ChristiaNet MallWorld's Largest Christian MallChristian BlogsFree Bible QuizzesFree Ecards and Free Greeting CardsLoans, Debt, Business and Insurance Articles

Traditions Of Men Word Of God

In the world we live in today, what percentage of churches would you say are based on the traditions of men and not THE WORD OF GOD?

Join Our Christian Penpals and Take The False Traditions Bible Quiz
 ---Rob on 4/8/11
     Helpful Blog Vote (3)

Post a New Blog



God made a covenant with the Jews on Mount Sinai. That covenant was with the Jews, NOT with anyone else. ---StrongAxe on 4/14/11

Lets say i accept your premis:

What about None jews( Gentiles/ strangers)

Hebrews 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

The New covenant is also made with israel and Judah
---francis on 4/15/11


Samuel, You want to push it on believers in Christ. Make them slaves again. Do you know why we are made alive to Christ (born of the Spirit? So that in the good things we do, we give all the glory to God. You miss all that when you want everyone to be under the law again. If you are back under the law, the glory goes to man and not God. Don't you see the difference? The Law was a tutor to bring us to Christ. Mark_V.

Yes I see the law is a tutor to bring us to Christ. But you say the law is done away with so it cannot tutor since it is no longer a sin to disobey the law.

I do not want us to go back under the law by trying to save ourselves. I want to say the law defines sin and that we should avoid sin. First John. Romans 3:31 Ch 7
---Samuel on 4/15/11


Lee, day-length is defined in Genesis 1:3-5-God created light and says this light and darkness defines day-length, as it does today. 'Day' is used with a number in Genesis 1. It is used as singular or plural with a number 410 times outside of Genesis and it always means an ordinary day.

Evening and morning are used together without day 38 times outside Genesis 1 and it always indicates an ordinary day.

Evening or morning are used 23 times each with day outside Genesis 1 and it always means an ordinary day.

And night is used with day 52 times and it always indicates an ordinary day.

It is so revealing of your character that you hold nonBiblical views whilst condemning others whom you claim hold nonBiblical views.
---Warwick on 4/15/11


Acts 15:24 "Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:"

What did they who even had sat at meat with Jesus agree in the end? Just about 4 things, nothing else.
Paul taught more than 4 things, did he not?That should be a good thing, no?
---Nana on 4/15/11


**Leonia, there is nothing in Scripture which says the 6 days of creation were of different length.

And you can say also with certainly that there is NOTHING in scripture that tells us the duration of any of the creation days.

In fact, I could care less as such a topic have virtually nothing to do with ones relationship to Christ.

I suppose you just like to pick arguements with others in some kind of attempt to prove to yourself how superior you are to others.

You are really a nobody but apparently not man enough to admit it.
---leonia on 4/15/11




Lee onia, there is nothing in Scripture which says the 6 days of creation were of different length. But there is everything in Genesis one, Exodus 20:11 and 31:14-17 which proves they are all 24 hour days.

You are the one who attacks Adventists because you say (but cannot substantiate) that they hold to nonBiblical beliefs.

And you wrote "Worst yet, you subscribe to me (and to others) beliefs that we do not possess. As such you have an evil spirit within you."

Then you contradict yourself by doing exactly what I claimed, by promoting a view which is not supported anywhere in Scripture. In fact it is plainly contradicted over and over throughout Scripture.

It is no rudeness to call you a hypocrite Lee.
---Warwick on 4/15/11


Axey: "The Old Testament (Leviticus) teaches against eating pork. If you are a Jew (and not a Christian), that would apply to you."

Where in scripture does it say that the OT dietary laws pertain only to Jews? Do Jews have different physiology than others? Are you not aware that there were a large number of non-Jews (mixed multitude) present at Mt. Sinai to whom such laws also applied?

How does something disgusting and unhealthy become wholesome, and why should it? How does something abominable to God become acceptable to Him? Funny, Jesus never mentioned such a thing.



