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God Made The Stars

Genesis 1:16 states that God also "made the stars". Are we justified in believing that the stars did not exist until the 4th period of creation?

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 ---lee1538 on 12/9/11
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According to Genesis 1 Day is defined as morning and evening. so DAY in Genesis is first established as the division of morning and evening.

Anytime YOM, Day is used to clarify a literal 24 hour period, a number is placed before it.

40 days and 40 nights, 3 days in the belly of the whale. Rose the 3rd day .

He created at that time a 24 hour period, whether the sun was put in it's place or not. If the sun was the determining factor of DAY then we would not see the word DAY until then and THAT would have been considered thw first DAY.


If Day meaning a 24 hour period meant 24 hours for nearly 6000 years why is it so important to CHANGE it now?

Circle still means circle!
---kathr4453 on 12/27/11


Mark, 'yom' does indeed have a number of meanings just a 'day' has. Nonetheless when someone (whether in the OT, NT or today) says 6 days for example it means 6 24 hr days. See Numbers 7:11,12 "They shall offer their offerings, one chief each day,..." He who offered his offering the first day was Nahshon...." This is obviously an ordinary 24 hr day, just as is Genesis 1:5 "God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, the first day."

Whether the light comes from God as it will in heaven (revelation 21:23)or the sun He created, is inconsequential.

There is no time-gap between Genesis 1:1 and 2.
---Warwick on 12/26/11


MarkV, again, all you did was talk, much of what I heard already from you. When you are ready to address the Truth, we will listen to you, otherwise all your talk and lies means nothing to us. It comes from an angry man who lives out there some place, and wakes up every morning with idea's on what to say each day to those who present Scripture . It's a very sorry use of God's time.

Stop compromising the WORD of God with what if's and maybe's, siding with false teachers here on line.
---kathr4453 on 12/26/11


jerry //But, I'll admit that he does go well with your man-made, spurious religion.
---
Adventism is a man-made (or should I say woman-made) religion. In fact, it all started in the mid 1800's and that on several false premises - one that Christ would come again in October 1844, the second being that whomever did not accept that belief, the door to salvation would be closed to them, a third that Christ left the Father's side where He intercedes for us, and went into the inner sanctum to begin judgment - 167 years ago! Others could add much to the list.

You must really like to eat bull to believe in all that malarkey.
---lee1538 on 12/26/11


Kathr, you speak of understanding the Word but you just don't. You have insisted on free will of man. Having the power over God to chose Him if you want. Now you put down:
"Isaiah 40:22
It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers, that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:"

You are but a grasshopper. And grasshoppers have no power over God. Your theology stinks. You need lessons from Luther, Calvin, John Wycliffe, William Tyndale, John Knox, Johannes Hus, Martin Bucer many more. You have no clue who the Eternal Son of God is. You should stick that passage in your brain so that you don't forget who you are before God.
---Mark_V. on 12/27/11




Warwick, before you guys make judgment, The word "day" in the Old T. is mostly the word "Yom" The word Yom has many meanings depending where it is found.
The New T. word "day" is mostly the word "Hemera" which also has some different meanings.
Second, the time between Gen. 1:1 and 1:2 is not specified. We know it was the first use of time for we are told "in the beginning" but we are not told if that time was 24 hours as we know it since the Sun was not created yet, as a day to us 24 hours because of the time the earth revolving around the Sun, but there was no Sun yet until (v.1:14). In (v.1:5) day here is represented a daylight, and darkness as night.
---Mark_V. on 12/26/11


Isaiah 40:22
It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, AKA SPHERE and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers, that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:


Anyone see how accurate GOD"S WORD is. So was Columbus'faith in the ignorance of gentille men who said the earth was flat? God never said it was flat, and no educated Jew ever said it was either. But since the RCC and Martin Luther went out to murder INTELLIGENT Jews, no wonder the RCC who pretty much controlled the world and scripture left men ignorant. And NOW they want to pat themselves on the back thinking God's WORD is only for the ignorant.

We know who had the last lauugh on that one!!!
---kathr4453 on 12/24/11


What knowledge and who's knowledge. Worldly knowledge or the Knowledge that is in Jesus Christ.

Jesus is made UNTO US wisdom and knowledge, and it is NOT the wisdom or knowledge of this world.

