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Law Of God Versus Moses

Is there any difference between what the Bible refers to as the law of God (Romans 7:22,25) and the law of Moses (Acts 15:5)?

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 ---lee1538 on 10/24/11
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francis //THE LAW OF MOSES which contains ordinaces of washing and meat oferings and drink offerings is called CARNAL.

So what God instructed Moses was carnal? fleshly, bodily, erotic, animal, voluptuous, sensual, sensuous, lascivious, wanton?

Do you agree the law (no matter type) was given only as a guardian (schoolmaster) until we could be justified by faith?

And once we have been justified by faith, we are no longer under the law as it has accomplished its purpose?

(see Galatians 3:24-25 So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian, for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith.)
---lee1538 on 11/2/11


In saying that the law of God and the law of the Lord as the same thing if the context is the same is nothing less than very bad exegetics of God's word.
---lee1538 on 11/2/11
I am sure that THE LORD and GOD are one and the same:
Deuteronomy 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God [is] one LORD:

Now read my post on 10/27/11
---Francis on 11/2/11


//law of God" or " Law of the lord" can refer at times to the entire writing of the bible...The law of God and the law of the lard are the same if the context is the same

?????????????????????the law of lard is the same as law of the lord?

//The law of God is NEVER called the law of Moses, while the law of Moses is at times called the law of the lord/ God
Example: Luke 2:24 And to offer a sacrifice according to that which is said in the law of the Lord, ...

In other words the Bible is inconsistent in its terms.

In saying that the law of God and the law of the Lord as the same thing if the context is the same is nothing less than very bad exegetics of God's word.
---lee1538 on 11/2/11


There is no difference. Moses did not have any authority to make his own laws in God's name. The Bible clearly tells us that the laws Moses gave to the people, he was first given them by God to give to the people. They were all God's laws.
---Jed on 11/2/11


somebody help lee
look at my post of 10/24/11 tell him i addressed the difference between law of God and law of lord
---francis on 11/2/11




the Bible itself when it speaks of 'the law' does not make any distinction as to type.
---lee1538 on 11/2/11
I have already answered this in another blog, but i will address it again:
Hebrews 9:10 [Which stood] only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and CARNAL ORDINANCES , imposed [on them] until the time of reformation.

Romans 7:12 Wherefore the LAW IS HOLY, and the COMMANDMENT HOLY, and just, and good.

HOLY and CARNAL are opposed to each other. By describing some as HOLY and CARNAL the bible is show two different TYPES of LAWS

THE LAW OF MOSES which contains ordinaces of washing and meat oferings and drink offerings is called CARNAL.
THE LAW OF GOD is called THE HOLY LAW, ROYAL LAW, PERFECT LAW
---francis on 11/2/11


Francis you fail to realize that the Bible speaks both the Law of God (Romans 7:22, 25) and the Lord of the Lord (Lk. 2:23,24,39).

What you replied to is the difference between the Law of Moses and the Law of God.

In any case, we really need to stick with the Bible dictionary definition written by scholars who are far more knowledgeable than we are unless we have very good reason not to.

However, any good Bible dictionary will state that the Bible itself when it speaks of 'the law' does not make any distinction as to type.
---lee1538 on 11/2/11


What I am asking is whether there is any difference between the law of God and the law of the Lord?
---lee1538 on 11/1/11

Read the post on 10/24/11 again carefully. You will see that I did answer it
---francis on 11/2/11


Are you going crazy because you now realize there is only one law described as the Law of God=the Law of the Lord= the Law of Moses?
---lee1538 on 11/1/11

To whom is God speaking to?
---lee1538 on 11/1/11


In other words, when Moses said he recorded YHVH's in Leviticus 19 ... he was really lying, right?
---Cluny on 11/1/11

francis has already answered all these question with detialed scripture on 10/24/11, 10/25/11, 10/27/11 and 10/28/11

lee1538's RESPONSE: "ok, I can see your logic in making a difference in the law of God versu the law of Moses,"---lee1538 on 10/28/11

Go back and read those posts
Do you have anything new?
---francis on 11/1/11


No you have NOT answer the question as I stated.
What you addressed is the 'clear difference in the Law of God and the Law of Moses on 10/24/11.

What I am asking is whether there is any difference between the law of God and the law of the Lord?

