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Harold Camping October 21 2011

Harold Camping now says the Rapture will happen October 21, 2011. Should you be prepared or is he crazy?

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 ---Alan on 5/24/11
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In dealing with the ideas of the qulaity and the scope of God's knowledge, a few very fundamental characteristics must be considered.
First, God is The Creator. That is, only The Creator is The God! And one characteristic of The Creator is absolute knowledge. For all knowledge is information about the creation and the Creator.

Now, since The Creator is, in no way, a function of time, His knowledge is not related to time, at all. Therefore, to use the word "foreknow" implies knowledge of events before they actually occur, in time. And since God's knowledge is absolute and is not gained through any arrangement of time, the idea of "foreknow" is man's idea and not God's, at all.
---Allan on 6/8/11


Always be prepared like the parable of the 10 virgins. just dont plan everything for Oct 21. Don't plan for your oil to burn out on that date. Every generation thinks it will end in there upcoming year or too. Examples during 70 AD (when temple fell), Fall of Rome, WW1 and Six day war (1960's).
---Scott on 6/8/11


//don't you think that maybe what Camping said, did a lot of good?//. I was in Africa over May 21. It caused a lot of questions and a lot of worry in the region i was in. We being in US or Europe have heard it many times before and no it is a sham but to Christians in Africa who do not have a large knowledge base it was scary.
---Scott on 6/8/11


Cluny * "The Pope is the Vicar of Christ."

Both sides assume that the Pope has some kind of special spiritual and prophetic role.

Not sure on what you mean by spiritual and prophetic role, however scipture and Early Church agree on "vicar of Christ on earth"

Cluny * but from an Orthodox viewpoint, their approaches were identical.

Bishop Ware wrote:

Different Orthodox would answer in different ways, for although nearly all Orthodox are agreed in their fundamental teaching concerning the Church, they do not entirely agree concerning the practical consequences which follow from this teaching. (pg. 307, 308)
---Ruben on 6/8/11


Dear Cluny

So you believe the Pope who affected the entire Western world had no religious significance whatsover? Or that you do not believe he is mentioned in Prophecy.

Second how do you define justification?

Do you have a site on the meaning of Daniel 7?

Agape
---Samuel on 6/8/11




willa5568:

Don't you think it would be grossly unfair of God to create someone, FORCE him to sin, and then torture him forever in hell for sinning?

Yet the Bible is constantly exhorting us to choose to serve God. If God could make us do things (and wanted to do so), there would be no reason for him to persuade us. He could just force us.

God may influence us, but he doesn't force us. The final decision is ultimately up to us.
---StrongAxe on 6/8/11


MarkV ... since God exists outside of time, He knows what will happen ... what we will do ... of our own freewill.
---alan8566_of_UK on 6/8/11


strongaxe,

Too your second question. If Gods wisdom is far beyond any, what can prevent Him from bringing to pass what He has said will happen. Is His will always done, 1Timothy 2:5 "who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth". And when you consider this verse it contradicts Gods character to create man knowing most will not.Has He changed His mind, Ahab is an example. These are just a few examples.

As to the first statement. The only verse that says this is Rev. 17:8. All others just say book of life, which peoples names can be blotted out of.

I am not saying it is or isn't right but is worth considering.
---willa5568 on 6/7/11


\\I also would like to know what assumptions. That Calvanists and the RCC make?\\

One is that "The Pope is the Antichrist," which is the opposite side of "The Pope is the Vicar of Christ."

Both sides assume that the Pope has some kind of special spiritual and prophetic role.

One time on the John Ankerberg show, I saw Water Martin and Fr. Mitch Pacwa arguing about justification from terms derived from strictly human jurisprudence. They seemed to be taking opposite views, but from an Orthodox viewpoint, their approaches were identical.

This help you answer your question, Ruben?

Glory to Jesus Christ.
---Cluny on 6/7/11


Strongaxe, you said to me,

" This error occurs by taking Calvinism to its extreme conclusion, asserting predestination and discarding free will."
If the acts of free agents are in themselves uncertain, God must then wait until the event has had its issue before making His plans. In trying to convert a soul, then He would be conceived of as working in the same manner that Napoleon is said to have gone into battle, with three or four plans in mind, so that if the first failed, He could fall back upon the second, if that failed, then the third, etc. A view which is altogehter inconsistent with a true view of His nature. He would then be ignorant of much of the future and would daily be gaining vast amounts of knowledge.
---Mark_V. on 6/8/11




willa5568:

If God does NOT have absolute foreknowledge of the future, this opens up many unpleasant cans of worms. For example, the book listing names of saved people from the foundation of humanity would be fundamentally unjust. It is much like a court declaring one's innocence or guilt before holding a trial. How could God properly pre-judge someone without knowing what they would do? Or even if they would exist (without knowing who would marry whom and give birth to whom). The same applies to all prophecy - how could prophets predict a future that God himself could not see?
---StrongAxe on 6/7/11


I also would like to know what assumptions. That Calvanists and the RCC make?