And those who have the Knowledge of CHRIST are being attacked here and assaulted with sarcastic remarks.

They brag about what faith they have, yet have no faith at all.

The knowledge of Jesus Christ cannot be found in books, anymore than the knowledge of a wedding night can. That's only head knowledge.

Real knowledge comes from experiencing Jesus Christand submitting to HIM, not Barnes or Calvin or any man.
---kathr4453 on 12/23/11


Lee: "It is far more accurate to say that 'for in six periods of unknown time"

In what universe is is it "far more accurate" to substitute a spurious meaning in place of the actual words written? If your interpretation were true, then your god has one of three problems. He was either too stupid to know the difference between an ordinary day and eons of time, he was just kidding, or he knew the difference but lied to intentionally deceive us. I don't like any of those options for your man-made god. But, I'll admit that he does go well with your man-made, spurious religion.


---jerry6593 on 12/23/11


//Knowledge is seldom advanced if people simply accept the status quo.// ---lee1538 on 12/22/11

you are talking about the status quo of men and their beliefs. what if man accepts God's "status quo"?

Abraham and Sarah laughed at God's.

Zechariah...

knowledge of God would greatly advance if we would accept God's staus quo.
---aka on 12/22/11




How typical of you Lee that Kath writes about doubting God's word and you missrepresent what she has written waffling on about questioning human opinion.

Do you know the difference between God's word and human opinion?
---Warwick on 12/22/11


//What I do find with LeeJ is that he has questions many things including the flood using human reasoning and not faith.

What would have happened if Columbus had just simply had faith that the world was flat?

What would have happened if Martin Luther had simply accepted the belief that the established church was what God had ordained? Christianity would have been destroyed.

What would have happened if Galileo had simply relented his belief that the earth was not the center of the universe?

We can thank God that there has been those who have questioned established beliefs.

Knowledge is seldom advanced if people simply accept the status quo.
---lee1538 on 12/22/11


If a day was really a million or a thousand years, wouldn't that mean that for 500 years or 500,000 years there would have been darkness where vegetation would have died? Oh Right,now faith comes into play where it is possible for vegetation to live in darkness for that long AND survive.

I saw a special the other night on where this idea that a day was not 24 hours came in, and it was the Modernists who also doubted many things in scripture along with the virgin birth because of DARWIN.

What I do find with LeeJ is that he has questions many things including the flood using human reasoning and not faith.

Lee, you really may want to check on what other things your books also teach.
---kathr4453 on 12/22/11


Perhaps Kathryn is having a relapse into her old nature that dominated her prior to her acceptance of Jesus as her savior.

Jude 1:23 save others by snatching them out of the fire, to others show mercy with fear, hating even the garment stained by the flesh.

No kathryn I did not get that out of Barnes!
---lee1538 on 12/22/11


Oh but LeeJ, are you saying unless I become a Calvinist, ...and that you are snatching me out of the fires of Hell if I convert to Calvinism? Wouldn't YOU be saving me then, and totally contradicting your own theology?

You see, I could say that to you according to my beliefs.
---kathr4453 on 12/22/11


LeeJ, you really need to get a good Christian book that teaches you the truths of scripture, and stop relying on teh false teachers you rely on.
---kathr4453 on 12/22/11


Lee, you wrote "the heavens were already created in egos past." I don't think your ego is past it, just on the way!

You wrote "Since Exodus 20:11 was written when the concept that a day was a 24 hour duration period, you may take it as written. You are therefore admitting God created in 6-24hr days, because He here equates His creation week to the week He has commanded the Israelites to live. Therefore to also say the 6-days of creation are on unknown length is nonsense, by your own admission.

If God had wanted to be vague about creation daylength why did He carefully define day 1 (Genesis 1:3-5)? No time periods there?

Trust Scripture not man Lee.
---Warwick on 12/22/11


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kathr//Leej, why do you insist on changing God's word and placing doubt in God's Word? It's doesn't say, in 6 periods of unknown time now does it. But I bet "BARNES NOTES" is where you got that too.
---
It is all too easy to quote from other commentaries written by those the Lord has called into the teaching ministry, howbeit, Barnes in is better than most at expressing what I want to state.

