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How Can I Be Saved

Someone here asked, "WHAT MUST a man DO to be saved?" which is similar to the rich man when he asked Christ, "Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?"

What does Scripture say?

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Do you really believe there a fake gospel going round out there?
Then you must believe like so many, the devil has power on earth.
And you of course have witness this power. I have not seen this power.
But, I have heard many talking about it. I sure hope Im making myself clear.
Here is what Christ said about the only power!

All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

---TheSeg on 2/27/12

"So where is the part where God can turn man... change a man into a monkey, because He is Sovereign and can do so????"

"The same hour was the thing fulfilled upon Nebuchadnezzar: and he was driven from men, and did eat grass as oxen, and his body was wet with the dew of heaven, till his hairs were grown like eagles' feathers, and his nails like birds' claws.

And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?"
Daniel 4:33,35

You were saying?
---christan on 2/27/12

No one denies God is God! To say He's sovereign is redundant, However God cannot do anything that would deny His own character. Since God is immutable, His words must reflect His integrity (Numbers 23:19). God cannot lie (Hebrews 6:18). In all cases, God not only remains truthful, but keeps every oath and promise He makes.
God cannot be tempted by evil. There is no element in His nature to which evil can make an appeal (James 1:13). While God will often test us, He tempts no one. In fact, God uses His unlimited power to enable us to resist and escape evil (1 Corinthians 10:13).
God cannot deny or contradict Himself. God remains faithful to His covenant promises (Malachi 3:6). A promise is only as good as the person who makes it.
---kathr4453 on 2/27/12

God works all things according to His Perfect will.

Like God, His Word is immutable (1 Samuel 15:29).

God does not revoke what He has given or discard who He has chosen (Romans 11:29)...ISRAEL.

God cannot forgive sin without the payment being made. Because God is just, He cannot simply wipe the slate clean (Romans 6:23).
God cannot force anyone to love Him or to receive His gift of eternal salvation through Jesus Christ.

It is an act of mans free will (John 1:11-13). When an individual chooses to respond in faith, welcoming Jesus into his life, he becomes a new creation.....NOT A MONKEY!!!
---kathr4453 on 2/27/12

Jesus taught there was an unpardonable sin, yet Paul said there was forgiveness for all sins.
JESUS: Matt.12:31
PAUL: Acts 13:39
Jesus told the 12 to preach the gospel of the kingdom, while Paul was given the gospel of the grace of God.
JESUS: Matt.24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations, and then shall the end come.
PAUL: Acts 20:24 But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the Gospel of the grace of God.
---michael_e on 2/27/12

i know that the concept of "accept jesus into your heart" is fraught with deception and misconception.

in order to believe/not believe we must accept the Truth/not accept the Truth. Is this not logical?


"...accept another gospel..." doesn't that mean that some have accepted the real gospel? gospel of whom? good news of jesus christ.

cluny, you are telling me that you do not have spiritual discernment, so how can you say that somebody else does not? i can't help plain scripture, "...The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God," with the verses that precede obviously a spiritual man does accept the Spirit of God..or God...or Him.
---aka on 2/27/12

Aka, many passages seem to imply something which if interpreted wrong you will contradict Scripture and who Almighty God really is. And when those passages seem to imply something against who God is, that passage is interpreted wrong.
When Jesus said, "Take eat, this is My body" the bread was not His body. His body was still seating there with them. What the passage seem to say was wrong. Jesus Christ is not incarnated into a piece of bread.
When the passage seem to imply satan is the God of this world, It implies he is, but he is the god of the spiritual fallen world. For Almighty God is the God of heaven and earth. Not everything is literal in Scripture. You do not study to make yourself approved, you prefer to argue.
---Mark_V. on 2/27/12

---(see further details in Easton's)
---lee1538 on 2/26/12

Like I said, they have their own DICTIONARY of definitions, just as I'm sure Joseph Smith did too.

So where is the part where God can turn man who God breathed life into his nostrils and man became a living soul, created after the image of God, now can now after He rested from all His works change a man into a monkey, because He is Sovereign and can do so????