---jerry6593 on 4/15/11


Samuel, you are splitting hairs with the law. You want to push it on believers in Christ. Make them slaves again. Do you know why we are made alive to Christ (born of the Spirit? So that in the good things we do, we give all the glory to God. While lost even the good we did was sin, we did not honor or give thanks God. We have been changed for the glory of God. You miss all that when you want everyone to be under the law again. If you are back under the law, the glory goes to man and not God. Don't you see the difference? The Law was a tutor to bring us to Christ.
---Mark_V. on 4/15/11


There is no eternal life through the law.

You want us to be under the tutor, (the law).
---Mark_V.


The first statement is true. There is no eternal life under the law. The second is a misunderstanding. The Tutors job is to teach us. After we learn what is taught are we supposed to forget it and not remember what we are taught?
Romans 3:31 Do we then nullify *the Law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the Law. NASB

The law defines sin. Like a mirror shows us what we look like. So when you break the law you commit a sin. When we are living in Grace we are not trying to save ourselves by the law. But that does not mean that we then commit sin.
---Samuel on 4/14/11


**Do you believe God created in 6 days of the same length that He commanded the Israelites to work (Exodus 20:11, 31:14-17)?

We can say for certainly that the days before the sun were created were days of a different nature or description since the sun was not created until the 3rd day.

I think we can say without any proof that a day is a day is a day and believe the creation days were all of the same duration since God is not limited by our concept of time.

Since all we have is the very brief and summary Genesis record, our interpretation is really whatever we wish to believe.

The subject is really not an issue with me so I leave you with whatever you wish to believe.
---leonia on 4/14/11




francis:

God made a covenant with the Jews on Mount Sinai. That covenant was with the Jews, NOT with anyone else. ---StrongAxe on 4/14/11

StrongAxe...look here. Judah/jews were 1/12th of the whole of Israel.
The covenant was made not just with them the 1st time but with the whole.
Now notice Jer 31:31-33 and Heb 8:8-10.
Covenant was made with two parties....but, still the whole of Israel.
The reason for two parties in the second covenant because the Nth House largest parts of Israel had been divorced.

By death of Christ they are freed for remarriage. The 10 virgins, bridegroom cometh etc.
Understanding this is key to understanding "whom" is being spoken of/too in the NT letters.
---Trav on 4/14/11


francis:

God made a covenant with the Jews on Mount Sinai. That covenant was with the Jews, NOT with anyone else. That covenant is still in place (since, as you said, God does not change his mind).

However, through the death and resurrection of Jesus, he has made a new, and different covenant with us. We are not required to be circumsized, and refrain from shaving, and hundreds of other things that Jews are required to do - because those requirements are part of a totally different covenent that we are not part of.
---StrongAxe on 4/14/11


francis, you keep bringing up the law just as David as if we were under the law. Here is what Paul says Concerning believers by faith,

"Is the law then against the promises of God? certainly not. For if there had been a law given which could have given life, truly righteousness would have been by the law"
There is no eternal life through the law.

"But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. "Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith." But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor"

You want us to be under the tutor, (the law).
---Mark_V. on 4/13/11


As stated before, you are much like your SDAs friends who have taught you to judge and condemn others who differ with you. leonia

It is unfortunatly true that many SDA's do speak judgementally. It is also true that many judge us. So there is blame on both sides. There needs to be more love on both sides.

I do not find that what the Bible teaches is based on what people say. But on what the Bible says. Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? [Is] the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
---Samuel on 4/13/11


Leonia, or is that Lee?

You insinuated that as I had spoken in SDA churches I was under their spell. I pointed out I have spoken to many different denominations, and am under the spell of none.

This long experience has given me knowledge and insight. However I have never claimed to be an expert or an authority. You made this up, just as Lee made things up. Maybe you are his sister?

You say I misrepresent your beliefs then let me ask you a question: Do you believe God created in 6 days of the same length that He commanded the Israelites to work (Exodus 20:11, 31:14-17)?