As to the Exodus 20:11, it is just too easy to see that the commandment was based on the definition of a day established after the 3rd period of creation, that the 'day' in the first 3 periods was different than those of the last 3 'days'.

In that case, one is totally jusitified in saying that God created in 6 periods.
---lee1538 on 12/22/11


Exodus 20:11
King James Version (KJV)


11For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.



Leej, why do you insist on changing God's word and placing doubt in God's Word? It's doesn't say, in 6 periods of unknown time now does it. But I bet "BARNES NOTES" is where you got that too.
---kathr4453 on 12/22/11


//Once again, you call God a liar. He wrote in Exo 20:11

God is never a liar but what really are you?

Romans 3:4a God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar,

//"For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth"
---
It is far more accurate to say that 'for in six periods of unknown time, the Lord made our universe' and that after He created other universes.

Your god is far too small and it is obviously you have a hung up on observing the Jewish Sabbath. But keep the Lord in focus, continue to study His word and you just might begin to understand what it is all about.
---lee1538 on 12/22/11


Lee: "Yes, the beginning of earth's creation, however, the heavens were already created in egos past."

Too bad you won't let your ego be past.

Once again, you call God a liar. He wrote in Exo 20:11

"For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth"

Aren't the stars in the heaven? Is that why you keep insisting that days aren't really days? It would seem that your entire belief system is based on things that the Bible does NOT say and the rejection of the simple truths that it DOES say.


---jerry6593 on 12/22/11


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Warwick //There can be no beginning before the beginning.

Yes, the beginning of earth's creation, however, the heavens were already created in egos past.

While you view the different translations, you simply read into them your own bias interpretation.

I would suggest you view Barnes notes on Genesis 1:1 "Hence, creation is not confined to a single point of time. Whenever anything absolutely new-that is, not involved in anything previously extant-is called into existence, there is creation."

Your god apparently is a god that did not create anything prior to the earth's creation. That to most of us, is simply not a realistic understanding of who God is.
---lee1538 on 12/21/11


Lee, I believe what Scripture says. You claim likewise while constantly championing either antiBiblical or NonBiblical ideas. Isn't this hypocrisy?>
I consulted 14 tranlations (incl. NIV, NLT, ESV, NASB and KJV) and all say "In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth."

Now tie this to your admission that Exodus 20:11 does indeed say God created in 6-24hr days and the meaning is obvious. There was a beginning and the first things God created (on day 1) were the heavens and the earth. God then created light..."And there was evening, and there was morning-the first day.

There can be no beginning before the beginning.

BTW our God is a Creator God. That you would demote Him to 'god' is revealing.
---Warwick on 12/21/11


Genesis 1:1 In the beginning, God created (past tense) the heavens and the earth.

yes, God created the heavens and the earth and much of that before time begin.

Sorry Warwick, but God is a creator god and has created everything at His spoken word.

Your view that all creation started with the creation of the earth is not even reasonably or plausible.

What do you think God was doing prior to the earth creation?

Those evolutionists that took you to the woodshed must have really given you a good paddling.

You really should learn how to think and stop trying to be argumentative.
---lee1538 on 12/21/11


Lee, you are the one who insists he accepts what Scripture says, and Genesis 1:16 says "He made the stars also" and this during the "fourth day." Scripture says nothing about any creation occurring before the beginning of the 6-days of creation.

I can just see the Lee version of Genesis 1:1. In the beginning (which sorta wasn't the beginning) God created the heavens and the earth.... In fact it clearly says His creative acts began on the first 24hr day.
---Warwick on 12/20/11


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Warwick //you know God is eternal, therefore has never come into existance? The very word existance infers a beginning, which God did not have.

I have virtually no problem believing God is eternal, that He existed for all times.

But when were the stars created? I do not believe God waved His magic wand and called all the stars into being on the 4th day. The text does not exactly say that.

As new stars are continually being created, I believe God as the creator created many of the stars prior to the 4th day. There is no end to God's creative activity.

What do you believe God did prior to creation of the earth? Mediate on this navel?
---lee1538 on 12/19/11


Lee, surely you know God is eternal, therefore has never come into existance? The very word existance infers a beginning, which God did not have.