You can make up aything you want and say it's the Sovereign right of God with no scripture to back it up, and CURSE anyone who questions your bazaar doctrine! NUTS TO THAT!!
---kathr4453 on 2/27/12

aka, Scripture NEVER contradict Scripture. The Scripture you quote from 1 Corinthians 2:14 contradicts your "free-will" theology. How ironic.

"The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned"

To start, "the natural person" speaks about the fallen man who's "dead in sins and trespasses". Which means you have no ability to go to Christ. You must first be "born of the Spirit" to be able to "accept the things of the Spirit of God". This verse doesn't imply "free-will" in choosing or accepting Christ.
---christan on 2/27/12

\\Do you not see accept Him in this verse? 1Co_2:14 \\

No. As a matter of fact, I don't.

And you don't have the spiritual discernment to see meanings not in there, either.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/26/12

aka, come on now!

1Co 2:14 But the physical man does not receive the things of the spirit of God.
1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God:

Why not?
for they are foolishness unto him:
But more!
neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

You dont know it. As so you can choose it.
But, you feel it in your spirit. Go back now:
1Co 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

Now read 12 and 13.
but which the Holy Ghost teacheth, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
---TheSeg on 2/26/12

//Do you see the words "accept Him"?// ---christan
Not in that verse. Do you not see accept Him in this verse? 1Co_2:14 The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned". seems we have to accept something in order to not be natural, but of the spirit.
2Co_11:4 For if someone comes and proclaims another Jesus than the one we proclaimed, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or if you accept a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it readily enough.
Do you see the words accept? doesn't that also mean that the Truth has to be accepted.
---aka on 2/26/12

//There is no such thing as "a Covenant of Grace".

Kathryn is wrong as usually. The term is found in Easton's Bible Dictionary.

Her problem is that she does not like what theologians use to describe concepts found in scripture.

CONVENANT OF GRACE, the eternal plan of redemption entered into by the three persons of the Godhead, and carried out by them in its several parts. In it the Father represented the Godhead in its indivisible sovereignty, and the Son his people as their surety #Joh 17:4,6,9 Isa 42:6 Ps 89:3 (see further details in Easton's)
---lee1538 on 2/26/12

Do you see the words "accept Him"?
---christan on 2/25/12

Where do you see the words "irresistable grace"? Yet you believe it when in fact Jesus Christ with his own lips and Hebrews 3 both say you CAN resist the calling of God and his desire for your life and disqualify yourself from Gods rest.
---JackB on 2/26/12

markv said:
//I gave you the word of reject it.//

ironically spoken. the scriptures say that satan is the 'god OF this world' and you want to explain it away based on your understanding. my understanding based on scripture: christians are IN the world and not OF the world (milk).

using (Judges 9:23) and (1 Samuel 16:14) is a clear example of how modern christians are so willing to include themselves in scripture where they do not belong and use a few scriptures to support their chosen doctrine.

based on scripture, i believe in both predestination AND the image of God's will, and not Calvinism and free will.

markv, you declare yourself something according to the word., and i declare myself nothing.
---aka on 2/26/12

Surprisingly the disciples were also ignorant of the cross, well into the ministry of Jesus to Israel.
And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken. Luke 18:34
Not only ignorant. They were afraid to ask
But they understood not that saying, and were afraid to ask him. Mark 9:32
In this dispensation, these verses could be written about the unbelieving who haven't trusted in the cross.
What about the 12 the Lord chose to be the leaders of his ministry? Especially since they had already been preaching A GOSPEL for years (Matt 10:1-6)
Understanding the preaching of the cross was revealed first to Paul eliminates confusion.
---michael_e on 2/26/12

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Rev. 3:18 I (Jesus) counsel you (kathy) to buy from me gold refined by fire, so that you may be rich, and white garments so that you may clothe yourself and the shame of your nakedness may not be seen, and salve to anoint your eyes, so that you may see.

