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Explain Proverbs 14:12

Proverbs 14:12 says,
"There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death." What is the "way" being referred to here?

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 ---mima on 5/10/11
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Francis, I believe Romans 1 25-27 implies that there is a right vs wrong, natural vs unnatural. Although it speaks of a woman with a woman, man with a man, these are called unnatural. The natural, is stated as being a man with a woman, and is obvious throughout scripture, so a man or woman with a beast could be implicated as unnatural.
---christina on 5/23/11


SIN! For the ways of sin lead to death.
---John on 5/23/11


francis:

You have to note the context. In Acts 13, Paul and Barnabas were preaching in the synagogue in Perga. This chapter is about their preaching there - it is NOT about the general customs of the new testament church.

Their target audience was the Jews - who naturally would be there on the sabbath. This very fact is emphasized just two verse later, in verse 46.
---StrongAxe on 5/23/11


Its when a person does what he / she believes to be right, as verses doing what God says to do. This usually leads to death of one kind or another. But, when one soweth to his flesh, repent and pray for a crop failure.
Genesis 6:5, Judges 17:6, 21:25, Proverbs 14:12, 16:25, 21:25, Galatians 6:7-8.
---Glenn on 5/23/11


In the torah there were laws about how to judge in trials and disputes and penalties. These are handled by the goverements we live under so they are not our to decide.

The laws of ceremonial purity are also over. Although many good health regulations should still be followed like wash your hands before you eat.
---Samuel on 5/23/11




---StrongAxe on 5/23/11
Not so at all.
how about this OT law, should we keepit at all, If so where in the NT is it?

Leviticus 18:23 Neither shalt thou lie with any beast to defile thyself therewith: neither shall any woman stand before a beast to lie down thereto: it [is] confusion.
---FRANCIS on 5/23/11


If you believe that you are obligated to keep old testament laws, you still have to keep those.
---StrongAxe on 5/23/11
OK

Exodus 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother:

Ephesians 6:2 Honour thy father and mother,

Now because this commandment is from the OT to the NT by you logic, it means we also obey the one that says:
Exodus 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

and they did
Acts 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.
---francis on 5/23/11


francis:

Jesus's sacrifice may have obviated the SACRIFICE parts of such laws, but not any other parts of those laws. If you believe that you are obligated to keep old testament laws, you still have to keep those.
---StrongAxe on 5/23/11



---StrongAxe on 5/21/11

Good question. The law which are we talking about requires an animal sacrifice (for sin).
Leviticus 15:15 And the priest shall offer them, the one [for] a sin offering, and the other [for] a burnt offering, and the priest shall make an atonement for him before the LORD for his issue.
Christ is our saccrifice so all laws requiring blood saccrifices has been fulfiled by the blood of jesus.

As laws requiring blood as a covenant
Exodus 4:26 So he let him go: then she said, A bloody husband [thou art], because of the circumcision.

So these laws never have to be kept because they are fulfilled by the blood of Jesus
---francis on 5/21/11


francis:

I give the same answer I have given on here many times. The reasons Christians do not do this is because we are not under the Law.

You, however, seem to feel that (at least some) parts of the Law must still be obeyed by Christians, despite Christians not being under it. I am curious how you decide which parts we must follow, and which parts we are free to ignore.
---StrongAxe on 5/21/11




Stronge AXE, you missed the point. When a man or woman is " unclean" by bodily fluids how do they cleanse themselve?

Leviticus 15:29 And on the eighth day she (HE) shall take unto her (HIM) two turtles, or two young pigeons, and bring them unto the priest, to the door of the tabernacle of the congregation.

Leviticus 15:30 And the priest shall offer the one [for] a sin offering, and the other [for] a burnt offering, and the priest shall make an atonement for her before the LORD for the issue of her (HIS) uncleanness.

now why do belivers in christ no longer sacrifice aniamls for sins?

And what sin is committed by a woman that is sick of her flowers? Leviticus 15:33
---francis on 5/20/11


francis:

Aha! So you admit that there are "good reasons for not observing a law".

However, this brings up a very important point: if we are free to stop obeying God's laws "when they no longer make sense", where do we draw the line between laws that are inviolate, and laws that we are free to change?

