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Meaning Of My Commandments

Does abide and obey have the same meaning to you? When Jesus says "my commandments", what does He mean?

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 ---aka on 9/28/11
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Francis:
1Cor 5 you're similar to Nicodemus with only physical understanding.

Again consider 1 Cor 2:13,14 "These things we also speak, not in words which mans wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, nor can he know them, because they are SPIRITUALYY DISCERNED."

God's word is a parable. Why?
Matt 13:11,13 "Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given.
Therefore I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand."
---Haz27 on 10/3/11


I have answered everyone's question. When I am going to get ONE question answered?
---Francis on 10/3/11


Haz, you first said 'Francis claims, to transgress the law you have not seen Christ nor known him, AND you're the "lowest form of life".'

I asked you to show where he wrote this-silence from you!


You now make a new claim about something he has supposedly written. However let us dwell on claim no. 1 before addressing no. 2.

You need to stop twisting what people say, and accept Francis believes we can only be saved by God's grace.
---Warwick on 10/3/11


Gordon //The Pauline struggle from ROMANS 7 was a temporary PHASE which Paul went through.

There is nothing in the scripture that tells us we can totally live up to all the law, only Jesus was able to do that.

if you ask any Christian if they no longer sin, that person would have to be deceiving himself or lying if he said he no longer sinned.

1 John 1:8 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Your interpretation is totally at odds with what all Christian theologians have believed for the past 2000 years.

And there is no reason you or your denomination has been given any special favor of God to see truth as other Christians do not see it.
---lee1538 on 10/3/11


---Haz27 on 10/3/11
1 Corinthians 5:1 It is reported commonly [that there is] fornication among you,..that one should have his father's wife. And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
1 Corinthians 5:6 Your glorying [is] not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?
Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened.


God is letting his church know that they should not glorify sin, that allowing one person to continue in sin, may lead to others embracing sin. Therefore he demands that they put this young man out, and put away sin from them before the whole church gets contaminated with sin
---Francis on 10/3/11




Francis //

1. Do not worship other gods.
2. Do not worship idols.
3. Do not misuse God's name.
4. KEEP THE SABBATH HOLY.
5. ...

the 10 commandments (craved on stone) depicts the Old Covenant.

Deut. 4:13 And he declared to you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, that is, the 10 Commandments, and he wrote them on two tablets of stone.

The church is under the ministry of the Spirit, not of the law.

2Co 3:7 Now if the ministry of death, carved in letters on stone, came with such glory that the Israelites could not gaze at Moses face because of its glory, which was being brought to an end,will not the ministry of the Spirit have even more glory?
---lee1538 on 10/3/11


---TheSeg
I realy like these question:
Exo 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.(but keep the law of adultery by killing)
Exo 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.(but keep the law not to kill)

Not too long ago in USA we were killing people for witchcraft(see salem witch trials), adultery, and punishing people for not keeping sunday holy ( sunday blue laws). This was a joint venture of church and state. the church accused the state punished.

The bible gaurantees us that in the future the government will enforce religious laws, that no man may buy or sell, and some will be put to death for not accepting the amrk of the beast

good question theseg
---Francis on 10/3/11


---Haz27 on 10/3/11
1 Corinthians 5:1 It is reported commonly [that there is] fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.

This is what provokes all other discussionS in 1 corithians 5.

---TheSeg on 10/3/11
1 Peter 2:13 Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme, Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the PUNISHMENT OF EVILDOEERS, and for the praise of them that do well.

Some governmentS have not taken it upon themselves to do this, but in other government like the islamics they have
---Francis on 10/3/11


Christan, ROMANS 8 "There is, therefore, now no condemnation to them which are in Christ JESUS (YAHUSHUA), who walk NOT AFTER THE FLESH, but after the Spirit." There is an holy Stipulation there, one must be walking after the Spirit and not be indulging the flesh. "For to be carnally minded is Death, but to be Spiritually minded is Life and Peace." The Pauline struggle from ROMANS 7 was a temporary PHASE which Paul went through. There must be some Spiritual Maturity sometime. We are not to always live as in ROMANS 7.
---Gordon on 10/3/11


Francis:
Regarding your mis-understanding of 1Cor 5:9 I refer you to 2Cor6:14
"Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers, for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness".

