ChristiaNet MallWorld's Largest Christian MallChristian BlogsFree Bible QuizzesFree Ecards and Free Greeting CardsLoans, Debt, Business and Insurance Articles

Authority To Change God's Law

Who on earth has authority to change God's handwritten law?

Join Our Christian Penpals and Take The Ten Commandments Bible Quiz
 ---jerry6593 on 1/16/11
     Helpful Blog Vote (3)

Post a New Blog



-- Francis :

Sister, The fear of the LORD, that is Wisdom, and to depart from evil is Understanding. Job 28:28. Wisdom is this principal thing we're all to get, and with all our getting we're to get Understanding.

Having eyes Francis you cannot See and having ears you will not Hear, all b/c you continue to cling to that which isn't God's Word & will not depart from the evil which you have been deceived into believing about the law not changing.

This is why Francis you're not sure & are unable to accept the Understanding of God's Word I'm sharing with you that you asked to see which is by Christ "The priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a CHANGE also of the law." Heb.7:12
---Shawn.M.T. on 1/21/11


Hebrews 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.
-Not 'in' the law, 'of' the law...this may be where you falter francis.
The law has changed, yet our God and Saviour have not.
Jeremiah 31:32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day [that] I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt,
Hebrews 8:13 In that he saith, A new [covenant], he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old [is] ready to vanish away.
Hebrews 8:7 For if that first [covenant] had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
John 1:17 For the law was given by Moses, [but] grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
---micha9344 on 1/20/11


Hebrews 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.
Hebrews 7:28 For the law maketh men high priests which have infirmity, but the word of the oath, which was since the law, maketh the Son, who is consecrated for evermore.

So the law changed to make CHRIST our high priest.

HHMM interesting:
Psalms 110:4 The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.

Here before the book of hebrews was written, The bible declars that God has spoken and will not change his mind, that Jesus is a priest forever.

That does not mean in any way shape or form that the Ten commandments, or dietary laws were changed.
---francis on 1/20/11


Psalms 110:4 The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou [art] a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.


Hebrews 7:23 And they truly were many priests, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death:
Hebrews 7:24 But this man, because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.
Hebrews 7:28 For the law maketh men high priests which have infirmity, but the word of the oath, which was since the law, [maketh] the Son, who is consecrated for evermore.

so when did christ become high priest?
---francis on 1/20/11


Jude 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
---francis on 1/20/11




We should never condemn anyone for food. That is clear. We can suggest and point out that GOD who designed us told HIS people a better diet and so we should follow that diet.

Now I will not judge anyone on the Sabbath. For it is not my job to be a judge. That is up to JESUS alone. I can teach that GOD gave Ten Commandments and they all should be considered equal.

The Law is fulfilled but not destroyed. What is the purpose of the law? To define sin. Not save just tell us what is right and wrong. That is why JESUS said he came to fulfill not destroy.
---Samuel on 1/20/11


francis, you've not yet answered my question about why you pick and choose which of God's sabbaths you observe.
---Cluny on 1/19/11
Sorry I did not se your question. Good question:
Leviticus 16:30 For on that day shall the priest make an atonement for you, to cleanse you, [that] ye may be clean from all your sins before the LORD.
Leviticus 16:31 It shall be a sabbath of rest unto you, and ye shall afflict your souls, by a statute for ever.

Day of atonement is also a sabbath, and your quetsion is why do i not observe this and observe theone inthe ten commandments correct?
---francis on 1/20/11


\\SO the priesthood being change, there is a change in the Law. What change?
---francis on 1/20/11\\

Read Hebrews, francis.
---Cluny on 1/20/11


Day of atonement, passover, and many other feast days were considered sabbath. A day of rest.
Some christians still observe the significance of these days at the approiate times.
These feasta are: Colossians 2:17 a shadow of things to come,
We are free to do so if we choose, and not be judged by anyone for it:
Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Others choose not to keep them and that is OK too:
Romans 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

But those feast days are Leviticus 23:38 Beside the sabbaths of the LORD
---francis on 1/20/11


---Shawn.M.T on 1/19/11

I am not sure what you are trying to say, and neither are you.
SO the priesthood being change, there is a change in the Law. What change?
---francis on 1/20/11




\\THE LAW MUST BE FULFILL.
ALL OF IT!!!
---John on 1/19/11\\

Are you saying that Christ did not fulfill all of the Law, John?

francis, you've not yet answered my question about why you pick and choose which of God's sabbaths you observe.
---Cluny on 1/19/11


The answer to the blog question is very simple...
Christ.

