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What Is a Catholic Christian

How can a person who calls themselves a Catholic Christian take communion yet doesn't know one scripture, doesn't obey scripture at all, says God doesn't talk to her, and still believe they're going to heaven?

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 ---anon on 2/28/12
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Warwick, if you don't believe that the bread and wine become the Body and Blood of Christ, you are in NO position to call ANYONE a "biblio-sceptic ."

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/8/12


The Christian Church Is Acts 2 v 38.

For christian Is the Man - made relig - org's churches.
---Lawrence on 3/8/12


StrongAxe, you do not need to explain what you have said or not intended to have said. What really matters is, you have said it and you were direct with the "Jonestown and Waco" reference. It doesn't really matter to me of what you think or say. Everyone of us is accountable to Jesus when He comes.

"But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment." Matthew 12:36

I am not accountable to anyone but Jesus Christ, who's my Lord and Saviour. Yes, I am a member of His body by the grace of God.
---christan on 3/8/12


Cluny 2: of most who answer for Catholics your one of the wise's. Since your wise, think why the road to destruction wide? In history, all Catholics, E. Orthodox, and almost all protestants who believe in salvation by their own free will as Catholics, E. orthodox, mormons, Islam, J. witnesses, and only a few in history believe in the Sovereignty of God, that God saves whom He will and has mercy on whom He will have mercy on. His own elect. Now do you understand why "..wide is the gate and broard is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it?"

A remnant of true believers dared to come out to perserve and propagate "the faith which was once delivered unto the saints" (Jude 3).
---Mark_V. on 3/8/12


Cluny, you are right most protestants are close to the Catholics in their believes, I'm sorry to say that, most have gone back to salvation by works as the Catholic teach. A lot of selfrighteous works to gain eternal life. My debates with most Christians who are not Catholic is because they believe they can save themselves by their own free will, just like the Catholics, mormons, Jehovah Witnesses, Islam. True Christianity is not by works, but by the grace of God through faith. And many have never known why they abandone the RCC. And you do speak for the Catholics even though you say you are not. And there is not much difference between the E. Orthodox and Catholics
---Mark_V. on 3/7/12




kathleen//All Catholics are Christians, all Christians are not Catholics

It is obvious that not all Catholics (Romans) are Christians since Scripture is very plain that Christians are really those in whom the Spirit of God dwells.

Romans 8:9 (Jerusalem Bible) In fact unless you possess the Spirit of God you would not belong to Him.

And no man has the power to impart God's Spirit to anyone as the Spirit will only indwell those whom God has called unto salvation.

And we can also argue that the Roman Church has much the same roots as most Biblical oriented non-Catholics, that the Roman Church became simply another denomination during the Reformation.
---lee1538 on 3/7/12


christan:

I mentioned Jonestown and Waco, because those are cautionary tales of people who are NOT part of any accountable body, but are accountable only to themselves.

I did not say YOU were like that. I just said people who reject all organized churches (and instead rely on "personal divine inspiration") are prone to these kinds of errors.

However, if you are a member of a church, and accountable to it, I would be curious just which one, so I would have an idea of just what it is you believe (since it's easier to do a web search than to try to get everything through a 150-word-wide straw).
---StrongAxe on 3/7/12


All Catholics are Christians, all Christians are not Catholics. It is truly sad no one responding to this blog has a clue about Catholicism. Ignorance is not Christ like, to learn your history you all would cease to be protestant, and most have no idea what you're protesting, and are regularly fed hate against your own brothers and sisters in Christ. My prayers are with you all, Pax Tecum.
---kathleen on 3/7/12


Actually, you are much closer to Roman Catholicism than you realize (as most Protesants are).

Roman Catholics believe in an infallible Pope.

You believe in your infallible self.


---Cluny on 3/7/12

And one of the two has the back-up of Jesus himself.:)
---Ruben on 3/7/12


Make that:

Are you telling us that you think you are going to HEAVEN on the basis of the doctrines that YOU believe?
---Cluny on 3/7/12




\\Are you telling me the Pope, Billy Graham, Jacobus Arminius, etc to name a few are all going to heaven from the doctrines they preach? \\

Are you telling us that you are going to church on the basis of the doctrines that YOU believe?