If you say there are no differences then you need to recognize that the Law of the Lord speaks of burnt offerings, sacrifices, new moon, Sabbaths and other feasts. 2 Chr. 31:3

See also Luke 2,22f
---lee1538 on 11/1/11




//WHICH ADVENTIST MADE THE DISTINCTION BY WRITING THESE:

Malachi 4:4 Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which GOD commanded unto MOSES in Horeb for all Israel,
----
Are you saying the Jewish Sabbath is one of the laws of Moses?

Clearly the Jewish Sabbath is a law ONLY in the Old Covenant. But Hebrews 8:13 tells us the Old Covenant became obsolete. If obsolete then replaced by the New Covenant but there is nothing in the New Covenant that commands the observance of any day. Romans 14:5-6 tells us we need not esteem any day or even consider all days as alike.

Are you going crazy because you now realize there is only one law described as the Law of God=the Law of the Lord= the Law of Moses?
---lee1538 on 11/1/11


Deuteronomy 4:13 And GOD declared unto you his covenant, which GOD commanded you to perform, even TEN COMMANDMENTS, and GOD wrote them upon two tables of stone.

To whom is God speaking to?

WHAT ADVENTISTS WROTE THE FOLLOWING?

2 COR. 3:7-8 Now if the ministry of death, carved in letters on stone, came with such glory that the Israelites could not gaze at Moses face because of its glory, which was being brought to an end, will not the ministry of the Spirit have even more glory?

Why do you refuse to trust Jesus for your salvation? Can you save yourself by obeying commmandments? Salvation is simply a gift and if you receive that gift, His Spirit will work within you to make you what He wants of you. Eph. 2:8-10
---lee1538 on 11/1/11


\\what part of ADDED NO MORE has confused you? tell me and i will help clear it up\\

In other words, when Moses said he recorded YHVH's words in Leviticus 19 with a bunch of moral, ceremonial, agricultural, and other laws, in the midst of which he quoted YHVH as saying, "Keep My decrees" he was really lying, right?

And if Moses was lying when he wrote this, what else of the Penteteuch, to which you are always appealing, is untrustworthy?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/1/11


law of the Lord same as law of God?
---
You really cannot answer the question!
---lee1538 on 10/31/11

I answered it on 10/24/11
---francis on 11/1/11


Is there any difference between what the Bible refers to as the law of God (Romans 7:22,25) and the law of Moses (Acts 15:5)?

If you answered NO, then you got the right answer since the source is the same, namely God.

One is as binding as the other for those under the law.

While the stone tablets containing the 10 commandments were inside the Ark, the 10 commandments were also written into the law of Moses.

Ro 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

Thank you Jesus!
---lee1538 on 11/1/11


lee1538 10/31/11
WHICH ADVENTIST MADE THE DISTINCTION BY WRITING THESE:

Malachi 4:4 Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which GOD commanded unto MOSES in Horeb for all Israel,

Deuteronomy 5:22 These words the LORD spake unto all your assembly.. and GOD ADDED NO MORE. And GOD wrote them in two tables of stone.

Jeremiah 7:22 GOD spake not unto your fathers, nor commanded them..concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices:But this thing commanded GOD them, saying, Obey my voice

Deuteronomy 4:13 And GOD declared unto you his covenant, which GOD commanded you to perform, even TEN COMMANDMENTS, and GOD wrote them upon two tables of stone.
Deuteronomy 4:14 And the LORD commanded MOSES at that time to teach you..
---francis on 10/31/11


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//law of the Lord same as law of God?
---
You really cannot answer the question!

2 Chr. 31:3 The contribution of the king from his own possessions was for the burnt offerings: the burnt offerings of morning and evening, and the burnt offerings for the Sabbaths, the new moons, and the appointed feasts, as it is written in the Law of the LORD.

So according to this verse, the law of the Lord (God)can describe ceremonial law.

There is the same problem in Luke 2:22 where Jesus was presented to the temple in accordance to the law of the Lord.