Shawn, great scripture.
You too Kath.

Christ said clearly that if we do the first 2, we automatically do the other 8.
Only in Christ can we do these.
If you love God and love your neighbor, truly you would not bang people over the head to worship on the same day you do.
Christ said through Paul not to do that. Not every man esteemeth the same day to God never the less, do all this unto God.
The same is said about food. If eating causes you to lose faith, thus causes you to sin, then don't do it. BUT don't judge someone else if they eat because they are not condemned of it if they eat.
---ginger on 1/20/11


-- Francis :

Brother, Christ who was on earth "abolished in His flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances.(Eph.2:13-15)"... But not God's Ten Commandments !!!

It's God's Ten Commandments which were written by His hand (Exodus 31:18)...

Francis, as a new Child of God learn the difference between the Ten Commandments & the ordinances of the law of commandments, and as you depart from the evil of being led astray into believing Scriptures shares that "God & Jesus both said that they will not & did not come to change the law", you'll Understand that "The priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a CHANGE also of the law." Heb.7:12
---Shawn.M.T on 1/19/11


Go sacrifice your son on an altar and build an ark..
Different commands for different people.
All for their salvation through their faith.
---micha9344 on 1/19/11


THE LAW IS UNCHANGABLE AND WILL EXIST FOR ETERNITY!
-
Matthew 5:18... I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.

We are in a Grace period (like a credit card grace period). Man could not fulfill the law. BUT HE MUST in order to enter The Kingdom. Christ fulfilled it and for the moment we have our High Priest holding the dam of wrath for us and keeping us saved. However, we all individually must fulfill the Law as well. When we acquire our heavenly bodies. We will then individually fulfill the Law.

THE LAW MUST BE FULFILL.
ALL OF IT!!!
---John on 1/19/11


A number of times God/ Jesus said that there will be NO CHANGE:

Numbers 23:19 God is not a man, that he should lie, neither the son of man, that he should repent:

Psalms 102:27 But thou art the same,

Malachi 3:6 I change not,

Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Luke 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.

Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

James 1:17 the Father..with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

Psalms 138:2 for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name
---francis on 1/19/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Bible Study


Lets say that i am new to christianity, i know what God and jesus both said that they will not change the law,and jesus specifically says he did not come to change the law.

So as a new christian I would like a scripture to show me Who on earth has authority to change God's handwritten law?
---francis on 1/19/11


The "covenant of grace," then, is that arrangement whereby God planned to save man from the just consequences of his sin, namely, immorality, misery, death, and damnation.
---leej on 1/19/11
LeeJ, any good bible student knows it's called the Everlasting Covenent. Hebrews 13:20-21

Your covenent leaves out the BLOOD,death and resurrection, and finished work of Christ on the CROSS whereby anyone can find salvation THROUGH Jesus Christ.

It's the covenent announced in Genesis 3:15, more fully explained to Abraham.

It's a covenent anyone can come BY FAITH....
And it's the root, (covenent) YOU a wild branch were grafted into.

The Bible clearly gives it a NAME and description. Hebrews 13:20-21
---kathr4453 on 1/19/11


I think the problem here especially with Jerry is that he believes one can with the indwelling Holy Spirit be enabled to obey all the law and thus merit eternal salvation.

Howbeit this make the law our savior rather than Jesus and works of the law are regarded as filthy rags. We are saved by the blood of Christ, not by obedience to law.

If obedience to the law is the means to our salvation, then we would have to conclude that salvation is not wholly of God but in our hands.

Salvation which depends upon man is no more dependable than man himself. But salvation which depends upon God entirely is entirely dependable.

Adventists are really Arminian in their soteriology.
---leej on 1/19/11


Jerry - do we limit scripture to the Old Testament alone as Adventist would want?

