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Can Christian Spirit Die

Romans 8:10,Mat14:26,Mat 26:41,Jon 19:30 1 Ths 5:23 1 Cor 15:35-58 2 Cor 5:8 Heb 4:12 Jms 2:26 1 Pet 4:6 1 Jon 3:24, 4:16. Can a human spirit, alive in Christ (1Cor 6:17) become dead and need resurrection the way a body does? Are Body/Spirit separate at death? Do not these passages support separation?

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 ---Pharisee on 1/7/11
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Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living soul.

Job 33:4 The Spirit of God hath made me, and the breath of the Almighty hath given me life.

Psa 146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth, in that very day his thoughts perish.

Job 19:25,26 For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:
---jerry6593 on 1/15/11


Ginger, why didn't you define what a covenant was? Since you say it was not a covenant? educate us. An example of a covenant was given, you must have a different definition. What is a Covenant?
---Bob on 1/15/11


ginger, I see the point you are making.
One thing to add that may help is the sign or token.
There always seems to be a sign that represents each covenant, but I do not see it in the case of Adam.
I may have confused 'command' or 'promise' with 'covenant' in which some on here may have as well.
Some on here may not be teachable for one reason or another as well.
We may not always agree, but I think the relationship between Adam and God was not based on a covenant.
---micha9344 on 1/15/11


No Bob I haven't changed my mind. Read genesis please.
God gave the stipulations to Adam before he sinned.
Adam sinned and brought the punishment on himself.

Are you saying God caused Adam's death? Are you saying God is the author of sin? Because the Bible says otherwise.

Seriously, read genesis. If you have already, then read it again.
Adam caused his own death because he disobeyed.
When you live in sin and disobey God you are dying by your own hand. If you can't understand this truth, then I suggest you pray about instead of trying to pigeon hole me.
---ginger on 1/15/11


Ginger, you changed your mind about Adam dying by his own hand. I knew you were wrong because it is not found in Scripture. Now you say that death is a punishment not a curse. How can it be a punishment if he is dead? Can you explain that? If a person is dead how is he been punished?
---Bob on 1/14/11




micha, I did way back.
I gave examples too.
The one with Abraham, Israel, through Jesus.
I am a bible beliving woman and God does not in no way shape or form give a covenant to Adam.
He gave him a command and told him if he did not obey he would die. God did not say he would do anything for Adam as he did to Abraham, Israel and through Christ. Those are covenants.
Adam didn't need a covenant because he was already free At least until he sinned.
Adam was created free but he bound himself up by committing sin.
Hope that sums it up for you.
---ginger on 1/14/11


"You claim to be without sin as a Christian"

Never once did I assert such a claim.
---Pharisee on 1/13/11

Probably a misunderstanding....I looked for where it might have happened. And found rather the opposite to be true.
She may have you confused with the profit eloy. Who has made statements along this line.
---Trav on 1/14/11


Define 'covenant' ginger...
---micha9344 on 1/14/11


Bill,

I would like to clarify.
When I said Adam died by his own hand ....
I mean Adam brought death on himself.
And actually death is not a curse it is a punishment.
The curses God put on man and woman is man has to work to bring home the bread...by the sweat of his brow.
Woman's was that she should have pain in child bearing and that she desire her husband and he will rule over her.
Death was the punishment for eating the fruit of the tree of know. of good and evil.
No where did God make a covenant with Adam. We can never be saved through our own flesh or actions.
---ginger on 1/14/11


Leslie, I have read many of your answers and I agree with many, but I really don't know why you have taken this out on Pharisee. He never did say he was without sin. I also like much of what he says, and the reason he gave for using Pharisee was a very good reason I suppose before someone called him something else. I do not agree with everything he says but he deserves to speak just like you and me and everyone else, plus you can see that he reads the Bible and is willing to discuss anything with anyone. Stay with the Truth which is more rewarding.
---Mark_V. on 1/14/11




"You claim to be without sin as a Christian"