Yes, kathryn I can see that you have been wounded but you really need to stop falling on your sword.
---lee1538 on 2/26/12

Duane, what Truth did Kathr give? All she did was put down Scripture with no explanation. She gave Acts 19:2-4) These people were filled with the Holy Spirit. In these passages in Acts, the subject is not about born of the Spirit or were they sealed by the Spirit are baptized by the Spirit. At this time they were indwelled by the Spirit for service. This was a permenent indwelling, something that the Spirit only did a few times in the Old Testament. The Holy Spirit came on this day as the firstfruits of the believers inheritance (2 Cor.5:5: Eph. 1:11,14:). With this indwelling came the gifts needed to do the believers service for Christ. Not for their own use.
---Mark_V. on 2/26/12

Aka, I'm never trying to be hostile to you. I gave you the word of God. you reject what it says because you don't believe it fits your understandings. God does with man what pleases Him.
"Then God send an evil spirit between Abimelech and the man of Sheechem,...which aided him in the killing of his brethren" (Judges 9:23). And yet another evil spirit was sent by God to trouble Saul, "But the Spirit of the Lord departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from the Lord troubled him" (1 Samuel 16:14). It is clear from Scripture that the angels, good or bad, are under God's control and willingly or unwillingly carry out God's purpose. Yet you reject it.
---Mark_V. on 2/26/12

markv, i did not say that you said that you are in control. earlier, i was quoting you. i don't have all day/night to post three posts in a row that say, "and you said..." ergo '//'.

//Aka, how little you know about God.// VERY TRUE. Gal 6:3 For if anyone thinks he is something, when he is nothing, he deceives himself. MarkV, you are something.

//I devise certian ways but in the end I am doing His will. //
so, you believe that no matter what you devise, in the end, you are doing His will? you can participate in a satanic ritual sacrifice and, in the end, you are doing His will?

i believe that no matter what i devise or how far off track that i am, when He leads me back to his Way, then i am doing His will.
---aka on 2/25/12

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Christan, where you are incorrect is this. There is no such thing as "a Covenant of Grace".

This made up covenant is based on man's theory steeped in what is called the Sovereignty of God according to Calvin.

Now the Everlasting Covenant of which Scripture does talk about has nothing whatsoever in common with christan's bogus Covenant of Grace.

The Covenant of Grace???/ uses different definitions for all sorts of words in scripture.

ALL Cults have their own bogus doctrines. Beware.
---kathr4453 on 2/26/12

Think of it! God is not only sovereign according to Calvinism, He is also all powerful. He even can change you into a monkey so you can swing from tree to tree.
---lee1538 on 2/24/12

Now when one questions this bazzar belief it's like being cursed by the Benny Hinnites who curse you for daring to question them on bogus miracles, accusing you of blaspheming the Holy Spirit.
---kathr4453 on 2/26/12

"Covenant requires an originator and the beneficiary must accept it..." aka

Really? When God made the covenant of grace, it was from eternity, the world was not even created. Neither were His people (the elect). It was between the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit, period. That's why when Scripture declares, "for He shall save his people from their sins", it's a PROMISE made by the Holy Trinity.

"And I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all, and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand." John 10:28,29

Do you see the words "accept Him"?
---christan on 2/25/12

Aka, how little you know about God. I'm in control of nothing. The God of Scripture is. I live because of Him. I know who I am before God. A sinner saved by the Grace of God. Not ashame to say it. Everything I do in life is because of Him. I devise certian ways but in the end I am doing His will. "A man's heart deviseth his way, But the Lord directeth his steps" (Prov. 16:9). Not hard to understand.
"For in Him and through Him, and to Him, are all things to whom be glory forever. Amen" (Rom. 11:36). You ought to say, "If the Lord will" (James 4:13,15).
You give an anology and in it, you still have to accept the gift which indicates, it is still by your works. That's not Scriptural.
---Mark_V. on 2/25/12

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Everyone, read what Kathr wrote on 2/24. Its very true.
---duane on 2/25/12

"Like I always said, Calvinists as did Calvin believe water baptism saves them!!!"

More and more garbage is being brought out into the open only to be smelly on a hot summer's day. You've definitely got your reading materials all tossed out and mixed with your other garbage.

Anyone and everyone who belief in salvation by grace 100% knows that baptism does not save. One baptizes is because he belief that he's saved by God's grace and nothing else. And I'm sure Calvin never taught that baptism saves, maybe when he was initially a Catholic monk but not after God converted him to see the light of His glorious grace.