Genesis ch. 1 is a description of everything God created over the 6 days of creation. They are 6 24hr days as you have agreed, as mirrored, and confirmrd by Exodus 20:11 of which you wrote "Since Exodus 20:11 was written when the concept that a day was a 24 hour duration period, you may take it as written." Therefore, even though you pose your admission, unsurprizingly,in a man centric way, you have admitted God did create in 6-24hr days. You seem to have forgotten this.

What God has or has not done, other than what He has chosen to reveal to us, is unknown.
---Warwick on 12/17/11


Lee: 'Warwick - You seem to want badly to believe God came into existence just prior to creation of our world, that He did nothing prior to the creation of earth'

We are not told if God did make anything before He made the world. But if God did, it seems He didn't show it to Moses.

God came into existence.....
UNTRUE

God has ALWAYS existed

---Peter on 12/17/11


Lee: Keep talking!

Ecc 5:3 .... a fool's voice is known by multitude of words.


---jerry6593 on 12/18/11


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Warwick - You seem to want badly to believe God came into existence just prior to creation of our world, that He did nothing prior to the creation of earth.

Truly you are the one that has a very tenuous grip on scripture as well as reality.

Your god must be a real bimbo!
---lee1538 on 12/17/11


Lee, it appears you have a very tenuous grasp upon reality or the concept of truth. You claim to believe what Scripture says but refer to the creation days as "creation periods" a term not found anywhere in Scripture!

You propose God may have made the stars before He began creating, a bizarre concept, having a beginning before "the beginning." Your non-Biblical ignores what scripture says in Genesis 1:16 regarding his creative acts on the fourth day "...he made the stars also."

Your fascination with the goings on in woodsheds is somewhat strange. I have only seen wood in woodsheds, but you see......
---Warwick on 12/17/11


//It is quite telling that Lee approches scripture with automatic disbelief, but readily embraces the conjectures of men that agree with his pet theories.

Jerry -All you have to offer is lies against those that believe what the Bible says not what it does not say.

Sorry to see that your legalism regarding the Jewish Sabbath has created an idol for you to worship.
---lee1538 on 12/16/11


Warwick assumes that the stars were created on the 4th period of creation because he simply cannot conceive of God creating anything prior to Earth's creation.

Like I stated before, he has problems with those that would believe fully what the Bible states, not what it does not state.

Perhaps he is still sore from being brought out to woodshed by an evolutionists. He should not pick fights with those what are more knowledgeable than he is.
---lee1538 on 12/16/11


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Warwick: "It is far above the changing opinions of falible sinful man. It is the revealed word of God. Brevity does not take away from Truth."

It is quite telling that Lee approches scripture with automatic disbelief, but readily embraces the conjectures of men that agree with his pet theories.

With regard to brevity, it has been my experience that truthful men will explain their beliefs, and their reasons for them, clearly and succinctly, while liars tend to many words and multiple blogs.


---jerry6593 on 12/16/11


Warwick //Lee, I notice you have evaded commenting if Dr's Wang, McCabe, Kelly and Barr are also fools for saying Genesis ch. 1 shows creation occurred in 6 24hr days.

I am not familiar with any of these authors or their views. Frankly I could case less what their position may be.

As I stated before, our main difference lies in the fact that I believe what the Bible says, not like you who would believe what is not in the Bible.

Sorry but the Bible does not tell us the duration of the first 3 periods of creation. That is a fact that is rather obvious.
---lee1538 on 12/16/11


Lee, as you have chosen not to reveal any detasils about the sceptic I have to wonder if these were your comments. In any contentious issue involving science you will commonly get for and against arguments from genuine people. That is the nature of science. Then there are the comments of people who are pushing a personal wheelbarrow. In reality the book has received considerable critical acclaim.

That Hartnett's book is for the more scientifically knowledgeable has nothing to do with opinion. Its technical nature can be discerned from reading it.

Genesis definitely isn't a scientific textbook. It is far above the changing opinions of falible sinful man. It is the revealed word of God. Brevity does not take away from Truth.
---Warwick on 12/15/11


Lee, I notice you have evaded commenting if Dr's Wang, McCabe, Kelly and Barr are also fools for saying Genesis ch. 1 shows creation occurred in 6 24hr days.