Never once did I assert such a claim.
---Pharisee on 1/13/11


Bill, MarkV,

Did God make Adam eat the fruit of the tree that caused him to die?
No God did not because God is not the author of sin.
God gave Adam an order, Adam disobeyed so he died by his own hand..He chose to disobey God. That disobedience is what caused Adam to die.
So, it is not me who does not understand God's covenants nor do I go around making them up either. God says what they are in his word and that is enough for me.
MarkV and Bill, if you want to believe that stuff written by man go ahead, I prefer God and his word.
---ginger on 1/13/11


Ginger, Adam did not die by his own hand. I was looking for that passage and could not find it. Did he commit suicide? Stabbed himself? How did he die? I was convinced that he died because of the curse that God put on both of them. I suppose I was wrong.
---Bob on 1/13/11


//Leslie says to trav -You are NOT God's but belong to someone else.

Having tangled with trav for some time, I have come to the conclusion that he is on a learning curve much like the rest of us. ...continue to dialogue with those who are more mature in faith.
---leej on 1/12/11

Ha, your a mature buttercup leej. Leslie said this to Pharisee.

You've never tangoed with me leej. Prophets Apostles have chased you.

I've compared scriptural witnesses,Prophets & Apostles(plural)many times with ur mature opinion. Always the same conclusion from leej. They are confused Prophets,and Apostles. Your doctrine is superior to these ancients.
You keep praying for ole Trav and his witnesses...we'll do same.
---Trav on 1/13/11


Pharisee - I KNOW you are NOT saved and you still belong to the devil. You claim to be without sin as a Christian - ONLY Christ was without sin. In 1 John it says if you claim to be without sin, you are a LIAR and the TRUTH (Jesus Christ) is NOT in you. I STRONGLY advise EVERYONE to turn a deaf ear to Pharisee - this one belongs to the devil and is trying to DECIEVE you.
---Leslie on 1/13/11


Ginger, it is you who is making a mountain out of a molehill. Death, die, what's the difference? He died just as God told him he would if he disobeyed. He died a spiritual death, and later a physical death. It was a command from God as the commands are in a Covenant. There is no equal parts on the command of God. Man has to do what God tells him or face the curse for disobeying same as a Covenant.
All you want to do is argue. Last response to you on this matter.
---Mark_V. on 1/13/11


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Pharisee, You're right I "still don't get it" at least what you're getting at.
There's absolutely nothing you or I or anyone could do to remove the "Adamic sin".Christ had to die to fix that problem.Nothing to do with "forgiveness" .The mechanics of trading a life for a life and Jesus volunteered to be that "sacrificial lamb".
daily sins are a whole nuther thing!
3 babies are born every second,each one "inherits" Adamic sin (not their/our fault) The removal of(Adamic) sin is not automatic, there are steps to take to "qualify" for redemption!
---1st_cliff on 1/13/11


Where do you get this "repent for uncommitted sin"???

Cliff if you're going to quote me make it verbatim as I did with your words. Secondly the sin of being born in sin is not a sin that anybody ever chose to make!
If Jesus came to take away Adam's sin then we're forgiven for being born. Forgiven for something we didn't do, how does that even make a shred of sense? Read the post again Cliff you don't get it yet.
---Pharisee on 1/12/11


He did say, if He disobeyed He would give him death. //

God did not say he would give Adam death. God said that Adam would die. There is a difference. That means Adam died by his own hand..for disobeying a command. So it was a punishment for disobeying a command it was not a covenant.

Why do you insist upon twisting scripture and upholding something a man said instead of just listening to the prophets and apostles of the Bible?
I do.
God did not call what he said to Adam a covenant. Anytime God does a covenant, he says it is a covenant.
Examples are Noah, Abraham, and Christ.
---ginger on 1/12/11


//Leslie says to trav -You are NOT God's but belong to someone else.

Having tangled with trav for some time, I have come to the conclusion that he is on a learning curve much like the rest of us. In which, case, we should encourage him to study study study and continue to dialogue with those who are more mature in the faith.
---leej on 1/12/11


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Pharisee, I read most of your post and they are awesome brother.

But how can you say we don't get a new body when the bible says we do. It says we will be transformed in the twinkling of an eye.
1 Corinthians 15:51-53

Yes, the Body Christ came back in was the same but glorified, changed as God said he will do for all those who are in Christ when he comes back for us.
John 17:4-5
Flesh Jesus had before crucified had blood. His flesh after resurrection didnt.