Notice you're a champion of dispensationalism theology. God for you and your soul!
---christan on 2/25/12

markv //You...believe, you are in control.// you can keep saying that but it does not make it true. in the bible the is a handful of the word "predestination" and its derivatives. i wonder how many hundreds of if-then statements are made by God. Covenant requires an originator and the beneficiary must accept it, which requires choice. if a covenant is not made, it can not be accepted. therefore, the originator is in control. e.g. my dad dies, leaves me money in his last will and TESTAMENT. without his origination there is no inheritance. but, to collect on my inheritance, i must make the choice. they cannot make me take his offer. there is no control on my part...just submission and acceptance of the covenant.
---aka on 2/24/12

Peter and Paul taught that Jesus Christ was the Son of God, that he was crucified, and he rose from the dead on the third day. So "What is the difference between their two gospels?"
Paul spoke to Gentiles and Jews, Peter spoke to Israel only, with the exception of Cornelius.

second difference is in making the offer of the kingdom to Israel, Peter spoke of the resurrection in order to show that the Lord was alive and could still return to be Israel's King (Acts 3:19-21). Christ's death and resurrection, the sign of Jonah, were stated as evidence. Peter wasn't proclaiming them as part of the gospel of the kingdom. Paul taught that the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ are essential parts of our gospel of grace.

---michael_e on 2/24/12

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Matthew 3:11I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
12Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner, but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable.

Like I always said, Calvinists as did Calvin believe water baptism saves them!!!
---kathr4453 on 2/24/12

Acts 19:2-4
2He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.

3And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.

4Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.

Paul had to further EXPLAIN teh Gospel of GRACE.

So, are Calvinists a remnant of these poor lost souls uninformed that John the Baptist could not baptize anyone into Jesus Death and Resurrection becoming MEMBERS of Christ's RISEN BODY!!!
---kathr4453 on 2/24/12

Also remember Christan, when I say to the Jews and not to the Church, I mean the Church as making up both Jew and Gentile becoming ONE NEW MAN In Christ.

Since that mystery was HIDDEN in the OT and was not even preached in Matthew. This misunderstanding is what happened in Galatia....Christian Jews believing Gentiles were in submission to Jews and the Jewish religion, not realizing the CROSS placed no one over anyone else, and in Christ both were ONE NEW MAN in Christ throught the Cross.

"To the Jews" is the Jews during the Great Tribulation period, who Matthew is addressing. Read the WHOLE BOOK Christan.

WE are not under any SABBATH LAWS! Or will have to worry about taking any FLIGHT on any SABBATH DAY!
---kathr4453 on 2/24/12

" John the Baptist taught Kingdom Law and the coming of the earthly Kingdom of the Risen Christ."

What a load of garbage. Present the Scripture that such a teaching was taught by John the Baptist. Always accusing others of creating theologies that does not exist and you excel in this the best.

If John really taught of such a promise than Christ was lying to Pilate when He said, "Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence." John 18:36

What "earthly Kingdom of the Risen Christ" is this? Utter rubbish!
---christan on 2/24/12

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"These different gospels can be understood by a careful study of Scripture..."" michael

"different gospels"? Seriously? There's only ONE Gospel of Jesus Christ written and acknowledged in the Holy Bible by His apostles Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. They are all written in perfect harmony to one another.

"Rightly dividing the Word" does not equate to your implications that the Gospels are different from one another as written by the apostles. It's only people like you and your cohorts teach of a "chopped up in pieces" Gospel of Jesus Christ. Always lying and denying the Truth of His Word.

And you dare call yourself a Christian?
---christan on 2/24/12

Aka, yes, we believe in the Sovereignty of God. We are controlled by an elite (elitism ) God Himself. You and others believe, you are in control. In ( Luke 18:11) I never said I am not like other man, in fact I'm just like you and others, a sinner saved by the Grace of God.
The Lord is Sovereign in my life, and does as His pleases, in your life, your sovereign and God does as you please. Two different concepts.
"As many as were ordained to eternal life believed" (Acts 13:48).
It is God Himself who makes the difference, for of His own it is written,
"And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know Him that is true" ( 1 John 5:20) seems not to you.
---Mark_V. on 2/24/12

Yes and it is the Holy Spirit who leads us into all truth who when you LISTEN and learn will enlighten one to know the CHURCH is not under Kingdom LAW.