Even if Paul in 2 Tim. 3:16 viewed only the OT as scripture, the New Testament refers to Pauls writings as scripture.And that has always been the view of the catholic church.

3 Peter 3:16 As also in all his (Paul) epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to be understood, which they (esp. Adventists, the slave children of Hagar) that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
---leej on 1/19/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Bible Verses


francis//Who on earth has authority to change God's handwritten law?

The question has been answered very directly.

But what you demand is something others regard as not being the truth.

Was the law changed?

Yes, it was from the Old to the New Covenant.

Take for instances the law pertaining to physical circumcision.
Was it required of the Jewish people?

Yes!

But was it required for Gentile converts?

NO, as we read that conclusion in the Jerusalem council Acts 15.

To go even further, was the Sabbath mandated to Gentile Christians?

NO, again, as there is virtually not even a hint in the New testament that Gentiles needed to observe any law distinctly Jewish.
---leej on 1/19/11


-- Jerry :

change God's Ten Commandment-- Jerry

Brother, Your Blog Question asked about the law not God's Ten Commandments... Do you know the difference ?

God hasn't changed His Ten Commandments but He has changed the law b/c by the law all were condemned under the law but after Faith in Christ is come, we are no longer under the law... we're under Grace, which is a change to the law.

God changed the law in Act 10:11-15, when Paul was told to 'Rise Kill & Eat' b/c What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common. John 4:19-24 changed the law when Christ said the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain nor at Jerusalem worship the Father... b/c True Worshipers Worship in Spirit & in Truth.
---ShawnM.T. on 1/19/11


Kathr //No such thing as the Covenant of Grace."

It is well defined in the literature.

The word "covenant" means a disposition or an arrangement. This arrangement is made by God alone. Man has no part in its making. Man must either accept the arrangement God has made or receive no covenant at all.

The word "grace" means undeserved favor. The grace of God is divine favor manifested to sinners who deserve just the opposite: his disfavor and wrath.

The "covenant of grace," then, is that arrangement whereby God planned to save man from the just consequences of his sin, namely, immorality, misery, death, and damnation.
---leej on 1/19/11


By the way, I have no problem with people worshiping on Saturday. The Bible says let everything that is done be done unto the Lord.
If I was visiting with a relative that worshiped on Saturday, I would go with them to worship because it is not about the day. It is about God.
---ginger on 1/19/11


Send a Free Holiday Ecard


Kathr, you said again,

No such thing as the Covenant of Grace."

That is the reason why you do not know the Truth. Because you cannot find Grace with God. You build theories which contradict the Word of God. The gospel you preach is not of Grace it is of works. You are still depraved and do not even know it. The reason you said you came to Christ with no repentance or conviction by the Holy Spirit, and no faith. If God had graciously brought you to life in Christ, you would have had received the gift of faith and gotten a conviction of your rebellion against God and would have repented. But you had neither.
---Mark_V. on 1/19/11


---ginger on 1/19/11

2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

When Paul said all scripture do you supposed he meant what we call NT?
All scripture means ALL scripture, not just the once you think apply to you.
---francis on 1/19/11


jerry//From your remarks, one can only conclude that you believe that you - or perhaps Paul - indeed have the authority to change God's Ten Commandment Law.

I have already answer your question several times.

While NO ONE has authority to change God's word / laws, some are NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT applicable to the Christian walk.

God's word told Noah to go built a boat, but are you doing that? God's word also commanded the Jews only to observe the Sabbath, but was that imposed on Gentile converts?

You really need to study Acts 15 otherwise you will continue to be troubled in spirit by false teachings.
---leej on 1/19/11


Most people have given their opinion, and what they believe.
If someone came here who was a none christian, i think they would like to see what the bible says.
Who on earth has authority to change God's handwritten law?
---francis on 1/19/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Arthritis


Lee: I note that you have contributed 11 entries to this blog (this is my second), and yet you've made no attempt to answer the blog question - just the same old tired, anti-biblical, anti-SDA, anti-Jew rhetoric. Perhaps you, like Hitler, think that if you repeat a lie often enough, it will become truth. Come to think of it, Hitler was also a Jew hater.