When this world ends, we get a new body. One that does not get sick and never dies.
---ginger on 1/12/11


Pharisee, Maybe you better wear glasses when you read my posts,or else you have a problem with perception!
Jesus gave His life as a "ransom" for the Adamic sin that caused man to die when he was created to live perpetually! (you know..tree of life etc)
Where do you get this "repent for uncommitted sin"???
Mankind sins on an almost daily basis, for these sins you must ask for pardon!
When John said "behold the lamb of God that takes away the SIN of the world" he was referring to "Adamic sin" The reason mankind dies!
---1st_cliff on 1/12/11


My advice for EVERYONE on Christianet is to turn a closed ear to you -You are NOT God's but belong to someone else. ---Leslie on 1/12/11

Pharisee's Publican self observation says more to me than your pharisaic attitude leslie. Note the scripture:
11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.

While you display proudly your misinterpreted Zeal and Fervor you are scripturally out of position to tell anyone what condition their condition is in. U might b silent as scripture instructs you to be and be found wise. Otherwise....
---Trav on 1/12/11


"the name Pharisee gives it away."

Ask Elder why I call myself Pharisee...On second thought I'll save you some time, it's a confession to self righteousness, I call myself a Pharisee so you don't have to. I call myself that because I've never felt worthy to have the knowledge I've been GIVEN. (there's the key word)

Leslie I have the Spirit of God, everything I've ever written here has been given to me by my Father through the Holy Spirit, and I know you don't know that Spirit nor do you hear his voice because your arguments come from your own intellect. (there is the possibility that your just a bad listener, and if that's the case you're not called to this and you need to stop)
---Pharisee on 1/12/11


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Pharisee - I can tell by your responses that you do NOT have the Holy Spirit in you and are NOT truly saved. How do I know, the name Pharisee gives it away. The Pharisees were ALWAYS going AGAINST Christ and the Word of God and arguing them - you do the same. My advice for EVERYONE on Christianet is to turn a closed ear to you -You are NOT God's but belong to someone else. If people do not turn a closed ear to you, they will find themselves in the same trap you are in.
---Leslie on 1/12/11


"there are some serious flaws in your knowledge."

Look who's talkin!

"Jesus gave His life to counter act Adam's sin (called Adamic sin)."

No he didn't Adam's sin is forgiven or none of us would be here!

"sins forgiven on a daily "asked for" basis and granted by Christ when asked in all sincerity! Nothing to do with His crucifixion!"

Where did you dream that up? By your words you claim a person has to repent of a sin they never committed! Cmon! It's the love of these common sins (John3:19) and their ongoing unrepentant commission that alienates people from God, Adamic sin is merely the root.
---Pharisee on 1/12/11


Have you lied? Have you stolen? Have you lusted (adultery)? Have you used God's name as a cussword (blasphemy)? Have you hated or been angry with someone (murder)? If you have the Bible says you are headed to Hell (1 Cor. 6:9-10, Rev. 21:8). Jesus died to take your punishment for you. All you have to do is repent (confess and turn from your sins) and trust in Jesus Christ as Lord (Rom. 10:9-10). If you have not done these things, you are still headed to Hell.
---Leslie on 1/11/11

One thing you leave out is what you havn't done, way of the master is guilty of this too, not telling that you need the Holy Spirit living inside. "Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his" Rom 8:9
---Pharisee on 1/11/11


Ginger, you said,
"God gave a command for Adam to follow. And he did not say if he obeys, he would give him etc.... like he did with Israel."
He did say, if He disobeyed He would give him death. So that would mean that He would give him life if he obeyed. You are making something out of nothing for argument sake. I suppose because I disagreed with you on the blog on the husband not wanting his son to move in with them. You took that one a long way. Now you are picking at straws. Your motives are not good ones Ginger. Not for the husband or for the commands of God. But that is ok, I hear it a lot from a few here. I do not expect everyone to be passionate to know the Truth. Some are here just to argue.
---Mark_V. on 1/11/11