I don't see a difference.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/7/12


\\Cluny, you were ready to jump in for the Catholics, then made a U-Turn and said you were not Catholic\\

I have NEVER said I was Roman Catholic, but have REPEATEDLY from the beginning said I was Orthodox.

And if you think there is no difference between Roman Catholicism and Orthodoxy, you know nothing about either.

Actually, you are much closer to Roman Catholicism than you realize (as most Protesants are).

Roman Catholics believe in an infallible Pope.

You believe in your infallible self.

\\What's important is I believe "when He, the Spirit of truth, is come, He will guide you into all truth",\\

You don't really think you've been led into truth, do you?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/7/12


"Since you believe differently, what kind of church do YOU go to? Where do YOU eat?"

Just as I have no interest in which "church" you attend, it's also of no interest to you which worship I go to since you relate my believe to that of "Jonestown and Waco". But sorry, I am not given cyanide or a gun to carry in case people like you come calling.

Are you telling me the Pope, Billy Graham, Jacobus Arminius, etc to name a few are all going to heaven from the doctrines they preach? According to Scriptures, I say No they are not. There's a reason Christ says "for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat"
---christan on 3/6/12


christan:

You said: Who really cares what church you and StrongAxe go to? What's more important is what you and StrongAxe profess to believe in, which is most definitely not what I believe in. Your doctrines tells a lot about what kind of church you go for your "spiritual feeding" and vice-versa for me. We are what we eat.

Since you believe differently, what kind of church do YOU go to? Where do YOU eat?

Or do you, like some others, learn religion "straight from God" without human oversight and accountability?

The world is full of Christian leaders who have better insight into God's truth than 2000 years of Christian tradition. We have seen extreme examples of this in Jonestown and Waco.
---StrongAxe on 3/6/12


"please tell us what church StrongAxe goes to. If you cannot, then there's no way you could know it's not the same as yours, is there?"

Who really cares what church you and StrongAxe go to? What's more important is what you and StrongAxe profess to believe in, which is most definitely not what I believe in. Your doctrines tells a lot about what kind of church you go for your "spiritual feeding" and vice-versa for me. We are what we eat.

What's important is I believe "when He, the Spirit of truth, is come, He will guide you into all truth", that is my guidance and conviction comes only through the wonderful grace of God through His precious gift of faith in Jesus Christ and nothing else.
---christan on 3/6/12


Cluny, you were ready to jump in for the Catholics, then made a U-Turn and said you were not Catholic. But you tell me what is the difference between your denomination and the Catholics? other then a very few things. You still kneel down and worship idols, and ask them for miracles, you still eat Christ. You are still born again by water. Your leaders consecrate the water and wine, make it holy, where anyone can drink or be washed and be indwell by the Spirit of God. No need for the Spirit to bring life, all man has to do is get baptized, or eat Christ. What you guys don't have is a pope and they do. The head of the Church. Infallible. Talk about replacing Christ who is the Head of the Church who is the only Person without sin whoever lived.
---Mark_V. on 3/6/12


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\\"What kind of church do YOU go to?"

Most definitely not the same as yours.\\

christan, please tell us what church StrongAxe goes to.

If you cannot, then there's no way you could know it's not the same as yours, is there?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/5/12


\\I cannot speak for the UK, England, Africa or even Italy or Russia. \\

Then don't, because that's EXACTLY what you seem to be doing.

BTW, the majority of the Christians in Russia are Orthodox, NOT Roman Catholic.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/5/12


christan:

I was not speaking of the theoretical "true church". I was speaking specifically of the "Catholic church" that you yourself referred to. Please do not mix apples an oranges.