Adventists have to make a distinction between types of law in order to promote the keeping of the olde Jewish Sabbath.
---lee1538 on 10/31/11


You posted a question about the difference between the law of God and the law of Moses. I gave a complete answer using the scriptures which showed the difference. I even explained under what circunstances we use the difference. Your response:

"ok, I can see your logic in making a difference in the law of God versu the law of Moses,"---lee1538 on 10/28/11

Deuteronomy 5:22 These words the LORD SPAKE unto all your assembly in the mount out of the midst of the fire, of the cloud, and of the thick darkness, with a great voice: and HE ADDED NO MORE. And HE WROTE THEM ON TWO TABLES OF STONE, and delivered them unto me.

what part of ADDED NO MORE has confused you? tell me and i will help clear it up
---Francis on 10/31/11


francis, as long as you keep on making the same old mistakes, you'll be given the same old truths.

As soon as you come up with a NEW mistake, you'll be given NEW truth.

Fair enough?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/31/11


---lee1538 on 10/31/
Do you have anything NEW?
You are asking the same old question which have been answered with SCRIPTURE already.
---Francis on 10/31/11


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Jerry, Francis - would you say that the "law of God" is identical to the "law of the Lord'? Or is there a distinction?

Hope you do not chew on your shoe leather on answering this question.
---lee1538 on 10/31/11


jerry6593. Regarding your quote of 1John3:7-9, what righteousness do you think Christians can possibly attain by themselves? Our own righteousness is as filthy rags.
To do righteousness as 1John3:7-9 reveals, is to have His seed (Christ) in us. That is the only righteousness there is.

And the SDA doctrine that "foot-washing" deals with transgressions of the law is a misunderstanding of John 13.
---Haz27 on 10/31/11


Francis - does the law of God contain ceremonial laws?

The following verse seems to indicate that the law of the Lord (or law of God) cannot be limited to the 10 commandments.

2 Chr. 31:3 He appointed also the kings portion of his substance for the burnt offerings, to wit, for the morning and evening burnt offerings, and the burnt offerings for the sabbaths, and for the new moons, and for the set feasts, as it is written in the law of the LORD.
---lee1538 on 10/31/11


Haz: "...you follow Francis is the false doctrine that if we continually break the commandments we are not Christian's."

1Jn 3:7-9 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He that committeth sin is of the devil, for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin, for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

"Then there's the false SDA "foot-washing" doctrine"

Joh 13:14 If I then, your Lord and Master, have washed your feet, ye also ought to wash one another's feet.
---jerry6593 on 10/31/11


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In any case regardless of the convoluted rationale that has been given for observance of the OT sabbath, it is plain that there is virtually no command or even a hint of a command in the New Covenant to observe any day as holy from any other.

And we can easily see that since the early church did not teach laws that were strictly Jewish in nature (the Sabbath, dietary laws, etc.) it is evident that the Apostles as well as their immediate successors did NOT teach Sabbath observance.

Romans 14:5 is very clear that "Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind" in regard to the observance or non-obsevance of any day.
---lee1538 on 10/30/11


Yet, Jesus took what was on the side of the ark and proclaimed what was inside the ark hung on two of Moses' commands...
---micha9344 on 10/30/11


" Law of God" verse " law of Moses."
These phrases appear a lot in the bible, it is worthwhile to ask what do they mean and study it.

I want to draw you attention to this passage:
Deuteronomy 5:4-22 which gives us all ten commandments and ends like this: and HE ADDED NO MORE. And HE WROTE THEM ON TWO TABLES OF STONE.

this clearly defines and designates the 10 commandmentsas the only Law given DIRECTLY BY GOD and God added NO MORE. This is how the Bible shows the difference between LAW OF GOD and LAW OF MOSES

I would ask all whether you agree with me or not to go through this blog, write down EVERY SCRIPTURE given by Me and Jerry, and take a close look at them in private.
---francis on 10/29/11


Francis said: "Your problem is that you do not want to OBEY GOD COMMANDMENTS, and you are angry at prople who teach THE LAW"

But what you follow Francis is the false doctrine that if we continually break the commandments we are not Christian's.

Then there's the false SDA "foot-washing" doctrine to deal with the commandments SDA's do break.

And I know SDA's who light fires to cook, travel and work, all on the Sabbath.
Can you tell us HOW YOU have been keeping the Sabbath holy every Saturday so far.
---Haz27 on 10/29/11


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When the Scripture states we are free from the law, it does NOT specify any type of law.--lee1538 on 10/28/11

Romans 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from THE LAW OF SIN AND DEATH.

Romans 8:3 God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

It is the law which said that when we sin, there MUST BE DEATH. CHrist took that death.