From your remarks, one can only conclude that you believe that you - or perhaps Paul - indeed have the authority to change God's Ten Commandment Law. How self aggrandizing of you.
---jerry6593 on 1/19/11


Francis, if you believe they are for you, then do them.
But no where in the commandments given by Christ are we told we can't eat what we want to. It is now left up to us as individuals.
All the law is summed up in the 2 given by Christ.
If in those 2 you don't eat certain things because God told YOU not to, then by all means follow it. If I were at your table, I would eat what you eat and if you were at mine, I would eat what you eat so not to offend you.
That is what #2 law given has to do with food.
You don't dictate what day or food a person has to eat or honor. God does. And in loving your neighbor, you would stop beating them over the head with it. And love them.
---ginger on 1/19/11


Francis 2:
Jesus is the first person to get into heaven by His good works. We also get into heaven by good works but the good works of Jesus. Jesus works become "our good works" when we receive Christ by faith. When we put our faith in Christ, God credits the good works of Christ to our account. The covenant of Grace fulfills the covenant of works because God graciously applies the merits of Christ to our account. Thus by grace we meet the terms set forth in the covenant of works---Mark_V. on 1/18/11

No such thing as the Covenant of Grace. And Jesus opened the way to the Father by His own blood.

Jesus didn't WORK His way to heaven. Jesus is GOD.

We don't WORK our way to heaven either, by His works in us.
---kathr4453 on 1/19/11


What I see you and others doing is trying to achieve your own righteousness.
---Mark_V. on 1/18/11

I hear this all the time. let me give you a BIBLICAL QUESTION that will help you.

Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?

Romans 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace?
---francis on 1/19/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Asthma


Romans 8:16 Do you not know that if you present yourselves to anyone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness?

Since it is not not a sin to eat food of any kind, the verse is irrevelant.

1Co 8:8 Food will not commend us to God. We are no worse off if we do not eat, and no better off if we do.

And even Jesus in Mark 7 and Matthew 15 told us that what goes into the stomach does no defile us but what comes out of the heart.

The major problem with you Adventists is that you really have to ignore any scripture that does not fit your designed religious beliefs.
---leej on 1/18/11


Mark 2:27-28 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.
---micha9344 on 1/18/11


Francis 2:
Jesus is the first person to get into heaven by His good works. We also get into heaven by good works but the good works of Jesus. Jesus works become "our good works" when we receive Christ by faith. When we put our faith in Christ, God credits the good works of Christ to our account. The covenant of Grace fulfills the covenant of works because God graciously applies the merits of Christ to our account. Thus by grace we meet the terms set forth in the covenant of works.
What I see you and others doing is trying to achieve your own righteousness.
---Mark_V. on 1/18/11


leej on 1/18/11
When ever you see the phrase " love thy neighbour" It is usually accompanied by one of the last six of the commandments. Matthew 19:19 Honour thy father and [thy] mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

The first four tells us how to love God, the last six how to love our neighbour.
The sabbath commandment falls in the first four, it is one of four which shows love for God by honouring him as our creator.

How does dietary laws show love for God.
1: The first commandments says that we have only ONE GOD. Whenever we choose to disobey any law from god we make ourselves God. So when God says do not eat, and we eat, we make ourselves god. Romans 6:16
---Francis on 1/18/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Cholesterol


francis //Deuteronomy 6:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might. Leviticus 19:18 thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself

Beautiful! So if we love our neighbor we do fulfill the law.

Romans 13:9-10 The commandments, You shall not commit adultery, not murder, not steal, not covet, and any other commandment, are summed up in this word: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. ...therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

But what does Levitical dietary and Sabbath laws have to do with love of neighbor???? If francis answers 'nothing', he has the right answer.

In other words, they are not applicable to the Christian's walk.
---leej on 1/18/11


Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]:
---micha9344 on 1/18/11


frnacis //You do realize you break this one everytime you condemn others who don't worship on saturday like you do?

Yes, Colossians 2:16 is very clear we are not to judge others on what we eat or the day we observe.

I would like either Jerry or Francis to respond to this question.

