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Finish It Here February 2012

How about a continue it here blog? I would like to apologize to Char for putting 'char' where chria should be in the How To Put To Death The Body blog, making it appear as if Char responded. I don't want any confusion.

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To his father he was as if he was dead.---MarkV

Exactly! But was the son really dead? No.

Your argument is with God MarkV.. James says "the body without the spirit is dead". If a man's spirit is dead, how does his body still live?
Obviously if a man is still alive then so is his spirit or does scripture not mean what it says....again (sigh). If only you were around back then to help God better explain things to us by putting the correct words in His book.
---JackB on 3/6/12


And how do we receive that new life, Christan?

Titus 3:5
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration (born again), and renewing of the Holy Ghost,

WHEN do we receive the Holy Ghost?

Eph 1:13
In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also AFTER that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Yet you claim the rebirth or being "born again" is BEFORE faith in Christ. That is unscriptural.
---JackB on 3/6/12


Something for you and Mark to think about.

Who does God reveal himself to?

Psalm 25:14
The Lord confides in those who fear him, he makes his covenant known to them.

Acts 13:26
Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.
---JackB on 3/6/12


As always some cannot seem to separate the spiritual from the physical.
There are two forms of death, one is the physical and, most important, the spiritual one.
---Elder on 3/6/12


Blogger, A carnal minded person is a lost person who lives in the flesh. That's his practice and state. It is not the practice or state of someone born of God. Though Christians can be carnal many times, "that is not their permanent state". ( 1 Cor. 3:4) Paul spoke to the Christians as babies in a carnal state. But Paul had just said, "But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for the are foolishness to him, nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discern. But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one"
The natural man is unregenerate so spiritually dead in traspasses and sin (Eph. 2:10) His permanent state is carnal.
---Mark_V. on 3/6/12




"Can the dead hear? Apparently so."

Visit a morgue or cemetery and start talking to the dead. If they reply you, I'll believe your "theory" that the dead can hear.

Using John 8:9 to prove that the "dead can hear" is nothing short of you being like the Pharisees, proud and foolish. They were only "convicted by their own conscience" (which even heathens and pagans are) BUT not convicted that they were sinners before God and needed to repent. That's the difference!

In John 8, the grace of God through Jesus abounded to the woman the Pharisees brought to stone. Grace never came upon the Pharisees and those ready to stone the woman.

And the "dead can hear". Ya, right.
---christan on 3/6/12


JackB, if "DEAD" doesn't mean dead, what then does dead means? Why would Jesus then declare,

"Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit." If you were not "DEAD", why would you need to be "born again"?

And then Paul, "And you did He make alive, when ye were dead through your trespasses and sins." Obviously "alive" is opposite of "dead" or to you something else? And I've been accused of not having "comprehension skills".
---christan on 3/5/12


"For to be carnally minded is death" this are the lost. "But to be spiritually minded is life and peace" Those are the ones born of the Spirit."

Not true. If you will carefully read 1 Corinthians, you will find Paul addressing the church at Corinth as SAINTS, but "carnal", "babies", and "acting as mere men". "Carnal" simply means "flesh minded" and "acting and living according to the senses". Comes from the same word as "carnivore" - a flesh-eater. Until we have experienced the full renewing of the mind, there is a degree of carnality manifesting, even amongst those who believe themselves to be doctrinally and hermeneutically correct.
---blogger0305 on 3/5/12


Can the dead hear? Apparently so,
John 8:9 "And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst."
Jesus actually had complete conversations with them, John 10:31_33.
Gee, dead PPL with conscience, conviction and understanding!
---Nana on 3/5/12


Jack B, the prodigal son was not dead he was prodigal living (v.13), and very much alive. He came back, he never died. To his father he was as if he was dead. His father cleary had been looking for his sons return. Without a word his father pours out his love for the son, and expresses his joy that what was lost had been found. The son returned because he repented of what he had done. The other son wasn't. He said, "I never transgresse your commandment at any time." If you notice this is not something that happened literally. It was a parable. The parable pictures God as the Father eager to forgive and longing for the return of the sinner. The main theme is the joy of God, the celebrations that fill heaven when a sinner repents.
---Mark_V. on 3/5/12




Jack B 2: you also said,

"Men cannot survive in this body without a spirit. If a man is "spiritually dead" he is physically dead as well."