It sounds to me like you find the Sabbath laws to be inviolate, while the blood one is not. What criteria do you use to distinguish the two?

Also, remember that Paul does not give us this luxury - he says that anyone who breaks the law is guilty of braking it ALL - not "any law except those that no longer seem to apply".
---StrongAxe on 5/20/11


Let me get this straight. I can understand not to do the ritual about being unclean. But shouldn't we take a bath? Just like GOD says. After all should we not try to clean our bodies?
---Samuel on 5/20/11


---StrongAxe on 5/20/11
Part of the answer has to do with the process of " cleansing" after an issue of blood of coming into contact with bodily fluids.

I have faith in you, that you above most in here will find the reason why people no longer observe this law
---Francis on 5/20/11


StrongAxe on 5/20/11
are you sure that you do not want to think about it some more?

It also applies tomen also
Leviticus 15:2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When any man hath a running issue out of his flesh, because of his issue he is unclean.
Leviticus 15:16 And if any man's seed of copulation go out from him, then he shall wash all his flesh in water, and be unclean until the even.


Leviticus 15:32 This is the law of him that hath an issue, and of him whose seed goeth from him, and is defiled therewith,
---fRANCIS on 5/20/11


francis:

You said: You missed the point.

Evidently. Care to enlighten me?

Also, you're STILL avoiding my question.
---StrongAxe on 5/20/11


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John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Isa 64:6a But we are all as an unclean [thing], and all our righteousnesses [are] as filthy rags...
Rom 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God,
Rom 14:23b ...for whatsoever [is] not of faith is sin.
-Every way that is not faith in Christ is Proverbs 14:12.
1Co 10:31 Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
Gal 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live, yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
---micha9344 on 5/19/11


---StrongAxe on 5/19/11

You missed the point.
---francis on 5/20/11


francis:

Leviticus 15:19 has nothing whatsoever to do with a woman "sheeding blood for remission of sins". It only has to do with blood making one unclean.

So, any married man who insists on keeping the Old Testament Law must obey Leviticus 15:19, and make his wife (as well as other adult women living at home, such as grandma, teenage daughters, etc.) live in the guesthouse, garage, tent, etc. for one week every month.

I ask for the third time, do you obey this particular law? And if not, why not?
---StrongAxe on 5/19/11


StrongAxe It would be good to have a seperate blog on why this law is no longer followed:
Leviticus 15:19 And if a woman have an issue, and her issue in her flesh be blood, she shall be put apart seven days: and whosoever toucheth her shall be unclean until the even.

Hebrews 9:22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood, and without shedding of blood is no remission.

Can there be remission in a woman shedding her blood?
---francis on 5/19/11


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Strongaxe Let me answer you quetsion this way: When they accused jesus of breaking the sabbath when he healed were they correct? When they accused him of harvbesting when he ate corn were they correct? NO.

the long beard part, i just do not get it. It is not a biblical command

In terms of the things related to BLOOD, the blood shed of Jesus fulfilled and prevailed over all other blood sacrifices.
---francis on 5/19/11


Samuel:

I never said that breaking laws is "good". Paul himself speaks about this. I DID say that WE, as Christians are not bound by the Law of Moses.
We don't need to be told "do not kill" or "do not steal" because if we "love our neighbor as ourself" we will never do such things.

For those who pick and choose and say they obey some laws but not ceremonial laws - where do they get a list of which laws and which ones aren't?

As far as watching TV, turning on lights, cooking, driving cars: All of these involve lighting fires (making any electrical circuit creates sparks, which are made of plasma, i.e. fire), hence technically forbidden by the Sabbath laws.
---StrongAxe on 5/19/11


Something also about the sabbath. No where in the NT does it mention anything about Gentiles observing it. I would think it to be very important for the writers to say we should if it was sin.


Acts 15:19-21 "Therefore my judgment is that we should not trouble those of the Gentiles who turn to God,
20 but should write to them to abstain from the things polluted by idols, and from sexual immorality, and from what has been strangled, and from blood.
21 For from ancient generations Moses has had in every city those who proclaim him, for he is read every Sabbath in the synagogues.
---willa5568 on 5/18/11


Dear Strongaxe
I don't follow the ceremonial laws since JESUS already died. I watch religious TV and Bible study on Sabbath as well as drive to church between sunset Friday night and Saturday night. The Bible does not forbid this.