Do Adventists believe themselves to be given a special annointing from God to judge other Christians in what they believe and practice?
---leej on 1/18/11


Ginger Leviticus 19:18 love thy neighbour as thyself:
Deuteronomy 6:5 love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

See these are OT LAWS not NT LAWS

Jeremiah 31:31 I will make a new covenant..Jeremiah 31:33 I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts

God did not promise to take away His Laws from his people. He promised under the new covenant to put them in OUR HEARTS:
Someone else has convinced you that rather than have the laws in your hearts, that they are done away with.
---francis on 1/18/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Lasik Surgery


Francis, the nature, character and attributes of God never change for He is the same yesterday, today and forever. What does change are His Covenants. Some greater then others. The Covenant of works is the basis of our need of redemption (because we have violated it) and our hope of redemption (because Christ has fulfilled its terms for us).
Because Adam fell into sin, God, in His mercy, added a new covenant of grace by which salvation became possible and actual. Only one human being has ever kept the covenant of works. That person was Jesus. His work as the second Adam fulfilled all the terms of our original covenant with God. His merit in achieving this is available to all who put their trust in Him.
---Mark_V. on 1/18/11


Francis, there was a change. Again get out of the Old covenant in get into the new which is Christ because you cannot keep the law without him.

What happened to the other 600 laws, Francis?
God removed them and they are not for us anyway.
They are summed up into 2 laws that we must follow. Nothing about having to worship on the sabbath on a certain day anymore.

Love God

He says love your neighbor as you love youself.

Francis, You do realize you break this one everytime you condemn others who don't worship on saturday like you do.
---ginger on 1/18/11


Scott on 1/17/11 :Romans 3:20 for by the law is the knowledge of sin. Leviticus 20:7 Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am the LORD your God.
1 Peter 1:16 Be ye holy, for I am holy.

Genesis 6:6
And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.-Cluny on 1/17/11
It hurt God that man had sinned, but God could not change his mind about creating man, man was already created.

All the law is summed up in only 2 that Christ gave us.ginger on 1/18/11
Deuteronomy 6:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might. Leviticus 19:18 thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself:

NO CHANGE
---francis on 1/18/11


//Think not I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

yes, we can agree that Christ came to fulfill the law "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes". Romans 10:4

It is all about Jesus and the grace He provides for those who would believe.

For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

Poor foolish ignorant Adventists, they continue to believe they can become righteous by the law.
---leej on 1/18/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Bullion


//Wasn't it Jesus? Have you heard of Him?
---alan8566_of_uk on 1/16/11 //

Yes, Alan, I've heard of Him. He's the one who said:

Joh 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. [It was His finger that wrote the Ten Commandments.]

Mat 5:17, 18 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Heb 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
---jerry6593 on 1/18/11


Thank you for that, Cluny.

Frances, God changed mind.
OT- is the history/fortelling of Christ our saviour.
If he hadn't come, the laws you keep saying WE must keep, would condemn us to hell. All of us are guilty.
NT- Christ has come and we are set free from the condemnation of the law. Jesus said ALL the law is summed up in only 2 that Christ gave us. If you do those 2, you have obeyed all of the law. Only in Christ can anyone do this. Are you going to continue in the sacrifice of bulls/goats or believe Christ who died for your sins and rose again so you could be free from this?
Also, Condemning others for not worshiping as you do is breaking law number 2 that Christ gave, love neighbor as you love yourself.
---ginger on 1/18/11


\\If you knew nothing else about God, it would be that God does not change his word.\\

Genesis 6:6
And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

To repent is to change your mind, and hence your words.

It's also curious that the first three times the KJV uses the word "repented", it refers to God Himself.
---Cluny on 1/17/11


If you know God at all, then you must believe that God:
James 1:17 is no variableness, neither shadow of turning
2 Corinthians 1:20 For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen,
Numbers 23:19 God [is] not a man, that he should lie, neither the son of man, that he should repent:
Psalms 138:2: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.
Malachi 3:6 For I the LORD, I change not,
Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

I don't care what denomination you claim, please do not let any man tell you that God has changed his laws or his words.Or worse do not let your pride deceive you to believe that God has changed after saying so many times he will not.
---francis on 1/17/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Menopause


In some things a christian can be deceived. But when it comes to God, no christian should be deceived.
If you knew nothing else about God, it would be that God does not change his word.