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1ciff, you said in plain english,
"If Jesus gave his life on fri. took it back on sun. what did he actually give??"
Jesus not only endured the worse humiliation that He could bare, endured the inflicting of severe pain and agony, and endured that to death by the crucifixion. Did you want more? And because He promised to rise again, He resurrected to life again with a glorified body as He had told them He would in three days. A glorified body that never dies. I never said His human body before death was immortal. You did. His Spirit was, is and always will be immortal.
---Mark_V. on 1/11/11


Leslie, I hate to be another one getting on your case, but there are some serious flaws in your knowledge.
Jesus gave His life to counter act Adam's sin (called Adamic sin). That caused mankind's downfall.
The sins you mention . lust,theft etc.. are sins forgiven on a daily "asked for" basis and granted by Christ when asked in all sincerity! Nothing to do with His crucifixion!
---1st_cliff on 1/11/11


1Cliff 2: Then you said:
"If He was God how could He be given a higher position in heaven??Phil.2.9."
In Spirit He was God. If you had read Phil. 2 from the beginning you would not ask those questions. Read them, study them. Then compare His deity in John 1:1.
Now you then say,
"That's the problem with trinitarianism, it doesn't fit!"
Of course it doesn't fit for those who do not believe Jesus is God. What did you expect? That they would? God came in the flesh in the Person of Jesus Christ. He walked among everyone, and was hated by many. Reject and killed as it was ordained from the foundation of the world for the sin of the world. In the Person of Christ He was exalted above every name.
---Mark_V. on 1/11/11


1Cliff, I err in one part of what I answered, I wanted to correct it, I said, "He gave "us" His spirit before He died." I misspelled "us" and should have been, "He gave 'up' His Spirit before He died"
Sorry for the error.
---Mark_V. on 1/11/11


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Mark V, Since you do not appreciate satire, I'll tell you in plain English.
If Jesus gave his life on fri. took it back on sun. what did he actually give??
He sacrificed His life forever,God had to give Him a new one, else no debt would be paid in full! His new life allowed him to walk thru walls etc. something He could not do before.
Scripture says he died, you say he was immortal, which one is correct?
If He was God how could He be given a higher position in heaven??Phil.2.9.
That's the problem with trinitarianism, it doesn't fit!Why can't you believe that Jesus was God's "Son"??
---1st_cliff on 1/11/11


MarkV,
The reason it is not in there is because it was not a covenant.
God gave a command for Adam to follow. And he did not say if he obeys, he would give him etc.... like he did with Israel. That is a covenant.
Please take it for what it is and not assume.

leej, what is a glorified body and where does it come from? is it our flesh or somethiung else? You need to research that then come back and tell me we don't get new glorified bodies.
Also, remember that our kind of flesh cannot enter heaven.
---ginger on 1/11/11


Let me ask ALL here something. Have you lied? Have you stolen? Have you lusted (adultery)? Have you used God's name as a cussword (blasphemy)? Have you hated or been angry with someone (murder)? If you have the Bible says you are headed to Hell (1 Cor. 6:9-10, Rev. 21:8). Jesus died to take your punishment for you. All you have to do is repent (confess and turn from your sins) and trust in Jesus Christ as Lord (Rom. 10:9-10). If you have not done these things, you are still headed to Hell.
---Leslie on 1/11/11


"Those who believe in eternal torment believe God gives eternal life to everyone."

Eternal torment is not eternal life, it's eternal death, and the wages of sin is death. It's pretty simple everything in our world has a polar opposite, the world is framed in paradoxes that mimic the spirit world, even Satan counters everything God does with a polar opposite. If there's going to be eternal life there will also be eternal death where the fire never quenches and the worm doesn't die!
---Pharisee on 1/11/11


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"it will be our spirits that will be raised, not our bodies"

How can that be when the Spirit of a Christian is one with Christ (1 Cor 6:17) Raised from what? According to Ephesians 2:6 we are already raised up and seated in heavenly places in Christ! Paul talks about the res in 1 Cor 15 speaking of corruptable putting on incorupption, our spirit is new it is in Christ, it's not corruptable because it's been made one with him, therefore there is no raising of the Spirit of a Christian, it's the body that dies not the Spirit, the Spirit is raised in Christ already and thats why there is resurrection power available, I know it because it shattered 5 addictions in me when I got saved!
---Pharisee on 1/11/11


"Do not fall into the trap thinking you are the only one that studies the Bible."