Not true, every descedant of Adam is born spiritually dead. That's why Jesus said, you must be born again, of the Spirit. A man has a soul and body when they are born.
"For to be carnally minded is death" this are the lost. "But to be spiritually minded is life and peace" Those are the ones born of the Spirit.
"Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness"
---Mark_V. on 3/5/12


//What a difference, "drowning" as to "DEAD - no life in you"! What can a DEAD man do?
---christan on 3/5/12//

James 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also

Men cannot survive in this body without a spirit. If a man is "spiritually dead" he is physically dead as well.

The only deaths I see in scripture are the first death when we die in this body and a second death after the resurrection of the dead, when hell and death are cast into the lake of fire.

"Dead" obviously doesnt mean what you think it does Christan. Perhaps you should consider another definition. (Luke 15:24)
---JackB on 3/5/12


MarkV, again sillyness.

Lazarus was physically dead. He was unable to reason and decide anything.

Parable of the Prodigal Son, MarkV. Jesus told it. Go read it. We can still reason (even though we are considered "dead" by our father) that we have lived foolishly and recognize our need for His forgiveness and restoral into his kingdom.
---JackB on 3/5/12


christan:

That is exactly my point. God told Adam not to eat from the tree. But he ate from it anyway. So if he chose to disobey God, he must have done so using his own free will.

Unless, of course, you believe that the world is one big Kabuki theatre, and we are all marionettes with God pulling all our strings, and we only THINK we make choices. But if that were the case, wouldn't God be punishing us for decisions he himself forced us to make. That is a bit sadistic, don't you think?

How would YOU react to a parent who (say) forced his child to steal, and then beat the child for stealing because stealing is wrong?
---StrongAxe on 3/5/12


Jack B, you said,
"Does a drowning man who screams in terror for help "steal the glory" from the one who jumps in after him and pulls him to safety?"

Jack, in the case of the lost, no one is drowning, they are dead already. They need to be born of the Spirit. God has to bring Spiritual life to them.
Remember Lazarus, He was dead. "When Jesus heard that, He said "This sickness is not unto death but for the glory of God" that the Son of God may be glorified" He gets the glory.
Jesus said,
"Lazarus, come forth" Did Lazuras say no, I want to stay dead? He had no choice "And he who had died came out bound hand and foot with graveclothes"
---Mark_V. on 3/5/12


"Does a drowning man who screams in terror for help "steal the glory" from the one who jumps in after him and pulls him to safety?" JackB

That's the problem with your "free-will" theology. You think that you are alive in the spirit and in communication with God, who btw is Spirit. You say you're "drowning".

Scripture clearly declares, "Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin, and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned."

What a difference, "drowning" as to "DEAD - no life in you"! What can a DEAD man do?
---christan on 3/5/12


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StrongAxe, let's start from the very beginning in Genesis. This is what Scripture says,

"And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."

Plain and simple, disobey God and you die. Do you see anywhere here that "God told Adam to choose between disobeying or obeying Him"? Be reminded at this point of time that Adam was sinless.

And we, who are born after Adam in "sin and trespasses" think you can obey God when Adam who was sinless couldn't? See where your foolishness lies with "free-will"?
---christan on 3/4/12


That's just simply silly, Mark.

Does a drowning man who screams in terror for help "steal the glory" from the one who jumps in after him and pulls him to safety?
---JackB on 3/4/12


---Your theology of a sinner needing to choose Christ after His Father has chosen him wreaks of foolishness---Christan

1 Cor 1:18
For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
---JackB on 3/4/12


Christan, Im sorry but you are as far off on this as you are on your understanding of Eph 2:8,9.

For it is impossible for (whom?)---> those who were once enlightened, have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, (under what circumstance?) ---> IF they shall fall away , (to do what?)--->to renew them AGAIN unto repentance...



In order for them to be brought to repentance "again" it means they have been brought to it once already.

The word used for "fall away" is parapipto in Greek. It means to defect.