I do not believe that breaking any of the Ten Commandments is a good thing. I never sleept with any of my Fathers wives, nor steal from my neighbor. I also do my best to share what I have with the poor.

So my answer to you is if disobeying laws is a good thing and proves you are saved. Why do you not break all the laws of the Bible?
The laws that apply to morals are still in effect. You believe the Sabbath is not one of them. Argue that point. Not judge us by a standard you do not believe.
---Samuel on 5/18/11


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francis:

You still did not answer the question I posed in my last message. Do you, in fact, do all of those things? If you skip even one of them, you are violating the law of Moses, which makes you guilty of violating the rest of it as well, making keeping the Sabbath (and or any other old testament laws) worthless:

James 2:10
"For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all."
---StrongAxe on 5/18/11


"Only those who belief salvation came from their own free will belief they can lose what he thinks he had by his own works. read 1 John 2:19."
---Mark_V. on 5/16/11
Here's a statement to be pondered upon.
---mima on 5/17/11


well mima, I've pondered. I do not believe I can lose my salvation YET I believe in free will.

Free will has nothing to do with eternal security. God's word and promises do.

Hebrews states Jesus is the SURETY of the New Covenant.

Surety is a LEGAL TERM. He has ASSURED my salvation.

Let's not bring free will into that truth.
---kathr4453 on 5/18/11


francis,

This is a very interesting statement Jesus makes, " Sabbath was made for man not man for the Sabbath". Every day is a sabbath for me because Jesus has finished my work for me so I will rest in that. Also if you, because of the way you believe, do not keep the sabbath it is sin to you. As I said every day is the same for me in Christ.
---willa5568 on 5/18/11


You may not like it, but it is true.
God did say not to eat certain animals
God did say not to lie man with man
God did say not to wear clothes made from wool and linen
God did say not to round the corners of the beard*
God did not say not to make yourself bald*
and all these

1. Do not worship other gods.
2. Do not worship idols.
3. Do not misuse God's name.
4. Keep the Sabbath holy.
5. Honor your father & mother.
6. Do not murder.
7. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
9. Do not lie.
10. Do not covet.
To do otherwise may seem right to you, but the ways of these things are death
---francis on 5/18/11


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---Mark_V. StrongAxe on 5/18/11

I am 100% correct.
There are men who sleep with other men and say that what they do is right, there are people who forsake what God has commanded aboutthe sabbath and tothem it seems right, there are those who eat what god calls detestable and abominable and to them it seems right. All these thngs God in his UNCHANGING word has commanded men either to do, or not to do.

Now here is the thing:
You can open the word of God and see that what I say is 100% true. But because it SEEMS RIGHT to you, you will reject it.

DId God not say that the 7th day ( SATURDAY) is the sabbath?
DId not not say that we should not eat what is unclean?
Did not not say that men with men is abomination?
---francis on 5/18/11


francis, I do not know why you have to go on and on and bring all those passages out when really, what you want to present and accuse others is about "Saturday Sabbath" all the other stuff is just a smoke screen. Get to the point. Because as I can see you are not sinless since you do not keep all of the laws.
---Mark_V. on 5/18/11


francis:

Do you wear a very long beard, avoid blended fabrics, make your wife live in the guesthouse during her time of the month, refrain from cooking, driving, television, and computer use from sunset Friday to sunset Saturday, sacrifice a lamb every Passover and travel to Jesuralem every year at that time? If you omit ANY of these things, you are violating some of God's old testament laws - and if you try to justify yourself by keeping ANY of them (for example, the Sabbath law) but you break any others, you are guilty of breaking ALL OF THEM.

So, tell me, do you actually keep all of the above?
---StrongAxe on 5/18/11


Proverbs 16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

Spiritualy / biblically only ONE thing leads to death!!!

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death,

There are MANY on christianet who continue day after day to reject the law of God, and claim that the law of God either does not apply to them, or has been done awy with. They have a way, a lifetyle of living in sin which seem right to them, but the end is death.

Proverbs 14:9 Fools make a mock at sin:

They mock at sin, they eat as they want, they drink as they please, to many of them the sabbath is a joke, the ten commandments a thing of the past.