A straight-forward reply would be appreciated but not expected.

You are the one who condemns. I simply pointed out your hypocrisy.
---Warwick on 4/13/11


Ezekiel 33:8 When I say unto the wicked, O wicked [man], thou shalt surely die, if thou dost not speak to warn the wicked from his way, that wicked [man] shall die in his iniquity, but his blood will I require at thine hand.

I do not see what the problem is in warning people of the danger of hell. It is a reality that those who live outside the will of God are in danger of the lake of fire.

The problem comes in only when we gaurantee anyone that they will go to hell. It is wrong because people do repent from sin.

But we are called to warn people of the dangers of hell if they do not repent.

Isaiah 66:17 They that eat swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, saith the LORD.
---Francis on 4/13/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Bankruptcy


the epistle to Romans was written to a largely non-jewish audience who would not know too much about Jewish traditions and Mosaic laws. So Romans 14 is very plain with little need for interpretation or need for hidden meanings.

While God does not change, He does change the tenets of the covenant He makes with His creation. For instance, there was a change in the priesthood, certain things such as circumcision, the dietary law, the Sabbath, the Jewish festivals were not required of Gentile believers under the New Covenant. This is something that Adventist cannot understand nor do they want to.
---leonia on 4/13/11


---StrongAxe on 4/13/11
So in your understanding does God change his laws?
Or is it possible that Romans 14 is missunderstood?

Numbers 23:19 God [is] not a man, that he should lie, neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do [it]? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?

Isaiah 66:17 They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one [tree] in the midst, eating swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, saith the LORD.
---francis on 4/13/11


They must be an example. On that basis no current church that teaches Apostolic succession can claim that they follow the early church fathers and the Bible.
---Samuel on 4/12/11

Then the Bible is wrong on it claim:

"and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. "Mt 16:18) Ruben

Are you sure? I do not believe it is the Bible that is wrong. But the teachers of this doctrine who claim that even though they stole money from the poor to spend it on multiple wives or concubines and wars that they were still the only representatives of GOD. Could they be wrong instead of the Bible?
---Samuel on 4/13/11


**Leonia,I have spoken in churches in a number of countries,... I found Adventists did well above average.... I am old enough, knowledgeable enough and experienced ...... I have judged you as you first judged others!
-
Being old enough, knowledgeable enough and experienced does not mean that you are an authority on anything or anyone.

Worst yet, you subscribe to me (and to others) beliefs that we do not possess. As such you have an evil spirit within you.

As stated before, you are much like your SDAs friends who have taught you to judge and condemn others who differ with you.
---leonia on 4/13/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Cash Advance


jerry6593:

The Old Testament (Leviticus) teaches against eating pork. If you are a Jew (and not a Christian), that would apply to you.

The New Testament (Romans, Collossians, Timothy) all tell us that we are not to be judged for what we eat. We Christians are NOT bound by the Law of Moses - in fact, if we TRY to live by it, we are REQUIRED to keep it ALL. Tell me, do you keep all 600+ of the levitical laws?
---StrongAxe on 4/13/11


Leonia,I have spoken in churches in a number of countries,...
I found Adventists did well above average....
I am old enough, knowledgeable enough and experienced ....
... I have judged you as you first judged others!
---Warwick on 4/13/11

You'll see a pattern:
1.Resume...(vaguely confirmed)
2.An authority statement so you will be in shock an "awe". Designed to keep arguments one sided...his.
3.More resume, "age","knowledge" and "experience".
4. Only self elected "stars" with "resumes" may ask questions or "judge".
You may not. Rule 1.Any answer is wrong.
P.S. Scripture appl rare to none, so b prepared 4 migrating ducks.
---Trav on 4/13/11


Lee onia: So you admit that you believe like the Muslims - that Old truth is a lie, and newer "truth" is the truth? Do you also condone the murder of "infidels"?
---jerry6593 on 4/13/11


Axey: "If the SDAs teach against eating meat (especially pork), they cannot be wholely bible-based, since teachings of this kinds are very specifically warned against in 1 Timothy 4:1-4."