And note 1Cor 5:7 "Purge out therefore the old leaven (works of the law), that ye may be a new lump..."

Have you purged out the old leaven (Matt 16:11,12)?
Remember "Christ is the END of the law for righteousness to everyone that BELIEVES" Rom 10:4



---Haz27 on 10/3/11




---Haz27 on 10/3/11
John 13:10 Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash his feet, but is clean every whit:
So this is Gods command not SDA

Romans 2:16 In the day when GOD SHALL JUDGE the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

It is not my place to say if one forgets to confess / or is harbouring secret sin what his destiny is. I do not even think the bible addresses that.

The area in which we are able to judge is by the actions of men, and only men IN THE CHURCH:
1 Corinthians 5:12 do not ye judge them that are within?
1 Corinthians 5:13 But them that are without God judgeth
---francis on 10/3/11


1 Corinthians 5:11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner, with such an one no not to eat.

You are comparing your behavior as holy, and theirs as not holy.
---Mark_V. on 10/3/11
Would you say that the writer of 1 corithians 5 is comparing his behaviour to theirs as not holy? After all this is what paul says of himself:
1 Timothy 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I AM CHIEF.

If not, why not?
---francis on 10/3/11


we cannot fall into ANY SIN, no sin is acceptable to God, not murder, not breaking the sabbath. ALL SIN must be repented of and confessed. and God will forgive.
Francis on 10/3/11

Francis, just how do you keep these laws?
How many adulterer have you put to death?

Please explain it to me.
If you dont and say you do, then you are just a liar?

Exo 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.(but keep the law of adultery by killing)
Exo 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.(but keep the law not to kill)

Lev_20:10 And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.
Pease
---TheSeg on 10/3/11


"Can we get an honest answer from you?"
---christan on 10/3/11
Galatians 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ,.. for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

So we are not justified by keeping the law, not law of Moses, not law of God, yet while we are not justified by keeping the law, we cannot fall into ANY SIN, no sin is acceptable to God, not murder, not breaking the sabbath. ALL SIN must be repented of and confessed. and God will forgive.
---Francis on 10/3/11


Warwick, this is what Francis declares, "a christian is one who obeys all ten commandments, who is FORGIVEN of his PAST SINS and lives no more in sin. Meaning he ABIDES / OBEYS all the laws of God"."

Based on Francis and your defending his testimony, you both have no idea of what being saved by grace means at all and are rejecting what Paul declares in Romans 7:18,19

"For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me, but how to perform that which is good I find not. For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do."

Francis, you speak on your own as Scripture contradicts you.
---christan on 10/3/11


"But as James (ch.2) writes faith without works is dead, that there are good works for the saved to do." Warwick

Warwick, I do not glorify sin. It is a contradiction of who God is, HOLY! Whereas the man is SINFUL as declared by Scripture. It is true that unless God forgives one of his/her sins in Jesus Christ, that soul will be damned in the Lake of Fire.

But for you and Francis to continuously pound on "good works" as a measure of having faith, using Scripture from James, shows you have no understanding of grace. For if your claim is true then the thief on the cross, even King Solomon in his latter days (who fell into idolatry and adultery) - according to you should not be in the Kingdom of Heaven.
---christan on 10/3/11


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Francis/Warwick,

Galatians 3:3 "Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?" 10-12 "For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them."

As Haz27 rightly asked "Please show scripture to answer this as it's important we know what these limits are (if they exist)." "Can we get an honest answer from you?"
---christan on 10/3/11


---Rob You went from this:
1. Do not worship other gods.
2. Do not worship idols.
3. Do not misuse God's name.
4. KEEP THE SABBATH HOLY.
5. Honor your father & mother.
6. Do not murder.
7. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
9. Do not lie.
10. Do not covet

TO THAT

1. Do not worship other gods.
2. Do not worship idols.
3. Do not misuse God's name.
4.
5. Honor your father & mother.
6. Do not murder.
7. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
9. Do not lie.
10. Do not covet

You may spend the rest of your life trying to justify it, but you know in your heart that there is no biblical way to do so. I strongly suggest you meditate on Isaiah 1:18
---Francis on 10/3/11


Francis:
Thanks for the admission what SDA's do when breaking a commandment.

But on 9-30-11 regarding Matt 5:19 you said
"God says you are thus the lowest form of life" if breaking one of the commandments.