GOD is in charge but I only see what I see and can only know what JESUS reveals to me.

I want to know JESUS better and act more like him.
---Samuel on 6/7/11


//This paradox is resolved by recognizing God can see everything...the future// strongaxe

there are valid disagreements to wither God knows all that will happen.It depends on what you determine foreknowledge to be. Some scholars agree with you, others with Mark and others that foreknowledge, because of His infinite wisdom, is the definite accomplishment of His determined plan (restoration of man and the earth to perfection).the idea is of a master chess player who knows every possible move of the opponent. It is obvious many times things God did not desire to happen did, was disappointed at the outcome and so on. This seems to make God far superior to anything or anyone I could ever imagine and makes free will much easier to understand.
---willa5568 on 6/7/11


From the Orthodox viewpoint, Calvinism and Romanism are simply two sides of the same error. One affirms, the other denies, but the assumptions are still the same.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 6/7/11

Interesting, what same error?
---Ruben on 6/7/11


\\I take it you used to be Catholic before you went to the other extreme and became a Calvinist?
---Jasheradan on 6/6/11\\

From the Orthodox viewpoint, Calvinism and Romanism are simply two sides of the same error. One affirms, the other denies, but the assumptions are still the same.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 6/7/11


//"if you are in Christ and walking in the Spirit, you will abide in Him, and you will be at the right time, at the right place, and speak His word to those that God has prepared to hear the gospel truth."
// Mark_V

Im sorry, Mark, but is this scripture or is it the opinion of men who wrote articles and confessions on what they believe the Bible teaches?

Does jEsheradan hold some special meaning? Its not my name. Shall I call you Murk_V? :P
---Jasheradan on 6/7/11


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Mark_v.:

My pevious point was reductio ad absurdum, showing ridiculous conclusions one can reach by believing everything is fixed and not influenced by one's actions. This error occurs by taking Calvinism to its extreme conclusion, asserting predestination and discarding free will.

This paradox is resolved by recognizing God can see everything (so he knows the future), but we cannot - so from our perspective we have free will and can influence events. Darth Vader became evil through his own choices, regardless of the fact that George Lucas wrote him that way.

Christians are commanded to preach, regardless of whether people listen, and prophets are similarly commanded to prophesy, regardless of whether people listen.
---StrongAxe on 6/7/11


Jesheradan, you are entitle to disagree, anyone is. As to your opinion, I will give you mine.
"if you are in Christ and walking in the Spirit, you will abide in Him, and you will be at the right time, at the right place, and speak His word to those that God has prepared to hear the gospel truth."
At no time is anyone lost that is not already lost.
---Mark_V. on 6/7/11


And Mark must whole-hearted DISagree with your statement. That things we do as Christians DO affect the decisions of others concerning Jesus Christ. Jesus even taught this. We are told in Jude that with some men have compassion and with others use fear. The method we use "makes the difference".
---Jasheradan on 6/7/11


Strongaxe, that's a terrible argument. Only a Christian would think of that since unbelievers do not believe in God in the first place. You said:
" Why should anyone bother to preach the gospel,"
We do it because we are commanded to do it. If we abide in Christ we will do it. And it should not be a bother to any of us. God formed a plan of salvation and how we conceive that plan is important to us believers, not unbelievers. It vitally affects the Christian's concept of God, of sin, and of salvation. God proclaims He saves, and how God through the great acts of the Holy Trinity work together for the recovering of lost mankind. Who they are only God knows, we don't. And what our concept is does not change God's plan.
---Mark_V. on 6/7/11


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Jesheradan, I have no bitterness towards the RCC. I love all the members. I speak against their false teachings. Their acts through history. Their traditions that speak against God's Word. There is many who are saved in that institution. The elect come from all over the world. No matter who they are. When God saves someone, it matters not where they are at or who they are, or what they have done, for salvation is all of Grace.
---Mark_V. on 6/7/11


Mark, I fear that your bitterness towards the RCC is hardening your heart. Maybe thats why your doctrine is so off the mark.