IN the LAW OF MOSES, whenever one sins there MUST BE DEATH. An animal was killed instead fo the offender. that animal symbolized the death of an inocent being for that of a guilty being. This is found in THE LAW OF MOSES and not the ten commandments
---francis on 10/29/11


THEY ARE ONE IN THE SAME! The Laws of G-d(Decalogue and The 633laws) were ALL given to Moses to pass on to the Israelites. Who feared hearing G-ds voice directly any longer. So G-d appointed Moses as the Interccessor.

Moses NEVER decreed ANY laws of his own. To do so would have meant instant death to a false prophet Blaspheming.

IGNORANCE OF SCRIPTURE IS NOT BLISS. PLEASE STUDY AND PRAY FOR UNDERSTANDING.

It will be given to you.
---John on 10/29/11


John 1:17 For the law was given through Moses, grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

Note that there is no qualifier on law in this verse.

There are many descriptors of the law, that being the law of God, the law of Jehovah, the law of Moses. But there is only one law.

While we can by our own criteria make a judgment as to what constitutes moral law, civic law, and ceremonial law, all law in the Bible came from God. The whole law in James 2:10 is ALL the law as the previous verse gives an illusion of sin being showing partiality. Agree that he furthers views sin as a violation of the moral laws.
.
---lee1538 on 10/29/11


whatever Moses wrote was also from God and thus is of no lesser importance.
lee1538 on 10/28/11
MOSES wrote of sacrifice and burnt offerings.

Jeremiah 7:22 For I spake not unto your fathers, nor commanded them in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices: But this thing commanded I them, saying, Obey my voice,

Hebrews 10:6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.

1 Samuel 15:22 Hath the LORD as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obeying the voice of the LORD? Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams.
---Francis on 10/30/11


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micha9344 on 10/28/11
Show how I took what lee said out of context

Your problem is that you do not want to OBEY GOD COMMANDMENTS, and you are angry at prople who teach THE LAW.

I did not take what he said out of context

LEE actually realized that the bible does make a distinction between law of God and Law of Moses

Until my posts he did not know that there were so many scriptures showing the difference
---Francis on 10/28/11


Francis //A DOCTOR IN THE HOUSE??? lee1538 can " SEE MY LOGIC" he ALMOST agrees with me there is a difference between the law of god and the law of Moses.
---
While I see your reasoning it is based upon false premises.

One that the law is divided and whenever the word 'law' occurs one needs to decide if it refers to the Decalogue, or the ceremonial laws of Moses.

There is only ONE law we need to be concerned about and that is the Law of Christ.

1Co 9:21 To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (not being outside the law of God but under the law of Christ) that I might win those outside the law.

Doubtful if a doctor would do you much good as there are few medicines for legalism.
---lee1538 on 10/28/11


micha: I disagree. Francis presents the ONLY cogent answer to the blog question using scripture, whereas Lee uses scriptures which seem to contradict his thesis. The "law of God" was written in stone by God Himself and placed inside the ark. The "law of Moses" was the "handwriting of ordinances" written by Moses and placed in the side of the ark. This "law of Moses" (in particular, the levitical ceremonial law), was that which was "nailed to the cross" (Col 2:14). The stone tablets of the Ten Commandments could never be nailed. It's really that simple. I don't understand why some find it so difficult.
---jerry6593 on 10/29/11


If a person would read the whole post by lee1538 on 10/28/11, one would notice how lee's quote by francis is used out of context from the rest of lee's post. This has been an issue with you, francis, and I urge you to study on contextual referencing in regard to slander or libel.
You are producing a false report and lee's post is in no way represented by your pieced quote.
---micha9344 on 10/28/11


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ok, I can see your logic in making a difference in the law of God versu the law of Moses,---lee1538 on 10/28/11

IS THERE A DOCTOR IN THE HOUSE???
lee1538 can " SEE MY LOGIC"
he ALMOST agrees with me that there is a difference between the law of god and the law of Moses.
---Francis on 10/28/11


ok, I can see your logic in making a difference in the law of God versu the law of Moses, however, where we may disagree lies in the fact that whatever Moses wrote was also from God and thus is of no lesser importance.

When the Scripture states we are free from the law, it does NOT specify any type of law.

Your view that God wrote only the 10 commandments onto beleivers hearts is an assumption. And we do not see all of the 10 commandments commanded in the Epistles or in the teachings of the early church.