But see what God declares:
Matthew 24:37-39
---francis on 5/17/11


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markv,
//If it says nothing, doesn't it mean nothing//

Does he mention us turning away from christ in the nothings?
---willa5568 on 5/17/11


Donna66:

I am talking about people who sincerely come to Christ, and remain in Christ for a fair time. THEY are certain of their salvation, and anyone who knows them would agree. Only LATER, some things happen to cause them to fall away.
---StrongAxe on 5/17/11


"Only those who belief salvation came from their own free will belief they can lose what he thinks he had by his own works. read 1 John 2:19."
---Mark_V. on 5/16/11
Here's a statement to be pondered upon.
---mima on 5/17/11


James L, good response concerning genuine Christian. I use that distinction in order for others to know I am not talking about those who call themselves Christians and are not of us. There is two groups called Christians. If I say Christians only, people will then concure I am talking about those who fall away also, those who were not of us. 1 John 2:19. A genuine, or true Christian never is lost. A true Christian is one who is born of God, who is endwelled by the Spirit, who is sealed by the Spirit, who is baptized spiritually into one body in Christ. The one's who are not true Christians at some point in time leave, "But they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us" .
---Mark_V. on 5/17/11


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Strongaxe -- The people who get involved in other false religions do so voluntarily.
And no true Christian believes they can (nor do they desire to) sin without regard to the Lord. Again this is voluntary.

The fact that they do this does not make me uncertain about my own salvation!
It does make me skeptical about the salvation of those who call themselves Christian but show no interest in pleasing the Savior.

The Lord is the one who sees the heart of every man. I do not believe we "lose" salvation because of unrecognized or even unconfessed sin, because I believe God takes whatever time is needed to teach us and convict us of sin if godliness is our desire.
---Donna66 on 5/16/11


willa5568,

Concerning the following verses some even go as far to say that the many
that Jesus mentions in these verses did not have 'true' or 'genuine' love in their hearts!
What are they doing, schooling Christ?

Matthew 24:11-13 "And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved."
---Nana on 5/16/11


Willa, said,

"but WE, not someone else ,can walk away"

Where does the verse says that "we" not someone else, in that passage? If it says nothing, doesn't it mean nothing? You say something can, 'we." Contradicting the Word of God by adding to His word something not there. Your not the first to say those words, they have been said many times by others who believe a genuine believer who is already a child of God, born of the Spirit can be lost by his own works. He wasn't saved by his own works, how can he be lost by his own works?
Only those who belief salvation came from their own free will belief they can lose what he thinks he had by his own works. read 1 John 2:19.
---Mark_V. on 5/16/11


\\The Bible tells us that genuine believers will never be lost.\\
---Mark_V. on 5/16/11


The bible doesn't ever qualify belief with "genuine" or "real" or "spurious" or "fake"

Those are manmade qualifications, by the self appointed fruit inspectors. Trying to know people by their fruit, and not even knowing what the fruit is that they're supposed to be looking for.


Belief is inside, whether or not it ever manifests itself for others to see.

All believers are eternally secure, all non-believers are still lost.

That must beg the question - believers of/in who/what?
---James_L on 5/16/11


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Strongaxe, you are asking Mima to tell you whether someone is saved or not, and he does not know. Only God knows. What we do know is that Scripture tells "us" its our duty to make "our own salvation sure." Not someone's else. The Bible tells us that genuine believers will never be lost. But that is our own salvation not others. If "we" have a clear understanding of what salvation requires and we believe the testimony of the Holy Spirit when He witnesses to our spirit that we are children of God (Romans 8:16). And make sure we have a genuine love for Christ, and "we" seek our assurance from the Word of God. Also whether we some evidence of the fruit of the Spirit present, then faith is present.
---Mark_V. on 5/16/11


Donna66:

Those people, after their conversion but before they fell away, sincerely believed they were saved.

If what you are saying is true, it means we can never be certain of our salvation (because it is possible for us to feel sure of something that isn't there).