For example I googled Professor Barr ( at the time Regius Professor of Hebrew at the University of Oxford) and there was his comment:

Probably, so far as I know, there is no professor of Hebrew or Old Testament at any world-class university who does not believe that the writer(s) of Gen. 1-11 intended to convey to their readers the ideas that (a) creation took place in a series of six days which were the same as the days of 24 hours we now experience ....

Is he a fool Lee? Yes or no will do.
---Warwick on 12/16/11


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Genesis 1:16 states that God also "made the stars". Are we justified in believing that the stars did not exist until the 4th period of creation?
-Just as justified in believing the Sun and Moon were made on the fourth day.
Gen 1-11, Word of God or not?
---micha9344 on 12/15/11


That is only your opinion because it agrees with what you want to believe.

Your arguments are really bias and unconvincing. You should not view Genesis as a scientific textbook as it is far too brief for that and leaves one with far too many questions whose answers can only be speculative.
---lee1538 on 12/15/11

He is trapped by his own doctrine. He must defend it no matter if vague. It is what he has preached 600 times. If it is wrong they won't build a statue of him.
Took a lot of money and lifetime to build.
Daniel 2:43
And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay.
---Trav on 12/15/11


Warwick //Anyone can write critical comment.

Yes, but is it worth the $ to order the book in light of the crictical comments?

//Hartnett's book is for the more knowledgeable.

That is only your opinion because it agrees with what you want to believe.

Your arguments are really bias and unconvincing. You should not view Genesis as a scientific textbook as it is far too brief for that and leaves one with far too many questions whose answers can only be speculative.



---lee1538 on 12/15/11


Apparently Blogger cannot find good support for his personal view that the Bible is only tribal stories, not the word of God. Surprize, surprize?
---Warwick on 12/14/11

He has and may or may not realize all the support he has yet. GOD states and...every Prophet, every Apostle, Christ himself testify by the thousands of words and verses.
Even the demons acknowledge.

It is the blind preachers of this day,days forward and days past that attempt to create/mold and change what will not and cannot be changed. Also written.
I thank my GOD for his multiple witnesses.
Eze 48:19And they that serve the city shall serve it out of all the tribes of Israel.
---Trav on 12/15/11


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Blogger if your understanding is the product of your education I am pleased I was educated differently.

Being a self-proclaimed erudite person you surely can answer a few questions:

How do you know God created?

How old is the "earth and the universe" and can you prove this by the scientific method?

Genesis ch. 2:4 doesn't mention the creation of the earth, sun, moon, stars, seas, land, sky, sea creatures, creeping creatures etc. How, therefore, can you say it is a different creation account?
---Warwick on 12/14/11


Apparently Blogger cannot find good support for his personal view that the Bible is only tribal stories, not the word of God. Surprize, surprize?
---Warwick on 12/14/11


Lee, I wrote of theologians Wang, McCabe, Kelly (and liberal Oxford Don Barr) who say Genesis 1 means 6-24hr day creation. You avoided intelligent comment. I recommended professor Hartnett's book and immediately you publish unnamed critical comment, as though anonymous opinion somehow destroys the integrity of Hartnett's book. "Hunting with the hounds..." Anyone can write critical comment.

Who wrote it, what are his qualifications and affiliations?

Hartnett's book is for the more knowledgeable.

You misunderstand or misrepresent Hartnett. He does not claim he writes of revealed truth but of a different scientific view. After all astronomy is much about imposed views, and speculations.
---Warwick on 12/14/11


Warwick you are a drowning in the quicksand of own bullheadedness and ignorance and when someone throws you the rope of education you reject it as you would prefer to drown rather than learn. God created the Earth and the Universe both are exceptionally old and but how God actually performed this is recorded nowhere in scripture. Genius 1:1-2:4a is nothing more than a tribal story for the from the oral tradition of the southern tribes of Israel. The second 1 day creation account starts at Genius 2:4b is as an oral tradition for the northern tribes. All this blending was dome by priestly editors around 900 BCE Mosaic authorship starts in Genius Chapter 12. Enjoy them but understand source of your text segment.
---Blogger9211 on 12/14/11


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Blogger, you write with such authority but how do you know the Bible is but tribal stories? Can you prove this?
---Warwick on 12/13/11