For instance, I could beat you to an inch of your life and not violate the commandment to murder. Again we fulfill the law by love of neighbor.
---lee1538 on 10/28/11


Let me add one other post to show the difference between the LAW OF GOD and THE LAW OF MOSES

Deuteronomy 10:2 And I will write on the tables the words that were in the first tables which thou brakest, and thou shalt put them in the ark.

LAW OF GOD WAS INSIDE THE ARK


Deuteronomy 31:24 And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished,
That Moses commanded the Levites, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying,

Deuteronomy 31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

LAW OF MOSES WAS OUTSIDE THE ARK
---francis on 10/28/11


Even Jesus did not command the Sabbath either in the Gospels or by His Spirit in the Epistles.
---lee1538
Matthew 12:12 Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the sabbath days.

Matthew 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

Acts 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

Acts 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.

Revelation 14:7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him, for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.
---Francis on 10/27/11


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This verse comes after the ten commandments:
Deuteronomy 5:22 These words the LORD spake unto all your assembly in the mount out of the midst of the fire, of the cloud, and of the thick darkness, with a great voice: AND HE ADDED NO MORE. And HE WROTE THEM ON TWO TABLES OF STONE, and delivered them unto me.

So here again we can further define the Law of God as the ten commandments ( in our context) As we see that God only spoke the ten commandments and ADDED NO MOPE.
So where did the other laws come from: THE LAW OF MOSES

so Is there any difference between what the Bible refers to as the law of God and the law of Moses?

YES, I encourage everyone to read all my post on this subject whether you agree with me or not.
---Francis on 10/28/11


lee1538 The Ministry of death is not the ten commandments. If the ten commandments are the ministry of death, then we should receive death when we worship God, or death when we keep the sabbath, ot death when we steal, or death wen we honour or father and mother

Proverbs 7:2 Keep my commandments, and LIVE, and my law as the apple of thine eye.


Leviticus 26:3 If ye walk in my statutes, and keep my commandments, and do them, Then I will give you rain in due season, and the land shall yield her increase, and the trees of the field shall yield their fruit

your interpretation as always is dead wrong

If you want to understand that passage k,I will teach you
---Francis on 10/27/11


//the LAW OF GOD referrs ONLY to the TEN COMMANDMENTS

The do you conclude that the Law of God is that ministry of death and condemnation written on letters of stone as expressed in 2 Cor. 3:7,9?

Do you say we must adhere to that ministry of death or should be abide in the ministry of His Spirit as noted in 2 Cor. 3?

Where in the New Testament does it command anyone to observe the 10 commandments?

Even Jesus did not command the Sabbath either in the Gospels or by His Spirit in the Epistles.

Did the Holy Spirit forget to command it of Gentile converts at the Jerusalem council Acts 15?

Or did the church have to wait for Ellen White to enlighten us for which the saints did not see for over 18 centuries.
---lee1538 on 10/27/11


If we simple say the phrase " LAW OF MOSES" it may referr to the five books writen by Moses, or to the law given to Moses on Horeb.
But when we compare and contrast the LAW OF MOSES with THE LAW OF GOD, Then the LAW OF MOSES refers ONLY to the law given to Moses at Horeb, and the LAW OF GOD referrs ONLY to the TEN COMMANDMENTS

BIBLE REFERENCES: LAW OF MOSES
Malachi 4:4, Deuteronomy 4:14
Jeremiah 7:22

BIBLE REFERENCES: LAW OF GOD: Deuteronomy 4:12-13, Jeremiah 7:23
---francis on 10/27/11


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I would to include what is said in 2 Corinthians 3 about the difference within the two covenants.

2 Cor 3:5-6 "Not that we are adequate in ourselves to consider anything as coming from ourselves, but our adequacy is from God, who also made us adequate as servants of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit, for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life"

I want to be a part of the covenant of the Spirit which is life, not death.
---Mark_Eaton on 10/26/11


isaiah 66 speaks of NEW HEAVEN and NEW EARTH, there is no reestablishing of leviticus priesthood. That priesthood pointed to JESUS,
who will the reestablished priesthood point to?

isaiah 66 speaks of the new heaven and new earth and points to two time periods
1: The weekly sabbath
2: The new month

On both these occasions the people of God will go to Jerusalem: The sabbath to worship as one people, the new moon / month to take part of thee of life
---Francis on 10/26/11


Francis // If the sabbath day pointed to Jesus, would not Jesus ALONE be enough in the new earth?