But since you disavow both Catholic and Protestant churches, I am curious to which church you belong, and from whence do you receive your Christian teachings and traditions?
---StrongAxe on 3/5/12


Cluny, I'm hispanic, I can only speak for them. I know Texas has great majority of hispanics, they are called Tejanos. Most are Catholic. Most everyone in Mexico is Catholic, and most of the Americas are Hispanic Catholics. I cannot speak for the UK, England, Africa or even Italy or Russia. Never been there.
Look Cluny, I hope you don't get down on your knees and worship idols and ask them for prayers. I hope you are a person who believes in the Lord Jesus Christ and love Him with all your heart, and that your dependence is on Him and Him alone, if you do, that is just so awesome. Peace I leave you.
---Mark_V. on 3/5/12


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"They couldn't, as the Catholic church did not yet exist."

StrongAxe, if you're a true Christian, you would know that the "church" existed from eternity with God. The "church" consist of the saints, ie, Abel, Noah, Abraham, Moses etc. It is most definitely NOT the Roman Catholic Church and not the Protestant.

"What kind of church do YOU go to?"

Most definitely not the same as yours. And thank God for that. He indeed is merciful and gracious to my soul, to spare from the kind of doctrines you have been receiving.
---christan on 3/4/12


And Ruben would also find that the early church fathers did not recognize Peter as being the head of the church. If they had then, they would have mentioned it in their writings and even referred tough decisions to him but they did not.


---lee1538 on 3/3/12


Then give names from the 1st till the 5th that did not mention Peter as the head of the church by Jesus. Besides scripture tell us Jesus gave Peter and him only the keys of the kingdom and call his church rock of Peter.Mt 16:16-19...
---Ruben on 3/4/12


\\No, Texas is filled with hispanics, Mexico all 100% hispanics, Central America, South America the same.\\

Mark V, is it Catholics that you are condemning--or hispanics?

Or are you using the two as synonyms? Have you conflated the two?

Be assured the two words are not.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/4/12


christan:

Of course they didn't. They couldn't, as the Catholic church did not yet exist. They didn't teach us to look to the protestant church either.

What kind of church do YOU go to? I can bet that whatever denomination it is, Jesus and the apostles didn't mention that one either.
---StrongAxe on 3/4/12


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Ruben, as I told you before, I do love you, and all my Catholic friends in Texas and wherever they are. In making my statements of what I know concerning the RCC history, it's not my intention to make people anti-Catholic, but pro-Christ. Our allegiance must never be to the church, Catholic or otherwise, but to the crucified Christ. The gospel that frees us cannot be contained within a legalistic religious system such as the Roman Catholic Church. "Why do you need indulgences and purgatory if the gospel alone can save you?"
Those who the Lord calls through the gospel of His Son will see that they cannot remain in a church whose fundamental message of salvation does not harmonize with the message of Christ but undermind it.
---Mark_V. on 3/4/12


"/If you did a little study into the early church fathers of the Catholic church you would find the Truth."

"For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also."

Christ nor the apostles never taught us to look to the "Catholic church you would find the Truth" or as the RCs boldly declares, "Outside the Roman Catholic Church there is no salvation".

Jesus simply declared, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

The Vatican added on to the Words of Christ. "If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book."
---christan on 3/3/12


"Both Martin and John believe Mary had no other children, something you both disagree with!" Ruben

If one can lie about salvation by the "free-will" of man when it's not taught of in the Holy Bible, such remarks like the one above by you would come as no surprise at all. You are only doing what comes naturally when coming to bear false witness of others. Keep up the good work or is it, keep up the evil work?
---christan on 3/3/12


//If you did a little study into the early church fathers of the Catholic church you would find the Truth.

And Ruben would also find that the early church fathers did not recognize Peter as being the head of the church. If they had then, they would have mentioned it in their writings and even referred tough decisions to him but they did not.