Most people use their position to change their word. One might say " I am the boss" or " I am the dad so I can change my word."
God gives us an assurance, that allthough he is God, his word will never change. God places his word, above all that is his name.
Psalms 138:2 for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

At no time can God say that because he is God,he can change his word. He placed his word above his title.

No christian can be deceived by anyone claiming that God has changed his word.
---FRANCIS on 1/17/11


The law cannot be changed. however the purpose of the law can change. In the OT the law is to show what sin is and to separate Jews from other cultures (make holy). As NT christians we do not have to obey the OT letters of the law. examples tattoos, clothing of 2 different materials (jeans), sacrificing animals. Jesus freed us from the law. This change is from GOD not man. So know one can change God's law
---Scott on 1/17/11


//We are not in the OT/Old covenant but the NT/NEW covenant.

Adventists like Francis & Jerry simply do not accept that as if they believed the church was under the New Covenant, they would have to reject observance of the Jewish Sabbath as there is not so much as a hint of a command to observe any day as holy in the New Covenant.

They also have to sort thru all 600+ laws/commands of the Old Covenant, and then decide which ones had their fulfillment and which ones are still applicable. But that requires of them some sort of 'pope' or spiritual leader who in their case is that Ellen White.

I have noted that they are very quick to ignore what the New Testament states as the Old Covenant overrules the New Covenant.
---leej on 1/17/11


Shawn.M.T//... for HE has put His laws into our Minds & written them in our Hearts... Heb.8:10-12

And what laws has God written on our hearts?

There are over 600+ laws in the Old Covenant.

Some are moral laws found in nearly every culture, some are civic laws governoring the state, and others are simply ceremonial.

That has been the problem with some that advocate observance of OT laws not found in the New Covenant. They have a problem is sorting them out and then determining which are applicable to the Christian (or which ones God has written or not written).

In any case, love of neighbor fulfills the law.Romans 13:9
---leej on 1/17/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Christian Penpals


GINGER God did not divide his word Into OT and NT.The word of God is divided by LAW, prophets and psalms.
But for your sake let me use NT scriptures:

Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever. Be not carried about with divers and strange doctrines

same doctrine YESTERDAY ( before the cross)
Same doctrine today( After the cross)
Same doctrine tommorow. So do not be deceived by people who say that God has changed his laws or his doctrines

James 1:17..with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

James 1:8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.
---francis on 1/17/11


NO ONE CAN!!! The laws are fixed and will remain so for eternity!

No laws, No existance!
---John on 1/17/11


While God has the authority to command anyone in His creation, we need to understand to whom He is addressing.

For instance, He commanded Noah to go build a boat, but are we to do the same?

He also commanded the Israelites to observe the Sabbath, but is that command also for us?

I think not, as clearly there is nothing in the New Covenant of the church that commands anyone to observe any day as holy.

So, while the written law given only to the nation of Israel may not change, many of those laws are not applicable to the Christian.
---leej on 1/17/11


No, no, no, Francis.. You dug in the OT/OC that points to Christ.
We are not in the OT/Old covenant but the NT/NEW covenant.
Christ clearly says he did away with the old covenant. Can we stick with that please.
The prophets and scripture of OT POINT to Christ fullfilling the law and coming to give us a NEW covenant. Christ is our fulfillment, not the law. We can't even obey the law without Christ. He changed that. In Christ we can do all things.
OT/OC..written on stone tablets..NT/NC..written on our hearts. So, Christ did change it and he does have the authority to. Can you show me where Christ doesn't?

Thank you MarkV, that really means a lot coming from you brother.
---ginger on 1/17/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Accounting


-- Francis :

show one biblical text for changing God's law-- Francis

Brother, Act 10:11-15 changed the law, When Paul was told by God to 'Rise Kill & Eat' b/c What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.

John 4:19-24 changed the law when Christ said the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain nor at Jerusalem worship the Father... b/c True Worshipers Worship in Spirit & in Truth.

Gal.3:25 changed to the law, b/c after Faith in Christ has come, we're no longer under the law.