He surely may. I can. He has or is realizing a fundamental truth you arrogantly/fearfully shun.
This history you presume authority with and of, was written by a 13 tribed people for a 13 tribal House/Body. Their blessings, heritage,heroes/villians, trials, mistakes, recovery and promised/covenanted end. While their GOD is GOD of all he chose them for a wife and service. To Love,Chastise and Honor. By attachment and their price paid we have knowledge of and reach for. Something even your Spongerobert Doctorates and scientific idols haven't seen or acknowledged at the simplest level. Wolves.
---Trav on 12/14/11


Blogger, you write with such authority but how do you know the Bible is but tribal stories? Can you prove this?
---Warwick on 12/13/11


So I know a little bit about astronomy.
---lee1538 on 12/12/11

Here's one below Professor N Dropper has never seen or considered. Some S.E.E.S. never apply or believe scripture.... only utilizing the clay they can mold into a "statues" of themselves. Jer31:37
Thus saith the LORD, If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD.

Astronomically the implication is the search. And who would be doing the searching. A timeline, a promise and a foundational confirming prophecy.

SpongeBob squarepants is about the only name left to drop....isn't it?
---Trav on 12/13/11


My apologies Cliff, I meant to address it to Lee.
---Warwick on 12/12/11


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Warwick, i guess you're so used to jumping on me that it just comes out natural>
I have no knowledge of that suject!
Before you ask... you are forgiven!
---1st_cliff on 12/12/11


Cliff I wrote of theologians Wang, McCabe, Kelly (and liberal Oxford Don Barr) who say Genesis 1 means creation in 6 24hr days. You couldn't find anything to support this truth. I recommended professor Hartnet's book and immediately you publish unnamed critical comment, as though anonymous opinion somehow destroys the integrity of Hartnett's book. Not so, anyone can write a critical comment.

Who wrote it, what are his qualifications and affiliations?

I am somewhat common and don't find such scientific books incomprehensible.

You either misunderstand or misrepresent Hartnett. He does not claim he writes of revealed truth but of a different scientific view. After all astronomy is much about imposed views, and speculations.
---Warwick on 12/12/11


One review of John Hartnett's book Starlight, Time and the New Physics is as follows:

[My problem with the book started in chapter 3 and continued through the end to chapter 7 before the technical appendices. It was never clear how the concepts presented in chapters 3-7 connected together to answering the basic question of how we see distant starlight in a young universe.]

Probably another one of those books written that is totally obfuscating to the common reader.

If something resembles an intelligent answer to a problem, then it must be correct.
---lee1538 on 12/12/11


Those interested in gaining a Christian perspective on the stars should read the book 'Starlight, Time and the New Physics' by physics professor Dr John Hartnett. It is also available on DVD and in Kindle download format.

Dr Hartnett's book gives an answer to the question some pose "If the universe is only six thousand years old and the universe is tens of billions of light-years in expanse, then how do we see light from distant galaxies?"
---Warwick on 12/12/11


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//If you want to know about the stars use the the right source tool, the Bible is not it. Study information about astronomy.

Howbeit science (truth) should not contradict the Bible. All too often it is our interpretation of the Bible that is incorrect.

I was the top student in my astronomy class when I was in college. Interesting enough when they asked me if I had any plans for the summer, I told them that I may go to summer school. They then asked me to handle the observatory for the National Science Foundation for the summer.

So I know a little bit about astronomy.
---lee1538 on 12/12/11


Blogger, you write with such authority but how do you know the the Bible is but tribal stories? Can you prove this?

Regarding science we must understand scientific belief changes. New discoveries disprove old as any scientist knows.

God's word never changes, He got it right the first time.

Others like you, who consider scientific beliefs revealed truth insist the human body had evolved leaving c110 'vestigal organs' which now have no purpose, as proof of this. It has now been shown these are vestigal, but have good purpose. The 110th is the muscle which allows us to wiggle our ears for which no purpose has yet to be found. Read "Vestical Organs are Fully Functional" by scientists Dr's Jerry Bergman and Howe.
---Warwick on 12/12/11


Blogger, there is nothing false about the Bible. The false things come from the interpretors of the Bible. So you are wrong. Your finite mind could never comprehend the mind of God. You look for information and Truth from man who is a sinner. The word of God has reasons why exact numbers or exact days or exact times are not given many times. It depends what God wanted to convey to the reader. And everyone has their own bias opinion. Even you and I in some way already hold to something we were taught or learned. The Word of God is Truth.
---Mark_V. on 12/12/11