What really clinches the argument against the Roman Church is their total inabliltiy to show any indication from history that anything was passed downward to the bishops of Rome to govern other churches. All too often decisions were made at councils.
---lee1538 on 3/3/12


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Ruben, I doubt what you say because your information comes from the RCC. And of course they will not speak of the atrocities they have committed. But defend all that they teach and what they have done through the centuries. Why would they give you the real Truth? I have gotten into their website, they have answers for every violation of God's Word, even their idol worship. If you did a little study into the early church fathers of the Catholic church you would find the Truth. Most of the traditions were taken from the pagans and heathens in order to convert them, so they would not feel out of place on what they were use to. You did not have to be born again to convert. you belonged to the RCC and you were saved by the Church.
---Mark_V. on 3/3/12


StrongAxe, mixing with many creationists, scientists and lay, I do not know of one who doubts that speciation occurs.
---Warwick on 3/2/12


christan* MarkV, do be reminded that John Calvin, Martin Luther and many others left the RC faith.

And Martin Luther in his dead bed said ' what a monster I created', speaking about his invention of Bible Alone!

christan* They did not hang around and die in that faith.

May God have mercy on their souls.

christan* He took them out and so will He take you out if you belong to Him, in His gracious time.

Both Martin and John believe Mary had no other children, something you both disagree with!
---Ruben on 3/2/12


Brandon 2: I am speaking with respect. You say,

"Yes, I know about the excesses of the Hispanics--but they are a minority, are they not?"

No, Texas is filled with hispanics, Mexico all 100% hispanics, Central America, South America the same. They are mostly Catholics. Have you been to San Juan de los laos? Or to Our Lady of Guadalupe in Mexico? Or to the shrine of San Juan in San Juan Texas? I bet you haven't. People are on their knees begging for favors from the saints. Many even kissing the feet of the Statues. In San Juan, no one lights a candle for Jesus. He has been forgotten, replaced by Mary and the saints. This is Truth, if you don't see it, you are blind, if you do see it, don't purposely hide it.
---Mark_V. on 3/2/12


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Heard of this book called "Far from Rome, near to God"? Maybe you Romish followers should get a copy and read the numerous testimonies by ex-Romish disciples or as they call them in the Vatican, priests.
---christan on 3/2/12


\\Not "orthodox" nor Roman Catholic nor Protestant nor Methodist not Presbyterian nor Baptist nor Calvinist nor all the denominations you can come up with.\\

Arius, Joseph Smith, Charles Taze Russell, Victor Wierville, and Mary Baker Eddy all claimed to be "just Christians," too.

So what?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/2/12


Cluny:

Why do you say Protestantism "denies the power"? Or, to compare apples to apples, what specific kind of power do Catholic and Orthodox churches affirm that Protestant churches deny?

From what I understand, the fundamental difference beteween Protestantism and Catholicism is denying the authority of Rome, not the power of God.
---StrongAxe on 3/2/12


"Obey those who rule over you," we have in Hebrew 13:17. And a man qualified to "take care of the church of God" is described in 1 Timothy 3:1-10. This is a man who has been proven in his own home, first, so we know he is qualified just to be considered for ordination. So, he is a family man who has learned how to do well in marriage with his wife and how to bring up his children right. And now he can be trusted to care for God's people in our Father's family sharing way, like he has learned at home, helped by his helpmate to learn this (c: Something else is falsely "Catholic", not the obedient church's way of doing things.
---Bill_willa6989 on 3/2/12


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Lots of name calling by both sides.

The other day a boy asked me if Roman Cathoics were Christians. I said yes. Now I know the RCC has many unchristian practices. But a Christian is a person who follows JESUS. I have never read in the Bible that being mistaken in belief caused a person to not be a Christian.

It is practice of love or lack of love toward others that labels a person a christian or not.

I am a Christian a Menber of the Seventh day Adventist church not the other way around. Church membership does not define who is a Christian. Their heart does. Only GOD knows the heart.
---Samuel on 3/2/12


"Nor is there anything Christian about Protestantism in any form."

So, finally the truth is out. Though you claim to be an "orthodox", you're a Vatican/Romish sympathizer. And who's a Protestant? If you're "subtly" calling me a Prostestant, I have bad news for you.

I AM A CHRISTIAN.
Get it?
C-H-R-I-S-T-I-A-N
CHRISTIAN.


Not "orthodox" nor Roman Catholic nor Protestant nor Methodist not Presbyterian nor Baptist nor Calvinist nor all the denominations you can come up with.