And then you quote Isaiah 66.

---
Isaiah 66 also speaks of the re-establishment of the Levitical priesthood. So Isaiah 66 is NOT a good argument that the Sabbath will be observed in the eternal state.

Isaiah 66:20 And they shall bring all your brothers from all the nations as an offering to the LORD, ...says the LORD, ...And some of them also I will take for priests and for Levites, says the LORD.

Your problem stems from the fact that you have made the Sabbath into an idol much the same as the Pharisees, the chief enemies of Jesus while He was on earth.
---lee1538 on 10/26/11


Hebrews 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, AS GOD DID FROM HIS.

HOW EXACTLY DID GOD REST FROM HIS WORK?

Hebrews 4:4 God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

Again God rested on the 7th day. We who enter rest rest the same way God did on the 7th day

and If Christ is our sabbath then why sabbath and christ in the new earth?

Isaiah 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make,..it shall come to pass, that from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me..
If the sabbath day pointed to Jesus, would not Jesus ALONE be enough in the new earth?
---Francis on 10/26/11


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Francis - You will NOT enter into God's rest by keeping the OT Sabbath, because the rest of the Christian is in Christ.

Hebrews 4:3f For we who have believed enter that rest (sabbath), as he has said,As I swore in my wrath,They (Israelites who observed the 7th day sabbath) shall not enter my rest, although his works were finished from the foundation of the world (at creation). For he has somewhere spoken of the seventh day in this way: And God rested on the seventh day from all his works. And again in this passage he said,They shall not enter my rest. For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not have spoken of another day (the day of our salvation in Christ) later on.
---lee1538 on 10/26/11


Francis //thus far I have defined the LAW OF MOSES and THE LAW OF GOD.

Your artificial definition is designed so fit your pre-conceived theology. Any good Bible dictionary would tell you that the law of Moses and the Law of God are merely two descriptors of the same thing, namely 'the LAW'.

Adventists are desperate to promote the 4th commandment as a moral law because if it can be proven the Sabbath is a ceremonial law and only a shadow of things to come in Christ, then they would have to acknowledge Colossians 2:16 does speak of the weekly sabbath that was nailed to the Cross.

Then they would have to do the same thing as the Worldwide Church of God (Herbert W. Armstrong's old cult) has done, namely to uncult themselves.
---lee1538 on 10/26/11


thus far I have defined the LAW OF MOSES and THE LAW OF GOD.
Now I will show preference:

Jeremiah 7:22 For I spake not unto your fathers, nor commanded them concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices: But this thing commanded I them, saying, Obey my voice,

God only spoke to them THE TEN COMMANDMENTS so that is Gods Laws, sacrifices was commanded by Moses that is Moses Law

Hebrews 10:6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.

Psalms 51:16 For thou desirest not sacrifice, else would I give it: thou delightest not in burnt offering.

1 Samuel 15:22 to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams.

What do you think God's preference is: OBEY or SACRIFICES?
---Francis on 10/26/11


Francis //... EVERYONE here has accepted except you, is how GOD / THE BIBLE makes a difference between THE LAW OF MOSES and THE LAW OF GOD.

As a analyst by profession, I deal with is established definitions.

If you were to read any Biblical dictionary you would quickly see that by defintion the Law of Moses "signifies the whole body of Mosiac legislation (1 kings 2:3, 2 Kings 23:25, Ezra 3:2), called with reference to its divine origin the law of Jehovah (Psa 19:8, 37:31, Isa 5:24, 30:9). In the latter sense it is called by way of eminence, The Law (Dt.1:5, 4:8,44, 17,18,19, 27:3, 8)." Ungers Bible Dictionary.

Only Warwick agrees with you but if he didn't like his wine so much he'd be an Adventist.
---lee1538 on 10/25/11


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Francis, none of those scriptures you posted make a distinction between God's laws and Moses' laws. To say it does is a far, far, far stretch. In the scripture you posted from Jeremiah, God does not even speak about the ten commandments when recalling what he commanded of the Israelites. But you hold the ten commandments to be God's laws more than others. Why then did God not say "this is what I commanded of you" and then list the ten commandments?
---Jed on 10/25/11


Your problem seems to be that what God told to Moses is of lesser importance than the ten commandments that God wrote ---lee1538 on 10/25/11

No. What I am pointing out to you, which EVERYONE here has accepted except you, is how GOD / THE BIBLE makes a difference between THE LAW OF MOSES and THE LAW OF GOD.