I take it you used to be Catholic before you went to the other extreme and became a Calvinist?
---Jasheradan on 6/6/11


Personally, I don't think what Camping did had any good in it. He profaned the name of YHWH by speaking with His authority and failing to come through. He mislead many who sold their belongings to follow a lie. He did nothing but paint Christianity as entertainment. The TRUTH sets us free, not false prophecy! No man knows the day or hour, it's that simple! :-)
Peace.
Ken
---Ken_Rank on 6/6/11


Mark_V.:

Unfortunately, that exact same kind of logic can be applied to ANY action. Why should anyone bother to preach the gospel, since the name of anyone who hears it was already written in the Book (or not), and preaching to them won't change it. Similarly, why should one avoid evil? If one is in the book, and commits murder, it won't hurt, and if one is not in the book, but refrains from murder, it won't help. With such thinking, there is no upside nor downside to any action, good nor evil.
---StrongAxe on 6/6/11


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Cluny, for your information, what Camping did, did nothing to add or not add to those who will be saved. The names have been written already from the foundation of the world. So just because he spoke the end was coming did not mean that he did anything to Christainity. People who believed him should study more. People who didn't believe him who were saved lost nothing. Most of the times when Christainity takes a blow is when movies show the RCC doing their thing. But even that does not change anything God has ordained or decreed. Not one thing surprises God. God had already warned us already through His Word about those who will predict.
---Mark_V. on 6/5/11


Mark_V.:

As Cluny pointed out, whenever Christians make fools out of them specifically in Jesus's name - either by making predictions that don't come true, or by preaching Christian morality that they themselves don't follow, or by performing other acts that are universally condemned, they bring all of Christianity, and God himself, into disrepute.

This has always gone on, as in Romans 2:24:
"For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written."

Failed prophecies cause people to behave as in 2 Peter 3:4:
"And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation."
---StrongAxe on 6/6/11


\\Strongaxe, don't you think that maybe what Camping said, did a lot of good?\\

What Camping did brought the name "Christian" into public scorn. So let me paraphrase:

"Don't you think that what Camping said, brining the name 'Christian' into public scorn, did a lot of good?"

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 6/5/11


Mark_V.:

Most of the people I have spoken to considered the whole "Camping debacle" to be a big joke. They were avidly watching thier clocks at 6PM, just to see that nothing, indeed, was going to happen. When nothing DID happen, all this did was to further cement the notion that date-setters are deluded crackpots.

Given all the false hysteria caused by Y2K, and all the "millenium" movies, and all the other failed doomsayers in the past decade, I did not personally encounter ANYONE who was taking Camping's predictions seriously. Prophecy already has a bad enough name in our society, and all Camping did was put yet another nail in the coffin. I didn't see ANY good coming out of this at all.
---StrongAxe on 6/4/11


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Strongaxe, don't you think that maybe what Camping said, did a lot of good? In fact many who never heard of the end times, were asking everyone who knew about it. They had never heard of the end times. And those who believed him were not very good in the Word of God, maybe now they will begin to read Scripture and come to know the Truth. There is so many varibles to his actions. Some negative and many positive. Believers should already know that no one knows the day or the hour. And they should already know there will be many who will teach that they know. We have been warned already about those.
---Mark_V. on 6/4/11


The Almighty isn't an "entertainer" that keeps His children amused and enthusiastic by foretelling future events.

The real purpose for God revealing Himself 'in entirety' is so we could be purified/saved (like Samuel just pointed out).

Jesus did all the "salvation stuff" (the "works of God"), all I need care about is having a good relationship.

God revealed Himself only PARTIALLY (Father and spirit) to worshippers and the "prophets" in the O.T., but now in the N.T., God revealed Himself to humanity COMPLETELY (the FULLNESS of God, all 3 manifestations of God) and began the age of ETERNITY.
...(in eternity, there is no such thing as "future", only "FOREVER").
---more_excellent_way on 6/2/11


more_excellent_way:

One 8.4 earthquake is horrible, but 40x weaker than Camping's predicted 10.0.

Self-destruct within 2 months? We have experienced MUCH larger earthquakes than this in recorded history (for example, when the Indonesian volcano Krakatoa erupted in 1883, it had a force of a 200 megaton blast, and was heard 3000 miles away. The 1556 Shaanxi earthquake (7.9) killed around 830,000 people in China.