SIMPLY A CHRISTIAN!
---christan on 3/2/12


Brandon, I will not call you father for there is only one Father in heaven. And you are not my physical father.
Second, I'm not angry at all at Catholics. Most of my friends in Texas are Catholics. You just don't get it either because you are a Catholic and a father and the Pope is the head of the church (Jesus is the Head of the Church, but what we write as former Catholics is true. There is no need to hide the facts in order to keep the peace. The Truth has been lost in the RCC. Have you been to the shrine of our Lady of Guadalupe in Mexico? Or our Lady of San Juan, in San Juan Texas? I have many times. All you see is worship of idols prayers towards the saints. No prayers to Christ. The Truth hurts many times, but it is Truth.
---Mark_V. on 3/2/12


\\Let an ex-cradle RC of 43 years declare: there's nothing Christian about the Vatican practices, period. \\

Nor is there anything Christian about Protestantism in any form.

As the Bible says, it has a form of godliness but denies the power.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/2/12


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Now, let's get to the real question: Why are you so angry at the Catholics?--Fatherbrendan

Ive been wondering this for 2 years now and Im not even Catholic. You can sense the bitterness.
---JackB on 3/1/12


Mark V said
The only missals Catholics know about are the ones that get you sick. Don't you understand? If they don't know Scripture why would they know what a Missal is?

Huh? Forgive me, but as a Born-Again, Baptized in the Holy Ghost cradle Catholic, I knew what a missal was, and it did not make me sick. I got one at my First Holy Communion, and it was dear to me.

Now, let's get to the real question: Why are you so angry at the Catholics? Yes, I know about the excesses of the Hispanics--but they are a minority, are they not? The Holy Church that I grew up in has steadily maintained that worship is only to be given to God. Mary and the Saints are venerated, but not worshipped--despite what you have seen in Texas and Mexico.
---FatherBrendan on 3/1/12


Let an ex-cradle RC of 43 years declare: there's nothing Christian about the Vatican practices, period. Scripture declares, "Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain, for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain." The Vatican excelled in this.

I was truly "blinded" for 43 years to not see this until the Lord mercifully and graciously "opened" my heart to the understanding of His Truth.

MarkV, do be reminded that John Calvin, Martin Luther and many others left the RC faith. They did not hang around and die in that faith. God never left Israel in Egypt to worship Him. He took them out and so will He take you out if you belong to Him, in His gracious time.
---christan on 3/1/12


MarkV, don't you believe YOUR church to be right?

If not, why bother about going?

In the Baptist Church I was raised, two leading (not marginal) members and big contributors were caught in financial and professional scandals involving quickie divorces and embezzlement.

At choir camp, the boys would meet together (usually before evening devotions and Bible reading) to swap stories of sexual prowess.

In the last Baptist church I was associated with the minister of music had a taste for teenage boys and the pastor was an adulterer.

If all Roman Catholics are as you described, then all Baptist are as I described.

Glory to Jesus Christ Who saved and delivered me from such immorality!
---Cluny on 3/1/12


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Cluny, I reveal my sins to everyone who is interested in hearing about them. "confess your sins one to another" and I repent for them too. God can reveal my sins to everyone too and I would agree with Him.

King David said when he hid his sins, his bones wasted away. Why hide them? Tell others so that you can get free from them.

Cluny, do you know this person's name that I mentioned her sins? Do you know where she lives? What state does she live in? Do you know her date of birth? My point is you know NOTHING about her so how could she be embarrassed.