2 Peter 2 backs this up. Please go read it.
---JackB on 3/4/12


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christan:

There are many places where we are commanded to CHOOSE. If we had no free will, we would not be in any position to choose - God would be pulling our puppet strings and choosing for us.

There would be no purpose in teaching or discussing religion anywhere, since everything that was supposed to happen would happen, regardless of what anybody else did about it.
---StrongAxe on 3/4/12


//the keywords from verses 4 to 6 are "For IT IS IMPOSSIBLE for those who were once enlightened and IF" in verse 6 not "fall away". //

that is the keywords to the one who doesn't think all scripture is key. the keywords from v. 4 - 6 are every word in the sentences which include if..fall away and then...restore.

you accuse other of free will, but killing others in God's name is free will not God's will.

in the old testament, god instructed His people to take their land by force. jesus said to dust feet and not murder like calvin did because there were those that disagreed with him.
---aka on 3/4/12


Jack B, you contradict yourself. I just want you to see,

"I dont want the glory for my salvation. It all goes to God. His Son is saving me."

First you give the glory to God. Then turn around and say,

"All I did" was ask Him to come into my life and change it"

This is what you suggest,
1. That you did something for your salvation, All I did"
2. That you did something good towards God while in the flesh. God's Word says "For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, it does not submit to God's law, "indeed it cannot," and those who are in the flesh cannot please God."
Only those born of God please God.
---Mark_V. on 3/4/12


JackB, don't flatter yourself and your "free-will". How's it "a fact" that "free-will" exist when you cannot support this claim with Scripture that God said so?

It's simple, that if you "fall away" from the faith, you were never even converted by the Holy Spirit which means your claim of faith was false from the beginning. That's the simple context of Hebrews 6:4-6.

Your theology of a sinner needing to choose Christ after His Father has chosen him wreaks of foolishness. When God converts, His power will definitely bring you to Christ and believe in Him. He's God and He can't overcome your will? Seriously? Maybe you should read the conversion of Paul in Acts 9.
---christan on 3/3/12


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//If I am wrong, who is it harming? Noone! I cant change "fate". Everyone who was supposed to be saved, WILL be saved.

But if you are wrong....wow.//

the first part is correct. for me, the wow is for a different reason.

there are those who believe that they can insert themselves into scripture (where they do not belong), then think they are free to murder, blow up abortion clinics, taunt others who do not agree with them, and other acts which are a clear violation of God's law, and then turn around to say that it is God's will and they are saved no matter what.

calvinists put the false moniker of free will on others, but actually it is them who act freely outside of God's will and then claim salvation.
---aka on 3/3/12


christan, i am not going to argue this. there are other versions that don't have the if.

//The "free-will" you cling on to so preciously is the "veil" that's covering your eyes, ear and heart.//

you can keep saying this, but that does not make it true. it is you that is hanging onto free will and putting it on others. you have to justify acting freely outside of God's will and doing as you will. calvin was a murderer and justified it by saying it is God's will. why else would you have to keep forcing this insiduous belief when according to you, we cannot help it. calvin is still trying to justify calvin. there is no such thing of free will and calivinism, there is only God's will and predestination.
---aka on 3/3/12


aka, read the Scripture real carefully, Hebrews 6:6, If they shall FALL AWAY, to renew them again unto repentance,

The keywords from verses 4 to 6 are "For IT IS IMPOSSIBLE for those who were once enlightened and IF" in verse 6 not "fall away". The writer of Hebrews is declaring here, that there's no way when a sinner is converted by the Holy Spirit can he ever "fall away", that's why the keywords are "IT IS IMPOSSIBLE" and "IF".

The "free-will" you cling on to so preciously is the "veil" that's covering your eyes, ear and heart. And as Paul declared, only God can remove them. "Read" 2 Corinthians 4:1-6.
---christan on 3/3/12


I think the reason you hate free will is because you dont like the fact that God is requiring something from you, Christan.

I dont want the glory for my salvation. It all goes to God. His Son is saving me. All I did was ask Him to come into my life and change it. How is that stealing Gods glory? I knew I couldnt do it on my own and was desperate enough at that point in my life to try Jesus. I havent been dissapointed yet and just as God promised, my faith in Him will not ever cause me to be ashamed.