She already has and it's pretty clear some cannot discern spiritual things, nor can any of us apart from God. There's the difference some of us really have the Spirit of Christ and are sealed in grace. Others who think they are saved and don't know him are the hardest converts. They're already righteous with their abstinence of Christmas, and their prideful merit badge of OT righteousness in their Sabbath keeping, but God has said he came not to call the healthy but the sick. How can you be saved if God doesn't want you? If you can't be saved you won't know his Spirit and you'll pervert his word- read scripture till judgment day it won't help.
---Pharisee on 1/11/11


"that was a glorified body Christ was walking around in"

And it was the same one he DIED IN!!! where did Christians get the idea that they get a new Body, Jesus says in the future "Behold I make all things new" not behold I make all things again. Ecclesiastes says what God does he does forever that men may marvel, but many of us have reduced what he does to something that is temporary...that leaves only one conclusion, you've ceased to marvel at the works of God and reduced the knowledge of him to something that comes by clinical study like a cancer. My friends your dealing with the words of the LIVING GOD, and you've come saying you understand it, and because of that you'll never understand it.
---Pharisee on 1/11/11


1Cliff, if you cannot answer with a godly answer then please don't answer me with jokes. I never said He did not die in His incarnated state or that He went to hell. He died in the flesh and rose again. His Spirit did not die or went to sleep, He gave us His spirit before He died. After all He was God and in Spirit could not die. Only God can kill the spirit/soul and there is no way He kills Himself. Where in Scripture does it say the Father gave Him a new life, not found in Phi. 2:9? You make fun of Scripture because it does not go well with your theology so you joke about God's word to your own damnation. Debate, but do not joke for His Word is not to be made fun of.
---Mark_V. on 1/11/11


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Leslie//It is clear that NO one here reads their Bibles but ONLY goes with their opinion, beliefs, and teaching ...

I totally disagree as we see many on this forum that quote the Bible for their beliefs. Do not fall into the trap thinking you are the only one that studies the Bible.

// it will be our spirits that will be raised, not our bodies.

That belief is not found within what the church has believed since its beginning.

Apparently Job believed that he would see God while being in the flesh even after the flesh was wasted.

Job 19:26 And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:

And if you believe in the Apostles Creed, you believe in the resurrection of the body.
---leej on 1/10/11


It is clear that NO one here reads their Bibles but ONLY goes with their opinion, beliefs, and teaching - which are WRONG. The Bible says that the body dies FOREVER (2 Cor. 5:6,8, Hebrews 9:27). Yes Christians will be ressurected anew in the rapture, but it will be our spirits that will be raised, not our bodies, and Christ will give us a new body (Phil. 3:21 1 Cor. 15:44). Also, the soul and spirit are two different things (we are a spirit with a soul (mind, will, emotions) in a body) (1 Thess. 5:23, Hebrews 4:12).
---Leslie on 1/10/11


And yes false doctrine CAN destroy the faith of some. (2 Tim 2:18 Titus 1:11)

Odd that something given by God can be destroyed by man.

This is why we must FIGHT and armor ourselves against false teaching. Our faith CAN be overthrown!
---CraigA on 1/10/11


--Craig, as Ginger stated it is assumed--

And as with any assumption they are subject to being wrong. Meaning you cant use assumptions as "Biblical proof" of a doctrine that you adhere to.

For instance when the Word of God says Christ "tasted death for every man" and died "for the sins of the whole world" wouldnt it be an assumption to think those words do *NOT* mean EXACTLY what they say?