Why don't you try explaining to us on this board WHY TAKING COMMUNION CAN BE SUCH A DANGEROUS THING WHEN YOU'RE IN KNOWN SIN? Give us your theological answer.
---anon on 3/1/12


Cluny, you don't get it. They depend on the Church to be right, they don't have to proof anything or read anything or listen to anyone. Just about every Catholic I know when growing up, unless he was an alter boy, knew anything about missal's. Why should anyone care? They are depending on the Church. Take a walk in a Catholics shoes one day in Texas or Mexico and you will find what they believe. And let me say it is mixed with paganism and heathenism. Mary in a parade with the bones of the dead. And people whipping themselves in order to gain favor with God.
I bet you have never been to a shrine in Texas or Mexico. People get on their knees, light candles for all idols, while Christ is in a coffin of glass with no one is around Him.
---Mark_V. on 3/1/12


Anon, you explained your blog very well. I now get what you were trying to say. I agree with your answers. Very good points you made. I don't group all Catholics together either, many were great man during the reformation who were not trying to leave the RCC but rather to reform it from it's corrupt state. But most were executed, beheaded, are crucified. Some escaped.
---Mark_V. on 3/1/12


"It's quite possible to be ignorant of much of the Bible and still be saved."

Such an unglorifying and blasphemous statement to make especially when a Christian is supposed to have the Holy Spirit indwelling in him. If a Christian is ignorant, then the Holy Spirit has failed in His mission which Christ promised, "the Spirit of truth, is come, He will guide you into all truth". Which is IMPOSSIBLE!

"For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ." 2 Peter 1:8

Therefore, if you're ignorant, the Holy Spirit is not in you, period.
---christan on 3/1/12


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\\The only missals Catholics know about are the ones that get you sick. \\

Back when I was a little Baptist boy, one of the things kicking around the house was a copy of MY SUNDAY MISSAL, which, among other things, gave the Bible readings (two, at least) for each Sunday, as well as the Psalm verses sung or read at different times during Mass.

Neither of my parents were Roman Catholics, btw.

If I, as a non-Catholic boy, knew what a Missal was and what it contained, why didn't YOU?

In my experience, the only scriptures most evangelicals and pentecostals know are the few their pastors tell them, and none of them are in context.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/1/12


anon, I doubt that your eyes can follow your neighbor into her bedroom, but remember that God's eyes follow you everywhere.

You have chosen to reveal your neighbor's presumed sins on this board, but God may reveal your real sins to all mankind on the Day of Judgement.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/1/12


I am an Eastern Catholic Monk who grew up Roman Catholic. There is no test to receive Communion. You don't have to know scripture. All you have to be is Baptized and in a state of Grace (i.e. no sins on your conscience).
---FatherBrendan on 3/1/12


//YOU disqualified your Catholic friend from going to heaven....Did Jesus disqualify her? Or only anon?
---Cluny on 2/29/12//

Okay I'm going to try and think like you Cluny. You're a very smart man (theologically) so you can read between the lines of my question. I'm really asking, "Can she, will she go to heaven? or should I be witnessing to her and telling her "maybe you shouldn't be taking communion so freely while living in fornication, and not forgiving your friend and should I tell her about the scripture in 1 Corinth about taking communion wrongly? That's what I'm really asking, sorry you couldn't read between the lines of my question.
---anon on 3/1/12


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Cluny:

I grew up Catholic in close-knit Catholic community. I went to Sunday School, and we were taught all kinds of church dogmas, but bible reading, or bible study per se were not part of the curriculum. It's true that scriptures were used here and there to support this and that, but they were never the focus of study.

I noticed something similar with Jehovah's Witnesses. They had "bible studies" but these were more like studying one of their books that taught some particular doctrine with supporting scriptures, rather than studying the scriptures themselves with commentaries.

I cannot speak to church policy - only what I myself observed.
---StrongAxe on 2/29/12


Cluny, you are not a Catholic or a former Catholic, how do you know? You haven't walked in the shoes of one or walked into Catholic churches in Texas or Mexico. You said,
"Did you ever sit down with a Missal?"
The only missals Catholics know about are the ones that get you sick. Don't you understand? If they don't know Scripture why would they know what a Missal is? You just don't get it. There is the Church, there is the priest, there is one pope who we believed was the Christ on earth, the head of the Church, before Christ and after the pope is Mary and the idols, we cannot forget those, in fact Jesus takes a backseat to all of them, most of the prayers go to the idols. That is all most Catholics know about.
---Mark_V. on 3/1/12


\\So I guess YOU disqualified me Cluny from going to heaven, but did Jesus?\\

Well, YOU disqualified your Catholic friend from going to heaven with the words in your opening post, "How can a person who calls themselves a Caholic [and doesn't fulfill my rules] still believe they're going to heaven?"