I agree with this, by the way. In the same way, it is possible for a sane person to know he is sane, but an insane person may erroneously think he is, due to clouded thinking. Thus, one can never be certain of statements like "I am saved", "I am sane", "trust me, I'm honest", "this email is virus free", etc.
---StrongAxe on 5/16/11


//Mima ...neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand" John 10:28 Eternal life certainly is synonymous with security.//

notice it says "neither shall any MAN PLUCK them out of my hand". Nothing can separate us from Christ, but WE, not someone else ,can walk away. "And you will be hated by all for my name's sake.But the one WHO ENDURES TO THE END will be saved." Also the parable of the seed being sown. Many receive it until other things cause them to walk away such as persecution, wealth, worries, etc. (also Romans 11:22) You can say well they weren't saved to begin with. I beg to differ that is not what it said. It says they RECEIVED it. Salvation will not be seen until the resurrection.
---willa5568 on 5/16/11


Those who turn to atheism, islam or wicca, make no claim to being "saved" in the Christian sense. If they claimed such salvation at one time, they now say they were mistaken.
I'd agree, they never were "saved" in the first place.

Someone who is a Christian, but for some reason doubts their salvation (or fears they have lost it) knows what is required for salvation and can reach out to the Lord for assurance. The fact that they desire salvation (or fear losing it) is a pretty good indicator that they have truly believed on Him.
---Donna66 on 5/15/11


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mima:

I understand this. However, what would you say about the example I gave? What is that person's status with respect to salvation?
---StrongAxe on 5/15/11


---StrongAxe as you know salvation is a free gift of God. Now we can do nothing to gain salvation--- what then can we do to lose salvation?(Nothing) the way we act after salvation has to do with rewards. But your salvation is secure. If there is no security then Christ was wrong when he said, "And I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand" John 10:28
Eternal life certainly is synonymous with security.
---mima on 5/15/11


\\Just because altar calls and sinner's prayers are not mentioned in scriptures, this does not necessarily mean they are ways of man leading to death.\\
---StrongAxe on 5/11/11


Those who preach altar calls and sinner's prayers already have a scriptural anathema pronounced against them (Gal 1:8-9)


They should be excommunicated and banished into exile
---James_L on 5/15/11


mima:

What would you say about people who sincerely accept Christ (i.e. they "call upon the name of the Lord"), but over time, become disillusioned, and later fall away, sometimes to atheism, islam, wicca, etc. There are many such people. Are they still saved? Or were they saved and subsequently lost? Or were they never really saved in the first place?

If they are still saved, it means once we come to Christ, we can do whatever we please, regardless of consequences. If they were saved but not now, it means salvation can be lost. If the were never saved in the first place, it means we can never be assured of salvation. No matter which answer you choose, that answer will likely challenge at least one of your assumptions.
---StrongAxe on 5/14/11


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Strong axe you are correct I have heard many of those who believe in osas say they were not truly saved in the first place.

Some altar calls are for a rededication to follow GOD. They are used in revials as well as evangelistic meetings.

I do not believe we can know the heart of a person. So when a person says they dedicated themselve to JESUS we can believe they are saved. But only GOD knows for sure.

I do believe that actions show what is in the heart.
---Samuel on 5/14/11


I have just gotten a telephone call from a soul winner in which we discussed your question about believing in altar calls and once saved always saved. As your statements imply you are certainly judging by appearances and that is a very human thing to do. But if we believe God's Word then we cannot doubt," whosoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved". I have no understanding except accepting the lord's word.
---mima on 5/14/11


willa5568:

Right. When people start quoting numbers like "12 got saved today" on a regular basis, it risks becoming just a statistic (despite precedents like Acts 2:41). This can cheapen salvation and put it on par with drive-through fast food ("20 billion served").