A Great book is by Lewis Sperry Chafer, of Dallas Theological Seminary who can explain this to you MarkV.

OH But De Chafer was not a Calvinist either! and exposes covenent calvinism as a false doctrine.

Many a WELL grounded Christian KNOW Matthew is to the Jews and not to the Church. John never baptized any Gentiles either.

So MarkV, believe your calvinism if you must. How totally IGNORANT he left you all.
---kathr4453 on 2/23/12

//they whin and slander the messengers, calling us the elite, // markv

Luke 18:11 can you deny that you haven't expressed elitism type of elitism to other calvinists here.?

//In Christianity there is only two sides//

to you and many others. i believe that only God is sovereign. and He made man in His image (i.e complete with His will), which he extended freedom or liberty. once man fell, man no longer had God's will but man's will and forfeited his liberty.

The only way back is through the one that was predestined from the beginning to bring man back IF he fell. Covenants are conditional and they must be met by both the maker and recipient.
---aka on 2/23/12

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Markv, here you are again, putting people down. How many is it now, you probably have lost count. You know it just shows your ignorance.
You need to ask yourself this, because you truly don't know.
//"WHAT MUST a man DO to be saved?"//
---michael_e on 2/23/12

Kathr, I didn't expect you to believe the Truth in the first place, since a person has to be born of the Spirit to understand spiritual matters. People with heretical views always stick together, but have different weapons they use, different Gospels of Christ, great.
---Mark_V. on 2/23/12

I agree michael_e, John the Baptist taught Kingdom Law and the coming of the earthly Kingdom of the Risen Christ. Those who really KNOW and understand GRACE will see that Matthew is steeped with legalism, not GRACE, to the JEWS and not the Church. NO Gentile is going to have to worry about taking any FLIGHT on the SAbbath. This is the problem with our Sabbath believers. Even THEY cannot rightly divide the word of truth here.

No one is going to have to put out an eye or cut off a hand to enter into teh body of Christ FIRST. We are Crucified with Christ taking care of both eye and hand.

The Earthly Kingdom is when earthly men will enter. The CHURCH will be Glorified together with Christ reigning and ruling with Christ at that time.
---kathr4453 on 2/23/12

Although every man at any time is saved by the grace of God through faith, the content of faith differs from one dispensation to the next. That is, the message that is offered and believed for righteousness and salvation varies according to Gods progressive revelation.

These different gospels can be understood by a careful study of Scripture making sure to rightly divide according to what had been revealed (2 Tim 2:15).
---michael_e on 2/23/12

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I'm pretty convinced that I am not saved, and can't be. One person says one needs to believe the whole Bible is literally true, another, that one must keep Shabbat, another that one must reject free will, another that one should become Orthodox. And all these people claim to be guided by the Holy Spirit. Are they really? It's too hard to know what to believe. I give up.
---John.usa on 2/23/12

Both taught different gospels" shear nonesense.
"Paul and John the Baptist taught two distinct gospels, both God given, the gospel of the kingdom and the gospel of the grace of God"

There is only one gospel, that salvation is through faith in Christ Jesus. The first gospel was spoken in (Gen. 3:15) There is no gospel that is not through faith in Christ Jesus. If there is another without Christ it is false. The gospels might have different descriptive titles in the Bible but they are all salvation through faith in One Person, Jesus Christ.
(Gal. 1:6-9) explains that. Each gospel had more informantion then the other but it was the same gospel.
---Mark_V. on 2/23/12

Paul and John the Baptist taught two distinct gospels, both God given, the gospel of the kingdom and the gospel of the grace of God. Pauls good news included Christs shedding blood, paying for our sins and righteousness without the law.(1Cor 15:1-4)

John the Baptist taught the good news of a coming Messiah to establish the promised kingdom to Israel. He water baptized for the remission of sins and for the priesthood (Mark 1:3-4)
Jesus, during his earthly ministry, taught the same message as John (Mark 1:14-15) Plus added belief in himself as the Messiah. Anyone who didn't believe Jesus was the Son of God was unacceptable with God (John 6:40) John's disciples may not have identified the Messiah. Followers of the Jesus were required to.
---michael_e on 2/22/12

michael_e, you once declared "However, many times Pauls words differ drastically from the words of Christ spoken during His earthly ministry."