What if youre wrong and they DO mean exactly what they say? Think of the damage that is caused by killing the hope of millions of people because of an assumption.
---CraigA on 1/10/11


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Mark V,So your answer is no Christ did not die, but just "shed His body!"
Fundamentalist's belief as I see it= Jesus pretended to die ,His body lie in the tomb whilst he got on Dr.Noah's time machine went back 2,500 years, preached to the fallen angels, then went down to the Greco-Roman Hades too free the prisoners, which means he would have to kill Cerberus (the 3 headed dog guarding Hades) lead the dead out to paradise, then sneak back into the tomb ,put on His old body (showed Thomas)pretending to come back to life!
Truth- Christ died,did not take back His life,The Father gave him a new life and exalted Him to a higher position(Phil.2.9>as a well deserved reward!
---st_cliff on 1/10/11


Matthew 8:22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me, and let the dead bury their dead.
-They are dead, yet they breathe...
John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
-yet, we all die...
---micha9344 on 1/10/11


Craig, as Ginger stated it is assume because if he sinned he would die, of course meaning he would not live. Very simple. He could continue to live as long as he obeyed. This contract or covenant is an agreement, however covenants in the Bible are not usually equal agreements. Rather they follow a pattern common to the ancient Near Eastern suzerain-vassal treaties. Like contracts between a King and the conquered. There was no negotiation between the two parties. God showed who He (the Conquerer) compared to (whatman) was as Article one of chapter seven. Then God listed what He will require of those rules He gives, and third He list the blessings for obeying, and the curses for not obeying.
---Mark_V. on 1/10/11


CraigA, there is no verse that says that. It is assumed.
Adam was told he could eat of every tree in the garden.
That included the tree of life.
The only tree he was not allowed to eat from was the tree of know. of good and evil. If he did, his punishment was death.


Markv, that was a glorified body Christ was walking around in. Bible speaks of it. That is why he could walk through walls. We will receive the same body when Christ comes back for us. Until then. Yes, the soul does seperate from our fleshly body. The soul will be given a new body when Christ comes back.
---ginger on 1/10/11


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Those who believe in eternal torment believe God gives eternal life to everyone. But John 3:16 and numerous other scriptures say only those who believe in Christ receive eternal life. So says John in 1 John 5:11, 12.
Without Christ there is NO life, therefore the wicked cannot be living in eternity, not in heaven nor in hell. They cease to exist.
That's what Paul meant when he said, "The wages of sin is death"(Roms. 6:23). Not eternal torment. The idea that the God Who "LOVE" could torture people as some believe is strictly a pagan concept brought into the Christian Church by the church at Rome!
---Lynn on 1/10/11


Hebrews 6 explains that Christians of the apostasy insist on remaining "babes" (1 Corin. 3:1) instead of moving on to a mature devotion. They still perform "works" (deeds of righteousness) so they can have "repentance" as their foundation instead of having JESUS as their foundation, and they also only have a "faith" instead of a "faith for faith" Romans 1:17 (read all chapter 6 to understand better).

When works/repentance is their "foundation", they can no longer be restored to 'cleanliness' (it becomes "impossible"), but God is not so unjust as to overlook all of the "works" they have done. Yes, "spirit" can be lost to a "works devotion".
---more_excellent_way on 1/10/11


--Adam was promised eternal life if he obeyed--

I cant find this in Genesis, Mark. What verse says this?
---CraigA on 1/10/11


1Cliff, I too believe I am talking to Christians, but every subject talked about has it's own context or meaning. So in order for a person to respond correctly the passage has to be in the context of the message. Resurrection might have one meaning in one passage and another meaning in another passage depending what the context is about, or what the writer was trying to tell us. The word "world" "soul" and "spirit" also has different meanings depending on the passage. When you throw all kinds of words out there, in order for a person to answer correctly they need to know where you got that word from. Overwhelming people with a lot of words you limit what the other person wants to say to answer correctly.
---Mark_V. on 1/10/11


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1Cliff 2: Concerning your question, I believe that the Christ (the Word) came in the flesh and lived among us. Jesus was the name given to Him at birth, had a physical body just like us, but His Spirit was Christ the Lord. When He died, He died a physical death just like us, but He gave up His spirit to the Father before His death. Since His Spirit is eternal for He is God, His Spirit never died. He (body) resurrected in three days, which means His Spirit and body united. For He was touch by man to show He was a man again. He had a special body for He could go through walls. Don't ask me how. That is what Scripture tells us.
---Mark_V. on 1/10/11


-- Leon :

Where in the Bible does it say your physical body dies forever --Leon

Brother, The LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and Breathed into his nostrils the Breath of Life, and man became a Living Soul. "The dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it." Eccl.12:7
---ShawnM.T. on 1/9/11


Mark v, I assume that I'm talking to Christians who know the bible and don't feel it necessary to cite every one (we have a limit)
One question for you- Do you believe that Jesus actually "died" on Calvary, or just shed a body?(while actually remaining alive)
---1st_cliff on 1/9/11


Apparently Job believed that he would see God while being in the flesh even after the flesh was wasted.