A few corrections:

1) It is the BIBLE that teaches against eating pork. Are you claiming that the Bible is wrong?

2) 1 Tim 4:1-4 does not mention pork, or any other unclean food. The Greek for "meat" means "food", and "creature" means "formation" or "product". The issue to which Paul referred was meat offered to idols.

To distort Paul's writings such that they contradict other scripture is poor scholarship at best and a "doctrine of devils" at worst.
---jerry6593 on 4/13/11


Locate Education Jobs


i do not not how many churches there are, but since there is only one true church, i would say 99.99% in one way or another.
---aka on 4/12/11


francis:

If the Seventh Day Adventists teach against eating meat (especially pork), they cannot be wholely bible-based, since teachings of this kinds are very specifically warned against in 1 Timothy 4:1-4.
---StrongAxe on 4/12/11


Malachi 4:4 Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, WHICH I COMMANDED UNTO HIM in Horeb for all Israel, [with] the statutes and judgments.

Jeremiah 7:22 For I SPAKE NOT unto your fathers, nor commanded them in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices:
Jeremiah 7:23 But this thing commanded I them, saying, Obey my voice, and I will be your God, and ye shall be my people: and walk ye in all the ways that I HAVE COMMANDED YOU, that it may be well unto you.

So We have TWO commands given to the people, ONE from God DIRECTLY to the people, ONE by God to Moses and then to the people

Guess which of these two is THE LAW OF MOSES?
---francis on 4/12/11


They must be an example. On that basis no current church that teaches Apostolic succession can claim that they follow the early church fathers and the Bible.
---Samuel on 4/12/11

Then the Bible is wrong on it claim:

"and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. "Mt 16:18)

"He that heareth you heareth me, and he that despiseth you despiseth me, and he that despiseth me despiseth him that sent me." (Luke 10:16)

"which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth."( 1 Tim 3:15)
---Ruben on 4/12/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Credit Counseling


Let's keep ourselves from man's tradition! "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 2Ti 2:15"

Confident that the Spirit will lead & guide us into all truth!
---Thusfar on 4/11/11

Well put. The "Sheep" will come together. The Shepherd will see to it. Lost Sheep have to be led....to dumb to just wander in.
Ezekiel 34:11
For thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I, even I, will both search my sheep, and seek them out.
Psalm 78:52
But made his own people to go forth like sheep, and guided them in the wilderness like a flock.
---Trav on 4/12/11


If you believe in apostolic succession, then the hierarchy are the ones God has called to lead the sheep.

1 Peter 5:1-4 ... not for shameful gain, but eagerly, not domineering over those in your charge, but being examples to the flock.
leonia

My problem with current Apostolic Succession is the doctrine that the position sanctifies the person. Instead of like the Bible and early church fathers taught that the person who leads must be worthy of leading. They must be an example. On that basis no current church that teaches Apostolic succession can claim that they follow the early church fathers and the Bible.
---Samuel on 4/12/11


jerry **Christians who claim God's earlier writings (Old Testament) are superseded by Paul's New Testament writings.

And such is the problem with those who are unable to distinguish between the Old & New covenants failing to realize God made a NEW covenant with the Jews that included Gentiles who need not become circumcised nor observe the laws of Moses = the dietary laws, and the Sabbath.

What could be more plain than..."I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, NOT LIKE the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt",...Jer. 31:31-32
---leonia on 4/12/11


When a religious denomination decides that it is the sole expositor of truth (rather than the Bible), and condemns "heretics" that don't agree, you get the persecution and Bible confiscation of the dark ages.