AND 1John3:6 you said "to transgress the law you have neither seen him nor known him."

So SDA's do foot washing ("rebaptized") each time they break a commandment to undo the damnation you stated above.
I can't help but wonder what if one forgets/misses this process or dies beforehand?

SDA doctrine distorts the gospel.

Instead God says sin was condemned in the flesh that the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us Rom 8:4 Believe on Jesus.



---Haz27 on 10/3/11


francis, 1 Cor. 5:11 no where teaches what you said:
"Would you advise them to continue in their way because we are saved by Grace and not by keeping the commandments? Would you advise them to repent, turn away from sin, and live a life of obedience to the commandmentsof God?"
The passage is saying the opposite of what you and others are doing,
" But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone name a brother, who is sexually immoral, or coveteous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner-not even to eat with such a person"
Your doing the opposite. You are comparing your behavior as holy, and theirs as not holy. When you youself admit you sin as a believer.
---Mark_V. on 10/3/11


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i think the story with mary and martha is a good contrast of abiding and obeying. one can obey without abiding, but one cannot abide without obeying.

then, the issue of "my" commandments...
---aka on 10/2/11


They were ALL intended for earth. You don't actually think that any of them were intended for heaven or hell or other planets, do you?
---Cluny on 10/1/11
Rather than come to an EARTHLY HIGH PRIEST when we sin with a goat or a lamb or bull, we rather to to OUR HEAVENLY high priest who has gained redeemption BY HIS OWN BLOOD

Rather than having an annual cleansing of the EARTHLY sanctuary Jesus by His bllod entered into THE HEAVENLY sanctuary to perform the cleansing.

So you see how we do not have ot make sactifices or go to an EARTHLY high priest, these are now performing in THE TRUE tabancle the one God made not man.

This is from the book of Hebrews
---Francis on 10/2/11


---Haz27, I do not remember saying that being a SDA makes on immune from sin. I do remember speaking of obedience to Gods laws, and FORGIVENESS FOR SINS. It is because christians may fall from time to time that Christ instituted the ordinance of foot washing: So that those who have been baptized need not be rebaptized each time they sin, but rather confess their sin and have their foot washed. Proverbs 24:16 For a just man falleth seven times, and riseth up again:

That is very different from one who does not keep all ten commandments and refuses to admit that failure to keep one is sin, does not confess and does not repent.
his sins are neither forgiven nor covered, he is guilty before God. Proverbs 14:9 Fools make a mock at sin
---Francis on 10/2/11


"And regarding "Be ye holy, for I am holy"?
1Pet 1:23"Being BORN AGAIN , not of corruptable seed, but of INCORRUPTABLE"
It is Christ in us that makes us holy. We are a new creation. "If the firstfruit (Christ) be holy, the lump is also holy"Rom 11:16.
---Haz27 on 9/30/11 "
Amen
---chria9396 on 10/1/11


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Abide, obey, keeping and doing all have the same meaning to me!

Joh_15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

Now, if you think youre going to go around.
Kissing and hugging everyone think again.
Most people will not understand you and honestly be afraid of you.
I believe it is this fear of love, that makes them rebel against you.
Although it not against you, but against the love of God in you.
God loves you in spirit! Not the way it sounds, but your actual spirit.
It belongs to him, it is his spirit.

1Co_6:20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.
Peace
---TheSeg on 10/1/11


\\Cluny, If you read the NT it is obvious that some of the 613 laws are not to be kept on earth.\\

Wrong, again, francis.

They were ALL intended for earth. You don't actually think that any of them were intended for heaven or hell or other planets, do you?

Try again.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/1/11


Francis, you always speak about keeping the 10 commandments. Yet many times from the things you have posted on these blogs, you constantly break three of them.
---Rob on 10/1/11


Haz, I note some here continually tell Francis what he believes, not what he has written.

You wrote 'Francis claims, to transgress the law you have not seen Christ nor known him, AND you're the "lowest form of life".'

Where did he write this?

Francis wrote "Romans 4:7 Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin."