Job 19:26 And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:
---leej on 1/9/11


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Blogger9211: If a deceased person's soul & spirit ceases to exist, what is there left to resurrect? How is something that no longer exist reconstituted? Thank you. :)
---Leon on 1/9/11


Leslie, you seem don't to understand the meaning of soul and spirit. You don't not have a soul, you are a soul, a living breathing creature [a mammal]. A Spirit is more special, it makes you personality unique and provides you with the intellect exclusive to human beings. When you die both your sour and sprit cease to exist. Christ and the Apostils had the power to resurrect individuals from death and reconstituting their souls and sprits from death At the time of the General resurrection all humanity will be resurrected in a new soul [resurrection body] suitable for habitation in an environment that God the Father has chosen for you, for eternity. In the interim between life and the general resurrection you [all mystification's] are just dead.
---Blogger9211 on 1/9/11


Where in the Bible does it say your physical body dies forever Leslie?
---Leon on 1/8/11


Your body dies FOREVER when you die. Your spirit and soul live FOREVER either in Heaven or Hell when you die. This is according to the Bible.
---Leslie on 1/8/11
First your statement is arrogant, you should say this is according to the way I understand the Bible.
Actually what I believe the Bible shows overall is different. Jesus says plainly that when he calls the graves will be opened and the dead will come forth to a resurrection of the just or the unjust. (John5:29) If what you say is true, then what point is there in this saying?
There will be resurrection! [1 thes 4:6 matt 22:30 Luke 14:4 John 11:24 Acts 4:2 Acts 23:6 Acts 24:15 1 Cor 15:12 & Just read all of 1 cor 15 again.] There's more but I'll stop there.
---Pharisee on 1/8/11


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Do not be afraid of man for he can only kill the body, but be afraid of God for he can kill the body AND the spirit.

When a person dies, he does not go to heaven or to hell. the body is dead and the spirit is asleep.

There are two resurrections: the first when Jesus returns and the DEAD in Christ rise and the living are caught up with the dead.

Second, when, after a thousand years, all the other dead rise and shall be judged from the Book of Life - according to their works.
---Steveng on 1/8/11


Leslie: "Your body dies FOREVER when you die."

At the soon coming of Jesus, it is said that the dead shall rise first and the living shall be caught up with the dead. Our physical bodies are what is changing into uncorruptible bodies. Just like Jesus' body before he went to heaven. Jesus was not a spirit, but was transformed into an uncorruptible body. And your body, too, can change from a corruptible body into an incorruptible body when you do only what Jesus has preached. "Doing" the one command Jesus spoke of: to love.
---Steveng on 1/8/11


I agree completely 1st CLiff. If a person did not 'die', in every sense of the word, there would be no need for a resurrection. The word "resurrection" "Anatasis" in the language used in the N.T. literally means "a standing up, a rising from the dead, a restoration to life, to raise to life again." (Strong's)
In the english language of today the word is defined as "the act of rising from the dead. a rising again, as from decay, disuse, etc." (W.E.D)
Even the Collins "Christian" dictionary defines "The resurrection" as
1. The rising again of Christ from the tomb three days after his death
2. The rising again from the dead of all mankind at the Last Judgment
---joseph on 1/8/11


Leslie, This should be an easy one for you.. since the soul is mentioned more than 800 times in the bible , show me "one" place it is said to be immortal ,deathless or never dieing!
---1st_cliff on 1/9/11


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1Cliff, when you answer you throw many subjects together, and without Scripture to try to overwhelm others to the point they cannot answer you. Then seat back and glory on what you do. And when you answer, you put no Scripture to support you view just your opinion, and when someone gives you Scripture, you do not answer them with Scripture to proof your point of view. I notice the same tricks from others whom I and others answer that all the passages we give, all they do is talk a lot with no Scripture either, and they completely ignore the Scriptures we put down and answer with a lot of opinions. If you want to debate a subject at least you can give someone a chance to answer, but don't try to overwhelm with twenty opinions.
---Mark_V. on 1/9/11