I am curious what those who believe in both altar calls and "once saved always saved" would say about people who go forward in an altar call, but later fall away? Either "once saved always saved" is not true, or these people were not "really" saved in the first place (making comments like "12 got saved today" premature). Either that, or the word "saved" does not mean quite what they think it means.
---StrongAxe on 5/13/11


Mark,

all I meant was how would you know a person was saved by saying a prayer with you or before the church.
---willa5568 on 5/13/11


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Willa, I too agree with your answer. Spurgeon was a great teacher concerning salvation. I too have seen many answer an alter call more then eleven times. But what I cannot do is say they are not save because really, none of us can see the heart but God. We can see their works, and so many times they don't seem to be save, but that is only our assumption. Many leave for good, and those we assume have really returned back to their roots. But again we don't know if they have just fallen from grace and God is allowing it to bring them to a stronger faith. Many things we just don't know.
---Mark_V. on 5/13/11


alter calls and the "sinners prayer" are very recent things done in the church. It does not mean they are wrong but the problem is to many times people believe that a prayer will save them. I have heard people say, "twenty people were saved today". How on earth would they know? I like the way Spurgeon did things. He would explain and teach what the Gospel is and what is required from us. Not in an alter call but with those who desired to know. I believe this is a much more effective way of bringing disciples, not "believers" into the church.
---willa5568 on 5/12/11


Lea, I invite you and anyone else who feels the same to pray for Cluny. I myself am praying in the following manner. I am asking the Lord Jesus Christ to greatly bless Cluny in every way. I do not feel I can be more specific because of my limited knowledge.
---mima on 5/12/11


aka ... I'm so sorry ... My post was intended to address StrongAxe, not you

Blame old age!
---alan8566_of_UK on 5/12/11


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Alter calls and sinners prayers do not lead a person to death. That is a rediculous statement, meant to attack Mima when the opportunity presented itself. Sort of like Mima does. Small stab wounds.

All descendants of Adam are heading to hell already. Alter calls are given because Scripture tells us that if we are willing to repent, God will forgive us, Acts 3:19, so if we confess with our mouths the Lord Jesus and believe with our hearts that God has raised Him from the dead, we will be saved, For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. Rom. 10:9-13. Alter calls are given for that reason.
---Mark_V. on 5/12/11


Genesis 3:24 "the way to the tree of life".

Luke 1:79 "the way of peace".

John 14:5 "how can we know the way?" Jesus said "I am the way...".

Luke 20:21 "the way of God" John 1:23 "the way of The Lord".

Acts 16:17 "the way of salvation".

Hebrews 9:8 "the way into the sanctuary".

2 Peter 2:2 "the way of truth".

There are many ways of addressing spirituality that seem right to a man, but the true worshipper must choose the devotion that is based on "the greatest of these" (1 Corin. 13:13), it is a "more excellent way" (a better way) than those chosen by man.
---more_excellent_way on 5/12/11


"not in the way of eye-service" (Ephesians 6:6)
2 Peter 2:15 "Forsaking the right way they have gone astray".


2 Peter 2:21 "the way of righteousness". Jude 1:11 "Woe to them! For they walk in the way of Cain".


God is generic (a cosmic/divine reality, devotion is NOT partisan rule following). All of humanity has salvation available ONLY by ackowleding Jesus AS SAVIOR.


"THE WAY" is not just the name of the 'relationship devotion' for the true worshipper, it is also a reference for the correct way of divine life. Paul was not the FOLLOWER type of person (and neither should we be), he was a "MEMBER of" the one who hung on the cross.
---more_excellent_way on 5/12/11


//Cluny this scripture [she] posted would do you some good!!/

lea, your first post is well taken. Nevertheless, i was not addressing to your either.

It is funny how there is Truth in Scripture that convicts and corrects. I had one thought in mind, but the Spirit had another for you (and all of us). Some of hear...some of us don't.

your post and some of cluny's are not necessarily given in a PC fashion, but sometimes our slings and arrows might be shot right on the mark AND the Spirit corrects on the follow through. The Spirit has a Way. Amen?
---aka on 5/12/11


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\\All the verse is talking about is choices that people make.\\
---Rickey on 5/10/11


Agreed. Read the bits of wisdom surrounding this verse and it should be clear.

verse 3 by the mouth of a fool comes a rod for his back.

Like a slave smarting off to his master. It seemed the right thing to do at the time, but...


verse 17 a man of quick temper acts foolishly

Revenge seems right to a lot of people, but...


15:1 a soft answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger.

etc etc etc
---James_L on 5/11/11


alan, i was not addressing cluny or mima. i was addressing the question with other scripture that expands on the "way" of those who do not know the Way.
---aka on 5/11/11


aka ... I think probably Cluny does appreciate the validity of "sinners prayers" and "altar calls". In fact he has mentioned that the equivalents of them are used in his Orthodox church, although not known by the same names.