If you want to know about the stars use the the right source tool, the Bible is not it. Study information about astronomy. That way you will know the components of the universe and how the interact. How to measure astronomical distances. Look at photos on the Hubble Telescope page and the information associated with the photos. Tribal stories will only provide you with false information, there are no correct creation account of the Universe or Earth in the Old Testament.
---Blogger9211 on 12/11/11


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Genesis 1:16 And God made two great lights, the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

Perhaps for completeness the phrase "he made the stars also" completes the view that God created the lights in the sky. However, this may not indicate that stars were created on the 4th day along with the sun, and the moon. The author added it more as an afterthought.

I say this because I do not believe God was not a creative being prior to Earth's creation and the fact that light from distant stars takes years to be seen on earth.
---lee1538 on 12/11/11


---Mark_V. on 12/11/11


John 11:9 Jesus answered, Are there not twelve hours in the day? If any man walk in the day, he stumbleth not, because he seeth the light of this world.

I do not deny the spiritual point that Jesus was making.

I am saying that there was also a PHYSICAL REALITY stated by Jesus.

That there are 12 daylight hours in a day
---francis on 12/11/11


francis, you have to put your spiritual cap on. Think in the Spirit. What spiritual revelation do His Words have when He speaks? This is not physical information but spiritual. The question was, "Rabbi, lately the Jews sought to stone You, and are You going there again?" He answered by giving the time of the daylight not the real exact time of day or the time of the night, since He knew the real time of a day.
He was told they were trying to kill Him. They could not kill the Light of the world, because He was doing God's will, but the time would come when darkness would fall, when by God's design, His earthly works would end and He would stumble in death.
---Mark_V. on 12/11/11


---Mark_V. on 12/10/11
while he was talking about walking in spiritual light, he did say that there were 12 hours of light in a day

Are you suggesting 12 hours of light and less or more hours of dark?
---francis on 12/10/11


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francis, the passage in John 11:9 is not specifying the equal hours in a day. He could not be, since He knew the exact time in one day. The Second reason is that He was not asked how many hours in a day. He was talking about the "light of the world" which was Him. He was talking about Himself as the light, and Him going away. During the light of the sun, people did their work safely. When darkness came they stopped. As long as the Son performed His Father's will, during the daylight period of His ministry when He was able to work, He was safe. The time would soon come (nighttime) when, by God's design, His earthly work would end and He would "stumble" in death.
---Mark_V. on 12/10/11


1 Chronicles 16:26 For all the gods of the people are idols: but the LORD made the heavens.

When Adam was created there were plants with fruits on them ready to be eaten. How long would it have taken for an apple tree to grow up and give fruit naturally?

Adam could take on day one!! How long does it take a baby to grow up and be able to talk naturally?

So the source of the light on day ONE was from God and so the source of the light from the sun was from God. It did not take light years for the light of the sun to reach earth. Like the plants that gave fruit on day one, the sun gave light on day 1 of it's creation.

What in nature would take years to develop God did instantly. That is why we worship him as creator.
---francis on 12/10/11


It is very possible that The light part lasted 12 hours, then the dark part came again. The light could have been coming from one direction as the earth rotated. WE JUST DO NOT KNOW

We do know that the light was separted from the darkness. So that one area had darkness and one area had light.

Genesis 1:4 And God saw the light, that [it was] good: and God divided the light from the darkness.

God did not remove the darkness, he just seperated them. SO the liht part could have lasted 12 hours before the dark part came.
We know that a day starts at sunset / night because God said so, also because the darkness was there before the light.