A born again believers spirit is promise eternal life. Not temporary, nor is it conditional on man's works, but a gift of God through regeneration and commitment to Christ through faith along.
Adam was promised eternal life if he obeyed, he failed and death came to all men, on the other hand we are promise eternal life through faith in Jesus Christ. "And not of works, lest anyone should boast."
---Mark_V. on 1/9/11


When you understand man's creation, you need not ask this question. Genesis 2:7. Man is made of only two components-body and breath (spirit). At death, the reverse occurs. The body returns to dust, the breath (spirit) returns to God. The soul ceases to exist until the resurrection when a new body (for the saved) will be created and the breath of life restored. There is NOTHING immortal about natural man! God ONLY has immortality 1Tim 6:16. The saved receive immortailty at the resurrection. 1 Cor. 15:51-55. No mention anywhere in scripture that there is an immortal soul or spirit except the Holy Spirit.
---Lynn on 1/9/11


Your body dies FOREVER when you die. Your spirit and soul live FOREVER either in Heaven or Hell when you die. This is according to the Bible.
---Leslie on 1/8/11


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Thanks Mima, that was nice of your to say.:-} It's great when someone agrees with you.:-}
---Reba on 1/8/11


Pharisee, ""I have put before you life and death...choose life that you may live"Deut.30.19,(notice) not life and eternal torture!
When Jesus died on Calvary it was not His body that bought your salvation (think about it) but his "life" He did not go gallivanting around the universe but was actually "dead" would have stayed dead if His father did not resurrect him, this is what he sacrificed "HIS LIFE" not his body!
Difficult to grasp the concept that He put His life on the line ,not just drop an old body and pick up a new one....what's that?
It's giving up His "life" for you and I,not just changing bodies!
---1st_cliff on 1/8/11


Pharisee, **gave up the ghost**=gave up his life's breath.
Did he just pretend to die? NO!He was dead ,not just His body , but completely,else what is "resurrection?" Not a body coming back to life but a "person".
So you're contending that God is not that merciful to just let the human die?wake him up and smack him again??
The wages of sin is not "torture".Death is not "punishment"?or not enough?
Sorry, no slander intended,the "you" was not personal!
---1st_cliff on 1/8/11


This answer is worth repeating.
"I believe when the body dies the Spirit goes to be with the LORD or hell, which ever you've decided before death. Then the Spirit lives on forever, for eternity. God tells the Christians to be absent from the body is to be present with the LORD. The Spirit never dies, it lives forever."
---Reba on 1/7/11
---mima on 1/8/11


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My understanding is that at physical death, the soul/spirit and body separate.

If the spirit can die in a way analagous to physical death, I haven't thought about.

Of course, many times in the Bible, "death" and "die" are used in figurative and metaphorical senses.
---Cluny on 1/8/11


Cliff please don't slander me with what you assume about me. Revenge is not the reason for my belief. It's more that God has said that he would punish sin, what you believe contradicts God's word and the truth evidenced by his son on the cross.

The fact that Christ paid the price that he did is proof that sinners won't get tucked in sweetly to eternal beddie bye like good little campers. Tell me what it means that Jesus "gave up the ghost." It's this simple: either you believe God or you don't, I won't call him a liar, neither do I think you are consciously doing so, but nonetheless it's what it amounts to when you won't take him at his word.
---Pharisee on 1/7/11


Pharisee, Defining "spirit" can be difficult,especially if you try to work in the word soul as synonyms!
Ruach Heb,psyche Gr. are defined as "air" wind breath etc. Pneumonia and pneumatic come from this root word.
We are a "one piece" entity, when die we are only brought to life by resurrection,in one piece.
Simple statement "the wages of sin is death, the gift of God is eternal life"
Why the words "eternal life? The alternate is "eternal death".God is a God of justice and mercy, what's more merciful than just letting the sinner die?
You want revenge????not God!
---1st_cliff on 1/7/11


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