In modern times, we have the Muslim religion which has exclusivity beliefs similar to the RCC and Eastern Orthodox. Muslims believe that the earlier ("peace") writings of Mohammed are superseded by his later ("kill the infadel") writings. In this regard, they mimic those Christians who claim that God's earlier writings (Old Testament) are superseded by Paul's New Testament writings.
---jerry6593 on 4/12/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Debt Relief


Let's keep ourselves from man's tradition! "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 2Ti 2:15"

Confident that the Spirit will lead & guide us into all truth! "But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.1Jo 2:27 "

We are His Body, we need each other! "And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee... 1Co 12:21"
We should come together all, no denominations! "Is Christ divided?"
---Thusfar on 4/11/11


Mary, because I know who he is and what his chruch is.
---John on 4/11/11


I think concerning the Sabbath we should read the decision about how the Gentiles were to worship between the elders in Jerusalem(James, Peter, John...) and Paul and those with him who told what the Lord was doing among the Gentiles(Acts 15:4-15). There is no mention of the Sabbath, but it does say what they are to do. I would especially advise reading verses 10-11.
---ryan on 4/11/11


\\"Why, do you, find it so important that the Sabbath be on Saturday?"\\

I've pointed out many times that Orthodox synagogues have services EVERY day, not just on the Sabbath.

Even the Conservative synagogue in my home town, which has a woman rabbi, has TWICE daily services.

It doesn't seem to have made an impression on anyone.
---Cluny on 4/11/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Debt Settlement


Samuel, I want to ask you something, if you don't mind. You answer without attacking anyone. And seem to have a good understanding of many things. The question is:

"Why, do you, find it so important that the Sabbath be on Saturday?"

If you are going to worship the Sabbath, why is it so important that that day be Saturday? Wouldn't you as a new believer in Christ, having the Holy Spirit in you, creating a new love for God every single moment of your life, worship Him everyday? Or every time you have the time? Or when your job or your wife's job allows you? What makes worshiping God any other day wrong? I would like your opinion if you can, if not, it's ok.
---Mark_V. on 4/11/11


There is that fear of diverse and wrong theology from those who are unlearned.
leonia
Heresies often start with a misinterpretation of the Bible. leonia
---Samuel on 4/11/11

You hit two nails on the head leonia.
Their arrogant stand of wrong theology and it is them that have the unwitnessed scriptural doctrines, most of the time. Put back to back scripture in front of the proudest chinny chin chin and they run as they should. Ironic. But, most lessons in scripture are opposite of typical.
Is twice as hard to unlearn bad doctrine that has no biblical foundation or formerly misunderstood scriptural witness.
Proverbs 14:12
There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.
---Trav on 4/11/11


**Some denominations view themselves as the undershepherds of the sheep that should follow them. leonia

I do not understand your point?
-----
If you believe in apostolic succession, then the hierarchy are the ones God has called to lead the sheep.

1 Peter 5:1-4 So I exhort the elders among you, as a fellow elder and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, as well as a partaker in the glory that is going to be revealed: shepherd the flock of God that is among you, exercising oversight, not under compulsion, but willingly, as God would have you, not for shameful gain, but eagerly, not domineering over those in your charge, but being examples to the flock.
---leonia on 4/11/11


Samuel **Why are some churches afraid of putting scripture as the final authority?

There is that fear of diverse and wrong theology from those who are unlearned.
leonia

That also occurs in churches that have tradition as equal to scripture. After all we have two main churches that do this and they disagree with each other. I fear and see false traditions as replacing scripture. Samuel

Heresies often start with a misinterpretation of the Bible. leonia

True. Samuel

Some denominations view themselves as the undershepherds of the sheep that should follow them. leonia

I do not understand your point?
---Samuel on 4/11/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Distance Learning


The OT sabbath was no longer followed by the majority of the church by the end of the first century because it was not taught by the Apostles & their immediate successors.
leonia

First the passage in Acts does not say that Sunday is a day of worship. Do you remember in Jewish weeks when first day starts. It starts at sunset. Which is why some bibles translate this passage as on Saturday night.