However just as scripture states if a man doesnt stay repentant and his heart is hardened by the deceitfulness of sin, he can fall away from the faith . We must always be on guard.
---JackB on 3/3/12


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Last time Im going to say it MarkV. I really hope you hear me this time. Please read closely.

The Spirit draws us to Christ otherwise we would be totally blind to that truth. That is scriptural. So you are partially right. HOWEVER, scripture also says that we can harden ourselves to the Spirit! It even says it is possible to fall under deception and teach heresies that deny the same Lord Jesus Christ who bought us! The Holy Spirit himself used Paul to write those warnings to us. I dont care who says we cannot resist Gods will, when the Spirit himself says that we can. That alone should be proof enough for you that God doesn not FORCE belief upon anyone. The Lord knocks just as he says he does.
---JackB on 3/3/12


"But if you are wrong....wow. How will you explain yourself to your Savior when he asks why you turned hundreds away from him?" JackB

There, that's the problem with your theology. How can a man "turned hundreds away from him"? Is it the "power of man to turn a sinner to Christ or turn them away from Christ"? You seek glory for yourself and take the credit for something the dead sinner has no power in.

When are you ever going to learn that salvation is the power of God and nothing to do with the man. " for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth".

So, where's your "precious free-will"?
---christan on 3/3/12


Jack B, the lost cannot get more lost then they are. They need the Truth. Just like most of you. You hear, but don't believe. Let me help you with the Word Of John first, then the Word of Jesus whom you should believe, John 3:27:

"John answered and said,'A man can receive nothing unless it has been given to him from heaven" Simple,

"But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep" You have to be one of His sheep to believe.
"My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never parish, neighter shall anyone snatch them out of My hand"
You cannot hear what Jesus is saying, why? because you do not believe.
---Mark_V. on 3/3/12


Hebrews 6:6 If they shall FALL AWAY, to renew them again unto repentance, seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. ---francis on 3/3/12

that is good scripture. not only the posers but the ones who have tasted...the parable of the seed and sower.
---aka on 3/3/12


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Jack B 2: You also said,

"If I am wrong, who is it harming? Noone! I cant change "fate". Everyone who was supposed to be saved, WILL be saved."

If you are wrong, and you are, since Jesus says you are, you are not saved because you have believed another gospel. And your fate has been sealed. And everyone who is suppose to be saved will be saved.
So you then say,

"But if you are wrong....wow. How will you explain yourself to your Savior when he asks why you turned hundreds away from him?"

No need to explain anything. Those lost cannot be turned. They are turned already. No violence is done to them that the curse of Adam has not done already.
---Mark_V. on 3/3/12


MarkV, I'm not concerned about me. My thoughts are for the lost that you turn away with your perverse doctrine. It is for them that I fight because Christ died for them also.

By spreading the lie of "Limited Atonement", you are planting seeds of doubt in the minds of those who are being led by the Spirit to Jesus Christ, and in doing so, brother, you are fighting against the very Lord who bought you! (2 Peter 2:21)

Lets think hypothetically for a moment:

If I am wrong, who is it harming? Noone! I cant change "fate". Everyone who was supposed to be saved, WILL be saved.

But if you are wrong....wow. How will you explain yourself to your Savior when he asks why you turned hundreds away from him?
---JackB on 3/3/12


//It's simply IMPOSSIBLE and blasphemous to even suggest that one who's born of the Spirit can still reject Christ//

Hebrews 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once ENLIGHTENED, and have TASTED OF THE HEAVENLY GIFT, and were made PARTAKERS OF THE HOLY GHOST,

Hebrews 6:5 And have TASTED THE GOOD WORD of God, and the powers of the world to come,

Hebrews 6:6 If they shall FALL AWAY, to renew them again unto repentance, seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
---francis on 3/3/12


//It's simply IMPOSSIBLE and blasphemous to even suggest that one who's born of the Spirit can still reject Christ//

i agree with this. there are many who consider themselves "spirit-filled" who are not. therefore, those "spirit-filled", who practice forms of Godliness, can later outwardly reject the true christ or even more tragic are those who profess christ but don't really know him.
---aka on 3/2/12


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//You speak of free will, and man's right to come to Christ//

how many times do i have to say that i do not believe in free will? i believe in God's will. 2Co_11:4 if someone comes and proclaims another Jesus than the one we proclaimed, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or if you accept a different gospel from the one you accepted...