"Such a man is not guilty because GOD HAS FORGIVEN HIM.....he does NOT return to a life of trangressing the law"

It is very clear Francis believes we are saved only by grace but should not then return to a sinful life-style. This is consistent with 1 John 3:4-6.
---Warwick on 10/1/11


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Christian, read what Francis has actually written, not what deceivers say. I have noted Francis has repeatedly said we can only be saved by grace. But as James (ch.2) writes faith without works is dead, that there are good works for the saved to do. Jesus says all the Law is summed up in loving God passionately, and loving and serving our fellow man. Surely one saved by grace therefore thankful for the free gift, should desire to, as well as he can, follow His commands, not continue in lives of lawlessness. Francis aptly quotes "2 Peter 2:21 it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment." Peter likens this to a dog returning to its vomit!
---Warwick on 10/1/11


Abide means to stay in,tolerate,perservere,it shows a settling in and remaining. Obey is to carry out,an order or instruction,comply. Jesus is the Word of God made flesh and every thing God ever said,creation and all was with Jesus. What belongs to God belongs to Jesus for Christ said I and my Father are one. Love Christ and obey his commands,the Gospel he preached and had his Apostles preach. The commandments Gentiles are to keep are in Acts 15:20. If a Christian loves Christ he will keep the way Christ taught for you cannot love and not obey,for a person who loves also tries to please the one he loves.
---Darlene_1 on 10/1/11


Francis:
Like others here, I personally know many SDA's, and we have seen how SDA's IN FACT fail to continually obey the commandments.

And your doctrine JUDGES fellow SDA's as NON-Christians. Your avoidance of this point is telling.

And ICor5:9 says "Know ye not that the UNRIGHTEOUS shall not inherit the kingdom of God".
A Christian's righteousness is in Christ ONLY. I no longer live but Christ lives in me.
You fail to recognize this and judge righteousness according to the flesh.
---Haz27 on 10/1/11


//You claim people can/should keep the law perfectly. Yet you admitted you don't. All SDA's I've known fail on this.

The early Jewish church of the first century followed closely in the Mosaic tradition by temple worship, keeping the laws of Moses, circumcision, dietary laws as well as keeping the OT sabbath.

The Jerusalem council did not mandate such laws to Gentile converts.

While SDA maintains they try to obey the law, the law they often refer to is the OT law that even the Apostles admitted was a burden.

Acts 15:10 Now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?
---lee1538 on 10/1/11


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Haz27 on 9/30/11
If you are having trouble obeying God there are a few possible issues:

1: the law of God is NOT in your heart Jeremiah 31:33 I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts,

2: you are carnally minded:
Romans 8:7 the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

3: you do not believe in the power of God to keep you from sin 2 Timothy 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof:

1 Corinthians 10:13 God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able, but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

YOUR PROBLEM NOT MINE
---francis on 10/1/11


Which of these should a person who is saved by Grace, justified by faith, be COMMIT to doing on a daily bases?
1. worship other gods.
2. worship idols.
3. misuse God's name.
4. Not keep the Sabbath holy.
5. Dishonor your father & mother.
6. murder.
7. commit adultery.
8. steal.
9. lie.
10. covet

If your sins are forgiven are you still guilty before God?
---Francis on 10/2/11


Haz, you wrote "And I still wonder what is that minimum level of commandment keeping YOU claim shows a person is saved?" I have never said any such thing.
---Warwick on 10/2/11


---christan on 10/1/11
CAN I GET AN HONEST ANSWER FROM YOU?
If you met someone who claimed to be a christian but worshiped other gods, made idols and worshiped them, blasphemed the name of God, refused to keep the sabbath, dishonoured his parents, is a murderer, a liar, a theif, and adulterer, and is coveteous, would you say that this perspn was saved?
Would you advise them to continue in their way because we are saved by Grace and not by keeping the commandments? Would you advise them to repent, turn away from sin, and live a life of obedience to the commandmentsof God? Would you tell him that it is OK to sin beacuse everyone does it? First read 1 Corinthians 5:11 before you answer. Why can we not fellowship with someone like that?
---francis on 10/2/11


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There is the Leviticus law of ceremonial cleanings, discipline and morality, and there is the 10 commandments from the mountain/Moses, but Jesus fulfilled the requirements of the Leviticus law and in regards to the law of Moses/10 commandments, we should all examine the covenants and let the Holy Spirit/NT lead our conscience through the work of the Cross and grace. Without an understanding of covenant theology it is difficult to interpret the OT and easy to get stuck in legalism. He is the Lamb of God that came to take away the sin of the world, He consecrates us before we are born, and He is completely Sovran and gracious desiring all men to be saved through the cross.
In His loving grip
---Poppa_Bear on 10/2/11


//You claim people can/should keep the law perfectly. Yet you admitted you don't. All SDA's I've known fail on this.