What Camping did was to wake people up for a few weeks, only to disappoint them. The NEXT time someone warns of imminent destruction, possibly even legitimately, the people who heard Camping will ignore the warning - so his false wakeup call has done much DAMAGE, like the Boy Who Cried Wolf.
---StrongAxe on 6/2/11


God did not put the prophesy into his mouth so do not be afraid of him.

On the other hand, many shall come and prophesy the date of the end and, as a consequense, people will mock the coming of the Lord saying, "When is your Lord coming?" and "When is the end?" So when it DOES come, well, you know.
---Steveng on 6/2/11


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More excellent, I agree with one of your points, when you said,

"Maybe God DID put Camping in the right place at the right time because we are "asleep" and need to "wake up" (Hebrews 12:27??)."

One thing is sure and no doubt about, Camping was in the right place and the right time. God allowed or permitted what he said to happen. If what he said would have change in someway anything God had already decreed, Camping would not have said what he did. The final outcome is God's. There is many like him who have predicted and they all had a purpose, for we were told in Scripture this people would be there.
---Mark_V. on 6/2/11


What are we doing today to spread the Gospel that JESUS died for our sins? Who are we helping with our time and money?

Instead of spending so much time arguing about when the Second coming happen. Let us as much as possible help others.
---Samuel on 6/2/11


\\Maybe God DID put Camping in the right place at the right time because we are "asleep" and need to "wake up" (Hebrews 12:27??).
---more_excellent_way on 6/2/11\\

Camping also said that a 10 earthquake would start in NZ on 21 May and go around the planet with the sun. It didn't happen, so that's two false prophecies on one day.

And 21 May 2011 was no more seismically active than any other day.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 6/2/11


Apparently, the news media has not reported some of the earthquakes that have happened this year, and neither the US Geological website nor the European monitor (EMSC) have even recorded them (reason unknown, the recent 8.4 quake of Libya is shown on youtube along with "Earthquake Censorship").

If you look carefully at the present condition of the world, you'd expect it to self-destruct within two months, but the governments don't want "hysteria/chaos" from the people or "predictions".

Maybe God DID put Camping in the right place at the right time because we are "asleep" and need to "wake up" (Hebrews 12:27??).
---more_excellent_way on 6/2/11


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more_excellent_way:

Evangelical preachers have been warning people that "we are in the last days" for decades. Camping's mistake is NOT in saying this, but in ALSO literally predicting the day (May 21, 2011) and even the hour (6 PM local time) (but did he account for daylight saving time?).

Jesus did not say nobody knows the season, but he DID say nobody knows the day or the hour but the Father. And I don't think he was referring to the father of Harold Camping's children.
---StrongAxe on 6/1/11


Agreed, More Excellent Way
---Linda on 5/31/11


To me, The Lord's second coming was when He came into my heart. Ever since then, I/my heart has been "enraptured".

Never has the existence of the world looked so hopeless as today (wars, weather/environment, economy/corruption, etc.).

I never paid any attention to Camping at all, but now I wonder if God had him stumble onto something.

On the morning of the 21st, I checked the US Geological website and there was a 6.1 magnitude earthquake in New Zealand. They soon removed that listing. Now they put it back as a 5.9 magnitude.

There are many conflicting reports. Some claim there was no quake at all.

Camping has always been wrong about EVERYTHING, but is GOD saying "WAKE UP, HUMANITY"?.
---more_excellent_way on 5/31/11


Unless someone is sinless, like five I know here on line, everyone sins. Each individual is responsible for his own actions before
God. Many have predicted dates, I know to never believe them. Each individual that did believe them were not forced to believe what he said. They too were responsible for their actions. That he deceived the "unbelievers," there is no question about it, that he deceived the "believers," now that is sad, because those believers do not study the Word of God, or they have no faith in God's Word when they do read it, but instead they put their faith in Camping's word.
I'm sure Camping was sincere, but was sincerly wrong, he already had a history of that.
---Mark_V. on 5/28/11


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Samuel, my belated apologies. it was not an attempt to attack the sect of the adventists, being a sectarian myself amongst all sectarians i would never attack other sects, which is basically every other church in the world(compare acts 26:5 & 28:22). so everyone included.
i'm only sorry that i'm about the only one to see this truth, all what matters is the fact that Christdied and rose again, and that we are saved by the blood of the lamdband the word of our testimony(id est) that we believe Christ is risen and lord over ourlives.
---andy3996 on 5/28/11


"But of that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but the Father and Harold Camping alone".