//If He did write them down, why would He take them off because of what man does? Did He make a mistake? //

Exo 32:33 And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

Rev 3:5 The one who overcomes...And I will not blot out his name out of the Book of Life...

all i know is what scripture does say.
---aka on 3/2/12


Jack b, somehow you have this corrupt understanding that we are here to argue with you and others, but that is so far from the Truth. We are here as Jesus commanded believers, to bring the Truth to others. Even if you don't agree with the Word of God we give you, God has a purpose for it to someone else whom God has opened their hearts. This is not about you or me. It's about God. Are you that corrupt, you cannot even understand that the Word of God is what is important.
You are so deep in your own self, you cannot see outside of you. I know, we are all sinners, but we should have understanding, you show none. In your mind it is all about how you are treated and what you are told. Stop thinking of yourself and think how you can serve God.
---Mark_V. on 3/2/12


"There you go judging people again when they disagree with you. You and Mark have a serious weakness for that." JackB

Guess both you and CraigA are guiltless of what you accuse others of doing and making yourselves out to be victims "of truth", right? Poor you.

CraigA, what Hebrews 6:4-6 simply means is that if you do fall away, it's not because you choose to but because you were never to begin with, born of the Holy Spirit. The "falling away from the faith" is simply you were never in the covenant of grace. Meaning, never were elected by God's sovereign grace and never "received His gift of faith".

Try looking at yourself first before you call someone else "stubborn".
---christan on 3/2/12


christan* "All that the Father giveth me shall come to me, and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out."

Yes, Jesus will not cast you out, but you can walk away:

"After this many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him." (JHN 6:67)


christan* "But we can walk away form his hand" is a sure sign that you were never even converted by the Holy Spirit. It's simply IMPOSSIBLE and blasphemous to even suggest that one who's born of the Spirit can still reject Christ!

The podigal son was in the Father(God)'s hand and ask to leave.


"Because this my son was dead , and is come to life again : was lost, and is found"(LK 15:34)
---Ruben on 3/2/12


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\\Cluny, spend more time reading the Scriptures is my advise to you......\\

Apparently, you don't know the meaning of the word "scripture", which means "written."

Nothing had been written by the time of Genesis 3.

Try again.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/2/12


There is a Major school of Christian thought that JESUS could not have sinned. Since GOD is impecable as well as Mary so must JESUS. So in reality he was not tempted as we are since he could not give in to temptation.

I actually think JESUS faced more temptations then us. I have never been tempted to turn stones into bread.
---Samuel on 3/2/12


Darlene1, in 2 Peter 3:9, the "all" or "everyone" that's mentioned does not imply the "whole of mankind". Here's why:

Jesus declared, "All that the Father giveth me shall come to me, and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out." John 6:37. Christ did not say, "all that chooses me", world of difference.

There are many false teachings using 2 Peter 3:9 the same way they use John 3:16 and verses that contains "all, everyone" to mean that man has the "free-will" to go to Christ. It's erroneous and it's from their father the devil. They are saying God did not elect when He clearly declared He did, calling Him a liar.
---christan on 3/2/12


Christan, Im sorry but you have horrible reading comprehension skills. Either that or you are simply stubborn.

What is IMPOSSIBLE is for them to RENEW themselves to repentance and become a believer again.

That is why Paul warns believers so much about falling away from the faith! You have to be wiser than what you appear.
---CraigA on 3/2/12


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There you go judging people again when they disagree with you. You and Mark have a serious weakness for that. I think as Craig says its a problem with reading comprehension for which Im sure the Lord does not fault you. Is English your second language? I dont mean that in an insulting way.
---JackB on 3/2/12


Cluny, spend more time reading the Scriptures is my advise to you.

GOD: "But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."

EVE: "And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die."