What God told to Moses to teach israel is called THE LAW OF MOSES. What God taught israel Himself Is called the LAW OF GOD

I have said nothing about which is more important, I have simply used THE WORD OF GOD which you seem to avoid, to show the difference in LAW OF MOSES and LAW OF GOD

P.S. IS your question about more importance, or difference?
Are you now running away from your own blog question?
---Francis on 10/25/11


Francis //If God did not command concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices who did?

What Moses commanded of Israel was from God. Your problem seems to be that what God told to Moses is of lesser importance than the ten commandments that God wrote on letters of stone, latter referred to as the ministry of death & condemnation. 2 Cor. 3:7,9

You could try to think about these things, however, we can hardly expect any kind of reasonable answer from any Adventists, most of whom have little knowledge of the Bible or early church history.
---lee1538 on 10/25/11


Francis //Malachi 4:4 Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which I COMMANDED UNTO HIM in Horeb for all Israel, with the statutes and judgments.

What idiot would require Christians to convert to Judaism, obey laws strictly Jewish in nature, to be legimate? Ever read Acts 15?

Your problem is your belief that we become Jewish upon accepting Christ, but Christ is the END of the law for believers. Romans 10:4
---lee1538 on 10/25/11


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One clear difference in the LAW OF GOD and the LAW OF MOSES is found here:

Jeremiah 7:22 For I SPAKE NOT unto your fathers, NOR COMMANDED THEM in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices: Jeremiah 7:23 But this thing commanded I them, saying, Obey my voice, and I will be your God, and ye shall be my people: and walk ye in all the ways that I have commanded you, that it may be well unto you.

If God did not command concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices who did?

Well those commands Ccme from THE LAW OF MOSES.
---Francis on 10/25/11


francis, I like that,
"DE NILE WILL ONLY GET YOU WET".
---Eloy on 10/25/11


---lee1538 on 10/25/11
Malachi 4:4 Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which I COMMANDED UNTO HIM in Horeb for all Israel, with the statutes and judgments.

God spoke to moses ALONE n the mountain, those laws which god gave Moses when they were ALONE are the laws of Moses
Exodus 24:2 And Moses alone shall come near the LORD:

Unlike the ten commandments
Deuteronomy 4:12 And THE LORD SPOKE UNTO YOU out of the midst of the fire: YE HEARD THE VOICE of the words, but saw no similitude, only YE HEARD A VOICE a voice. And HE DECLARED UNTO YOU his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments, and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.


DE NILE WILL ONLY GET YOU WET
---Francis on 10/25/11


What are you doing? This does not glorify God or your Christian testimony. Its no wonder our nation built on God is in such moral deline. Let's get it together.
---Ladydi4God on 10/25/11


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//This " in your law" refers to the word of God.

Rather poor exegetics of scripture.

Where do you get your interpretation of Scripture?

Check any good Bible dictionary as to what is the Law of Moses you will find it to be the entire legislation of Moses (1 Kings 2:3, 2 Kings 23:25, Ezra 3:2), that all the law given to Moses is the Law of Moses.

There is NOT two laws in the Bible, it is all simply LAW with several different designators for the same thing.

Adventists reason that there are 2 basic laws - moral and ceremonial in order to justify their belief that the Sabbath commandment is a moral law but they really cannot offer anything that is convincing.
---lee1538 on 10/25/11


cluny, I posted no promise, instead sinner, this is exactly what I posted on 10/14/11: "I am leaving to minister elsewhere.
---Eloy on 10/14/11"

---Eloy on 10/25/11


Eloy, you had promised that you were leaving us.

I should have known better than to believe you.
---Cluny on 10/24/11

I didn't promise. Anyhow, whom else is going to keep you renegade fleshes in check? Accept the light, else be blinded by it!
---Eloy on 10/25/11


Eloy, you had promised that you were leaving us.