Judas 13:32
---John on 5/27/11


//The Adventist who came out of that movement never made the same mistake again.

To save face, they like Camping will invent some cockoboo story that something happened in the heavenlies that no one can verify.

Adventists still believe Christ left the Fathers side as mediator and went into the Most Holy of Holies in heaven to begin judgment on Christians. And that was around 167 years ago! Ridiculous!!!!
---leej on 5/27/11


//And those who give his some slact are inabeling him to keep sinning.// kathr

//No we should not give Camping any slack. But we should offer forgivness if he repents and turns from his false course. //

Prayer is not slack. Sometimes, if the Lord wills,it binds tighter.

In addition, our interceding prayers can turn Camping and the rest of the mistaken 'profits' and their lemmings unto repentance, thus enabling them to discern spiritual Truth.

What others deem as slack just may be what the Lord offered those same people in mercy and grace. (splinter...plank)
---aka on 5/27/11


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\\Yet so many today are taken in by the false pretrib rapture theory that was invented inthe early 1900's based on false futurist theory and dispensationalism neither which are biblical.\\

It was 1830, Samuel.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny

Right again Cluny. thank you for helping keep me honest and correcting my memory. :)

Chirst is risen indeed.

He is our High Priest in heaven and our only Mediator.
---Samuel on 5/27/11


Donna66:

You said: Short answer: Yes, be prepared every day.

Yes, we must be prepared every day, for we do not know the day nor hour.

No, he's not crazy. But he's almost certainly wrong.

Believing one alone is right and everyone else in the world is wrong, is either a sign of severe delusion and/or madness, or a sign of pure genius. Doing so when the reverse has already been proven, not once, but twice, leaves only delusion and/or madness on the table.

Unfortunately, this sort of thinking is all too common in the world, and in the Church (even on these blogs). Countless cults have been started with leaders with such beliefs, sometimes tragically (Jonestown and Waco come to mind).
---StrongAxe on 5/27/11


Being & staying prepared is every day. Only God knows when that time will come. Harold is definitely Camping out at his
wrong idea, because, No man knows the time, the hour or the day.
---Lawrence on 5/27/11


Short answer: Yes, be prepared every day.
No, he's not crazy. But he's almost certainly wrong.
---Donna66 on 5/26/11


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\\Yet so many today are taken in by the false pretrib rapture theory that was invented inthe early 1900's based on false futurist theory and dispensationalism neither which are biblical.\\

It was 1830, Samuel.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/26/11


Christians are always prepared 24 hours of every day, and 7 days of every week, and every day of every year. As for Harold Camping, he spends too much time camping on dates.
---Eloy on 5/26/11


No we should not give Camping any slack. But we should offer forgivness if he repents and turns from his false course.

We should offer sympathy to his followers. Yet so many today are taken in by the false pretrib rapture theory that was invented inthe early 1900's based on false futurist theory and dispensationalism neither which are biblical.
---Samuel on 5/26/11


This may be hard for some to hear, after all, we are so much more sophisticated today, but in the OT, false prophets were stoned. NO, we don't do that in this day of Grace. But's God's view of them has never changed.

It only shows how many do not read their bibles, and do not have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, and yet believe in the Rapture. Those who do believe in the Rapture KNEW from the get go, this guy was a false prophet! Did I even give his prediction a second thought? NO!

False prophets have no place in the Body of Christ. Does the Spirit of truth in us LIE, and then keep lying? Adding sin to sin?

And those who give his some slact are inabeling him to keep sinning.
---kathr4453 on 5/26/11


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I met a man several years ago, who being in a church that ecncouraged and taught NEW revelations of prophecy, predicted the total destruction of Chicago. He gave time and date. Well it never happened.

But what I saw was remarkable in this man...he cried, and got on his knees asking for forgivness. He said I'M WRONG.

He learned a valuable lesson from all of it, but it took him years to work through and sort through much false teaching that encouraged what he said. He was caught in the snare of satan.