Was what Eve said the same as God to Adam? And guess where Adam was? "and gave also unto her husband with her, and he did eat." Next to the wife!
---christan on 3/2/12


Nana, you're as ignorant as some here. DO NOT even compare Jesus Christ temptation with Satan to that of the man at Eden that's made of dust. Jesus Christ is the Word that became flesh. Jesus is God! He was never going to fail the temptation.

Or do you not even understand the difference,"And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul, the last Adam was made a quickening Spirit." 1 Corinthians 15:45

Obviously you're a self-confessed work monger when you mentioned laziness and comparing it with being born of the Spirit. Laziness is an attribute of the fallen nature of man. Even Christians can be lazy but it has nothing to do with salvation by grace.
---christan on 3/2/12


Christan, you very true what you said. It's impossible to be born of the Spirit and reject Christ. For it is the Spirit who testifies of Christ to our hearts. Many do believe they are save and later reject Christ. It's because they were never born of the Spirit. If they were, the Spirit would be guiding them to all truth. If they are not guided, they are not born again, very simple. There is many who believe that salvation comes by their own works, (RCC, Islam, J. Witnesses, Mormons, Buddism) and so believe they are saved, but no fruit of the Spirit is found in them. Those who fall away could not possibly have the Spirit of Christ in them. "...Indeed, he will be made to stand, for God is able to make him stand" ( Romans 14:4 ).
---Mark_V. on 3/2/12


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Mark V, 2 Peter 3:9 I went back and read this all again and this is what I found. Peter is explaining to the friends or brothers in Christ(church) why Christ hasn't returned. There are two groups being talked about in the whole thing,the unsaved in 3:9 and the saved further on in verses 14-17. It is saying God is longsuffering and tries to wait longer so more of the lost can come to God and be saved in 9,saying he wants everyone to come to repentence. The verses 14-17 at the end are a warning to those already saved to stay steadfast and not fall away. God Bless
---Darlene_1 on 3/2/12


"It's simply IMPOSSIBLE and blasphemous to even suggest that one who's born of the Spirit can still reject Christ!"
christan on 3/1/12

Even Christ was tempted to reject the Father. Satan desired to shake Peter's faith. Jesus said,
Mark 13:37 "And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch."

Luke 12:37 "Blessed are those servants, whom the lord when he cometh shall find watching: verily I say unto you, that he shall gird himself, and make them to sit down to meat, and will come forth and serve them."

It is not impossible to be a lazy bones who guess what, would get NO BLESSING, regardless of your entitlement theories!

Blasphemy is saying that God said, when God did not say...
---Nana on 3/1/12


\\Adam did that to Eve and she to the serpent when God came calling.
---christan on 3/1/12\\

christan, what Scriptures did Adam and Eve quote?

Please be specific.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/2/12


JackB, say what? Do you even understand Hebrews 6:4-6 and what it means? Obviously not. The writer of Hebrews states,

"For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened", the word here is "IMPOSSIBLE"! Just as Christ also told His disciples about salvation, "With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."

What's in the word "IMPOSSIBLE" that you cannot understand? Oh ya, forgot that if you're not born of the Spirit, it's indeed IMPOSSIBLE to believe His Word, let alone understand. Sorry, my mistake.
---christan on 3/2/12


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It's simply IMPOSSIBLE and blasphemous to even suggest that one who's born of the Spirit can still reject Christ!
---


Wrong!

"It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace"

It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them.
---JackB on 3/1/12


Ruben, you can twist and turn the words of the scripture all you want with tenses but "Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his." 2 Timothy 2:19. That is, what's more important is has God chosen and given you to Christ? The blessed assurance is, "All that the Father giveth me shall come to me, and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out."

"But we can walk away form his hand" is a sure sign that you were never even converted by the Holy Spirit. In short, your "confession of faith" was purely false. It's simply IMPOSSIBLE and blasphemous to even suggest that one who's born of the Spirit can still reject Christ!
---christan on 3/1/12


christan* "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him:

Jesus explicitly also said "and the one who comes "v 37 and they are they who the Father 'draws'

christan* "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

It does not say 'My sheep 'HEARD' my voice, and I 'KNEW' them, and they 'FOLLOWED' me.We must continue to Hear, continue to know and continue to follow him.


christan* neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand." John 6:44, 10:27,28