Please read the Sabbath in Christianity in Wikepedia before saying it was wide spread. By the way why did the Pope outlaw Sabbath keeping?
---Samuel on 4/11/11


Samuel **Why are some churches afraid of putting scripture as the final authority?

There is that fear of diverse and wrong theology from those who are unlearned.


Heresies often start with a misinterpretation of the Bible.

Some denominations view themselves as the undershepherds of the sheep that should follow them.
---leonia on 4/11/11


One tradition that the church follows is that of gathering for worship on the first day of the week, called the Lord's day.

Acts 20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow, and continued his speech until midnight.

The OT sabbath was no longer followed by the majority of the church by the end of the first century because it was not taught by the Apostles & their immediate successors.
---leonia on 4/11/11


Some traditions are good. Saying a person can follow both GOD and Mammon by using the church to get rich is a bad tradition.

The problem is when traditions are placed above the Bible making them part of scripture. Then traditions now have the same or higher authority then scripture. So when they contradict scripture you cannot change them for they tell you what scripture means.

For hundreds of years men tried to keep scripture from the hands of the people so that they could not learn what it said that contradicted their teachings. Even today the Greek Orthodox Church had a missionary put in jail for giving a teenager a bible about five years ago.

Why are some churches afraid of putting scripture as the final authority?
---Samuel on 4/11/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Education


Cluny, it's obvious that our belief's concerning the faith of our founding fathers conflict. I do not wish to get into a debate with you over this issue every time I chose to "drag it into a discussion" as you put it. I don't call you on everything I disagree with you on. What's the point? Arguing back & forth only shows egos & stubbornness So give it a rest. I believe our nation was founded on Christian principles, get over it. That's my opinion & no matter how much time you choose to waste on "trying to enlighten" me, I will still believe the same. So, can we now allow me to voice my opinion without big brother trying to set me straight?
---Reba on 4/11/11


Mat 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
---jerry6593 on 4/11/11


Cluny, I agree with the statement you made when you said:

"My point is that contrary to what Reba and others think about the founders, they weren't such great Bible believing Christians some want to think they were."

That is one of the reasons that the traditions these guys brought were not biblical. Most of those founding Apostolic fathers of the early church, came from paganism, and heathenism backgrounds, bringing into the church, their own Philosophies. Second, a lot of the material that came to us were counterfeited or adulterated.
---Mark_V. on 4/11/11


**In the world we live in today, what percentage of churches would you say are based on the traditions of men and not THE WORD OF GOD?

ALL major Christian denominations have their traditions. But is all tradition bad?

Some tradition was established by the Apostles themselves.

2 Thess. 2:15 So then, brothers, stand firm and hold to the traditions that you were taught by us, either by our spoken word or by our letter.
---leonia on 4/10/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Home Equity Loans


\\What he did or didn't say isn't the point of discussion on this blog question.
---Reba on 4/10/11\\

Then why did you drag the founding fathers into this discussion as if they had some kind of spiritual authority?
---Cluny on 4/10/11


"Are you saying that Jefferson's own word's are not to be trusted...?" Cluny, I'm only saying, I don't feel the need to argue the point. What he did or didn't say isn't the point of discussion on this blog question.
---Reba on 4/10/11


For traditions of men & the light for such came from here, 2nd.Cor.11 v 14 beginning with the Man - made trinity roman cath church then spread down through her offspring daughters churches, the cath, luth, presby, cog, naz, bapt, cr - science, aog etc trin churches, Rev.17 v's 4 - 6. For those that worship the gods of islam, buddha, hindu etc, will fall inline also.
---Lawrence on 4/10/11


The vast majority, base their beliefs on blenderized doctrine.
---michael_e on 4/10/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Interest Rates


\\Because when push comes to shove, neither of us know for a fact what they believed, only what we read in the history books & other man made sources & that changes all the time.\\

Are you saying that Jefferson's own words are not to be trusted as a source about what he thought?