I knew by his brokenness he was saved.
---kathr4453 on 5/26/11


I guess oct 21 is the escape clause

sadly too many follow men ...why The Father in Heaven tells mankind have no other GODS before ME ...otherwise one falls into idolatry ...people worship Camping he will always have is LOST followers they are following their "bible" idol

Camping is a false prophet of which MANY MORE will be coming and TESTING ...Holy Scripture says believe EVERY word from Scripture doesn't say mortal mens idea's ABOUT Scripture

Christ will come HE says watch and pray and be counted WORTHY to escape the times of trouble ...one would KNOW Camping is a FRAUD by believing his anti christ rapture theory

watch out more lying rapture theory followers will begin to make speculations too
---Rhonda on 5/26/11


i've heard camping be called a fool, a false prophet, a *$#^, a deluded idiot, ...

he might be those things, but two things are for sure: his progeny like Oprah Winfrey will be comfortable and you will waste more time attacking a man that obviously needs prayer.
---aka on 5/25/11


Wow, I had not looked into this but this is serious and tragic!
Very sad, that some people sold their homes and cashed their children's college fund
to finance a massive advertising campaing promoting the advent of the prediction.

Gee, they could have spared their kids future just by going Economy Class
On the campaign:
A simple raiment of camel's hair, leather girdle about the loins, meals of locusts and wild honey, and taking it to the streets!
---Nana on 5/25/11


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Elder:

My comment was part in jest, part serious. When Jesus comes, we should be doing what we are supposed to, whether evangelizing, working, even partying.

Everything here will pass away. When we are gone, the Antichrist will get everything ANYWAY. There's no reason to feel jealous of anyone, let alone him.

But if we think our own activities are important enough that we wish Jesus would delay his return so we can enjoy them first, we have our priorities out of whack.

Sometimes we can get a little bit of good out of bad situations (like Camping crying "wolf") if they make us re-examine our motives. I wasn't intending to single you out specifically - moments of insight are important to all of us.
---StrongAxe on 5/25/11


Like always, those waiting to see the sun come up never see it until it's too late. So I've been told.

The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there!
(What he's doing)
For, behold, the kingdom of God is within you!

(BUT)
The days will come, when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, and ye shall not see it. And they shall say to you, See here, or, see there: go not after them, nor follow them!

For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven, so shall also the Son of man be in his day.
---TheSeg on 5/25/11


\\We just believe it is coming and we need to be ready.

Or we could die tomorrow and need to be ready.\\

Exactly what I've said elsewhere.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/25/11


Dear Andy

The Seventh day Adventist church did not exist as a church when the Advent movement misunderstood the Bible and predicted the Second Coming in 1844. The Advent leaders and followers were wrong. We readily admit that.

The Adventist who came out of that movement never made the same mistake again. We just believe it is coming and we need to be ready.

Or we could die tomorrow and need to be ready.
---Samuel on 5/25/11


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Harold Camping did not commit criminal fraud. In fact, I'm not sure he committed fraud! If he actually believed what he predicted (and I believe he did) then he is innocent of any kind of fraud.

The blame, if there is any, belongs to those who believed him, without checking out other scripture. Hopefully those who fell for this will not be fooled next time...and there will be a next time, I'm sure! This sort of deception has been going on since Paul wrote his letter to the early church.
---Donna66 on 5/25/11


StrongAxe, Whoa.... take a chill pill Bill.
Everything I have said was done humorously.
Camping and/or anyone else that comes up with these dates is
confused at best, lying or just a liar in their heart. Rev 21:8 deals with these folks.
If no one knows the date of Christ's return how could one make plans that would interfere? So if you brought your evidence of Christ returning on Oct 21st we would take you off of the birthday party guest list also, otherwise you are invited. Bring a gift small enough so if Christ does return on the 21st I can grab it and take it with me to heaven. I aint leavin nothin' for no anti-christ.
---Elder on 5/25/11


He"s definately in need of some help. or is it a skam to make people give all to the organisation he"s head of? remember the same technique worked well with the JW whenever they needed more funds then they had so it worked with the mormons, the advetists and many other cults. why did this not really work with with the Pentecostal movement. basically our division makes our strength. so it is not always bad the idea of one pastor governing one church.
---andy3996 on 5/25/11


Do NOT listen to Harold Camping, or you WILL be DECIEVED - He is a FALSE Prophet.
---Leslie on 5/24/11

Speaking from my own personal experiences, I think that the same could be said about A LOT of other Evangelists / Preachers / Teachers too. Things that I've Heard / Been Taught in many Churches and Seminars:

Give X amount of money and you'll be healed NOW.

Come to MY services and be freed of Worldly problems forever.

Remarriage is just like any other marriage. With some BONUSES.