In your very own words, you accuse Paul of contradicting Christ's teachings and yet, majority of your quotes comes from Paul's epistles. Is there a double-standard of understanding that's coming from you?

You're a very confused man.
---christan on 2/22/12

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In every dispensation salvation is always by faith in God and obedience to the word which he has revealed. Every new dispensation from God perfectly fits together into Gods plan for the ages Although there are many gospels delivered to man in the Bible there is one message of salvation for today. 1Cor 15:1-4
---michael_e on 2/21/12

What must I do to be saved?

A classical question!

The Philippians jailer asked the same question of Paul.

Acts 16:30 Then he brought them out and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household. And they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house.

To believe is all that was required of him, but if you are an Adventist you would have to request the believer to observe the 10 commandments, especially the Jewish Sabbath.
---lee1538 on 2/20/12

"Christ taught his disciples to keep the law, Paul said we are not under the law." michael_e

There's no contradiction to Christ and Paul's teachings, if you truly understand the meaning of Faith in Jesus Christ. Rather it's Paul's teaching of Faith that a Christian is deemed to have kept the law, which was fulfilled by Christ.

The trouble with teachers of the Holy Scripture is they continue to lie to the people that Faith can be manufactured from within the sinner which Paul never taught. Rather, he tells us that "Faith is a gift from God", and unless He gives it to you, you have no True Faith, period. Carnal faith yes, but it's not saving faith.
---christan on 2/20/12

Instead of preaching Jesus according to the flesh and his position as King of the Jews, we preach Christ glorified, Head of the body, which is the church, (Eph 1:22-23).
Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more. 2 Cor 5:16

Instead of preaching Jesus according to the gospel of the kingdom, 12 tribes, the priesthood of Israel, we should be teaching as Paul taught Him: according to the revelation of the mystery Rom 16:25

But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness. But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God. 1 Cor 1:23-24
---michael_e on 2/20/12

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However, many times Pauls words differ drastically from the words of Christ spoken during His earthly ministry." michael_e

michael....Have you any idea how Paul received the gospel that he is teaching? He received it by revelation from Christ Himself.
---JIM on 2/20/12

2Tim 2:15 calls it rightly dividing

Christ taught his disciples to keep the law,
Paul said we are not under the law:
CHRIST: Matt. 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. Matt 23:1-3 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses seat: All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do, but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

PAUL: Romans 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held, that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
---michael_e on 2/20/12

"However, many times Pauls words differ drastically from the words of Christ spoken during His earthly ministry." michael_e

You are implying that Paul was preaching a different Gospel to that of Jesus Christ? And you are a Christian who doesn't belief what Paul wrote?

Paul received the complete revelation direct from Christ through the Holy Spirit that he wrote his epistles with regards to salvation. The book of Romans is a classic systematic theology of the fall to salvation by grace. You must be blind as a bat not to see that salvation is 100% of God. Paul's teachings merely confirmed what Christ was teaching in great detail.
---christan on 2/20/12

Barb, A-men.
---Eloy on 2/19/12

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Its impossible with men because for US to do it we would need to fulfill the law perfectly as Christ said. Youre reading more into it than what is there.

God can do it through Christ who gave his life for us and empowers us to change by his Spirit.

That however requires us to believe who Jesus Christ said he was and who the Spirit tells us he is and call upon his name for the free gift God offers all men. Some simply do not want the change, so they deny the truth presented to them.
---CraigA on 2/19/12

michael_e, talk about standing alone!
How is anyone going to believe such a just vision of God?

With all my heart.
God bless you michael_e
---TheSeg on 2/19/12

Whoever said that a man having faith in Jesus Christ was a work? Faith is not a work (Romans 4:5). Faith does not save the man. Its the object of his faith that does.