--- MarkV & Ginger :

Brethren, Amen ~ We keep & fulfill the whole law by being in Christ... for HE has put His laws into our Minds & written them in our Hearts... Heb.8:10-12
---Shawn.M.T on 1/17/11


Jesus has the authority and the honesty to change how we understand it.

"Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor." (Galatians 3:24-25)

John, chapter five > Jesus healed that man at the pool called Bethesda. Then He told the man, "Rise, take up your bed and walk." It was the Sabbath. The man could have come back another day to get his bed, but Jesus commanded him to carry his bed. The Jews understood that carrying his bed was working on the Sabbath. Jesus understands the law better than humans do > Proverbs 3:5-6 > Do exactly what Jesus personally directs you to do, like he did.
---Bill_willa6989 on 1/17/11


Ginger, what you said is very true. We ourselves cannot fulfill the law, we needed Christ to do that for us. Everyone who is lost is under the condemnation of the law, and need very much for Christ to fulfill the law for them. Otherwise they are still condemned under the law trying to fulfill the law on their own merits and no one can do that, for there is no salvation under the law. When the individuals who are lost place their faith in Jesus Christ, Christ will fulfill the Law for them. And they will no longer be under the condemnation of the Law.
---Mark_V. on 1/17/11


Christ can. SHow me the scripture where it says he cannot or did not?
---ginger on 1/16/11

Ginger that is a very good question. The answer is that Christ or God cannot change his laws once he has made them.
Numbers 23:19 God [is] not a man, that he should lie, neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do [it]? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?
Psalms 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.
James 1:8 A double minded man [is] unstable in all his ways.
---francis on 1/17/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Fundraisers


francis,
The question asked Who has the authority to change God's law.
I answered it.
Christ can. SHow me the scripture where it says he cannot or did not?
Didn't CHrist remove the death penalty for us? Yes he did.
Didn't he say HE is our rest and we are to rest everyday in him? Yes he did. We have been around this tree several times. I am tired of it.
It is not us who follows or fulfills the law but CHRIST in us who does this. We can't even follow the law without being in CHrist or him in us.
---ginger on 1/16/11


End the fight, show the text where jesus changed the law.
---francis on 1/16/11

That would be a mute point, as Jesus IS God. But in Matthew, He said that He had not come to abolish the Law or the Prophets, but to fulfill them. (5:17) He modified the Law when He commanded us to love our enemies, but again, He is God.
---CalicoHawk on 1/16/11


leej, Barnabas gives no biblcal, divine, spiritual, or spirtual support.

In this case anyone could say "I keep friday because it was the day the lord died." or "I keep thursday because it was the day the lord instituted the lords supper of the new covenant."

Proverbs 16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof [are] the ways of death.

Thus far NO ONE is yet to show one JOT or ONE biblical text for changing Gods law. All have given MAN's reason, but no one can say God did it with any scripture.

If you cannot show who has authotity to change God's law, neither can you show in the bible a change, are you then really following God?
---francis on 1/16/11


NO one has this authority but God Himself. The Bible says God and His Word are the same yesterday, today, and FOREVER and they do NOT change. The Bible also says we are NOT to add to or take away from His Word, or He will NOT hold us guiltless.
---Leslie on 1/16/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Ecommerce


LEEJ you need time to think about your beliefs. :
1:No one has the right to change what God has ordained.
2: Paul did not teach against the Law of Moses ( law of the jews)Ac 25:8 Paul argued in his defense, "Neither against the law of the Jews, nor against the temple, nor against Caesar have I committed any offense."
leej on 1/16/11
3: And yes, there were a mixture of both Jews and Gentiles present in the synagogues, the latter were viewed as proselytes - converts to Judaism.

leej on 1/8/11
4: While I can agree the earliest church was all Jewish, once Gentile converts came into the church, the decision was made that they did not have to convert to Judaism to be genuine. leej on 1/7/11
---francis on 1/16/11


francis //The seventh-day Sabbath was solemnized ...until the Council of Laodicea did, in a manner, quite abolish the observance of it.

You cannot use the Council of Laodicea as a defense for the Sabbath as that council was strictly a regional conference, Rome was not even involved.