As far as your comparison of today to the 19th century US frontier, there has always been nostalgia for the good old days since the times of the ancient Greeks and Romans.
---Cluny on 4/10/11


Cluny, I will again, agree to disagree with you. I refuse to debate the faith of our founding father's. Because when push comes to shove, neither of us know for a fact what they believed, only what we read in the history books & other man made sources & that changes all the time. Who can trust any of it to be fact. I wouldn't bet my life on it's truth, would you? All I know is the life of morals & care for mankind that we now live in is not the Walton's or Little House on the Prairie any more. & in my opinion, that's a falling away from God & his teachings. Blame it on the church, parents, the schools, the government.... we're all to blame & America is suffering because of it.
---Reba on 4/9/11


John, please explain: why do you call Rick Warren "an anti-Christ"? I honestly have no idea why you accuse him of that.
---Mary on 4/9/11


The Catholic Mirror Sept. 2, 1893:
The Adventists are the only body of Christians with the Bible as their teacher..

THE CATHOLIC EXTENSION:
We also say that of all Protestants, the Seventh-day Adventists are the only group that reason correctly and are consistent with their teachings.
Peter R. Tramer. Editor

People who think that the Scriptures should be the sole authority, should logically become Seventh-Day Adventists" Saint Catherine Catholic Church Sentinel, Algonac, Michigan, May 21, 1995.
---francis on 4/9/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Internet Marketing


Ricky Warren is an Antichrist!
---John on 4/9/11


\\No matter, you have to admit that even if every one of them felt that way, the morals of the majority was far better than the ones of today. Christian values were more respected than today.\\

That, of course, is an entirely different issue.

But the thing is, most of the Founding Fathers were miles away from what the average American evangelical Christian believes today. Too many were deists. Many were strict Calvinists. At least one was a Roman Catholic.

They were not the secular saints many try to make of them.
---Cluny on 4/9/11


If someone has stomach problems as he anticipates responses to his comments, it shows he is not too sure of himself. Sad.
---John.usa on 4/9/11


I'm thankful that our God is a forgiving, redemptive, God.

However, I think that many churches have "taken advantage" of God's grace. These churches teach what people's "itching ears" want to hear. 2 Timothy 4:3. God's standards get "watered down" and diluted. Little, or NO, mention of Sin or it's consequences.

In the USA, almost anyone can start a church, for almost any reason. You just have to convince the IRS that your church will be for improving the "public good". That might be for either Tradition or God's work.

I'd say that about 90+% of USA churches are for Tradition these days.
---Sag on 4/9/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Life Insurance


John, I find it hard to knock Rick Warren, God has used him to help a LOT of people, primarily through the founding of Celebrate Recovery.
---Mary on 4/9/11


Cluny, that may have been one of the father's view point, however, it is my opinion that his view was not the majority's view in that day. No matter, you have to admit that even if every one of them felt that way, the morals of the majority was far better than the ones of today. Christian values were more respected than today. America has come along way from moral values & even the importance of human life has gone way down. I personally believe that God's Word & Godly principles for daily living is what made the difference & that's why we as Christians no longer have the same respect from the world as our founding father's had.
---Reba on 4/9/11


Most if not all seem to be rooted in religious traditions of men and NOT the Word of God. There are few and far between that are rooted in the Word of God only. This is why most "Christians" know NOTHING about Christianity or the Bible. It is a sad and scary reality.
---Leslie on 4/9/11


Alot! most of todays churches are.
---candice on 4/9/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Make Money


The Catholic Mirror Sept. 2, 1893:
The Adventists are the only body of Christians with the Bible as their teacher..

THE CATHOLIC EXTENSION:
We also say that of all Protestants, the Seventh-day Adventists are the only group that reason correctly and are consistent with their teachings.
Peter R. Tramer. Editor

People who think that the Scriptures should be the sole authority, should logically become Seventh-Day Adventists" Saint Catherine Catholic Church Sentinel, Algonac, Michigan, May 21, 1995.
---francis on 4/9/11


ALL OF THEM!!!