But we can walk away form his hand. "Jesus continued: The younger one said to his father, Father,(God) give me my share of the estate....set off for a distant country " (lk 15:12-13)
---Ruben on 3/1/12


"it's not what i said. it's what the scripture says"

Jesus explicitly declared, "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day." and "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand." John 6:44, 10:27,28

Scripture confirms Scripture. The conclusion is your understanding of Scripture is simply erroneous. And don't think you can get away with simply pointing your finger saying "it's what the Scripture says". Adam did that to Eve and she to the serpent when God came calling.
---christan on 3/1/12


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Aka, ok, I will try to have a godly discussion with you. You speak of free will, and man's right to come to Christ or not, yet you say'
" God leads us to His Son, and we only have one teacher" the statement is true, doesn't that mean God must have not lead many to Christ? because many are going to hell.
Second,
You say the names are already written in the book of life. Implying God wrote them. If He did write them down, why would He take them off because of what man does? Did He make a mistake? Did He not know what you were going to do? Who is this god you are talking about? The One from Scripture is Omniscient, knows all things, and never makes mistakes. You imply He changes His mind after He finds out what you did.
---Mark_V. on 3/1/12


//What you are saying, God can still take the names out of the Book of Life if someone does not fulfill "the conditions", right?//

it's not what i said. it's what the scripture says:

Exo 32:33 And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

Rev 3:5 The one who overcomes, this one will be clothed in white clothing. And I will not blot out his name out of the Book of Life, but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.
---aka on 2/29/12


//Nothing I answer will change your mind or your heart.// markv

you are right in saying this.

according to calvinism, there is nothing that you can say that can change any man's heart. are your words mightier than the Lords?

according to scripture, God leads us to His Son, and we only have one teacher. its serves us well to learn our place.
---aka on 2/29/12


Aka, you claim to believe in predestination? If "every name is already in the Book of Life" then they should all be going to heaven. What you are saying, God can still take the names out of the Book of Life if someone does not fulfill "the conditions", right?

If that's the case, then the whole Book of Life will be an empty Book by the time Christ comes. That's because "all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God". What an absurd and erroneous understanding of "predestination".

"All that the Father giveth me shall come to me, and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out." The ALL here are already in the Book of Life never to be taken out.
---christan on 2/29/12


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//And I sure don't want to cause you to sin by answering me in the flesh. // markv

that is soooo ironic, but really isn't this a convenient time not to be in defense of the gospel, which you have so boldly claimed in the past.
---aka on 2/29/12


christan, see. perfect example. instead of reading what an individual says... if you don't agree with _______, you must agree with ________.

i already said that i believe in predestination AND God's will ... not calvinism OR "free-will". the scriptures clearly show that every name is already in the Book of life to be blotted out. THEN, there are conditions to be blotted out...IF.

another assumption...i can't overcome anything under my own power especially sin. but, the scripture does not say overcome sin. he did that for us. it says overcome darkness, the evil one (evil), the world, which he will also do for us if we accept as you once did before you knew.
---aka on 2/29/12


MarkV thank you for answering me,and your kind words and yes I love you and its a blessing you love me,and most important we care about each other as family,real brother and sister and with that comes respect. No matter what differance of opinion that should never affect our caring for each other or others as God wants us to. God Bless
---Darlene_1 on 2/29/12


aka, what's very true is that God's tolerance to sin is 0% or why else did His Son have to die for the sins of His people?

You have no idea of what the fall of Adam really did to his posterity (which includes you and I). And you think that your name is in the Book of Life is because you have stopped sinning? Or why else do you use Exodus 32:33 and Revelation 3:5 for? To show that you have the "ability" to "overcome sinning against God by your own free-will", right?

"If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us."
---christan on 2/29/12


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Aka, you can be assure I will not go crazy on you. I will leave you alone. Nothing I answer will change your mind or your heart. And I sure don't want to cause you to sin by answering me in the flesh. People here get angry and hateful, athiest is more respectable then most Christians who answer. I answered Darline because she is very respectful and loves me, and I love her very much. I want to keep respecting you. Peace I leave you.
---Mark_V. on 2/29/12


markv,

without going crazy on me:

Exo 32:33 And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

Rev 3:5 The one who overcomes, this one will be clothed in white clothing. And I will not blot out his name out of the Book of Life, but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.