We are saved through faith not BY it! Our faith must be redirected from confidence in ourselves to the power of God in Jesus Christ. We will not be "saved" until we humble ourselves before the Lord and admit defeat and ask for his wonderful gift.

That in no way is a work. And it certainly doesnt mean that the man is "saving himself" or "stealing Gods glory" by placing his faith in Jesus Christ. Whoever believes that has been deceived.
---Blogger9680 on 2/19/12

//If it was really "so simple", please read the words that Christ spoke to His disciples, //
Very simple.
consider that the words of Paul in Romans through Philemon are the Words of Christ. However, many times Pauls words differ drastically from the words of Christ spoken during His earthly ministry.

Under the kingdom message, as under the law, works were always a part of salvation, but under grace, salvation is a free gift without works:
---michael_e on 2/19/12

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"Salvation today is so simple, you really have to try to miss it." michael e

Far be from it according to Jesus Christ. Only Satan will tell you that "salvation today is so simple". If it was really "so simple", please read the words that Christ spoke to His disciples,

"Who then can be saved? But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible." Matthew 19:25,26

Exactly like the account in Genesis when God told Adam, "for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." but the serpent contradicted God, "Ye shall not surely die". See the similarity?
---christan on 2/18/12

Here we go with the context argument again....

Well Im not playing this time. You know good and well "the whole world" and "all men" mean EXACTLY what they say. The reason you wont accept it is because it would rip your doctrine to shreds and you would need to rebuild everything. Scary stuff I know, but sometimes its necessary to know the Lord even better.
---CraigA on 2/18/12


2 Peter 2:1-3 written to : those who through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ have received a faith as precious as ours" (see 2 Peter 1:1)

But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among YOU. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who BOUGHT them bringing swift destruction on themselves

Men for whom Christ died denying Him even after being bought with his blood! Its right there!

In their greed these "teachers" will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them...
---CraigA on 2/19/12

Salvation is a free gift without any work whatsoever. (Eph. 2:8-9) Salvation isn't accomplished by walking the aisle, joining the church, being baptized, turning over a new leaf, repenting of your sins, turning from your sins, forsaking your sins, confessing your sins, asking for forgiveness of your sins or inviting Christ into your heart.

Forgiveness is available to all who believe that Christ died for our sins, was buried and rose again and that God forgave us for Christs sake. (I Cor. 15:1-4) Salvation is trusting completely in what Christ did for us at Calvary. (Eph. 1:13) this truth has been hidden from the world by the religion of this world that substitutes traditions of men for the truth.
---michael_e on 2/19/12

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Jesus told the young man to keep the commandments and sell all that he has and follow Him. In the days that Christ walked the earth the New Testament had not yet been written and the only way the rich young ruler could learn the testimony of Jesus was to leave his riches and life behind and follow Him. He refused.

Today we have the words that the eyewitness disciples wrote down for us so that we too can see and hear the truth. Sadly, some of us are still trying to climb into the sheep fold some other way. John 10:1-6. Pay close attention to verse six.
---barb on 2/19/12

The rich young man was keeping what is called the old testament ten commandments, but keeping the old testament commandments is not enough for salvation, and he asked Jesus what he yet lacked to do, that he may have eternal life. Scripure reads that Jesus said: "One thing you lack: go your way, sell whatsoever you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven, and come, take up the cross, and follow me." He became sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions. Mk.10:21,22. The Cost to be with the Lord, Please Read- Luke 9:23-26+ Luke 14:26-35.
---Eloy on 2/18/12

CraigA, as I have said earlier when the words like "world" or "whole world" is written in the Holy Bible, we have to read them in context just like any other reading materials.

And when you compare 1 John 2:2 to John 17:9, "I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me, for they are thine.", you begin to understand that the "whole world" John was referring to are "All that the Father giveth me shall come to me, and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out." John 6:37

Only when you stand-by "free-will", will you deny that those who will go to Christ are only the elect, whom the Father has given to His Son.
---christan on 2/18/12

In order to be saved you need to believe that Jesus died for your sins, and that everything written in the Bible is literally true, and be willing do die for your beliefs.
---John.usa on 2/18/12

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Salvation today is so simple, you really have to try to miss it.
1Cor.15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand, 2By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures, 4And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
---michael_e on 2/18/12

CraigA, I've been accused of using one verse to create a doctrine, but you are no better. The context in 1 John 2:2 must be understood as who John was addressing? Believers or unbelievers?