I believe it is their obsession with keeping the Jewish Sabbath that deceives them into believing they are keeping the law.

But the flesh likes to be religious.
---lee1538 on 10/2/11


Francis:
You claim people can/should keep the law perfectly. Yet you admitted you don't. All SDA's I've known fail on this.

But Paul, being blameless in regards to righteousness in keeping the law, considered this as "DUNG" Phil 3:6-9.

You say we are to be OVERCOMERS (keeping the law).
But you fail to recognize 1John5:5 "Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that BELIEVES that Jesus is the Son of God".

And regarding "Be ye holy, for I am holy"?
1Pet 1:23"Being BORN AGAIN , not of corruptable seed, but of INCORRUPTABLE"
It is Christ in us that makes us holy. We are a new creation. "If the firstfruit (Christ) be holy, the lump is also holy"Rom 11:16.
---Haz27 on 9/30/11


"How can any vital topic be covered if the non JW's have to contend with one hand tied behind their backs?" Warwick

Me thinks that Warwick needs a hug. ---scott on 9/30/11

this was on a blog that was closed on 9/29.

there are a few people who get to post after a question is closed. there are a few people who get to post 4 or 5 posts (of 125 each) addressed to the same person in one update.

//How can any vital topic be covered if the non JW's have to contend with one hand tied behind their backs?//

1Jn 4:4 You are of God, little children, and you have overcome them, because He who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.
---aka on 10/1/11


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Cluny, If you read the NT it is obvious that some of the 613 laws are not to be kept on earth. How did the APOSTLES know which is which. The answer is: THE LAW OF MOSES which is the law given to Moses at Herub, Malachi 4:4 when God told him to make a sanctuary... which has carnal ordinances, Hebrews 9:10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, andCARNAL ORDINANCES, imposed on them until the time of reformation, SHOULD NOT BE KEPT ON EARTH. Do you see meats and drinks and washings in the LAW OF GOD ( ten commandments, tithing and so on) Meats and drink here referring not to what people eat or drink but Exodus 30:9 meat offering, drink offering
---francis on 10/1/11


Francis,

There're commandments after commandments for man to obey. Nowhere in Scripture does it tell us that we can obey God whenever He commands. Rather, Paul reveals that His laws served only one purpose,

"Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin." Romans 3:20, "But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them." Galatians 3:11,12

You seem to belief and teach contrary to what Paul teaches, clearly declaring to us that unless we obey God's laws, the Christian is not saved.
---christan on 10/1/11


Warwick:
Francis claims, to transgress the law you have not seen Christ nor known him, AND you're the "lowest form of life".

I'm trying to understand Francis's position in light of the above when SDA's such as him also transgress the law at times.

And I still wonder what is that minimum level of commandment keeping YOU claim shows a person is saved?

The criminal on the cross had no opportunity for commandment keeping to prove his salvation.
BUT what if someone lives for 10,20 or 40 years as a Christian. Are there allowances made for how many transgressions you can commit for each year you live?
You've still given no scriptures to support your claim, hence I don't understand your doctrine.


---Haz27 on 10/1/11


Haz27 YOUR ARGUEMENT HAS ALREADY BEEN REJECTED,
1 Corinthians 5:11 I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is CALLED A BROTHER be a fornicator, or covetous,.. with such an one DO NOT EAT

One who is a christian doesn't return to sin.John 8:11 go, and sin no more.

Romans 4:7 Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

Such a man is not guilty because GOD HAS FORGIVEN HIM.HIS SINS ARE COVERED and he does NOT return to a life of trangressing the law

2 Peter 2:21 it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment.
---Francis on 10/1/11


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Jesus was addressing the Jewish people under the Old Covenant.
---lee1538 on 9/30/11
Matthew, Mark, luke and John is not about the people who jesus is addressing: hebrews. It is about the people to whom the authors are writing many years after the death of Jesus. Jesus did not write the book fo Matthew. Matthew wrote the book himself to THE CHURCH letting US know the teaching of Jesus.
If we go by Leej's logic that what Jesus said only applies to hebrews since he was speaking to hebrews, then we must say that what paul wrote only applied to the galations, oR corithians, or ephesians. Thus we need apistles to the Canadians, Mexicans and so on.

then Revelations would only apply to hose seven churches named in the book.
---Francis on 10/1/11


Francis is saying we can only be saved by God's grace. But when saved, as James says (ch. 2) faith without works is useless-good works being proof of salvation.