I'm sure that the reason he points out that they are not mentioned in the Bible is because of the continual insistence by Mima and others that certain Orthodox and Catholic traditional practices are not mentioned in the Bible and are therefore to be condemned.

Mima and others should not issue such condemnation, when they have their own "non-Biblical" practices
---alan8566_of_UK on 5/11/11


Cluny:

Just because altar calls and sinner's prayers are not mentioned in scriptures, this does not necessarily mean they are ways of man leading to death.

In many places, the Bible speaks of us making a choice, like Joshua's "choose you this day whom ye will serve" (24:15). A sinner's prayer is little more than a private way to do this explicitly, and an altar call is a public way of doing the same thing. You could think of an altar call as an engagement, and a baptism as the wedding.

Of course, people who treat these as cliches will get as much benefit from them as one gets from vainly repeating any other empty ritual, but I am sure most people treat them very seriously, and are very sincere about them.
---StrongAxe on 5/11/11


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OOPS !sorry mima and aka thank you for the correction.
---Lea on 5/11/11


As it is written, "There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understands, there is none that seeks after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable, there is none that does good, no, not one. Their throat is an open sepulchre, with their tongues they have used deceit, the poison of asps is under their lips: Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness: Their feet are swift to shed blood: Destruction and misery are in their ways: And the way of peace have they not known: There is no fear of God before their eyes." Romans 3:10-18
---aka on 5/11/11


Mima, the "way" you are asking for on Pov. 14:12 refers to:
"Enter by the narrow gate, for wide is the gate and broad is "the way" that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it." (Matt. 7:13).
---Mark_V. on 5/11/11


Proverbs 14:
6 "A scorner seeketh wisdom, and findeth it not: but knowledge is easy unto him that understandeth."
8 "The wisdom of the prudent is to understand his way: but the folly of fools is deceit."
9 "Fools make a mock at sin: but among the righteous there is favour."
11 "The house of the wicked shall be overthrown: but the tabernacle of the upright shall flourish."
We should all know what is prudence, the meaning of knowledge and understanding, wisdom, fool, deceit, mockery, righteousness...
Lets make two groups:
1) prudence, knowledge, understanding, wisdom, righteousness
2) fool, deceit, mockery

Which Way is the Way?

Shawn.M.T.,
Yes, Sin=WrongWay.
---Nana on 5/10/11


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All the verse is talking about is choices that people make. One choice can seem right to a person, but it may lead to destruction, failure, etc.
---Rickey on 5/10/11


Lea ... Mima is a he!!!
---alan8566_of_UK on 5/10/11


To Whosoever Has An Ear To Hear?

Brethren, Sin is the way which seemeth right unto a man but the end thereof are the ways of death, b/c death is the wages of sin !!!

Grace Unto All & Peace Be Multiplied
---Shawn.M.T. on 5/10/11


For some reason, when I hear/read this verse, I also think of the one that says "every man is right in his own eyes". I think it it can be any of a number of things, but the bottom line is that it's about pride. ANYTHING that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, Christ (The TRUE way), is idolatrous.
---christina on 5/10/11


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There is one way to heaven through JESUS. There are many ways that men follow because it please's them all the other ways lead to death.

For without GOD you cannot have eternal life.
---Samuel on 5/10/11


forgive me mimi for using your blog to say this but im sick and fed up of Cluny and his hate.

Cluny you remind me of a little boy that wont grow up or get a life and you sit right there in front of that monitor waiting for mimi to post something so you can reply with your stupid comments.......get over it!
and Cluny this scripture she posted would do you some good!!
---Lea on 5/10/11


If there is one "way" this could be talking about . . . Jesus does say, "If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny

himself,

and take up his cross daily, and follow me." (in Luke 9:23) So, Jesus does not mainly say to deny some religious way of things or deny the devil, but deny my own self. My own self can be the "way" that seems right to me > I can fool my own self and not even know it! And self's "ways of death" can include pointing the finger away from myself to others, independence which keeps us from being able to share life of love, using arguing to get what we want, using people instead of loving them, picking and choosing who we love (Matthew 5:46).
---Bill_willa6989 on 5/10/11


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