Jesus said, "For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved." Using your very understanding of the "whole world" in this verse, will there be multitudes in hell or even a place called hell? If your answer is yes, then your understanding becomes erroneous.

There are about sixty-two "world" mentioned in the Gospel. Do they actually mean the same when you read it in context? Obviously no.
---christan on 2/18/12

Just in case you think thats still not what scripture is saying maybe the words of someone you DO trust will help you better. Thnx to Blogger9860

""Christ suffered for the sins of the whole world, and in the goodness of God is offered unto all men without distinction, His blood being shed not for a part of the world only, but for the whole human race, for although in the world nothing is found worthy of the favor of God, yet He holds out the propitiation to the whole world, since without exception He summons all to the faith of Christ, which is nothing else than the door unto hope" --- John Calvin
---CraigA on 2/18/12

---It's your very "own word" and definitely not from the Holy Spirit.---Christan.

Here ya go.

And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the WHOLE WORLD. --- 1 John 2:2

Whole: (Greek) holos : which means ALL, EVERY, altogether, every whit, throughout

World: (Greek) kosmos : which means orderly arrangement, the adorning, the world

Now you DO see it.
---CraigA on 2/18/12

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michael, Acts 16:30,31 is one of the many Scripture the free-willers" enjoy using to tell people they have the ability to "believe in Christ" by their "free-will", which they cannot substantiate in those verses that says man has the ability. They assume they can.

To counter their erroneous assumption and "free-will" theology, here's what Christ declared, "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day." John 6:44.

So then, who are those who can believe? Jesus said, "All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out." John 6:37. These are called the Elect.
---christan on 2/17/12

CraigA, see how dangerous that heart and tongue of yours is? I do not find the word "entire" before any of the word "world" in the Scriptures. It's your very "own word" and definitely not from the Holy Spirit. If you cannot show prove of your claim "entire world", how are we to take you seriously about what you claim is truth.

Be reminded, God commanded Adam, "But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." What did the serpent say? "Ye shall not surely die."

See the similarity in the claim you made? Eden all over again.
---christan on 2/17/12

Christan, Paul was obviously led by the Spirit as was evident from the fruit in his life and the fact that his writings were added to holy scripture. He also did not murder those who disagreed with his teachings.
---CraigA on 2/17/12

"Scripture also declares in numerous places that Christ died for the entire world....WORLD!" CraigA

You're going to have a hard time telling Adam, Caine, Pharaoh, Egyptians, Judas, Esau, Pilate, Herod etc, that your "christ died for the entire world" and yet they still ended up in the Lake of Fire. What a powerless and sad god you worship.

"You can also look at their fruits and you have your answer."

Are you implying that the apostle Paul was writing his epistles without the guidance of the Holy Spirit? You better take heed of what Christ warned, "But I say to you that for every idle word men may speak, they will give account of it in the day of judgment."
---christan on 2/17/12

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Acts 16:30And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? 31And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
---michael_e on 2/16/12

When Christ said sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor.
Think he was talking about money right, most people do.
He was talking about the treasure hid in a field!

What is the true treasure of this world?
If you have these give them to the poor.
Are you asking why? Mat_13:44

Mat_19:21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
Luk_12:15 And he said unto them, Take heed, and beware of covetousness: for a man's life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth.

1Ti_6:17 Charge them that are rich-
---TheSeg on 2/15/12

"What does scripture say?"

Loaded question...

Scripture also declares in numerous places that Christ died for the entire world....WORLD! But yet some ignorantly deny that fact because it doesnt fit into what one of the founders of their church defines salvation.

So either Paul or John Calvin was NOT led by the Holy Spirit? I dont see any letters written from John Calvin that were cannonized as holy scripture. You can also look at their fruits and you have your answer.
---CraigA on 2/15/12

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