Jesus words:

'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.'

'Love your neighbor as yourself.'

'All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.' Matthew 22:37-40

'All' includes the 10 Commandments. Loving the Lord means doing what He commands. Loving your fellow man means treating people God's way.

Therefore, post salvation, as part of our good works we must aim to follow the 10 Commandments. But what sort of a Christian would plan to disobey God's Commandments?
---Warwick on 10/1/11


Can God save Francis in spite of his sinfulness? Or will he goes down the tubes when the Investigative Judgment occurs?
---lee1538 on 9/30/11

Or the Apostles?
Romans 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
2For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth, but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.

3So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law, so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.

Balance of 7 is Ur answer.
---Trav on 10/1/11


The Laugh in on you since you are so limited in your understanding of God's word. Jesus was addressing the Jewish people under the Old Covenant.

Galatians which states the following:
.... to redeem those who were under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons.
---lee1538 on 9/30/11

I won't be laughing at someone who is concerned with doing what GOD asks.

We are all ignorant until we aren't....you in that you presume Judah equals all Israel.
The Northern House was divorced/put away under GOD's law. They were Israel, under the law as Judah. But,unaware of them, unsought,you can't find them.
Don't look for them.
By that alone, one cannot see or hear 3/4 of scripture.
---Trav on 10/1/11


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I keep on asking francis why he picks and chooses which of God's 613 commandments he will obey, but so far he's not answered me, aside from making a specious distinction that the Bible does not and never had made.

Glory to Jesus Christ.
---Cluny on 9/30/11


Francis said:
"a christian is one who obeys all ten commandments, who is FORGIVEN of his PAST SINS and lives no more in sin. Meaning he ABIDES / OBEYS all the laws of God".

I understand what you claim here BUT what I'm asking is that as you fail to ABIDE/OBEY all the laws of God then by your own judgement you NEVER KNEW HIM 1John3:6.

James 2:10 To offend in ONE point your guilty of ALL commandments

So using YOUR words referring to Matt 5:19, to break a commandment makes YOU "the lowest form of life".

How do YOU feel about YOUR position? As a Christian YOU have at sometime broke a commandment, thus guilty of all and therefore YOU have been judged as never having known Him?

---Haz27 on 9/30/11


--lee1538 on 9/30/11
Let me save you some time:
I will post this:
1. Do not worship other gods.
2. Do not worship idols.
3. Do not misuse God's name.
4. Keep the Sabbath holy.
5. Honor your father & mother.
6. Do not murder.
7. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
9. Do not lie.
10. Do not covet

And say that we are saved by GRACE and not because we obey these, but once we accept Jesus we keep God's commandments which show we love God and our neighbours.

You cannot deny this, so you then attack E G WHITE and say that E G white teaches salvation by works. I ask you to post it and you have no sourse. See the time i saved you?
---Francis on 9/30/11


//Jesus commands us to:
1) Love God with all your heart,mind,soul, and strength.
2) To love your neighbor as yourself.// ---JIM on 9/30/11

Amen. Before His summary of 2 from ten, He said commandments. After the summary, He says keep my commandments. it isn't not a change, it is amplification. think about it.

application: if the law says that each apple costs 50 cents and i buy 2 from you, the law says I owe you a dollar. if one of those are rotten, by law you are not obligated to refund me 50 cents.

Moreover, His commandments say the same. BUT, you are bound by your own expectations, and the Lord will only give you what you are willing to give others.
---aka on 9/30/11


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Can God save Francis in spite of his sinfulness? Or will he goes down the tubes when the Investigative Judgment occurs?lee1538///


Funny you should ask that lee1538, because Calvin taught YOU ALL had to one day stand before a tribunal. No Kidding! Calvin never understood either we stand IN CHRIST a New Creature. He never understood Romand 6!

