]-pictograph-a twisted cord---The adversaries intent is to twist-falsely accusing-as judge.Discern this spirit behind-quickly-refuse to give place.
Heb 4:12For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword,piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow,and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
[stated through Love]-Find an agreement.Jn 14
---char on 2/12/11


"Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit." John 3:3,5,6

"But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." John 1:12,13

The Word of God is not a ballgame, it's between life and death.
---christan on 2/12/11


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An entire planet full of creations that disobey Him on a daily basis. Justly condemned for their sins. He reaches out with a hand of mercy and forgiveness and does ALL that is necessary to save us.

I dont think God is asking much that we believe the work He has done to save us. To at least acknowledge Him and love Him for what He has done.

I think FAITH brings glory to His name. He wants our love and respect, not a fruitless obedience out of fear of punishment.
---CraigA on 2/12/11


CraigA, your theology of your god has the father, son and the holy spirit running all over the place in separate directions not knowing what is happening, just like you.

Whereas my God who is the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit who's working in perfect harmony as One. My Father has chosen, my Saviour Jesus Christ came to die for those whom His Father has chosen and given to Him and it's the Holy Spirit who will only regenerate those whom the Father has chosen and given to Christ, who died for their sins at Calvary.

This is in One perfect harmony of the triune God. "All that the Father giveth me shall come to me, and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out." John 6:37
---christan on 2/12/11


"TY Char."

I was thanking you lol

Its nice to see not everyone plays word games to make people look bad :D
---CraigA on 2/12/11


CraigA, once again, read the following -

"It is the spirit that quickeneth, the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life." John 6:63

"And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins," Ephesians 2:1

These verses supports Donna66 kind explanation. It is the Holy Spirit that converts, period. It's either I have the false Christ and you have the true Christ, but make no mistake, we do not have the same Christ of the Bible.
---christan on 2/12/11


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Craig, If you had any understanding of Scripture you would not say what you say, "The disciples (dead in sin and trespasses) believed in Jesus and didn't have the Spirit yet." Is blasphemy.
Then you say she has tickles ears. It's you who cannot hear the Truth.
Here is Jesus Words,
"The Spirit of Truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him, "but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you" John 14:17.
The Spirit of Truth was already dwelling with them but would be in them forever after Pentacost.
"And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, "receive the Holy Spirit." John 20:22
---Mark_V. on 2/12/11


I know you didn't brother.

I was acknowledging that fact.

///I [do not see] CraigA has stated ..."the Spirit didn't exist when God created the world"
---{IF} that is what's being Implied.///
---char on 2/11/11


TY Char. I didnt say that at all.

I said they didnt HAVE him as they follow Jesus Christ. Jesus told The disciples that it was NECESSARY for Him to go away because if He didnt the Comforter WOULD NOT COME unto them.
---CraigA on 2/11/11


---If the disciples had so much trouble believing what they could see, how are we able to have faith in what we CANNOT see?
There is no way.--- Donna66

Because the Spirit of truth is now in the world.


I have yet many things to say unto you
(his disciples), but ye cannot bear them now.

Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself, but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.


How much more plain can scripture be? These men who were followers of Jesus Christ and believers didnt even have the SPIRIT!
---CraigA on 2/11/11


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What Im saying is that Jesus Christ himself veried that these disciples didnt have the Spirit yet!

Am I gonna believe Jesus or Christan?

This is what I was talking about earlier. Men only wanna hear what tickles their ears. She wont ever believe what Jesus Christ said here because it would cause her to doubt the doctrine she clings to. The doctrine that tickles her ears.
---CraigA on 2/11/11


The disciples believed on Jesus because He was present with them. If they had never seen Him, how could they have believed on Him? He certainly did not fit their concept of "Messiah".Jesus rightly said to them "oh, ye of little faith"

Poor Thomas is forever an example of the doubter. Was he the only one?Isn't it likely that the others also doubted until He showed them
His wounded hands and side?

If the disciples had so much trouble believing what they could see, how are we able to have faith in what we CANNOT see?
There is no way. We aren't smarter or better than they. We cannot have faith on our own. It is only by the HOLY SPIRIT of God that we are led to faith.
---Donna66 on 2/11/11


///What Christ said in John 7:38,39 does not imply the Spirit didn't exist when God created the world-christan on 2/11/11///

---Huh? ---For the record before [I move on] I do not see CraigA has stated ..."the Spirit didn't exist when God created the world"
---{IF} that is what's being Implied.

///The disciples (dead in sin and trespasses) believed in Jesus and didnt have the Spirit yet. CraigA on 2/11/11///

Yehovah testifies of HIS WORD-ONLY.

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Perhaps this is what CraigA is referring to.
---char on 2/11/11


Christan, show me a scripture that tells you that the Holy Spirit gives us faith.