John 11:9 Jesus answered, Are there not twelve hours in the day?
---francis on 12/9/11


Micha, I agree with the second part of your answer. In Gen.1-2, we have no clue of time. God did not provide information of days and nights until (v.3) which the beginning of "let there be light" in which God now divides light from darkness and called the light Day, and the darkness Night, "so the evening and the morning were the first day"
People can only speculate about (v.1 and 2). If God thought it was important for us to know, He would have been more specific. But He was not.
My theory, God called everything into existence by His Word and they were there. It didn't take millions of years for the light to reach us, yet darkness was on the face of the deep, ocean. When God created man, he was there.
---Mark_V. on 12/10/11


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He could have done it all, in the twinkling of an eye . . . easier than it is for us to think and talk about it (c:

If God raised Jesus from the dead, changing His body into His own glory, then with any material thing God can form it any way He pleases . . . possibly first from a very highly workable resurrectional state . . . of the "light" that was first, then converting it down to the material level.

And He could have made the stars with light already between each star and the earth . . . if He saw fit.
---Bill_willa6989 on 12/9/11


Lee: 'then man could not have observed them for centuries.'

That is a good point. We are not, however, told that the light we actually see really comes from the star - we SEE the star, but if it is a far away star, the light may have been created by God part of the way to earth.

I can't really see any other way, as we have all these 'millions of light years' - if the universe is 6-10000 years old, the light must be from something else - logically when God said 'let there be light'
---Peter on 12/9/11


Right from the start there was day and night!
Gen 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
Gen 1:4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
Gen 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

And who said:
Are there not twelve hours in the day? If any man walk in the day, he stumbleth not, because he seeth the light of this world.

Yea, Im good with that.
I mean, is it not there?
Right from the beginning or was it after the beginning?
Oh no! Here we go again!
Im with you, micha9344!
---TheSeg on 12/9/11


Mark_Eaton //Is the Jewish Sabbath such an idol that truth has to be avoided?
---lee1538 on 12/9/11

Is that what this blog is all about?

Just responding to Francis statements as he has related creation days to the Jewish Sabbath.

Suggest you respond to his foolishness.
---lee1538 on 12/9/11


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Is the Jewish Sabbath such an idol that truth has to be avoided?
---lee1538 on 12/9/11

I think that there are enough blogs about the sabbath already. I hope that this is not your thinly vailed attempt at another anti sabbath, anti E G white or anti SDA blog
---francis on 12/9/11


//Are you saying that God made the sun before he made the light?

No, but clearly the light source of the 1st 3 days was different than that of the sun.

The sun is also a star but its light reaches the earth in only 8 minutes. Howbeit, other stars are light years away from earth and light from them takes years to reach earth.

Obviously if God created the stars on the 4th day (and the record really does not say that!), then man could not have observed them for centuries.

You really need to learn how to think! Unfortuately all too many religionist has been trained not to question but simply to goose-step behind some idiot who had declared himself (or in your case, herself) to be an annointed messenger of God.
---lee1538 on 12/9/11


Is the Jewish Sabbath such an idol that truth has to be avoided?
---lee1538 on 12/9/11

Is that what this blog is all about?

I nearly posted a reponse earlier and asked why you were using the "Are we justified" wording. Now I understand why.

It is not about understanding when the stars were created, but some hokey thing about the Fourth Commandment.

Geesh.

Can we stop this kind of junk?
---Mark_Eaton on 12/9/11


lee1538 on 12/9/11
strawman defence huh?

Are you saying that God made the sun before he made the light?

Did i say that the source was the same?
how could the source be the same when the light existed before the sun?

During of a day could be 24 hours: John 11:9 Jesus answered, Are there not twelve hours in the day?

it is very possible that the light on day one was available for 12 nours before dark part came/ we just do not know or care
all we know is that one day is made up of the dark part, and then the light part
---francis on 12/9/11


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I believe the six dyas of creation to be of normal one day-24 hour, if it was measured that way back then, length.
The text does not show otherwise, in fact, without outside influence, it is very plain, an evening and a morning-a day.
---micha9344 on 12/9/11


francis//Then God made the sun to give light which he HAD ALREADY MADE
---
Anyone knowledge of optics will tell you that there are different types of light.

In the case of the light before the sun and after the sun, the light source was different and could well have been of a different nature.

Why is it so very hard for those who know how to read, to understand that the record does NOT specifiy the duration of the first 3 days of creation?

Is the Jewish Sabbath such an idol that truth has to be avoided?


---lee1538 on 12/9/11


then God made the sun to give light which he HAD ALREADY MADE
---francis on 12/9/11

he also created plants before the sun which confuses the photosynthesis thing.
---Scott1 on 12/9/11


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