In order to be Used By God, you MUST have completed X Schooling and have X Position.

How much of that stuff is Biblical? I don't think that Jesus taught any of it.



---Sag on 5/25/11


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Cluny:

This would all make sense if Camping thought he were more than a mere man. While I don't believe he does, many cult leaders and false prophets (David Koresh, Jim Jones, Sun Myung Moon, etc.) did.



Elder:

Perhaps it's a test for YOU personally - whether or not YOU consider personal schedules more or less important than God's schedules. Not that I believe Camping's schedules for a moment, but it would be wise for all of us to reflect on what would happen if we had something special (a party, anniversary, vacation, promotion, etc.) going on next Saturday (say), but found out Jesus was returning on Friday, would we be overjoyed, or a bit annoyed at him for not waiting for a day or two for us to have our fun first?
---StrongAxe on 5/24/11


Do NOT listen to Harold Camping, or you WILL be DECIEVED - He is a FALSE Prophet. The Bible says NO one knows the day or hour, NOT even the Son (Jesus). Please go ONLY with the Bible which is 100% right (TRUE) 100% of the time, and stay away from FALSE prophets like this.
---Leslie on 5/24/11


\\This is not religion is a case of pure criminal fraud ....\\

Actually, believe it or not, his actions are protected by freedom of religion AND speech.

Camping solicited NO donations for this advertising campaign. It was STRICTLY done by his followers of their own initiative.

Nor did Camping promise anything tangible for what his followers did with their own money. BM did promise return on investments, Camping didn't. Hence the latter perpetrated no fraud.

I'm not approving of his false prophecies, or defending his listeners' gullibility. Alas, there's no law in the USA to protect one from his own stupidity.

Christ is risen.
---Cluny on 5/24/11


This is how Harold Camping gets his predictions: add 12, multipy 6, divide by 10, and subtract 2 - this has NOTHING to do with the Bible, but is just "hocus-pocus", and is a LIE. He is a FALSE prophet who is NOT in line with the Bible at all.
---Leslie on 5/24/11


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Harold Camping is a case of fraud from the word go he has predicted the end of the world on September 6, 1994, May 21, 2011 and now October 21, 2011. He uses a network of radio stations and syndicated on 150 other stations. This is not religion is a case of pure criminal fraud and should be treated as such all of his organizations should lose their tax exempt status, the FCC should pull all station licenses. And he should be prosecuted for criminal fraud just as Bernard Madoff and hopefully incarcerated in solitary confinement until his death.
---Blogger9211 on 5/24/11


Listen up now!

If Camping says that October 21 is the date Christ will come, then we can certainly expect that he will develop some kind of theory that Christ did something, perhaps in the heavenlies much like the claim of the Adventists movement back in 1844 when Jesus left the Fathers side and went into the heavenly Inner Sanctum to begin judgment - an event impossible to verify.

Anyone here for betting?
---leej on 5/24/11


Hey, Mr. Camping I say the world will not end in Oct. Let's see who'se right on this one.
Any way I still don't want you at my birthday party.
---Elder on 5/24/11


That's right, Candice . . . always be ready to die right. If we are ready to die right, we are ready for Rapture when "the dead in Christ will rise first," as Paul says in 1 Thessalonians 4:16. I personally do not mean a pre-trib Rapture, though, because Jesus says, "Immediately after the tribulation of those days," the sun will go dark and the moon won't shine and Jesus "will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet" to gather His people (in Matthew 24:29-31). And Paul says the resurrection (Rapture) will be "at the last trumpet" (1 Corinthians 15:52) which is "immediately after".
---Bill_willa6989 on 5/24/11


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Are you crazy to ask such a question?

Obviously, Camping has invested so much of his life in making this prediction, albeit over and over again, he wants to see it before he dies. And at 89 he hasn't much time. So a few months from now is better than another ten years...
---atheist on 5/24/11


Think about this.

When Jesus was born, it was in the flesh--though it had spiritual effects.

When He was baptized, it was in real water and in the flesh--though it had spiritual effects available to all of us.

Same for His Passion, Crucifixion, Resurrection, and Ascension.

NONE of these things happened "spiritually" first.

Now Camping will have us believe that Christ came spiritually, and then physically a few months from now?

Think about it.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/24/11


He was wrong the first two times, and now he will be right?

Jesus explicitly said, "NO MAN knows the day or the hour."

At this point, the man is in prelest--spiritual delusion.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/24/11


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