Bring it.

Ill give you scripture showing you that we receive Him AFTER faith in Jesus CHrist.

Game on.
---CraigA on 2/11/11


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CraigA, use of Scripture to justify "No-scripture isnt lying at all. The disciples (dead in sin and trespasses) believed in Jesus and didnt have the Spirit yet." is nothing short of blasphemy. What Christ said in John 7:38,39 does not imply the Spirit didn't exist when God created the world.

Scripture contradicts you "It is the spirit that quickeneth, the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life." John 6:63, "And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins" Ephesians 2:1

Talk about "making assumption based on a horrible interpretation".
---christan on 2/11/11


No-scripture isnt lying at all, Christan. Your just making assumption based on a horrible interpretation of what "dead in sin and trespasses" mean. The disciples (dead in sin and trespasses) believed in Jesus and didnt have the Spirit yet.

Heres your proof. Maybe this will clear it up for you.

John 7:38,39

He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given, because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
---CraigA on 2/11/11


Word of God-Son of God-Son of man-Immanuuel-God with us.
Word was God Jn1:1-15

Yehovah confirms [HIS WORD ONLY]1 Cor 2(all) For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct Him?
He foretold us ALL things
By Faith we believe it.
Mk13:23,Is 46:10
God is Spirit-We believe [HE IS]present and alive.
(permanency)-Jn 11:25Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth [IN ME], though he were dead, yet shall he live:
If one believes [He exist]-He will Teach and confirm only [HIS WORD]-no other.
Heb 11:6But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that [HE IS], and that he is a rewarder of them that [diligently seek HIM].
---char on 2/11/11


Jesus Christ is God, He does not need faith. It is the sinful man who needs to be justified by faith that he may receive the righteousness of Christ. And this justification by faith can only happen after one is born of the Holy Spirit.

However, there are some here that already believe they have faith within themselves without the regeneration work of the Holy Spirit. They claim they can see, that they are alive in the spirit when Scripture screams at them saying, you are "dead in sins and trespasses." If they are alive in the spirit as they say and have faith from within then Scripture is lying... or they are.
---christan on 2/8/11


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Because expressing your faith pleases him. The scriptures say that he did not many miracles among certain places because of the people's lack of faith.
---Eloy on 12/30/10


Rick_Supplee,

i have read a few of your blogs. Why is faith so important to Jesus?
---aka on 12/30/10


Jesus told Thomas, BLESSED are those who don't see but believe.

Faith is the evidence of things NOT SEEN.

But we do have a group here who didn't come to faith until they were given eyes to see FIRST.. That my friend is not faith.
---kathr4453 on 12/30/10


sounds like an intro into Word of Faith heresy...

"Proponents believe they can use words to manipulate the faith-force, and thus actually create what they believe Scripture promises (health, wealth, etc.). Laws supposedly governing the faith-force are said to operate independently of God's sovereign will -- God Himself being subject to the "laws" of faith....
...Word of Faith teachers often redefine or reinterpret Christian essentials in order to fit them into their own peculiar theological systems." What Is the Word of Faith Movement? gospel outreach dot net

E.g. God did not create the world out of nothing, He used the Force of His Faith. -KENNETH COPELAND (Spirit, Soul and Body, #01-0601, Tape #1)
---aka on 12/29/10


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God wants us to trust Him like a child trusts. They come into the world knowing nothing & completely trusting. It's that kind of trust in the LORD that pleases Him. It's difficult because we can't physically see Him, that's where faith is needed & required. Remember the old hymn, "Trust & Obey"? That's what we should all strive to do.
---Reba on 12/29/10


Faith determines what we do, it forms our convictions, creates hope and creates in a person a means by which God can effectively enter their life.

To Jesus your faith is everything and that's why salvation is by faith. Or how can a person respond to something they cannot see unless they first believe it's existence?
---Pharisee on 12/29/10


Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him,for he that comes to God must believe he is,and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for,the evidence of things not seen. My thoughts, Faith is the material from which our hopes are made and have their existance. It is the reality of the things which aren't seen,the outward sign,the proof of God's love and power and our life through him and commitment to him,based on our full belief in him.
---Darlene_1 on 12/29/10


The Bible says that without faith it is IMPOSIBLE to please God, and that lack of faith is SIN.
---Leslie on 12/29/10


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Because without it you cannot please God...the bible says so.
---Donna5535 on 12/29/10


Faith is very important for faith is our bridge between the the aspects of Christianity which we can directly observe and the spiritual which we can not observe.

But we also have to remember that unless God chose you to be in in family prior to creation having all the faith in faith in the universe is totally useless because you were rejected by God and that can never ever be changed by anyone.
---Blogger9211 on 12/29/10


Heb 11:6 And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him.
---leej on 12/29/10


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