IOW, The one who does not overcome, this one will not be clothed in white clothing. And I will blot out his name out of the Book of Life, and I will not confess his name before My Father and before His angels.

it seems to me that everyone is in the book of life, and he that does not overcome gets scratched out.
---aka on 2/28/12


Darline, from blog "Important to obey God'.
The passage you gave in ( 2 Peter 3:9) is not talking about God been patient to save everyone. It is referring to the beloved, the "us" or the "any" or "the Elect". All the elect are born under the curse. Longsuffering toward "us." and those who will come to Christ. The any refers to those whom the Lord has chosen and will call to complete the redeemed, the "us."
Since the passage is about God's destroying the wicked. His patience is not so He can save all of them, but so that He can receive all His own. He can't be waiting for everyone to be saved, since the emphasis is that He will destroy the world and the ungodly.
---Mark_V. on 2/28/12


I am led to answer Atheist's questions from the "Can We Stone Kids Today" blog. His questions are in Italics
"Is this Christian Law. Deuteronomy 21:18-21: yes or no." No.
"All, Actually I am just trying to get clarification on what you all believe to be law for Christians." The law of the Spirit of life in Christ jesus.
How do you decided what parts of the Bible, if it is the word of god, is what you believe and follow? Follow Christ. Mat. 22:37-40>1 John 3:14
The question is really simple, what law are Christians supposed to follow? The law of faith.
What parts can now be discarded? The parts that advocate the Law of works.
---joseph on 2/28/12


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Chria, thank you, a great answer. The number of them is already known by God, and cannot change. What I believe happens is that people fail to see from God's perspective. They see things from man's perspective and time. As if God was learning something new each day someone commits to Christ. The passages where Peter is talking to believers speak of this,
" The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us (the beloved) not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance" 2 Peter 3:9).
The "any" must refer to those whom the Lord has chosen and will call to complete the redeemed. Since the whole passage is about God's destroying the wicked.
---Mark_V. on 2/28/12


The whole discussion on the plurality or singular meaning of Elohim is really taking the discretion of the translator as "inspired" because Elohim and Adoni are both "substitutes for YHWH which in no way is "plural"!
Remember superstition caused the scribes to substitute LORD and Lord for YHWH!
---1st_cliff on 2/28/12


hello'Family! this ELENA just try'n text & say the Lord is good! I have trouble get my one good eye focus! so,that why you don't see me often like youused to the Lord ha!ha! keepin' me so,we goin' have trials & tribulations!love you all today a good day! don't go much cuz I am can't see people faces n' they get mad..don't believe me can't see..
---ELENA on 2/28/12


"Chria, was it you who answered all of the blogs that had Char on them?" No Mark
"I want to make sure what answers and to whom I am answering to if possible." Same here, and thats why I started the post, to clarify/avoid confusion. Only this is mine:

"char, if i may add something. Those chosen have been chosen already by God, already known by Him. The full number.From God's perspective, complete. However, in time as we know it,...it is until the number of their fellow servants and brothers has been completed.
---char on 2/26/12"
---chria9396 on 2/27/12


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Each has a gift, a talent, a word, all are not a foot or hand Encourage one another daily. put on love, which is the bond of perfection. And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to which also you were called in one body, and be thankful. Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom, teaching and admonishing one another...with grace in your hearts to the Lord. And whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through Him.
---chria9396 on 2/27/12


//There are multitudes who know many languages. So what? The question really is, are you "born of the Spirit"?// christan

my point was not how many languages somebody knows, it is what they get out of everything the Lord has to offer while in pursuit of the Lord. the scripture you used strengthens char's encouragement. "For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God."

i think the original written language of the root of David qualifies as a deeper thing of God.

thanks for your encouragement, char. i have read your responses long enough to know they are from the heart and you do not think that you are something that others are not for any reason.
---aka on 2/27/12


"But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God." 1 Corinthians 2:10,11

There are multitudes who know many languages. So what? The question really is, are you "born of the Spirit"?

"But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." verse 14
---christan on 2/27/12


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