I see no difference. Did Jesus disqualify her? Or only anon?

**As long as you get that feel good feeling, what else is really needed?
---lee1538 on 2/29/12**

My experience with evangelicals and pentecostals is that all they are looking for is to feel good--and look down on Catholics.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/29/12


\\ You are right though, most Catholics don't ever carry a bible,\\

And until the invention of the printing press, most people didn't have a Bible to carry around. So what?

\\I confessed to the priest only the sins I thought he should know, the others I was ashame to confess. But I was good for the next week.\\

And were you not taught that willingly withholding a sin in confession was a sin in itself and did NOT make you good for the next week, but merely made things worse?

Did you ever sit down with a Missal and see how it quotes verbatim extensively from the Bible, as all the classical pre-Reformation liturgies do?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/29/12


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Anon, I'm sorry for taking your post the way I did. You are right though, most Catholics don't ever carry a bible, and don't know much about it. I am a former Catholic, and when I was growing up, not one of my friends knew anything about Scripture. They just don't care, even now. Most are born Catholic so they know nothing else. We use to make fun of those who carried a Bible, we called them holy rollers. I use to sin all I wanted to, and on Saturday's I confessed and felt great after. I confessed to the priest only the sins I thought he should know, the others I was ashame to confess. But I was good for the next week. That was all there is it. It is a Church where the members have a lot of pride.
---Mark_V. on 2/29/12


//anon, You're not saying that YOU are going to heaven, are you?
---Cluny on 2/28/12//

Oh no Cluny, because all I do is Love the Lord thy God with all of mine heart, mind, soul and body. Believe Jesus is my Lord and Savior. I obey Him at all cost, forgive my enemies, pray for their salvation, I obey the Word at all cost.

I Love Jesus with all of my heart and soul and although I have MANY sins, faults & weaknesses, I believe Jesus died for my sins, shed his blood and then rose again from the grave so that I may be presented Holy & Blameless before God.

So I guess YOU disqualified me Cluny from going to heaven, but did Jesus? Did you Father God? disqualify me? or did Cluny?
---anon on 2/29/12


"For the catholic christian people can smoke, drink & get drunk, kill, curse, etc & the such like."

I am not a Catholic, nor am I defending thier beliefs. But you have people like that in every denomination, not just Catholicism. Half the people you sit in church with are probably like that. It all depends on the individuals level of commitment to serving the Lord.
---Jed on 2/29/12


Cluny //I don't know where you got this statistic, but around half of Evangelical Protestants are remarried divorcees, too, according to many surveys, so they have nothing to brag about.

The stats are available just about anywhere.

Evangelical Christians can continue to go to their church and receive communion, but Roman Catholics cannot as divorce and re-marriage forbids them to do so.

Most ritual based religions such as the Roman or the Eastern hold that ritual is something that makes up for what they have done, but there can be nothing from the heart in such rituals.

Chomp on a bit of bread, rattle a few beads, and you are really to go again! As long as you get that feel good feeling, what else is really needed?
---lee1538 on 2/29/12


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//But to group everyone as lost is not fair Mark_V on 2/29/12//

Mark, please re-read the question. "How can A person," it doesn't say ALL Catholics.

I stated what she does to believe she's going to heaven.

saying: "a person" is not grouping every Catholic together. Thank you for understanding that. (((huggss)))
---anon on 2/29/12


anon:

It's quite possible to be ignorant of much of the Bible and still be saved. Very few people know it ALL. It's also possible to travel to a destination without a map. But it's a lot easier to get lost along the way without a map than with one. It's also a lot easier to get caught up in erroneous and even dangerous beliefs if you don't know how to tell if they are true or not.
---StrongAxe on 2/29/12


\\For the catholic christian people can smoke, drink & get drunk, kill, curse, etc & the such like. Then they go to a cath minister to ask forgiveness & then go do such again - again. \\

Straw man argument.