If you want to quotes to view, consider those of the early church -

"We keep the 8th day [sunday] with joyfulness, the day also which Jesus arose from the dead' (Letter of Barnabas, A.D. 74)

It is no wonder that even some Adventist historians agree in their research that the Jewish sabbath was no longer observed by the end of the 1st century.

Sorry that you have no good arguments for support of the sabbath. Sad is it not?
---leej on 1/16/11


Christ!!!
And he did. We can worship when we how we want and when we want. In fact every day is given by the Lord.

I agree with pharisees , I think you ask these questions to start a fight.
---ginger on 1/16/

End the fight, show the text where jesus changed the law.
---francis on 1/16/11


\\"They know little who do not know that the ancient Sabbath remained and was observed by the Eastern churches three hundred years after our Savior's passion"
[Prof. Brerewood: Treatise on the Sabbath]\\

Speaking as a member of the Eastern church, Brerewood doesn't know what he's talking about.
---Cluny on 1/16/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Jewelry


Christ!!!
And he did. We can worship when we how we want and when we want. In fact every day is given by the Lord.

I agree with pharisees , I think you ask these questions to start a fight. I really wish people would not do that.
It is not edifying and it causes the biggest division in the Body of Christ.

We all must remember God is not the author of confusion.
That is a work of the flesh.
---ginger on 1/16/11


"They know little who do not know that the ancient Sabbath remained and was observed by the Eastern churches three hundred years after our Savior's passion"
[Prof. Brerewood: Treatise on the Sabbath]

"The seventh-day Sabbath was solemnized [i.e. observed] by Christ, the Apostles and the primitive Christians - until the Council of Laodicea did, in a manner, quite abolish the observance of it. The Council (A.D. 364) first settled the observance of the Lord's Day" [Wm Prynne: Dissertations on the Lord's Day. Prynne was a 17th century Puritan]
---francis on 1/16/11


No one.

However, as the New Testament proclaim, the Death, Resurrection, and Ascension of Christ, bought about a New Covenant, a New Priesthood, and a New Law (Hebrews 7-10).

As Holy Tradition (Sacred Scriptures, and the Witness of the Fathers) teach, Christians under the New Covenant are no longer obligated to follow precepts of the Old Covenant, namely Moses Law, which includes, but are not limited to, the Jewish Sabbath and old Jewish Dietary Laws (Acts 15, Romans 14, Col 2:16-17, Galatians 3-5, etc).

Those who try to live in both worlds are called Adventists or Neo-Judaizers.

In IC.XC.,
---Ignatius on 1/16/11


Heb 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.
Rom 4:14 For if they which are of the law [be] heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect:
Gal 3:17-19 And this I say, [that] the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect. For if the inheritance [be] of the law, [it is] no more of promise: but God gave [it] to Abraham by promise. Wherefore then [serveth] the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made, [and it was] ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
---micha9344 on 1/16/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Furniture


"Who on earth has authority to change God's handwritten law?"

Wasn't it Jesus? Have you heard of Him?
---alan8566_of_uk on 1/16/11


I posted this before, but will do so again.

The Christian is called to live by faith (Rom. 1:17,Gal. 3:11), not by the law.

All the law does is to reveal knowledge of sin (Rom. 3:20) and the need for our Savior Jesus Christ.

Obedience to the law cannot save the sinner (in contrast to what Adventists teach).

Scripture is plain one cannot be justified (declared righteous) by the law as the believer in Christ is justified by a righteousness apart from the law. Romans 3:21f

If you seek justification by obedience to the law, scripture is very plain you are severed from Christ. Gal. 5:4

Sorry Jerry, but Adventism is a different gospel with a another Jesus, not the one God has revealed in scirpture.
---leej on 1/16/11


Pharisee//Another loaded Adventist question, good luck with this one Jerry. I don't know why you come here to start arguments.

perhaps Jerry likes to be abused by the truth.

2 Cor 4:4 In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

If he and francis were not spiritually blind, they would acknowledge that Jesus is the Savior, not obedience to rigtheousness of the law viewed as filthy rags.

But such is the plight of those trapped under the smelly skirts of a false prophets (Ugh!).
---leej on 1/16/11


Copyright© 1996-2015 ChristiaNet®. All Rights Reserved.