I should have known better than to believe you.
---Cluny on 10/24/11

Did you think it was a prophecy or something?
---Trav on 10/24/11


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"law of God" or " Law of the lord" can refer at times to the entire writing of the bible:
Example:John 10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
" Ye are gods" IS not a law with commandments. This " in your law" referrs to the word of God

Or a specific set of commandments: example ten commandments:

The law of God and the law of the lard are the same if the context is the same
The law of God is NEVER called the law of Moses, while the law of Moses is at times called the law of the lord/ God
Example: Luke 2:24 And to offer a sacrifice according to that which is said in the law of the Lord, A pair of turtledoves, or two young pigeons.
---Francis on 10/24/11


Sinuous people ask questions like this, looking for loopholes. :)
---God.is.everywhere on 10/24/11


lee1538, many here are not taught the difference between law and grace, that's why they keep wedging one must obey the law even after being saved or they'll loose their salvation, which contradicts Paul's teaching in Romans 8:31-38.

The exact scenario in Galatians 3 is being repeated today. As a Christian, what's important is we acknowledge that the law given was to make sin known and "the wages of sin is death...", Christ then fulfilled the law when "He died for the sins of His people" in their place making grace abound, for "the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." Romans 6:23

Salvation indeed is a gift of God by grace through faith in Christ.
---christan on 10/24/11


Eloy, you had promised that you were leaving us.

I should have known better than to believe you.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/24/11


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Romans 7:22 > "For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man." Well, this law could be what is "inward", in us . . . bringing what God Himself is actually doing in us > "for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure." (Philippians 2:13) God works in us according to His own laws of His own nature, doing all that is better than we can understand the law of Moses to mean >

"Trust in the LORD with all your heart,
And lean not on your own understanding,"
(Proverbs 3:5)

Do not limit yourself to how you can understand the law of Moses.
---Bill_willa6989 on 10/24/11


Francis - very good. Now tell me if the Law of the Lord is the same or identical to the Law of God.

Lu 2:23 (As it is written in the law of the Lord, Every male that openeth the womb shall be called holy to the Lord,)
---lee1538 on 10/24/11


LAW OF MOSES: Spoken to moses on the mountain by God, and then taught to israel by Moses:
Malachi 4:4 Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which I commanded unto him in Horeb for all Israel, with the statutes and judgments.
Deuteronomy 4:14 And the LORD commanded me at that time to teach you statutes and judgments,

LAW OF GOD: Spoken DIRECTLY to ISRAEL by God
Deuteronomy 4:12 And the LORD spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard the voice of the words, but saw no similitude, only ye heard a voice. And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments,
Jeremiah 7:22 For I spake not unto your fathers.. concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices:
---francis on 10/24/11


Christian //Moses never wrote the law but he received the law from God.

Like what you state.

But left me wondering if one can categorize what God wrote on tablets of stone and what God said through Moses as being of lesser importance. When they asked Jesus what was the most important of all the commandments, He did not even mention any of the Decalogue.

Which laws did Jesus fulfill and what was left that was written on the hearts of believers? I rather doubt our Adventists friends can come up with any answer that is supportable.
---lee1538 on 10/24/11


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God has two laws: the old levitcal-Mosaic law of B.C.(before Christ), and the New judaic-Messianic law of A.D.(annual of the Lord). The Brit Attiq or Old Testament is abolished, and the Brit Chadashah or New Testament is currently inforce.
---Eloy on 10/24/11


The law is the very being of God. It tells us how Holy God is and how sinful we are before Him. Moses never wrote the law but he received the law from God.

When Paul wrote, "For I delight in the law of God after the inward man", the "inward" refers to his "born again spirit" which he received from God through regeneration. That spirit, born of the Holy Spirit indeed delights in the law of God. In context of Romans 7, Paul talks about the struggles of a Christian within his flesh (which sins) and the spirit (born of God).

The real difference between Romans 7:22,25 and Acts 15:5 is Paul acknowledges he is sinful while the Pharisees were telling the people to perform the law for righteousness.
---christan on 10/24/11


Piere - what you state does not make sense in light of some scripture.

Luke 2:22 And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord, (As it is written in the law of the Lord, Every male that openeth the womb shall be called holy to the Lord,) And to offer a sacrifice according to that which is said in the law of the Lord, A pair of turtledoves, or two young pigeons.

If the law of the Lord also the law of Moses, is it not the same as the law of God which in this case has some aspects of the sacrificial system employed when Jesus was dedicated?

How can you limit the law of God or law of the Lord to the Decalogue?
---lee1538 on 10/24/11


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