Aside from the fact that smoking and drinking are not sins in themselves--and don't forget that St Paul and St. Peter weren't above a salty expression themselves--going to confession assumes a "firm purpose of amendment."

Of course, YOU have no sins that you repeat (aka "besetting sins"), do you? You are perfect and above sin, correct?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/29/12


anon, I understand what you are saying concerning communion, not knowing Scripture concerning Catholics. I was one of those. But what Christan wrote is very true. We are called Christians because of who we are in Christ. We are not divided as religions are. We are one body in Christ. The elect come from all corners of the world. They are saved by Grace through faith.
If you want to discuss certain doctrines, then that is different. But to group everyone as lost is not fair to those who are saved already, or who will be saved (the elect). There is many things wrong in many denominations, though the RCC has the biggest history of that.
---Mark_V. on 2/29/12


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anon, there are people whom go to their religions and participate in their ceremonies only because their parents raised them to go through their routines, and many of them are like you say, they do not have any clue of what they are doing, and may be following their religions out of a sense of superstition or rules-keeping. Many give a tithe, a ten percent of money, with the thought I paid my dues I bought my ticket therefore I have bought my place in heaven. And as long as they believe the lie, they are without the truth.
---Eloy on 2/28/12


For the catholic christian people can smoke, drink & get drunk, kill, curse, etc & the such like. Then they go to a cath minister to ask forgiveness & then go do such again - again.
Not man, Only God can forgive sins. They keep on doing such aft they ask God's forgiveness, they'r digging their grave into hell.
---Lawrence on 2/28/12


"Catholic Christian"? Then there should also be "Methodist Christian", "Protestant Christian", "Anglican Christian", "JW Christian", etc, etc., right?

"Is Christ divided?" 1 Corinthians 1:13. According to you guys, it sounds like you're very,very divided.

"And the disciples were first called Christians in Antioch." Acts 11:26. Did Scripture call these "Antioch Christians"?
---christan on 2/28/12


\\Over half of the Roman Church is divorced and remarried but they continue to go to church and take communion.\\

I don't know where you got this statistic, but around half of Evangelical Protestants are remarried divorcees, too, according to many surveys, so they have nothing to brag about.

**Are they REALLY going to heaven?
---anon on 2/28/12**

You're not saying that YOU are going to heaven, are you?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/28/12


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//How can a person who calls themselves a Catholic Christian take communion yet doesn't know one scripture, doesn't obey scripture at all, says God doesn't talk to her, and still believe they're going to heaven.

Simple answer is that they have created in their own minds, a god of their own conception and they call it God!

Over half of the Roman Church is divorced and remarried but they continue to go to church and take communion. But as long as they toss an ocassional nickel in the collection plate, they will never be challenged.
---lee1538 on 2/28/12


Catholics are religion followers whom practice whatsoever they will practice.
---Eloy on 2/28/12


anon, do you actually think that the number of scripture verses you know determines whether or not you're a Christian, or your fitness to take communion?

I doubt you found this teaching in the Bible.

This is not Christianity, but gnosticism--the idea that you are saved by WHAT you know.

And God says you don't know what you're talking about.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/28/12


anon you are part of a denomination or at least a denominational specific ideas. Since you are human you have a wrong doctrine somewhere. Make sure you do not become a Judiazer and put your religion on someone else. yes I believe she is wrong but you can teach her.
---Scott1 on 2/28/12


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Not all Catholics are the same. You can't say all Catholics don't know scripture or obey scripture because of this one person. In my experiences, yes, most Catholics are rather apathetic about their faith, almost like being Catholic is a status or something. But I have known some that know the scriptures like the back of their hand and really live what they believe also.
---Jed on 2/28/12


Cluny, so are you saying they're deceived people?

Are they REALLY going to heaven?
---anon on 2/28/12


The same way Protesants who don't really know scripture (beyond their few pet verses) or who say God talks to them, and still think they are going to heaven do.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/28/12


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