So, in pointing fingers at another, one might look well into their own false doctrine.
---kathr4453 on 9/30/11


Frencis //Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments...

The Laugh in on you since you are so limited in your understanding of God's word. Jesus was addressing the Jewish people under the Old Covenant.

I know you ignore most of the New Testament especially Galatians which states the following:

But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law, to redeem those who were under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons.
---lee1538 on 9/30/11


Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach [them], the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
---francis on 9/30/11


Francis I know what you mean, that we can only be saved by God's grace through the atoning work of Jesus upon the cross. And once saved we should plan to follow His Commandments, not as unto salvation but as good works in obedience to God. In Philippians 2:12 Paul told this Church, already saved by grace that they should continue as God would have them live, in good works. James concurs saying faith without good works is useless.

However others ignore what you have said and try to make out that you are saying we can firstly be saved by Commandment observance.

They know what you mean but prefer to misrepresent your beliefs.
---Warwick on 9/30/11


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---lee1538 on 9/30/11
LOL LOL
Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the lowest form of life ( BY THOSE) in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach [them], the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

So you choose to break one and teach men to so, God says you are thus the lowest form of life

---Haz27 on 9/29/11
Maybe we are not understanding each other. My point is that a christian is one who obeys all ten commandments, who is FORGIVEN of his PAST SINS and lives no more in sin. Meaning he ABIDES / OBEYS all the laws of God. What is your view?
---Francis on 9/30/11


"When Jesus says "my commandments", what does He mean?"

John 14:15 "If ye love me, keep my commandments."
John 14:24 "He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me."

Abide and obey are the same thing. All things in proper measure and justice.
Reminds me of Paul saying, 2 Thesalonians 3:10 "For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat."
Paul is not teaching us to be unmerciful, rather that mercy shall not be abused...
---Nana on 9/30/11


The Commandments are the two greatest Commandments of loving GOD first and then loving your neighbour as yourself. On these two Commands hang all the Law (the Ten Commandments) and the Prophets (including Prophecies of GOD: the Old and New Prophecies).
---Gordon on 9/30/11


To abide is to be kept in a continuous state. To obey is to listen attentively, and submit to that which is heard.
"When Jesus says "my commandments", what does He mean"
His precepts, Love the Lord, Love your fellow man.
For "If you fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself," Jam 2:8
"Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law." Rom 13:8
"For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this: "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." Gal 5:14
"And this commandment we have from Him: that he who loves God must love his brother also." 1Jo 4:21
---Josef on 9/30/11


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Can God save Francis in spite of his sinfulness? Or will he goes down the tubes when the Investigative Judgment occurs?

He might get a D+ for effort but will that be a passing grade required by God?

At least he can boast that he observed the Sabbath, but no one has yet to figure out at the end of the day, if that was successful.
---lee1538 on 9/30/11


Jesus commands us to:
1) Love God with all your heart,mind,soul, and strength.
2) To love your neighbor as yourself.
---JIM on 9/30/11


Abide can mean to keep on living somewhere or in something. And obey can mean to do what someone says to do. So, they can be different. But if Jesus says to abide in His commandments, then obeying Jesus means staying in doing His commandments, in which case abide and obey mean the same thing. Keeping Jesus' commandments can mean doing what He personally tells you to do. This could be what He means, in John 15:10: not just general commands, but personally communicated directions.
---Bill_willa6989 on 9/29/11


Francis:
It seems we are missing each others points in our previous discussion.

I used YOU as an example regarding your transgression of the law.
You are GUILTY of ALL 10 commandments (James 2:10) so therefore you have "NOT SEEN HIM NOR KNOWN HIM" (1john3:6). Both these scriptures you also used.

I asked how can you claim to be Christian when you fail to obey the law, hence guilty of all commandments and have therefore not seen Him nor known Him?

You reply with 1Cor 5 & 6 referring to fornicators, adulterers, coveteous. As you are guilty of all how are these scriptures explaining YOUR position?
---Haz27 on 9/29/11


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Are you a 'COMMANDO'....OR...
..........a LOVER of Jesus?
---more_excellent_way on 9/29/11

Well lover man, fight the complete fight.
Love isn't going to plow the garden. Corn with a little salt and butter tastes a lot better. Some one has got to milk the cow and churn the butter. Yes we love it mmmm.
Can't love it into a meal.
Ephesians 6:17
And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:
---Trav on 9/29/11


John 15:10 If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love, just as I have kept my Fathers commandments and abide in his love.