From the Orthos/RCC to the latest Rock and Roll, Ricky warren garbage.

All of them have their own traditions. They will preach the "Traditions of men, as Doctrines of G-d."

And they will defend THEIR traditions(i.e. Infant Baptism/Pre-Trib) even against the Throne of G-d Himself.

NOTE:

After Stating This Truth! I expect will get this nickpick SILLY post... "John..."ALL" of them??? Have you been to every single chruch???"

So in antipation of this nauseating lame response. I will proceed to take my Antacids/Pepto Bismol.
---John on 4/9/11


\\Who do you worship, Jefferson or God?
---Harold on 4/9/11\\

Harold, did you understand the point of my post?

Reba said, "...If we had stayed with the WORD OF GOD like our founding father's, we'd be in better shape as a nation...."

My point is that contrary to what Reba and others think about the founders, they weren't such great Bible believing Christians some want to think they were.
---Cluny on 4/9/11


//The "assembling ourselves" is talking about the meeting of the local church//

Heb 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is, but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
Where do you see local church in this passage?
---michael_e on 4/9/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Rehab Treatments


cluny:
Thomas Jefferson and John Adams were smart men.
The one that inspired the writters of the Bible and promised that not a jot or tittle would pass away from and is able to keep it is the only perfect being, God.
If the Bible is not true then we have no way of knowing God or Christ.
Who do you worship, Jefferson or God?
---Harold on 4/9/11


\\Many if not all churches are guilty of teaching the traditions of men in place of the commandments of God.\\

Like sinner's prayers, mima?

\\Consider the question of assembling ourselves together, is it not true that when two people are talking about the Lord Jesus Christ we are assembling ourselves together? \\

No, it is not true.

The "assembling ourselves" is talking about the meeting of the local church, and you boast that you are a member of no local church.
---Cluny on 4/9/11


Many if not all churches are guilty of teaching the traditions of men in place of the commandments of God. This creates great confusion. Many churches teach man's traditions were as the way unto salvation and of course nothing could be farther from the truth. Take the New Testament church building is it of the Word of God or is it tradition?
Consider the question of assembling ourselves together, is it not true that when two people are talking about the Lord Jesus Christ we are assembling ourselves together? Think about it. Any church that speak highly of tradition must be seen as a false church.
---mima on 4/9/11


Reba, here's what one of the Founding Fathers said about the Bible:

"The whole history of these books [the Gospels] is so defective and doubtful that it seems vain to attempt minute enquiry into it: and such tricks have been played with their text, and with the texts of other books relating to them, that we have a right, from that cause, to entertain much doubt what parts of them are genuine. In the New Testament there is internal evidence that parts of it have proceeded from an extraordinary man, and that other parts are of the fabric of very inferior minds. It is as easy to separate those parts, as to pick out diamonds from dunghills."
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to John Adams, January 24, 1814
---Cluny on 4/9/11


Read These Insightful Articles About Stocks


I do not personally know the three hundred or so million people in the United States. So, I can't speak for them all. But I have seen how two or three wrong people can be taken to represent everyone (c: A few wrong people here in our blogs do not speak for anyone but their own selves. And wrong people can have a way of making a big show of themselves, while right ones are humbly out of sight doing the will of God. And how do you know you aren't fooling yourself? I can! It's easier to point at how others are wrong. Well, though, it is not really easy in Christ's yoke which is easy (Matthew 11:30), but it is lazy!!! lolololololol
---Bill_willa6989 on 4/9/11


The vast majority. On this website alone it is evident that many are not seeking obedience to the entirety of scripture, but rather justification for their peculiar man-made traditions and pet sins.
---jerry6593 on 4/9/11


Fallible humans interpret the Bible, so whatever anyone tells you the Bible means is at least in part fallacious. Thus, human tradition with regard to Bible interpretation is always present in every church or Christian body everywhere without exception.
---John.usa on 4/9/11


Copyright© 1996-2015 ChristiaNet®. All Rights Reserved.