Yes, to abide in Christ would mean that one would be obedience to all His commands.

But what are those commandments He speaks of? Is the 10 commandments specifically in view here in this verse?

A comparison of other passages in John's writings suggests the answer.

And this is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. And the one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. (1 John 3:23-24a, Light in the Darkness, Studies in the Gospel of John, by Homer A. Kent, jr.)
---lee1538 on 9/29/11


francis //When Jesus says "my commandments", what does He mean? All of them, every word out of the mouth of God

There are over 600+ commands or commandments found in the Old Testament alone. Any good student of His word would say that only the commands that are found in the New Covenant and not the Old are applicable to the Christian.

Deut. 4:13 states the 10 commandments are the Old Covenant God made with Israel at Mt. Sinai but the church is not under the Old Covenant.

if you try to obey ALL the commands, then you may end up marrying your dead brothers wife if he had no children. Mt. 22:24f

And if you follow the Old Testament you need get yourself physically circumcised.
---lee1538 on 9/29/11


1 John3:23
"And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment."
---Haz27 on 9/29/11


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Moderators: The pro Jehovah's Witness stance of this site is disgracefull. For just 1 example 6 out of 7 of the final blogs on 'Finish it Here Part 2' were from David and Scott. This has occurred on numerous occasions previously. I have never seen anyone else given such a free hand. I have seen these men given 4 blogs in a row and no one else.

Maybe it is time to openly declare the denomination of those in control here.

How can any vital topic be covered if the non JW's have to contend with one hand tied behind their backs?

I say vital because the Jehovah's Witness organization leads people away fron Scripture. Peoples eternal life is at stake.

Tell us why these men are given such favour?
---Warwick on 9/29/11


clearly abide and obey do not have the same meaning!

however I'm sure we shall see how counterfeit christianity teaches their LIES creating new "meanings" for these words so they can twist distort and REJECT the plain truth from Gods Holy Word deceiving many into belief they have a license to sin "in Christ" Eph 2:8 Jude 1:4 unaware by doing so they serve another Christ 2Corin 11:4

Gods Word is CLEAR

John 15:10 1John 3:24...If one obeys and keeps the Spirit of the LAW (Gods Holy Just 10 commandments - HIS Spiritual Laws) they abide in the love of Christ

If one does not walk as Christ walked one cannot abide in HIS Love

eternal salvation is ONLY for those who OBEY Heb 5:9
---Rhonda on 9/29/11


John 15:4-7 "Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine, no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered, and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned."
1 John 2:10
"He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him."
1 John 3:6
"Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not..."
---chria9396 on 9/29/11


Does abide and obey have the same meaning to you? YES
When Jesus says "my commandments", what does He mean? All of them, every word out of the mouth of God
---francis on 9/29/11


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He refers to Baptism and the Eucharist, among others He gave.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/29/11


To "abide" can mean to either LIVE IN, or LIVE BY.

In 1 Corin. 13:13 ("faith, hope, and love"), the word "abide" means 'abide BY' these three principles.

All throughout the N.T., "abide IN Jesus" means to actually LIVE INSIDE Jesus's body SPIRITUALLY so that you are protected.

If you have spiritually placed your soul inside the body of the one who slew death, then....you "live and move" because of His power (Acts 17:28) and your spirit that is inside Him has NO GENDER.

Inside Jesus, there is "neither male nor female" (Galatians 3:28, spirits have no gender).
---more_excellent_way on 9/29/11


Jesus said that we can simply "WALK IN LOVE" and we will be fulfilling EVERYTHING that is HIS WILL.

Caring about someone's will/desire is an act of love, caring about what they DEMAND/shout/order is not LOVE, it's simple partisan COMPLIANCE (good procedure for a soldier/robot/puppet).

Jesus abolished (Ephesians 2:15) the commandments that were embraced by Israel so that there could be a new heavenly creation that is the result of HIS SPIRIT combining with OUR SPIRIT.

Ephesians 2:15 "that there may be one new man" (new creation).....the combination of His spirit and ours ("in place of the two").

Are you a 'COMMANDO'....OR...
..........a LOVER of Jesus?
---more_excellent_way on 9/29/11


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